How to Use Storytelling In Business

You're listening to the PT Profit podcast, episode number 19. Today I'm sitting down with storyteller Katie Soy who's teaching us all about how to use storytelling in business. So stay tuned. Hi, I'm Beverly Simpson, former fitness manager turned online personal training business owner. And this podcast is where smart fitness professionals, including trainers and clinicians, discover how to increase client performance and movement, package and position their products and services and get out of their own way so that they can increase their revenue to live a life that they love without sleazy sales. Welcome to the PT Profit Podcast. What's up coach? Welcome back to the PT Profit Podcast. As per usual, I'm super excited for today's episode because I'm diving in with a very special friend, Katie Soy. Before we get started, in case you have heard, starting August 17th I am hosting a brand new free five day challenge. So when you join us inside the challenge, you will get your first one to five high paying clients using the messaging inside of your content in your social media posts. So if you are a smart and struggling coach and you need help using content that converts into high paying clients, then I want you to come and hang out with us inside the free five day challenge. I'm linking that inside of the show notes. Day I'm sitting down with an Amazon best selling author, Katie Soy, who happens to be a very dear friend of mine. And we are chatting today all about the power of storytelling and how we can use different types of story inside our business to help us influence and persuade our potential clients. But more importantly for those of you who have worked with me, you know that I'm talking about how we can use our own personal story and our own context and how those experiences can be used very powerfully inside of your content and inside of your messaging and case really takes it to the next level. And so you're really going to love this episode when you stay till the end. And so I know when you stay with us till the end of the episode, you are going to be blown away by how to use story in your content and you'll be able to walk away today with tools that you can implement today in your content. So Katie Soy is an author, consultant, story wizard and adventurer. She helps entrepreneurs and companies and personal brands unleash the power of personal story in branding. Katie's career adventure began with a Master's degree in Business Communications and it led to several years as a college communications instructor and over seven years as a corporate marketing manager and copywriter, focusing on national campaigns for a Bicoastal mortgage company. And now she works as a storytelling strategist at Freelance Writer. She's a transformational coach for Jim Fortin and a scripting coach for Brandon Lucero. Creative writing is her passion. And she has an Amazon best selling novel which is available at Barnes and Nobles with more fiction projects in the works. So without further ado, let's go ahead and roll that interview. Hi, Katie. Thanks so much for joining me on the show today. How are you?

I'm doing well. Thank you so much for having me. It's so great to get the chance to chat with you because we're friends and we're also colleagues and you're just the best. So I'm excited to be here.

Oh, that's great. No, you are the best. Honestly, I'm super pumped. I think that your stuff that you are going to bring to the audience today, I just, I know they are going to love it. I know. I am so excited. So just to kick us off for fun today, can you tell us a little bit about who you are and who you serve and, and how you got there?

Yes. So I am the founder of the Story Collective and I help business owners, usually entrepreneurs, personal brands, companies who are too close to their company mission to see the value of their authentic, vulnerable experiences and how you can relate those to branding and business in a really powerful way. So I help people really unleash the power of their personal stories in, in business branding.

Oh, so good. So how did you get into that?

It's been, in one way, it feels like it's been a journey. In another way, it feels like I've been doing this my whole life. So I have always been a writer. In fact, I am a writer. I have a book on Amazon. I'm working on other fiction books right now. And that kind of led me to a marketing copywriting career for a mortgage company in the corporate world. And then that led me to consulting on the side and helping people do that on the side, which brought me to people going, well, how do you talk about tough stuff in business? How do you humanize, like, for example, like working in mortgage. How do you humanize loan officers?

Right.

Everybody sells the same product at different companies.

Right.

How do you humanize those people in communities? How do you humanize the mortgage industry, which over the last decade has gotten some negative press over the years. Right. Because of stuff going on in the industry. And then that led to the conversation of how do you tell, like, how do you differentiate, how do you differentiate yourself if you are Somebody who sells a similar product to a ton of other people. And then how do I tell stories in my business and my professional branding that are really personable or really vulnerable or really raw, right? Because people kind of tend to think, oh, I have to be this way in business and this way my personal life. And so once you have that intersection of taking those stories, the things that have happened to you, different experiences that have shaped who you are, probably shaped why you started your business, and you tell them in this brilliant way, you connect to your ideal audience, you build trust, right? So you can sell more easily in an authentic, real way, and you can change the world, right? It's those stories that make people feel less alone. It's those stories that, like, reach a hand out to other people and go, oh, they did this too, so it's possible for me. So to me, there's like the business ROI of storytelling, you know, builds trust, you know, connects to your audience, you know, grows your audience, helps people want to buy from you more easily, you know, kind of in the 3D, right? But then there's also this higher purpose step of it too. Like, those stories are what connect other people to us and help people feel less alone.

