17. How to use your desires and fears to win in your everyday life and career

How.

How do we go from like. And then just so deep and we're.

Not afraid to answer each other's questions. Like, we're not like, oh, I won't answer that on camera or anything like that.

Well, what I love is, like, we prone each other to go deeper. I feel as though you killed this. I was like, okay, but what about this? But going deeper to bergs, like, what about this? Do you think that's why you do? You know what I mean? Like, we just kept.

Just when you think you're the deepest you can go, it's like there's another door and it goes further down, there's another set of stairs.

I think what's good about the pod is that you and I are both good at asking good questions. Not all, not always fucking great, but like, yeah, when we're in the zone, I feel as though we ask questions that prones a little bit more. Like, deeper responses.

And it's fucking rewarding as well. You're like, I've never thought that before. Let's fucking go there. Let's see what this really is.

Dude, I was literally learning more about myself in that episode. I'm like, that's the gold, man. Like, that the listenership. Like, this is actually, you know, there's so many good, positive wins out of it.

Doing this podcast, mate. We're back. Quick, turn around.

Very quick, turn around. I was trying to find a meal of the week, but I haven't had many meals since the last episode.

Bear market.

But, dude, Dubai, man. I fell in love with Dubai.

See, you've been there for a week and a half. Tell me all about it.

I've actually fallen in love with Dubai. Now, I did say this to Dave, our operations manager this morning. Apparently I fall in love with every place I go, he tells me, but I genuinely feel as though like, are falling in love with Dubai. So the first few days, right, I was here, I was like, this place, you know, it's different. I don't know what's going on. It's confusing. Dude, now I'm in love. People are so nice here. There's so many different cultures. Everyone's just so friendly. No one gives a. Like, you could have, you know, an Arabic person. One, you know, they're Swedish, German, Chinese, Filipino, Australian, American, Canadian. No one cares, mate. Like, like, everyone's just so nice. The service here is amazing. Everywhere you go, everyone's like, treating you like a prince. You come in, the hotels are so nice. They've got, like, laid out towels on the ground. And they, they bring you bags up and they're just, they're helping you in the elevator. The food's brilliant, weather's great. Doesn't rain here, dude, weather's great.

It's like 50 degrees.

First few days I was dying, now I'm actually like genuinely enjoying man, it's really good.

But what you worked out how to, how to live in the desert?

Well, I haven't been out of the desert yet to be fair. But it's funny, right? If you look at this place in a map, if you go to Google Maps and you search Dubai and you look at all the places around you like oh Jesus, you know, like Iran, Iraq, you know, like this is probably scary place to live. Yeah but it, I'm becoming accustomed to it. But one thing I haven't become accustomed to is the nightlife. I went out and said I went out on Saturday and the stuff I saw in Dubai going out was insane. So Dubai, right? You don't. For starters, no one pays tax here in Dubai. I think it's a 5% sort of, I don't know, something that they pay here. So it attracts a.

But it attracts a lot of wealthy people. But there's also a lot of wealthy families and stuff here. You know, a lot of oil money, A lot of people from India coming over. There's just a lot of money here. Now what do people do with money with a lot of money? They like to spend it Burgs, believe it or not.

Now one thing that Dubai does great there is always an upsell mate, if you have the money youy can get anything you want here in Dubai, it doesn't matter. And I witnessed some of this stuff on Saturday night. So first of all we went to a beach club during the day. So this is like a hotel. It was called Five Palms. Probably the most like, you know, I don't know, one of the top rated like beach clubs. So you basically have a beach club like there's no sense like a pool party, right? Everyone's in the pool. But it's all built around having tables. So you book tables. So what you do is you book a table in advance, you get table, you get, you know, service, you get food and drinks, whatever you want. I ride a little bit late, my friends were there already but. And there's this group next to us, Bergs, maybe seven dudes. They've got probably the biggest booth in the place. And I've been there for about 20 minutes at this point and within this 20 minute period three times they had Booked champagne bottle service. Now that is basically where you get four bottles of champagne that they stick like fireworks in the top of it like a firecracker. And there's this ladies come out with basically naked ladies come out and they're doing these dance they're like you know showing you these bottles right now each bottle of champagne was probably like 4,000 dirham so about 2,000 bucks a pop so you know $8,000 within 20 minutes they've done this three times so they'd spent $24,000 on this champagne. Now do you think they drink this champagne burgs if you're paying $24,000 in 20 minutes for champagne do you think you drink it? Fuck no. These guys are shaking that champagne, popping the cork and just spraying it I over everyone spray on themselves.

Amazing.

Spraying it everywhere and they just order another round and I was like what on earth is going on here? Anyway, it gets better so the, the, the sun goes down. Once the sun goes down everyone leaves. Beach club's over right. So we go out to this nightclub called Blue. Now Blue nightclub is one of like the apparently a premium nightclub, whatever. We get a booth there with some friends as well are in there and I think the booth was like Dh4,000 right. So we all pitched in Dh4,000 so it's about $2,000, $1700.

It's a lazy TJ so you get.

Like so it's like six people when you split it up so it's like two or three hundred bucks each right so and that includes drinks so you, you like it's not just for the booth that's like you know it puts in the bathtub.

But how much do you reckon a bottle of vodka for example is in these places? Bring out the iPad. Right.

The cheapest, just vodka.

Give me a guess.

Hey I reckon like the cheapest vodka probably about 500 bucks.

Cheapest bottle of vodka was 1800 Australian dollars. 3,900 dirham the cheapest 700 mil bottle of vodka. So one bottle of vodka basically that it booze down. So you know you get a few drinks you probably pay two or three hundred bucks each. So it's like you know it's, it's pretty expensive.

But Bergs these guys down at the front of this stage now this nightclub by the way is not your normal nightclub. You think about a nightclub, you go and you dance around. No, this nightclub was for like you know there was a lot of basic rich people there and it's all built around tables so you think of like a fashion walk, like a. What's it called? Yeah, yeah, that's where the DJ is. Catwalk DJs there, no one around him. He's just up there like on a big podium and then it's like an auditorium of tables and booths, two levels. This is all built around people getting a table and just spending a shitload of money. So we had like one bottle of vodka and I was like, man, I'm done, I'm not paying any more. Like, fuck that.

These guys down the front were buying bottles of champagne. So it's more than the beach club. These guys, you know, we're probably talking 9, 10,000 dirhams a bottle of champagne. You know, four or five thousand Australian dollars per bottle. So they're getting three or four bottles at a time. The ladies coming out, doing the dancing, a bubble service. Woohoo. Everyone's like having a great time. Do you think they'd drink this champagne burgs? Do you think they'd spray it? Bergs?

Of course.

Of course not. What were they doing? Bergs? They were pouring it out. They were, they were doing it, getting the champagne and just pouring it in the bucket of ice. Not, not to drink, just to pour it out.

Like I was like, that's wild.

So no one else, but no one was doing anything. They're not drinking it, they're literally just. It's like buying a Dh10,000 bottle of champagne and pouring it all out and then doing it again.

Like this is wild. Is this, is this like, is this like a signal of wealth where it's like, you're so rich, you pay the money so the ladies come out, do the dance and whatever. And then it could also be like, you know, you're, you don't drink or anything like that, so you just get rid of it.

This is a signal of you money. This is a signal of you money. This is. I've got so much money, I pay thousands of dollars for something I don't even want. And I'm just gonna pour it out and everyone can like watch it.

And I'm literally just pouring down the drain.

Do it again.

And the money.

Insane, right? And the lifestyle here in Dubai is like, you have, you drop like this for the rich folks, they had their drivers, they pick you up wherever you want, they'll stay, they'll pick you up. Like the guys that were taking me around here in Dubai, he's got his own driver, they pick you up, they drop you off, he lives with you, you get you, you know, I Went to this guy's birthday on the weekend. It was an Indian family to have a cook, to have a cleaner. They cook all the food. They clean after you. They pick you up, they drop you off. It is like the life of royalty, mate. Here, if you have money and I've witnessed it, it's insane.

