Pregnancy, Postpartum, and Pilates with Alison B. Marsh

You're listening to the PT Profit podcast, episode number 84. Today we're discussing all things pregnancy, postpartum and Pilates with Allison Marsh. Are you ready? Let's get started.

Hi, I'm Beverly Simpson, former fitness manager turned online personal training business owner. And this podcast is where smart fitness professionals, including trainers and clinicians, discover how to increase client performance and movement, package and position their product and services and get out of their own way so that they can increase their revenue to live a life that they love without sleazy sales. Welcome to the PT Profit Podcast.

What's up, coach? Thank you so much for pushing play on another episode of the PT Profit Podcast. I'm your host, Beverly Simpson, and today I'm bringing you another incredible episode from Pilates expert Allison Marsh. So she is a national certified Pilates teacher and is the founder of Pregnancy Pilates Impact. She's been teaching Pilates since 2002 and dedicated her career to educating and supporting other Pilates teachers in developing the confidence and competence to teach and positively impact the pregnant and postpartum, or what she calls the perinatal. And I shouldn't say it's not what she calls. It's a word that she does teach us all about inside of the podcast, which honestly was very insightful for me and which is something that I am now going to be using moving forward. But she talks all about that inside of this episode. So she believes that her students are making a world changing contribution through offering sessions that go beyond the movement, recognizing the emotional needs of perinatal clients, and attention to thoughts, language and demeanor. And you will be blown away inside of this episode when you stay till the end because she talks a lot about why and how she's able to do that. So without further ado, let's go ahead and roll that interview. Alison, thank you so much for joining me on this show today. How are you?

I'm awesome. How are you?

I'm doing great. Thank you so much for asking. I'm super pumped to have you here. So let's just go ahead and dive in. For those of you who don't know who Allison is, can you please share a little bit about who you are, who you serve and how you got there?

Okay, so I teach Pilates and I specialize in pre and postnatal, also called perinatal. And basically I got into Pilates because I was a dance major in college and I was also a social work major, so I was doing double majoring and in. In the dance program. I'm in Las Vegas, Nevada. So it was unlv, University of Nevada, Las Vegas. In the dance program, they require you to take Pilates. And I fell in love with what it did for my body. And then, of course, you know, as a dancer, it's the perfect kind of exercise for dancers because you're moving from your core, which is. Which is funny because in Joseph Pilates work, and those of you that aren't familiar with Pilates, Pilates is the last name of the man who invented it, which is Joseph Pilates, who had zero medical background, athletic background. It was something he came up with intuitively. Anyway, he never mentions the word core, which is interesting, and that Pilates has become like a core thing. Right. Anyway, so, okay, so Pilates, dance and social work. I was studying to be a social worker at the same time, and I had to witness taking children away from their family in my practicum. Okay. I was working with abused and neglected kids, and I had to witness that twice. And I was traumatized for life. And I was like, how could I be a social worker if I can't even handle the practicum? So that's kind of how I became a Pilates instructor instead.

So what drew you to social work? I mean, that's such an interesting combination of work and dancing.

Yes. Yes, it is. So basically, I had a. I guess you can say troubled boyfriend in high school who is. Who is a drug addict actually, and he's actually since passed because of it. But I. I would go with him on these. At the time, I didn't know, but on these drug runs and I saw children in these homes that were. I mean, it was horrifying, dirty, you know, diapers filled. I mean, the whole thing, you can even imagine. And at that point, I was like, I need to save these kids. Yeah, that's what got me into it. And then, of course, you know, having the boyfriend as the addict and watching that all unravel really drew me to helping children in general because he, you know, he was a teenager. Like, he. He was one of those kids that came out of the ADHD time where they used to give him Ritalin, and he got addicted to that, and then it went into speed, and it's the whole thing. So that drew me to really helping, wanting to help other people, not only parents, but obviously the children as well.

Oh, my gosh. That's powerful. That's a powerful story. No idea. My gosh, how moving. Okay, so then. And I'm with you, honestly, with that, I could not be. I could not like, my Hat is off to the people who do that work. Because if I would be like you and like, I can't take it, I mean, I watch Minority Report on tv, bawl my eyes out. So I couldn't handle it, but. Okay, so now you become a Pilates instructor. Love it. Okay, so then we get to. How did we get to teaching other instructors?