And I love it. And we're just gonna go really deep into it. The things that you said, which I think is such a powerful point, and it's something that I always bring to my clients at work with me, that I feel most people miss, is that it's so easy to look out into the industry. And so for us, I'm talking to fitness professionals, and it's to see, like, oh, I can't reinvent human body biomechanics and, you know, teach people how to, you know, squat and deadlift a different way. Our skeletal system had a muscular system. It's not changing.

Acro level for.

For just argument's sake. So they miss the fact that their story and that their context is part of what makes them unique, right? And I think so many people forget that and then struggle to weave that into their business content.

And I totally agree with you. And I think, you know, for your example of in your clients who are in fitness, if you're trying to sell the same thing everybody else is selling, it's just like with loan officers, right? Or any. Any MLM company, it's how do you make yourself unique? And yet there's this inner resistance in a lot of my clients, I find into sharing what actually makes them unique. So, for example, you and I have chatted before. We're friends. So you know that I've had kind of a whole mental health journey over the last few years.

Right.

And so if I'm looking for a fitness coach, I'm going to naturally gravitate more towards somebody who is open about working out when you're depressed or working out when you are. You know, how do you feel your body and feed yourself? Right. Nutrition and supplements when you're dealing with depression, anxiety, things like that, Sharing about their journey and how food helped them and they healed themselves.

Right.

And, like, workouts fueled, like that helped their. That helped them process. With all that stuff, I'm naturally going to gravitate. Like, look at. Look at postpartum moms.

Right, right.

There's a natural. There's a natural draw. Like, it's. It's just. It's just, you know, story mechanics. It's how we're. It's how we operate. Right. That's how the human brain operates. We're going to go to our, you know, women trainers or trainers who are very supportive of this postpartum community and the changes that you've just gone through and all of that. So telling these stories, it's almost like, that's the one. Like, everybody's like, how do I be unique? But then I find this resistance of, oh, well, I can't talk about that because that's too much.

Right.

And I, you know, interestingly enough, I feel like a lot of my clients come to me with stories of trauma, with stories that have been considered, you know, more sensitive. And so are those harder to tell in branding? Sure. But to me, they're the most challenging because they can be the most impactful. And when shared the right way, that can completely shift somebody's life. Yes, it can sell your products and connect to your audience, but it can change somebody's life when you go, I was here and you're here right now, and I know how dark it feels and whatever it is, but I got out of it. That's what storytelling is. And so to me, yeah, that's the main thing that makes us unique. And I think it also helps people build trust with you.

Right.

Like, you can go, here's why I can talk to you about this. Stories also build credibility in your brand, and you can use them to overcome, you know, objections in your marketing and your messaging and your branding, too. Like, your stories can go, here's why. Like, I've got proof of why I can help you, right? So there's just so many things that it does from a business standpoint, but I feel like, people can be hesitant to go, I don't want to talk about that, Katie. Like, come on. And I'm like, no, this is the hidden gem, what we need to bring to the front of your brand. Yeah.

So I just want to jump in here real quick because I recognize that since Katie and I are such good friends, that we talk about storytelling, and I think that people understand conceptually, like, what a story is. But I think when we are actually look at it from a deconstruction, like a deconstructing it point of view, and really asking yourself, like, well, what is. You know, what does constitute as a story? I think that we can all conceptually understand that, but I'd love to, like, just take a look at it from. Just take a little bit of a closer look at it. What do you mean when you're talking about a story?

This is a great question, and it's one that I love, because when people come to me and they're like, I don't want to tell this story, I want to tell this story frequently, I go, that's not a story.

Right?

So a story typically involves. It's like a recipe ingredient. So I'll give you a long answer to this question, right? It's like, in any recipe, you know, there are certain things that you're gonna have if you bake a cake versus making cookies or versus making a roast, Right. Whatever it is. So in stories, you have main characters, you have conflict, right? There's no story without conflict. Look at any movie, any book. Beverly knows I'm a huge movie TV show, fiction book lover, Right? That's my jam. And you have main characters, you have conflict. They either overcome that conflict, they overcome challenges.

Right.

Or they don't. That's when you have tragedies happen, right? And then you have an ending. So you've got your ingredients of your main characters, your conflict or your challenges, your beginning, your middle, and your end, right? And so when you're telling a story, again, whether it's business, friend at coffee shop, right? This is how the brain naturally tells and registers stories. So that's. I don't know if that's helpful for the answer to your question. So when we tell this in business, we want to make sure. Usually my niche is helping clients tell stories that put their clients in the hero's journey, right? So again, same thing. You've got your hero as your main character. Probably you. Maybe it's a client, maybe it's a client that you've helped. It's testimonial and you're kind of bringing that testimonial to life. So it's not kind of one dimensional, somebody saying, oh, this helped me. It's three dimensional, where you're telling the story.

Right?