That's so interesting. This is like in India as well. Even if you're just a middle class family, you still have servants. Like, you have someone that'll come in and cook for you, you have someone that will drive you around. It's a real service industry. Someone will come along and sweep like your front steps of 50 cents or something like that. It's just completely different when you live in those like generally Asian countries with the service industry. But this is like next level, man, when you get that. I still remember this story my mate was telling me and he's, he goes up to Dubai a bit and he knows quite a lot of the, you know, the shakes that are there. And he was saying like, literally he saw one guy, it's like he's one of his friends, he's like got a, a magazine of planes, airplanes, man, and he's like flipping through and he's like, I'll have this one, I'll have this one. I have this one. And you're like, I think this guy was like, just him, not his family, was something like 50 million a day from oil money, which was just like, you can't even fathom that amount. But like, we're like, holy crap, we got so much money that it just becomes worthless. Like there's just so much more tomorrow you couldn't possibly spend.

But I feel as though Dubai is set up to just take people's money. Like it's an endless pit. Like, if you think about Melbourne, right, if you've got that much money, what are you gonna do in Melbourne, right? You could get out top, top level hotel room at Crown, you get, go to a nightclub. But dude, like here, yeah, if, if.

I, if I came over to you with Melbourne and I gave you, let's say 100 grand, what on earth are you going to do for 100 grand in Melbourne?

Get a plan.

Would you even know?

Would you do like get a plane to Sydney? Like, Whoopi, do like, you know, get.

A plane to Sydney.

Like, awesome, that sounds great.

Like here, like, what did you, you go out to a fancy dinner, you go, you might go on a helicopter ride, you might bloody hire, hire a place out for maybe ten grand a night. That's Insane. You might do a bit of gambling.

Like, dude, here, you go out to Salt Bay, you buy gold steak for $10,000. You go out to the clubs and spend a hundred. You then get on your private jet and fly to Greece for the night. Go chill over there. You come back, you stay in your 16, 000. This.

This.

I had a meeting the other day with an investor that was staying in a hotel that was $16,000 a night. It was insane. This place, man. Like, there is just money. The other thing, too, with this nightclub, right?

Are you like.

Are you like.

Are you like, bro, just stay one less night and give us the money. Invest in the company, mate.

Literally, man, like, so just go downgrade the budget for a week, and then we'll take the money. But. And there's just so many.

Like, it's also filled, like, this nightclub, this premium nightclub was filled with escorts. And that's not really for me, but there was, you know, you walk in, they've got like, 15, 15, 20 escorts sitting in the bench, basically waiting for, like, guys to arrive. And they just come up and, you know, greet you. And I was like, no, like, I'm. I'm okay. I'm fine.

But.

But that's what they do. And that's all that. There was people at the Beach Club, dude, there was guys there, you know, like, not. Not a chance. They were, like, organically with the women they were with. That's what I'm saying. And they've got, like, They've got these booze, and there's just like, well, this one. Dude, you're looking at me like, how on earth are you with these, you know, women? But it's just. The company was paid for, man. Like, and it's just a whole new world, man. It's insane.

This is. This is really interesting where during COVID you couldn't really fly around that much. And there's, like, you know, you kind of, like, hear the stories about, you know, the. The Instagram models flying out to Dubai for a while doing some work and then coming back a lot wealthier. And then you had, like, the online version, which was, like, only fans, but it must be a completely different thing to actually go there and see this, like, firsthand, like, how it actually works.

It's.

It's. You've.

You've got to be careful. Like, you know, I so went on Saturday night, I was like, okay, this is. This is my budget. I'm not going out. But, you know, after this, that's it. Because if you don't, they Just take your money, man. Like you, the. I, oh, you, you know, you've had a few drinks, you're a bit tipsy, all of a sudden you're buying like on the iPad, they bring you like four thousand dollar bottles of vodka and stuff. It's like, you know, at Dirham, So, you know, 2000, like, you know, you've really got to be careful. So.

But that's how they take like, that's, that's why there's so many rich folks that just go there and just like blow a bunch of money.

So two things. When are we opening a Dubai office?

And then also this is a good lesson for us as well. Like the lesson here is constantly have an upsell.

Yes.

And even us in our business, we need to have that upsell. This is something we need to look.

Because people, humans are all the same. They had the same problems, you know, they had the same characteristics.

Some are just, you know, at a different level. You know, like a $10 to someone is a hundred thousand dollars to someone else. You know, that equivalent, you know, loss of, you know, expense. It's, it's when you see that top 1%, man, like it actually made me feel like, I don't know, when I saw these guys pouring out the champagne, man, I was like, there's a whole new level of wealth. Well, or perceived wealth. Right. They could have had all money, who knows? Like, yeah, you know, a lot of this is about social, you know, I don't know, not proof. It's like communicating. I have money. You know what I mean? It's all of an ego thing. Yeah.

Signaling.

So this, this is the thing, right? Everyone's like, you see people, they're wearing a Rolex, they've got a Lamborghini, they've got all this kind of. And everyone's like, oh, this person's rich. And I'm like, how are they funding this? Are they funding it with debt or equity? And 9 times out of 10 is funded with debt. They are deeply, deeply in debt. And you never really know, like behind this, like, yeah, they're putting on this kind of, this front and they're signaling that I'm rich. I've got this, I've got that. My watch says something about me, my car says something about me. But it's like, how are you funding that lifestyle? And it's, it's only the, like, you know, the really rich families and people that have done something significant and have a lot of wealth. Okay, I've got all this money now. I'm going to spend it on these things.

And then it's usually the kids, it's the generational wealth. That's the other thing I've seen here as well. There's a lot of very young people that have been gifted an absolute bucket load of capital and money because how wealthy their families have been for generations. So a lot of these guys just walked into wealth. They have done, you know, I know I'm generalizing here but probably most of them have done all really. They're just being handed a shitload of money. Which yeah, by the way, I think is really scary. Like I, for us as everyday sort of Aussies that haven't been born into generational wealth, the idea of like growing something from nothing to something is so fucking exciting and empowering for me, you know, and probably for you too. Bugs like a lot of us are in that. Especially here at collective shift versus just hey bergs, he's 10 million bucks mate. Off you go. Go and have a great like life. That's, that's a different game.

Yeah, so I think about this a lot, especially with my kid as well. And you know, there came a point where I got really comfortable a couple of years ago and I was still studying and I was still doing like, you know, all this stuff. I was still kind of consulting. But I got comfortable because I got to a point where.

I had enough money to pay my bills, I had money left over, I was paying off the mortgage and the was some left over to invest. And you can get really comfortable and complacent. You lose that hunger and that drive and that's not a good place to be. You always need that hunger and you always need to achieve something more. But then, you know, money loses its value. So I need to chase something else. And for me that was building a business, building product and having success with Collective Shift. That's the thing I want to go after as well as the lifestyle it affords me. And you spot on. I'm very like worried about generational wealth and like I'm not ultra rich or anything like that. But my daughter will not live the life that I had with my folks where they basically saved all the time, had high interest rates, managed to keep their house and pay it off. I've built on that. I've got my house, I've got some investments and my daughter will have more than what I have. And back to the rich people. There's a saying where it's like, you know, there's one generation to make the wealth, the next one will grow it and the third generation will blow it. And the reason that is, is because the first family, like when you're coming up and you're doing all this, you know, you're, you're working hard, your kids see that you're always at work, you're building your business, you're working really hard, you're putting deals together, you're hardly home. They see that and they appreciate that. And they know what it's like to not have a lot of money. But then their kids, they grow up rich, they have a lot of money. All they've ever known is wealth. They've only been spoiled. They haven't had to strive for anything. And that's when they become complacent, don't understand money and the value behind it. And that's challenging for me as well, where even though it's. My daughter, will probably want for nothing. It's not on that huge scale. But it's more like if you think back to when we were kids and you didn't have all the toys, you didn't have anything, you didn't go on holidays, you didn't go on international trips, she's got all that stuff. And I'm starting to like, you know, worry about that. And I've even seen people on Twitter that have exited companies have got, you know, hundreds of millions and they've come to the point where it's like you constrict their resources so they have less and they have to do more in order to get the things that they want. It's like this never ending kind of balance, mate. When my kids, like in, in her teens, I'm gonna be like, whoa, what's that gonna be like? What's money gonna be like? You know, how much do I give or what do I make? It's like, it is, it's a hell of a thing to think about.