Okay, so I was teaching for about five to ten years. I was certified in 2002 through DK Body Balancing, and Dolly Calipas is the mentor. And I was also trying to get pregnant. About five years in, I was trying to get pregnant, and my mentor knew that I was trying to get pregnant, and she wanted me, so she asked me to develop a pre and postnatal certification program for her to kind of piggyback off of her comprehensive Pilates certification. Because I was doing all of the research, I was taking as many courses as I could, and there wasn't a lot out there at the time. This is about 2008. The only primary person out there was Carolyn Anthony, who's kind of the pioneer in pregnancy. Pilates and Women's Health center for Women's Fitness. So doing all the studying, trying to get pregnant. Still not getting pregnant, but developed this curriculum for her. Started teaching in person trainings just on the West Coast. We did a few in California, Arizona, and then the studios here in Las Vegas. And in 2012, between 2012 to 2014, that was kind of the tipping point of I'm still not pregnant. In the meantime, we adopted two kids. And that was kind of my. That was kind of my social work, like, contribution. Right. I was working with these kids. Yeah. So. So we adopted two kids. And I said, speaking of kids. Right.

So mine is home right now. So that's why I'm like. I knew in between, just in the off, off case, like, who knows what she's going to do? Love it. But I knew it. Every time we have these urges, they always seem to come. They always show up again, so.

Exactly.

Always show up again. And I love that. I love that. Okay, so congratulations, by the way. I know people that have gone through that process. It is not easy. So we've got our two babies. Great.

Yes, we have our two babies. They are from the foster care system. It was very hard. But they're. They're both just can. They're both considered special needs because they were drug and alcohol exposed at birth. Well, in utero. But let me tell you, like, they're amazing kids. They're 14 and 10 now, and you don't Know, like, you would never know that anything happened to them. And by the way, my son is here too as well. He's in the room. He knows. He's. He's doing his thing. He's six. Our kids are pretty close. Mine. Mine will be six in July. How old is yours? Yeah.

So Gwenny turns. She turns six. She's five, but she turned six in October. And Abigail, she just turned four in June.

Wow. Okay. So you have little.

They're 20 months apart.

Awesome. Okay. That's so cool. That's so cool. And just for you, like, I'm. Obviously, we'll get into this, but super, like, love moms, obviously. I mean, I think that moms are. Who is going to change the world because you're raising the next generation. The next generation. Exactly. So. So, yeah. So, so basically we adopted these kids. Still wasn't getting pregnant. I was at the point where I felt like I could not teach pre and postnatal, especially to teachers, if I was not going to have the experience. Now I know that. Interesting. Yes. Because obviously you look at like a male obgyn, right?

Like, yes, exactly. Or I always use, you know, Ste.

Spielberg.

There's a reason why he's the director and not the actor.

So 2014, I go to my mentor who I created the program for the. The pre and postnatal certification, and I said, I can't do this anymore. I'm not getting pregnant. I really. It was an emotional thing for me, too. I was at the point where when I was teaching clients who were pregnant, I was getting teary. Like, I couldn't. I wanted it so much. Yeah. That I just. I couldn't do it anymore. And I mean, I literally took all of my books, everything to unlv. I gave them all to her in her office. I was like, I can't do this. And it sat, like, everything sat for like three months. And I'm like, really? Who's going to do, like, am I really expecting someone to just pick this up and just start doing something with it again? So September. No, actually it was October 2014. I said a prayer at the time. I was going through a, like a Christian walk and really into the Bible and studying. And just a little side note, I am. I was. I had a, like, I would say, problem drinking issue for a lot of my life. And 2010, I, like, gave all that up. I stopped drinking and. And so I said a prayer. I said, God, if you want me to do this pre and postnatal program, like, if you want me to continue to teach pre and postnatal women or client pre. If you want me to teach pre and postnatal women and teach teachers, I want to be pregnant. I want to have this experience. I was pregnant the next month within, like, 14 days after eight years of unexplained infertility. So fast forward to today. That's why I'm doing what I'm doing.

That's amazing. What a powerful story. Okay, so then, congratulations. So now we've got. You're a mom of three, and we have two.

I have two older stepdaughters that are in their early twenties.

Amazing.

So five. Five total.

Big family. I love it. I'm from a family of. There's five. My husband comes from a family of five, and there's a family of three. I'm a family of three.

So cool.

Okay, so now fast forward to where you are now, and that's really essentially how you started. Are you still teaching Pilates and teaching and teaching coaches?

I am, yeah. I have my studio here in my home now. And just out of, like, people find out that I'm doing this, and I have the equipment, and they'll reach out to me, and so I will still work with women, which I think is really important that I still do that anyway. I mean, I love doing it, you know, from a business standpoint, it's more about experience for me, and just have it continuing to work personally with women so that I can share with teachers, you know, those experiences as well. I agree.