Does that make any sense? Because you're actually going to go into more detail about what this testimonial involved. And so you're going to have, you know, identify your main characters, your conflict or your challenges, your inciting incidents, 1, 2, or 3, and then your ending and how that was resolved. And the resolve is really where you can build your credibility and establish that trust. And so the hero's journey follows that same. And we've all heard this, right? The hero's journey follows that same lineup. And again, you can place yourself in that so that you show clients what's possible for them. And I always use this example, like, we've all been at dinner parties or at coffee or out with friends, and you've heard people tell similar stories, like, different ways. So, like, you can tell when somebody's being arrogant. And we all have heard this at some conference or some event that we've been to. And some, you know, like when somebody's telling a story and it's like the brag rights, you know what I mean? Like, they're just telling a story to sound great versus somebody sharing a story where you're like, and then I dealt with this, and this was probably the wrong way to handle it. And then I went here, and then my friend came and helped me with, you know what I mean? There's a different feeling. And so we want to tell the story in a way that makes the client see what's possible for them, even if you're using yourself as an example. And so that's really kind of those key ingredients, following the hero's journey and making sure that we use that so the client can see what's possible, not so we're getting some sort of, you know, good feeling or for our ego of telling the story. That's what I advise my clients.

Oh, and this is so good. I'm so glad that you brought this up, because I think this is something that I know a lot of my clients struggle with, because one of the things that I'm gearing, you know, that I'm teaching them, and I didn't say it quite as eloquently as you did, but what you said was making sure that in your storytelling or in your content, you're positioning your client as the hero. And I think what.

Yes, yes, yes.

So many people is that when they're telling a story about themselves, they're having a challenging time putting themselves in the guide position and putting their client in the hero position.

Right.

And I think, yeah, that's, that's a very common struggle. And I think that first of all, if this is new and if you're wanting to tell stories the right way, probably this might feel really weird to tell a story about yourself, but I always tell my clients, you can tell that story in a way that involves humility and in a way that clearly defines the road that's possible for your client.

Right.

It's just all in the way that you tell the story. So one of the things, so my niche with my, with my one on one clients is helping them identify. Because you just asked what is story? And my next follow up to this was going to be there's also different kinds of stories. You need to have different kinds of stories at the ready to tell in your branding. If you want examples on this. If you ever follow Brendan Burchard, Tony Robbins, Right. Like top people in the entrepreneur space, Brendon Burchard tells the same stories at his conferences over and over and over again. And I've heard him tell the same stories that I've seen him speak three different times. And I still laugh because he's such a great storyteller.

Right.

So you need to have, as a business owner, you need to have your stories, right. So there's not just one story that you're telling. And so I think some people are like, well, how do I tell this story and not make it about me? Well, that story might be about you because it might be the best example that shows your client that they can accomplish something like you accomplished as well. That might be the best way to tell the story. So instead of being focused on, oh, it's about me or it's about them, I want to focus on the best way to tell the story to get the point across. If you're the best example, then you're the best example. But we can also include other types of stories that are going to touch on your clients aren't going to be about you. They're going to be about a friend or they're going to be about, you know, that, that 3D testimonial I kind of mentioned.

Right.

So I would say, first of all, it can be about you, and that's not always bad. And second, you're gonna have, you're gonna have a handful of stories at the ready, just like these guys that we see that tell These stories for their business.

Right.

You see it with politicians too. It's, it's done all over the place. Because that's the other thing that people say to me is they're like, well, I can't tell the same story over and over again. And I'm like, yes, you can. That's what makes you recognizable. Like, do you change your logo every two months? No, because that's what makes you recognizable as a brand. So, yeah, you're gonna, you're, you're gonna be evolving and your business will evolve and new stories will pop up and you'll shift old. That's totally fine. But I help people develop these different types of stories. And so you may have a couple about you and then some others that are totally great examples of other people or metaphors in your industry.

Right.

So there's so many options.

Okay, so good, I've got two follow up questions popped up and I'm gonna start with this one. Okay.

Okay.

You mentioned that it's a good idea to have different types of stories and one that you identified was, you know, like the client testimonial and talking about, like a client's story and talking about a client journey to maybe potentially overcome an objection. What are the other stories that you recommend as a brand? We should start thinking about.

This is my favorite because, okay, this is the great, this is the best question. I get excited about all of this because again, my, because of my writer passion and that, that part of what I do in my career, I, what makes me different when it comes to brand storytelling is I take a narrative fiction approach to your stories.

Right.

And that's a good thing. That's a good thing because I'm looking at this like, okay, who's the main character in this story? Are there, is there more than one? What's the villain?

Right.

If you're telling a sensitive story about trauma, chances are when you tell me that story, there's going to be a person that's the villain. And I want to make sure that we change that before we go to your audience and go public and make sure that that villain is an obstacle.

Right.

