From Zero To $16 Million in 3 Years... W/ Adam Hendle

I think this is the first time I've really said this out loud other than to my wife. You're playing almost Russian roulette. At a certain point you have this thing in your mind. At least I did. It was like once we exit this, everything is just like the clouds apart. And it's just like after that six month mark, it's like, okay, what am I going to do with the rest of my Life? I had $5,000 when I started the business. So we doubled sales every year, three and a half to eight to 16. I built a brand that I wanted to see in the world. That's what kept me going. You've got to make people feel one way or another, E, they hate you or they love you. If you can create that, that to me like drives feeling and like drives.

Purchase telltale signs that a brand is going to fail is.

I don't like talking about this because it feels like first world problems, like, like even worse than first world problems. Like what is the brand that's going to get me excited in a space that I feel like is not exciting?

I really like that question. That's a really good question.

I mean I've never dealt with anxiety in my, like, I just never.

I didn't before my exit either.

Isn't that weir?

I just like, I'm so glad you said that.

This episode might get, might get you canceled there. Hopefully not.

Hi everyone. Welcome to capitalism dot com. I'm Ryan Daniel Moran. Today I'm going to be sharing a case study with you with Adam Hendel. Adam started a company in 2017 called Ballsy. It's exactly what it sounds like. And Adam started this business while he was working a cozy, cushy corporate job and there was no demand for this product. So if you've followed any, I don't know, playbooks about how to build million dollar businesses, some of them will tell you to find out what other people are selling and sell it a little bit better than them. And Adam followed more of my playbook, which is you choose a person and you sell what you would like to give that person. What does that person want? What do you want to see exist? And the world? What does that person wish exists in the world? And Adam did that. It was literally a shower idea. And Adam tells the story in the podcast, but he had a $3.5 million first year and that was pure chaos. And then three years later he had an eight figure exit. Now that sounds great on paper, but there's a lot more details of that because Adam was working a full time job while he was doing this. Adam was a father while he was doing this. He had never had a successful business before. And so if you have any of that, like you're a parent wondering if you can do this or you're working full time wondering if you can do this, or you don't have a ton of capital and you're wondering if you can do this. This case study is going to show you an example of someone who was not in their early 20s when they started, wasn't rich when they started, didn't have a ton of free time when they started, and they had an eight figure exit in three years. And whenever you're ready to start your road to 1 million, come join us@capitalism.com 1. All right, let's go hang out with Adam. Hey Adam, thanks for coming over, man.

Hey, great to be here.

So you and I met as a result of you being in the capitalist pigs, but you shared with me that you didn't discover any of my work until after you had an eight figure exit, but that our stories are so similar, it's crazy. It's terrifying.

It really is.

So take me back. When did you start the brand and what were you doing beforehand?

Yeah, so I started ballsy in 2017. Ballsy, if you don't know, is a men's personal care product.

You can put two and two together.

Yeah, so. So before that I've been involved in a bunch of different startups, have a marketing background. So I bounced around from an e commerce startup which was like a Shopify meets Etsy kind of thing, to an influencer marketing platform which was bought by Google. So it was there for.

What was that?

It was called Fame bit. So this.

Oh yeah. Okay.

Yeah, so I was the first employee there and yeah, got to see a lot of. Did you get a pie that small piece?

Okay.

Not as much as you'd hope being the first person there, but I think.

You'Re the first employee. You must have done pretty well. Very, very small.

Small piece, but not as much as.

You got from building your own brand, that's for sure.

But what I got was a ton of experience and got to see a lot of YouTubers and how much influence they had. I actually used to have a YouTube channel like eight years ago unboxing men's T shirts. So I built this like crazy community. That's how I actually got my first E commerce job in San Francisco is I built this community around men's T shirts. Most odd thing ever. But I had you know, wait a minute. Yeah, we can unpack this. I just don't know how much time you want to spend on.

I don't want to. I didn't expect to go down here, but I. I. Did you monetize this channel with.

I did. So this was legitimately now, but you were an affiliate nine or nine or ten years ago. All I got was awesome men's T shirts. Okay, so, like.

Okay, so what brand do you stand by today that has the best men's T shirt?

