42. How Bitcoin can increase from $20,000 to $1.4M by 2030

A research report put out by Ark Invest on how Bitcoin will increase from $20,000 currently USD to potentially 1.4 million by 2030. So, yeah, that's massive, Ben. Can you imagine? Welcome back to another episode of the Benneberg show in person. Today, ladies and gentlemen, I have flown over unwillingly to Perth to meet Burgs. Unwillingly.

Come on, son. You know, what's the best place on the planet? You couldn't wait to get here, mate.

Five hour flight, direct flight from Launceston, man.

See, that's how quickly you wanted to get here. You went a direct flight, didn't want to go through Melbourne. You're like, how do I get to Perth? The shortest time possible because it's the best place on the planet.

So they only had one flight, you know, per week that goes from Launceston and there's nobody on it because who the f wants to go to Perth?

Seriously? No, because there's only four people that live in Launceston, mate. Seriously. And that's the thing, everyone wants to come to Perth. There's no flights going back, mate. You got to go through Melbourne.

Anyway, long story short, today we are doing our podcast in person, which we're super pumped about. And we're kicking off today, first one with a research report put out by Ark Invest on how Bitcoin will increase from $20,000 currently USD to potentially 1.4 million by 2030. So yeah, that's massive, Ben. Can you imagine?

That's huge. So people holding bitcoin at the moment, imagine you got one, you got 20k USD. Well, 23k, so it's about 30 something thousand Australian. Imagine that just going to 1.4 million USD, which would be close to 2 million Australian. That is crazy. And that's in seven years time.

Yeah, that's not too far away. Now Ark Invest, they buy. You know, I don't know too much about these guys, but it's run by Cathie Wood. She's an OG crypto, you know, investor. And I think they're. Are they a VC fund or a hedge fund? They're a research firm of some description, but they don't just do bitcoin, they do a lot of different other industries. Bitcoin is probably one of their main ones and they put out this 153 page report. Now not all of this is bitcoin, but as we've sort of gone through it, what they're basically outlining here is the potential growth opportunity for bitcoin. And one of the Most fascinating things that they've put in here is the bitcoin use cases because I think a lot of people don't realize the potential growth for bitcoin and what it could actually do. Now what they've done is they've split this between a bear case, a base case and a bull case. So the bull case is a $1.48 million Bitcoin by 2030, the base case. So what they're saying is kind of the average is what they're thinking is $682,000 Bitcoin by 2030. And the bear case is still a quarter of a million dollar bitcoin burges. That's still about a 10x from here.

So they reckon the worst it's going to be, the worst case scenario is a 10x258. And if we look through these, the bear case is $258,000 per Bitcoin. That's a CAGR of 40%. So CAGR is compound annual growth rate. That means between now and, and 2030. So over the seven years, each year it goes up by 40% year on year. For the base case it's 60% CAGR and the bull case is 75% CAGR which is just insane.

Insane. Now they've listed out eight different Bitcoin use cases here. I'm going to go through each one here because I think this is really fascinating for listeners at home that may not realize, I guess the other areas of bitcoin's trying to penetrate in. So obviously the most obvious one for me is the digital gold. And, and what they've done here is they've outlined the total addressable market of digital gold is the gold market cap. Now what Ark investor saying let's just look on the base case burges like you know, we get pretty excited about the bull, but let's look at the base case. They think in seven years time that Bitcoin could penetrate 40% of the total market of gold, which is wild. That's massive.

The market cap of gold to keep it easy, let's call it 10 trillion.

Yeah, that's huge.

Yeah, so it's going to be 4 trillion. At the moment it's about 440 billion. So that's a 10x from here.

And like if we think about, I think the digital gold space and out of all the bitcoin use cases here, bitcoin, sorry, the digital gold has the biggest penetration rate that they are assuming for bitcoin. You know we think about digital gold like let's say you have a few million bucks of gold. You can't take that anywhere. That's sitting in a vault either at your place or, or some sort of gold vault in the city or somewhere that you got to lock it up. You can't take it, you can't throw it in your bag, you can't, you know, send it overseas, you can't cut it up. It's fucking hard.

You can try, but good luck.

Yeah, good luck.

Yeah.

Bitcoin has all the use cases where you can, you can split it up, it's decentralized, it's digital, it's borderless. And you don't have to lug around this massive, like, you know, imagine how much, how heavy is 2 million bucks of gold, mate?

