Building a Better Web through AI and Blockchain: Insights from Lasso.gg

This is the PoolTogether Community Podcast. PoolTogether is the world's number one no-loss prize savings account. You can visit pooltogether.com to deposit. You're listening to the PoolTogether Community Podcast. I'm your host, Hot Mike, AKA Millie Yearley. AKA, I just made a pour-over of the finest Brazilian beans, and I am hyped up on those Brazilian caffeine pills. And I'm here with Hus from Lasso.gg, from Nen Labs, from just a builder, just, just somebody who's building. And, and that's what crypto is all about, is building. So welcome, Hus. Thanks for being here.

Thank you for having me. Really excited for this chat.

Cool. Listen, when I get, when I get so hype in the beginning, I need you to match my energy on this. Okay? I need you to be like—

I need more Brazilian coffee beans. I'm not— I'm not getting any today. That's right.

That's right. We need to send you some. That's right. We need some Milady Brazilian coffee beans that may or may not be laced. Okay, so listen, I wanted to, I wanted to talk to you about just, just the regular Pull Together podcast stuff. One is, how did you get involved into crypto? 2, how'd you start doing Lasso? How'd you get there? 3, what's the future for Lasso? And then we'll just keep talking about stuff. I know we're going to talk about AI in this podcast. We might talk about Valadez a little bit, but yeah, yeah. Give me your origin story for crypto.

Yeah, I mean, so I don't know if I can make it super interesting, but pretty much towards the end of my university degree, I was really interested in the fintech space. I was kind of studying in the stats and CS kind of interlab. And we had this person who's now, without doxxing, I guess, who's a pretty prominent CT member that was just a person that I respected in kind of where I was from, before they had this CT alt. And they were just tweeting from their main about Like Yearn and ETH and yield farming and all these sorts of things from their main. And I was already interested in this whole kind of like the tech and finance kind of crossover, and I really wanted to understand what the fuck he was talking about. Sorry, can I curse on here? My bad.

No, that's okay. We'll just bleep it out and we'll do like a little or something. Every bleep will be different.

Okay. All right, cool. Yeah, my bad. So pretty much this person was just tweeting about all these things. He was super early. This was during DeFi summer, and kind of me and my co-founder were just really curious as to what he was talking about. So we started watching these YouTube videos, trying to understand what yield farming was before we even understood anything about crypto. And it didn't make any sense to us for months. But once we we kept on trying to understand it, understand what's happening. We got kind of into the CT space, and once it kind of clicked, it really clicked. And we have been really sucked into the rabbit hole since. So that's kind of how we discovered it, how we got into it. What's that?

What actually clicked for you? Because I remember my journey in 2019, 2020. I would get stuff and I would swap on Uniswap, and I got an ENS, and then I'm like, Okay, now what? Like, what do I do? And there's like, oh, there's these things called DAOs. And I'm like, okay, I joined one. Well, now what? You know, like, for me, it was just like, I didn't really understand. And so, like, I just dipped out and then it would take a friend to be like, hey, get back in. And like, it wasn't the trading for me. I just wanted to do stuff, you know? But what was the thing that clicked for you? Is it when you made your first million?

That's a good question. I think, like, I think there's 2 things. So generally with crypto, I think from an ideological perspective, it really resonates with me. I'm really, as a person, you know me personally, I'm quite against authority, against gatekeepers. The permissionless aspect and self-sovereignty kind of aspect of crypto really resonated with me. And then the Web3 pitch in general, where you have this application of crypto that is like an internet kind of native financial layer and internet native currency, or at least set of currencies that kind of underpin the internet, for me is something that I'm just really bullish on. And when I kind of saw the vision there, yeah, it hasn't left my head since.

So now that you see what you've seen, right? So when it clicked for you and it really matched with your values, which I think is a great way to get into something, is it matches, it kind of like It kind of aligns with everything that you've been believing up until that point. And now we're here, right? So what has changed? Are you disillusioned now? Are you like more bullish than ever about like how the space has aligned with your values?

That's a really good question. I think I tend to sway sometimes. Sometimes I'm like, man, what are we doing here? And then sometimes I'm like, this is like the most obvious thing ever. I think that generally I always get centered back to we just have a lot more work to do and we're way earlier than I think I understood at the very beginning. There's still a lot of work to be done as far as, in my opinion, a lot of the issues are with scaling solutions and gas costs and speed of transactions, like the scale of these things. So yeah, I mean, there's also something to be said around how many innovative primitives have we seen since over the last 2 years? I think that there are definitely a lot of interesting things, but I think that now that we're in, now that there's just kind of builders left, I think we'll start to see even more interesting things come up.

