Rebuilding Self-Trust and Intuition with Jesse Janelle

Most of us spend a lot of time deliberating decisions and when you have strong self trust and you are practiced at being able to hear the voice of your intuition, it makes decision making not only better as in you make better decisions, but you get there faster.

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Hey Happiness Squad. It's great to have you with me on this Happiness Squad podcast where we host guests who are industry leaders and experts helping organizations and individuals make flourishing their competitive edge. In today's podcast we will explore some practical ways that you can use to deepen your self trust and really tap into that intuition and inner voice that we all have to increase your flourishing and leadership effectiveness. Meet Jesse Janelle Jesse is the Founder and CEO of Gemini Leadership and creator of the Soul Session method. She's an ICF certified transformational coach and her TEDx talk on the Power of Self Trust is in the top 2% most viewed talks of all times. Her mission is to help mystic minded millennials reach new realms of possibilities for their lives. In this session we discuss a powerful model that she uses to help individuals assess their self trust and also some practical ways to amplify their hidden intuition. Stay till the end where we discuss how as leaders you can not only help yourself, but help others invest in their own self development journeys. Join me as I welcome Jesse to the Happiness Squad. Welcome Jesse. It is so lovely to have you on our Happiness Squad podcast.

Thanks for having me.

So my friend, we always usually start with this first question which is what is happiness and how has your definition of happiness changed from when you were younger to now?

Yeah, my definition of happiness is freedom and I think when I was younger, and I think this is true of probably most children, there is this element of freedom that's just part of your existence. There's so much you don't need to worry about yet. There's all these societal expectations and stories that haven't been put upon you yet and for me as an adult now, happiness is getting closer, closer and closer to that space of feeling free.

Beautiful. I love that. You know, it's breaking free from all these fears and expectations. Right. Like truly being able to live in light with your values and what you know for yourself to be true.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Which is so much of your beautiful work in this conversation is going to be about. I was so intrigued, Jesse, when you had reached out because, you know, and your website says it right, says, you know, a little bit of Hogwarts, a little bit of Harvard.

Yep.

And so for our listeners who are listening, you know, Jesse has a really, really unique approach towards coaching and leadership development which combines the power of tarot cards intuition with real science based coaching work to help individuals with personal and professional growth. So I'm curious, tell me a little bit about the story around how you came to create this method, Jesse.

Yeah, absolutely. It's a long one, but I'll shorten it for your listeners. So my personal development journey really began back when I was 11 years old. I experienced a trauma at school that broke my relationship between my thoughts and my intuition in my body. So what I would call my felt sense for a long time those two areas were completely disconnected for me and I spent a lot of times, several decades trying to rebuild that connection. So earlier on in my career it was a very academic approach, Right. So I majored in psychology, got good grades, studied positive psychology. I was interning at the Institute of Coaching at Harvard during its founding years and helping them work on their evidence based coaching research library. So it was a very academic approach to this type of stuff, to this type of work. And then as I got further on in my career, I went to the New Field Network. I got certified as a coach, started practicing. I also had been certified as a yoga teacher and was practicing that for a very long time and started really rebuilding that connection between my mind and body. And that's when I started doing more spiritual type of work on my own. So bringing in tarot cards, bringing in more spiritual work for my own practices. And my clients started picking up on it. So they would notice the cards behind me or they would ask me about my own practices and I'd share it with them. And it was a flow to that type of development. It was never intentional for me to really start a tarot based coaching practice. I just started bringing it in very lightly to my work with clients and realized how powerful it was. And a colleague of mine said to me we were having a conversation about presence Because I do a lot of coaching work on presence and I speak a lot on that topic. And again, I was kind of focused on the academic side of everything and talking about the theory. And she said to me, but how do you do it? You know, your presence, like, what's the actual thing you do every day that makes you be able to show up like this? And it was a really striking question for me. And when I thought about it, I said to myself, it's my daily tarot practice. That's the word, that's the daily work, that's the tangible thing that I could teach somebody else how to do. That would be a huge difference maker in their lives. So that's when I started really revolving my whole business and all the work I do around tarot based coaching.

That's amazing. I want to get into that and really want to understand really how that works. But it's such a beautiful notion of what you're saying, right? Which is. And that's what a lot of the work that happened in squad we're focused on. You know, we could know a lot of things cognitively, but until we do them, we don't get the benefits. And if we do them consistently, we become them. And that's what people experience, right? They experience a different you. It's not what you're saying, but it's what you're emanating. And that's, you know, that's beautiful that, you know, when somebody asks you, they're like, hey, but how do you do it? What am I experiencing? It's not your logic. So tell us a bit about how tarot cards truly can serve as tools for self discovery and decision making, especially, you know, in this professional world in which we inhabit.