Seriously, even like one gold bar, you know how they got the challenge where you have to get it out with one hand. Yeah, it's, it's just not an asset that you can carry around. It is, it is absolutely crazy. And in today's digital world, gold is making less and less sense.

Yeah, it is, it is. And obviously like that's very similar in a sense of it's limited supply asset, it's scarce and you can use gold for a lot of different, you know, fancy items, jewelry, etc. Etc.

Yeah.

But you know, for me, you know, digitization and holding that same amount of, you know, physical gold on a USB.

Stick, I'm all for, or even the brain wallet. Just holding that seed phrase in your head, traveling anywhere and then opening that wallet and being able to transfer it. What I really like about bitcoin is like the creators are like, it's peer to peer digital cash and the market's like, no, you're digital gold. The market has spoken.

Yeah, exactly. Now, heading to the next use case for Bitcoin here and I'm trying to think about what I think is the next most likely or the biggest sort of use case. It's potentially that seizure resistant asset. So this is a total addressable market of the global high net wealth, basically market individual markets. So if we think about individuals that have an absolute crapload of money, like in the tens, if not hundreds of millions of dollars, you know, as, as we say on the podcast all the time, you know, one of the hardest things is to grow your capital, then the next hardest thing is to keep your capital.

Sure.

And especially if you've got that amount of money, you're looking at different diversification strategies to, to make sure you keep that those assets. And a big problem for some of These guys is literally the idea that it could be seized. You know, especially if, you know, you may be overseas or if you're in a government or, you know, in a location where the government can do some pretty nasty things with your money. And holding hundreds of millions of dollars of cash in a bank is pretty scary.

Exactly. One day they could just say, hey, your money's not there because you got an intermediary, you're trusting someone else. Or if you've got a lot of money in property and they change the property rules or for some reason you have to get out of the country and go somewhere else.

Yeah.

You know, you will want a certain percentage of that to be in a seizure resistant asset. So if you've got 100 million bucks, you want at least a few million to start over. You would put it in something like gold or bitcoin. And if you really have to get out of Dodge, you want bitcoin because it's easier just to get on a plane and go.

Exactly. We saw this in Canada recently where they had the, the protests of the truckers. The truckers and the government said, right, oh, we're just going to cut their access to their money. And they just shut down their bank accounts. You couldn't get access.

Such a scary thought.

Imagine that. Yeah, imagine how scary that is. So anyway, they're basically looking. Here is the penetration rate on the seizure resistant asset is around 3% of the total global net worth individual wealth. Can you imagine 3% of the entire high net worth of individuals wealth in bitcoin?

That's insane.

I actually think it could be more. If you think about it.

And if we just took look at this, that is a huge amount of money. Shitload amount of money, Isn't it like $4 trillion just in global markets? No, no. 4 quadrillion in global markets. And then the majority of people, like 1% will own 99% of that.

And where do they have that money right now?

Exactly? Across heaps of assets, businesses, derivatives. Yeah. Bonds, cash, real estate, all this boring shit.

Why wouldn't you just buy a bit of bitcoin?

That's it. Well, when you get to that stage, it's not about wealth generation, it's about wealth protection. So you're thinking, how can I protect these dollars? How can I have it for my kids in perpetuity? How do I diversify across these assets so I have the biggest chance of success? No matter what's happening in all these different markets, I can still win. So you're going to look to New asset classes like bitcoin.

Okay, Number three, institutional investment. So the total market here is the institutional asset base. And we've seen this with the likes of, you know, Micro Strategy, Tesla Block. There's a lot of these institutional companies that are already putting their capital in, in, in Bitcoin. And again, it's a, it's, you know, whatever that might be. If you've got a massive balance sheet of a heap of cash, you know, you're. If, if we think like the cost of living is going up and the, the purchasing power of your cash for everyday people is going down, you can imagine these massive corporations that have tens, if not hundreds of millions of dollars of cash. They're losing money every day in terms of purchasing power.