We want to make sure we're not sharing stories in victim mode. We can come back to that. So that all comes to the fact that my key stories, I think are really important for people to have in their business are your origin story and your vision story. And then I have what people, what I call your brand stories and your signature stories, which are like personal anecdotes of your life. So those are My, those are the ones that I think are absolutely key. If you only want to work on one or two, it's always going to be the origin and the vision story. And when I say origin story, Bev, I mean like pick like what's, what's a common usage of origin story right now, Right. Like Marvel superheroes, right. Like you have your Avengers movies and then you have the Captain America origin movie, and then you now have the Black Widow origin movie and Iron man origin movies.

Right.

What is your origin story? How did you come to be doing what you're doing? I guarantee you that you're, you're in business because of something personal that happened to you, right? Maybe a series of personal things. So origin story, vision story, what does that mean? Where are you taking your clients? Sometimes this is a brand value that's internally facing and people can go, oh, I'm taking them here. And I go, okay, well, I see that in the brand sheet that you sent over, but that's on your website. I don't see it as a theme in your messaging. I don't see it anywhere in recent Instagram posts or blog posts.

Right.

Where are you taking them? What is this story? And that's more of a fictional journey that you and I will work to create if we're working together. And go, where am I taking the client? Because that needs to be bright and vibrant and clear. Like, where can they end up? So that's very much. The client is the main character in that story and you're sharing your goals. Like the ideal path that they follow when working with you gets them. What, how do they feel? Where are they at? What does their life look like? So that's an example for your earlier question about a story that is totally related to the client, not you at all.

Right.

The origin story all about you. And it can be amazing. And then, so that's my, that's my framework, my head to heart story framework. And then the brand and signature stories we can talk about in a minute. But those are two other types of stories.

Yeah, the brand and signature. I want to talk about that real quick. Like, okay, so people need to focus on the origin and the vision. And I do have a follow up question about that, which I think, ask the other types of stories. When would you use those?

So when you are identifying the origin and vision stories, typically you have, you end up finding so many more stories that are personal that have to do with why you started. They may not make it to the final cut of your origin story.

Right.

Because one of the things that we do in storytelling is we make sure that your origin story, any story that you're telling is concise.

Right?

So normally what happens is I go through and start working with clients and we go, here's the origin story stuff, here's the, here's the vision story stuff. And then we have all these leftover things and I want to use those. So you've got this high level framework that you can keep, you know, using and it just goes forever. So a signature story is what I call, that's my name for a personal story that might be secondary to your origin story. So it might be a really funny story, it might be a really sad story, it might be something that's really traumatic or sensitive. And it's one of the things that happened on your path.

Right.

To get you where you are today. And then a brand story is basically, it's not a personal story. It's literally one or two lines that explain what your brand values are and what the company stands for. So they're very, they're just, they're very short. They're just very short. But they like. So when you give me a brand value kit and I'm like, all right, this is great, what does that mean? If your brand value is integrity, what does that mean? And so we work out a couple sentences or a paragraph and then we start threading those themes into your messaging.

Right?

So we talked about what the brand stands for and we can actually go in because you don't want to just say our brand stands for integrity. Okay, great. Everybody's brand stands for integrity. So a brand story, no offense, no offense, but I mean, come on. And so a brand story is, what does that mean for a fitness professional? It's going to be different for a fitness professional that's dedicated to helping people overcome mental health issues with fitness, that's going to be different than Nike's brand story on integrity makes sense. So a lot of people, especially entrepreneurs, I feel like will have, yes, I stand for A, B and C. And I'm like, let's tell a quick short story about what that means. So those aren't personal anecdotes. It's not an origin story, but it's definitely, it's definitely a brand story. And then those themes usually make up the vision.

Right?

The vision story for your client usually involves those themes. So it's kind of, it's its own little framework.

Awesome. This is totally getting me thinking. I'm like, oh, I need to go back, I need to revisit this, for me, this is a treat.

Yes, yes, you do.

So here's the two things you know, that come up for me is number one, I'm curious, you know, what do you say to your clients? Like, number one.

Right.

You mentioned, you know, a lot of things in terms of storytelling that maybe are really like big events, like a trauma or they have like a life altering moment, something happens, it's like super traumatic. And sometimes even like, especially in the fitness space, you go out and you look at people that maybe have bigger followings. Like, you know, Brianna Battles, for example. She talks about her diastasis because she had a diastasis. Like it was like a thing. And so what if you're someone that's like, nothing big's ever really happened in my life. Like, what if they, you know, my origin story is boring, Katie. I didn't just like, like working out, and I do it for a living. Right. So what would you tell your client who's felt that way?

I would tell, and I have told this to clients. I said nothing about, nothing about why you're doing what you're doing is boring, first of all. Okay, so, I mean, look at, I mean, let's take, let's take an example of an industry that might be considered more boring. Maybe not everybody thinks this, but when Bill Gates dropped out of college to start Microsoft, he probably would have said, well, this isn't anything fancy. This is really boring. Like, this isn't really that big of it. Like, I'm just, I'm a coder. I don't know what he was, coder, programmer or whatever. I'm dropping out to go do this. Okay, cool. If you're into tech, maybe that's cool. But I don't think people at the time would have said, that's really inspiring, Bill.