Fascinating. I've been thinking about this a lot recently, around motivations behind doing certain actions. And I was having a conversation with a man the other day around like, you know, what is the thing that drives us to do certain actions? Like, let's look, let's look at work, for example. Why the hell are we trying to build, you know, collective shift, for example. Like, if you look on the outside, it is hard. You're constantly working, it's stressed, you know, it's difficult. You're doing the hard things, right? So what is the thing that gets you out of bed every day? And I've really, really tried to ask myself that question, you know, because I think sometimes maybe you can fall in the trap of just doing something for doing something. But I know, like, I've been. Yeah, you want to say something.

Exactly. So just on that point, you always have to ask yourself, am I doing this because it's the thing I want to do and directionally where I want to go, or is it just inertia because I've been doing this for so long that I just keep doing the thing?

I think you went through that, right? You were back in your corporate job. You're just doing it because you did it.

You know, I mean, but 100%, it's. It's. You know how fucked this is. It's like, I've been doing it for so long that I'll keep doing it. I'll keep building on it. I've got escalation of commitment. I've got power. I've got. I've got ego. It's what I'm known for. My whole life is structured around it. And it is so hard to stop and be like, why am I doing this? Is the thing I want to do. And am I prepared to kill myself, which is literally kill my identity and kill my ego and chop that off to go and be happy and do the thing I want to do and give up the power? The. You know, the. The thing I've been building, the thing I've been compounding on all the relationships, all the people, am I willing to do that?

And I think it comes back to understanding what you are trying to achieve. Like, what the thing that you value the most. Is it. Is it your career? Is it your health? Is it your families, your friends? Is it wealth? Is it freedom? Is it time? What is it? And that's such a fucking hard question to answer. And I genuinely don't know the answer for myself, and it's a very personal question. And for me, you know, I've really been thinking recently around, like. Because right now I'm actually going through this interesting time where I feel so fucking motivated and so determined to win. I want to succeed. Like, genuinely. I will wake up some mornings and be so, like, I want to rage. I'm like, I. Like, I know that sounds really cheesy, but sometimes I, like, no. Saturday morning, I woke up, I had a good sleep. I woke up and I was like. I literally was like, I want to win so fucking bad. Got up and just, like, just attacked the. The day. Sometimes I don't feel like that. I don't want to get out of bed. I feel like absolute garbage. And I'm stressed. But yeah, the idea of success to me is really interesting because I started thinking about why do I want to win so bad? Is it for, is it for other people's opinions of me? Am I trying to be successful for others? Am I trying to be successful for me? What is the thing that is driving me? And I don't think it's for other people. I don't think it's trying to show other people that that's, you know, that I'm successful and that's why I want to do it. There's something deeply ingrained in me that is just so badly wants to win and to the point where it's like, you know, not that I'd go and say this to people because it's not necessarily individuals. It's just like as a competitive thing in my head, I'm like, fuck you. I want to like, I, I will win. You know, I, I can be better than that. We can be better than that. Like it's constantly so competitive and potentially pretty unhealthy level of competitiveness, to be fair.

Yes.

Because that's really, for me where my downfall is. The volatility and stress that that comes with when we're not achieving that. When I want it so bad, we're not there. And it's constantly like just never enough, you know, or not. Yeah, I don't know if it's never enough or just never. We're never at the level I want us to be or item.

Yeah, you expect, yeah. You got high expectations and the expectations are never met. And you keep doing that because you're always goal setting. So you're on an infinite loop, an infinite rigor, where it's always the next thing. It's an infinite game. You keep going, you set another goal, set another one, set another one. If I would have asked you six months ago, where do you think would be and if I said where we are now, you'd be like, holy, that would be amazing. I, I would love to be there. But when you're constantly setting those goals and the next thing and the next thing, so. And you spot on. So this was one of my major things at my previous job where we were exactly the same, all of us. Right. It was very self selecting into that team and the leader that we had, she was absolutely like that. Inspiring, motivating, never enough, hardwired, optimistic, going hell for leather all the time. The downside of that is it's very taxing. You get burnt out, you don't celebrate the wins you don't stop to smell the roses and appreciate what you've actually done. That's like the downside of that. And you keep going and keep going, keep going because it gives you that, you know, adrenaline, that sense of worth, that sense of achieving, that motion, that inertia to really keep going. And I would ask you, like, so you're what, why do you work at Collective Shift? Why do you run this company?

I love it. I get off on getting a new member in the door. I get off on us launching a new feature or product or us being able to raise money and bring a team in and seeing customers genuinely love the product. Like, I love to win. I love, like, making others win and I love to win myself. And that's. And obviously I like business and crypto and it all sort of like, comes together into one. And I like to be the underdog and I like to build something from nothing because I've always come, like, not that I've come with, come from nothing, but like, we were pretty, you know, I don't know what you call it, like, everyday family, like, we didn't have, you know, money, you know, mum and dad.

Yeah.

Sort of work, work, normal job. So the idea of building something and showcasing. Look, I think in the past I probably was like, trying to prove. Because I've done, like, because I went down this. I've been down this path before. I've been on this path where I sat down with a therapist and because I was going crazy trying to win so much. And I feel as I maybe go a year or two ago, I was trying to prove something to someone. I didn't know who that someone was. I was trying to prove something to them. That doesn't feel as strong now. It's not like I'm trying to prove someone, something to someone. I just want to win. I don't know how else to explain it. Like, it's so. You know what I mean? It's so strong.

I feel you, bro. I got the same thing.

It's like, even when I do, like, you know, the therapy and listen to all this stuff, that voice still comes back where it's like, just do some more. Just prove these fuckers wrong.

Take a big on them, you.

And it's like that very crypto thing where it's like, yeah, you do what you tell me I'm gonna win in my own fucking way. And it's like, it's that irreverence of crypto, that kind of underdog, real feeling and building something and getting that validation from the market. And you mentioned all these things with like getting a new customer and getting this. What is it about that winning feeling that really does it for you?

As in, as in like, because you're.

Doing all these activities to get a feeling.

It's euphoricness, it's pumped up. I want to fucking jump on the table and I want to, you know, rip my shirt off and go run four laps. You know, it's like, it's genuine excitement and passion and like hard work equals a result. I think that's the key, right? You work so hard on this one activity or these three activities and you don't win. And you don't win. You get kicked down your nose and denied and you're losing money. It's stressful. And then you get a win and you're like, yes. You know, that is what I love. That's what I love to play for.

And are you focusing when you, when you get up and you're super motivated, are you focusing on the long term goal of this company being successful, having a big exit, or you focusing on the short term? How do I win? What can we do?

Today? I struggle to look long term. Like, obviously I know where I kind of want to be, but it's not like I wake up and I'm like, oh, can't wait to be a billionaire, you know, like, it's not like that. It's like, it's like I want to get up like on Saturday, right? I had to do this new paycheck for invest. I got up, I was like, gonna nail this pitch. Like, let's go. Went to the gym, smashed some pre workouts, smashed some weights, went to cafe and just destroy this pitch deck, you know, that's. And I'm like, I'm getting excited now.

I'm like, it was, it was, it was actually awesome, man. Yeah, yeah, it was good. It's like, see like, just get on the pre workout, go into the future and maybe smash it. That was like, it was off the, off the, like Friday, man. Like when you came in, you're like, how are we going to be a billion dollar company? Let's go, let's go. We just brainstorm, wrote it all down. You wake up the next day, you're.

Like, no, no.

