How to Pivot Your Business During the COVID-19 Pandemic

Hey, guys. Welcome to episode number 272 with my friend Caitlin from Strength and Grace Boutique. Let's talk about your business strategy and the juicy details of what actually works, from mainstream fashion to fashion on Main street and the entire ecosystem behind it. How do we scale your company and do it with the balance and the happiness that we all seek? Let's hear from those insiders, experts, and strategists that actually make it happen. I'm your host, Ashley Alderson from the boutique, and I can't wait to chat. When the pandemic first hit, I know every boutique owner was scrambling to figure out, how am I going to save my brick and mortar? How am I going to go online? Is this the end of my business? Could I even get out of bed tomorrow? Do I have to get out of bed tomorrow? What am I going to do with my kids? And what is happening to the world in 2020?

What?

But what was amazing to watch unfold after the pandemic hit was the way that so many boutique owners began to hustle and create new realities for themselves, their families, and their businesses. During that time, I had the pleasure of getting to private message with so many of you who are sending questions and ideas and just needing support during a really uncertain time. And one of the boutique owners that I had the pleasure of chatting with was my friend Caitlin from Strength and Grace Boutique. And she began to tell me how she was hustling and the different things she was implementing inside of her brick and mortar that were really making a difference and helping her come out of the pandemic even stronger than when she went into it. So I wanted to share her story with you guys today so you could be inspired and see how a pivot just might be one of the best things that happen inside of your business. Get ready to meet Caitlin from Strength and Grace Boutique. All right, guys, welcome back to the podcast. This week, I am with an awesome Boutique Hub member and my friend Caitlin Lucien, the founder of Strength and Grace Boutique. And let's just start with this. We all know 2020 has been one heck of a roller coaster, and if there was someone who has definitely lived it firsthand, it's you, Caitlin, correct?

Absolutely.

So today we are going to deep dive into what it was like to deal firsthand with a pandemic from someone close to New York and all the madness happening there, and give some tips on how Caitlin pivoted and what the rest of the country can learn from this experience. So, Caitlin, I'm so happy that you're with me today. Thanks again for joining us on the show.

Thank you so much for having me. I'm very excited to be here.

Well, let's start here. I always love to give people context on who you are, how you got started in the business, and a little bit about your boutique and how you operate, what your sales channels are, that sort of thing. So if you wouldn't mind, start by giving me some background.

Yeah. So this is actually. Being a boutique owner is a huge pivot for me. I went to school for education. I was an elementary school teacher. But for seven years and about four years ago, I decided I wanted to do something that would really change how our family was functioning. I wanted to have a lifestyle of greater flexibility, less havoc, and provide an opportunity for people to have a sense of belonging and create a community that could continue to grow and people who had similar values as me. Now, I know all boutique owners know that being a boutique owner is anything but simple, but it has provided, you know, greater flexibility in our life. And I wouldn't change a single thing I've done along the way. We started our online boutique. We started as a small boutique operating out of the basement of our house just about two years ago. And then in January of 2019, we opened a brick and mortar location in our hometown of Sandy Hook, Connecticut. We have the best community, both online and in person, and we love every second of it. Our boutique features mainly apparel and sizes small through 3x, and we have gifts and accessories and jewelry and all the fun stuff you find. Our style is essentially comfortable, casual, affordable. And our main goal, whether you are a part of our online community or if you are a part of our local community, is to make sure that you know how much, you know our customers, know how much they mean to us and how much we value them, and that they leave with an experience that makes them feel like they are our top priority.

I love that that sense of community is so important in every single boutique. And truly what sets boutiques apart from the rest of the world. Right? Big box stores and everyone else. Absolutely.

I mean, I. We try our best to know our customers inside and out. And you're not going to go to a box store and find that.

Absolutely. Now. So, Caitlin, I didn't realize that you were from Sandy Hook for whatever reason. I didn't put two and two together there. So as I'm thinking about the challenges that we've really walked through in 2020, I mean, your community has already faced a number of challenges. So the sense of community there has to be almost on another level because of the road that you all have walked together. Can you talk to me about that?

We do have a absolutely phenomenal community that comes together. I can't speak to any experiences that some of our families may have had. I just know that we love each other and we really focus on pulling together. I think that's been the case always, but more so based on some of the things that have happened in our community.