I still. Well, as, like, graphic T shirt company. I still love Johnny Cupcakes. I don't have you ever come across history. He's on. His brand is unbelievable. He's got, like, a bakery in Boston that you go to, and, like, he takes, like, them out of the oven. Like, it's just the creativity around his brand. Okay. Unparalleled. And they've been around this entire time. There were so many different T shirts.

So. So you have it. So you have a digital marketing background. Right. And you have Swiss army knife and a bunch of different.

A bunch of different.

You do a little bit of influencer marketing. You do a little bit of YouTube videos. Like.

Yeah.

You understand the digital landscape, which is actually where I see people have probably the fastest success when they build a brand.

Sure.

Because they know all of these skill sets, and all of a sudden they're applying it to something real. Yep. And now they're not just making money. They're building something. They actually take off. So you started ballsy when?

2017. Okay, so ballsy was legitimately a shower moment idea about a shower product.

It's.

It was just like one of those.

Things are just everywhere.

It's too perfect. Right. So no, legitimately, it was like I was looking at all the different products and brands that my wife had, and, like, at this time, I had like a five in one, like, you know, Dove men's body wash kind of thing.

Yeah. It's like shampoo, conditioner, soap, a snack face wash. Yeah.

You know, like, whatever it takes. Like, we put it in this $3 bottle of, like, blue. Like. Like it again.

Which is so true. I used to do this joke in stand up. If you walk down the. The women's aisle.

Yeah.

You have shampoo for fine hair and thick hair and dirty hair and.

And it's unbelievable.

And it's like you have a whole line of shampoo just for women. For men, it's like five and one. Perfect. That's what I need.

My caveman needs are met. Done. You know, so like, that was kind of the moment is like, it literally went through my head, was like, well, as guys, we have body wash, we have face wash, why not ball wash? And I jumped out of the shower, Google ball Wash. And to my, you know, surprise and delight, no one had ever created a product called Ball Wash. So it was like this moment of either I'm a genius or this is the dumbest thing that's ever, you know, happened before. So, yeah, I almost went and said.

So you scratch your own itch. And I was like, I can't use that.

Yes. There's so many things I can't say.

No, but what. But essentially what you did here is I like when that happens. Yeah, like a lot of, A lot of brand builders, like, no one's ever done it before. So there's no proven concept. And I think, well, if you're, if you're talking to a person, you have a specific person that you're marketing to, then you just serve whatever needs they have, whether there's competition or not. And the more attention you give to what other people have done, then you're not building your brand anymore. You're just copying what has worked for somebody else, which has its place, but not for building a brand that you can sell.

Absolutely.

So. So you decide to.

So, yeah, right. Let's. Let's wash some balls. So, yeah, I started asking a bunch of friends what they thought. They thought I was an idiot, but I thought it was fun and I thought there could be something cool here. So aside from like the five in one body washes, I was just looking for better quality products at the time. But like in 2017, like, there wasn't a huge men's personal care space. Yeah, like, that has evolved like drastically over the last, you know, four or four years or so. So in the brands that were high quality in the space, they were just super lame. So I'm like, can we take a fun brand that tackles an area of a guy's body that's been overlooked with a high quality product?

Give me an example of what you were seeing. That was somebody who was doing it, but it was boring.

I don't want to name any brand like Manscaped.

They're kind of fun.

I think Manscape's done a great job.

Yeah.

But again, this is before Happy Nuts manscaped and us launched basically the same time. But there was no one in below the belt at that time. It was us and manscaped. That came out around the same time. And then Happy Nuts has gone up, but I'm talking about, like personal care brands that were like apothecary style. Like, oh, we have.

Oh, I see.

It's high end, but it's just like, it's lame and it's just like, I don't want to.

There's no personality to it.

Exactly.

Yeah. And it makes. I was. I was sharing with you before we recorded that. I'm just starting to get my itch back.

Yeah.

With sheer strength. Where we bought it late last year and like remembering. Oh, I can. This is how you do it.

Yeah.

I'm actually rereading my own book right now.

That's amazing.

Super arrogant and weird.

No, not at all.

As I go. Okay. All right. All right. This is. This is how I think about this. It's been a while and. And just this morning, one of my team members sent me the new draft of some of the copy that we were working on. And for one of our products, the headline that we're sort of playing with is, don't take this for you, take this for your family. Because our market is dads. And the mission of the company is to prevent fatherless homes. So you age well, you age gracefully, you live a long time. It's a longevity play. Right. So we love to talk about this idea of if fatherless homes blame the government or you blame society or blame the nuclear family or you blame capitalism, whatever, but you. And meanwhile, like, you've got Cheetos on your belly.

