023 Interview w Phil Newton, Founder of Antivestor com

Hello and welcome to the Consistent Profits podcast brought to you by Inside out trading and Brian McAvoy where the focus is on consistency because when you have the consistent part down, profits become easy. All right, hello everybody and welcome to the Consistent Profits podcast. This is brought to you by Brian McAvoy. That would be me of Inside Out Trading. Today I'm really excited to be interviewing Phil Newton of Anti Vestor. Thanks so much for being on the podcast today, Phil.

Thanks for having me.

Now Phil runs the slight anti vester, but he started out hand drawing charts in the mid-90s as a way to learn about the markets and put into practice what he was reading about in the textbooks. 2001 he went into full time trading at a prop shop, but that came to an abrupt end after major health issues and he was finally diagnosed with Crohn's disease which nearly killed him. In January 2003, while still in recovery, he started trading his own accounts and managed to turn a thousand pounds into 92,549 and change, change, oh and change in around eight months. Now he trades stocks, options and index futures using a variety of mechanical rule based trading systems which he also teaches two small groups of ser traders who want to get results without being glued to the computer screen all day. It's very focused on systematizing and automating his trade so he can spend more time enjoying life, which is awesome. Again, thanks for being here, man.

Again, thanks for having me. It's always a pleasure to try and kind of spread the word that I think there's, there's so many different ways of trading and they're all right. So it's always nice to get a different perspective on the markets and sometimes it'll resonate with people and other times it won't. So, you know, thanks for having me.

Yeah, indeed. So, so I gotta ask, just because it's, it's pretty cool sounding and it's different. How'd you come up with the name Antifester anyway?

Well, originally my site was called trading-strategies.info back in the early noughties because it was an information thing. It was an information site, made sense and I, I wanted to rebrand it, but I like to think that I do things in a slightly different way. So I was always like I'm anti investing and the, not necessarily the anti trader. I'm not necessarily contrarian thinker in that regards, but I just, I, I just don't agree with investing in the traditional sense and then eventually just percolating that over it's like anti Vesta made sense to me. So eventually I did a rebrand and got a dot com and joins the. Joined the dot com boom about 15 years too late.

Yeah. Well, that's very cool. Now in reading your story, you, you, you got interested in stock trading like way back in high school, before you were even of like legal age to start trading, is that right?

That's correct, yeah. So when I was about 15, I went to a neighbor's house running an errands and he was on the phone talking to what I now know as his broker. He was talking about gold and buy this and sell that. And it was an in depth conversation which I was privy to partial part of that conversation. It just intrigued me and I asked him, you know, what was all that about? He said, I'll buy and sell and that's how he, he makes his money. And that's neighbor's house, running in errands. And he was on the phone talking to what I now know as broker. He's talking about gold and buy this and sell that. And it was an in depth conversation which I was privy to partial part of that conversation. It just intrigued me and I asked him, you know, what was all that about? He said, I'll buy and sell. And that's how he, he makes his money. And that's what he was doing. It just fascinated me, just everything that was going on. And he basically told me, he said, like, anyone can play the game of the stock market as long as you've got money to kind of buy into it or open a brokerage account. And coming from quite a poor background and upbringing, that fascinated me that anyone could participate in what was perceivably or perceived by most people as an exclusive club. So I asked them to teach me and he said no. And it was the best. I was a bit pissed off, to say the least. But that was the best thing you could have done for me because then it set about my own journey trying to find out what was working for me. Because as we said a moment ago, there's so many ways of trading and I suppose that the hardest thing is finding your path to, you know, to, to consistent trading. That's what it set about with me.

Yeah. Indeed. Well, so you get, you get busy like right after you turned 18. Um, at what point did it actually turn into an occupation for you, though?

It didn't until about 2001. And like most people, you're kind of scared of committing to something new and unknown. And I didn't realize that there was other people doing this and kind of when I was learning and coming up in the ranks of trying to make it work, there was no Internet, certainly not in the UK in the same level that it is now. So there was no one to ask, no one to turn to. I thought I was the only person that was trading the markets, you know, like most people. But about 2000, 2001, the Internet became a thing in the UK, spread bet companies started to come about so it just allowed easier access to the markets. Forex started to become a thing as well. Again it just opened it up to the, the retail trader on mass because there was a lot of online brokerages so it became a lot easier. There was a lot of prop shops starting to come about at the time, but that's where went to, to work for. I was actually just finishing a second degree at university and I bumped into a guy at one of the airports that I had a part time job at and they were at the, the helicopter center and he had a, a prop shop essentially and invited me down, had an interest in trading and he gave me a seat on his, on his desk there. So that was where I spent around about eight or nine months before I was diagnosed with Crohn's disease. And then I was forced into trading my own accounts and I was housebound for, you know, almost three. I had to make it work, I had no choice. So just trying to kind of make that leap of faith and trade my own money. It was, the decision was taken away from me. I was forced into doing it because like everyone, I've got food to buy, got bills to pay, I've got money to make and I couldn't from then onwards work a traditional job. So that trade your own money was, was a decision that was forced upon me to make it work. I had this skill set that I was using elsewhere and there was no reason for me not to try and do it with my own money and you know, proved it myself for myself over the next eight months that hey, maybe I've got something that works. I made a lot of mistakes like most people early on, but the markets were quite forgiving back then where you could drop it in the morning and make it back in the afternoon or vice versa. You know, you have this opportunity to make reasonably good money in a very short space of time.

Very cool. Now you started in, you started in stocks, but then later we started in.

Sorry, the first, sorry just to correct you, the first trader placed was in stocks, right? Or a stock company called Waterfall but then I went on to futures at the prop shop and then I was essentially trading futures initially and then I got into currencies in a really weird way. I spent 12 years trading currencies. Sorry to, to interrupt you, but it was someone I looked on the phone to a friend who was also a trader at the time and he said, do you trade currencies? And I said no. And he said, you should. So the next day I got a D data feed for it and, and that was how I got into currencies. It was just a random conversation. And I remember to this day, so I stopped trading futures because it was a 24 hour market so I could kind of pick and choose when I wanted to trade. Because if you're not familiar, Crohn's diseases. And it was for me back then quite dramatic in that I get tired quite a lot to get fatigued. So although it's not active for me right now, I do get tired on a regular basis. So it just allowed me to go, okay, I've got an hour where I'm feeling good now and there's somewhere, somewhere around the world some currency that's moving. And it just allowed me the opportunity to trade around my lifestyle, in my case my illness at the time. So that's what it allowed me to do. The currency markets.

Gotcha. Now when you were doing the currency trading though, you, you were day trading, that correct?

Yeah, essentially, yeah, it was day trading, short term swing trading, maybe lasting one to three days. So that was what it was Primari focused on back then.

Okay, now is that how you're trading the futures or did you make a shift when you switched to currencies enough.

I'm actually trading probably the same way that it did now back then, only I've got more rules in place that allow me to systematize and almost automate what I do. But I'm essentially trading the same strategies that I did back then. It's, it, there's no re revelation behind trading. You know, when you find something that works, you've just got to stick to it, keep doing it over and over and over again. I think the mistake a lot of traders make is they get some that works and then get bored and then decide to do something different.

And it.

Ends up a catastrophe very, very quickly. And it's, it's just doing that same thing over and over again for intense purposes. One of the patterns that I like to trade is breakouts. Find consolidations, trade breakouts. And I did that. I just traded that one pattern for 12 years on currencies. And it, it, it's, it's very, very profitable. I do something very similar now on inde to do something very similar now on stocks. And it's just one of the tools that's in the, the arsenal things that I like to trade.