Explain. Like, I genuinely, I know this sounds really cheesy, but I genuinely woke up and I was, I don't know, I'm saying this. I was dreaming of success, mate. Like, I know that sounds so. I was like, yeah, like this, this. How are we going to succeed. I need to do this deck and that result of this deck is going to get us this fundraising and these guys are going to win and we're going to get the money and then we're going to win. Like, and that was like, let's go. Like I genuinely couldn't get into it and I know I'm definitely not always like that. So this is home. Please don't think I'm like, I'm this sort of like robot that just gets up and transition because I don't some days. Sometimes I feel even the last, like.

Before the last pod, we were pretty both down in the dump.

Like I'm so volatile. Like I go from different days and a really. There's a lot of variables, but what I found is like if I'm eating good, I'm going to the gym. The gym. The gym is. I've realized like I did not want to go to the gym. This one. I kind of shit sleep last night. So I was watching movies and fucking dead today. Last week, hungover from Saturday still. But I forced myself to go to the gym. And now I feel like I'm kind of tired, but I still feel like I'm up and I had a sweat out. I'm getting into it. Like I feel as though that is like I don't know what sort of chemicals are going on inside when you go to the gym, but it just fucking gets things moving, man.

It hits all those switches and it gets all that self talk and negativity out of your head where it's just like your best version of yourself.

Mate. How good I've got. I get the same thing where it's like, I don't know why, but usually it's on like a Saturday night and I'll wake up like, I'll go to bed and I'll wake up about midnight or 1am and I'll just feel like. And this, this is if I had like a cracking week or something's happened. Feel like you're lightning coming out of my hands, man. And between like 12:00am and 4:00am, I'll just sit in front of the computer and just smash something. And it's literally like a month's worth of creative work that will just come out and I'll be like, holy, this is like when I did that product strategy and I look back and on the Monday I was like, fucking, who wrote this, mate?

This is awesome strategy, man. You wrote literally is unbelievable. Like it is everything that anyone would need to understand our product. Like that Thing is worth a fucking like yeah. Billion dollars right there. You know what I mean?

Could you imagine how much you have to pay a team of MBAs to write that? That was like. And it's not tooting my own horn. It is, it is like a good thing that I'm proud to like show other people.

Right.

So hell. And it's like when you had that activation and you.

Oh.

And you cultivate that like state just so. And this is the thing they always say like innovation is the flower of a. Well tended.

Yes. Okay, I want to go.

And they say no.

Dp. I'm sorry, I'm sorry to interrupt. I'm going to. How do we get this spot more? Because I. How often do you get into act. Let's call it activation mode. Right. When activation mode is when you look at the time you're in this deep work. You're so fulfilled and like you're in it and just time flies by, right. And you get this most just the best work done and you're loving it. I had one on Saturday. I probably get them maybe once, maybe twice a week. You know, if I'm in the zone doing something I'm really loving, I'll get the like the MySpace. And how often do you get it and how do you get into the activation zone?

Okay. For work, maybe two to four times a week. Generally during the week with just things. Oh, probably at least 10 to 15, I reckon. Like. Yeah. So I've got. Yeah. So my brain's a bit different. Definitely neurodiverse with work and it like today I'm just like I'm gonna punch out a flywheel where I'm just like I'm feeling it. I'm in the mood. Let's go. Put everything else to the side. Got an Alice punch out a flywheel. I made a sick one. I'll show it to you later. So good. I was just like my brain was just thinking about it. I couldn't stop thinking about it. It's not going to go away. And I'm like, I've got this list of stuff to do. I'm like, nah, let's capitalize on it. Let's do this. And the way my brain kind of works is I get hyper fixated on a lot of things and I get task focused as well where I won't be able to stop thinking about the thing. I'll keep thinking about the thing. I'll just have to do the thing until it's done right. Even if it's just a short period. Of time. And it might be something like, I need to go and fix that sprinkler and do that thing. But I'll do it so well where I'm in a flow state and I'll be so happy that I just capitalize on it. That can be very, very bad because, you know, if I'm just working normally and I'll need to do a thing, but I'm thinking about this other thing and I'm like, oh, fuck, I really need to do that thing. I really need to go and. All right, but to get that, that's like, that's definitely a neurodiverse thing. But to get myself, let's say just general work into a state where I want to do a thing, it has to have a number of things. I have to be eating right, sleeping right, exercising. So I think my body has to feel good, comfortable, relaxed and loose. There can't be any tension there. Right. In order to get into that state. And then I'll need some kind of stimulus. So it'll either be intrinsic motivation, so coming from myself, or extrinsic, where it's, I'll talk to you and I'll get excited, or I'll talk to a customer or the team, or I'll see someone else's product and I'll go, why the don't we have that? I need to be like that. I want to be like that. What is it going to take us to get there? What do I need to build or create or strategy or plan in order to get that? Because I want to be that good. So really it comes down to, yeah, not having that tension, feeling loose, having that well tended garden. You know, it's. It's fed, it's fertilized, it's watered, it's ready to go. And then what do you need to bloom? And it's always some kind of some book I've read or things I've listened to in a guided meditation or a text from you or a voice message that gets me amped, son. And then I'll like, oh, I'll have to write that down and bring it in. That's generally what will happen. Like creating that scenario and then having that either internal or external stimulus.

We're so similar, man 100. First of all, the garden has to be water. Like gym, eating good water, slept well. The second one, the most important one for me, which I've realized as well, is.

A deadline. If I have a deadline that I have to have something done by, I usually am one to procrastinate right after the last minute. But if I had that deadline, I'll fucking make that deadline, you know, if it's really important to me. The third one is no distractions. So Saturday, Saturday morning, Dubai time, no one's awake, us is asleep. You know, Aussies aren't working. There was no distractions and I just hustled from eight like it was just four hours. I had these four out of literally four hour activation zone where I wasn't doing anything else.

Yep.

Didn't check social media, didn't fucking apart from my knock, my water over the table, if went fucking everywhere because I was so excited. Like I was just sitting at my, at the desk of the cafe and smashed out this deck with everything I needed. Had operational, it had growth metrics, unit economics, it had product strategy, it had team credentials, it had three months, three month, three year, five year plans, acquisition strategies in four hours. Man, it was unbelievable, right? I couldn't say, I was about to say you couldn't pay MBAs, but I don't know, I'm not MBA. I had to do that.

But you would get, you get very generic shit if you paid MBAs. If you paid a top tier consulting company, you wouldn't get what you pulled out.

But that for me is like, I need to do more of that. How do I do more of that? Well, for starters, I think I just have way too many fucking meetings every day. I've got. And I think the listeners at home have probably got that in their world, in their lives. Like having the open calendar, having the time where you've got time to do deep work when you don't need to drive to work, you don't need to go this lunch date, you don't need to have this meeting, you don't have to. These fucking slack messages, you don't need to. You know what I mean? You've just got an open slather to do this one thing that you need to get done that is so vitally important that you cannot do in 10 minute chunks. Have like a little 15 minutes here, 20 minutes there. You've just got to go deep, just get it done.

Yeah, and the thing for me is like I can't just turn that state.

No, it's not a switch.

I can't do it. It'll. Yeah, it's more about noticing when you're feeling it and how to capitalize on it. So today, yeah, today was that day for me where I only had this meeting today. The rest was just casual stuff that I can move around and work that just needs to get done, that can always wait till tomorrow. And that's when I was. And I got into that state and I recognized it and I built that flywheel. Yes. So it's having the, the doing all the stuff for your body, but having that free time. So when it comes, you can capitalize on it. Because if you've got a meeting, you're.

Done capitalizing on the energy. It's like, it's like a light. It's like a rocket ship or lightning going through. When you see it, you go fucking grab it and then just use it. That, my friend, is. That's exactly how it happens. But you have, there is things you can do to generate more lightning bolts. Like if you're feeling shit, you're constantly like, you know, not sleeping well, you're eating shit. The lightning bolts can be far, you know, few and far between. But if you're doing, you're watering the garden, you're taking time off, you're doing the thing, you're setting yourself up for the lightning bolts, that's where you can really take it and capitalize.