Yeah.

Watching Netflix. So that's the number one cause of fatherless homes is you're checked out meant. Anyway.

Yeah. Look in the mirror. Right.

I'm going a bit of a tirade here, but the point here is my. My team member sent me this copy and it was pretty good. But I'm comparing it to what the private equity group had up when they were running the company. So our headline says, don't take this for you, Take this for your family. Their headline was natural, natural, natural, natural energy. Oh, my. What? Why did this company go bankrupt?

Seriously?

And so I'm always amazed that there's so few people that is like, how.

Do we do this?

Fun.

Yeah.

How do we do this in a way that feels light? How do we do this in a way that targets specific person? And it sounds like you were going through a very similar experience when you get the idea for ballsy 100%.

Yeah. I mean, I wanted to create the brand that I wanted to see in the world that spoke the way that I did in the way that my friends did. And like, that was it and it was real and funny and. But still with a high quality product behind it. And I think those two worlds can exist together. And that's where, you know, kind of ballsy.

I feel like they have to exist together. I mean, if you're having fun, that is going to play over into your ads.

Yes.

If you're having fun, that's going to play over into your team members and the customers. Customers are going to resonate with that. But not all of them.

Not all of them. That's. Let's underline that.

And yeah, not all of them, but the ones that resonate with that are going to really resonate with it and come back and buy over and over again, 100%.

And I always like to think that, like, good brands, like, to some degree, separate people. Like, you've got to make people feel one way or another, either they hate you or they love you. If you can create that like, that to me, like drives feeling and like drives purchase. If you're kind of in the middle, like, it's. You're kind of lost in a sea of just, you know, everyone else. That's the way I look at it. So when we went on, you say.

The middle, you mean like not ruffling any feathers, just being.

Talking about same as everyone else? Yes.

You're just. You look exactly, yes.

Copy and paste of every other brand out there. Right. And I think some people are scared to kind of ruffle the feathers a little bit, but I think that's where the magic happens. Right? So like, we used to post ads on, you know, on Facebook was our biggest lever. What I loved was when we get some customers coming in, or not customers at the time, but people are like, this is the most disgusting thing I've ever seen. How can this exist? And then other people, like, lighten up, like, life's too short, have some fun. Like, this is a fun brand. And like, they would interact and then we would, you know, insert ourselves and put fun gifts and stuff. But, like, it made people feel and then people were sharing it out because it was just like, I'm just here for the comments, you know, and like that. I loved that.

So just this morning, my partner texts me and shows a graph of one of the brands we've invested in at the Capitalism Fund. And this brand is doing a little over $2 million a year. Actually, they're doing, they're doing more than that, but their monthly run rate is like 200,000amonth. And he shows me the graph, and just yesterday there's this big Boom in sales. And it's like 4x to the business. And it's because an influencer with like 3000 followers post something that is getting controversial comments. They didn't intend for this to happen. Yeah. It just is. Some people are piling on like taking you taking issue with one second of a 16 minute clip that an influencer posted and the comments are what's making it go viral. And it sounds like you sort of manufactured this a little bit in a way or you at least encouraged it.

I encouraged it, yeah. And I think there's a difference. Right. We never tried to be controversial just for the sake of doing it.

Right.

It was inherent in the brand. And I think people that are just trying to ruffle feathers for that, like it's short sighted and it's not going to be good for the brand. But if it's on brand and it's fun, at least it was fun for us. Like that's what worked. Right. Because it was real to who we were.

Yeah. So how did you get the initial traction for this? When there's nobody in the space that has got search volume, so there's nobody going out and typing in ball wash into Amazon.

Sure.

So you have to kind of create the space a little bit. How did you do that?

So it's funny because you always talk about, you know, the who. Right. And like I had the who in mind and it was, you know, guys that were out doing extreme, not extreme sports, but the sweating. Right. They're like getting out like they needed some active dudes. But guess what? That wasn't the who that bought it. At least not originally.

Okay.