I think that's really important. I mean, for me, you know, I want. With a coach who's also in the trenches, maybe not even barely doing the same thing as I am, but, like, can, you know, at least network or sharpen the saw? Which is why it's really important to me. I'm a huge believer in coaches needing coaches because you're always in momentum, and you're either going backwards or forwards.

Right. I like that.

So it's like. So I love that. Being in the trenches is important, too. I agree. So I'd love to hear just a little bit about, like, Pilates we hear about in a very general term, like, there. I feel like there's a lot of specific specifics inside of Pilates. Like, you've got Pilates reformer, Pilates mat, which are. I mean, what is it? What is your special? I know you said pre postnatal, but is that pre postnatal, Matt and.

Okay, yes.

And can you tell us a little bit about what perinatal is?

Yes. Okay. So perinatal is usually a medically used term, but I like it because I don't have to say in all of my marketing, pregnancy and postnatal, it's just perinatal. So that's. So I'm trying to get the education out there of what it means. And basically it's the full year of pregnancy and then one year postpartum. Now I never heard that term.

Wish I'd heard it. Thank you for introducing it to me.

Well, that's. Yeah. And isn't that. Yeah. Like we actually had somebody in our last emails respond to my woman. I was working with another teacher and said, can you please spell. Spell the word correctly? They thought that we were trying to spell prenatal, I guess. And so that shows where the misunderstanding or the need for the education in the word comes from. So, yes, it's Perry. P E R I P E R I Natal, N A T A L. You will, if you look it up in the dictionary sometimes you'll see it meaning only like the first, like three months postpartum. So prenatal. Prenatal and then the first three months postpartum. But I have a mentor, Dr. Sinead Dufour, who gave me the definition of the. The full year. So I'm trying to get that education out there that, that's what it is. And it's, It's, I believe, vital for teachers to understand that whole period to be able to help women or clients.

I agreed. And I feel like that, that, you know, and I want to, you know, we'll get into this too. In my opinion, you know, in your opinion in terms of, like, people have some. So many different beliefs about what postnatal is and how long that period is, and they. We get these arbitrary weeks of when we're supposed to do what by. And the truth is that it's just not. It's not linear for every single person.

Yeah, exactly, exactly. So, so real quick, let's talk about Pilates first because I think that's really important to know the differences between that and like your regular yoga, for example. Totally different. And a lot of people like to put that in the same boat, right? Yoga, Pilates, totally different. Pilates, as I said before, is the last name of the man who created it, Joseph Pilates. And an interesting fact I found out about him. I love history, learning history on Pilates. And a biography that I read about him said that his inspiration, he got his inspiration from a woman from a woman named Bess Messengdijk. She was a doctor and her. This is in the early 1900s, she wrote a book for women, for postpartum women who were in the workforce. This is where he got his inspiration from. A lot of people don't know that. That, of course, to me is like, amazing, right? Like Joseph Pilates, what. What he created is, I believe, the best form of exercise in a modified form for pre and postnatal. And now I know why. I mean, that was a lot of his influence. So that's kind of the history with Pilates. Now, as far as what I. I do, I teach both Matt and the equipment. And right now I'm working on a project with the 34 exercises. So he has a book. I know you can't see. I mean, I know your listeners can't see, but I'll show you real quick. Return to Life is the name of the book. In this book, he talks about or shows the 34 MAT exercises of Pilates. A lot of them have been really, have become popular. Like the hundred, I think, is kind of popular. So. Right. So. So Anyway, there's these 34 exercises. And if you were to do them the way that Joseph Pilates shows in the book, they are all contraindicated for pre and postnatal. And here's the thing with teaching postnatal, it's actually very simple if you can keep a few things in mind. And I think that with. With all of the education out there, it's easy to get confused and make it really complicated. What you said that it's not linear and that everybody's different.

Oh, yeah.

Like everybody is different.

There could be.