Yes, I love that you called it out specifically as a tool because that's how I frame it as well. For me, it's a tool of something called metaphor coaching. So there are a lot of different ways to do metaphor coaching, but basically it's about bringing a third party into the energy of a coaching relationship. So sometimes you can do metaphor coaching with a little box of trinkets. It's any type of tool that's brought in that helps the client be able to externalize the issue or externalize the perspective outside of the conversation. So for me, I bring tarot cards in not as any type of tool of divination, not as any type of fortune telling, but just as a new energy. Right. A third party being brought into that container that can spark new perspectives, it can spark reflection. What I'VE found in my work is that it takes the coaching conversation deeper, much faster. So what normally might take several sessions to kind of get down to the heart of the issue. And okay, now we're really talking about what we wanted to be talking about here. That happens in 10 or 15 minutes.

So bring it to life for me. So what would that look like? And when you say bring a third person in or externalize, what, what, what does that actually mean?

So in normal coaching conversation, I would usually start off with something like, what do you want coaching on today? Right. And the client would usually describe for a couple of minutes what's been going on. And in a coaching conversation without tarot, I'd be asking additional questions like, why is that important to you? Or tell me more about that. I'd be digging in to really get into, okay, what's the focus of this conversation going to be? When I'm in a tarot based coaching session, I bring my cards. And the first, over the course of a coaching conversation, I ask five questions. But the first question that I pose with the cards is, what do we need to know about? And I pull a card after the client's explained, you know, whatever's going on, whatever they want coaching on, and I show them what that card is. And it usually helps them narrow in on that topic. They look at the card. I explain very simply, this card typically means whatever it means, or this card typically means for me, abc. And it's just a simple sentence where I'm inviting in a particular perspective that I give the client a lot of space to say, what does this mean to you? What resonates with you? I show them the card. So they're looking at the rich imagery of the card. They're interpreting their own definition of what the card means. And then it takes the conversation in a particular direction that we explore further.

And so is it important that you pick a card or they pick a card from the tarot?

Most of my coaching I do virtually.

So you're picking a card?

I pick the card and show it to them. Yeah. Even when I'm working with someone in person, I'm usually holding the cards and showing the cards as we go.

I see. So give me an example of how a specific tarot card, you know, coaching session facilitated a really transformative moment for them in their work life.

Yeah. I'll give you an example that comes to mind. And it'll also highlight the differences of what it's like working with tarot versus a traditional leadership coaching.

Sure.

I had a client who owns her own business. And she had been really hung up on this idea of rest. She was always doing, always busy, always going, and couldn't figure out why she couldn't slow down, even though she thought it was very important to her, but she just didn't seem to be able to do it. So we were working on that together, and one of the cards that was pulled was the seven of swords. Now, this card, for me, means somebody is lying to themselves. Now, in a typical coaching conversation without tarot, I would think it would be a very strong move on the part of a coach to come out and say something like, I think you're lying to yourself. That would be more aggressive than I would tend to do in a. In a normal coaching conversation. But in this conversation, when I pulled that card, I could invite in the that idea and say to her, this card typically means that there might be something you're hiding or you might be lying to yourself about something. How does that resonate with you? Does that land? And it was a lighter way to invite in that type of conversation. And she said, you know what? I am? And we started getting into a conversation about her definition of success and what that really means to her. And resting and not achieving meant she was not successful. And we went down this whole other path around that that ended up being about redefining her definition of success to focus on peace and joy instead of making a certain amount of money or having a certain caliber of client. So. So that's an example of where in a normal coaching conversation, it would have taken us a while probably to get there, but with pulling a particular card, we're able to kind of externalize things. Hey, the card said it, not me. You know, pulling the card and get there faster.

And did you choose it on purpose or you just choose a card? It could have been some other card which would have taken the inquiry a different way, correct?

Yes. So it's totally random. I shuffle them before every conversation. And even though I say to do this type of work doesn't require any particular spiritual belief, but it does require this openness to the idea that there's an energy in the conversation we're having and that a certain card is coming up for a reason. Right. So there's a little bit of curiosity, a little bit, I like to say, a touch of magic to it, even though it really doesn't involve you believing in anything in particular, and the cards aren't telling your fortune or anything like that. But there needs to be some type of belief and openness. To the idea that we pulled this card for a reason.

