“Best Of” Series - How to Simplify Complex Training Concepts

You're listening to the PT Profit podcast, episode number 26. Today is a special best of episode where we are replaying the episode with Katie St. Clair of Katie St. Clair Fitness. So if you haven't listened to this episode, you are going to want to stay till the end and if you have, you are definitely going to hear things in a new way. So be sure to stay till the end. Are you ready? Let's get started.

Hi, I'm Beverly Simpson, former fitness manager turned online personal training business owner. And this podcast is where smart fitness professionals, including trainers and clinicians, discover how to increase client performance and movement, package and position their products and services and get out of their own way so that they can increase their revenue to live a life that they love without sleazy sales. Welcome to the PT Profit Podcast. Welcome back to the PT Profit Podcast.

I'm your host, Beverly Simpson and today we're doing one of the first time ever we are running a best of the podcast where we will be running replays of some of our most popular, very important episodes. And it's hard for me to choose.

Because honestly, they're all so good and.

I honestly love them so much.

But today we're starting with a replay.

Of Katie Sinclair of Katie Sinclair Fitness Podcast where she talked all about how to simplify complex training systems. And the reason why we're replaying this one is because she's got an upcoming webinar that's scheduled for September 8th where she's talking all about the performance variability for general population, how you as a coach can actually implement positional breathing coordination and motor control to optimize performance for the general population. And all of the big misconceptions in the industry that athletic and dynamic movements are only applicable to sport performance. How that's actually not true. So we'll definitely link that training inside of the show notes. But for now, let's go ahead and run the replay of how to simplify complex training systems with Katie Sinclair.

Hi Katie, thanks so much for joining us today. How are you?

I'm great. Thank you so much for having me. I'm super excited to talk to you.

I'm excited. It's our pleasure and privilege to have you on the show. So let's just dive right into it. Can you just share with my listeners? I was about to say viewers, go ahead. You can edit that if you can. Just please share with my listeners a little bit about who you are and how you got to doing this incredible thing that we're going to get into today.

So I Don't know how incredible it is, but I enjoy it and I find it fascinating. And that's my nerd brain and my athletic brain that just love movement. But I am a former athlete. I am a mom. I have one boy who is five years old, and I live in Charleston, South Carolina, and I am a business owner. I've had my own training business for my own own business for 12 years and then have worked in the industry for over 20 and have had many different roles in the industry. And now I have a business that I'm developing online that's helping me, I guess, vary what I do in life and sort of branch out. For me as a human, I think for a long time I was just training day in and day out and seeing the same clients who I absolutely love. But I wasn't growing as a professional and I wasn't growing as a human being. And I think that I made the decision about two years ago that I'd really like to pass on and teach and move into a different role. And so now I'm doing a lot more online. But I also just still love my clients and will never give up training one on one. So that's kind of me in a very small nutshell.

You're a former athlete. I'm interested. What was your sport?

So I was a gymnast for most of my life till I was about 16. And that was a huge part of my life. I started probably at age 5 and was in the gym by the time I was like nine or ten, I was in the gym for three and a half hours every single day except for Sunday. And then, I know it's kind of weird, right? You're saying, oh my gosh. And I'm like, I know it's strange, but that was just normal for me. And I did dance. I was required to do dance, ballet, tap and jazz is like a side thing for make me better as a gymnast. Tai chi. My coach was super progressive and we went to camps, went to Bella Crowley's camp, went to camp in Pennsylvania. There's a famous gymnastics camp up there. So basically my whole life was gymnastics. And then I got into high school and I had unfortunate situation. My coach left, passed away. It was not good and it was kind of sad. But I will say there was a lot of positives that ended up out of a bad situation, which was that I no longer had gymnastics. And I had to figure out, what am I gonna do? I always loved movement, period. Like, I just was that kid that wanted to do all kinds of crazy Stuff and I grew up in the water, so I was wakeboarding and doing all kinds of fun stuff. Skiing behind the boat, like during the summers, that's what I would do all day long. And so in high school I went to a very big school, had like maybe 3,000 students, and it was a 5A school. And I had all these opportunities. It was like, I can try out for all these different team sp. And so I am so glad that happened because team sports teach you an entirely different aspect of who you are as a human. And that was really helpful for me. So I played four of varsity sports in high school and so that's basically my movement background in terms of athletics. And then when I went to college, I was a student athletic trainer at Florida State and kind of went more into the training side of things, but didn't play any sports. Probably would have been good for me to play a sport now, looking back and going to like a small school where I could have walked on or something, but I didn't even try for that. But I was. I'm just glad for the background that I have.

That's awesome. So that kind of leads into my next question, which was, you know, what led you to go from, you know, an athletic performance pursuit into more of a training background and coaching?