I mean, okay, for example, I have a brand new mover client who has never done Pilates. Never worked out. She. She walked. She has been walking. That's what she does. She's a young mom. But her journey in Pilates and she's postpartum, early postpartum is super beginning. Okay. We are starting at the very basic fundamentals of which we. We call pre Pilates, which is breathing, getting what we call lateral thoracic breathing, getting the rib cage moving, the back and the sides of the rib cage mobile. And then I have a postpartum mom. They're. They're about the same, like four months postpartum. Her goal, I'm in Las Vegas, as you know. Her goal. She's a Cirque performer. Cirque du Soleil performer. She does aerial work. Her goal is to get back in the show in July. Now, from. Right. So from. From the perspective, if you know anything about postpartum, first of all, research shows that even in athletes, women at 6 months postpartum have 50% of their pre pregnancy abdominal strength back at 6 months postpartum. And that's whether. I think it's less when there's a C section but with a vaginal. And this is why women get frustrated, right? They feel good, they want to jump back into their regular stuff. But the healing process is vital that year. Postpartum is vital. And I think a lot of, a lot of teachers that I've talked to are concerned about hurting mom or baby. They're more concerned about the prenatal time. And I'll tell you, like it's actually that postpartum time that women have the hardest time because it's, it's a patience, it's that it's, it's a patient, it's developing the patients to realize that the body just did this miraculous thing. First of all, let's just focus on that. The fact the body can create a human being, that is the most miraculous thing. I'm sure people that have gone through infertility can probably relate to that more than people who. It was very easy to get pregnant and it took nine months to do that. First of all, that's miraculous in just nine months, but that's still nine months. So when the doctor, I think doctors are getting better at this obgyn, but when OB GYN says lays mom on her back look, does her check her six week check and says, oh you're good. C section scar is healed or C section is healed or you know, the vaginal birth, you're healed, it looks good and you can go back to doing what you're doing before you got pregnant. This, I think they're getting better at this. But this used to be, I mean not that long ago.

The, it's, you know, I always talk about this. My daughter is 2015 was when she was born, right. And my doctor came in before she even did an internal. She's like, you're good, you can come back and do blah blah blah blah, do all jumping, blah blah blah. And I look back on it now and I'm like, that was six years ago. That was not that long ago, right?

No, yeah, it's.

They forgetting.

Say that again.

And that was still advice that we were getting. I didn't even know that I should go to a pelvic floor physical therapist. Like that wasn't even ever talked about. I remember mentioning it to my mother in law and she was like, oh no, you don't have to do that.

Yeah, it's so, yeah, that's what. And that's one of the biggest frustrations is that this is. This is what it comes down to is OB GYNs have a job to. To focus on. What this is kind of how I've figured it out, is the organs. They are experts in your organs. They help to make sure that you have a healthy baby. Okay. But they are not physical therapists. They don't understand that part of it. And let me. And so, okay, so here's something else. So you lay. So you lay the pregnant, or let's say the postpartum woman, six weeks postpartum on the table. How do you know if someone. You can't say that someone doesn't have prolapse. If you're laying them on the table, they have to stand up and be able to, you know, I mean, like, it's. So that's where a lot of the myths is. And women, we want to trust our doctors. How it's. It's really difficult when you're trying to trust this person who you've. You've. Who has birthed your baby and they're telling you that you can go back and do these things. And then if you find. Are lucky enough to find a really good coach or pt that will inform you of what really is going on with your body in the healing process. From a myofascial point of view, myofascia is muscles and fascia. That's the other thing can we talk about real quick is how in anatomy we have been gravely misled on how the body works. I mean, right. We are. We were taught. We have this muscle here and this muscle here, and this muscle does this and this muscle does that. And the pelvic floor is a perfect example that it's this muscle by itself. We are totally connected. Our body doesn't understand, doesn't know that it's this muscle and that muscle. And it's highly valuable to learn that. It's also highly important that, again, this is what Pilates teaches and why I think it's one of the greatest forms. The whole body works together always. Your pelvic floor doesn't know that. Maybe you shouldn't be doing Kegels or you should be doing Kegels. Your pelvic floor with that. Also, let's talk about thoughts and the. The neuro part of all of this. Again, I know Pilates is known for mind body, right? Like, that's kind of a big. A big way that people describe it.

It's a theme. It's their theme.

Yes.

Values and mission statement.

Yeah, it's a mind body connection. It totally is a mind body connection because of what you're with what you're thinking, Will. And this was just confirmed. So one of my mentors is Dr. Sarah Duvall. Do you know her? She's Core Exercise Solutions.

You know her?

Yes. Yeah, she's awesome. So she's one of my primary mentors. And the reason I like her work is because it really does parallel Pilates a lot. Even though she didn't know it, she.

It does.

It's beautiful. Anyway, she. She says that a lot of the women she works with that have prolapse, that 80% of them will tell her that their symptoms are more a cause of their stress and the way that they're thinking about it. And when they relax and they stop worrying about it and they just do what they need to do, it is 10 times better. So one of the things that I do with pregnancy, Pilates Impact, which is the education platform that I run, is the first thing we talk about is the teachers confidence in themselves only because with the countless conversations I've had with Pilates teachers, the number one theme that keeps coming up over and over again of why they're not working with this population or what scares them about working with this population is their overall lack of confidence. So with that, one of the things I do is I highly recommend teachers get in there and start teach if it's a friend, if it's a family member, anyone who's pregnant or postpartum, and get the tools that they need, the basics, right? And you have to get in there and just start teaching. That's how you learn, just like anything else. Right? So the. So let's. I know I kind of like veered off to another place here.