Okay, well, so along along with breakouts, what, what other strategies do you like?

Breakouts. So there's three market conditions which hopefully I'll answer your question. Markets can be going up, they can be going down, they can be on the sideways. So I like to trade the trend, buy the dips, sell the rally. So up and down, they're the, the two most mechanical versions of what I do. Using a combination of moving averages to determine direct value areas around the move on averages, use them more of a, a guideline rather than focus on the crossovers. And then we've got ranges so we can trade the breakouts, bullish breakout, bearish breakouts. And then if price is in a range, if it's sufficiently tall or it has a good depth and I can trade the range and trade reversals off the range lows to the range, highs and vice versa. So they're the, the six patterns that I like to trade. The two that are left are counter trend. It just doesn't agree with my personality, trading against the grain. So I generally don't do it. But they' Broadly speaking, the six things that I like to do about, I'd say 85, 90% of the time I'm buying dips and selling rallies. It is the most mechanical way I can trade. And wherever possible I'll default to, you know, trading the trend because I hate that uncertainty. You know, one of the things that we all go through when we start out, and I was an especially emotional trader starting out, I want to try and remove the indecision, the hesitation, the should I be, should I be in this? Is this the right time? Where's my ent entry? Where's my stop loss? Where's my target? All those things that we always ask ourselves, is this the right stock? Is this the right opportunities at the right time? And I just wanted to get rid of those nuances that though the devil and the angel on your shoulder, constantly fighting that, having that conversation, is it the right time? It's not going up, it must be going down. And vice versa. I just wanted to get rid of all of that. So I ended up focusing on trying to systematize my own system. So again, most of the time I'm buying dips and selling rallies and I use moving averages as a framework to mechanize that decision making process. You know, when all the averages are stacked on top of each other, the 200, the 50 and the 20, for example. And when they're all those three are stacked on top of each other must be going down and vice versa. You know, I just wanted to get rid of all of that. So I ended up focusing on trying to systematize my own system. So again, most of the time I'm buying dips and selling rallies and I use moving averages as a framework to mechanize that decision making process. You know, when all the averages are stacked on top of each other. The, the I'm bullish. I'm only looking for bullish trades. When price comes between the move and averages. That's my buy zone essentially. So when it goes back above all three moving averages, I'll get positions. And it, you know, the back of the envelope version is that, that is as simple as I make it. So it does a little bit more to it to make it mechanical, but it allows me to automate 200, the 50 and the 20 for example. And when they're all those three are stacked on top of each other, those decisions and again I can get all the fancy performance reports that the software provider I'm bullish. I'm only looking for bullish trades when price comes between the move and averages. That's my buy zone essentially. So when it goes back above all three moving averages, I'll get positions. And it, you know, the back of the envelope version is that, that is as simple as a make it IG to say hey, you know, is this a good stock or time frame or index for this style of trading? The trend. And I can get a 20 year history of saying yeah, it, it looks good, we've got a nice equity curve, great. There's no reason for me not to trade this. Then the second part of after that, you know, we've got the system that's working is to, to be consistent. So there's a little bit more to it to make it mechanical. But it allows me to automate those decisions. And again I can get all the fancy performance reports that the software provides you to say hey, you know, is this a good stock or time frame or index for this style and just trade instruments constantly or the time frame constantly, day in, day out, getting the whole thing that, that I realized was consistency. The only way that you're going to make it work is to, is to just find three or four things to train the train the Trend and I can get a 20 year history of saying yeah it looks good, we trade and just, just trade the out of them and just keep going. We've got a nice equity curve. Great. There's no reason for me not to trade this. Then the second part of speaking of.

Consistent, what, what do you consider are like the main obstacles the traders run into? Because I mean consistency is that's, that's like everybody's challenge. So what do you consider probably like the top, you know, few obstacles that people run into as far as consistency?

I think jumping around from indicator to indicator, tool to tool market. Some of after that, you know we've got the system that's working is to, to be consistent and just trade vats instruments constantly or the time frame constantly day in market time frame to time frame. Like I'm a one time frame trader. I don't do top down analysis. Just because it was written you know, 50 years ago in a textbook by a cycle. It doesn't mean that it's a good method. It works for some people. It doesn't work for me because as you know you're laughing because you, you obviously have some, some day out. The whole thing that, that I realized was consistency. The only way that you're going to make it work to just find three or four things to trade and just, just trade the out of them and just keep going.

Speaking of consistent, what, what do you consider are like the main obstacles the traders run into?

Kind of viewpoints. You know it, you can see opposing viewpoints. If you go from a monthly to a daily there's two different directions can be happening and that, I mean consistency.

Is that's, that's like everybody's challenge. So what do you consider?

Probably like the top causes confusion. So I'm just trying to, I'm just trying to eliminate confusion. And so I generally One time frame. So it's one time frame, one indicator or one tool to support you know.

A few obstacles that people run into as far as consistency I think jumping.

Around and I only use indicators and because it allows me to clinically say this is an event that has happened. It allows me an A, a binary decision. Price has moved past or two or touched a moving average. And we could be talking about any tool, any the tool doesn't matter. If we were talking five years ago we would have been talking about from indicator to indicator tool to tool, market to market, time frame to time frame. Like I'm a one time frame trader. I don't do top down analysis just because it was written, you know, 50 years ago in a textbook by cycle. It doesn't mean that it's a good method. It works for some people. It doesn't work for me because, as you know, you're laughing because you, you obviously have some, some Bollinger mantles doing exactly the same thing, but just through the lens of a Bollinger band that the tool doesn't make the trading opportunities. It's just how we approach it. So it's one time frame, one tool, and, you know, one setup. You know, in this case, buy the dip and sell the rallies, and it's trading the trend. So the moving averages allow me to identify viewpoints. You know, it. You can see opposing viewpoints. If you go from a monthly to a daily, there's two different directions can be happening and that causes confusion. So I'm just trying to, I'm just trying to eliminate confusion. And so I generally. One time frame. So it's one time frame, one indicator or one tool to support it. And I only use indicators and because it allows me to clinically say this by a trending environment. And then I can buy the dip. And that's the bit that people forget is people want to buy the dip, but they forget to look for trend first. So just recognize is an event that has happened. It allows me an A, A, a binary decision. Price has moved past or to. Or touched a moving average. Again, the moving average is. Allow me to recognize the market conditions. And similarly, we could be talking about any tool. Any. The tool doesn't matter. If we were talking five years ago, we would have been talking about. It tells me when not to use them. So if we have multiple crosses in those moving averages, it says, yeah, you know what? Now's not really the right time to focus on trending tools because the market conditions are not favorable. So maybe I just press pause, draw a big box around the whole area where I've got these multiple crosses and Bollinger bands doing exactly the same thing, but just through the lens of a Bollinger band that the tool doesn't. Then, you know, wait, wait for the breakouts or, you know, if, if the, the range is defined make the trading opportunities. It's just how we approach it. So it's one time frame, one tool and, you know, one setup. You know, in this case, buy the dibble in a, a robust fashion. Then maybe I can trade the range as an opt and sell the rallies. It's trading the trend. So the moving averages allow me to identify. Again, I've got choices depending on how we interpret the chart again all through that lens of the move on averages, right?

Yeah, very cool. Now so you were trading Forex for a while, but you're back to stocks now, correct?

Yes.

Okay, so, so why did you make that shift? Had what happened that they lost their.