So I think a lot of things let it. So when I went to school, I tested to see like, oh, what program is going to be good for me? What's your fit? And I don't know, apparently you could just take a multiple choice test and people could tell you what you're good at. So I listened to them, which is crazy. Looking back, they didn't know anything about me. I literally filled in dots and then they were like, this is what you should major in. So I majored in economics because I think what happened and I look back and I think it's because I have like a very scientific, sort of like strategic, you know, very like math oriented brain. Like, I need processes. I need to like write everything down and have a system. And so I was really good at math and I went into economics and by my sophomore year, I freaking hated it. I was so bored I would want to fall asleep in class. It just was not for me. And so I started thinking outside the box and I was like, what else can I do? And you know, Florida State's obviously a very big athletic school. There's so much going on there. So I looked into their health and nutritional science program, I looked into their athletic training program. Kind of just like looked in that whole realm. And I applied for the athletics. So basically, like, if you're gonna go into the athletic training program, you have to apply. So I applied that. I think it was that spring before, and then was accepted starting the fall, the next fall semester with the football team as a student athletic trainer. And so I did that. I kept on the path and I did all of my prere. Prereqs, like, but I just don't think it was the right fit for me. It didn't really solidify how I felt about movement. I also didn't feel like I was learning that much. I felt like I was doing a lot of taping ankles and, you know, sucking air out of ice bags, setting up water coolers. And it just wasn't really for me. And I probably would have done better maybe, if I was with one of the smaller team sports. And so anyway, I ended up changing, and I got a degree in nutrition exercise science and continued on to get my cscs and go more into just the coaching part of it.

So what would you say? You know, what would you say? So it was clear that you wanted to go from, you know, athletic, you know, water cooler stuff because you were. Had this drive, this passion to do something else, to, like, you know, change people's lives. And so what specifically do you feel like you were called to do?

Oh, that's a good question. I don't think I really had a direction. Like, what was I called to do at that time in my life, in my 20s, when I was all over the place and crazy and just living life for the moment. But I feel like I was very good at listening to people. I was good at sensing what they felt and reacting to it in the way that they needed. And that probably has a lot to do with my childhood, but I was able to empathize all of the time and, like, kind of allow myself to feel what they felt and then create what they needed based on how that happened. And so I think that was something, though, like, innate from a young age. And so then within the athletic world that I love, in the movement world, I probably, without even knowing, took that on with all of my clients and in all of my jobs, you know, prior to having my own business, I was still just. That was like an innate part of me that I made part of whatever job I took on.

Yeah, I think that, you know, we talk about this to my clients, you know, who are personal trainers, is that you have to have this. And physical therapists, that you have to have this service heart. You want to know you want. You're operating and coming from a place of, you know, how can I help someone? And you had a really key thing when you said that I'm listening to them and then providing solutions. That's essentially what business is. You just uncover the problem and then provide the solution for sure.

But you also have, I think in order to do that, you have to be willing to really listen to what they're saying. Because sometimes the way they say it doesn't give you the feedback you need if you don't read between the lines. So someone could say to me, I want to lose weight. Okay, great. Why do you want to lose weight? Because I want to look better in my bathing suit. Why do you want to look better in your bathing suit? Because I just want to look better because I feel better about myself. Why would that make you feel better like that? I think diving in and I don't deal a lot with weight loss, so that was probably a terrible example. But if you provide people with a resource that's based on their needs, you're going to do great things for them. But if you don't understand what their true needs are, really, because you can't be the person that they feel comfortable telling those needs to. So you have to come at it from a place of very empathetic, loving sort of way so that they feel like they can talk to you about their real needs. And then when they can tell you that, then you can help them make the change that they really want. Otherwise, you're just making changes that are their first, I guess, their first judgment or their first. The first thing they said, I want to lose weight. Okay, well, here's how we're going to lose weight. Well, that doesn't really address what they really want, so. Right.

So what you're really saying is that there is a difference between listening to what they say versus listening to what they mean. In order to get that, you have to ask those deeper questions. And once you ask those why questions or what's causing questions, that's going to elicit the value. And then when you can put the value up against the goal, you'll be able to increase adherence. Because at the end of the day, all this really, you're going to get your clients results when you get them to adhere to the program.

Right. And adhering to the program sometimes means reframing the goal. So you can't adhere to a program with a goal that doesn't keep you motivated to adhere to it. If the goal is fleeting and you don't understand that there's more behind the goal than just the outlying idea of what you would like, then how likely are you to stick with the process that has to happen? If you understand that every day is achieving a goal that's benefiting something outside of the box, then you'll probably keep going. But if you, if your goal is simply weight loss is easy, so I'll just say that. But if it's, if it's weight loss and you lose weight, great, you achieved your goal, are you going to keep working out? Probably not. But if your goal is, I want to move better, I want to feel better, I want to live a healthy lifestyle, I want to make sure that I can survive disease and go with my family. We those things never end. So you're always going to be chasing that goal or life goal rather than just chasing 10 pounds that you want to lose on the scale. And the same thing is applies with athletics. Like if I sat there and was like, I just really want to be able to do a double full, which is just like a trick in gymnastics. So I get to do the trick and then like, okay, great. No, I have to think. I also want to move up a level. I want to be a better gymnast. I want to move forward, I want to learn more. So I could potentially go, you know, to the Olympics or I could go to college, like, whatever else. There has to be, like, some other reason you're doing this. It can't just be because I want to.

