39: Undercover to Fully Recovered, Former Police Officer Overcomes Addictions // The Story of Brock Bevell

If I throw up again, my bones are going to come out my mouth. I realized in that moment that I was completely alone. I'm like you, man. I want to have a purpose. I just want to tell people, if you want to start something, start it. You know, I was challenged about a year ago to start my podcast and I was probably a lot like you. I think we probably have the same personality. Tell me I can't do something. I'm going to do it just to show you.

Welcome to From Rock Bottom to Rockin It. I'm your host, Eric Gilbert Williams, and this is the podcast where we explore personal stories of people who hit absolute rock bottom, then got back up, wiped off the dust, kicked failure to the curb, and now they're rocking it like you'd never believe if you didn't hear it. Live right here we cover subjects in business, sports, and life in general. If you like this podcast, please share it. These interviews are intended to inspire, to motivate, to give hope and vision. So please share this episode with someone who needs it. Use your Instagram account, Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn, hand signals, trained pigeon sent smoke signals up in the air. Use Morse code, whatever you like. Just share the love and share this episode. Also, email me anytime. Podcasterricilbertwilliams.com Send me questions you would like to have asked of future guests and I will incorporate them. Or just send me some suggestions on how to run a better podcast. Or just say hello, I'd love to hear from you. That's podcastericgilbertwilliams.com I know you're going to love today's interview, so let's get started with us here today on From Rock Bottom the Rockin it is a very special guest, none other than the undercover to Recovered keynote speaker, podcaster, drug and alcohol recovery expert, and creator of the Fight like David Challenge Rock Bevel. Now, not only is his story inspiring and incredibly powerful, but it's super relevant to my own story, right to the bottom core. As many of you know, part of my story involves when I was a teenager, I left school, I left home, and essentially I lived in a drug house for a little over a year. Then the inevitable happens and we were narcked out. And for those of you that don't know what that means, it basically means that an undercover police officer successfully built the case against us by buying drugs more than once. And then a SWAT team of about 15 or so officers came and raided the house and arrested us all on the front lawn. And you know, that was how it Happened. Well, Brock was an undercover officer in narcotics. Brock, I feel so grateful to have you here today, man. Welcome to the show, man.

That makes me giggle. What's up, Eric? It's cool to have it, man. I like being able to talk this way because when you said that, like, I'm thinking from the criminal mastermind, like what our county attorney made us do to be able to even officiate that arrest. Right. I had to have two buys that were hand to hand, my money to you, Right. Before we could even make an arrest. So there was case building. I like that. I'm glad you brought that up. Most people don't understand it.

Why two? You know, I never actually really figured that out. I was like, why didn't they do it on the first time? I never really thought about it before. I just remember there was two and that stuck out to me.

Well, one would just. One wouldn't make you a dealer because maybe you just want to make a little money. Think about back in school days. You would sell dope for whatever. But it was a one time thing, just trying to make a little cash. But to the county attorney, to be able to go to testify in court, they could say, hey, on two different occasions, two different times, this person and what a lot of people. I don't want to get too deep into it, but we would actually mark our bills.

Oh, yeah, I got charged with possession as well. Possession of proceeds. Because he pulled out the little black light and he's like, that's the bill that I gave you.

There's different ways to market and. But yeah, we come back and then we would count your money and then we would see that was. It was a dope deal. And then that would add in the charges.

Yeah. And so how did you get started with the police force?

Always wanted to be a police officer. I mean, I know people say that I went into my dad's closet when I was probably five years old, and in the back of his closet was that suit that had the baggie on it. And I was like, what is that, man? What is that? So I took it out and I ripped it open. And there's his Mesa police uniform. And so he had since moved on. But I see that the hat with the badge on it and his badge on his shirt. And I was totally like, what? My dad was a cop, you know, and I put that thing on and of course it came down to like, yay, you know, all baggy. And I'm like, I felt like a superhero. So I always wanted to be A cop. You know when you're in third grade and the teacher's like, hey, what do you want to be? You got to write this down. I put I wanted to be a cop. And I mean, years later, there it is, comes to fruition. So it was kind of cool.

If I was an officer and I retired, I got to keep my uniform and keep a badge. I didn't know that.

Absolutely. What's interesting is you have to buy all that, so your uniform's yours. The badge, they actually give you a retirement badge that I carry in my wallet. And I got to keep my service weapon. I had to pay $1 for it. So the pistol that I carry. Yeah, so they're pretty good about that.

Interesting. Yeah, I had no idea. And so the show here, from rock bottom, the rockin it, obviously people that are listening here, including myself, are. Some of us are going through rough times. Some of us are going through good times. Some of us are somewhere in the middle and just want to keep ahead of the curve. And like I said to you before, Brock, when I was on your show, and we'll do a shout out here too, at Chase Devase Podcast is Brock's show. So if you ever want to check him out, I encourage you to. And there'll be a link to that in the show notes to this episode as well. So you can check out his podcast anytime. And do you remember what episode I was on by chance? That's a random question.

I don't.

Yeah, don't worry about it. I don't remember. I didn't ask you to get it ready. It's just a random number. How many episodes have you done so far though?

I'm up to 55.

Nice. You got me beat, man. Cool. So when I was on Brock's show sharing a lot about my story and now we get to switch the table around, I get to hear a little more about your story and hopefully this. And actually, no, I know there's some big takeaways here for people that are listening and I don't want to put it in my own words because it's not my story. So I wondered if you could share the story here and what are people getting into by listening today?