You know, it seems a bit. Jesse, which I really like is, you know, when I'm doing a lot of leadership work with clients in large groups, you know, we'll use imagery, right? We'll use cards and say, hey, describe a little bit of your current situation and pick a card that describes the future and we'll go around and do a little bit of debrief, right? So what I'm taking away from you is with tarot, with imagery, you're just using a different part. You're inviting a different line of inquiry that might or might not. It's breaking the logical pattern of I do this and I don't do this. And it's just trying to get in deeper through a different lens. Even sometimes something that might be invisible to our own self.

Right? Absolutely. And that's, that's the power of it is because someone sees whatever they want to see in the imagery. It's not about knowing the definitions of the cards or having worked with tarot before. I always say when I give a little bit of like this card typically means, I always preface that with it's way more important whatever you see in the card or whatever it means to you than whatever I might be sharing about it's possible definition. And it is just the client reflecting on what they see, what they see in the context of the rest of the conversation we've been having. And it just allows those shifts to happen a little more quickly than can happen with a coach, just questioning like they typically would in a coaching conversation.

Jesse, have you used this in a corporate setting with a leadership team or with the intact team working on an issue?

I haven't used tarot with teams. When I come in for leadership development work, I'm coming in talking about intuition and self trust, typically in a workshop environment. But the cards, right now, I've just been doing one on one.

Got it. So let's switch to that notion, you know, of self trust. I listen to your talk panic to presence and your journey from fear to self trust. And it was beautiful. It was just beautiful to all our listeners, if you haven't, please search for it. You will be moved and you'll learn quite a bit. So share a little bit. Give us the cliff notes version of that TED Talk for our listeners so they can then go listen to the full part of it and how you talk about self trust.

Yeah, so I spoke about this a little earlier on in our conversation. A little bit of foreshadowing there. I Had experienced a trauma at school when I was 11 that sort of broke my self trust. So I describe that in the TED talk and what happened and describe how I started putting the pieces back together if you will, how I started rebuilding that self trust for me. And I know Ashish, you also went to the Newfield Network so you'll be familiar with this definition of trust that they talk about there. But they talk about reliability, competency and sincerity as the three elements of trust. And I apply that same idea or that same framework to the idea of self trust too. So you know, reliability, do you keep promises to yourself? Competency, do you believe in yourself? So this idea of self confidence or self efficacy, right. Do I believe that I can do it? And really the part that I focus on the most in the TED talk is this idea of sincerity and talking about am I really being who I truly am in the world. And because of this trauma that I had experienced, I had a very strong mask up in the world. And I talk about how exhausting it is to keep that mask up all the time and to hide who you really are from the world. And I take people on this exploration of the idea of who were you before the world told you who you should be and getting back to that sense of who you really are and how much energy you can save by doing that and how much more capacity you have access to in not only for your own well being and your own happiness, but in relationship to others and how they experience you and what that allows you to be able to go out and do in the world and how that allows you to be in the world.

Yeah, isn't that amazing? You know, this is something that is so, so present with so many. You know, almost everybody when they're growing up will go through something, you know, a core wounding that we then armor up. And we armor up because we are afraid of letting the hurt in. But we are also preventing our love and our goodness to reach out. But we are also limiting others goodness to reach us. Right. Because once you armor there's very little that starts to get in. How does one. Once you realize that and you feel, you know, like there is a loss in self trust, how does one go about building that back?

I think any type of practice that begins to connect you with your intuition is a great place to start. And I know that's really broad, so I'll give you some specific examples, different introspection practices that you can do on your own. So that might be journaling, might be yoga. I teach about a Tarot self practice that you can do on your own. Anything that starts to get you in touch with yourself a little bit more. This is a process because at first it's almost going to feel like you're pretending, like because you're not used, you don't know that person yet. You don't know who you really are anymore. You forgotten person, you've forgotten, you forget. So it's like building a new relationship. It takes time. You're going to need to explore and get to know that person a little bit. So any type of introspection practice that allows you to do that, where you're in conversation with yourself, that can help you get to know yourself again. And then building that self trust over time happens when the voice of your intuition slowly becomes louder than the voice of your inner critic. And it starts by being able to distinguish between the voice of your inner critic and the voice of your intuition, because that's a very big and difficult first step is even knowing who's talking here. Is this my anxiety or my worry and my fears? Or is this that little guidance system, that voice within me, that voice of love that's always here that's helping to make life easier for me? You know, determining those two different voices and just distinguishing them is a huge first step. Once you are able to do that and you can kind of tell the difference a little bit, you build more trust. The more you start to listen to that voice of your intuition and go out in the world and practice what it's guiding you to do and get that reinforcement from the universe that this is the right path. This is what you should be doing, is listening to that voice. And the more it continues to get reinforced and reinforced, it becomes louder and louder and it becomes much easier to trust it and follow it.