I always tell people that you have to love the process more than the outcome, because the outcome are those, like, peaks, fleeting moments. They last for 10 minutes, maybe a day, because you're going to spend the majority of your time in the process.

Yep.

So good. So I love your background. Can you share a little bit more with us about who you serve and what you do now?

So now my clients probably range anywhere from mid-30s to late-70s, so more of a general population clientele. I do have some athletes, usually on the younger side or older athletes, who are now playing like tennis or racquetball or golf and want to keep moving really well so they feel good. My model encompasses breathing and position so that I can help people regain or continue to have the movement they need to do the activities they love without pain and without interruption within their training cycle. So I don't want someone to backslide because they have an issue coming up. So I'm using preventative measures that involve the body becoming more symmetrical or less compensation overall so that they can continue to move really well. And that could be anything from exercise selection to very specific strategies that alter their mechanics so that they can do regular exercises the way that they need to.

Awesome. And so that's your primarily, that's your clients that your one on one remote clients. That's who you serve. But you also do a lot of education for other trainers and other coaches and other clinicians.

Right, right. So that is definitely something new in the past couple years. But I love it. It's like exactly what I wish I was doing. When I started out to do it. I knew I had this idea in my head of a seminar I wanted to create, which I created for in person. So I was. My goal in the beginning was like, oh, I have this great seminar idea. Something I really want to do is I want to teach trainers how to utilize these concepts. So any trainer anywhere, you could have a year of experience or 15, 20 years of experience, it doesn't matter. But these concepts will help you become a better coach and provide results for your clients that you haven't really seen before. Something kind of outside of the box. So I created this seminar based on a lot of these concepts. And I said, I'm going to do this in Charleston, South Carolina. And then I realized, wow, like, why don't I just have to do this in Charleston? Why can't. I was doing a little bit of online training. I was dabbling in. I had one on one clients and I was programming for them on Train Heroic. And then I thought, you know what, I should just open this up to everybody and put it online and do sort of like a mentorship where it's weekly thing. And at the same time I was doing a lot of one on one client programming. And I was finding that I was bogged down with having to program for like 10 people at a time. And I'm super specific in my programming. So I am not a great programmer when it comes to making money because it takes me forever and like I make a million videos and it's crazy. So I was like, how can I put forth the program that I would do for myself that I find just enjoyable in the gym to help someone become more athletic while maintaining strength and building strength, which I think is a hard thing to do, is kind of combine both the athleticism and the strength. And that's how I've always worked out because I just enjoy moving my body. So I decided that I wanted to create a group program. Had no intention of doing the seminar within that, but I was like, here's a 12 week group program. I wonder if I can just like, you know, get a bunch of people on board to try this. And then I was like, wouldn't it be cool if instead of having to do a weekend course, people would just learn this information in a small tidbit week to week? Because I learn much better like that if I can just process through like an hour. And I think being a mom, it's really hard to find the time. So, like, just processing through like one hour each week and having it match up the ideals within the program. And so then it got really crazy because I was like, okay, so now I'm doing a 12 week program, a 12 week seminar. I'm combining them all. And I just kept going with it. And that's what happened. And I ended up with Empowered Performance, which is that mentorship programming for 12 weeks that helps you understand all these concepts.

So can you talk a little bit more about what these concepts are and how you came to know them and learn them?

Yeah. So it started almost four years ago with Postural Restoration Institute, and I took one of their courses. And that was after the birth of my son. I had a lot of chronic neck and back pain from gymnastics. That just was pretty debilitating, to be honest. I had to call into work, like at least four times a year because I was in so much pain and I couldn't get out of bed and my body was just super beat up. And I knew that I needed to train differently, but I didn't know what differently meant, you know, Like, I understood a lot of different systems and I understood training, but I really just like, didn't know how to fix myself. And so I went to their course and I was like, wow, this is great. Crazy. I never thought of it like this. And I remember driving home from Orlando and I was hip shifting in the car, like, trying to organize my body into the symmetrical pattern that they had suggested. Just like, literally while I was driving. And I was like, oh my God, what a relief for my low back. I had no idea. Like, this feels so good. And I didn't understand anything at that point. I was just practicing their exercises and trying to figure out any way I possibly could to make these things work. So I just kind of kept taking their courses. And then I realized that after a while that I needed to make things more applicable to the gym floor because I couldn't have people lying down and doing PT exercises. And I was already kind of experimenting with that in my own body. So I take an exercise and just kind of like shift or do some kind of weird rotation. And I was like, oh, that feels so much better on me. And so I started just playing around with it. And that's how I came to develop my course, which is basically taking a lot of concepts from different courses that I've now taken over the past four years and putting them into a seminar that respects position and helps people to understand what is happening with their own body and be able to assess and reassess that for themselves. They don't need me. I want people to go out, take this information, do what I did, use it, create their own things, their own systems, their own workouts that work for them. Because we as humans can only really understand movement from our own body. We can see it, we can try it, but our own position is going to dictate how much we can actually feel and sense. And so I teach people how to do that. And then I say, okay, now go take this and make it whatever you want. Do whatever you want with it, except experiment. See how you can get other people to get better if you're a coach, or how you can continue on your own path as a regular person. But so now essentially the course, I'm on the second iteration of it and it's developed quite a bit since I'm developing constantly week to week. But the goal is really to help people understand some of these higher levels. Position, breathing, programming, strength based exercises like how we put all that together so it makes sense for someone within their own life. Not just like at the moment for the hour that you work with them, but actually how do we transition that over time so they become more mobile, have less pain, can do more, regain strength and feel athletic in their bodies over that 12 week process. So they leave and go, wow, I never knew I could feel like this again.