So here's what it is. My goal for sharing my stories is I don't like telling it just for to share my story. I'm like you, man. I want to have a purpose. I want to have a purpose driven life. I want to have a reason to share it. I want to give you hope because I was Raised in a phenomenal home, right? I mean, phenomenal as in there was eight brothers and sisters, huge home. We went to church on Sundays, we'd go and do extracurricular activities. We would serve people. And, you know, I felt like growing up, I had a pretty, well, a good childhood upbringing, right. Looking back now, you see some of the trauma that happened, but you didn't realize it was trauma at the time. So my goal is to share it. One thing that I want to make sure people understand in addiction is I had addictive personality at 8 years old. I realized that when I saw a Playboy magazine for the first time, right. My brother and I, he was two years older than me, we were taking out the trash. We get out there, we remove the lid of the trash, and there's this humongous box of probably 50 Playboy magazines. And what do I do? I reach in and look at it, open it right up to the center fold. There's this naked lady and I'm like, I am drawn into it. And my brother slapped it out of my hand. He goes, hey, we don't look at that stuff. And I'm like thinking, we don't. You know? And the reason I tell that story is because at that moment I realized that there was almost this rewiring of my brain, right. I went back in, he ignored it, it was gone. He never thought about it again. But I could not get that thought out of my brain. I'm like, how am I going to sneak out there before the trash man comes tomorrow, get a magazine and hide it? You know what I mean? Like I'm maniacal, freaking at 8 years old to get into pornography. So people have to understand that brains are wired differently. People with addiction, limited self regulation. I had zero self regulation at the time, Right, right.

I never looked at it that way. That's powerful, man. I never actually interpreted. I mean, if I go and analyze my own child, I'm like, geez, you know, there were indications. This is. Okay, sorry, continue. This is. I just never looked at it that way before.

Yeah. And so it was just interesting to know. I mean, and I didn't notice this for years later. I wasn't 8 years old, going, oh my gosh, you're a full blown addict. But I remember looking back at how like the trigger. And so to understand your addiction cycle, right? It's a cycle and it's in like that for everything we do. It's a trigger, thought, craving, use, remorse, shame, guilt, right? And then it goes back in the same. And I would go from A trigger to a use and within minutes. And I'm sure most people. But with pornography, it was crazy is I could actually slow it down as I got more mature and understand, hey, my trigger was a picture or your, my cell phone, my thoughts, right? That's what led into it and my craving. Most people don't understand the difference between a trigger and a craving is there's a physical change, there's a physical alteration of your body. Like you maybe start tasting. A lot of guys who use heroin say, man, I could taste it. It was like this tinge that I had my. In my taste buds. For me, my craving for pornography was an erection. That was the physical change that it took. And if you think about Eric, how many of us men. I'm going to speak just the men can get an erection and then say, okay, I'm going to stop right here, I'm going to go backwards.

That's not a common thing.

That's not a common right. So people can understand the addiction cycle and how it works in our lives through that because we've all experienced it, right? Whether it's sexual, whether it's pornography, whatever it is. And so they can understand, hey, this is my trigger, this is my craving. That's my thought. This is what happens when I use. This is why I feel like crap. And then boom. But what happens is we, we don't take the time to slow down in our lives. Now there's good addiction cycles and there's bad addiction cycles. And so that's what I like to educate like I like to talk to people about so they can understand and take a deep dive into their own self. Because in reality we can't change it unless we can identify it.

Yeah, that's powerful. So clarity. First I remember me talking to, whether it's a psychologist or my spiritual guide or even just my friends. And just being aware of something is a starting point. Because for me, when I would be aware of something I'm doing that's self destructive, whatever that is, fill in the blank, doesn't matter what it is. If I'm doing something self destructive or even if I had a business meeting and the business meeting didn't go very well and I can spotlight where it went wrong or what happened. That awareness, for me anyways, triggers often a little bit of shame. Oh, how can I. Or self criticism, how about that? I'll criticize myself and that leads to shame and guilt and whatever. But what I'm learning in my own life is that when I have that awareness that clear Awareness of this is exactly what happened, why it went wrong or where it went wrong. That's the starting point to doing a change. I think that's what you're alluding to, akc.

That's how I like to teach awareness, knowledge and choice. Right. What you're talking about, Eric, is you're becoming aware of these things. Most of us, we go through life and we never slow down enough to recognize this. I can never become aware of it. If someone doesn't either point it out to me or I take enough deep dive into my own life to do it, then I have to become knowledgeable. Why is it happening? Am I the cause or is this person the cause or is it my business? Am I not sleeping? And then you have to make a choice and that's the hard part. Am I going to change it? Is it a positive or is it negative? So you have it, you're nailing it.

Interesting. Okay, I like this. So you do work right now with people. You help people who are having challenges with addiction and help them improve their lives and help them work through some of this stuff to get into a positive angle of it in a positive direction. So is that fair to say?

Yeah. So I work with men and women who struggle with PTSD and addiction. I kind of like hitting those two together. I work with. I mean, anybody that calls me says, hey, dude, I'm stuck, I need help. I love to help. Right. But most of us are those in addiction that call me.

Yeah, you have a big heart, man. That's one thing I remember from the show last time was pure passion. That show you run is pure passion. And it's really refreshing. It really is. There's my compliment for you right now and you've come a long way from it. And maybe I can segue into it with this little short story. I don't mean to gross anyone out on the show, so I'm going to. I'll make this one really short, but a few months ago I had a kidney stone and now I don't, which means it was passed. So that's what happened. And you know, anyone who's ever had one can kind of relate. So I'm not going to go into any details. I'm just going to say it was 9 millimeters. And let's move subjects. And I was totally hospitalized. I almost passed out. It was terrible. And while I was in the hospital, the doctor prescribed to me some anti pain medications. You're okay with going in this direction, right Brock, and talking about that stuff?

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, please.

Okay. I didn't give you a warning on that one. I didn't tell you about this yet either, because this literally just happened, like, what, less than two months ago?