Yeah, but here's the deal with the builders being left, because then At some point, things will go back up, right? The line goes back up and then you get like the hype train and the incentives and— Right. You get like the, the, the, the, the, the memes with the green bars and the, you know, all that stuff. And then, and then it's back to like proto-feudalism, right? It's like, hey, you know, some— we're going to— there's this Wagme thing. But let's be real. It's like when you talk about generational wealth, you mean for you? And, and right. And then it becomes like the people that got in early and the people that didn't. And, and so, so I really, there's like really this values clashing I see in the space where it's like, there's so many people that want to build and build like this utopia, basically just want to, want to buck the system and create a better system. And then the way that the thing grows is by like the worst of the existing systems, right? Kind of creeping in. So, but maybe you're like a super capitalist and like, that's great for you. But I wonder like, how do we fix that? Or how do, how do we Do we find a happy medium or what do we do?

Yeah, that's a really good point. So I think definitely these things follow cycles. We'll have another bull. There will be a lot of stupid shit that gets done, a lot of noise, and then that stuff will die down. And this is just kind of at least how I kind of see it. It's very cyclical. But I will say, You make a good point, right? Which is that at least with crypto, it's hard to pull out kind of like the fundamental technology unlock from how financialized everything is. It's so inherently financialized that you have all these really weird dynamics where kind of a lot of the things that you just talked about are unavoidable. I think that— I don't know if it's a good— I don't think that— so if we have Web3, right, if Web3 kind of ends up proliferating, becoming this thing that we all want it to be, I don't know if I want to take a directional bet on how quickly my pizza is going to arrive. Right. There is a lot of learning that I think we need to do as a community around what should be financialized, what shouldn't be, what makes sense to be. like these bets versus like just focus more on like value transfer. It's really, it's a very blurred line that like we're still learning to walk is kind of how I see it.

Yeah. And that makes me feel better about myself when I'm like, I see something taking off and I'm just like, I'm like over it or something. Like it just doesn't vibe with me or something. But I'm really, I'm a bad investor because I just, I go with my gut and I go with things I like. And generally the things I like, a lot of people don't like. It's like still too early or whatever. And so, so, you know, but that's what I love about the space. I love the reason I'm in this space. The reason I love it so much, the reason I love like going to the ETH Tokyo Hackathon is that you see the building and you see like people dreaming dreams and making stuff up with like really primitive tooling, right? Like, like I was in a chat room in Decentral Games. Ice Poker was like advertising on Hustler Casino. And so it's all these normies watching poker streams and they see this ad for crypto play-to-earn platform. And I asked, I was like, hey, what do you think about this? You know, what do you think about Decentral Games? And somebody's like, their website looks like I'm gonna get hacked. Because their value is not the website. Like their website is garbage. Like doesn't, didn't look good cuz they care about the product. But like Web2, what, what the rest of the world cares about is how slick is your website? Equals I'm going to trust you more, right? And especially in crypto, I'm expecting a scam at any turn. And so, yeah, I don't know where— oh, I don't know where I was going with that. Oh, yeah, yeah. The whole, like, I love that we're building with primitive tools and we're, like, standing stuff up and we're trying stuff. And like you said, where are those primitives? Where are those interesting things that crypto innovation creates that we didn't have before? And I think one thing— Yeah. Is what you're doing with lasso.gg. I think this AI crypto nexus, you know, the 2 of the hottest trends, you smash them together, you get an even hotter trend, right? Is that, is that it? Is that the way to succeed?

Yeah, we just like, we just look for like the 2 biggest like grift areas and we're like, all right, we got 2. Yeah.

Put Taylor Swift and BTS on it as well. And then, I mean, it's perfect.