So good. So three things came up for me and we'll start one at a time. But the first is, you know, one of the big takeaways that I heard from you is you were talking about how it's important to take these concepts and first put it in your own body. But for me, I feel like this is where coaching is a key component. Because there are things that we might feel that we, or things that we think we feel but we can't see. Which is why I always encourage people to get a coach, because a coach is going to see that outside perspective that maybe you are missing. Does that up in your program. Like, do coaches feel like, oh, I am doing it? And then you are looking at it differently and saying, well, have you considered. Considered this?

Yes. So definitely, like, as they're going through, I mean, I probably answer, like, at this point, 40 messages a day where I'm just, like, watching people move. But part of that is the test retest too. And there's a learning process. So we might take something very basic where it's just like stepping off a step in a certain way that aligns their body in a certain way and doing that on the other side. And they go, wow, it feels so weird on this side. And I said, okay, so what are your test results? Those test results mean this. And if you can regain some of that movement on the other side, then your test results are going to improve. So we have to also, like, back it up with the test retest, or we're not really taking into account what's happening. But I think also, like, just for general population and everyone, it's really important to video yourself sometimes and actually see what you're doing. I didn't know until I got online how many things I was doing completely wrong. All these things were happening in my body I wasn't even aware of. And the videos that I was posting on Instagram, I look at it and go, oh, I didn't do that. Right. I wonder why not? And I try it out on myself. So I think we can coach ourselves also by taking video, but also by having an actual test to see where your movement limitations are, trying an exercise and then retesting.

I mean, movement and marketing are so similar in that way, which is why I think it was just such an easy transition for me, because it's all about guessing, testing, and then assessing.

Yes.

You only know what you know you don't, you know. So it's so good. So the second thing that came up that I wanted to talk about a little bit was you. One of the things that I really admire, which I think is clear so far in this, just in this podcast for anyone that's new to you, is that your just relentlessness in getting as much information as possible. And you had mentioned and just learning, and it's clear to do that so that you can get your clients results. And you had mentioned that you took your first course when your son was born. So after he was born, and as a mom of two young girls, I know how challenging it can be to put yourself first. So I'd love for you to talk a little bit about, you know, your experience and what brought you to say to yourself, no, I need to put myself first for my clients. And I'm doing this so that it's going to benefit my family. What led you to do that and how'd that happen?

Yeah, so I put my career on the back burner for a really long time. My husband, you know, and we made that decision together. He went. And I wouldn't say I put my career on hold. I put my education on hold. I had a business, and I was seeing clients day in and day out, but I had no other time than that. My husband went to PT school for physical therapy and got his doctorate and then continued on in an education capacity. We ran into a huge roadblock with our pregnancy and struggled for three years to get pregnant. And it was just a very emotional, very expensive time in our lives. And so we gave up a lot of ourselves. Like, I couldn't even have imagined spending $600 on a course. Like, there was no possible way I needed $600 for progesterone. Like, that was all I was thinking. So I literally just gave up everything I cared about in the pursuit of having a child because it was such a big deal to me. And that was the whole reason I got married and, like, wanted a family. And so it. When it. We felt like it couldn't happen, we kind of went crazy and just decided we got to do whatever we got to do. And so within those, like, three or four years, I completely gave up any education. And I didn't even read articles. I didn't read a book. I didn't care. Like, I was just. I was, like, just going into the gym day by day, training my clients, but not getting better as a professional. When you stop getting better in your career as a professional and educating yourself, you lose passion for it, and it's not that interesting. And so we got over that hurdle. We were so lucky. We had our son, Quincy. He did have terrible colic. So the first year was, like, kind of a nightmare. I'm sure all moms out there can understand this, but it was like, what just happened? I thought he was supposed to sleep once in a while.

My second daughter, she was colic, too. And it was just a terrible time.