Appeal and found the guy a trending environment and then I can buy the dip and that's the bit the currency market that back in sort of 2003, 2004, the, the currency, the currency markets are very easy. In fairness it was you would have an Asian range in the UK trading session there'd be a breakouts. People forget is people want to buy the dip but they forget to look for the trend first. So just recognize. So again the moving average is allowing me to recognize the market conditions. Similarly it tells me when not to use them. So if we have multiple crosses in those moving averages, it says yeah, you know what? It would move an average day's move by around 10 o' clock in the UK morning there'd be a retracement over lunchtime into the early US session. You could buy the 50 retracements and it retest the high by four, you know, by lunchtime in the US and that's pretty much how the day went three times a week as an absolute minimum. And maybe there'll a bit, a little, little bit of nonsen. So looking back on it, now is not really the right time to focus on trending tools because the market conditions are not favorable. So maybe I just press pause, draw a big box around the whole area where I've got these multiple crosses. And I wish I'd realized at the time, but it was very easy by comparison to the market condition now. So I just found that the market conditions went very soon, you know, wait, wait for the breakouts or you know, if, if the, the ranges defined sloppy, very messy, they became directionless. It bec more difficult to apply in a robust fashion. Then maybe I can trade the range as an optional extra. Again, I've got choices depending on how we interpret the chart. Again all through that lens of the move and I buy the same setups. I also found that the range of movements on an intraday basis and on intra week basis for that matter was just getting smaller and smaller. And I appreciate you can increase your position size, but just psychologically I just couldn't wrap my head around I'm trading, you know, small movements where I'm used to, you know, for years.

Right? Yeah, very cool. Now so you were trading forex for a while, but you're back to stocks now, correct?

Yes.

Okay, so, so why did you make that shift? What happened that they lost their appeal.

And found that five times the size of movements and again I know it can increase the position size but just psychologically it just didn't. I, I couldn't wrap my head around at the time. Also the, the requirements for margin in 2009 change options. You didn't need the same requirements currency market that back in sort of 2003, 2004 is what you did. You know, there's no margin requirements. They basically eliminated themselves. As a buyer of options, the, the currency, the currency markets are very easy. In fairness it was, you know, if the price of the option was 500, that was all it was going to cost me, 500. So it just allowed me the opportunity to do the same strategies in stocks but use options as the vehicle to profit from directional movements alternative to trading stock. And it allowed me to instead of trading one or two things and having most of my capital tied up in margin to then go, you know, now I can trade a portfolio of stocks, you know, 10, 15, 20 stocks. You would have an Asian range in the UK trading session there'd be a breakouts. It would move an average day's move by around 10 o' clock in the UK morning that for the same, you know, allocation of funds if you like it would be a retracement over lunchtime into the early US session. You could buy the 50. It's just a smarter way of trading all of a sudden. So it was a combination of things that all happened at retracements and it retest the high by four, you know, by lunchtime in the US and that's pretty much how the day went. Three times a week it's absolutely the same time, you know and I can just put my capital to better use over and maybe they'll be a little, little bit of nonsense. So looking back on it, you know, multiple occurrences again, I'm a big fan of portfolio trading either a portfolio I wish I'd realized at the time but it was very easy by comparison to the market condition now. So I just found that the market conditions went very solio of stocks. So for example, on the, on the swing trade side of things, what, what I'm doing with daily charts is I have 25 stocks. That's it, that's all I'm looking at. So I just want to trade those setups. Consistent, sloppy, very messy. They became directionless. It became more difficult to apply the same setups. I also Found that the range of movements on those 25 stocks regularly, consistently to get paid at the end of the month or at the end of the quarter. And then a similar process is used for 60 minute time frame. So I can get paid at the end of the week or the end of the month with the shorter time frames. And then the day trade stuff that I do, I can get paid at the end of the day or maybe I'll hold them overnight depending on how the, the, the strategy unfolds for the time frames that I'm trying. So it just allows me to dep. Multiple strategies, multiple trading occurrences and on an intraday basis and on intra week basis for that matter was just getting smaller and smaller. And I appreciate you can increase your position size but just psychologically I just couldn't wrap my head around. I'm trading, you know, small movements where I'm used to, you know, four or five times the size of movements. And again I know I can increase the position size but just psychologically it just didn't. I, I couldn't wrap my head around at the time. Also the, the requirements focus my attention again and all of this can be done in you know, 60 to 90 minutes at the start of the day for me because I don't need to be at the computer all day every day flicking through for margin in 2009 change for options. You didn't need the same requirements chart at the charter. There's like 25 things in my universe to be fair, there's about 35. You know, when I look at index futures and a few other things because I'm trading multiple instruments as well. It, it's a very simple process to follow. Just buy the dip, sell the rallies. If there's a range, step aside or trade the range, wait for the breakouts. It's a very clinical decision because everything is as defined as I can make it as what you do, you know, there's no margin requirements. They basically eliminated themselves. As a buyer of options, you know, if the price of the option 500, that was all it was going to cost me, 500. So it just allowed me the opportunity to do the same strategies in stocks but use so that I'm not thinking. And again, the main motivation is I've got Crohn's disease. I get brain fog options as the vehicle to profit from directional movements as an alternative to trading stock quite regularly. I'm ill on a regular basis. In my case it's not active as I mentions but I have permanent mild symptoms in my case. So it's just one of the things that I have to get used to. So the trading reflects, or the way that I trade reflects the life that I want to live or the life that I have to live in fairness, tennis and when I'm not well, it just allows me to go up and it allowed me to, instead of trading one or two things and having most of my capital tied up in margin to then go, you know, now I can trade a portfolio of stocks, you know, 10, 15, 20 stocks. There's my 60 minutes or 30 minutes or even 10 minutes. You know, you can be done quite quickly some days after the same, you know, allocation of funds if you like. It was just a smarter way of trading all of a sudden. So it was a combination of things that all happened at the end. Put the trades on or not as case may be and go and do sort of the else. And obviously when I am well, because obviously I'm not ill all the time. It's just from time to time these days, thankfully it just allows me to have a life around doing other things. I can go the zoo, go hiking, I'm not interested in the same time, you know, and I can just put my capital to better use over Fed announcements, the news announcements. I can just spend all the time doing other things, you know, multiple occurrences. Again, I'm a big fan of portfolio trading either a portfolio of stocks. So for example, on the, on the swing trade side of things, what, what I'm doing with daily charts is I have 25 stocks. That's it, that's all I'm looking at. So I just want to trade those setups consistent without having to, you know, be a full time trader from an hours and time committed point of view.

Yeah. Well now as far as. So are you. So you have, if I understand you correctly, so you have kind of a set and forget system. If you can just trade, you know, you know, matter of minutes a day or so. Are you selling options? Are you buying options?

I'm buying options. Buying options. So I'm using stock, sorry, I'm using options as an alternative on those 25 stocks regularly, consistently to get paid at the end buying stock because the capital requirements are significantly less.

Which means.