Actually, before I get into Lasso, I'm curious. I want to ask the same question back to you. Do you feel like you're disillusioned with kind of the thing that brought you in in the first place? I guess you said that your friends are the ones who kind of kept on pulling you in until you kind of stuck around. But I'm curious how you think

about it. I love the space because there was a point in my life where I was walking around Google. I'm a religious man, so I was praying about Google and getting a job there because I grew up in My professional career has been the nonprofit sector. And so I was— but I've always been into tech and like edgy, and I've applied for jobs in tech. And generally you need to go to an Ivy League school or you need to be already in tech and show, show that you can do stuff. So I was just kind of always on the outside looking in on the tech world. And then when I got into crypto, I'm like at the front of the tech world, right? Google people leave. Google to work in crypto now, and I just like I leapfrogged the thing, right? So now I'm now I'm in the in the excuse me the um I'm I'm already in tech now. So I think that's cool, and it's really fun for me having ADD and like everything changes so much. So that's also great. So I love the space. I love the people in the space. I don't like the the scams and the and and I feel like when I interact with people, I can kind of tell. which direction we're going or which vibe of crypto we're in, in the conversation that we're having. Yeah. I think that also being religious, I have a lot of faith conversations with people in crypto, people who got that generational wealth, and then they're like, I'm not happy. Why am I not happy? Like, what else? Those kind of things, right? Or it's like crypto is very much a meritocracy. And so, people are only the value of their output. Which I don't think is true. I stand up against that. You are not your output. You are a human being. You have worth and value intrinsically. So those are, those are kind of the places where I get disillusioned. The scammy stuff, I guess that always is happening. Like even on telephones, my mom gets called and tries and is scammed. Doesn't matter the technology. So I think that's more my disillusionment is people is that You think you're going to build this utopia, but then you're not happy at the end of it, right? Even if you get to whatever that might be.

That's interesting. I think the point on meritocratic, it sounds like the more meritocratic aspects of crypto are still something that appeals to you, though, because like you just mentioned right now, you're pretty much on an even playing field with these folks from Google as far as being at the forefront of the space and making an impact. And things like this, right? I would imagine nobody really cared about what your background was. They were just like, what ideas does he bring to the table? Does he seem like a good culture fit? And things like this, which I think is also pretty inherent to crypto, at least from a cultural perspective. Something that I also really admire.

Totally. And I do have a war within myself, and meritocracies appeal to me because they're easy to kill yourself working so hard to try to succeed and that sort of thing. And that's like a constant battle within me. I will say, though, that there is the sheen and appeal still of big tech and Ivy League because of institutional money. I think that, you know, when I was applying for jobs in the crypto space, I was— I just was— I had like my portfolio or whatever, but I didn't have— like, had I come from Google, I would have gotten a job. I feel like if I had those credentials, and I think a lot of it kind of goes to my personality as well. I'm, you know, there's this like desire to have the super pro institutional, like, how can you relate to, you know, Visa? Like, like they're dreaming of you being in that, in that boardroom with Visa or in the meeting space trying to court institutional money, which again goes— Crypto's warring within itself. Like, we need Visa to succeed because we need fiat on-ramps and off-ramps. But also we want to kill Visa, right? So

yeah, it's true. Yeah, we gotta, we gotta bind up for certain, for certain scenarios for sure. That's

right.

But yeah, I mean, at the end of the day, users don't give a shit if you went to— sorry, I keep cursing. They don't really care if you, if you went to— they don't care what school you went to, what your job background is. They just want to see,

you

know, how you can help them out.

Yeah. Listen, Hus, I want to thank you for asking me a question. Rarely happens, but also because I just immediately barrage people with questions. But you just broke in there. You broke through my crystalline veneer and asked me a question and got me to just really do some deep introspection. So I thank you. But let's talk about AI. Let's talk about you. Let's talk about your