Right, right.

I mean, so that's why I'm like. And Oprah is the same thing. Like, Oprah, Oprah was fired from a job as a, as an, as a news reporter or anchor.

Right.

And at the time when she was like, I'm gonna start this talk show. I mean, we don't. It's not up to us to decide if our story is inspiring or not, because we are our worst freaking critics all day long. So if somebody said that to me, those are, that's kind of what I say. I bring them. I kind of get bossy and I get on my little soapbox and I'm like, here's why you need my head to heart story framework lovingly. And then get off the you know, I feel like I alternate between, like, on the soapbox like this, and then, like, cheerleader on the sidelines, like, yay, let's tell your story. I swept it between those two identities. Yeah. So it's not up to you to decide if your story is inspiring. It's up to you to tell your story, because let's say that you. Nothing happened to you and you like working out. The point of telling a story is to attract your ideal audience. Right. Who are probably similar to you. So if you're somebody, like, I have people in my family who have experienced mental health battles like I have, we can always get into really deep conversations about that. I have other people in my family who are lovely people, and they have not had those struggles. And so when that comes up, they just are uncomfortable and they're not trying to be awkward. But it's. You know what I mean? It's just not the same thing because they're like, oh, I don't know what to say. I don't know who to be right now, because she was talking about this deep thing, and I have no experience with it. So you're not trying to attract other people that aren't like you. Right. Like, most people that are going to work with you are probably have some similarity to you. So if you are a fitness person and you're like, nothing ever happened, I just like working out. Your goal is to tell stories that are going to have other people be attracted to you for that same thing.

Right.

And go, I just like working out. I don't need. I don't need, you know, postpartum support. I don't need somebody to help me go through, you know, workouts when you have hormone imbalance or I don't need somebody to help me try to work out when I'm dealing with depression. I just. I just want to work out and I want help. You're going to tell a story that connects those clients. You're just going to be the bridge for those people, your people. So you're not going to, you know, be the bridge for somebody else's people. That's not the goal.

Yeah, that's so good.

The other thing is, when you come out, out of the closet about your stories, they are very polarizing, typically. Or at least that's kind of the clients I tend to attract. And so people will go, people know this. Then they might not want to work with me. And I go, yeah, high five.

That's exactly what we want.

Right.

Because that's not your people. And you don't people look, you know, work with you and then realize they're not your people down the road? Like, we want to stand out and disrupt and be who we are at the front end of our marketing and our messaging on every platform, so we're very clear and people can go, yeah, that's not my person. Great. That's awesome. But then you're going to be that lighthouse for your people. So if your people haven't dealt with trauma, that's fine. We'll tell stories about how you like working out and you want to motivate yourself to eat healthy and work. Like, that's totally fine.

Yeah. And two, you know, something that we haven't said, but I want to definitely also mention, is that, you know, sometimes you don't have to be your ideal client. You don't have to go through the same experiences. Totally fine. Because there are people out there that need that and are attracted to that. Like, I always think about moms, right? Male trainers who sometimes, you know, they like working with moms, and they're like, well, I haven't had a kid. And I said, yeah. Do you know how many times the last thing I want to be doing is talking about my children? I don't even think about my children, right? There's a pool of moms out there that want to work with male trainers.

Who don't want to talk about kids 100%. And that's why we. That's why we have to define who your audience is, and your goal is to bridge the gap to that audience. So it doesn't matter to me if you think your story. First of all, like I said, most people are so off about how they see themselves, right? Like, I have, like, my magic wand. Like, we joke that my clients and I joke that I'm like, the story wizard, and I'm going to get their stories out of them and kind of. You know what I mean? So I have a magic wand. You probably have this with your clients, too. You see them just as their best selves. Like, you just have the biggest heart, and you're like, oh, my gosh, I see you. And people don't always see themselves like that. And I've had coaches do this for me and mentors do this for me, and people that I've hired go, no, here's what your website design should be. It's so much bigger than what you thought, right? So if you think your story is boring, whatever, that's not. That's not something that you need to worry about because there Are people out there that will connect or like you said, people that. There could be people that are like, I really want a pause. Like, super. I don't want this, you know, other type of workout situation where it's focused on, like, getting through mental health battles.

Right.

That's fine. And I will say I have experienced the same thing, because I've. I've chosen dance classes that are taught by moms because I feel like they're less pressure than, like, the ones that are. You know what I mean? Like, I just feel like I can go. And I don't have kids, but I feel like I can go. And it's just, like. It's less. There's less of, like, the expectation of looking a certain way in the gym. And that was a struggle for me for a long time. So I don't have kids, and I was, like, seeking out that group going, okay, because I want that fun, kind of playful. We're all here for whatever, you know, as opposed to the strict, like. You know what I mean?

Go so hard. Yeah.

Yeah.