It was fine, you know, it was good. What this. This conversation does bring up for me is a couple of things. Right? So I'm curious, you know, as someone who teaches Pilates instructors, I'm someone who really has worked with a lot of strength and conditioning personal trainers. So I'm curious what are some of. In physical therapists? And I've gotten the pleasure of working with a lot of, like, pelvic floor physical therapists as well. And so we were talking about why there's this gap between, you know, for moms and for professionals, but in the professional world, I also noticed that there's a gap between, you know, personal training, like misconceptions, between, you know, strength and conditioning and Pilates. Because earlier when you were Talking. You said that Pilates gets lumped with yoga, but it's very different. So I would love for you to share a little bit about some of the common misconceptions that you see from people that you know before they go through your training. Like, so for me, I'm curious, you know, what is the blend of fitness professionals and more of a gender sense versus people who come to you who are already Pilates instructors? Like, do you get a lot of people that come in that maybe they've never taught Pilates before, but they've got a lot of pregnant and postpartum clients, and they're like, what should I do? So I'd love for you to expand a little bit on two things, because one thing, expand a little bit on the common misconceptions that people have about Pilates in general. And then the second thing you said, which I'd love for you to expand on, is that you think it's one of the best exercises that. That perinatal people can do. And so I'd love for you to expand a little bit on what. What causes you to say that.

Okay. Okay. So misconceptions. So that. I think the number one is that pre and postnatal women are fragile. I hear that a lot. And people. I mean, teachers, will not work with them. I've heard stories where women are turned away from studios.

I'm laughing because I think I'm so grateful that the human body is as resilient as it is, because, oh, my gosh, the things I used to do before I knew better. Oh, thank you, moms, for hanging in there with me.

Okay, so what did you use? Like, what are some things? Let's talk about this, for example.

Like, you know, and we talked about it a little bit earlier, but it was like, before I went through the process myself, and I just believed in that age old, like, oh, you could get back to doing whatever it is that you were doing. Right. And navigating the. You know, navigating. And you and I have talked off camera about this, but one of my friends, you know, Brianna Battles, and I did her certification, is navigating that athletic mindset between, you know, what can you do versus, you know, is it. It's not a matter of can, is it? It's a matter of should. Like, is this the best? You know, and. And navigating that athletic brain and pushing past thresholds that you might not necessarily need to. But as an athlete, and I use that word as someone. Anyone who has been active for any amount of Time. We're used to pushing boundaries and used to pushing thresholds. And so there. There is a nuanced conversation, in my opinion, between can you?

Should you? So are you? So my first question to you then is, are you. Have you had any adverse effects from the things that you felt like you were doing that were.

No, I didn't. Which is why I said. Which is what caused me to say, like, oh, thanks, thing. Thank God that we are resilient, because I think I have. You know, there are things that I potentially did and did with my clients that, looking back now that I know better, I probably would have done that differently. Like, I remember once I gave advice to someone like, yeah, of course you can do planks. You're six weeks postpartum. Go right ahead. Not navigating that.

And sure.

Are there people that can. Yes, absolutely. But there are things that to navigate first. It's not exercise I'm gonna do. I'm gonna check in with breathing and positioning now. But I didn't know that back then, of course. Right wing, you know, So I was just going, you know, we only know. And this is. This is true for everyone always, 100% of the time is that we only know. Like, we don't know what we don't know. And you're just gonna get better as you continue to grow. So it's. And just like you said, I'm a huge advocate of, like, getting in there and learning and then just of kind continuing to sharpen the saw. If I had just stopped where I was then we'd probably be having a very different conversation. But I knew there was a gap for mom, so I just kept learning and getting better and then going, looking back and being like, thank goodness we're resilient.

Right? You know? Okay. And with that said, I want to point a few things out about being resilient. First of all, how old are you? I'm 38. On.

Wait, how old am I?

Okay.

I'm 38 on Friday.

Okay. Oh, well, happy early birthday. That's awesome.

A week from Friday, actually.