I was hoping you go into a little more detail on the kidney stone, but that's okay.

I don't think anyone wants to hear that story. But maybe I'm wrong. I don't know. I think. Speaking of ptsd, I think I still have a. I don't know how comfortable I am going into some of that, too. So I'm sitting there in the hospital bed, and, you know, I got this thing in my vein, you know, pain meds and all that stuff. And he says, I'm going to prescribe to you some powerful pain medications, and before I give them to you, you need to read this. And he gives me this piece of paper, and the piece of paper is these huge warnings about addiction and what to do with addiction and overdose and hotlines and helplines. And these are all the things that he's making me read and understand before he gives me my prescription. Like, geez, what the heck is he going to keep giving me? And then it hit me. I know what he's about to give me. And honestly, I thought about you. I don't know if that's weird or not, if I'm thinking about you in the hospital bed, but I did. I thought of you and your story when he gave me a bottle of opiates. And there was questions. Do you have an addictive personality? Da, da, da. And I said, no in the moment because I was in pain, but I kind of do have an addictive personality in hindsight. So anyways, he prescribes to me this bottle of opioids. And I look at it, I'm like, holy crap. This is kind of related to the story that I heard of my buddy Brock. And I go back home and I got this bottle of opioids. And I'm like, I don't know what to do with this, right? And I'm thinking, if it gets to the point where I'm about to pass out on the floor again, you know, I guess I kind of have to take one, but I don't want to. And I'm scared, right? I don't want to take these things. And everyone listening, like, yeah, you'll hear why in a second. But. And I never did, by the way, because I guess I was fortunate in that a lot of the pain passed on that at two or three days, where. So I never actually. And, yeah, so the bottle Never got opened. And I don't want to open it. And, you know, there was even a part of me that was curious. What is this thing that people are so, you know, making this big seato. Why would they put so much paperwork? Oh, what is it like? You know? And that's a terrifying feeling for someone who has even the slightest tendency of addiction, or not even anyone to explore. What is it like? And my answer was, it's not worth finding out. So I kept the bottle closed, and I never went down that road. And maybe this is a segue. I'll pass it over to you.

So that was nice, man. Well, I'll tell you what happened with mine. So I was on opiates for 10 years. And so for people to understand what opioids do. Opioids, the pill actually attacks the receptors. So your pain receptors that you have in your body latches on them. So it reduces the amount of pain that you have. It actually just kills the pain. Right. But they don't tell you that also takes away your inhibition. Right. It also takes away your ability to think clearly. Right. You're foggy. And for me, it was killing more of my mental pain than my physical pain. I was like you. I got to a point where I'm like, dude, my knees. Because I was run over. Multiple surgeries when I was a police officer. That's how my addiction started. I was a cop. Got smashed by a car. So I go the doctor, what does he do? He gives you those huge bottles of.

Opiates in a raid, right? You were doing a raid or something?

No, I was actually. It was a traffic stop. A mom was prostituting her 12 year old daughter.

Oh, geez.

Yep. In exchange for drugs. And in. In the middle of it, the doper comes up, goes to take the girl out. We come up and she decides to run us both over. But I go to the doctor and he's like, hey, you're a cop. You're never gonna get addicted to this stuff. So I'm like, okay, right. But what happened with me, that's a little different is they tried to get me medically stable, but because of my injuries, they're like, dude, you can't come back to work. So they retired me. And so now I go from wearing this cool badge, arresting people for drugs. Right. Big search warrants.

Yeah, for good reason.

Yeah, good reason. Right. And then the next day, I'm at home changing my kid's diaper. For me, that was a massive blow. That would be like you losing your job. And tomorrow Being back in an apartment, you're like, what's going on? Like, that's just not a bad thing. It's just not your style.

It's a shock, man. It's a complete reality shock.

Yeah. And now I'm like, who am I? I don't even know who I am anymore. And so I noticed that I started taking these opioids to mask. And the more opioids I took, the happier I became and the further away those emotions and feelings went. Like, I think I was emotionless for 10 years. Like, legit, you know? And so to get to your point, I hit a rock bottom. I had a point to where I was like, you, man. Like, I started noticing that these things are messing me up. I go into my medicine cabinet, open it up, and there's all my pills perfectly in place, written on. And so I took a pill and I shut that cabinet, which gave me a glimpse into my room that showed me whatever, my life had taken a turn. I'm living in a damn crack house. My house was a disaster. Messy, stinky. And that's where. And this is what I want to tell your audience. This was probably my biggest mistake and biggest blessing wrapped up into one, because I'm the type of guy. I'm an A type personality. I got pissed off, ripped that cabinet open, opened all the bottles, and dumped every single pill down the toilet. Well, this is what most people don't understand. That's an oh, shit moment. I'm like, oh, my gosh, dude, I'm totally out of opioids and I can't go get anymore. I just had a refill. But I remember telling myself, listen, I'm like, having this dialogue. You've wanted to do this for so long. Now is the time. You can't go get anymore. You got to man up and you just got to handle this right here. And so a lot of people don't understand. There's two drugs that can kill you from the detox. Alcohol. So going cold turkey off alcohol, you got a guy, 20 year alcoholic, he just stops cold turkey, and he could have seizures. I mean, it's violent, right? I mean, I think most people. And opioids, those two things.

I didn't know that. Not heroin.

Nope. Well, heroin is an opioid.

Oh, that's right. Yeah. I guess it's derivative. Okay.