So you and I were talking about this last week or the week before, before Grand Final. And we, we were working hard, we were, we were tired, we were cooked. So, so many meetings, so much stuff going on. And then we had a day off. It was a public holiday and we both had a day off. I spent the day painting and gardening. I don't know what you did. Probably sleeping lazy dog. And then we start texting and my God, I'm like, look at our products. How do you feel when you see this and you're like, holy shit. And then we just literally solved so much shit in about an hour. Just over asynchronous text, over WhatsApp. Because our minds were free. We were doing other stuff. We weren't caught up in the minutiary of how our operations work and what our people are doing and what we need to plan next. It was this big, you know, 10,000 foot thinking and it was just unbelievable.

So fascinating, right, Because I hadn't taken a day off in between there we were sort of talking about before like that creative juices and flowing when you're not just always bogged down in the weeds like having that time to be creative. I was so hungover yesterday, I'm not going to lie because we had a big day on Saturday.

But how many messages did you wake up to me like from fucking yesterday, like in Slack and WhatsApp, you know? You know, and some of it was, you know, questionable at best. But.

My mind, I was literally lying in bed watching the Wolf of Wall street because my favorite fucking movie, and all these things were popping up, and I was like, wow. Although I am running at about, you know, 17% here, the idea of taking yourself out out of what you normally do. And for me, that was just going out and hanging with friends and not thinking about working at all for probably, like, a day. And it's like light bulbs will sort of like spark out. Even though it's hungover as fuck. There's this stuff that was popping up. It was like just a part of your brain. When rested or done, something does something else opens up and just allows some creativity to be flowing there. And this is the other thing I realized with my lightning bolts. I get my lightning bolts when I'm not here. Like, I'm in my hotel room at the moment. If I go to a cafe or a Starbucks, yeah, dude, there'll be. There'll be. There'll be some lightning around. Because I'm just like. I plug in my headphones.

Oh, my.

Out of my. You know, every day, and I'm just there to do a job. And it's like, you just wire in.

This is the thing. Like, you're in a cafe, you see different people. Like, oh, they look weird. I wonder what their life's like. And you just start thinking about different things. This just reminds me of, like, when you look at, like, artificial intelligence and models. You have data that goes into a model, and then you have an output. So you've got some kind of stimulus going in. It goes inside, and then you have an output. And we're exactly the same. We've got these programs running in our brains, these loops, these kind of, you know, habits and everything else that we were taught. Like, don't touch this. It's hot. Don't go over there. Do this thing. Show up to work at this time. All this sort of shit running just in the background. And if you're doing the same thing every day, you're working from home, you're talking to the same people, you're talking about the same stuff. Your world is very small, and the problems that you want to solve are not going to get solved in that way. But if you do something different, you go and lift weights, you go for a walk, you look at nature, you talk to someone you've never met before, you go to a different cafe, you go on a holiday where you don't understand the language. And all those kind of people, all of this kind of stimulus changes your worldview. It breaks that sequence in your brain. It gets you thinking in a different way, gets you really creative, and helps you to solve those problems. I'm a big fan of it, man. I'm going to start going out to WeWork, man. I got to do it.

You took me up there.

Beautiful view. When I was looking at that view from that building, I was like, holy. Like, the juices.

There's people around you that are also just juices flowing like. Like, let's. Let's go.

They're getting after it.

Yeah.

Like, everyone's there building companies, getting after it. And like, at home, I can kind of like, you know, be lazy and that kind of stuff. And you can talk to your staff and everything, but there's also, like, that power and control where they'll react to you in a certain way. But you go out there and you're like, what's this guy doing? He hasn't moved in six hours. He's had 14 coffees. Why haven't I had 14 coffees? I'm a lazy dog. I've got to get after it, mate.

You know what I mean?

Like, who the is this guy? He thinks he's better than me.

Let's go. You. You drink more code than any mate. Get. Let's go. I'm gonna be.

Yeah, let's go. So this comes back to, like, I heard a quote, and they say to ask yourself, there is only one question, and the question is, what are you afraid to feel? And it's a very hard question. And if I ask you about, you're motivated, you're building collective shift, you're doing all these activities, you're doing them for a reason. What are you afraid to feel if you don't do those activities, what would you feel?

I've thought about this, and it's a. It's a bad place. It's letting people down. That's. It's the idea of failure and failure in the eyes of your peers that you failed. That is a fucking awful feeling. And I've sat there for a little bit. I'm like, I do not want that.

And is it failure that you're not doing anything or failure because you've not done the activities? What I'm getting at is, is it okay to do all this stuff and then the outcome is not what you want, or is it more the I'm sitting at home being a lazy dog.

Failure, that everything we're doing here will not work like it? But the feeling of. The feeling Anything but success.

So interesting. So this is why you're like. Because you said on the other, like last week on the pod that I'm like, you're a mad lad. You just get after it. And he's like, bro, I just look at the things that need to be done. If it needs to be done, I have to do it. And literally the way we've structured this business is this is where we need to get to. These are the set of activities that give us the highest chance of success. We need to execute on these. And every time you do those. So this is really interesting because I'm kind of. I'm. I'm exactly the same up to the point where I can't control the outcome. I want to succeed. I will do whatever it takes to succeed. But if that day comes, I have to be okay with that outcome where it's like, people guess, Marcus decide. That's right. So the reality is I'm going to go nuclear up until that point where we have to stop this, right? Until they absolutely say, you know, no.

Fascinating.

But if that day comes, I. I will be. I think I will be. I don't know. Because the day hasn't come, right? So, yeah, that I will have to be okay.

Because you, that you sort of. You level me out. And since you and a man both do, when, When I come to you guys with a problem or something's going on and you guys really provide that balance in my head, because in my head it's like, no matter what.

We will fucking have to win, you know, like, there is no other choice.

So, yeah, there is no plan B. And that's. That's great. And that's the way we all think, right? Like, that's absolutely what we're going to. There is no plan B. We're all in. What happens on the day.

If you fail?

See, that is the real challenge. Because I've been in your situation before when I was young and I thought exactly the same way. And you just keep going. It's an infinite kind of thing and it's kind of a stoic thing where you should appreciate the things you have and where you're going. But if they're taken away from you, it should not affect who you are and your life and your self worth and everything else that happens. And you see this in normal life where people build up a lifestyle, they have a house, they go to restaurants, they do all this stuff. Suddenly they lose their job, those things get taken away and they're like, who am I? And if you're tying, you know, your identity or your success metric to something you can't necessarily control. That's something you really want to look at. Because if that day comes, it's not that you failed and you're not a success. You got off the couch, you worked your ass off in insane situations. Like over the last year. You're raising capital in the hardest bear market. You built an amazing team, and this business will continue, but really tying it to the outcome, it's more about the things that you've achieved along the way, the things that you've learned and the skills you have and the person that you'll become.

Yeah, I definitely see what you're saying, and I think I used to.

So when all this shit happened last year with, you know, old mate, like, I think that was the toughest period of my life. And because I was so with at one. Oh, my personality, my. Who I was was the business. So if the business failed, I failed.

Yeah.

And I still have a lot of that, right? I still have a lot of that. Probably 90%. Where I get that 10% or where I'm like, I probably was at 100%, I'm probably now gonna say, like, it was a 90% and it fluctuates. But when I'm doing other activities, when I'm playing golf, when I'm traveling, when I'm meeting new people, when I'm doing other activities, I can start to see the different. Like, there's band and then there's, like, work. There's two separate things. However.

That'S a big. Yeah, it will be. What will it be? Because in my head, there. There isn't. There is no scenario where we fail, because I don't even think about it. It's not gonna happen. But. But that's. That's the thing we're trying to get at. Because if it does, then it's like, now you're probably, you know. You know you're gonna be in trouble.

What I'm getting at is it is. And that's. That's the mentality have. I'm exactly the same. This business is never going to fail. Right? I will do whatever it takes. Like, you pick up the phone anytime, like, bro, what do you need done? Let's do it. Like, it's always like, soldier in the trenches. Let's go. If the event happens, it'll be. It'll be sad for me. I'll have a cry. It's gonna suck. I'm gonna miss the team, but it's not going to Be a catastrophic event where I'll be catatonic for months and not understand what my life is.