Hi, friends. We hope you're enjoying the tips discussed in this episode. If you're on the career treadmill, seeking the next promotion, experiencing stress and anxiety, or reach the top of your career and wondering if the sacrifices to get there were worth it. Ashish and I have been there and we're ready to support you. The Happiness squad rewire program is designed to integrate the nine hardwired for happiness practices into your day. Within five minutes form proven habits to experience more success, resilience, satisfaction and creativity. You won't be alone in your journey. Check out the rewire link in the show notes. Make happiness your competitive edge to achieve your goals. Now back to the episode.

Beautiful. So it's truly trusting that voice from within. And I love what you Call that, you know, there is obviously the inner critic, which is loud in so many people. But, you know, the reason that is so loud is because the other voice, the voice of the helper, the voice of the cheerleader within. Right. That intuition, something deeply, we have silenced it. Right. And so we have to quieten and we have to connect to, like really cultivate that. And I love this notion of what you said, like a way if you can't immediately go, trust is journal, journal around it. You know, also this notion of that I really love. And we do this, I do this a lot with my own clients and coaching. And we do this in the Rewire program, even forcing ourselves to say, you know, hey, what would. How would somebody else, right. If I was not this, but somebody else, what would they tell me? Or, you know, if the lover in me was to be saying something, how would they say it? Right. Or if the logical operator in me was saying it rather than this, you are not good. Right. At Newfield, we spent so much of the time as well, Jesse. Right. That you and I experienced this notion of looking for counter evidence against what we are hearing from the critic, which, by the way, might be supported by what the inner helper or the inner guide is telling us. So, I mean, I love that you would say to our listeners, if you want to start to build a trust and if you want to bring out your intuition, start first with an introspection practice, anything that turns you inwards. And then second, start to bring it out, start to bring it out slowly in less risk to higher risk situations till it gets strong enough.

Right. Because you're building trust, right? So the more you can try something out and then have it reinforced, the stronger that trust is going to be and it's going to be easier to just go with it when you hear it and not question it and not have to look for counter evidence anymore. Right? Because it's just going to feel like, yeah, I've done this a hundred times and that voice is always right. And just allow that to flow.

That's a good idea too. Keep track, right? Keep track, keep track of when that voice came through. Because we always. Oftentimes that is such a big confidence booster.

And when you can combine in introspection practice or also have going at the same time some type of body practice, and that can be something like yoga, it can be just walking, it can be exercising, but something that brings you into your body a bit. What that can do is allow you to sort of test what you're hearing in your Physical body. So one of the things I talk about a lot in workshops that I do in spaces is this difference between the inner critic and the voice of love or the voice of intuition. And usually I get the question in the workshop, how do I know if it's anxiety or intuition? Because people have. I have this feeling that I shouldn't do this. And how do I know if that's my intuition talking or if I'm just scared? And in that type of circumstance, I always have somebody go to their body because. Because that feeling of love, that voice of intuition, whenever you're being guided by that voice, it feels expansive, it feels opening, it feels warm. And if you're practiced in connecting to your body in some way, whether that's through exercise or through yoga, if you can go into that space and feel into your physical body, it makes it way easier to do that first step of distinguishing between intuition and inner critic. Because you can test it in your physical body. The inner critic or that fear or anxiety that feels constricting, that feels diminishing, it makes you literally huddle down or hover over. It can make you feel shaky, it can make you feel cold. There's a bunch of different sensations you can feel. But it feels physically different to sit with something where you're being guided by your intuition than when you're being guided by your inner critic.

Yeah, even like number one, connecting more to the body. Because how many of us roam through the world as just heads with no body? Right. Even not aware that we are breathing. So connecting with the body and then also learning to your point of what you're saying is notice how one feels different than the other. So it's the body sensations that can act as our compass of is it anxiety talking or is it intuition? Right. And if it is anxiety, maybe breathing to let that fight flight response that we are in that amygdala hijack or the high activated sympathetic nervous system, let it calm down, Let it calm down. And then maybe take on a different body disposition, a more open one and see what voice comes up for you. Right. If you can't access it, go there. But I love this notion and learn and then notice again what is coming up in your body so that you know you can use it as a guide, but also create it. I think it's really, really powerful, really beautiful. So talk to me and connect all of this self trust from all the work that you've done. How does as people connect deeply and start to trust themselves and trust their intuition Again, talk to me a Little bit about, you know, how does that in your mind contribute to flourishing for them or happiness for them?