Yep. So cocaine hurts. That sucks. Methamphetamines, that hurts. Marijuana, whatever. But those other two. And so that's where my life changed, man. I'm like in my bathroom and I'm going to be graphic. Even though you won't talk about yours, I'm going to talk about mine. I'm in the bathroom, and the first thing that starts happening is I lose all physical control. I defecate myself. I'm pooping all over myself. I'm throwing up so violently by day three that I feel like if I throw up again, my bones are going to come out my mouth.

Three days. Wow.

Three days.

Holy crap.

And so, I mean, I would never been so cold, never been so hot in all my life. My body was just fluctuating in hot, cold. I was running the shower, running, turning it off, running the shower, peeing myself, throwing up, dry heaving. And this went on for seven days.

Holy, man. Were you alone?

See, that's the key right there, man. And that's what I want to tell people. Like, I realized in that moment that I was completely alone. Nobody physically, other than my higher power was with me. Like, nobody was coming to save me. Dude, I had pushed everybody off. I pissed everybody in my life off. You know, I lied to him. And because I worked undercover, I knew what to say. I knew how to mask it and hide it, right?

Oh, right, yeah. You're a pro at that. Yeah, pro.

Oh, I know what it's going to look like. So don't talk like that. Be on time. I mean, I actually just lived this totally different life. My family didn't even know I was struggling with opioids.

Eric, here. I hope you're enjoying the episode today. This is a passion project that I put together. I really wanted to do this, want to help people out there. I had so many people reach out to me when I was younger and when I was having a tough time and struggling. I've written a book about it. You can check it out on my website. Please do. But most importantly, reach out to me. Give me some feedback. What could I do better with this podcast? What am I doing that I should stop? What am I not doing that I should do? Tell me your experience. Give me some tips and suggestions. I really want to design this to suit your needs. And all you got to do is send me an email. It's ericericgilbertwilliams.com or. Or use the contact me button that you'll find on my website. Just send me an email. We'll have a phone call or we'll chat online. Doesn't really matter. I would love to hear from you and figure out how to make this show even better with your help. So please reach out and don't be Shy. Cause you hit it from them so successfully.

You mean totally hit it.

Wow. When I think about stresses at work, a lot of times people can tell me they don't know that I'm stressed or that I'm off or that I've had one hour's sleep or something because I, you know, I learned how to hide it. It's important. And I think everyone. Well, maybe not everyone, but I think a lot of people listening can relate to the concept of masking how you're really feeling and not letting it fully out. And whether you're doing it to protect, you know, your family or your loved one or even just you're not ready to face it yourself. But this is a whole different type of lonely. And it's also skill to be able to mask it like that. That's practice. And you're by yourself, man. So seven days and what happened after the seventh day start to go away or like, you know, happily ever after or like, yeah, yeah, kind of.

I made a deal, man. I had a conversation with God, and this is really what happened. I mean, I'm there. I'm day seven. I'm like, okay, listen, I'm not going to be the guy that tells you what to do, but I can't handle this anymore. I don't know if I could even go another minute. Like, I'm hurting that bad. And I'm like, okay, if you give me an opportunity, like, either take me now, like, just end my life or let me be somebody for you. Let me be different. Let me just help people out. Right. Because you can't go through an addiction like we have and not speak about it. I think it's impossible. I look at these guys and they want to share their story. People that go through addiction, they have such a powerful story coming out of it.

Yeah, it's huge story. Yeah. Yeah.

And not enough of us, and I feel not enough of us share because my story may have a great impact in your life, but the next guy, it might not. But your story matters to them, and that's why we all need to be sharing what we're going through.

You know, I say that on maybe not every show, but people that listen to the show frequently know that I say this a lot. Part of the purpose of the show is for me to share my own stories and get it off my chest and help other people benefit from it. But maybe a bigger part of the show is to have other people sharing their deepest, darkest, rock bottom and rockin it. Right. It's not just a We're not just here to talk about sad stuff. We're here to talk about rockin it stories. Here's where it sucked and here's how it got awesome. Here was the turning point and the courage that's required to share a story in its darkest and lightest moments is a type of courage that's on the inside. It's not external. You can't see it, you can't measure it, you can't weigh it. But it's a type of courage that's next level in my opinion. And we're 100% on the same page there. The more that we do our shows and talk about this stuff, here's the reality. I'm going to speculate and I'm going to take a guess of everyone that's listening to this show. There's probably a certain percentage of them maybe don't relate to having a deep rock bottom. And that's great, that's wonderful. Even that's to be cherished. Most people listening to the show might be listening to this and saying oh wow, that's a crazy rock bottom and they might be thinking about our story. My challenge is to them internally, they don't have to say in it. But if you're listening to the show right now and you're listening to this stuff, what's your rock bottom and are you comfortable sharing it with someone? When was the last time you allowed yourself the self esteem to share your story with someone you trust? Whether it's a friend or a psychologist or family member, it doesn't matter what even it out loud, you know, sharing your own what is your. And owning it. What is your story and owning it. And to this, what we said at the very, very beginning. Awareness. What was it?

AC Awareness, knowledge, choice.

Awareness, knowledge, choice. And when we can come to a place and I'll just speak for myself, when I can come to a place of acknowledging what my rock bottom was and I've had a few, then we can start to make change. So people listening to this show. Yeah, anyways, that's a little rant there. What is your rock bottom? And and let's celebrate that. The fact that you have an awareness of it is a massive step in the direction of affecting change in your life. And that's the whole point of this. That's how we do this, right? Is that fair to say it?

So that's why I do it, that's why only reason. And you know I get asked a lot Eric, and I'm going to ask you this question if you had an opportunity give to never have your addiction, would you have given it up?