Yeah. And so there's literally no time. Like, all you're trying to do is comfort a child 24 7. And not to mention, I wasn't working as much. I was only working, like, 15 or 20 hours a week because I was trying to piece back my business. And anyway, so I think it was, like, a year after he was born, maybe a year and a half. And I was like, I don't even know if I want to stay in training. Like, I am that dispassionate about what I'm doing because I feel like I've been lost. And that's when I realized. And my body hurt and I had a four finger diastasis. And there were just so many things. And I was like, I don't even know what to do with myself. I don't even know what I told myself. I'm over this. I can't even move. My back hurts, my neck hurts. I want to lay in bed. My child screams. I don't know what to do with myself.

And terrible. But we're totally laughing because, you know, we're through it now. But I'm laughing because I can relate. I know those feelings so bad.

Yeah, it's like you're just exhausted. Like, the thought of. I just give up. I just want to go work at Starbucks, make a latte and have health insurance. Like, you know, it's just like the simple things. And then not have to think, just go into work. I don't care if I'm not gonna care about this. It's taking me so much work. I just do a job that's easy. I clock in and clock out. And so I was like, this is not good. I need to figure it out. And I think I just had, like, a heart to heart with Jason. He's always been super supportive and reached out online to a bunch of people and just kind of said, what? What courses? Like, what are you guys taking? And Sarah Duvall, she recommended pri. And I was like, all right. And I had taken her course in person, like 10 years ago. And so I thought I did find that really fascinating, the stuff she was talking about, the diaphragm and the movement. So that's how I ended up. And I, you know, put my big girl pants on. I didn't want to go by myself, but I drove down to Orlando, got a hotel by myself. I was super intimidated. I felt like I wasn't smart enough to learn it. I felt like I didn't know how to jump in the game again. And I showed up that first morning and just was like, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun. Like, the heart just beating, racing. I looked on the little board and it said, like, all the people's names that we had to sign in and what their credentials were, like if they were a PT or a PTA or a strength coach or an atc. And I was the only strength coach and everybody else was a PT or atc. So clearly had more education than me. As well. And so it was just super intimidating. But I was excited and I laughed with a lot of really good information. And I think I cried because it was like the first time I left my son for three to four days, you know, and I'm hip shifting all the way home and doing all this weird stuff. And it just kind of continued on from there that I couldn't just stop. I got the bug and I had to keep moving forward with it.

So you said something that I definitely want you to expand upon. You talked about, you know, how you felt like you didn't feel smart enough to be learning this stuff. Now to me, when I hear things like that, I feel like that's a sign of a good coach. And I love that. But it's what I would also call like a coach's greatest asset, but also their curse, the curse of the good coach, where they are always coming from this place of there's more to learn, I'm a beginner, I'm a beginner mindset. They already have an understanding that industry is always changing and that we need to be on the cutting edge. Right. But the curse part of that are those feelings that come up like, I'm not smart enough, I'm not good enough, or someone else is doing it better than me. I need more certifications. So I'd love for you to expand upon, you know, how did you go through, how did you get to the other side of, you know, not feeling smart enough and what would you say to someone who might be feeling like that? Like, I'm just not smart enough to really grasp these concepts?

Yeah, I think so. Two things. One is that I just had to be scared of shit. I literally had to decide that I was okay with the judgment of others and that I might be wrong, but that I was getting really good results with people and I at least knew that. And that if I could provide this information to other people, maybe it wasn't perfect, but it was something better than what I was seeing out there in terms of the general standard of training. And I had to decide that if I as a 40 year old woman, do I want to stay training day in or day out, or do I want to utilize the information that is not just from these Systems, it's from 20 years of training. It's from a lifetime, half a lifetime of experiencing the world and humans. And there's a lot of value in that. That is not just biomechanics and anatomy and physiology and understanding systems. There's a lot of value in how you Relate to people. And so you can know a whole lot about systems and theory and all of this stuff, but if you can't relate to people, you aren't going to be able to provide them with change. And I knew that I could relate to people because it is something that I've for 20 years. And so for me, I had to get out of my headspace and just do it, even though I was super afraid. The other thing that I would say to people who are on the edge and they really want to take that, that next step and, you know, get over their fear is to just forget about your career. Just forget about what you're learning. Don't think about all the nonsense. Do something else that forces you to get outside the box. So for me, I took up kiteboarding and I was, I love the water and I love surfing. I love all these, you know, throwing myself upside down. And I decided I'm going to do something that makes me scared because I hadn't done that a long time. I traveled a lot in my 20s. I went and lived in other countries, I backpacked around the world. I did all these things that frightened me in my 20s. And then once we got settled and I had a child, I stopped doing them. And I thought, if I can do this, I can do anything. That sort of feeling. And that could be. It doesn't have to be kiteboarding. It could be, I'm afraid to learn how to cook. It makes me uncomfortable. I feel like I'm terrible at it. Like, okay, great, you're terrible at it. Challenge yourself to learn how to do it. It'll benefit you in other ways in your life, but it'll also provide you knowledge about how to take on something that you're not good at or you feel like you're not good at and conquer it. So then when you go into a course, you think, I can't do this. But you're like, but I thought I couldn't do that either and I did it. So you're just boosting your own confidence by trying other things that might be a little less intimidating and then that provides you. And so that year of me trying those things really solidified. I can do this. I've just got to keep doing it. You know, I think that most people.