Yeah, there's a few different components. One is you become a more effective decision maker. So most of us spend a lot of time deliberating decisions. And when you have strong self trust and you are practiced at being able to hear the voice of your intuition, it makes decision making not only better, as in you make better decisions, but you get there faster because you can just trust that voice. And you don't spend as long in that indecision. And after you make the decision, you don't spend as long questioning whether or not that was the right decision. So that's sort of one practical element.

Faster and more effective decision making.

Right. Especially in workplaces. That's a big one. Right. It makes you a more effective decision maker. It also brings a certain presence or it allows you to access a certain type of presence and presence, meaning how other people receive you. And we talked about this a little earlier on too. But the way somebody feels you or what they get from being with you, maybe they feel calm when they're with you. They get a calming presence off of you. Presence is all about actually somebody else. It's all about how somebody else receives your energy. That is your presence, right? So when you build self trust and that voice of the inner critic gets quieter, you're able to relate to people better. People feel a certain presence off of you. There's a resonance that can happen. So you hear people better and they hear you hearing them, they can feel you feeling them. That's the type of energetic connection that can be created when you're sitting in self trust or when you're living in self trust because you show up in the world more authentically and you save a lot of energy when you show up in the world more authentically. Because we talked about masking earlier too. That is incredibly draining. It's incredibly draining.

The weight of that armor that people carry, right?

Pretending, pretending and not even realizing you're doing it. And you're wasting all that energy, right? And when it can come down and that armor can come off, a weight literally is lifted off of you. And that energy now can be utilized in ways that are more productive and useful and in alignment with your values. And it can be directed towards intentionally making your life better and living the type of life that you want to live.

It's beautiful. So, friends, just to recap, if you build, truly build, regain this trust in yourself and your intuition, right? You are able to now access and make Much faster and more effective decisions. You're able to reduce the drain that comes from carrying this massive weight of armor around you. You're able to connect more deeply with others, feel them and they feel you. Literally. You're letting your goodness reach them and their goodness reach you. Right. You can come across as a lot more authentic. Your presence is a lot more confident too, because you're not doubting yourself. Because when you are doubting yourself, you think you're just doubting yourself. But everybody else also knows and can feel that doubt in what you're saying. So once you reduce that inner critic voice and are standing confident in your intuition, people will feel it. Right? People will feel it. There'll be higher resonance, there'll be higher connection, higher love. And all of that results in not only you flourishing, but everybody around you feeling confident, feeling present, feeling seen, guided more effectively. And hence the need to really build this competency. Really the need to build this competency. Now, I'm curious, Jesse, have you seen do men versus women, you know, is there lack of self trust more in one versus the other?

When I have a client one on one, I don't notice a difference. However, when I'm guiding a workshop, my observation is that it's a little more difficult for men to put down the mask. I don't know if the armor's stronger, if there's more societal expectation. Whatever the reason might be, it takes a little more work to get through. But in terms of once we're through there, the access to the intuition or even what that intuition is guiding, I don't notice a difference.

You know, it's interesting and I wanted to share this with you. This is the reason I asked the question, this intuition work. I always find this interesting in my work. Masculine versus feminine energies. Those who have more feminine energies. Right. Whether it's women or men who are also have, they're more grounded. You know what I find really interesting is women are. And more feminine energy is more intuitive by its nature, but also higher levels of self doubt. Yeah, right. So it's almost like you've got more of something, but you also have a higher level of tampering it down. So in the outside it might come across as the same. Right. But if you're able to lose that, how much more can we cultivate? So that was the reason I was asking because you've obviously done a lot more of this work, you know, in that space. But that's kind of when that starts to make sense to me. Right. And I was just like, why why is it not more. And I think this Doshan would explain that. So let's talk a little bit. I want to hear right. In addition to all of this work, the tarot based self trust, you know, helping people increase their self trust presence. You are, you know, you're a very successful leadership coach. You do a lot of work with teams and work cultures. And we are in a very interesting period, Jesse. Right. That we are navigating. There's a lot of employee disengagement, there's a lot of break in trust in systems and organizations. You know, even big companies like Google that have always been known, you know, there's been massive layoffs. Wayfair just announced a bunch of layoffs. There's so many companies where you know that trust is broken. Disengagement is high. There's a high degree of burnout and stress. What are some strategies that you are seeing, you know, leading companies deploy or you are advising companies to truly turn back this tide? Because you know, for me, flourishing and the work that we try and do at flourishing, for me it is truly about performance, you know, and in the end we need people to execute. And if people are disengaged, stressed out, not trusting the companies in the workplaces, so little is possible. So we've got to figure out a way to help companies to do more of that and win that back. What are some ways in which you are seeing companies do it or what you're advising them to do?