Oh, okay. Okay. So I have. What? Okay, awesome. Well, I'll have to tell you happy birthday. So, yeah, so there's a few things of being resilient. One of them is definitely eight. Okay. It's just a fact that our collagen breaks down as we age. So the older we get just, like, with our skin, you know that. I mean, that's why you have a lot of women getting hysterectomies, things like that, because stuff falls the Organs fall and I have to tell you something about a hysterectomy. Let me just write a note real quick in a moment. So I don't get off track here. Okay. But it's also hereditary. GR genes are, I mean as far as who's going to get stretch marks, who is going to have a abdominal separation that doesn't heal, who is going to have prolapse. A lot of it is hereditary. However, there's consider. Yeah, I hadn't. Yeah, that's definitely yes. And then you have obviously the side of yes. There's a lot you can do to help that I teach from a myofascial perspective. Again, like the whole body that. I love that word, using that word resilient. Because that really is. If we train our body the right way and treat it the right way and pushing it is not the right way that the body actually starts to break down when you push it too far. You can counteract to a certain point your genetics. So yeah, it's just like anything heart issues, the skin and the way that you heal is going to be that way as well. So. Yeah. So the misconceptions of like you said planks. Yeah. At six weeks postpartum, generally. No, that wouldn't be something you give somebody. But nobody would know. I mean, let me tell you something. And here's this is what you know, what you don't know. Okay. I, There, there was a. I'm thinking of it right now, like many years ago I signed up for like a free newsletter or something. It for pre and postnatal Pilates, I think it was. Anyway, the very first email I got was about diastasis recti. And guess what the very first exercise was. They said they should be doing plank. A plank. So here's the thing is we can't. It's so hard to say yes, women should or shouldn't be doing this, but because some women can. I mean it totally depends on how they are progressing, but generally there are. And I think that's where women like teachers, they love to have like that safety point of like what do I do, what don't I do? And I tried. And a lot of teachers who teach other like educators won't do that because they understand the variable of, of the ability out there. And so they don't like to say do this, do that. What I like to do is give especially beginning teachers that are, that are not familiar with this population. I do like to give them specifics. Here, do this. This is what's going to keep Both of them safe. From there, as you're learning, then you can start to get into, you know, more of the specifics. But there are those general things. I'm going to tell you that the number one thing is managing intra abdominal pressure. If, if you can learn how to do that as a trainer, you, you're, you're, you know, that's going to be like your safety, managing intra abdominal pressure and then your demeanor, the way that you communicate with your clients. I'm huge on that and I really want to make sure that that point is pointed, that I'm pointing that out very seriously here because the way that teachers think about their clients, talk about their clients when they're not there, will affect them. And I'm, and I'm saying this because I've seen in Pilates forums, like Facebook type things I have seen. There was a post, a specific post many years ago where a teacher had, had said for other teachers, what is the most annoying thing that your client does? Oh, and it, and it's meant to be a safe space so people can talk. But out of her just. And here's the thing, it's like I'm, I'm never about shaming anyone because you, like you said, you only know what you, you don't know. And as Brene Brown, I'm big, big Brene Brown. Shaming doesn't work. I think it's more about educating. But anyway, that post blew up. There were like over 100 comments. And that, I mean just reading it, it just like I'm getting chills right now. Like they don't, just because they don't. They didn't understand how that the complaining and that those negative, that negativity feeding on it will adversely affect their clients progress. And with pre and postnatal women, it's 10 times more. And this is proven research has shown that especially prenatal, late prenatal women can tell they did a research like with doctors or something that the demeanor of the doctor, how that doctor was seeing them, just by their facial expression. Yeah, it's huge.

So I'm really glad that you bring that up because as we start talking about these types of misconceptions, you know, I think it's really important too. And I do always like to say this because it always seems like two things. It always seems like I'm criticizing my doctor when I mentioned that, you know, we didn't even do an internal exam, but we didn't. But the reason why I think it's important is to remember that A three things is that a, your doctor is human and two, we have to also remember, and I tell my clients this all the time, like evidence or experience can be a double edged sword. Like these OB GYNs have seen hundreds upon hundreds upon hundreds of patients and they're human. So that, you know, we, that we go in with experience and evidence and, and we have to remember to press that reset button, that this is a first time mom potentially and they have as many cases as you have. Right. And I think that that is a skill that not everyone has or that we have to remember it.

Right.

And you know, the third thing too is that in relationship to that is that, you know, she's using her years of evidence and experience, experience of working with people. And she knows me, she knows that I was a trainer and so she might have assumed that I knew better when not everyone knows better.