Miss is that change and growth. It happens on the other side of being uncomfortable.

Yes.

That feeling of fear, it's brain based and it's there and it's never going away. And it's designed to keep you safe. Safe and keep you comfortable because as we know, the body is always looking for that homeostasis. And anytime you're creating a new habit or a new neural pathway in that brain, fear is going to come up and say, nope, sorry, we don't do that. You know, And. And so when you can push through that, that's when you're going to grow. And I think what you said is a huge component, which a lot of people, it's hard for them. I think that, you know, they understand it conceptually, but it's hard for them to know it, actually do it. Which is. It's okay to be wrong.

Yes. Okay to be wrong. And it's okay for people to judge you 100%, and it's okay for you to just not care. And it's. And the other thing I'll say that I didn't even think about, but is finding a support system, creating your own support system of people that back you no matter what. And when you're wrong, they are like, so what? Well, now you know better. Like, or, yeah, but it could be that.

Like.

And people who are willing to always find the best in you. So I think you've always caught them, like, your ride or dies or whatever. It's those people in your life, your family, your friends, your mentors. Like, those are the people you want to keep close by because they're going to recognize the best in you and see the best in you, even when you're judging yourself. And so when you get judgmental, if you open up to them and you tell them about how you're feeling or what you're going through, they're going to support you through it, you know, and so creating a group of people within your industry or your business or whatever that are maybe have different skill sets than you. So, like, having somebody that might be able to recognize or have something that I don't have.

For sure, you know, you said, and it's 100% true, and I tell people this all the time, is that it's human nature to judge. We are judging 100%. Whether or not you're judging something good or something negative, it's still a judgment. It's still an interpretation. So the faster that you can get on board with, hey, I know I'm going to get judged 100% of the time, the faster you're just going to get to do what you love. Otherwise, what else is there, right? Something I think we all can take away just from listening to this, like, from my experience and listening from this podcast, is that you want to get to your. Your failures. I use that word. I rarely use that word. But what people consider their failures or their lessons faster because success is the worst teacher. Success isn't going to show you your lessons that you need to learn. Everything we've talked about could, you know, that has led us to the next step could have been what someone would perceive as a failure or someone would perceive as a getting it wrong.

Yes, definitely. And that's exactly what stops people from putting themselves out there. And it's a big part of my program because I tell all the women, you know, it doesn't matter what. How much you know or how much you don't know. You know more than somebody.

Yes.

And so you can help the person you know more than some. Guess what? You're always. You're never, ever, ever going to know as much as somebody else. There's always going to be somebody that knows more than you. And so what's the harm in trying to help the people who maybe don't know as much as you? And what is that audience to you? Who does that look like? And how can you be the best mentor, the best cheerleader, the best coach for that person? You're not. You don't. There are 6 billion people in this world. You can help someone, and you just need to figure out what your message is and who you enjoy helping.

And I think people forget, too, that when they're looking at their idols or they're looking at people that they think, you know, are so much greater and that they have to wait. They started somewhere, too, and they only got there because of all the steps that they took before that. So often comparing, you know, someone's step 10 to their step one.

Yes. I remember, like, having a hundred followers on Instagram, and I don't even have that big of a following now, but I have a hunt. You know, I had 100 followers on Instagram. I'd post something, and I'd have, like, three or four people like it. Right?

Okay. Someone starts somewhere, but then when you, you know, you, You. You bring up that example. But I always think of it like if you were speaking in front of 100 people in a room, you're gonna feel like that's gonna have a different energy. And that's exactly what's happening when you're on Instagram. Even if you just have 100 followers, people think, oh, I just have 100 followers. Yeah, but you have a hundred eyeballs looking at you, listening to you. That means something. And everyone starts somewhere. So that's good. Now something else you brought up. And I definitely want to talk about it because this is kind of what I was alluding to that we would get to at the beginning call or the beginning of our recording, which was you. Your program, Empowered Performance speaks specifically to women. Like you work primarily with women in, at that capacity in that programming. And so I'd love for you to just talk a little bit about that movement and how, where you, how you got there and why it's important to you.