What you mean, right? Like, a lot of people, too. Sometimes they're like, I don't have. As a trainer, you know, I don't have a big, massive transformation story. I just have always been athletic, right?

Yes.

And that's okay, because your clients will have massive transformation stories. Like, it doesn't be what you've gone through.

Okay, I have a really good point on this that I just occurred to me, because I've had that, too. I've had people say what I teach people I've never struggled with.

Mm.

So the point is, what I tell them is, has there ever been a time when you've had a transformation on something else in your life not related to what you do for business? The answer is always yes. Okay. So I had a client who. She helps people with gut health, and she has struggled with an origin story forever. In fact, she was avoiding the sections on, like, webinars and, like, courses that she bought that it asked you to tell your story because she was like, I've always had really good gut health. And so what we did is I took her through an exercise where I was like, can you list out not the steps per your industry that you take your clients through, but the steps, like, concepts and themes that they experience when they go through your program, like emotions and feelings? And she was like, well, they have to work hard. It takes dedication to follow this plan to heal your gut. They deal with judgment from their families, people that are like, why are you being so Strict, Right. So we picked out those themes and I said, okay, so we did like a map of those themes. And I said, has there ever been a time in your life where you've dealt with, you know, five or ten of these? And she goes, well, yeah, she had a really tough time with her family at one point in her life. And so we told that as part of her origin story. We locked in the emotions and the feelings that her clients go through when they go through her program with a target.

Right.

And then we found another situation that was not related, that was able to really kind of define the line with that empathetic, you know, connection. And she was like, oh my gosh, this is so powerful. Same thing. I had somebody who was actually in fitness and had always been fit, but she dealt with a lot of debt and the same techniques that she used to have her debt was what her clients needed to go through in the fitness program. So we. So the debt story is her origin story. So again, I'm like, I like roll up my sleeves and there's like not a clear. Yeah, you know, transformation story. Because I'm like, alright, there's some somewhere else in your life where you've gone through something similar and you don't have to. It's not like you have to go into every single detail in a story too.

Right.

Like you can, you can hit the high points to go, yeah, to pay off debt, I had to be disciplined. I had to do this every day. I had, you know, and you can easily see, right, you can probably see right now how that's so similar to, you know, to getting those same types of great results in the fitness program. So. Yeah, true.

And one of the things that you said that I definitely want to highlight because this is something I do teach, is that when we are trying to be persuasive and when we are looking for people to, who commit to the next step and sell our product, people buy an emotion and they need to feel a certain way. So if the story is going to elicit the same type of feeling that they need to say yes, then it's going to do this. Then, then, ta da.

You did it. This is what I do when I get excited and I'm like agreeing with you silently. So people, if they're watching, they're like, who is she interviewing? What is this? I look like, like one of those things that. Like the car. The car, the car. Lots.

Right.

Like the. But yes. Can I write down what you just said? Because that's the thing is. And that's part of that map of story mapping, too. When we got into her origin story mapping, and you were like, all right, here's what your clients like. Here's the scenes and concepts they experience. And then the other part of that was, what emotions did you feel when you were stuck in this. In this tough family situation? I felt trapped. I felt like there was no solution. I felt like no matter what I did, it was my family. I could never get out of it. Same thing if it's your gut health, as you know, because this is related to fitness helplessness. It doesn't matter what they do for workouts, what they're eating, there's no results. They gain, you know, there's weight gain, like, regardless. So those same emotions. Right. And so now that's part of her origin story, is dealing with kind of setting herself free in that area that she felt like was going to be an uphill battle forever. And so, yeah, it's those emotions. So. And that's part of. As you know, I teach persuasion and influence as well for messaging with some of my clients. And it's something where you have kind of, you know, your logical persuasion structure.

Right.

For messaging, but then you also have to go in and you have to go back and add in your emotional language. And if you don't have one or the other, that piece isn't right. It's the. That's off.

Right?

Your messaging's off. And so, so often people will nail the logical structure, and then there's no emotional language. And so stories connect with emotions. And so origin stories, if that. If you've had a transformation related to your business, awesome. Super easy to do, if not still awesome, and actually way more powerful because I think it takes more effort and more. It's more challenging and it's more impactful. So, yeah.

Yeah, I love that. Okay, so I want to be mindful of your time, too, because I'm like, oh, my gosh, we could talk.

I know. We could talk all day.

But one of the things, too, I'm curious, is what would you say to someone who's like, but, Katie, I'm not a good writer.

Oh. Oh, dear. I would say, what a fascinating, limiting belief you have. Do you want me to shift it for you or do you want to stay there? Good storytelling is not only writing. Like, when you go to the movies, are you reading a script or are you engrossed in a story?

Right.

Good storytelling could be an Instagram post and it could be an email, and it frequently is. When we look at messaging Right. And that's the other thing is in my. What, in my work, we're not writing social posts. We're not writing emails. We're creating stories and themes that can be talked about and tied together. And so many. So many pieces of your content on any platform. But it could be a video where you're talking. Are you a good talker? Can you speak? Okay. Then you can film a video about your story.