Lasso.gg. Yeah, sure. I can give kind of the TLDR and what we're building. Yeah, I think I mentioned it earlier, but Lasso is a search engine for on-chain data. We're aiming to democratize access to information across assets like NFTs, tokens, pricing data, transaction data, DAOs, treasuries, wallets, et cetera, all under one house. And allow you to query that using natural language in the pretty much easiest way possible. And the kind of problem that we're solving there, it's like a big pitch of Web3 is like this transparency aspect, right? Or crypto in general, where you have people throw around a lot of the selling points for Web3 is like, you can verify, not trust. You can check the chain, everything's transparent. But realistically what that means is you have access to a bunch of Fundamentally, what that means is you have access to a bunch of transaction data, right? That means nothing to the human eye. That's because that transaction data is generated for a machine to read it and reach consensus. It's not made for humans to extract any value or derive any real meaning from it. And so there's been a lot of— so there's some tools out there that try to help people make sense of it, sense of this data. Right? There's the kind of analytics tools of the world, like the Dunes, the Flipsides, the kind of GraphQLs. I mean, sorry, The Graph and things like this, which are great. They're huge services to the space, but they do require like a ton of domain knowledge and a ton of technical knowledge to know how to pull any information out. Right? And then if you're not somebody who has that sort of knowledge or skillset or time, then you need to rely on a ton of information across many different websites that curate data for you, right? So you as an individual or like as an investor specifically, information that you care about is fragmented across many different websites. Like CoinMarketCap is like pretty decent at pricing data. Some certain pool statistics are just on like Uniswap Analytics. DeFi Llama has also like their own subset of stats that are interesting. There's like the .info websites that are literally dedicated to entire websites dedicated to just 7-day average fees or one for different blockchains. Token Terminal is good at fundamentals data. I can go on. But now your experience is super fragmented. And on top of that, if you try to— some of the block explorers in the space, they're again, incredible tools for everybody, but If you want to onboard the next billion people, the learning curve should be a lot less for understanding how to use them. So with Lasso, yeah, we kind of saw the opportunity here with some of the technological unlocks that were happening with the LLM space, as well as kind of going through our own trials and tribulations trying to make sense of on-chain data to kind of solve the big problems around having technical knowledge, having like this triangulation cost of even finding the data that you need, as well as like having deep domain knowledge by just allowing people to literally ask the question that you want to know, and we can service the data that you think is interesting to you.

I think that one of the powerful things about AI that prompt engineering actually I guess kind of when you hear that there's a prompt engineering position that people are really talented about making prompts, I think it also instills in like the general public, the normies, the people that are just hearing about AI, it kind of creates this FOMO like, oh, I still need to be technical and learn how to talk to AI and prompt it in the correct way. And what I've been doing recently is ever since ETH Tokyo, I did this— I joined a hack team that created ChatGPT, which was basically just training ChatGPT-4 on smart contract vulnerabilities and fixes. And then you could actually just drop a GitHub link into your smart contract and it would evaluate it for you. It'd actually rewrite your code with commenting on what it changed.

Cool.

And then, and then you should be able to just like run it again after you kind of correct it. But through those lessons of just that kind of got me piqued on this and what I've been learning, talk using ChatGPT is actually AI succeeds when it actually anticipates your questions, or you can actually just communicate needs or things that are important to you. And then the AI produces those results rather than like, what's the right question that I have to ask to, to really get that zinger from AI? And so what I'm thinking about for specifically PoolTogether is we're talking about like, who are these depositors? What are they doing when they deposit into PoolTogether? How long are they in for? How do we get more of these people? Right. And being able to put that into lasso.gg, which would be sweet. It's just like, hey, you know, PoolTogether really wants these kind of things to see growth happen in the protocol. What do you see from the data? And then like, boom. That's like, is that the holy grail? What's the holy grail?

I think you do today. I can talk a lot more about this idea of having to prompt engineer and what makes a good system there. But I think today, yeah, you do have to know what questions you want to have or you want to ask and get answers to. But I think as we chip away at the product, you can definitely get to a point where you can ask it to do do the analysis on the data that you're— like, you can ask it to find the dataset or whatever query that you want and then perform the analysis as far as extracting insights from it directly, right? So you could go in and ask, like, okay, what are the most interesting things that our depositors are doing? And that's a super not concrete analytics question, right? I'll make something interesting. But yeah, I think that we can totally get there. Today, it's just, it's more focused on, like, Straight analytics questions though. But just kind of going back to your point though about prompt engineering, you definitely do have to know how to talk to the system. But I think that it's good. I think one, it's good because it forces you to think through your investment process. At least we're kind of focused on the investor crowd right now with Lasso. It forces you to think about things that were previously really implicit to you. Right? So you might have, let's say I'm like thinking about buying some more maladies, right? I have like a whole set of questions that I have for myself or like pieces of information that I go and try to seek out across many different websites again. But with that, so I'm kind of like forced to like think and be like, okay, what do I actually care about? What do I want to know? What is actually a better way of phrasing this? And then now my investment process is kind of more crystallized to myself, along with the actual answers to my questions that I'm looking for. And also mention, I think a good system for getting people answers is able to help guide them, right? So if somebody asks a vague question, ideally a system— we can actually take a very simple example with Google, right? You ask a question. First of all, I think We don't necessarily talk to Google how we talk to people, right? We input half sentences, and that's because we know how to use Google, right? And then Google will also help us suggest what we might be meaning if we have a typo, and also has suggestions of other queries that are relevant to us when you get into your results. I think that those are all really good attributes of a system that is designed to help you get the answer that you're looking for. So if I'm asking a really vague question, maybe the system is able to make an assumption as to what I mean, explain what assumption that was made, and then make some suggestions around perhaps if you meant this, or if this is what you meant— sorry, yeah, perhaps if you meant another version of this question, and here are some examples of things that you could ask, or if this was what you meant, here's some interesting drill-down questions or further questions that other people are interested in knowing. when they're presented with a similar looking dataset. So, so yeah, there's, there's, there's definitely like a little bit of a learning curve, but I think it's not as bad as, as some other things out there. At least you don't have to learn SQL.