So. So Fast forward to 2020. How close are you to New York? And kind of the epicenter of where the pandemic broke out. Talk to me kind of about where you first heard about it and how you started to feel as you started to relate the pandemic and how it was going to impact your business.

Well, it's a crazy story. So we were actually on a cruise from March 6th. Oh, no. Yeah, from March 6th to, like, March 15th. And it was right around that time, like. Like when we were leaving, I was like, no, no, it's not going to come here. Oh, it's in Washington. That is all the way across the country. It's not going to come here. So we got on our plane in New York and we flew to Florida, and we're in the middle of the ocean when things start to be like, okay, it's here, and we're not going to be able to contain it. So it was at that point in time where I really started, honestly, panicking. I think it's only normal to have some sense of panic when you see that your area or, you know, there is some sort of thing happening that is totally outside of your control, but has a huge potential to impact every aspect of your life. So basically, I left on vacation and did not reopen my store again. I mean, it was open while I was on vacation, but we are just about an hour outside of New York City and we have a lot of commuting families. And Connecticut, my area of Connecticut, actually became, you know, one of the highest per capita hospitalization rates in the country. So it was intense here for a while, and everybody was completely shut in. We were mandated to. I actually closed a couple days before it was mandated by the state that we close. But it. It was a hard time mentally, to figure out what we were going to do next.

How. What was your initial reaction? I mean, did you. Did you think right away, okay, I've got this. I can go this other direction? Or were you scared about your business, like, ceasing to exist at that point?

I was scared about my business. Honestly, the beginning of 2020 was subpar. It wasn't going as I was hoped. So I was already a little bit stressed about my business standing. In no way did I feel like it was something we wouldn't be able to recover from eventually. But it was always in my mind that we needed to make some changes. And I was trying to evaluate where our original shift had came. So when this happened, I definitely had moments of doubt. I actually said to my husband, I think this is it. You know, this is going to be what ends the business for us. And it's kind of like one of those things where, like, well, nobody could blame you if your business closes during a pandemic, you know what I mean? But after about two weeks of that pity party, I kind of had a mindset change, actually, thanks to a lot of some of the things that you and Sarah and Ed were posting in the Hub on how mindset is important and we need to pivot because, you know, I may have had a different experience than other areas of the country because of the large number of cases we are experiencing of COVID But every boutique was affected when this first began. So I had a mindset shift, and I decided, you know, it started as something every week. I was looking for that one thing in the beginning that people were going to want. It was around Easter. So we did Easter baskets, and then we did blue light lens glasses. You know, finding that individual piece right now that I could sell out of the water that people really needed. So I had to pivot what I was offering and what people needed, and things kind of slowly started to roll together from there, man.

One piece at a time. Talk to me about, like, the inventory shift in that whole process. You needed to. You knew you needed to move your boutique home. Were you already on Shopify? Do you already have a website and everything through Shopify? So E commerce. You said you started as an online boutique. Do you have that base?

Right. And that was helpful. We were able to kind of shift back to our roots we had in online community, which, honestly, this whole experience made me realize that I had kind of been neglecting them since my store opened. You know, of course, I did gain new online shoppers because locally nobody could go out and do anything. But I had a whole community of shoppers that weren't local enough to me to shop, that wanted to shop. But I had been putting so much energy into my store that I hadn't been working with my Facebook group. You know, I do a lot of social selling that way, and I kind of just ignored them. So that was a huge eye opener to me. And you know, as we've reopened, balancing, that's been a whole balancing act for me, figuring out how to, you know, make sure I'm serving both communities in the way that they need to be served. But we had our shopify set up, we had our social selling sell up set up. And I worked with in my local community to do everything I could to get people things that they needed. The biggest turning point in our business was when the CDC said that the general population should wear face masks. And we immediately sought out a vendor and made the decision that we wanted to provide that to our community. And it was one of the most humbling experiences. The emails of gratitude I would get from people for offering them at amazing price points. I would spend hours driving around my town delivering these orders because, you know, it would get to people quickly because of the delays in the postal service. And I wanted to do something that I felt was helpful because we all felt so helpless, you know, during the shut in and you have all the frontline workers going to work every day and everyone else was staying home and I needed to do something that would make a difference and. And it did. Hearing the feedback and getting referrals day after day from people saying you need to shop at Strength and Grace, you know, they're doing everything they can. Their products are amazing. Their service is phenomenal. It has really, really helped my business, man.