Right.

You know, there are people who are so worried about the perfectionism of, you know, you know, an email or a sales page or social post. And I would just ask, has ever been a time where you were really impacted emotionally, despite typos, despite errors? Probably, yes. And so you can't hold yourself back like that because what you're really saying is you're more attached to your belief that you're not a good writer than you are about your mission to change the world. That's what you're saying. If that's a belief that you want to hold on to. And so, okay, don't write, then, you know, speak it. Do a video. Talk to me on a Facebook Live. If you're a really good speaker and you're really engaging on video, tell me your origin story on a Facebook Live or make it a video and post your Facebook ad. Don't write a copy. There's so many ways around it. But also, don't let your fear of perfectionism hold you back.

Right?

So, yeah, it's so funny because right before we got on this call and recorded, you know, we were talking with our friend Brandon, too, yesterday, who's one of my mentors all the time. It's like, you guys, if my English teacher knew how my business, entire business is built on the fact that I can write now, I think she'd be like, no, not Beverly.

Exactly. And messaging is so much more than one medium. It's not just writing. It's not just speaking. And it's also how you make your. It's how you make your people feel. And, like. Yeah. So, like, if you've ever felt emotional and connected with somebody who wasn't speaking in perfect English to you, probably even if just your friend, right? And your friend's telling you a story and they're messing up, you're not paying attention if they're screwing up their tenses or their speech.

Right.

You're emotionally connected to that story. So it's the same thing in writing or speaking, but there. Yeah, there are just so many different ways to do it. One of the things that does hold My clients back in this process though is the fact that when they're writing their story, a lot of times they're like, I can't write this down, it's too much. I can't organize my thoughts because writing isn't supernatural. So one thing that I encourage people to do, if that's a concern, we're going to shift that limiting belief. So that's off the plate. But if it's a concern, you can always speak your story and like record yourself and pretend you're talking to a friend or even give your friend, give a friend prompts and have them ask you and then, and then record yourself because you'll find if writing is not natural, that speaking it out is really helpful. And then listen to your recording.

Right.

Take them and take stuff from that. So that's another really good kind of trick to help if that's a concern. But the world does not need you to be perfect to make a difference.

So good and so true. You know, also I want to circle back to you said something and that I want to also highlight and I want people to hear this too because I recognize this in myself all the time, is that what we are the most, we are the closest to ourselves and there's so much that we can't, that we can't see about ourselves. Like oftentimes I'll be able to see like my clients mission. I'll be able to see my client's story and take that 30, 30 foot thousand view that I'm gonna, that I don't necessarily see for myself because I'm so close to it.

Right.

You know, that's why it's just another reason why it's so important to hire a coach and to hire somebody else to help you see what you can't see because you can't change what you.

Don'T know that is so powerful. You cannot change what you don't know that is so powerful. I actually had a client who came to me because she was working in fitness and wanted to work on brand storytelling. And as we got through her, my framework because as you know, let me back up a little bit. As you know so much of what we do. Like, like we talked about at the beginning, there's the 3D aspect to it. Like yes, I do this for business to make money so I can pay my bills. But then there's also like a purpose, like a higher purpose aspect. Like, but I also, I also do this work to help people. Like if you're in fitness, you help people feel confident Right. Like you're giving them new views on their beauty.

Right.

New views on their body.

Right.

So it's higher than I just give people workouts or I just give people story frameworks.

Right.

So this client came to me, and in the middle of it, I said, this is not what you do. I said, sorry to break it to you, News alert. I said, you specifically help women recover from sexual trauma. And that completely shifted her brand. So, yes, she still has her fitness framework, but she, her whole brand pivoted to work around that. This is what she does now, because I had that vision of her. Right. This is why when you say people think, you know, if they're like, but my story is boring, I'm like, no, probably not. Probably not to me or to you, because we can see it. So it is so important to that, because now she shifted, and it was immediately aligned. People started, you know, joining her membership almost immediately because she shifted it to, yes, fitness. But that was now secondary to this recovery and this empowerment for women. And it was very niched.

Right.

That was super niche for the brand storytelling there. But it was so amazing to see the shift and see her be willing to step into it because again, and as you and I have talked, our friend Brandon has given us both mutual shifts from things that we couldn't see. And I recently had that this summer where he came to me and I said, I did not even see that. So it is so important to hire a coach or somebody who can see you differently because it can totally shift your whole business.

Yes, for sure. And also, too, I'll leave you this last question, and then we'll tell my audience, or they can find more about you. Is, you know, for a lot of overthinkers, because I used to be an overthinker, I'm now recovering. Yeah. So I'm sure that we have a lot of people in my audience that are like, I gotta do it.

Right.

What's the first step? Like, what would you say to my overthinkers that maybe just need kind of like a baseline in terms of, like, these are some of the targets that you can be going after when you're telling a story?