This is something Michael Saylor bangs on about. And if we combine this with the corporate treasury, so it's a target addressable market of cash and cash equivalents. So think about this. You're a company, you're doing well. You got to. Let's look at Apple, you know, trillions and trillions on your bloody balance sheet. What are you going to do with all that money? Year on year, you are losing money. So you can do a couple of things. You can either invest back in your business or, or you can invest in other businesses and acquire them, or you can do financing activities which will be investing in companies buying bitcoin, whatever it may be. And people are starting to understand that you can't just hold all of your money in one asset class. You need to diversify. That's a very kind of, you know, sage and old rule. But now where they're bringing the newer assets like Bitcoin because even as a smaller percentage to hedge against all of those other ones. Because the current thing, if you think about monetary and fiscal policy, is you raise interest rates. Great. But it's a very blunt instrument. It affects everyone across the economy. Great things go up, your money gets inflated away. The customers you have have less discretionary spending so you can't rake in more dollars. How do you hedge against that and still survive as a company?

Yeah, it's like it's just leveraged. You know, it's leveraged compared to the individual with a massive business. So, you know, that's what we said. How much Bitcoin is microstrategy own now?

Must be a ridiculous amount.

That's the thing.

Like Michael Saylor will get on and go. You can only be known for one thing. And then one thing is buying bitcoin, right? You're literally buying. He describes it as L4. Right. So you're all the way down the stack and you're buying a company that's predominantly bitcoin, but you can't get the bitcoin out.

Fascinating. So anyway, that's. That's number three. The next one I'll talk about, I think, is the cash and equivalents burgs. And this is.

This is corporate treasury.

Yeah. So this is like, if we think about, you know, back to what we just spoke about, the amount of cash that's, you know, floating around in the system looking for a home, especially when you've got, you know, rising inflation rates, rising interest rates, you know, you want to have that cash in a. In a hard asset. I think that bitcoin makes a lot of sense. I think the thing that's probably stopping that right now is just from a regulation standpoint, a lot of, especially in the us all those corporations aren't ready to invest into bitcoin because they're worried about what the government can do to it. You know, like, there isn't enough clarity in the market in terms of, you know, if you're going to be risking tens, hundreds of millions of dollars, you want to make sure, you damn sure that you know that it's going to be safe wherever you're investing that. And I think that's what's restricting that at the moment. But that's a massive space as well.

And think about this. If you're a CFO of a company, you have to look after all the cash, the financing, investing activities, and, you know, bitcoin's a thing, and you've looked at the returns. But imagine going from a traditional person to then understanding bitcoin, how it works, what the risks are, how to get it into your company, how to get it out of your company, how to manage it, how to explain that to your board that it's a good thing and convince them. So a good example of this is the Perth Heat, the baseball team. Now, they're relatively small, but they went full bitcoin. And they actually got on an episode with Pomp and explained it, which was just. It was a cracking episode about a year ago, a long time ago, and in crypto, and they basically said, look, we're plugging into the bitcoin network. As soon as we do that, we got people like you Pump working for us. You're promoting it. Everything they do, they pay in bitcoin, their whole treasuries in bitcoin. They're now the Bitcoin Heat. It was just. It's it's incredible for them to go to that length and adopt that and plug into the network. That's the kind of extreme version of it. But he was explaining how he had to. Everyone thought he was mental, flat out.

Right.

Had to explain to not only his internal team, his finance guys, but then explain it to the board. And he said it took over a year for them to actually get it. And him just banging that drum constantly. And now they've gone full bitcoin. It'll be interesting to see how they've actually gone. Their treasury holdings. You can look at it on chain, which is really interesting, but that's a really good example of the benefits you can get. You mean plugging into bitcoin and holding your treasury in there?

You make a good point, though. Like the. The idea of when you have these massive businesses and you need to make a group decision and you're the innovator, you're the person with that, you know, niche information that everyone doesn't necessarily believe or understand. It's so hard to convince everyone. I remember when I was running my. Not. Not in bitcoin, but I was running my sportswear business before collective shift and trying to go in and convince a board of basically parents of sporting organizations to buy your uniforms. Like, it's. It's difficult because, you know, there's a misinformation. No one's in alignment. There's budgets, there's, you know, there's different strategies, people have different thoughts. Like, and you think about that on a massive global scale and talking hundreds.

Of millions of dollars and these large listed companies, for a decision like that, you may have to go to your shareholders.

Yeah.

And think about this. So these shareholders, who are the shareholders of the big companies, Big funds, mums and dads, super companies, convincing them to put a percentage of the money that is theirs because they're a shareholder into Bitcoin, where they're like, isn't that a scam? Isn't that what drug dealers use? And then getting a vote and then potentially putting yourself at risk as an executive and having a vote of no confidence or getting voted because year on year they vote for the executives, voting them out or voting the directors out. Putting a lot on the line, mate, that's it. You have to be very, very confident. And if you're a company that's huge with a lot of money, why would you do that?