Right? Yeah, yeah, I, yeah, I mean definitely, like for sure, like definitely not knocking OBGYN. It's like, obviously we need OB GYNs, they're just not PTs. I think that's the difference. Right. They're not trained in the body, they're trained in organs. That's kind of how I've deciphered it. And where was I going with that? Oh, with that said, I think that all trainers and OB GYNs should be having their clients. Well, trainers, I guess we're talking mainly trainers. Definitely have your postpartum clients see a pelvic floor pt. If you're not one, see one because it will open up a window of what is going on before you start working with them. We talked about intra abdominal pressure. It is pressure. The using the pressure the wrong way that causes prolapse and that causes a diastasis not to heal. Okay. And if you can teach your clients to manage that pressure not only in the studio, but ten times more outside of the studio. Because that's where the debt, you know, that's where the damage is happening mainly. Let me tell you, like, you are not, you're not going to do anything that's going to permanently affect your clients. I don't want to say it permanent. Nothing's permanent. You're not going to do anything. As long as you're working in moderation, you in the studio are not going to cause any major adverse effects. It's what mom's doing outside of the studio. Lifting heavy things the wrong way. Getting up out of bed every morning and pushing, pushing the pressure out on the linea Alba doing that over and over. And those are the Things that are going to cause these. So. So I'm really big on teaching moms, and obviously in my case through Pilates, how to manage that pressure. So not only in the studio so that they can have the strong abs that they want and language there, but helping moms, you know, they want that flat stomach and Pilates is going to help them get there. But focusing more on the function of what their body is doing. That's research based by the way, that if you use function focused language over like appearance focused language, women are 10 times more feel confident. What were some other words that they used? Just happy. They felt obviously strong. Where on the other hand, if you're using language like blast that cellulite or get that body back, women actually felt actually much less encouraged, depressed. These are the kinds of words they use. So a little side note there.

Well, that's my, the impact and power of language. Like I just love and obsessed with that. So it's that, that's a powerful, that's a powerful piece of, you know, info you just shared with us. So I'm curious, you know what, you said this earlier, so I'd love for you to expand a little bit more on it. And then I swear I want to be mindful of your time. So this will be my last question. But you know, you said that, you know, Pilates is the best and so I'd love for you to just share a little bit about what causes you to say that.

Okay. So first of all, Pilates was developed. A lot of the exercises start on the back. And Joseph Pilates reasoning for this was.

That.

Is a way for the organs to rest. It's, it's a, it puts them in a position of obviously different than usually where we're upright. Right. So that's why he starts.

Okay, Just quick interjection though. Like moms aren't supposed to be on their back when they're pregnant.

Right.

Is that a misconception?

Okay. Yes. I'm so glad that you brought this up. Yes. So it's not a misconception because sometimes that's how it is. But so yeah, let's talk about that real quick. So prenatal. Okay. Yes. There's, everybody knows by now, right, that there's a fear of having mom on her back for too long. So the reason why, and I wouldn't even say it's a misconception, it's because it's going to depend on the mom. So you put mom on her back, flat on her back. Okay. If she starts to feel dizzy out, like short of breath. That's when you know you're going to want to tip her up. Okay. And you can use wedges. You can, you know, what we used to use is a deflated, like half deflated exercise ball, big exercise ball. That worked for us.

So what, what's causing, like the weight of. What's happening with the weight of the baby. What's causing mom to feel dizzy?

Okay, so what happens is the weight of the baby presses on many veins, but the main, the main one is. And the main one is the vena cava. It's called the vena cava. So you might see vena cava syndrome is what they call it. That pressure is reducing the amount of blood that's running. And I believe it's the up direction. So that's what's happening. You're basically cutting off circulation. Okay. Okay. So. But again, mom will know. And usually if, if she's uncomfortable on her back and you boost her up, she's great. And obviously there's, you know, different ways to work around that, to do different things. But if she's okay on her back, if she feels okay, as long as she's moving. Okay, moving the leg, like let's say on the reformer, moving the legs, she usually, she's okay because the blood is running. If she feels okay and she's moving, you're good. Here's a, here's a rule of thumb. Don't keep her on her back longer than about five minutes. So kind of move it around, you know, like five minutes. Do. If you're going to do reformer legs and then put her on her side or stand her up. That's probably the best piece of advice as far as prenatal is keep her moving in different positions. It's really important. Especially Pilates instructors. It's really important to have to end standing with a strong, even like some weights at the end so that she's getting all those different positions. Squatting, teaching her the basics. Squatting. I also do gentle hanging. Okay. Katie Bowman is one of my inspirations and she teaches hanging from a door jamb. You just put your fingers on the very top. You just gently bend your knees. You're not taking your feet off, let's be clear. So you're not actually like. But you're allowing. That's part of that. Managing that intra abdominal abdominal pressure. You're allowing the space between the rib cage in that torso and you're giving more room basically for, for the baby, for the, for the womb to be able to Grow.