Yeah, so which means that, you know, if, if the option is going to cost $500, for example, the month or the end of the quarter and then a similar process is used for 60 minute time frame so I can get paid at the end of the week or the end of the month with shorter time frames and then the day trade Stuff that I do. I can get paid at the end of the day or maybe I'll hold them overnight depending on how the, the and that's all it costs me as a buy buyer. You know, my risk is defined by 500. My margin required is 500. You've got this. I tend to use the full price, the premium as a built in stop loss. So we don't need to monitor the exits. Like there's my entry buy the strike buy the strategy unfolds for the time frames that I'm trading. So it just allows me to deploy multiple strategies, multiple trading occurrences and sufficient time, you know, on the more time than I'll, I'll practically need to make, you know, focus my attention again. And all of this can be done in you know, 60 to 90 minutes at the start of the day for me because I don't need to be at the computer all day every day flicking through to trade work or to see if it's going to work. But if it's not going to work, instead of being stopped out, I generally just let it expire. I've got till expiration to manage it better and either to get a job at the chart. There's like but 25 things in my universe to be fair there's about 35, you know, when I look at index futures and a few other things because I'm trading multiple indexes, instruments as well. Juice risk or get out at break even or you know, sometimes you just, you know, the entry is the least important part. We all know that, you know, you can toss coins, it's the exit amount. It, it's a very simple process to follow. Just buy the dip, sell the rallies. If there's a range step aside or trade the range, wait for the breakouts. And it's a very cluttered. So rather than focus all my energy on being stopped out or where shall I get out if I'm wrong long, well, it doesn't matter anymore. I'm going to mistime my entry. I've let go of that a long time. Clinical decision because everything is as defined as I can make it so that I'm not thinking. And again the main motivation is I've got Crohn's disease, I get brain fog. I've got the entry setups. As long as directionally I'm right, I've got enough time for example on the, the daily swings, I've got 150 days minimum to be right. I only planned if I'm right, I'm only planning to be in it for about 30 days. 20, 30 days. Days. The end of the month essentially. But I've got 150 days to figure it out if it's not going right, if it's underwater. And I've seen so many trades turn around just because I missed time the trade by you know, maybe five, 10, sometimes 15 days. And you know when you're wrong, you're always wrong. You know, it doesn't matter where the entry was, it's always going to get stopped. It's always going to. So rather than worry about where the entry was and where to get out from wrong, I just want to focus my energy just on when or if I'm right, where am I going to take profits and that it, it's such a freeing and liberating feeling to not worry about being what if I'm wrong? Well, it doesn't matter anymore. It's just like when I'm right I can manage it better and if I'm wrong I've got the opportunity to fix it. And to be fair, I've just had that with a couple of trades. Amat, amat. You know, that's one of the the stocks that I had to trade it it was a buy the dip opportunity. It went sideways for you know, one and a half, two months. Months. I think it's amount. Let me just double check it. And it went sideways. So I got in in March on a buy the dip classic sort of quite regularly. I'm ill on a regular basis. In my case it's not active as I mentions but I have permanent mild symptoms in my case. So it's just one of the things that I have to get used to. So the trading reflects or the way that I trade reflects the life that I want to live or the life that I have to live in fairness awareness. And when I'm not well it just allows me to go okay, there's my 60 minutes or 30 minutes or even 10 minutes. You know, you can be done quite quickly some days and put the trades on or not as case may be and go and do something else. And obviously when I am well because obviously I'm not ill all the time. It's just from time to time these days. Thankfully it just allows me to have a life around doing other things. I can go the zoo, go hiking. I'm not interested in the average crossover and it came back to the 50p of me of an average so in from around $120 it went sideways for a month and a half started to. It just took Too long to get there so I can get out at break even. Small profits and reposition and now it's starting to move SL slowly still, but it's still moved. Fed announcements, the news announcements. I can just spend all the time doing other things unfavorably. But it was underwater for a month and a half. But if you stopped out in that traditional sense with stock, firstly you're locking up your capital, secondly, you've appreciated the loss without having to to you know, be a full time trader from an hours and time committed point of view.

Yeah. Well now as far as. So are you.

Well I've got till expiration to figure it out. Well in this or manage it better as I like to say in this case it eventually moved favorably. I've avoided being stopped out. I don't have to worry about a re entry.

So you have, if I understand you correctly, so you have kind of a set and forget system. If you can just trade, you know, you know, matter of minutes a day or so. Are you selling options or are you buying options?

I'm buying and everything worked out fine. And again if I'm wrong, it's always going to be wrong. But because I've got that trade and I've got till expiration to see if it's going to turn out to try and manage it more effectively. I also have a rule where I don't take another trade buying options. Buying options. So I'm using stock, sorry, I'm using options as an alternative to buying stock because the capital requirements are significantly less until that one's been managed. Managed. So it forces me to not over trade that stock especially if it's sloppy and it's going up and down and yo yoing back and forth until that range is perhaps confirmed. It just forces me to sit on the sidelines. This trade has got till expiration to be managed more effectively. I can't manage it effectively. I don't close a trade for a monetary loss. Yeah. So which means that you know, if, if the option is going to cost 500 for example then that's all it cost me is a buy higher. You know, my risk is defined by 500. My margin requirements is 500. You've got this. I tend to use the full price, the premium as a built in stop loss. So we don't need to monitor the exits. Like there's my entry buy, the strike buy. I want to try and get out at break even or better and it just forced me to go, you know what, just sit on the sidelines, wait Wait, wait. Okay. It's not worked. It expires worthless. That's when I take my loss. The worst part about the way I trade trade, whether it's the, the daily swings, the weekly swings, you know, the same process is used. And even with the day trades, I generally close the day trades obviously at the end of the day take whatever sufficient time, you know, on the, you know, more time than I'll practically need to make there or not as the case may be. But it just forces me not to over trade work or to see if it's going to work. But if it's not going to work, instead of being stopped out, I generally just let trade in less than ideal market condition. And I find that that works. So I end up focusing all my energies on if I'm working right. You know, the hardest decision I have is should I take the, when should I take the profits? You know, it's like that's the best because the losses are going to expire. I've got till expiration to manage it better either to get a reduced risk or get out at break even or, you know, sometimes you just, you know they're going to roll off on expiration. They, I've already accounted for that. So the worst part about it is you're holding the losses until expiration game. A lot of my students tend to, it's a little bit of a mental gear change to work the head around that. But when they get used to it, it's such a liberating feeling to not worry about, well, what if I'm wrong? Well, it doesn't matter anymore. You're just trying to figure out how can I manage this trade more. The entry is the least important part. We all know that you can toss coins. It's the exit that matters. So rather than focus all my energy on being stopped out or where shall I get out. If I'm wrong, well, it doesn't matter anymore. I'm going to mistime my entry. I've let go of that a long time ago effectively.

Well, so how do you wind up helping other traders anyway?

I've got the entry setups. As long as directionally I'm right, I've got enough time. For example, on the, the daily swings, I've got 150 days minimum to be right. Pardon?

How did you wind up helping other traders?