Yes, right. Yes, you don't have to learn SQL, which is like right there, the killer app. But I, one of the things that I, that blew me away with, with these ChatGPT plugins is that, and I could be wrong, but I think that they're just basically prompts. Like it's a prompt, it's a pre-prompt. It's before you put in your thing, it's telling ChatGPT what to do. And I've been creating my own little bots. So I have, I do Eurorack synthesizers, right? With like patch cables and it's very crazy and it's very hard to learn and the manuals are really thick. But like I can actually, I created a bot that basically just only returns answers in the Eurorack universe. So that I don't have to like tell it that I'm asking that. So basically it's like pre-prompting. It's just, it's a, it's these bots are just basically preventing you from having to write like a big long first prompt and just so you're off to the races by using that straight up bot, which is, I feel like pretty primitive. Like you don't necessarily, like eventually AI is going to know what to do and what you want and kind of anticipate your needs. But the same thing, I think one of the ways that AI can help us with blockchain exploration is right now, there's all these dashboards. And I think it's that you don't know what you really want to know. And so, being able to learn and anticipate and get those questions or pull insights for you that are surprising, I feel like is a killer app. But I have a question for you, Hus, because you said that you're going after investors. Why are you— why'd you go after investors and not like builders or not like protocols? Because I, working for PoolTogether, working with PoolTogether as part of the community, I see the need, like how this would be so awesome for PoolTogether. But I'm like, why are you going for investors? Go for protocols, please.

So we do plan to serve both audiences. Right now, the space is pretty much just investors and builders, right? There's not that many casual users of crypto in general. Not yet. So you can pretty much just split it down those 2 lines and you can further segment if you want. But the reason that we choose to go after investors first is because I think that there's more volume there. And part of building an AI system that becomes more robust over time is having that volume of training data, right? So if we focus on B2B sales, A, or if you focus on serving a B2B product, I mean, there's exceptions to this, but if you focus on serving a B2B product, the volume is not as guaranteed. Whereas if we directly target the investor crowd, I feel like there's a lot more of them. So there's a lot more training data and that's a diverse view of training data that we're You can acquire, and then we can move into, uh, then we can definitely move into serving more B2B use cases. Um, and there's a lot of really interesting ones.

Okay, so right now Lasso.gg is in closed beta, so you got to get on the waitlist, you gotta, you gotta see. So how can, how can we see this? Uh, what are next steps for you as far as rollout goes, roadmap? Would love to hear Any alpha you could give us?

Yeah. So

I can also edit out alpha and then it just won't make it to the podcast. Totally up to you.

I don't think there's too much alpha. I would suggest everybody just stay tuned for more updates from us as we begin to let more and more people into the the product, if you're on the waitlist, that's great. We do have a pretty different version of the product that is coming out earlier than the original product, than the kind of like one that we all know, that I think is going to be really compelling and that should be launching in the next couple of weeks. So yeah, I'm excited to start letting people use it.

Awesome. So that's on the waitlist and then we like follow the Twitter and then we'll find out.

Exactly. Exactly. But yeah, I think it'll be worth the wait. I know it's been a little bit. I know some people have been messaging me trying to get the product into their hands, but I think it'll be worth the wait. There's some really exciting stuff that we're building.

So how do you stand out in the crowd of AI tools? Because, you know, on Twitter, there's all these Twitter AI influencers that are like, I found the next 10 hottest tools. And then they— and at one point, I'm like, I don't need an influencer anymore. I can just ask AI what the hottest new AI tools are. And so how do you compete? How are you going to battle the bots?