Just that demonstration of service above self, right? How far that goes in business. If you could walk this again, if you could go back to the beginning of the pandemic and say there's someone listening, that was a brick and mortar, but maybe didn't quite have an online presence yet, or that was a bigger step for them. What advice would you give them to pivot in the way that you did and to quickly get online and start servicing customers from their home like you did.

I think it's really important that you get on your social media and get active right away. There are definitely some stores in my town that were right where you are. We have this cute little small business toy store in our town. They have so many toys and they literally worked tirelessly overnight to get all of their products up online so they could continue to serve their customers during the pandemic. And it is a huge undertaking. But your community will be so grateful if you offer them these options because what a lot of people, especially in my community, and I'm sure that it will translate to other communities, they have found out what it actually means to Be a small business. And to support a small business when everybody had to close down, there's so much lingo, you know, shop small, support small. But you don't really see the actual importance of practicing that until you hear that your main street might be empty. And if you can get your community the opportunity to continue to support you, they will. So get on your social media, Let them know what you're doing. I offered free shipping through the entire time that I was closed, and that was something I was willing to do. It's not something we normally do, but it was something that was greatly appreciated by all of my customers. I delivered within town, set up something that's going to make you apart, set you apart. If you're allowed to do curbside pickup, do that. We have been open for six weeks now, and we still do contact free curbside pickup while we're operating our store, just because there are people who still don't feel comfortable coming into public places. And that is so greatly appreciated, too. And if you can team up with other small businesses in your town and work together, find ways to do that. We have an amazing community in Newtown and Sandy Hook, and all of our small businesses work hard to work together, to come together, to find ways to support each other, to promote each other, and. And in the end, we're going to have main streets that are still full.

Hmm. I love that. It's going to bring people back to what they were taking for granted in the first place, right?

Yes, absolutely.

Yeah. Now, you and I both know we talk a lot about Facebook groups and the power of Facebook groups. But for anyone who's listening that doesn't yet use a Facebook group. Talk to me about how specifically you leverage that to build community around your brand.

Absolutely. So one of the things that I love about my business is that it surrounds my family. And I am not, you know, box stores and chain stores. They're very. I don't want to say cold, but I can't think of a better word. But it's just very rigid. You know, there's no personality to it. There's no face that you can put behind the business. And by implementing a Facebook group, we call ours our insider group, that's basically for where they get to see the face behind the business and the family behind the business. So they learn more about me, I learn more about them, and it's also a place where they can come together and meet. I have so many people that have technically met each other online through my community and found, you know, different things they have in common or they get into discussions on our posts and things like that. I would say that a group is not only a selling platform, it is a selling platform. But if you want a successful group, then you have to look at it as a community as well and work to get to know your customers and things about them that are going to connect you in the long run. I share things about my family. I share struggles I'm having. It's an open thing and they appreciate that and feel more invested in me because they know I'm invested in them and they just. They know my background. Our store, strength and grace is actually namesake of my children. My son's name is Ethan, which means strength, and my daughter's name is Madeline Grace. So everything we do is all about our family. And they know my kids, they know my husband, and. And that community helps to bring us together in that group.

I love that. I love it. In your Facebook group, are you doing try on sessions live sales? Like, how are you also maximizing multiple revenue streams? Your website, obviously, your storefront now, curbside pickup, also video and social selling? Are you using those opportunities as well?

Yeah. So once we kind of realized the import, you know, saw we were neglecting our online community, I knew I needed to step it up. So we started using comments sold. We had always been social selling, but I wanted to comment sold has been something that has made it a little bit easier for me because it takes a lot of the back time, you know, the time out of it behind the scenes. So we do try on sessions and I say we. I'm a control freak. It's like all me. I have amazing staff at the store and they are part of my family. But a lot of the online things fall on me. And my husband helps me and even my kids help me. They'll do little taste tests of like different popcorns that we have and stuff like that. But we do wall drops with outfit inspirations. We do try on sessions. We do live sales, and I try to find as many different avenues to reach my online audience as possible. So we obviously have our e commerce site, we have an app, we do our live sales. My husband manages our Pinterest board, which is starting to generate some more sales for us that way from new customers. We have our Facebook ads running and we are active on our Instagram account as well.

I need you to repeat that. Your husband runs your Pinterest account. That's awesome.