Yeah, that's a great question. One thing that I advise and a phrase that I live by as well in the work that I do is that personal development is inseparable from professional growth. And I think the companies that are getting this right are the ones that have a willingness and an openness to, to invest in personal development for their employees. So self development journeys and more individualized development. I think a lot of times companies, because as you said, we care about results, we care about getting things done, companies will spend their leadership development dollars on more skill based programs like okay, how do we have difficult conversations or let's talk about how we do feedback conversations like all these things that are fairly technical skills that somebody can learn how to do well. But when you give people the space and make the investment in somebody's personal development, such as what happens in self development leadership journeys, that becomes contagious in organizations. So people come back from these self development journeys where they were really given the spaciousness and the guidance and the facilitation to be able to explore exactly the things that we've been talking about in this conversation, right? Those wounds from childhood, their way of being in the world, their presence, their authenticity, intuition. They've been given the space to explore all of that and they come back to their organization with a different presence like we were talking about. They're able to relate to people better. People around them in their teams feel seen and heard. And even if that teammate didn't get to experience that same journey or that same growth opportunity, they're experiencing that other person's presence and they get a touch of it. Right. It's an invitation for them to let down their mask a little bit and show up more authentically to bring emotions into work, to bring their full self in. Because now they're being received by somebody who has the capacity to receive them because they've been given the opportunity to do this type of work. So that's where I would say the biggest difference maker is between the companies that are are getting this right, are the ones that are putting their professional development and leadership development dollars towards self development work.

Beautiful. And what are some innovative ways in which people can do self development?

There are a lot of different ways that companies can invest in self development. They could do so individually for their employees by getting them a leadership coach who's able to help them explore this individually. They can also invest in, you know, group self development journeys like we do at Mobius. Right. I work at Mobius executive leadership as well as having my own practice. And this is what Mobius does out in the world is focus on self development journeys and leadership development leading from self. So contracting a company like Mobius that has been doing this for years and years and knows how to facilitate this, knows how to bring that little bit of magic as we were talking about that Hogwarts meets Harvard into corporate spaces. Finding a company that knows how to do that really well, like Mobius does is one way.

Yeah. And I think part of it is creating space. Right. So my, the work that I'm doing and the start of happiness squad and my whole she shift away from let's drive more profits for companies to let's focus on helping people live their best lives actually started from one of Those self development one weeks that I did with Mobius at McKinsey. It was our inner program and it was a very powerful program. You know, friends, you can look at Google and search within yourself, right? Search inside yourself journeys that they have historically done. Wilderness trails, another wonderful, wonderful place to give people the opportunity, even as whole teams to step away and really rediscover truly discover their self right? Listen. Find who they really are. So so so powerful. Jesse. Thank you. So for our listeners who are more intrigued about Tarot based coaching about truly learning to trust their intuition, where can they start, where can they find you and what additional resources would you recommend?

Thank you. The best place to go if you're interested in this topic and want to explore it More deeply is 7minutetarot.com. That's one of my websites where I have a free 45 minute masterclass that dives into this topic a lot more deeply than we were able to do today in this conversation. But it's the actual how to conduct a seven minute Tarot practice that you can do as a self coaching practice at home in seven minutes to become a more effective decision maker. It's one of those introspection practices that we talked about that's a way to kind of begin to dip your toe in this water and begin conversation with yourself. So if you'd like to learn how to do that on your own, you can go to 7minutetarot.com and I'll walk you through it.

This was amazing. Thank you Jesse. I can't wait to get into it. I want to try one of these seven minute Tarot myself and I want to introduce that to folks who go through the Rewire program at Happiness Squad, right? Which is all around truly rewiring our brains away from fear and towards happiness. And I think self trust and intuition can be a big, big, big part of it. In fact, the center of our nine practices is self awareness. Awareness of who you really are. So thank you for adding another tool, truly a tool to the toolbox that our listeners and our users and those who are participating in Rewire programs can use. I wish you an amazing day. Thank you for sharing your great insights with us.

Thanks so much for having me.

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