And this is where the testing kind of came in. So we launched like four or five different Facebook ads. Four different groups of guys and one set towards females. And the female audience, no, like 10x the male audience buying it for their dudes. Buying it for their dudes. And we launched around basically Black Friday. So it was like a gift kind of.

Okay.

So what we, we figured out like in consecutive holidays was that we could lean into gift but make it fun. But like a Trojan horse. Right. So like for example, the next Valentine's Day, we're like, how do we get women to buy ball wash for their guys without a guy being like, what.

Are you trying to say?

So we actually, my wife came up with a slogan. It says I'm nuts about you. So then we put it in a box that had our three best products. It says I'm nuts about you. And then when you open it up, it tells you all of the reasons why the product is actually great. So like we got in the door through the female with humor. But then we deliver on the product quality and hopefully like the guy would stick around. And then for Christmas it was keep your jewels jolly. So like we really leveraged like getting in the door through fun, humor, female aspect to buy it for their guys. And like I said product quality had to be there and obviously to keep people around. But that's what we found work for us.

So is was that consistent that the acquisition for was women and then but the men came back and were the repeat buyers.

Yeah. So it made it inherently hard to track.

Right.

Especially you know, you get a gift for Christmas. Like we had a lot of people that buy them for like you know, a gift exchange at our office or whatever. So like we started to hack this to where like we made a. A scratch off ticket that had Santa holding a gift package over his package and it was like scratch scratches.

They're really lean into the fun.

I really lean into the fun of this. But then they would have a code if to come back to the website. We'd capture their email so we'd get the gift buyer then we could segment them off. So we had to do some interesting tracking over the long run. And I think the other interesting learning that we had was we found is while the gift givers like the the ROAS or return on ad spend for gift was way higher than the people during the middle of the year. But we found though is the LTV on the people during the middle of the year.

That makes total sense to me. So. So you were able to get customers cheaper around with this gift idea, but they didn't necessarily stick around because you're going to have some breakage.

Yes.

When somebody is given a gift, but if somebody voluntarily chooses it, the lifetime value of that customer is going to.

Be they were buying it more for the product solution. Like we had a product called Ballgard that was like a lotion that dries as a powder for sweat and chafe. Like I'm buying this because I really need this, whereas I'm buying this business is fun. Right. In both, you know, obviously it's it. We use the holiday gift givers to really cash flow the business. Right. And then we would buy more expensive customers that were longer term with that.

Yeah, that makes that. That makes total sense. So how long into the business until you were pacing the first million.

Three months.

Oh, wow. Okay.

Yeah, like we, we came out Black Friday.

Yeah.

I mean so we only had I had $5,000 when I started the business, so it was a very small amount. Amount of money. So we launched with 500 units. We sold them out basically, like in the first, in the first day. And I called up the supplier and I was like, good news and bad news are sold out. Bad news. It's like it's not even December 1st. Right. So he made us 15,000 units in a little under two weeks. We sold all of them out. And then we, we rolled that snowball into Valentine's Day, like I was mentioning. And then from there we were kind of off to the races. We ended up doing three and a half million dollars that first year.

Wow, that's incredible.

Yeah, it was, it was insane.

And you're probably bankrolling all of that back into more inventory, people advertising.

Yeah.

So everybody is like, oh, you got a $3 million company, must be nice. And you're like sweating bullets with 100% tied up in inventory.

100%. So I actually didn't even leave. It's crazy. I didn't even leave my, my position at Google until after that first full year. So I was running it part time with my other buddies.

And you working full time at Google for a year?

Yeah.

Working on the fame, that project.

Yes. And then working at Ballsy at night when I got home. And I guess I'm just like super risk averse, so.

I know that's super common. Yeah, I think, I think people need to know that because one of the telltale signs that a brand is going to fail is at least in the fund, is we give them money and they want to pay themselves.

Sure. Like, no.

Yeah. You have not earned the right to pay yourself.

Let's slow down.

Two million bucks out. You pay at least a million and a half. Well then what are you doing paying yourself? Yeah, you've got, you've got to put.

In the cart before the horse.

You've got to really grow this baby before you put it to work.