Probably like most people, you, you in my case it was kind of pre social media. It, we were on forums back then. Trade to win. I think one of your plans, if I'm right, I'm only planning to be in it for about 30 days. 20, 30 days. The end of the month essentially and but I've got 150 days to figure it out. If it's not go past guest John Foreman was, was on there that that's kind of like how we met but you just start posting stuff and you get involved in the community on public forums and you post off and you realize that you're one of the anomalies that you're actually making this work work and the other 10000 people are not. But you just start getting private messages saying hey can you show me what to do? And you know it just kind of snowballs from there. Eventually you know, people just started saying you know, can you show me? Can you put some time aside? Can you train me? I'll pay you. Oh people pay me. Will you? You know and that's where it came from. And I found that I really enjoyed helping other traders and get a leg up and I had something going right if it's underwater and I've seen so many trades turn around just because, because I missed time the trade was working and because of the way that I try and approach my own trading and try and back then it was a little bit more discretionary than what it is right now but try and sit by you know, maybe five, 10, sometimes 15 days and you know when you're wrong, you're always wrong. You know it doesn't matter where the entry was, it's always going to get stopped. It's always going to. So rather than worry about where the entry was and where to get out from wrong I just want to focus my energies on when or if I'm right, where am I going to take profits and that it's such a freeing and liberation what I'm doing. Certain things have to happen. It was always going to be if this, you know, series of things has happened then I'm going to take action. So it was always like a checklist like, like a pilot has a pre flight checklist and that was attractive to quite a large number of people who feeling to not worry about being one from wrong. Well it doesn't matter anymore. It's just like when I'm right I can manage it better and if I'm wrong I've got the opportunity to fix it. And to be fair I've just had that with a couple of trades. Amat, amat. You know that's one of the, the stocks that I like to trade. It was a buy the dip opportunity. It went Sideways for, you know, one and a half, two months. I think it's amat. Let me just double check it. It went sideways. Firstly, we're either brand new or very busy people where they couldn't spend hours analyzing stock charts for whatever the divination they were looking for. So it just progressed from there. And then over the years of again trying to answer my own question. How do I make this more mechanical? How do I take the discretion out my own tradings? So I got in in March on a buy the dip classic sort of and then it just firms up the strategies and the process that we use. So you know, these days it's, it's a very methodical, very mechanical cycle process for the two primary strategies that I like. And again it's attractive to quite a number of people because it means that, you know, to answer my own question, how can I do this in the least amount of time possible and still get the rewards from trading? It means that people can do it around the work. They can check in at lunchtime, they can check in at breakfast. If they've got a bit more time to look at the lower time frame stuff, you can check in again. One of the strategies I have with futures trading is you check in at 10 o' clock and you either have a setup or you can don'ts. It's either there or not. It's a binary decision and if yes you place the trade and if no you come back tomorrow. So a lot of people find that quite attractive because that's what I want for me. I don't, I just want to know do I have anything to do right now? If yes, place over an average crossover. It came back to the 50 period moving average so in from around $120. It went sideways for a month and a half. Started to, it just took too long to get there. So I can get out at break even even small profits and reapers. If no, come back tomorrow. So again, everything could be done. And if you want to trade everything, if you've got a little bit more time, it's going to take you 30 to 60 minutes. And maybe when you're learning it'll take you an hour and a half to position. And now it's starting to move slow, slowly still, but it still move hours if you've got the morning and you can get everything you need done done in a very short space of time. And again when you get used to like with anything, when you get used to any process, you can condense that down into, you know, 20, 30 min you know, should you choose to. Again, like learning how to drive. When you remember when you learned how to drive, it took you a long time to figure it out and to not run favorably, but it was underwater for a month and a half. Well, if you stopped out in that traditional sense with stock, firstly, you're locking up your capital. Secondly, you've appreciated the loss. Well, I've got till expiration to figure it out. Well, in this, or manage it better, as I like to say, in this case, it eventually moved favorably. I've avoided being stopped out. I don't have to worry about a reentry lockdown when you were changing gears or change doing the, the, the indicators and pressing all the, the foot pedals. You know, eventually when you get a little bit of practice at some basic maneuvers, driving becomes very, very easy. And that's how I compare what I do. I mean, I, I often refer to what I do as a production line process because like you're in a factory, the decisions that you make are going along the production line and if you get a no on any of those decisions and everything worked out fine. And again, if I'm wrong, wrong, it's always going to be wrong. But because I've got that trade and I've got till expiration to see if it's going to turn out to try and manage it more effectively. I also have a rule where I don't take another trade until that one's been managed. So it forces me to not over trade that stock as you, you flick the trade off into the reject bin. Eventually. What we want to do is you want to get, you know, five decisions, five main decisions so that we get the completed product and we, we click confirm and set. Especially if it's sloppy and it's going up and down and yo yoing back and forth and forth until that range is perhaps confirmed. It just forced me to sit on the sidelines. This trade has got till expiration to be managed more effectively. I can't manage it effectively. I don't close a trade for a monetary loss. And on the trade, you know, that's what I want to do. I want that for myself first and foremost. But as we said, that is quite attractive to, you know, other people who are interested in, you know, just finding opportunities on a regular, consistent basis.

Well, so as far as with, with the anti vest, I mean, are you, so are you, are you basically teaching people the strategies and the methods or do you have like a signal service or.

I've had a signal service in the past And I found that it doesn't work if I want to try and get out at break even or better. And it just forced me to go you know what in the. From the point of viewers I want people to be able to feed themselves. I know it's a little bit of a. Just sit on the sidelines. Wait, wait, wait. Okay it's not worked. It expires worthless. That's when I take my. The worst part about the way I trade whether it's the. The. The daily swings, the weekly swings, you know the same cliche but what I found was as people weren't understanding the method processes used even with the day trades I generally close the day trades obviously at the end of the day take whatever's there or not as the case may be but it just forces me not to over trade in less than ideal market condition. I find that that works so ideology behind it. So they weren't getting the most out of those things. So I've done that in the past. As is the short answer. What I prefer to do is to show people how I do what I do. And there's links somewhere next to this video. There's I give two free strategies. The two strategies I'm talking about the breakout and the buy the the. The semi MC end up focusing all my energies on if I'm right. You know the hardest decision I have is should I panicle and fully mechanical process. I'll outline those in the. The link if in the description presumably and it's a 20 minute video it takes you through both take the when should I take the profits. You know it's like that's the best because the losses are gonna. They're gonna roll off on expiration. They. I've already accounted for that so the worst part about it is strategies and what I prefer to do is show you how to do what I do. You're holding the losses until expiration. Again a lot of my students tend to a. It's a little bit of a mental gear change to work the head around that but when they get used to it it's such a liberating because I think that's more important that you're self sufficient rather than be spoon fed And I always think back to my own experiences and kind of thinking back to you I'm presumably you've read Reminiscence of a stock Operator. There was a feeling to not worry about well what if I'm wrong? Well it doesn't matter anymore. You're just trying to figure out how can I Manage this trade more effect effectively.

Well, so how do you wind up helping other traders anyway?

About Jesse Livermore in the turn of like the 1900s, 1905 sort of era in the stock markets and one of the things that he described Even you know, 110 years ago, was he full prey to or fell prey to taking a, an alert or a signal off a fellow trader. Pardon?

How did you wind up helping other traders?