Yeah, so I had no intention of keeping Empowered Performance just women. But I essentially went through the decision early on because I don't have any female mentors or I didn't, I didn't have. I can hardly even remember having a female coach or a female educator. I have been to a few courses where there have been female teachers, but overall I say it's largely male in general. And so I kind of just felt like, why is that? Why do we see. I don't know what the statistics are, what the percentages actually are, but like if you go to a conference and there's like five female speakers, why is that? Why are there 40 men and five women? I don't know. Except what I think is that life gets in the way because we have other responsibilities. When we become pregnant, we become mothers. I think that we are often told to be seen and not heard. I think that we maybe feel like we're not capable of putting our voice out there, whereas men are able to put their voice out there, even if it's total bs, like they're willing to take the chance, why aren't we? And whether that's, you know, that's kind of an old school way of thinking, but I think it still exists. And so I decided that, you know what I do, I'm going to just give this information because I spent a long time learning all this information and it's nothing against men, but I wanted to provide women the opportunity to learn some cutting edge information so they could take it and then go teach it too. And I encourage them all, take this, it's not mine. I just got this information from somebody else. I just assimilated it into a course so that you could try to understand some different concepts. And now I'm supporting you 100% in your effort to be a leader in the industry that can teach. And I wanted to give back and say if we collectively as a group are able to move ourselves a little bit higher, then the women in their 20s coming into the industry will now have female mentors to look up to. To educate themselves with. And there's nothing wrong with having both. I just think we need to level the playing field a little bit, because what I can offer to them is I get you. I get what it's like to go through infertility or just go through a pregnancy, lose your job, have to take maternity leave, have to stay connected in your life, not feel like you can speak up at work, not feel like you have a mentor that's a female to look up. I get that. I want you to now be that person for me when I was 20. And so that was my intent. And then I just, you know, I. Our good mutual friend Kyle, but he's been a great business mentor to me, and I was on his podcast and they were like, I think you should just keep this women only. Just like, that's kind of your niche now, and it's like a good audience for you. And I was like. And he. And he was like, and furthermore, there's no one else doing it. And I was like, you're right. And in fact, when we were talking yesterday and I was trying to come up with females in the industry, you were talking about biomechanics that do something similar to me, where they are, like, teaching and blah, blah, blah. And it's partly me just need to get out there. I'm sure there's a lot of them, but we were really struggling to find someone to ask to come on.

So there are two things that are, you know, two things that I want to share with you was that the first is I love that you didn't have the intention, like, that it was gonna be female. And I definitely did not want to allude or suggest that you were, like, in the front of, like, women only and female empowerment. That's not what I was saying. But I just know for me and my perspective, I'll never forget, I was a fitness manager. And I, you know, like you said, it's no secret that the industry is primarily male. Not that that's bad. But at the time for me, I was just. There were mostly men that I was working with. I was working my. And I had the privilege of working with some of the best men out there and the best coaches. So I never had that need or that inclination to, like, seek out female role models. It wasn't something I felt like, I mean, or was missing. But I was presenting for a room full of trainers, and I'll never forget it. And I was listing off a whole bunch of resources and people to follow and people to see, study their Work to sharpen the saw as a trainer. And one of the trainers raised her hand and said, do you have any females on that list? And I didn't.

Wow, I totally know what that feels like. Yes.

And it was at that moment where I just felt like a punch in the gut where I felt like, why do I not have any females on this list? And not that it was bad and I don't think. And there was no intention of like, oh, this, you know, it was none of that, but I just had that moment of like, oh, I want to seek this out. This is something that I want, I want to find because I know it exists. I just, I want to seek it out. And I think too that it's really important to bring up this point because. Because I think what happens to a lot of trainers is that we get in this mindset, our own small little bubble and we think everybody's doing it. There's no space for me in the market and I'm not smart enough. Or we just get into all these stories about why we can't do it and it's just another example, like we've already, we just talked about two examples of why your work is needed. Because when you look out the 8 billion people in the world, you're looking on Instagram, like even if you have 4,000 followers, that's 4,000. Or that you're following 4,000 people all talking about the same thing. Well, that's 4,000 compared to the 8 billion out there. Right. You know, when you're saying everyone's doing it, is it really everyone? No, there's space for you. And we need to have, we need to have those voices in the market so that know 20 year old Beverly or the next 20 year old version of myself, or you know, next female, next female trainer can come through and have those role models, more of them.

Yes, 100%. And it's always evolving. So whatever I'm teaching now will probably be different. It's already different. I'm changing a lot of my slides. I'm like, oh, I was wrong about that, I shouldn't have put that in there or whatever. That's going to continue on, I hope, you know, and so whatever we're all in our little niche talking about right now, it's gonna not be there and it's gonna be stupid in two years. At least, I hope so, because we're evolving. And so it's okay to come at it from this smaller place. And then as you continue to teach more and provide more education for People or counsel clients or whatever, that's gonna change and you're gonna evolve. And so you're never gonna know enough because it's never going to stop learning. There's never an endpoint. And so what's that?

I said, and that's a good thing, because if there's an end point, then you'd be bored.

Yes. And so there are a ton of people talking about the same thing. Maybe they like hearing it from you more than they like hearing it from me. Right. Maybe they just like your personality better.

Or there's gonna be a cue that you use that resonates with your clients, but somebody else's cue is gonna use a different C and it resonates better, differently.