Yeah, I think that's a great question. And it's so important to not overthink, because, as you know, with messaging and influence and persuasion, there's really no way to get it wrong. You just get better.

Right.

So I would say to keep that in mind, like, write that on your forehead, put it on a sticky note, get a tattoo, whatever you need. There's no, like, you just. You'll just learn and do it better. So I think keeping the key story ingredients in mind, which we started with, is really helpful. So who's your main character? Is that you? Is it a client? Who is. Or what is your obstacle or challenge? What's the conflict?

Right?

There has to be a conflict in any story. What is the main character? What's the hero dealing with that's causing a problem?

Right?

And then you have to keep in mind your inciting incidents. Like, you know, maybe the inciting incident was my family did an intervention and I realized I had to go to recovery for my addiction or I ended up, you know, missing more days of work than I should, and I got fired from my job and realized I had to go to, you know, this, this, you know, recovery for. So things like that, like what happens that helps you resolve the conflict and then where are you at now? So keeping those ingredients in mind is helpful. And then also just know that you're trying to connect emotionally. So use emotional language. Be emotional if you can. We also don't want to verbally vomit, right? Like, brand storytelling is not the same as, like, going out for wine with your girlfriends and talking about your ex. That's not what we do. But there's a way to tell that story about your ex and share that if you want to, for your business. That will be really impactful for other people in those same situations, so they know what's possible. So keep in mind emotion, but not verbal vomit. It's one of my favorite things to say. And then. I'm sorry.

No, I was just say there needs to be a lesson.

Yeah, there needs to be a lesson. And we cannot talk down about other people. We never want to come from a place of victimhood.

Oh, yeah, about that. Yeah, go.

If there's any place of victimhood, people sense that energy. And you and I know. You know, again, when people are connecting with you, they don't buy based on logic. They buy based on emotion and a sense and a feel of you or what you can do for them. And so if you have any sense of victimhood, it's just not a good place to work from. And so we want to work from a place of empowerment. So sometimes that means we don't tell stories yet. If clients are still in the middle of, say, a messy divorce, maybe you wait until you're on the other side. Or if you're in the middle of it and you feel like you can talk about it in an empowered way where you're not trash talking anybody. Then share raw real. Right now, this is what's happening today.

Right?

Like, that can be powerful too. And there's actually currently, right now, there's a really famous transformational coaching couple author that's navigating a very public divorce. And the husband is actually on Instagram stories most days talking about what he's dealing with. There's no victimhood about the now ex wife.

Right.

Like, he's talking about finding peace on his runs and he's talking about finding peace with his children.

Right.

So there's no right or wrong way. Like a lot of people ask me, you know, should I wait to tell a very traumatic story till after it's over? You can, but you don't have to. And so there's examples of that going on all the time. But yeah, keeping your. So in answer to your question, so keeping your, your story ingredients in mind. No victimhood coming from a place of empowerment. And then keeping your different types of stories in mind are helpful too. Like origin and vision. Those are priority ones about where you're taking your client. What does the end story look like for them? Really feel into it too.

Right?

And then where, like, how did you become who you are? Think your superhero origin story. Don't get caught up if it's boring or not. It's not your business. And then, you know, keep in mind as you're going through that, I go, oh, this is a great, detailed look at why I have this brand value, brand story. Or oh, this is a really funny, embarrassing, sad example of a personal story. Not totally vision story, powerful, like not that little, but it's still really good. That's a. So, you know, that would be one of your signature stories. So keeping that is helpful too for kind of a framework. But there's, there's not. Like, usually my issue is we get so many stories out, we have to try to organize them so they can use them. Because there's so many good stories. People have so many good stories when you kind of like look up under the hood. And so I'm really passionate about making sure we're tracking all of them and you can use them, you know, whenever you want going forward. Too much content. Better than not enough.

Oh, I love that. It's so good. So thank you so much for your time. This has been super helpful. I'm like, so excited and I'm like, okay, I need to go work on my origin story. So I'm super.

Yes, you do. Yes, you do. Thank you for having me. This is such a joy to come on and chat with you. I mean, we're friends, so it's, it's a treat, but it's, it's really special to get to talk to anybody or inspire anybody who might be thinking about telling stories and stepping into it more. So thank you.

So where can we find you? Can you tell us a little bit? Where's the best place to hang out with you?

The best place to hang with me would be Instagram. So I'm isskatiesoy. And then you can always check out my website, which is katiesoy.com you can leave me a note. There's a place to contact me there. You can also reach out to my Instagram and that's usually quicker. But I, I would love to hear from anybody who has questions. And yeah, it's just always exciting to watch people step into the power of who they really are. And I think that's one thing that business storytelling really, really, really helps showcase.

It's exciting. Okay, great. So I'll of course link all that up in the show notes. So thanks so much, Katie.

Bye.

Thanks, Beverly.

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