So I don't really look at it as I don't think that the user really cares if it's AI. They just care how quickly and easily am I able to derive value from this product. So I don't really see us as like, oh, we're competing against other AI tools. We're just competing against other sources of truth for blockchain participants. And I think today, the current state, we're relatively competitive. Against what's out there. And so, yeah, we're just going to focus on delivering user value, delivering it quickly and easily. And that's kind of what we've been focused on since the beginning. Probably not like the sexy answer you want me to say, but yeah. I

think it's a good one. I mean, you really just need to say, listen, you take AI and you add it to crypto and you get the secret sauce. Like, that's the thing. That's the future in the future. Future plus future equals moon. So there you go.

I think just to add on that, I think there are a lot of, like, when you just zoom out, it'd be like crypto AI. There's some use cases that make sense. I think specifically one of the big unlocks with some of these LLM advancements has been the idea that you can bring structure to unstructured data. And some of the premises that— one premise that we found really interesting when we were first kind of getting started with Lasso was like, even beyond crypto, there's a huge opportunity to leverage this technology to structure unstructured data for investors in general, right? Because there's a lot of stuff that one needs to sift through. And so I think that this is a use case where it really does make sense And then specifically why crypto is interesting is because, A, we're bullish and we think that all financial activity will eventually be tokenized and brought on chain. So we'd rather build for something that will grow in the long term. And the market is more nascent right now. But I think also what makes it great is I think there's like 6, 7 million monthly actives on Ethereum right now in a bear market. all these people are interested in querying one single dataset, right? And that's like the chain, right? That doesn't really exist. Like, you see, like, Texas SQL is like a pretty big kind of use case for LLMs, but you don't really see that sort of opportunity in a lot of the applications that are coming out, right? Most people are like, okay, I want to query my company's internal database. I want my users to be able to query our specific information using natural language within my product. But there's a really interesting opportunity to leverage these models to allow people to, millions of people to query this one dataset and do it very, very well. So I think that the opportunity for this is pretty unique.

So can we ask Lasso.gg, can we say, hey, what's the next blockchain that is perfect for a prize savings account that is moving to accept any token, any yield source? Like, can it tell us where PoolTogether should deploy next?

Eventually, yeah. You know, there's a lot of like, our product roadmap is centered around what, like, How much more data can we begin to index? Today is more focused on kind of like asset layer information and analytics questions like, okay, how many daily active users are on Blur, for example? What is the kind of supply distribution of these tokens or this NFT collection? Who are the biggest whales? What was the biggest buys over this amount of time? How many people who bought Pepe sold for a big profit and then went and bought like a Remilio or Milady right after. Like, how many people have like those exist? You can really zoom in. You can be like, okay, show me all the holdings of this wallet. Show me the P&L of this wallet. Show me the largest transactions. Show me every wallet that they've— every address that they've interacted with. There's a lot of interesting things that you could ask it. But subjective questions right now, we're not quite there. We do want to get more qualitative data though. So we also want to allow people to ask questions like, summarize this whitepaper for me, or summarize the governance discussion on Uniswap over the last week, or the specific governance proposal. Tell me about the wallets that are voting on it and the general sentiment around it. There's a lot of cool things we can bring in, Twitter data, et cetera, et cetera.

Yeah, bringing in off-chain data as well, because that's like definitely necessary, especially for sentiment. Um, you, you definitely have the on-chain, but then like crypto Twitter really matters. There's, you know, these white papers really matter. The GitHub repos really matter. There's like a— Absolutely. And I, I love the, the idea of something keeping track of all of that for me. That'd be pretty sweet. How do you, how do you track all these off-chain Yeah,

I think it's super important. And actually, if you think about it, I mentioned it right at the beginning of the call, right? Or at least when I first started talking about Lasso, that a lot of this, like, the data at a fundamental level that we're interested in querying, it's just like transaction data that has no context around it, right? So this context, and I can get, for example, just wallet labels, all of that is like off-chain information, right? And there's not really a source of truth as to whether something is Definitely like a Uniswap pool. I mean, kind of, but not really. Or whether a wallet belongs to a certain person or something like this. A lot of the context is off-chain. So a lot of what gives this stuff meaning is off-chain data. So that's a big part of our job too. So yeah, just kind of like indexing more on that is super important. How we do it, it does range.

Yes.