So this is where you and Feliza's home. Aaron is very balanced. Right. You can go to Bergson any problem. He's like, yeah, no worries man. This is how we're gonna sort it. Bergs is, he's got the.

I'm glad you think that, mate. I feel very balanced. It's something I continually have to work.

You can ride a one wheel bicycle, mate, you are fine.

Me on the other hand, coming in, guns are blazing. One day I'm oh, it's the end of the world. One day it's like we're gonna be at Mars. Like I am all over the shop.

This is like the last episode, how we went into it and we're like ultra negative. Then Ben had a break and he had a really good phone call and we come back and we do the look back to the episode and we're all happy.

So when you listen to the last episode, the intro is gonna be. So it's gonna be popping off and then the episode is just gonna be just, just dull and depressive.

Oh yeah. But I, to be honest, I haven't, I haven't listened to it yet. But I loved that episode because it was hard. We were both really tired and we went really deep as well. It was just really talking about what's going on. I'm interested to see what kind of a list.

When do we record that? Thursday or Friday. This is, it's recording on Monday like four days later.

Yeah.

It's quick turn around like so. And this and this. Like when you're playing games like we are. When I say games, I mean startup life. You are playing, you are long term games.

Yeah.

No, but I mean when you're playing early stage startup games, you're playing all or nothing. You're playing huge bets.

Yeah.

On red and black and you're spinning that wheel and you're going to have wins and you have losses. It's not this linear growth. It is like a bitcoin chart, you know, and it is really hard when you don't have a clear path to success to be balanced and always, I guess okay with everything that happens. So what I found in startups is that it's hugely volatile and I think really where you should be living is somewhere in between, you know, like running through here. But what happens is you go above and below and Gary V talks. That is all the time. If you can bring that down and not think about Too much of the winds and not go too deep in the depressive nature. Bring it in. You're probably going to have a much better time. But I certainly struggle with that. I'm. I'm like a meme coin to chart, man. I'm.

I. I'm getting better at it, but I'm still the same and I need to. There's a brilliant book. It's called Ego is the Enemy. I don't know if you've read it, but I need to reread it for sure. And it basically goes on about what your ego is. There's a lot of stoic philosophy in there as well. It's a very short read. It is. You can read in an afternoon. And it's absolutely brilliant. It's a book that you'll read over and over again. And really, it goes on about that exact thing. Like, what do we tie our identities to? If we take that away? Who are we? What do we really have? Are these things really important? And even Iman is really good at this. Like, if you drop something and you'll drop a voice message and I've still got this thing where you're like, oh, bro, the product should be like this. We should have this. You should have that. My initial instinct is like, I'm not good enough. Why haven't I done the thing? And I have to catch myself and be like, no, this is a product thing. This is not tying to your identity, your self worth, how well you've done in the company. This is just another challenge we need to do. It's external to me, something that flows through me, but it is not who I am. And I don't need to take this personally, but I still have that initial instinct and have to catch myself. Go take a breath. Right, cool. I absolutely want to get to that spot. How do we get there? And it's about the thing and it's not about me. Do you have that as well, where you kind of feel like it's 100? It's like you with the team, like, oh, yeah. Oh, it's brutal, isn't it?

An example.

Yeah. I can't think of an example right.

Now, but cash flows, the cash flow is a classic example.

Yeah.

Like, you would feel like a failure if you didn't raise enough money and we didn't have collective shift 100.

Yeah.

And you think about all the people, the teams, their jobs, and you feel like you've let them down. When in reality you're doing way above and beyond, like, let's say, like, you'd expect 8 out of 10 from people. You're at about a 15 with the things you're doing. You're flying to different countries, talking to millions of investors, going to conferences. It is way above and beyond. No one would point to you and say, you have not put your.

I would. If we didn't succeed, I'd be like, fucking oath.

So, so would I. Not for you, but for me. And I would. I look back and I'll always be like, I could have done more. And now I still say those things, but I'm more comfortable because I don't feel 100. Where I just have this guilt and obligate obligation and regret that I didn't do enough because I could have done.

Why do we do that? Is that. Is that. Is that personal expectations of ourselves are so high that we could never achieve enough unless we win? Like. Like, why are our expectations so high?

I think it's a couple of things. It's. We want to succeed. We've got really high expectations. But it's not that we have high expectations. It's that we keep resetting them and we never reach those expectations. It's almost like you don't have that middle chunk or that filter kind of where you go through, and it's constantly setting, resetting, having, having that. It's like a escalating loop, right, where you, you, like, look at this business. I came into this business. I. My. Right, we're going to change this. Had success. More, more. Got my first bonus. Oh, my God. Amazing. Let's go harder. Let's go more. Your team starts to burn out. You just, you constantly. It's like that in life. They call it hedonistic adaptation, where it's like, okay, you get a bit of money, you go to fancy restaurants. Now you go to a fancier restaurant, and then now you're going on big holidays, all of a sudden you're pouring out bottles of champagne in Dubai. You constantly adapt and you're leveling up. Keep going lifestyle.

Do you think it's also impacted by.

What other people have? He's got the Ferrari, he's pouring out the bottles of champagne. He's flying everywhere. I want to be like, 100.

Oh, and this. This is the dumbest comparison in the world, where you look at one aspect of a person's life and you're like, why the do they have that? And I don't have that. And I look at my mates and I'm like, some of them are in consulting. They're earning like 300k I'm like, why don't I earn that much money? Then I'm like, but look at their lives. I'm like, if I want to do that, I have to take everything from their lives. Do I want the travel? Do I want the hours? Do I want the stress? Do I want all the stuff that goes with it? Do I want to not enjoy my day to day doing something? Like I'd prefer to do something that I love. And you can't just have that one sliver of a person's life. You have to take their whole life. And you look at the most successful people and you're like, oh, they got $10 billion. Look at them with all these women, all this kind of stuff. Yeah, but look at their history. They've got like five divorces. Their children don't speak to them. You have to choose and select and be, you know, with so much intent. What do I want my day to day to be? Life and where am I actually going? And it's a whole thing where comparison is the thief of joy. If I'm comparing myself to someone else's journey, it's not about them and what they have, it's about me. Am I better than I was yesterday? That is the only thing that matters in life. If you're improving yourself and you're leveling yourself up and you're running your own race and your journey and that is the measurement, not against someone else.

Practice that self reflection. It's probably a self reflection process, you know, like I think when I journal, for example, and I love journaling, but that's more like a constant stream of thoughts. I'm not reflecting on my day yesterday or my week or my last 12 months. Do you go through a process of self reflection to stay in your lane? Because I feel as though that's probably one of the best ways to, to, to remember where you've come, where you're going.

It is the best way. And I do it in a couple of ways. I need to journal more, but I generally write when I've got too much on my mind and it's generally when I'm stressed or feeling unwell or something like that. And I go back like a year or two and I read that kind of stuff and I'll probably like, honestly, I'll probably only write this like maybe four times a year. I need to get better at it. But just looking at my thought process and how I was thinking and what I wanted to achieve, and I look back and I'm like, man, I was Dumb. None of that shit mattered at all. And. But then the interesting one is where I do the daily manifest where I write down my goals. I'll go back, I've only done it for about a year and a half. I'll go back and I'll look at my goals and I'll be like, holy shit, I've achieved a lot. I remember how I felt and one of my major goals was to join Collective Shift. Like, that's literally what I wrote down. And we tried to do it a while ago, but then, you know, a lot of stuff happened with Old Mate. But that was my main goal and that's what I was focused on and now I've achieved that and I look at my day to day and the things that I can do and it's just, it's epic. It is continual self reflection. You can either do it like the hardcore people do it, like daily. You take 10 or 15 minutes. At the end of the night you write down some stuff and you reflect on it. You go, great, what can I learn? Or you could do it weekly, or you could do it monthly. But it's more about, for me, it's about how I was thinking and what I thought was important.