I have to say, it's just who I am and I don't even know who I would be anymore. I have no idea. My story, of course, wasn't addiction nearly to the degree of yours or other people you know are out there. Mine was. I was struggling at school and I was a loner. I was picked on, I was bullied, I wasn't learning well. I was depressed, My mental health was compromised. I was depressed. And there's a pro and a con. Back then, mental health was not a subject that was talked about. So there was no support and no help for me, which was very, very good. Sorry, that was very, very bad. What was very, very good is that back then there was also not really any social media, so I was not exposed to self harm, thus suicide. I was not exposed to harming others because I had a good family as well. So I was never harmed and I was never really exposed to the social media craziness that goes on about hurting people. Because I feel like when there's a extreme rock bottom that happens, there's either three lashings out, one of three, and one is harm to self, ultimately suicide, harm to others, see about shootings and violence, or just withdrawal. And withdrawal is drugs, in my opinion. And for me, when I was having my mental health problems, I went into marijuana, which kind of. I mean, it's totally legal in Canada now. So, you know, is it even a drug? I mean, yes, it is, but it's not an addictive substance to the degree that you'd see anywhere else. And marijuana at the time was my escape. It was helping me with a problem that I had with mental health. And I didn't have any backup plan. So perhaps I took it too far. And that's probably would have been better off not going that far. But that journey that I went through ultimately brought me to a place where I can have a podcast that helps people. I can have. I found self confidence, whereas for 10 years in my elementary and high school years, I had zero. Like, I had negative. It wasn't even on a scale of 1 to 10. I had like a negative something and I found it now. And so I don't know, would I change it? I mean, if I had to change it, I would probably be born with a billionaire business when I was 19 and perfect marriage. I mean, is that reality, right?

It's not reality, no.

And I'm happy with my life right now. It's ups and downs. The Grass is always greener. But I am happy with my life. So no, I wouldn't change that. What do you think about that question? That's a deep question.

I would never give it up. I want it because of what I went through. I've learned a lot of things through it, man. I learned about mental toughness, right? I learned about how deep I can really go. I understand what my rock bottom is. I handle situations a lot different now than I would even with my kids. With people, I think I'm a little more empathetic of, hey, maybe they're going through something. So I'm kind of. I feel blessed that I went through number one. I'm blessed that I got through it. Because a lot of people use walls, you know, they're not getting through it, they're not coming out.

Marijuana is legal in Canada. This is what I was arrested for. That arrest affected the course of my life. And I'm not going to put a negative or positive on it. It's just a fact. It certainly did affect the course of my life and now it's legal. There's no problem at all. People ask me, and I even ask myself, what was that all about? Because it took me 20 years to recover from to the concept of marijuana that maybe doesn't have to always be negative. It took a long time for me. My friends would be smoking a joint and I would say no, because to me, I look at what they're doing and I know where it came from. I know the cycle and the types of people's hands it passed through. I know who probably got hurt and didn't get hurt and what percentage of people probably ended up in jail and how it led to other things. And I look at them, my buddy's smoking a joint and laughing about it. I'm like, there is nothing funny about this at all. And then all of a sudden, you know, the crazy things happened in my last construction, my last company was in construction. And my lawyer, bless his heart, awesome guy, shut down his law process, his law firm to open up a grow op. Illegal grow op, right? In my mind, I'm thinking it was very difficult to process this. He was closing down the most legitimate. And he was a very good lawyer too, in a positive, good morality way. He's shutting it down to go into the one thing that I associate with all sorts of negativity. And then my mom is eating a CBD guppy to go to sleep because she can't sleep. Like, mom, why are you doing this to me? Right? And then the final stroke was of course, you know, it was legalized too. And then I was having, you know, deep anxiety problems a couple years ago. And maybe there was a medicinal aspect that I could explore, but it took 20 years to recover from that. Now, how do you feel about opioids at the moment?

Oh, man. Now, here's what's crazy. I understand that there is a health benefit to it. Right? But not for me. And the reason I say that, as I know that I have zero self regulation, I know I have to go get knee replacements coming up in the near in 10, 20 years, eventually, because of the nature of my injuries, I will not use opiates. I'll get through it some way, however, they're going to help me get through it. But it will not be an opiate just because I am an addict. I'm addicted to opiates. And so for me, I just know I'm not going down that path because I'm scared to death to go through that detox again.

Are the benefits, medicinally speaking, worth having opioids still on the market? I'm kind of asking myself this question as much as asking you, because I actually don't know the answer.

Here's the problem is the regulation is getting better, but it's still not there yet. Why are you sending a guy home with 120 pills for a toothache?

It's a lot of pills.

Yeah, it's just you're creating an addiction now. I've heard of doctors sending them home with four pills. Hey, I'm going to get you through two days. By that time you should be fine. Now that's regulation. That's something that I can stand behind. Right? You have a major hip replacement. Your mom, the grandma, she got a hip replacement. Doesn't mean she's going to be addicted to it. There's just us who are addicts. Our brains are wired that way. Just like an alcoholic, he drinks an alcoholic beverage. He's done right just because he's wired that way. So I understand there's value when it just not in my life. And that's taken a long time to figure out.

Which is what I was alluding to is like. Yeah. And just out of curiosity, how long was the span of time do you estimate from your recovery to realizing that there might be benefits to some people and that, you know, maybe there are reasons to keep it around because that's a big jump. I feel like that for me, that was really difficult to do, to see that there might actually be a reason to keep it around, you know, and maybe there is not all negative stuff there.

Well, the difference between marijuana and opiates is opiates is legal, right? I could go and talk to my doctor today, and I can walk out of the doctor's office with opiates, right? I got this massive back spasm. He can't see it. Okay, here, take some muscle relaxers, take some opiates, and call me next week. And I'm not talking about recently, because even in the US Marijuana is becoming more acceptable, right? And being an addict, I even see value in medicinal marijuana. I do, I see it. But there has to be some type of regulation on it. And I just don't feel yet that the doctors are taking opioid addiction as serious, because here's what's happening. I don't know about you guys in Canada, but we are struggling in the US because of what's happened is the guy's going to the doctor, he's hooked on pain pills, right? The doctor cuts him off. What's the next thing he turns to? Heroin, right? What's heroin? A lot of heroin today. Laced with coke.