Probably like most people, you, you in my case it was kind of pre social media we were on and you then reliant on when to get out, when to manage it, when to exit it at forums back then trade to win. I think one of your past guests, John Foreman was, was on there that that's kind of like how we met. But you just start, you know, all those decisions in between and you're reliant on that person. And I had my own experience of, of that where a friend of mine had convinced me to use my own money on posting stuff and you getting involved in the community on public forums and you post off and on his trade idea but also to, to he would give me say 500 pound and I would. So I was using all my money, all my margin and he, he just wanted you realize that you're one of the anomalies, that you're actually making this work and the other 10,000 people are not. But you just start getting private messages saying hey, can you show me what to do? His share of the trade. And he didn't realize that there was margin required because we were trading stocks. But it basically convinced me to put all my money up on his trade. And you know, it just kind of snowballs from there. Eventually, you know, people just started saying, you know, can you show me, can you put some time aside? Can you train me? I'll pay you. Oh people pay me, will you? You know, and that's what I did. And I was completely dependent on him telling me me when to get in, when to get out. And like at the time I was an experienced trader but like I didn't know what I was doing came from it. And I found that I really enjoyed helping other traders and get a leg up. I had something that was working and because of the way that I try and approach my own trading and try and back then it was a little bit more discretionary than what it is right now. But try and sit in because I didn't understand the logic behind why he was interested in this stock. And that's what I'm estimatize what I'M doing certain things have to happen. It was always kind of to be if this, you know, hopefully I'm trying to articulate, it's probably failing slightly. So I'd rather tell people here's the system, here's the process, here's the list of stocks that this strategy works favorable on, here's all the market conditions that it works in, here's when not to use the system so that you can have full series of things as happens then I'm going to take action. So it was always like a checklist, like, like a pilot has a pre flight confidence that when you're placing the trade that it's the right stock, the right trade, the right strategy, the right market conditions and on average you'll make money. That's more important to me than spoon feeding someone because you're just going to create more checklists. And that was attractive to quite a large number of people who firstly were either brand new or very busy people where they couldn't spend hours and heartache and frustration. If you give someone alerts without understanding all the knowledge behind analyzing stock charts for whatever the divination they were looking for, why that's happening. Sorry, A little bit passionate about that. I've just had positive and negative experiences, mostly negative things with, with alerts. The trade that I mentioned was reliant on making some money. I was quite a bit underwater. And then for one day, for one hour it was profitable. I ended up phoning him and saying so it just progressed from there. And then over the years of again trying to answer my own question. How do I make this more mechanical? How do I take the discretion out my own trading? And then it just firms up the strategies and the process that we use. So what, we're making some money. What shall I do? I'm like sweating, like panicking, you know. And he go, oh yeah, let's take the profit. You know, because he didn't realize that like I'd had two margin calls on this trade and, and he didn't know that. He doesn't know that I've had a margin call. He just sees that, oh yeah, just send me my, my couple hundred dollars over. You know, these days it's, it's a very methodical, very mechanical process. I'm like really? He just wanted, he just wanted his like pocket change is what it turned out to be. But like you know, that's what I want people to avoid. You know that what shall I do in this situation? So again I'd rather show people what to do. Why? To do it for the two primary strategies that I like and again it's attractive to when to. To deploy a strategy so that you know, if I pop off this mortal coil, if I get run over a bus, if I relapse with my Crohn's and pop off tomorrow, then you can carry on without me. Is that to me is more important than again spoon feeding someone without understanding of what's going on.

Oh, that's good. I mean, yeah, I'm the same way. I would prefer to help people be self sufficient so sure.

Well, quite a number of people because it means that, you know, to answer my own question, how can I do this in the least amount of time possible and still get the rewards from. From trading? It means that people can do it around the work. They can check in at lunchtime, they can check in at breakfast. If they've got a bit more time to look at the lower time frame stuff, you can check in again. One of the strategies I have with futures trading is you check in it.

That said, and it's funny because I've actually, I've had some not we've all.

Had one of those, haven't we?

Help. And they were like, you know. But you know, I've been using the signal service and I like it and.

You know what, it works for some people. You know I not it just in my experience the people when I ran the 6, 10 o' clock and you either have a setup or you don't, it's either there or not. It's a binary decision and if yes you place the trade and if no you come back tomorrow. So a lot of people find that quite attractive because that's what I want for me I don't, I just want to know do I have anything to do right now? If yes, place, if no, come back tomorrow. So again everything could be done and if you want to trade everything, if you've got a little bit more time, it's going to take you 30 to 60 minutes and maybe when you're learning it'll take you an hour and a half, two hours. Sorry. Rolling over your conversation, the way that I preferred people to think about it was it was an augmentation to the hours. If you've got the morning and you can get everything you need done done in a very short space of time. And again when you get used to like with anything, when you get used to any process you can convey analysis like take it or don't take it. I was sending out an alert every day or two or three something sometimes. And here's all the reasons why. So I gave the full understanding of what they were doing. So just think about it as like, done for your research. If it agrees with your research, go for it. Condense that down into, you know, 20, 30 minutes, you know, should you choose to. Again, like learning how to drive when you remember when you learned how to drive, it took you a long time to figure out and to not look down when you were changing gears or change doing the, the indicators and pressing all the foot pedals. You know, eventually when you get a little bit of practice at some basic maneuvers, it doesn't. There'll be another one tomorrow. So more of a research than a blind alert service. Sorry, what, what were you saying about your signal service?

No, I just. I know and I agree with you. I mean, that is one, one approach with it. The main thing I tell people is, you know, if you're gonna, if you're.

Gonna use somebody else's, I think becomes very, very easy. And that's how I compare what I do. I mean, I, I often refer to what I do as a production line process because like, you're in a factory, the decisions that you make are going along the production line. And if you get a no on any of those decisions, analysis and their.

Advice, you know, do your best to understand what their, what their strategy is so they kind of understand the thought process behind it. But then always, as with everything, test it out, make sure that, yeah, it actually does perform over time and, and, and, and then you can relax and be okay with it. But, you know, establish that, that proof.

That yes, you, you flick the trade off into the reject bin. Eventually what we want to do is you want to get, you know, five decisions, five main decisions so that we get the completed product and we, we click confirm and send on the trade. You know, that's what I want to do. I, I want that for myself first and foremost. But as you said, that is quite attractive to, you know, other people who are interested in.

It does actually work and they, they do know what they're doing.

That's why I like this. And what I can do is I just realized, John, I can show the, the out the engine behind it if you want. Just, it's just so. I appreciate. I've just realized we're recording this off. Always forget that we have visuals on the, some of these podcasts. If you want, I can just give you the quick visual of the mechanical strat. It'll take me about two minutes to go through. If he Wants just maybe a nice place to finish.

Well actually we're out of time.

Let's start.

Just realize that most people are going to be listening to this, okay. Like the great majority of people are, you know, like listening to it on their way to work.

How about this? For anyone that's listening, I can send a two minute video. Just send me an email and I'll send you, you know, just finding opportunities on a regular consistent basis.

Well, so as far as with, with the anti vest, I mean are you, so are you, are you basically teaching people the strategies and the methods or do you have like a signal service.

Or, or a little video? Send me the stock that you want me to analyze and I'll show you the process and the strategy performance reports that come with it. Because at the click of a button I can just say hey, is I've had a signal service in the past and I found that it doesn't work in this type of style of trading. Is it good or worthwhile on this particular stock And I can go back for the last 20 or so years and say here's what it would have looked like. Like so that from the, from the point of view is I want people to be able to feed themselves. I know it's a little bit of a cliche but what I found was as people weren't understanding the method for me, as long as I'm seeing a nice steady equity curve, then I've got an expectation that that should continue for the next six or eight months as an absolute minute. It's been working fine for the last 20, the next trilogy behind it. So they weren't getting the most out of those things. So I've done that in the past is the short answer. 12 months should be fine as well. And then I'll reevaluate, evaluate that stock as whether it should be in my portfolio for the following 12 months. So if anyone wants that, send me a message. You can get to me through the website and I'll happily look at any stocks that you want me to.

Well and again your, Your website is antivenor.com correct? And yeah. And you said you also have a couple of free strategies. It's got the short intro to your two favorites that you like to use.