Absolutely. And I mean, so I waited till we had three and a half. I mean, that, that, that was probably, maybe a little too long. But it was the end of the year and it was even then I was a little nervous because I, you know, I've got a wife and a, you know, child, and I'm like, I'm set here at Google. Like, you know, this is the dream, you know, and I, I went to my wife, actually, I put in, which was an interesting conversation with my manager. I'm leaving Google to work on men's. Men's Genitalia. But I got home from that conversation, my wife, and, like, I had a hard time sleeping, to be honest.

Of course.

And she was like, she's my biggest supporter. And she was just like, basically, you know, metaphorically slap me. And it's like, look, like, we need to do this. You need to do this. We're meant to do. And if it doesn't happen, you can always go back.

Yeah. Or work somewhere else or find some other opportunity. Yeah. We oftentimes think that, like, if something doesn't work out, we're just going to, like, fall back to zero.

Yeah. That's unbelievable how it always feels like that.

Yeah. And I mean, I still feel that sometimes. Right. That was. That was my fear post exit.

Yeah.

Well, now I just have further to fall to zero if I make a mistake. Now I've got this many millions of dollars to lose when I go to zero. And so that's going to hurt even more when I fall.

I. I don't like talking about this because it feels like first world problems. Like, like, even worse than first world problems. Like, oh, like, poor you. But, like, it. It's different. Your stress from one thing gets transferred to another thing and it almost amplifies. At least it has for me.

I think it's a good word.

So, like, this a lot that I've been, like, inspired and related to you. I'm like, man, all right, I'm not the only person that feels this way. And it's just great to connect with other people that are, like, going there.

And what do you mean that feels this way? Do you mean post exit?

Post exit, like, like, was I lucky?

Am I good enough? Was it my partner? Was it good timing? All that stuff.

You have this thing in your mind. At least I did. Is like, once we exit this, everything is just like the. The clouds will part and it's just like raising sunshine ever again. But your worries just transfer into other worries. Right. And like, yes, like, you have, like, can I do this again? Right. Like, was that a lucky moment with Ballsy? Or can I, like, can I build another brand again? You know, did I catch lightning bottle? Right place, right time. And all of these questions that you had the first time, at least for me, like, I'm also having the second time, which is, you know, interesting.

But. But if. Here's the. Here's the thing that a lot of people don't understand is now that you've done it once, if you do it again and you fail, then that little part of your brain that says, I'm a failure. I'm going to that now. It has evidence.

Yes.

Whereas when you've started and you got nothing, you're like, I'm trying this thing. Who.

Whatever.

Who cares?

Yeah.

And if it works out, great. That would be awesome.

I'm already trying to mentally prepare myself for that outcome. Like, if we try and it doesn't work, like, how am I going to feel? And it's that, like, there's that little voice that gets a little bigger. Hopefully it won't, but I think it's. I think it's healthy to really think about these things and, like, prepare yourself.

Yeah. And I can tell you it can happen. Yeah. Right. But I will tell you, I think that the. The projects that I started after my exit, that failed were because I was so afraid of not failing.

Yeah.

And so. So I played defense, and I, like, put my chips in places to, like, try and guard against. What if this happens? What if this happens? And that means hiring this employee all of a sudden. Like, you make it happen.

Yeah.

You do the dumb things that make it happen.

Absolutely.

And now I just, like, feel looser and, like, step up to the plate and take some swings.

Yep.

And things are starting to work again.

Got to be loose. Right. Got to be having fun.

So how long until you had the exit?

So we basically launched Black Friday of 2018. So the idea for balls was 2017. We launched in 2018, and then I exited in August of 2021.

Okay, so that's pretty quick.

Yeah, it was quick. So we doubled sales every year from that first year.

And then three and a half to seven to 14.

Yeah, three and a half to eight to 16. And then. Yeah. But then around that last. That last year, we're kind of hitting that, you know, eight. Eight figures is when people started coming in and asking about the company.

How did they approach you, or did you approach them?

So we had a lot of people just organically email, and we had a.

Lot of aggregators at the time.

Not at the time. So we did end up with an aggregator, but it was, you know, some private equity groups, just some smaller, like, private buyers that were interested. And a lot of wasted time, to be honest, like, preparing data rooms and, you know, having all these conversations that led nowhere. But at the end, we had one person that. My partner, Brock, He. One of his friends had exited this company. So we felt like, you know, pretty strong. We had good ties. We had a lot of good conversations. And they put an LOI on the table. And I was like, all right, this is this is getting real. It was a figure that we were all excited about. We were like two days away from signing it. Lawyers are looking at it and then we get this email from this other group and they're like, hey, we're very interested.