Rat poison.

Yeah, that's it. That's in meth. But crack, what's the stuff they're bringing across the border in Mexico?

Oh, fentanyl. There it goes, fentanyl.

So what happens is today we have guys that has a legitimate concern, had a knee surgery. He definitely got hooked on it. There's no help from the doctor to wean him off, right? He doesn't go to rehab, he turns to heroin, dies of a fentanyl overdose. The guy's not a bad guy. He's not 15 years shooting up heroin. He's not struggling with it. He got hooked up because he had a surgery, and now the fentanyl, and they are. They're lacing this stuff with fentanyl to make it more potent.

You know, it feels like sometimes government's a little slow to respond, whether in a good way or a bad way, if something needs to be stopped or something needs to be started. It feels a little bit slow sometimes. And I don't know if that's a default of just government being government or if there's anything to be done about that. But it makes me wonder sometimes. The work that apparently Thailand can do with facial, like skin surgery and skin graft replacements is phenomenal from what I hear. And I mean, anyone listening to this, don't take my word for it, because I don't know anything about it, but I've heard multiple stories that you can go to certain countries in the world, whatever those countries are, you know, if you've got burn scars or whatever, you can have skin, like made for you and put in place and you can almost not tell the scar lines anymore. Why isn't that here? And on the flip, so a little bit slow maybe to adopt some perhaps good things. And on the flip side, you know, slow to maybe stop some things that need to be stopped as well. And I don't have an answer to that stuff. I think about it, though, sometimes. Why is it so slow? Is maybe just paperwork, red tape, stigma, priorities. Do you have any speculation on that front, or is that kind of a random subject?

I think it's money. There's so money wrapped up in opioids in doctors. I mean, if you read the papers, doctors are getting paid money to prescribe, right? And that's a problem.

It's huge. And I keep hearing that the prison system is incentivized by having people in jail. And I don't know anything about that, and I wouldn't have brought that up until you mentioned this, but do you know much about that subject? Is that something that you've heard a lot of or looked into? To my understanding, if you're running a prison, you're paid based on how many people are there. So you're kind of incentivized to have full occupancy, for lack of a better word. It's almost like a hotel at that point. And you have the ability to force your visitors to stay and not let them go.

And you're absolutely right. In the US we do pay our communities for housing prisoners. And there's an actual prison swap, man. Like you get a prisoner from Arizona going to Wisconsin, we pay that prisoner to be in Wisconsin. We pay Wisconsin to house them. I mean, that's a whole other podcast. Our prison system in the US Is broken. We have guys going into prison that have never had an addiction and they leave prison with the biggest, I mean, full blown addiction of heroin, methamphetamines. I mean, it's crazy.

I want to switch gears here for a second. We had some deep stuff. I mean, I could literally chat with you for hours. For real, dude. Like, honestly, let's switch gears for a second. Let's hear about some of your rockin it moments. You came out of this, you recovered. You did it on your own, right? You didn't just, like, it's one thing to recover in a center where you're cared for. You did it on your bathroom floor by yourself, man. You overcame something that sadly most people can't. How do you feel about that? You know? And tell me, what are you up to these days and what does rockin it look like for you right now?

Man, I love it. Rocking it is. Eleven and a half years sober.

Congratulations.

Thank you, man. Rocking it is. I have an amazing relationship. I've been married for three years to my wife just being present, you know what I mean? Rocking it is I have five children of my own. I have given to me through my wife. Right. Step kids. I don't even like calling them step kids. They're my kids. Right. I just feel like that being present and being available to them to be able to resolve those concerns and doubts that they have, like just being in the moment. I believe in active addiction. That's taken from us. I currently run a program called I do a challenge with first responders. Right here's what happens in the US I don't know how it is for you guys in Canada to go to rehab. It's expensive. Okay. And it takes a lot of time. So they're kind of broken up into 30 day, 60 day, 90 day, 120 day rehabs. And I realized I was running one of those and I was realizing it was almost like a mill. Like you get guys in and then they would return and they would. The recidivism rate, the rate of them returning was just over and over. And I'm like, man, we got to fix the system somehow. It's broken. And so what I did is my avatar. I want to say the guys that I was having in the program were the wrong guys. Okay. And what I mean by that, I mean they're all addicts. They came to me saying, hey, I need help with an addiction. But I didn't understand when a 19 year old kid came to me. He's been on heroin for four years. He lives with mom. Right. I'm like, something's doesn't fit to me but. And I had a hard time working with that individual. But there are programs out there that would nail it. I realize my avatar is first responders is veterans, these guys who have been in and out of battle who are going through a situation where they need help. But they're attorneys and doctors and nurses and they can't leave their professions for 30 days. It's like me calling you Eric and said, hey, because you are on something, I need you to come and be in my rehab facility for 30 days. What does that do to your business?

It's gone.

Gone destroys it, right because you are the face of the business. You can't take care of your family. So I'm like, hey, I need to be able to bridge the gap for people like Eric or an attorney. Okay. What I'm going to do is I'm going to meet you online and I'm going to give you challenges every day, I'm going to give you rehab type information on it every day. And then we're going to come back tomorrow morning, we're going to rehash it. For me, that's rocking it. I love that, man. I love working with men and women with like mind that have a little bit of swagger to them that feel like, hey, I run a multi billion dollar business but I understand that akc, Awareness, knowledge. So I'm struggling with other components of my life. Help me out, that's what I get and get behind.