Absolutely. So there'll be the two strategies that we focused on today. There'll be a full outline again, nothing held back, no catches, no gimmicks. Just need your email and I'll send you the link for it. But the breakout strategy fully outlines where the entries, the exits, the Stops the targets. It's focused on futures but it will work on other instruments as well. And then there's the mechanical strategy that I mentioned as well the buy the dips and obviously works with the seller rally the opposite side, the bullish and bearish. And that's the 100% mechanical rule sets that was just described and that gives me the algorithm and all the strategy performance report. So there's full disclosure on all the rule sets that I'm using there.

Very cool. Now your coaching that you offer.

What I prefer to do is to show people how I do what I do and there's links somewhere next to this video. There's I give two free strategies. The two strategies I'm talking about the breakout and the buy. The. The. The semi mechanical and fully mechanical process. I'll outline those in the. The link if in the description presumably and it's a 20 minute video. It takes you through both strategies and what I prefer to do is show you how to do what I do.

You've got the. You call it production line trading. Right.

That's the. The process I generally refer to what I do as production line trading. Yeah. So everything that I'm doing because I think that's more important that you're self sufficient rather than be slated in that.

How long does it take to get through that your training?

There are 56 three to five minute videos spoon fed and I always think back to my own experiences and kind of thinking back to. You read and presumably you've read Reminiscence of a stock Operator. There was about Jesse Liveymore in the turn of like the 1900s, 1905 sort of the strategy. Some of its mindset, some of it's how to manage portfolio, some of its other bits but the actual strategy side of it is very short. You can probably get through all of the train era in the stock markets. And one of the things that he described Even you know 110 years ago was he full prey to or fell prey to taking a. An alert or a signal off a fellow trader and you're then reliant on when to get out, when to manage it, when to exit it. You know, all those decisions in between and you're reliant on that person. And I had my own experience of that where a friend of mine had convinced me to use my own money on his trade idea but also to. To. He would give me say 500 pound and I would. So I was using all my money, all my margin and he, he just wanted his share of the Trade and he didn't realize that there was margin required because we were Dr. In an afternoon, you know, if you wanted to go through and put it on, you know, one and a half times speed or whatever you want to do. I don't know how fast you listen to it. You probably get through everything in a week if you're just doing it an hour a day. So that's the, the, the DIY version. The actual training side of it, it's very quick to get through. I've tried to do it all in bite sized formats because I don't want to spend two hours while I am a talk. As you probably gathered, I've tried to be very condensed in the training that I do. So you can just get, here's the info and if you ever need to go back to an element you can go. I'm having problem with this. All the titles are very descriptive. I can just dip in, get the three to five minute reminder refresher and then you know, dip out to the, the next thing that you want to need. I also provide, you know, ongoing support for as long as you want and you can send me a message anytime to get help support if there's a stock that you're looking at that you want help interpreting because maybe it's not as clear as what you think or a setup that you looking at. Again, most people, most of my students send me, hey, I'm looking at this, what do you think? And I'll either give a thumbs up or some, you know, feedback and critique on you know, what they're trading. So I try and take my role as a mentor very, very seriously just because people are putting their trust and faith in me to help them get results. But it basically convinced me to put all my money up on his trade idea and I was completely dependent on him telling me, me when to get in, when to get out. And like at the time I was an experienced trader but like I didn't know what I was doing because I didn't understand the logic behind why he was interested in this stock. And that's what I'm hopefully I'm trying to articulate. It's probably failing slightly. So I'd rather tell people here's the system, here's. So I want to be there for them and not be a, you know, absentee mentee mentor rather. So I just want to make sure that people get results. And that's one of the things that I am very proud of. If you look at the website and the, the any of the the recordings that I have, I gender the process. Here's the list of stocks that this strategy works favorable on. Here's all the market conditions that it works in. Here's when not to use the system so that you can have full confidence that when you're placing a trade that it's the right stock, the right trade. Normally post up. You know, what my students have done the previous week just because, because of the reasons that I mentioned. Because right strategy, the right market conditions and on average you'll make money. That's more important to me than spoon feeding someone because you're just going to create more positive, repeatable process and mostly rule based. You know, my students generally get results quite fast. So I am very, very proud of that fact because there's no discretion. I think that just going back to one of your early questions, you know, why do traders go wrong? It's, it's not necessarily that they go wrong, it's just that it's finding the right strategy in the process. Heartache and frustration, friction. If you give someone alerts without understanding all the knowledge behind why that's happening. Sorry, A little bit passionate about that. I've just had positive and negative experiences, mostly negative things with, with alerts, the trade that I've done. And early on in your trading career, you don't want discretionary decisions. You want to know with clarity what you're doing and when you're doing it. And I think it's a great starting block to have a very rigid set of rules that you can check, check, check, place the trade, trade, and then you can apply discretion later on should you want to. But I think most traders make the mistake of starting with discretion but they don't have the experience to make those discretionary decisions because the clues in the name, it's discretion.

Yeah, very true, very true.

It's a great place to start. And again if you, for me personally, I'm trying to, I've done it backwards. I've started off discretionary, come up to rule based training. I just want to remove the emotion. The should I or should I have not taken that trade? It's just, it's either there or it's not place to trade.

Gotcha. Yeah, very good.

Selfishly, I want it for me first I mentioned reliance on making some money. I was quite a bit underwater. And then for one day, for one hour, it was profitable. I ended up filming him and saying.

Oh, that's very cool. And you shared quite a lot. This is, it's been, it's been a good really, really good. And again, you know, for everybody, you know, if you want to catch up with Phil, you like what he's got to say and, you know, it resonates with you. Antevestor.com and go ahead and check out his site and what he's got there. And yeah, as far as, you know, advice for our listeners, any, any watch.

We'Re making some money. What shall I do? I'm like sweating, like panicking, you know. And he go, oh yeah, let's take the profit, you know, know, because he didn't realize that like I had two margin, you know.

Last words of wisdom before we wrap things up here.

Enjoy life calls on this trade. And. And he didn't know that. He doesn't know that I've had a margin call. He just sees that, oh yeah, just send me my, my couple hundred dollars over. And I'm like, really? He just wanted. He just wanted his like pocket change is what it turned out to be. But like, you know, that's what I want people to avoid. You know, know that what shall I do in this situation? So again, I'd rather show people what I do. Why to do it. Life is worth enjoying. You should not spend all your waking hours, certainly not flicking through chart after chart like a mindless zombie. Give yourself restrictions. The one thing that I've learned I had a priest stand over me. Give me the last rights. You know, I was very. When to deploy a strategy so that, you know, if I pop off this mortal ill when I was eventually diagnosed, the one thing it did and I think everyone who's had the coil, if I get run over a bus, if I relapse with my Crohn's and pop off tomorrow, then recent experiences that we've had, we'll just leave that hang in there is Evans had that realization. Find something to do outside of work, outside training. You can carry on without me. Is that to me is more important than again, spoon should involve family. It should involve fun. And put it on the calendar like two or three times a week I go and do something fun. Me and the wife, we like hiking, we like going to zoos and gotta love like seeing animals having experiences. Do something with your family, you know, that's probably the most important thing that you can do. Because if you're stressed feeding someone without understanding of what's going on.

Oh, that's good.

I mean then that will come out in your trading, you know, so find time to relax.

Yeah, I'm the same way. I would prefer to help people be self Sufficient so sure.

And enjoy yourself. I spent last week at a log cabin in the woods. I feel so relaxed. I didn't realize I was quite stressed and wound up but I feel so relaxed right now and that's coming out in the decisions that are making not just with trading but with life in general as well. So yeah find times that said and.

It'S funny because I've actually I've had.

Some and we've all had one of those have fun is all I'm trying to get to. I like to laugh at silly things as well hence.