Yeah.

But when your competitors start to move and they start doing it and you see the gains they have, it forces your hand. It's A similar thing with that we're seeing with AI, everyone's like, it's a flash in the pan. Don't worry about it. You see companies start to use it and you're like, actually, they're getting a lot of gains. We need to move as well because we're losing our competitive advantage and we're falling behind.

Yeah. No one ever wants to be first and I want to be last.

That's it. That's it.

And I think, yeah, it's just a massive opportunity. But the problem is, I think too, like, even going down and looking at, like, well, how do you store bitcoin? How do you store tens of millions of dollars of bitcoin? Who does that? What are the risks involved? Makes me nervous just thinking about it.

You know, Imagine being that guy. Oh, my God. The one that's got me excited here is national, state, treasury. So global treasury reserves. So the bear case was 0%, base is 1%, bull is 5%. So these are kind of, let's just look at it. They say state, nation states, let's just say countries. Keep it easy. No one knows what nation state is and weird definition. And think about this. Australia at the moment, we keep, you know, a lot of our money in cash. We have bonds, we do some kind of financing as well. And we hold overseas currencies as well. That's kind of like the basket of goods that we have to manage our capital. It's so interesting to think that countries are going to hold bitcoin now. And we see the companies with other countries without.

Stable currencies doing that already, things like El Salvador. So it's going to be interesting to see, like, do they start holding physical assets as well, like real estate? Do they start holding a bit of gold? They may already. And then holding bitcoin. Like, imagine a country holding some bitcoin.

It's a massive opportunity, man. I think this is what all the people don't really understand. Like, people think about bitcoin as just this, this thing that does payments and, you know, whatever. But it's like if you think about the existing financial system and even another one on here is the global remittance volume. I mean, God, the technology they're using now to do this is so archaic. Like, it hasn't been updated in years and years and years and years. I remember the story I told you about my brother when I sent him, you know, a thousand bucks and it got lost. It took 90 days for them to find it.

So I did. I did a transfer yesterday. It was A Sunday. And it was. It was five grand. It was five $1,000 deposits.

To a crypto exchange. I wanted to buy some crypto and it didn't go through. And then I got a call from the bank and you just popped into my head where, you know how they just canceled everything on Combat. Oh, God. But it was the loveliest lady, and she was like, oh, hi, how you going? You know, I just need to. If you're not comfortable giving you kyc, you can call the bank. But I saw it was a bank number anyway, so talk to me. She goes, oh, I've just seen these five things go across. I'm like, yeah, they'll mind. She goes, oh, did you send it to, like, Binance or something like that? And I'm like, yep. And she's like, oh, oh, did you like, click on a link or did someone send you something? She was just so nice about it. I'm like, look, I absolutely sent it. They gave me. Even the exchange I use. They gave me my own pay id and it pops up as my name within my bank account, which is really good and really safe. Send it across. And I'm like, look, I work in crypto education. It's all good. I definitely did. She go, oh, that's really good to know. I was like, because so many people get scammed just sending that across. But my point here is just trying to get into Bitcoin and. And then trying to send that to someone else or overseas is a nightmare. Imagine doing it like bank to another bank. It's at least two plus two settlement, plus all the fees, and then sending it across. We wouldn't be able to utilize a lot of the contractors we have today if we had to pay them in that way.

It's such a pain. And I think the reason these banks are having to crack down on this because I think so many people are stuffing up, they're getting scammed and it spreads A real obviously. Sorry. It's a real obvious thing that so many people are getting trapped into these bitcoin scams or crypto scams. And now the banks are probably getting influx with, like, customer support and needing their money back because everyone's getting done, so they're having to do all these extra checks. Even I was running one of our collective shift onboarding, one on one onboarding services on the weekend with one of my clients and, you know, coin spot now have a onboarding call you've got to have. So, like, we were buying. We're buying a, you know, we're Basically buying a bitcoin. We're buying, you know, 20, 30k of crypto and we bought, we bought, we bought on the exchange and we're moving at the cold storage. But it got stuck and we, we sent it to, we obviously do the normal testing transaction, send a little bit. Awesome. It arrived, went to send the full bitcoin and it was stopped and they had to do a phone call onboarding Coinspot. Guy calls up and goes through all the questions.

Yeah.