I think I use goals as a prioritization method. It helps me prioritize what's most important, important to do day to day. But the reflection part is such a fascinating angle that I don't do enough of because I've certainly opened up. I've got a. I've got a personal goal spreadsheet that I probably haven't looked in eight months. I'm actually like, now I'm like, I actually want to check it out and see what the hell I was trying to achieve. Because when I have done that, usually you achieve way more than probably what you initially set out to achieve. All the goals, you look back and go, Jesus, that. Is that really like, man, there's a long way, I've come a long way since then.

Or you've got those goals you still haven't achieved because you keep putting them off. And you look back like, fuck, I still haven't done that. Like, even with mine, like automating a lot of my finance, I still haven't done. Like, I absolutely have.

But then why, but, but then why like a goal? Is that because it's like, is it nice to have? Is it something you really need? Because I feel as if it's something you really need. You would have done it by now.

I don't necessarily really need it because I'm just doing it manually, but it's more about cognitive offload and a lot of it, I just can't be fucked. And with me, I, I'm definitely a warrior and I make things more difficult in my head than they're actually going to be. So for me, it's like I'll have to write a contract with my trust, open trust accounts and do a few things in my head. I'm like, just can't be fucked up way too hard. And in reality it's probably about two hours worth of work, but. But still I put it off and put it off and put it off.

What about the.

And, but also it's finance because boring.

So it's like the, what's the, what's the result there? What's the, what's the win? You know, we, we, we as humans do things with rewards. What, what's the reward for that?

Yeah.

Okay, so the challenge here is it's a long term win. So what it does, it cognitively offloads the things I have to do that I'm doing manually. It'll save me chunks of time here and there, but it will absolutely make sure that every time my dollar cost averaging and everything that I'm doing is going to the correct areas. It's structured correctly, it's tax efficient, and the payoff is in 10 to 20 years. That's the problem because the payoff moves there. The payoff's not like, I'll go to my fridge and eat a meal. Yeah, mate. Oh, that's it. That is absolutely it. Oh, and man, speaking of startups. Oh man, I gotta tell you this one thing. So I went to my old boss I used to work with, she had a book launch and it was fantastic to catch up with the old crew. And they're asking me, they're like, oh man, what's startup life like? I'm like, man, it's pretty much the same, except there's a lot less bureaucracy, I can move a lot faster and everything could end tomorrow. And like the whole thing we've been talking about is like moving towards that goal, going super fast. But you've always got that thing at the back of your head where this could just stop. Like if I make the wrong product choice. You know how you saying you're putting it all on black or you're putting all on red or the market may change or you may run out of money. It's such a fascinating game.

It's a really, really good way to like.

It is.

And I think you're constantly running.

You'Re constantly jumping off a cliff trying to build your plane before you hit the ground. And you keep on the way doing it. That's literally what you got to do. Once you build the plane, then you start to take off again. But then you need to rebuild the engine mid flight and if you it up it could be all over. Yeah. Like it's a constant battle of running against time, market conditions and building something that no one's ever built before to win a game that no one's won before.

It's crazy. You, I like that. A game that no one has won before for. That's exactly it. You're, you're running that race to find something, to find something new, something interesting, something someone hasn't seen before. And you're like I'm going to build something around that. I'm going to capture that market. I'm going to win over here. And you're betting the farm on it. You're betting your time, you're betting your money.

You're all in betting careers.

You're putting hours like yes, yes, that is it. Because humans think in a way where I'll work here, then I'll work there and I'll slowly build up. You're like, you're basically saying F you to all that stuff. I'm going to go over here, I'm going to do something absolutely nuclear. And even with me. Think about it. I was in a corporate life, I was building it, you know, I was C level, I was working in health could change a couple industries if I wanted. Now I'm in crypto. Something that people don't understand, they think it's a scam. I'm on podcast with you, I'm swearing my ass off, I'm giving you the fucking beans. And I've never been happier in my life. But you burn those bridges and you find that hey, that life wasn't really for me and the people that want me and want to be around me will be self selecting and now they know who I am because I have this leverage content on the Internet. Do you think it's a very like.

Success motivation for you? Because I'm starting to think about myself it I'm wondering the success motive to win. Motivation comes from a place of trying to find happiness. It's trying to find a place of comfort. It's trying to find a place of abundance and freedom with, with maybe that the finance the wealth gives you or the, you know, the, the status it gives you by getting to that certain level, does it come from a place of happiness?

So.

So for me, I really thought hard. So my answer to this question about why I do this is I wanted to move into another area that was less restrictive. And I fucking love crypto. I've consulted with you for ages and I'm happiest when I do that. I'm happiest, God knows why, looking at your horrendous face. But when I'm talking to you, we're motivating each other. We just, we love the game, we love business, we like going in deep. And I wanted to be at the stage where I'm an owner in a business as well. Like, it ticks all these, like, generic boxes. It has a potential to build wealth. Yeah, I don't get paid at my top level that I would be if I was consulting or something like that. But my day to day is I get to build something awesome with awesome people that I really like that. I flew over last year and met them all. And it's a really special thing. I get to put all my skills on display. And I think for me, what it gives me is it gives me fulfillment. And I need that thing every day where it's. You need something to do, someone to love, and something to hope for. And I've got someone to love. I've got multiple people to love. That's great. I need something to do and that's something to do. Has to use my entire brain. This business absolutely does that. And then also something to hope for. I have lots of things to hope for, but I also get the business thing to hope for as well. And that hope is that we can all work together, carry out those activities and be a successful business.

Perks. Fucking hell. An hour's just passed.

Holy shit, mate. So in the background, we've got this huge thing written about all the stuff we're going to talk about. We're going to have to say that for next episode. We're gonna have to go in. We did have to, like, wrap this puppy up.

Nothing that was on our agenda, but that was the best episode we have recorded so far. That was intense, man. That was good. That was incredible. Just, just, just. Before we get into Meme of the Week and Meal of the Week listens at home, let us know what you'd like. Are you struggling with the same. Are we just on a completely different planet? Are we talking a language? Let us know. Like, hit us up on Discord. Twitter. We've got our Discord, which is a link below Bergs and Ice Twitter is the link below. Fucking send me a message. Email me whatever the hell you want. I would love to hear, like, what are your experiences with finding happiness, finding motivation? What drives you to do the things each day that I'd love to know.

Absolutely. Yep. Hit Ben up at Ben Simpsonau on Twitter and me at Baby Backburg. Give us a chat, we'll chat back. Get amongst it, man.

I need, like, I need a mate. How good that was?

That was. We went deep, man. We're going into some, like, deep mind there. Like, how do you really feel and why do you feel it? That ain't easy, man.

Right, let's go. Let's, let's.

Let's lighten up the mood.

Let's.

Let's go for Meme of the Week.

What do we got this week?

We're not gonna get canceled, but God damn, this one had any stitches. So this. This is a photo of an mma.

But this is from Zaza Myota, right? They said. They say Shorty looked like she snorted a drumstick.

What?

The poor lass has been. She's being bashed up, right? She's been in a fight in mma. She's in the Octagon, and she's got this giant hematoma going up her nose into her head, and it's just swollen and it looks like a chicken dumpster. It literally looks like she snorted a chicken. Her other eye is shut and you're like, oh, my God, she is so tough. But I looked it up my. Hot damn, that's a chicken drummy. I'll grab that out of my head and just eat it. That looks delicious, man.

That does not look healthy.

That. That is Meme of the week. And I got sent another one today that I just have to do. It's your boy, Prince Charles. Oh, sorry, King Charles. King Charles. And he's back with his sausage fingers. And they've literally gone and got fresh sausages from the butchers and replaced his whole hands with sausages. This is the best looking thing on the planet. I can't believe it. And just the look on this mad lad's face. He's like, yeah, I know. I got sausage fingers. What about it? This is a bloody 10 out of 10 Photoshop job, mate. How good?

Oh, dude, that's classic. Classic sausage fingers.

Oh, my God.

All right.

Might. Shall we. We'll go into meal of the week. Did you want to do. We'll do yours first because apparently you weren't very.

Mine's not. Mine's actually not food this week. Burks.

Let's just share your meal and mate, this is what you're eating. Bear market blues. What are you eating over here, mate?