And they were like you know. But you know I've been using the.

Obsession with flamingos.

That is sound advice. So kind of like in. In the book the one thing those one thing I appreciated with that they said when you're getting out your calendar to plan the year the first thing you put on it is your vacation time days off. Yeah Signal service and I like it.

And you know what it works for some people. You know I'm not it just in my experience the people when I've ran the so it's quite uncanny when you give yourself restrictions from certainly the work point of view you get more done and the more free time I allocate for myself then the better I am at the other things that I've got to do when I'm dedicated to working. Sorry rolling over your conversation there the way that I preferred people that may be for you but less. Less is more is again another cliche. But you know the thing about it was it was an augmentation to the their analysis like take it or don't take it. I was sending out an alert every day or two or three sometimes would have thought grandma was right to do everything in moderation.

Advice. Well Phil, again thanks for. Thanks for taking your time today and.

Thank you for having me.

Yeah sure.

And here's all the reasons why so I gave the full understanding of what they were doing. So just think about it as like done for your research. If it agrees with your research, go for it. Thank you.

Appreciate it. And if everybody listening, you know again if you want to if you like what you heard, swing by site and dot com and you know if. If you get any questions doesn't there'll.

Be another one tomorrow. So more of a research than a blind alert service. Sorry, what. What were you saying about your signal service questions?

You know by all means reach out to Phil or me and other than that we'll see everybody on the next episode of the Consistent Profits podcast. Cheers. Thank you for judges. And I agree with you. I mean that is one, one approach with it. The main thing I tell people is, you know, if you're gonna, if you're gonna use somebody else's. Joining us today on the Consistent Profits podcast brought to you by Inside Out Trading. Make sure to swing by Inside Out Trading and pick up your copy of the proven formula for consistent monthly profits analysis. And their advice, you know, do your best to understand what their, what their strategy. If you enjoyed the show, make sure to subscribe on your favorite channel and we'll see you on the next episode. Sure is. So they kind of understand the thought process behind it. But then always as, as with everything, test it out, make sure that yeah, it actually does perform over time and, and, and then you can relax and be okay with it. But you know, establish that, that proof that yes, it does actually work and they, they do know what they're doing.

That's why I like this. And what I can do is I just realized John, I can show the, the, the engine behind it if you want. Just, it's just so I appreciate, I've just realized what we're recording vlogmas. I always forget that we have visuals on the, some of these podcasts. If you want I can just give you the quick visual of the mechanical strat. It'll take me about two minutes to go through. If he wants just maybe a nice place to finish.

Well, actually most people are going to be listening to this.

Okay.

Like the great majority of people are, you know, like listening to it on their way to work.

How about this? For anyone that's listening, I can send a two minute video. Just send me an email and I'll send you a little video. Send me the stock that you want me to analyze and I'll show you the process and the strategy performance reports that come with it. Because at the click of a button I can just say, hey, is this type of style of trading, is it good or worthwhile on this particular stock? And I can go back for the last 20 or so years and say here's what it would have looked like. So that for me, as long as I'm seeing a nice steady equity curve, then I've got an expectation that that should continue for the next six or eight months as an absolute minute. It's been working fine for the last 20, the next 12 months should be fine as well. And then I'll re. Evaluate, evaluate that stock as whether it should be in my portfolio for the following 12 months. So if anyone wants that, send me A message you can get to me through the websites and I'll happily look at any stocks that you want me to.

Yeah, well. And again, your website is antivestor.com correct? And yeah. And you said you also have a couple of free strategies. It's got the short intro to your two favorites that you like to use.

Absolutely. So there'll be the two strategies that we focused on today. There'll be a full outline again, nothing held back, no catches, no gimmicks. Just need your email and I'll send you the link for it. But the breakout strategy fully outlines where the entries, the exits, the stops, the targets. It's focused on futures, but it will work on other instruments as well. And then there's the mechanical strategy that I mentioned as well. The buy the dips and obviously works with the seller rally. The opposite side, the bullish and bearish on that side. That's the, the 100 mechanical rule sets that was just described and that gives me the algorithm and all the strategy performance report. So there's full disclosure on all the rule sets that I'm using there.

Yeah, very cool. Now your, your coaching that you, that you offer though, you've got the, you call it production line trading, right.

That's the process. I generally refer to what I do as production line trading. Yeah. So everything that I'm doing in is all encapsulated in that.

But how long does it take to get through that? Your training?

There are 56 three to five minute videos. The strategy, some of its mindset, some of it's how to manage portfolio, some of its other bits. But the actual strategy side of it is very short. You can probably get through all of the training in, in an afternoon. You know, if you wanted to go through, through and put it on, you know, one and a half times speed or whatever you want to do. I don't know how fast you listen to it. You probably get through everything in a week if you're just doing it an hour a day. So that's the, the, the DIY version. The actual training side of it, it's very quick to get through. I've tried to do it all in bite sized formats because I don't want to spend two hours while I am a talk. As you probably gathered, I've tried to be very condensed in the training that I do. So you can just get, here's the info and if you ever need to go back to an element, you can go. I'm having problems with, with this. All the titles are very descriptive. I can just dip in, get the three to five minute reminder refresher and then, you know, dip out to the, the next thing that you want to need. I also provide, you know, ongoing support for as long as you want and you can send me a message anytime to get help support. And if there's a stock that you're looking at that you want help interpreting because maybe it's not as clear as what you think or a setup that you're looking at. Again, most people, most of my students send me, me, hey, I'm looking at this, what do you think? And I'll either give a thumbs up or some, you know, feedback and critique on, you know, what they're trading. So I try and take my role as a mentor very, very seriously. Just because people are putting their trust and faith in me to help them get results. So I want to be there for them and not be a, you know, absentee mentee mentor rather. So I just want to make sure that people get results. And that's one of the things that I am very proud of. If you look at the website and the, any of the recordings that I have, I generally post up, you know, what the students have done the previous week just because of the reasons that I mentioned, because it's a repeatable process and mostly rule based, my students generally get results quite fast. So I am very, very proud of that fact because there's no discretion. I think just going back to one of your early questions. Why do traders go wrong? It's not necessarily that they go wrong, wrong, it's just that it's finding the right strategy in the process for them. And early on in your trading career, you don't want discretionary decisions. You want to know with clarity what you're doing and when you're doing it. And I think it's a great starting block to have a very rigid set of rules that you can check, check, check, place the trade and then you can apply discretion later on should you want to. But I think most traders make the mistake of starting with discretion, discretion. But they don't have the experience to make those discretionary decisions because the clues in the name, it's discretion.

Very true, very true.

It's a great place to start. And again, if you, for me personally, I'm trying to, I've done it backwards. I've started off discretionary, come up to rule based training. I just want to remove the emotion the should I or should I have not taken that trade? It's just, it's either there or it's not place to trade.

Gotcha. Yeah, very good.

Selfishly, I want it for me first.

Well, that's very cool. And you shared quite a lot. This is, it's been, it's been really good. And again, you know, for everybody, you know, if you want to catch up with Phil, you like what he's got to say and, you know, resonates with you, antevestor.com and go ahead and check out his site and what he's got there. And yeah, as far as, you know, advice for our listeners, any, any, you know, last words of wisdom before we wrap things up here.

Enjoy life. Life is worth enjoying. You should not spend all your waking hours, certainly not flicking through chart after chart like a mindless zombie and give yourself restrictions. The one thing that I've learned, I had a priest stand over me giving me the last rights. I.