Do you know what you're doing, where you're sending it? You know, basically going through the bank checklist and it was nice about it. And I feel as though like my initial reaction was like, for fuck's sake. Like, why do we have to go through this? But then as I sort of listen to these questions, I'm like, okay, this is, this is obviously in response to a crapload of people getting stung by scams and doing the wrong thing.

Think about this. That's a very resource intensive exercise. That doesn't scale. They're doing it for a reason. And the reason is because on the back end, they have to unpick all the scams.

Yeah, yeah.

And even with my bank, I actually wanted to send six and a half thousand and I could only send five. If I wanted to send six and a half thousand, it's one to three business days.

Oh, my God. Oh, the withdrawal limits.

Yes.

Yeah.

So I could only send five grand for Osco. Yeah, send that through. And first of all, I was sending it through an account and I went to that account. It doesn't exist for some reason anymore and I only set it up two months ago. Amazing. So I had to use another one.

Sign a statutory declaration for my account. Amazing.

Goodness me.

Although we bag out banks, they are really good facilitators. They do keep you quality, quite safe. But honestly, the experience in crypto is good. Once you know what you're doing, you've had some experience. It is quite harrowing if you don't have that because the wheels are off and you're by yourself. You're literally meeting someone in a car park and like giving them gold and hoping they give you cash.

So there's a couple other ones here which we won't touch on because there's a couple of things I want to, want to get into before we wrap this up. So the other other bitcoin use cases are the emerging market currency, nation state, Treasury. We spoke about corporate treasury and the Economic Settlement Network. If you want to have a look at this report, head over to Ark Invest. We'll drop the link in the in the show notes. But the other thing I wanted to talk about Burks was some of the fundamentals of bitcoin and how they have improved year over year. So if you look at some of the bitcoin metrics, you know, whether it be lightning, network capacity, long term holder supply, bitcoin addresses with non zero balances, these are all really, really increasing at a rapid rate. So for example, the long term holder supply over the last four years starting in 2017 has gone from 51% of the long term holders holding Bitcoin 51% to 67 to 66 to now 71% of the total bitcoin supply is held by long term holders. Bitcoin addresses with non zero balance. So this is the number of million bitcoin addresses with more than zero bitcoin. So basically it's addresses with money in it. Over the last four or five years it's gone from 24 to now 43.5 million addresses all time high. 11 million more unique addresses than this time two years ago have more than zero Bitcoin. So the network adoption, the amount of people that are buying bitcoin continues to go up.

And that can also be people using bitcoin in the right way where instead of always sending it to one address, you can send key to people and they can generate your addresses. So each time they send it to a different address but it's still yours.

Yes.

Yeah. Which is super exciting to see the.

Other one, which is really cool, which is the supply of bitcoin last moved more than a year ago. So this is the amount of bitcoin that hasn't been moved in more than a year on addresses. 66% of the total supply of bitcoin has not moved in over a year. That's up from 61% two years ago, up from 50% four years ago, and up from 44% five years ago. So this is an extreme increase of people that are buying and holding, not moving it and using bitcoin for long term store of wealth. This is really exciting.

Absolutely. Like the market has spoken, it's digital gold. And you talk to quite a few business owners and people with a lot of money when they want to get into bitcoin. What are their kind of views around it, what do they want to do with it, why do they want to get in and what do they want to do?

It's moved much more towards a store of wealth. They want to be there for the potential upside. The asymmetry upside is massive. Where the downside isn't that much like you're putting, you know, no more than you're willing to lose. And the potential upside if we're looking at some of these research pieces, like, is insane. You know, the bet here that you're at $20,000 bitcoin and we're saying that potentially on a bearish case is going to 258,000. Why the hell not? Would you not want to, you know, get involved?

Don't you think it's wild where they put out a report and they go, the worst case scenario we can see is a 10x man.

That's why I'm like, I'm trying to sell my kidney.

But it's fascinating because I think, like you mentioned your question, Bergs is people are now thinking a lot more strategically about this. I think people are looking at Bitcoin and Ethereum is far more blue chips. And we're seeing the use cases for Bitcoin specifically is far more detailed and in depth than people probably realize on the surface.

Absolutely. And the use cases are increasing day by day. People are building on it. Even the lightning network, leaps and bounds, it's just going to keep increasing. I can't even imagine what Bitcoin is going to be used for in 2030. Who knows? That's really exciting to think about.