Yeah, I don't even know. He's like, I can do this. So I was like, you Go for it.

Most men are like, what is Pinterest?

I don't understand this whole spreadsheet set out on everything he does and all the boards he posts to. I don't even know.

That is awesome. Good for him. Oh, my gosh.

It's a family effort over here, right?

It's a family affair. You do what you got to do. Yeah. Caitlin, do you think about, like, going back to your brick and mortar after having walked this experience? Do you look at your brick and mortar business completely different? Like, have you come back with different hours, how you handle things differently? Like, how has it shifted now that your part of the country is kind of past the big wave? And other parts of the country are obviously dealing with that now. But how has your brick and mortar specifically shifted after you having this experience?

So we started with curbside pickup only at the store, and then we reopened on June 6 with modified hours, so we cut our hours back. And the biggest change has honestly be. Is. I'm sorry. Has honestly been how much I am working in the store floor. That has decreased a lot, mainly because I am focusing on the online component of it right now. We have added on hours as time has gone by, but we're still operating less than what we used to. I am handing over more hours to my staff, who are doing a wonderful job, you know, on the sales floor, and I am focused on different aspects of the business because we have really grown a lot through Covid, and it's just a whole different ball game right now. And the store isn't slow either. Our store traffic has picked up tremendously. So when I was working the store, I'd have a lot of downtime before COVID because we aren't in a strip mall. We aren't in a mall. We are in a freestanding building. It's a small downtown. You only came there.

You.

You came to our store if you knew you needed to get something. It wasn't really a browse store, but now we have a lot more people who want to come and shop, and it's busy all day long. So I found that I wasn't able to get any of my tasks done or, you know, work with the online aspect of it. So it's been a shift in where my responsibilities are. I work one day a week on the store right now, and I used to work all days a week at the store. So that has been the biggest change. You know, even though we are. We are one of the few states with a decrease in cases, I will say that our safety Protocol is very different than what it ever was before. Connecticut mandates face masks, and my store does as well. If you don't have a face mask on, unfortunately, you're not able to shop with us, but we will offer you an online option to shop up. We have different sanitizing protocols. We have. We are have our fitting rooms open, but we have special protocols of trying on clothes and steaming clothes, leaving them off the floor for a couple days before they can return to the floor. So there's more work put into it. But because we are going above and beyond to make sure that our customers know we're doing everything we can with their health and safety as a priority, it's worth every second of it. And one thing I can say to brick and mortar stores as they may look to reopen or if they're open now, I went into reopening with the mindset of there are. If we're going to look at two ends of the spectrum here. If we have that end of the spectrum where a customer is incredibly worried, is very anxious, is unsure if they should even be out shopping, and then we have the other end of the spectrum of someone who, you know, isn't really worried. They don't care. They're fine about this. They're not, you know, concerned. Those are ends of the spectrum. As a business owner, you need to tend to that most worried and scared person, because if they feel safe in your store, they will come back. If they don't feel safe, they are never going to come back again and they're going to tell everybody they know what went on at your store. At the other end of the spectrum, that person who isn't as concerned, they might roll their eyes if they think your protocol is a little intense, but they're probably going to come back eventually.

I can certainly sympathize and understand where you're coming from, and there's so much fear out there today. So I think it's good that you're clear and you're empathetic and you're giving people multiple options and, you know, for other parts of the country, I think it's really important to hear your advice on that. I want to back up to something that you were saying just about taking yourself off of the store floor a little bit. I would say overall, the more stores that I visit with, I find that stores coming out of the pandemic are more profitable because I think they had to really look at their numbers in a new way, living through this, but they also value their time in a brand New way. Would you say the same is true for you? You're more profitable and you've been able to prioritize your time more?

Absolutely. We are way more profitable. We actually, we've also just signed up with management one, so another little plug there. You know, it's unknown territory for us. As our sales have grown, we want to make sure that we are able to stock our inventory properly as we move in to hopefully what's an amazing Q4. But prioritizing my time has become so incredibly important. I have six year old twins at home. We have very little activities for them to participate in. We don't know if they're going back to school or not. And it's really important that I am not, you know, wasting my time doing things that someone else can do or that aren't generating income for my business or necessary for my business. So time prior prioritization has been crucial and I am definitely in that ball game of prioritizing.

So would you say if there has been blessings that have come out of the pandemic, what would they be for your business?