Sure. And so that's where there's a place for everyone. It doesn't matter. The question is, again, I think it's like we're coming full circle, is it goes back to how well can you empathize, how well can you listen, how well can you hear people? What's your communication style? Are you able to make people feel truly that you care because you really do, because you actually are genuinely interested? That's so basic. If you can figure that out and, you know, some good information, you can do anything you want.

I know. I love that. So good. I, you know, also share, too, that, you know, I'll definitely have the. I've definitely had a million of those moments where I was like. I was so, so wrong about that. Sometimes they haunt me. I will never forget, like when I was first starting to, like, get into this, like, pre postnatal training, and I made some recommendation that was probably the worst possible thing that you could do. Yeah, like the worst. But I just took a stab at it because I wanted to try. I wanted to. I wanted to learn.

I.

From there, you know, that moment was just burned into my brain because I was just so wrong. But because that happened, it led me to study more, to get better, and I helped hundreds of other people because I was willing to take that first step.

Sure, sure.

Confident.

I talk a lot about how confidence comes from competence, and competence will only come from action.

Exactly. And if you're not teaching or you're not putting yourself out there and putting your thoughts out there, you're not going to learn as fast. You might still continue to learn, but you're going to learn a lot quicker if you just say it and then look back and go, now I see how that's different. Now I see how it's wrong. Or maybe I was right about that, like, whatever it is, but you're putting it out there. And the fear is like, here's the thing with Instagram. Like, I can put something out there and no one's gonna even look at it a day later. So don't worry. No one cares that much about what you're saying anyway. You can have somebody scroll. I always love, like when I see somebody, like, scroll back and like, like 20 posts ago, and I'm like, wow, that person, like, obviously is a good follower. Like, he really wanted to see what I was saying. Because most people care less if I'm done with that. So it's trial and error too. It's like, oh, just try this. And maybe it resonates. And maybe people are like, well, that's stupid. Or maybe people are like, that's great. Whatever. You're also just trying out your own reasoning. You're getting over your fear of creating your own reasoning, not just regurgitating or saying someone else's information. You're speaking as yourself, as a human and how you interpret things. And no one can say that's wrong because that's how you experienced it in that moment. And that's what makes sense for you. And so that's okay. And if they somehow want to prove you're wrong, fine.

Yeah.

And post later. You just don't care anymore. Right.

It reminds me of when I was watching my children to learn how to walk.

Right.

They don't just stand up and then all of a start running. I mean, you and I take walking for granted. Like, we just walk. But then when you actually watch some. We just walk now. But when you actually watch someone learn how to walk, they fall 700 kajillion times and then just get right back up. That's how they get there.

Yes.

They're not sitting in their toddler book being like, how do I learn how to. How do I learn how to walk? That's all they're doing.

If they are, you're raising a genius.

The camera and put them on YouTube. No.

I'll have to send you the video of Quincy walking that I posted the other day. He sounds like a dinosaur of his first steps. He's like, the intention was so extreme.

I love that.

I love that.

Alright, so I definitely want to be mindful of your time. This has been so good. Thank you so much.

Thank you so much.

I'll leave you with one last question before I let people, you know, come find you. But if you were to give yourself your younger self one piece of advice from, like, back when you were 20s, from where you are now, what would you say? Hmm.

Gosh, that's a good question. In terms of business or in terms of life, maybe? It doesn't matter.

It doesn't matter. You pick.

Never. No, I'm not going to say never. I'm putting a different way. Every single time something scares you, go after it. Don't run away from it.

So good. So good. I love that. Okay, so where can I send people they wanted to learn more about you, what you do, where should I send.

Them so you can go? KatieStinclairFitness.com on my website and there's lots of stuff on there, but Instagram is really where I post and put all of my thoughts and ideas together. And that's the same Kati St. Clair Fitness and I am going to be doing a webinar coming up. We talked about this in July, I'd say mid July. So if you get on my newsletter or sign up for any of my wait lists that's on my website, you'll get a PDF that has like squat biomechanics and some information on it that you might find useful. But it'll also clue you into some of the other things that are coming up, like the webinar that I'm going to be doing. And then you can also find me through the Female Fitness alliance, which I created over during the COVID time. We have two talks left, so we're going to have one this Saturday with Crystal Laswell and then we're going to have one the following Saturday on Nutrition with Erin Murray. And so though that's a great place, you can sign up there for the Female Fitness alliance and you'll get the email specifically about that. And it's completely free. You sign up and we'll send you the deets on how to get into the zoom. Call and join a bunch of really awesome women who want to support each other. And we have a private Facebook group too, that's also free.

Okay, awesome. I love that. Thank you so much. We're going to link all of that into the show notes, so. So anyone who's interested, you can go ahead and get the links inside of the show notes. So thank you so much, Katie, for joining us today. I really appreciate it.

Thank you so much, Beverly. It was awesome talking to you.

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