The last thing I just want to mention here is around the institutions and how they're committing to Bitcoin even during a bear market. So we've got four entities here that are massive entities in the global space of not crypto and now coming to crypto. So BlackRock. In June 22, BlackRock partnered with Coinbase prime to provide all their institutional clients direct access to crypto, starting with Bitcoin. They're now connecting Coinbase prime and BlackRock's Aladdin. What we think what this is going to do is could usher in trillions of dollars in the asset class in the coming year. So blackrock is a massive, you know, investment management firm over in the US and they have a shitload of institutional clients and they have direct access to crypto.

Aren't they taking over the world? They have like 10% of the world's wealth.

Yeah, yeah, I know, man. The next one which I'm even more excited about is Fidelity. So one of my advisors, one of our advisors in the US is, his name's Steve, he banks with Fidelity and he logged in the other day, this is in November last year. They have now officially launched retail bitcoin, Bitcoin and eth trading inside the platform and you can custody them inside the platform. So within his banking system, this guy's a big baller. He can now buy crypto with inside his banking platform.

That is so good. That just removes all the barriers like Commonwealth bank, they spend a lot of time and effort doing that. But then they kind of softed out towards the end because it was all too hard. I think they ran a trial and I'm pretty sure they ran into all the things we talked about before. They're like, this is too much of a headache. Predicted money and benefits we're going to get. And also they would have weighed up like, you know, how much they would increase shareholder value, what it would actually say about them as a company. And they're like, time's probably not now.

And the market is a lot different in the US to Australia. Right. We're talking 400 million in the US people, 22 million here in Australia. Different, I guess, different setups. There's a lot more money in capital in the U.S. oh yeah. A lot more high net worth people and I think Coinbase, sorry, combat sort of put out. But this is massive, man. The Next one quickly, BNY Mellon. So BNY Mellon touches more than 20% of the world's investable assets, launched a crypto asset custody platform to safeguard assets for their institutional investors. So BNY Mellon could use Bitcoin to scale financial services, cost effectively.

Of the world's investable assets. What? That is huge.

That is crazy. So hang on, hang on. If we got four quadrillion, that's like nearly quadrillion. Yeah. 800 trillion, $800 trillion.

That's a little bit of coin mate.

That is huge. Could you imagine one of these companies because they're always looking for how do we get more money, how do we beat our competitors? This might be the answer for them to get that competitive advantage.

Yeah, massive.

Incredible.

And the last one I want to mention here is the Eagle Brook Advisors. So Eagle Brook Advisors and ARC Investment Management, which is the research paper we're reading here, partnered to offer financial advisors globally and access to actively managed crypto strategies, including direct crypto asset ownership, low minimums and portfolio reporting integration. So if you think about when people want to get into crypto and especially those people with money to have a financial advisor. And a lot of financial advisors, especially in Australia, aren't clued up or educated about this space. With eaglebrook Advisors over in the States, people come to their financial advisors and now they're actively trained and can help them with their strategies to get involved with crypto.

That is so good. We're starting to see a couple of companies actually reach out to us to train their advisors, get them up to speed, and accountants and finance people as well. It's really exciting to see.

Yeah, it's really coming here and it's exciting. The collective shift is really in the conversation around, like helping, whether it be tax accountants, financial advisors, universities are reaching out. You know, we've got schools. There's so much that's happening that we can help educate and help people on board. It's super exciting space, mate.

I love this. Read the report. It is amazing. Just look at the graphs. I saw this tweet on the weekend and I just got super excited. I was hungover as hell after a bucks and I got very, very dehydrated. And I saw this and it just perked me right up.

Bought more bitcoin.

I've been a bit soft with, like, accumulating. I'm like, nah, it's time to put down. This is all I needed. Just that little push over the edge.

Amazing, man. Thank you everyone for listening. I hope you enjoyed that episode. If you want to learn more about this research report, we'll drop it in the show notes. But as I said, bergs and a bearish case. $260,000 Bitcoin by 2030. 682,000 in the base case and 1.48 million the bull case.

Incredible. Get amongst it. That's it, mate. Sell those kidneys.

Thanks once again for listening, everyone. If you like these episodes, we'd love for you to leave a rate and review on the podcast platform that you're on. And if you want to send us in a question or have any feedback, we'd love to hear from you @benSimpsonAU, on Twitter and at Babybackburg. And we'll see you next time.

See you, champions.