Ashisha. I'm not. Because I'm not eating anything. I was out for. I was in Dubai, so went and had some high quality. Like.

I'm not sure if it was actually Arabic or. Or Turkish food, but it was bloody gray. It was big meat stack. I should have taken a photo of burgers. It's incredible. And then had. I'm not a big. Like I've never really had shisha properly. So tried it out. Definitely interesting experience. I'm not sure if. Does it have to tobacco in it? Shisha. Like is it. Is it actually like nicotine?

Yeah, it's like flavored tobacco. Yeah.

So probably won't be having it too.

Often but depending on the one you have. But generally that's what we won't be having.

Me too often, but it had great flavor and it was interesting. Like it's, it's. People are sucking them down, man. Over here. Like they love it everywhere here.

Oh, I love it as well. Like you just get in there and just blow. Big clouds, lad. What flavor did you have, mate?

A bit of grape. It was actually pretty nice. Oh, big meat stack.

I love cherry. Get on cherry.

They had a whole menu of flavors inside. Oh.

Oh man. And just having like some like slow.

Cooked meat, like some lamb or something. I like. I had a. I had a mixed meat combo like chicken, lamb, like bread, tzatziki sausage. Yeah. Oh, mate, I should have taken a photo of it.

That sounds phenomenal.

What do you go for us?

Oh my God. All right. Was that your first shisha?

What would you give it out of ten?

Look, probably like a six just because it's, you know, probably not that healthy.

Yeah.

And you know, I probably wouldn't have it all the time. I had to try it but it's not really my thing.

Fair enough, mate. This was my.

So. So this is a ribeye steak from meat and wine company. So went out there for the anniversary. Took a couple of nights off with the. With the Mrs. Highly recommend just having everyone out there, dump your kids with the grandparents and have a night or two off with the Mrs. Just go to a hotel somewhere in the city, wake up, no kids, go to breakfast, walk around, walk by the river, have a ice cream, just get amongst it. Highly recommend it. Take some time out. Just a couple of days. Nice reset. So meat and wine co and whenever I have a steak I always, always, always have a ribeye because the flavor is just phenomenal. So here we've got a ribeye, medium rare, bowl of chips now with this. Oh, perfectly. So this is actually on the outside, so through the inside, it was probably like, rare plus. I love my steaks rare plus. But I always order medium rare because no one knows what's rare plus. But this was just one above medium rare. So you have medium rare, rare plus, rare, blue.

Oh. Oh, geez. You're nearly like. Yeah.

Wow. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a thing, mate. But they don't put it on menus. But chefs know what it is if they're a good chef. Smashing down wine with this. Absolutely delicious. Had a side of like. I love broccolini, man. These are just market greens. Nice toasted almonds, bit of lemon on there as well. Had some Dutch carrots with harissa paste, sesame seeds, and then, like a lovely light cooling kind of creme fraiche underneath. And, mate, here we go. The happy anniversary. This was chocolate fondant. Yeah. With. Oh, with hazelnut ice cream. And so the missus had a Frangelico with this, and then I had Pedro Jimenez, like a. It's like a pork cherry kind of thing.

Oh.

And it was just like this. This sticky, delicious liqueur that just tastes like dates and syrup. And it was so good. And then, mate, look at that. Just open it and just. Oh, phenomenal. I just. Oh, man, I wish I could grab that right now. This. This was just amazing. Oh, man, I would give this meal a 9 out of 10. I walked out of there so happy. It was just. It was amazing. Amazing. It was so, so good.

Anniversary now, now, mate.

Oh, yeah, it was brilliant, man. Like, you got to celebrate the little things, man. Now, should we do the accountability of the week, or do you want to. Do you want to skip it and.

Start next week? How soft do you want to be? Do you want to let that inner win or what?

Hit me, mate. Let's do it. Accountability right now. Let's go.

I'm hard as name. All right, let's go. Okay, okay. All right, listeners, so we've got a new thing. This is the hard thing or accountability of the week. This is shit that Ben and I don't want to do, we've been putting off. But we're all about personal growth, and we're going to hold ourselves accountable, and we're going to be accountable to you, dear listener. And this is the deal. So we've each got a thing, and we need to do the thing. If we don't do the thing, we have to pay $500. It's going to be 500 bucks a week. So it's not going to be cheap. If we cheap out and bloody don't do all this stuff. And that 500 is going to a bar tab and we're going to have a Ben and birds meet up at some point in time and all you degenerate are going to come down and that bar tab is going to be huge and it's going to be sick. All right, mate.

So.

The listeners screaming for us to not do our account, screaming for us to not not actually achieve the thing so we all get.

I think, I think the reality is. Exactly. But even if we're, we're champions and we do obviously, you know, this has to be hard, it has to be challenging, it has to be things we don't want to do. But even if we're $0 by bloody the end of the year or whatever it is, we're still gonna have a degenerate. So don't worry about it. Okay?

What? That's how we roll. Okay, so do you want to go first?

Okay, you do yours first. So here you go.

I travel a lot, as probably most of the listeners probably know. And I when it comes to going to the gym fucking soft. I usually go two or three times a week because I just can't be fucked sometimes. But I want to get five times a week I want to have that summer Bodbergs now single need to have that rig in order for the beaches in, in Australia back in December, January, but two or three months to get this bloody absolute mop.

Rig in order. So my accountability this week is to go to the gym five times in the course of seven days. Right? So I've gone today, I've got until Sunday to complete another four gym sessions. Now I know that for some people we might be absolute heroes now, but I don't say burgers. But I have not been able to get to the gym five times in a week in. I cannot know, I don't know how long, long fucking time.

So all right, five times you've done, you've done one. Now let's, let's put some more rigor around it mate, because I don't want you to soft out here. So when you go to the gym you have to at least say you're gonna do a thing like you're gonna. Yeah, okay, A certain amount or you have to go for a certain amount of time or what is it? I'll show this up.

Minimum 45 minute session. I've got an app that I use that gives me workouts. I've got to use the workout app five times this week for a minimum 45 minute session. Like proper sweat up, like none of these fucking bullshit. Walking backwards on the treadmill for 12 minutes and going home. Like, proper, proper pump on.

Amazing. All right, fantastic.

What are your thoughts?

All right, so mine's actually a very. A similar one. And it's the thing that I hate most, but I need to do the most. And I'm fine with working out. I'll go and lift, I'll do all this, but mine is stretching and in particular, doing yoga. So when I do yoga, this is the best thing for my body. I sit in a chair a lot, I'm lazy as fuck, I still lift and I, you know, I get amongst it, but I don't move in the way that I need to move. I hate doing yoga because it hurts, it sucks. It takes up my time. I feel like an idiot because they're all bending like, you know, 180 degrees, all this. I'm like, I can't even reach my toes, mate. So it makes me feel like a real idiot and it hurts. But it is the number one thing I need to do for my body and I feel so damn good afterwards. So I'm going to commit to yoga five times this week. Minimum half an hour. Yeah, minimum half an hour. And I'm just fucking gonna get amongst it because that flows onto my life. I don't get angry because I don't have niggling pain or tension or I can't quite lift properly and it, you know, prevents injury. It just makes my life so much better in every aspect. It is something I need to do and I'm gonna commit to that shit.

Go, baby. We're gonna have a couple of stretchy, flexible fit blokes here next week, I tell you.

Oh, mate. And here's the thing. You and I are not allowed to talk about our goals to each other until the next pod to find out if we've done it or not.

If one of us rocks up real, real depressed, the start of the pod, not gonna be happy.

Oh, mate, that's the thing. I don't care about the 500 bucks. I care about letting everyone down.

Letting down all our listeners that want to get drunk.

It's interesting. Like when I'm. Yeah, it's like if I just commit to myself and be like, yeah, whatever. If I've made a promise to someone else, I'm like, I have to do that.

I cannot let them down audio, dude.

Amazing.

What an episode. That was probably my favorite episode so far. Let us know what you think. Everyone, leave us a comment, send us a tweet, get in our discord. If you like this episode, feel free to share it around and we'll see you back next week.

Awesome. Champions.

Speak soon.

Catch you then.