And I'm sure you've had some success stories. Like is there a time that really stands out? And obviously everything's super confidential, but is there a time where you can remember someone came back to you and they're like, dude, you literally just saved my life. Like, is that, is that the thing that happens or how does that work? You know?

You know their life. Yes. But I feel like their marriage is like right now they can come back and say, hey, you literally just saved my marriage. I was acting a certain. I'm working with a young man right now. Same situation. Him and his wife decided to drink together. Right. They're not drinkers. They drank for about two years. Wife at the end of the two years realized, hey, this is getting out of hand. Hey, let's stop. Wife cold turkey stops. Husband is now struggling. Right? Came to me, hey, I need help getting through this. So baby steps, right? We put these challenges in every day and they're really simple things, man. Like have a plan. Let's get a plan for the day. Let's script our days.

Let's break it down. Right?

Break it down. Thank you. Yeah. And he's like, dude, you've literally saved my marriage, which has saved my kids, has saved my family. And you know, we're giving people long term solutions.

Wow. And like how many, how many people do you work with at a time, you know?

Yeah, I like to keep it around 25. That's manageable. I can handle that.

Yeah. And if, if someone was listening right now and wanted to have a chat with you about some of this stuff, where would they find you?

They can email me at chasing the vasemail.com. they can find Me on Facebook, my name is Brock Bevel. I mean, go to the fight like David challenge and so they can just hit me on that.

Tell me about fight like David. Is this the challenges that we're talking about here, about you throwing out these challenges for people to achieve?

Yeah. So I have a chase, the vase challenge, which is a 30 day challenge that I go through this fight like David is new, man. And it's based on the Bible. Right. If you look at the Bible, you have this David and Goliath. Everybody looks at that story and said, oh, Goliath is champion. David's his underdog. Well, when you really break down that story, David was actually a champion. And Goliath, if you knew the story, is actually the underdog, Goliath had no opportunity to beat David.

If you look at the detail behind the scenes.

If you look at the detail behind the scenes, yeah, Goliath couldn't move, man. He's basically fighting a sniper. They're saying the rock that came out of David's sling was about the same velocity as coming out of a.45 caliber handgun. Right. Goliath had no chance. And if you read the story, Goliath's like, hey, come to me, come to me. Well, David didn't fight that way, but Goliath wanted him to be up close. So when you think about it, you just got to break down that story. I love Mark Twain when he says, the greatest swordsman in the world doesn't fear the second best swordsman of the world. Right. Why? Because he knows what he's going to do. He knows his feet work. He's seen this before. But he does fear a farmer with a pitchfork. And so that's what we try to teach is like, we got to be a little bit unconventional today, like to recover, to overcome some of this stuff, man. I don't have to go to rehab. I don't have to spend thousands and thousands of dollars going. I just need, like you say that pivot point that you talk about, I need that. I think everybody in their life one time or another needs that pivot point.

Speaking of pivot points, if you had, I asked a lot of people on the show this, and sometimes it's not easy, but if you had this chance to go back in time, like hot tub time machine style here, and poof. And you had like 60 seconds to just talk to yourself, you know, in the bathroom. You are who you are now today, and you're going backwards in time 62nd, like, what would you even say to yourself, you know, like, how would you phrase that? Like. Like, hang in there. Or, like, you know, it'd be all right. Like, how do you. What would you say?

Man, I like that question. I haven't really thought about that. But I would say, slow down. Like, you're too damn serious. Nothing in your life, if it doesn't matter in five years, it doesn't matter in five minutes. You know, we take life way too seriously. Calm down and take a vacation. I'm dealing with guys right now that haven't slowed down in years, are so worried about making money. They're so worried about that progression of life. And this life, I've realized, is hella short. Right? It's short, man. And if you don't have time to spend it with the people that you love, it's wasted.

It is. It's relative, too. If we look at it mathematically, the definition of short and long is only having a definition by. Relative to what? Relative to something. So when we're 10 years old, one year represents 10% of our entire lifetime. When we're 50 years old, one year represents a substantially shorter amount of time. So one year actually goes by relatively quicker. And so the older we get, the faster time goes. Have you ever thought about that before? These are one of those moments I sit there and go, wow, that's mathematically correct.

Eric, I'm 49, okay? I'm 49, dude. And I'm telling you, like, I'm getting a little bit anxiety every now and again.

Like, am I doing enough?

What more can I do, you know? And I'm just like, yeah, man. And I'm the guy that needs that. Just slow down. Take a vacation.

I'm one of the guys that needs to slow down. I really am.

I said that for you, actually.

Thank you. You read through the lines on that one, eh?

Yeah. We're too busy, man.

Well, you know, and on that note, like, just being vulnerable. I mean, you know, I have this startup, we're raising capital, we're getting some traction. But, like, you know, my mom and I are best friends. I mean, when I left home, it was horrible and, you know, devastating for her. I can imagine. But we're best friends now, right? And so I call her, and sometimes I'm like, oh, this whole thing's about to collapse. It's not working. And then the next day, I'll call them, like, yeah, we're just about to go super big. We got this crazy thing that just happened. And she's like, which one is it? How can it be both, right? And I'm like, well, that's just the nature of the business. It's either going to go really, really big or it's going to poof up in a bottle of smoke. And I have this. I'm driven by passion, right? But I'm also terrified that something bad would. I'm knocking on wood here, and I don't want that to happen. And if it is going to be something that doesn't work, I don't want it to be. And I won't let it be because I didn't try hard enough or I didn't push hard enough. But the problem with that is that there's no limit. What am I going to do? Just stop sleeping forever? I realized, you know, motivational videos are not meant for everyone. Some people are too motivated already. They got to slow down. That's a big lesson.