Like today we can bring in some some Twitter data and we kind of map that over to wallets. You can now have a really interesting lead gen tool or whatever it is where you can ask about the top holders of X NFT collection and go see what their Twitters are, go reach out to them if you think that they're part of your ICP or whatever. But over time, we can actually build these agents, right, that just take in a question, try to analyze what's the best task to be done. So you can have you now have the kind of analytics version of Lasso would just be like one operation that can be done with this meta chain, this meta agent. It's just like a user asks a question, the agent is like, okay, are they asking about something that's like some analytics question about what's happening on chain? Are they asking about summarizing a whitepaper? Do I need to Google something about latest news about a certain topic? Do I need to go and use Twitter to Grab some analysis, whatever it is. We can either empower it to actually search the internet, or we can have these document stores of information that we think is particularly important. And we can actually just have a meta-level agent that finds us information or decides on which task makes the most sense based on what the user is asking. And I think that's when we start to kick into some really crazy problems.

Yeah, it sounds like the way that you build the product is actually have users using it and then giving you feedback on, like, hey, here's what I'm trying to do. this is how it's responding. Is there a way to tweak this or add some other source of knowledge or truth that Lasso can analyze? And then just rinse and repeat, right?

Absolutely. Absolutely. Getting user feedback is super important. And there's such a huge universe of things that we could build, right? So understanding what the market and our user base really cares about really helps us prioritize and And focus on delivering value over building what's just interesting to build.

Okay. And the way that people keep in contact with you is through Twitter. And then there's not— is there Discord, anything else that they should join, be a part of?

Yeah. So Twitter is the best way. We'll be making some announcements soon, next couple of weeks. Wait for it. And Yeah, we'll start inviting people into the Discord too with these announcements. And yeah, Discord should be fun.

All right, nice. All right, well, since you have all the power of AI, I would love to hear your prediction of what happens in crypto next, Hus. What are we going to see in the next 6 months with whatever you want to talk about? NFTs, Miladys, Twitter, coins, Base. Blockchain regulation. What do you think? What interests you? What are you excited about? What are you scared about? Actually, just only excited. No FUD.

Good question. I think I'm excited to see L2s pick up more stride. I think I'm pretty excited about Honestly, something that I'm really interested in and I've been tracking is how the NFT exchange market landscape is changing. So we're seeing in our own data right now, Blur, they launched in October and they're sitting at upwards of 60% market share of total volume of NFT sales. That's insane. How did OpenSea go from the complete market dominator to 25% market share, and it might be a little bit higher given wash trading. But regardless, Blur is absolutely killing it, right? And so I've been really interested in keeping track of how they're going about things. They just launched their kind of lending solution. I find that to be really interesting. I think the NFT space in general, I'm pretty excited about. I like NFT Perp. I want to see how people end up creating new primitives and new ways to interact with these NFTs over time. So I'm pretty interested in that. As mentioned, yeah, the L2s, seeing steam pick up there. I'm really interested in the permissionless lending protocols that are kind of— sorry, the undercollateralized lending protocols that are coming out. And I'm interested in seeing Milady flip like every other NFC out there.

Yeah, of course, of course, of course. But what do you think? So are you talking about like Pawn and Arcade as far as like peer-to-peer lending goes, or what other undercollateralized protocols?

Yeah, so I mean, I'm particularly excited about like, you know, there's the Sentiments of the world, there's the like Sentiment on Arbitrum, I think is like Really compelling. You can do undercollateralized lending and you can kind of use that loan that you're taking out to do things like swap into tokens, but as well as do like yield farming. So I can like 5x lever my ETH into either staking ETH or even like into Aave and start earning fees. And like, yeah, I think that their protocol is actually super interesting. You know, there's, there's, there's a couple out there, but I think Sentiment is one I'm like particularly interested in, uh, and seeing how they, how they shape up.

Nice. All right, well, uh, I mean, I'm done with questions. You have anything else that you wanted to talk about before we wrap up?

Uh, no, I, I appreciate you having me on here. Uh, it's always fun to kind of nerd out about this stuff, uh, and not just do it in like text form but actually talking to somebody. So yeah, I appreciate it. It's been cool. Keep you guys in the loop on the product and I'm excited for you to try it. Is there usually like a Q&A part? Does anybody have any questions?

There's a chat where they can put questions in. And so yeah, I generally, if I see them, I'll ask them from the chat, but we're good. Hey, thanks for being here. I'm pumped about following Lasso.gg on Twitter. And, uh, and looking forward to these new products, this new stuff that you're innovating with.

Yeah. Thank you. I appreciate it. Uh, yeah. Cheers.

Milady.

Milady.

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