That's a great question. I mean, the blessings that we've gained are plenty. I could say that. Oh my gosh, I don't even know what I'm gonna say. There has been, I can't even name them all. I mean, we have. Our customer base has tripled to quadruple. That is a huge blessing that I would have never expected. The gratitude from our community is more than I could have ever expected. You know, it's very tough. Feel appreciated is amazing. And the ability to try to time block and time balance and without any option, you know, you've got to be getting more things done in the day and we're able to do it.

Man. And something that we need all year long, right?

Absolutely, yes. And, and you know, one of the other things that I think really helped my business, you know, a lot of the questions leading up to the podcast were, you know, referral sources and traffic sources and things like that. And I can say word of mouth referral has hands down been the biggest traffic source both in store and online for my store. And I honestly think that comes back down to customer service and doing the best you can to work with your customers and make sure they know that you are their priority.

You know, it goes back to that idea of the 100 true fans. Right. Like we so often change or change. We chase thousands and thousands of followers thinking that's the key to sales. But really, just like you said through Word of mouth. If you have a hundred true fans, that can be a greater revenue driver than all of these more shallow followers.

Right? Absolutely. It's. It's quite. It's the quantity of your audience over. I'm sorry, the quality of your audience over. The quantity of your audience.

Right, Absolutely. As you head into, you know, the end of the year in 2020, do you see some of the strategies or processes in your business changing or how do you feel like you're going to approach the end of the year in the holiday season?

I think that there's a lot of uncertainty as to what Q4 is going to look like. You know, we always have in the back of their. Our minds. I know. I don't know. They're like deeming this like wave one, part two. I don't know if there's going to be, you know, another spike in cases as we get to the colder weather. So I am going to continue doing more of the same and honestly just trying to kill it with customer service and have my staff kill it with customer service. Customer service and monitor the trends of the product classes that are selling for me and restock them and be willing to pivot because I think the biggest obstacle that can stand in our way is if we get thrown another curveball and we don't want to pivot again. Pivoting is hard. I remember when I had to close my store, it was like the worst thing ever. I probably cried about it for two days. And then when I had to reopen my store, I thought it was the worst thing ever. And I probably cried about it for two days. And it's just being flexible and being able to pivot, knowing that it's 2020 and nothing's going to go as planned. Right.

Go into flow. I have to back all the way up to the beginning of your story because I'm still grappling with the idea that you were on a cruise when all of this broke out. So can you please tell us how did you get off of the ship?

Okay, so we got off of the ship just fine. So we were in the Caribbean and our cruise got back on March 15, I think. And I think it was on March 13 where they announced that there would be no more cruises, you know, for months. But thankfully we were still able to port. Honestly, it was the worst vacation ever. I wish I did not go on it because I'm bad at vacations anyways because I really have a hard time, like, taking a break from my business and being away from it is always hard for me, but it's good. At the same time, we were able to dock just fine. There was no reported illnesses on our boat, but it was just so stressful. I was like, are they gonna let us off the boat? Are they gonna let us on a plane? Are we gonna have to drive from Florida to Connecticut? And how many public restrooms would I have to stop at then? Do I have enough Lysol wipes to do? Like, it was very stressful. But we got off the boat, we were able to get on the plane. There was like temperature checks and stuff like that. But, like, we didn't have masks or anything because this was like pre mask. But we made it home. And I try to look at it, like, with a silver lining. Like, we got a break in the sunshine in the Caribbean before being so stuck home for a couple months. And my kids had a blast, and that's what matters. And my husband had to listen to me be worried the whole time.

The calm before the storm.

Yes. Yes.

Oh, man. Well, Caitlyn, let's do a lightning round. I always love to ask a couple of these questions. So let's start with this. What is the favorite, your favorite book that you have read? Personal or business?

My favorite series of books is actually by Stephen Covey. For business. It's the leader in Me. I was a teacher and we used that methodology to guide our students to be leaders. And it's actually helped me in life to prioritize my big rocks and things like that. So those are great personal books, in my opinion.

Love it. I love Stephen Covey. How about podcast? Favorite podcast?

The Boutique Up.

Shout out. I'll take it. How about other mentors? Like, do you have other business mentors that you love to follow?

You know, I know I should, but I am so focused in my own lane that I kind of just put my head down and go. And I seek out information when I need it, but I don't really have super mentors. I feel very out of the loop in that because I know a lot of people do, but I'm just head down moving forward.