I guess this would be good for your listeners. How are you slowing down?

This is a total admission here. And my investors that may be listening, hopefully they take it as a positive in that I'm building for sustainability and like a marathon. But two things I did today specifically on this subject to slow down. Gyms just opened up here from COVID restrictions and all that. And I got my shot. And I don't care if you are pro or anti vaxxer, I don't know, I got my shot anyways. It is what it is. It's done. So I went to the gym for like an hour and a half right in the middle of the day. I was up at what, five in the morning pounding away at this stuff. And I'll be up till almost midnight tonight. So middle of the day I was like, you know what, I got to stop. I got to go to the gym. And I did that for me. I did that for my body. I did that for my mind. I did it for my attitude. And, you know, I did it for everyone I'm about to talk to for the rest of the day so they don't have to talk to a miserable grouch, right? And then I brought my Oculus headset. I'm a VR. I'm not really a big gamer, but I have. I have a lot of fun with that. And I brought it to the office because I'm at the office often, 12, 14, 16 hours a day. And the Oculus gives me a 15 minute game time where I'm laughing and thinking about something completely different. So I played my Oculus headset and I got poked by someone in the office who thought it would be funny. And I got videoed by another person who also thought it would be funny and they're both right and wrong at the same time. And that's what I did today. So some days are more successful than others. But yeah, that was my today thing. And you know, everyone listening. If you're a go, go, go and you don't know how to stop, I got a question for you. What did you do for yourself today that was just for you? Not motivated by fear, not motivated by greed, not motivated by anything other than self care. This is what my body needs, you know, awareness. Where is your physical state, your mental emotional state right now? Personally, with your relationship with your business, with your family, with your kids? Where is it? Take a little spot check here if you don't like the answer that you hear yourself tell yourself, what could you do today? Some little tiny thing. What could you do that might be a positive step in a direction of you going to bed and saying, it's a little bit better now when I put my head on the pillow than it was when I listened to this podcast. There's my challenge for you guys out there listening to the show today. You want to add to that there?

Brock, you know, I appreciate you saying that. I went to the gym this morning and I CrossFit. There was a 12 minute workout and I missed it. I didn't finish the workout. I wasn't able to get all my reps in right. And I was pissed off. I was pissed. And I realized I'm getting out to my car. I'm like, I was so mad.

I've never heard you swear before. You must have been really mad. It's the first time it was this legit. Brock was pissed today and I was.

Like, you know, I cannot believe you didn't finish. And then I'm like, but hold on a second. You started right? And that was the difference is did not finish versus did not start. At least I started right. I was there, I competed. And guess what? I get a chance tomorrow to go back and repeat it. Not the same workout, but I get to go and do it again. So that for me, I appreciate what you're saying. If you don't like it, change it.

I like this. You're such a powerful person, man. I'm so glad that we connected on your show. I'm grateful to have you here as well. Is there anything you want to touch on and talk about while we're here? I mean, there's no rush and sometimes I ramble and you know how it is being a podcaster Right. So is there anything on your mind that you feel like getting out or talking about or the people listening or whatever?

I just want to tell people, if you want to start something started. I was challenged about a year ago to start my podcast, and I was probably a lot like you. Well, I think we probably have the same personality. Tell me I can't do something. I'm going to do it just to show you. But all in. Yeah, I'm all in. But. But the cool thing was I was issued a challenge and put out two a week, and so I started doing that. I realized it didn't become easier, but it became doable. Like, I started moving things in my life to make it happen. And so I believe in a lot of people. It's just, you have to be focused on what's really important. We do a lot of things in our life that don't matter. And so when you said, hey, go back and do your evaluation, I really like that. I appreciate that. Because even now, I feel like there's things in my life I could get rid of to where I could be a better human and more focused. So I'm glad we had this. This is a therapy session for me.

You know, Me too. You know, being a podcast, talking about the stuff that we're talking about. I don't know about you, but I get probably as much, if not more than anyone else listening. I say I do this show for everyone else, and I do, but, man, I do it for me, too. This is life changing every time I do. You know, talking to you today and being on your show before as well changed my life for the better, and it becomes a memory I've shared. You know, I've talked about you several times with people in my circle, and I probably will continue to do so. So. Yeah, I hear you. This is therapy for me, too, man.

Yeah, I appreciate it, man. Thank you.

Let's stay in touch. Everyone out there listening. The only ask that I have for you is to please share this episode with someone that you think needs to hear it, because if you don't share it with them, they might not ever hear it. And, you know, this is a philanthropic venture. There is no sponsors. The only money that exists in the show is the money that I put out to pay for it. That's the beginning and the end of the monetization. It's from my wallet into my really qualified and amazing team that does the editing and my assistant that does all the bookings, you know, and I don't ever ask for money. Either. I just do it because it's a way for me to feel good and give back and I like it. So the only ask I have for you, please share the episode, subscribe, share with a friend. You'll go back and listen to some other episodes and share those ones too. The more you share it, the more it grows. The message gets out there. People get comfortable sharing their own stories, personal development happens. And we all, you know, move towards a perfect future. A bada boom, bada bing, world's problems are solved. I wish it was that easy. It's obviously not. But, you know, we all do our own little bit. So thank you again, everyone listening. Thank you, Brock for coming here and spending time with me. We'll see you guys next time on From Rock Bottom to Rock' n it. Until then, have a Rockin it day. And that's it, my friends, for this episode. We will see you next time. Please send me an email, say hello, give me some feedback, let me know what you think, give me some tips and suggestions. I'd love to hear from you. Also, please share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, doesn't matter. Just get it out there. I really appreciate it. And we'll see you next time on From Rock Bottom to Rockin It. Have a Rockin it.