Or telling me, you know, we were talking about why you think Pilates. Why should be a Pilates?

So, okay, yeah. So managing interpreters. So one of the, one of the biggest movements or ways of teaching Pilates is cueing belly to spine. Okay, you'll hear that a lot. Or scooping. Okay. Belly to spine, scooping. Okay. When we say Pilates, when I say Pilates is the best. Let me clarify. Modified Pilates. It has to be modified. Here's one of the reasons a lot of, again, that belly to spine, saying belly to spine or scooping does not allow for movement. So when a mom is pregnant, I think there is a misconception, I think it's getting better. But that women can't work their abs or shouldn't work their abs. That is a misconception. They definitely should be working their abs. It's just a matter of how. So with the belly to spine idea, instead of saying belly to spine for pregnancy, I say hug the baby. Okay? So, and here's another very important thing. If teachers can start doing this, this is a big deal. Instead of that belly to spine cueing, starting from the lower abs. From the lower abs. So I usually say lower abs, middle abs, upper abs. She's hugging the baby in and up. So she's basically contracting her transverse abs, belly to spine. But she's bringing the baby there and she doesn't want to compress. So that's why I don't like the belly to spine idea. I like the hug idea because it's much more free. Okay. It allows for movement. So this is vital for moms because they are losing a lot of what their abdominals are able to do in pregnancy. They're losing that because it's expanding. So their back body, their lats, thor, columbar, fascia, glutes in particular are going to become their core. And when you teach this, hug the baby in and up to support, you're using the transverse primarily or does, does that action. But it. But as we know, everything's connected. And what that actually does is it helps to support the low back. And mom is able to move through her everyday life and Pilates exercises without that, the weight pulling her away. So that's the number one reason I believe Pilates is the best, because we do work from that core idea that everything starts from the core and, and moves its way out. And then another theory that I have is that when we're moving from the core, we're bringing the blood flow to that baby to the core, rather than like, let's say a free weight bicep curl, which there's. I mean, here's the thing. There is no wrong exercise like way of exercising. I think it's all good. I think it depends on the mom. For my clients, what I've seen and what I feel is that Pilates is gentle enough and yet it offers what moms need as far as taking them inside to recognize what's going on with their body, understanding what's going on with their body. I think client education is huge. And creating, helping moms to create autonomy, being able to be responsible for what's going on in their body and understanding and not having to rely on the coach or trainer for that. So that's going to be my number one reason why I think Pilates is the best form and just so good for moms.

Pilates is so good for moms if.

You have a good teacher who understands what's going on in that perinatal time. Yes. And if anything, again is. If you can be a welcoming, like inclusive, have an inclusive environment and have some of that moderation, you're gold. I mean that the way a mom just wants to feel good. Whatever you, it's like she doesn't know unless she's a Pilates teacher or something. You know, you can give her whatever you want to give her. Within these moderations, as long as you are, your demeanor is inviting, nonjudgmental, encouraging. I think that you are way ahead of the game.

I love that. I love that. Okay, so I do want to be mindful of your time. So for anyone who wants to, to learn more about your certification, wants to learn more about working with you, I'd love for you to share with us a little bit about, about your program and tell us where we can find you.

Sure, sure. So my website is Pregnancy Pilates Impact. I'm on Instagram a lot as well. Pregnancy Pilates impact there. And we focus on building your confidence, your competence in teaching, obviously. And then we have a contribution piece where we actually teach you how to market and get out. Get. Yeah, like reach the women who need you or the clients who need you. That's the other thing. Real quick, I want to, I want to point out as far as women and clients, I just read an article that non binary people are getting pregnant. Okay. So people that don't identify with the word woman or she. And I mean, I know maybe younger people can kind of catch on to this word and maybe the older generation, but it's something that I'm being more mindful of that, just knowing that that is a possibility that you will have a client that that maybe doesn't identify as a woman but is able to as pregnant. So yeah, pregnancy Pilates impact. And you go to my website and I've got all kinds of information there. And yeah, I'm just grateful to be here and help. And I'm, I mean that's my life's work, is to help Pilates teachers through this.

I love it. I love it. So we'll definitely make sure that we link all of that up in the show notes. And I just want say, to say thanks so much for hanging out with us today. I really appreciate it.

Thank you, Beverly. I'll talk to you soon.

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