Perfect.

How about.

What's your biggest fear? Snakes. Payroll or Internet trolls?

Snakes, man.

You're up less like three podcasts in a row. Everyone's on the snake bandwagon, so I'm with you.

What about.

What is your favorite trend? Fashion trend of 2020.

My favorite fashion trend right now would probably be casual tie dye, because there's nothing more. I love that everything's comfort right now because I could live in leggings. Every day, leggings and a tie dye tee.

Everyone's going to be in 2021. Looking back at sales reports from 2020, and they're going to be like joggers. Tie dye joggers.

Just ran my first Management one, and basically my sales are casual tees and face masks. Right. Oh, man.

For anyone who's listening too, that doesn't yet know what Management One is, they're a partner of ours at the Boutique Hub, and they offer some amazing inventory planning services that integrate with whatever point of sale that you're using. And they don't only just take your actualized data, but they take data from stores all over the country and then compare and create like a trend report of sales for the next couple of months. So if you've heard of open to buy, very similar thing, except you're using actualized data with your store and with other stores around the country. Country as well. So if you're a Hub member, we do have a deal of a partnership with them. So you get discounted rates with Management One, but altogether, they're awesome people to work with, aren't they?

I agree. I mean, we're. I'm really new in it, but I love my. You know, I was given a couple consultants to pick from and I love her and I think we mesh well together and it's great as. Because we are a corporate member through the Hub, we do have that choice of finding someone that you mesh well with, and I'm really excited to see where it goes.

Awesome. All right, Caitlin. Well, last question, you guys. Anyone who's a member of the Hub, anyone who listens to the podcast, you guys know I'm big on our big why in life and business and that we're here to do a lot more than just sell widgets. Right. In fashion and face masks. Yes. So tell me about this. You've got kids. We're fast forwarding 20 years down the road and you're sitting on the front porch with not only your kids, but your grandkids at this point point. And you're talking about the life that you lived and the business that you built and how you survived 2020. What a bunch of madness that was. And as you look back, what is the thing that you want your family to remember the most about what you created in the life that you lived?

I want them to remember the hard work that can be put into any aspect of your life. In this case, hard work and passion put into a business. And that with those things, you can push through anything you have the mindset, the passion and the hard work and good things will follow.

I love it. Perfect. Well, Caitlin, thank you so much for spending time with me today and sharing your story and your pivot and the opportunities that can come for those that are brick and mortar and online business businesses no matter where you're at in the country where you're dealing with the pandemic. So I appreciate you and thanks for being a member of the Hub as well.

Oh, thank you so much for having me. I hope that even if one person got a little piece of information that was helpful, then this was more than worth it.

Absolutely. Thanks again you guys. Thank you so much for listening to this week's episode. If you are tuning in live as this episode's being released, then you know this week is a very special week at the Boutique House because we are launching the 2020 Boutique Awards. For all of you who are members inside of the Boutique Hub. We take this special time to lift up and celebrate you as retailers inside of your local community, giving all of your customers and your community the opportunity to lift you up and celebrate you by voting for you in the Boutique Awards. We celebrate the categories of Boutique of the Year in your state, Global Boutique of the Year and Then in all 50 states, Canadian provinces in Australia we also recognize the children's online, mobile and Brick and Mortar Boutiques of the Year. Guys, whether or not you want to compete and look at this as winning award or look at this as an opportunity to simply have a conversation with your fans and your customers about what it means to shop local, shop small and to support your business. There is an opportunity to drive traffic and engagement and spread awareness of what it means to shop with a boutique inside of the Boutique Awards. So check it out. The boutiqueawards.com you've got to be a member of the Boutique of to participate. So if you are not yet a member, head on over. Make sure starting August 21st that you are supporting and celebrating the boutiques that you love most. If yours isn't on the list, if you have any questions, as always, reach out to us anytime at the Boutique Hub. We're here to lift you up and to raise the voice of our industry together. Hey guys, thank you so much for listening to this episode. We hope that you loved it. Don't forget to hit subscribe and leave a rating and review down below for a chance to be one of our featured listeners each and every week. For more information on our spirit of community over competition and how to access complete show notes and bonus downloads from our guests. Head on over to the boutiquehub.com and join the community. We'll see you next week.