Oh.

And we're like, you basically have 24 hours. Because we have a deal that we're very happy with. We're going to sign. This is what it's going to take. And like we got on the phone, they said all the right things, they made the right, I guess offer and then 24 hours later we had an LOI from them. So it was like I guess putting the pressure on them almost. That worked to our favorite. I mean it just so happened that, you know, the timing on that was perfect and then we, we ended up moving forward with this second deal.

That's, that's great. And how long did the process take from signing that to getting the check?

About two months. Oh, two and a half.

You're so damn lucky.

How long did it take for you?

I don't even remember. Okay. It's like a black cloud. It was six or eight months.

Oh dang.

And I mean every week we thought it was going to fall apart.

Yep.

I mean I sold before the big E Commerce boom.

Sure.

Right. So this was just private equity groups taking their time.

Dragon.

No competition. Yeah, we had a few, we had a few interested buyers. But the one once we signed an loi.

Yeah.

And you're three months into the process. They know they have you buy the balls.

Absolutely.

So they just, just dragged it on and cut away at our numbers. It's just, it was so painful.

I couldn't imagine that because even the, you know, the two and a half, three months I went through, it was like so many sleepless nights and stress.

Yeah.

Then you're just worried about that you're losing focus on the business. And it's just, it's just, it's a brutal process.

This is during the time like money is easy to get and everybody's funding all these E commerce roll ups and yeah this and they have their processes down. So it was a, a better time to sell.

It was. And I think since they knew that that other company was, you know, very interested, like they made it a point to us. Like we would close quick. They wouldn terms of the deal although they did. But they did move quick. So that was.

I want to talk post exit here in a minute but first, could you help identify a few lessons that you learned in those three years that you wish you had Known when you started.

Yeah, that's. I think the biggest takeaway for me was I built a brand that I wanted to see in the world.

World.

Like I, I loved it. Like, it was me. Like, I wrote, you know, 90 of the copy. I did a lot of design. Like, it just, it kept me going when things. And most of the time things were really good for Ballsy. But like, it's not always good. Right. And when times are hard and things are falling apart or, you know, things happen, that's what kept me going because I just loved it so much. It wasn't like, I'm doing this because I'm hoping for some potential exit or I'm just like doing E. Comm. Because that's what everyone says you should be doing. Like, I did it because I wanted Ballsy to be there and that got me through tough times. So I think that was one of the biggest things for me, I think.

Tell me about one of the hard times.

One of the.

Because the macro view is you went from you at a three and a half million dollar first year, boohoo.

I know you get to 8 and.

Then 16 and he has a big exit. What was one of the dark times?

Yeah, I think when you scale up that fast things, you're playing almost Russian roulette at a certain point. So, like we had to take on every year a bigger and bigger inventory financing loan to finance hopefully that growth for.

Right.

And I think the key word is hopefully. Right. Like, so we were taking all the cash we had in the bank, we were borrowing some and then buying inventory for holidays, hoping that.

Yeah.

You know, and we had to, we had to finance both Christmas and Valentine's Day because they're so close together. And then people shut down in the middle. So like, we were just taking gigantic swings. So, like, those were the most sleepless nights. Right.

And like you've zeroed out your bank.

Account and then some and borrowed and you're like, okay, and it's all tied.

Up in ball wash.

Yes. And hopefully this is going to work again, you know, and especially like the time you hit like the third holiday season. And like, we've done a lot of the things that we know work, but it's like, is this going to work again? Like, all right. Like, but we got to take a bigger swing. So luckily all those things worked out. But I would say that's probably like the most sleepless nights and most stress that we had over the business. And then, you know, other things just happened. Like we had a whole container of Boxes coming in from China that just disappeared. That like before, you know, holidays that was just like got. They didn't disappear, but they got like caught in customs for months. Right. We actually did have a container that I don't know if you remember hearing the news that one of those container ships that like turned over, that we had stuff on that it was just like things like that.

You don't hear about that in the news.

No.

Like thousands of containers of ball wash or swimming in the ocean mean a lot of boxes. You know, dolphins everywhere have the cleanest balls you've ever seen. Yes.

So there's just things like that. You know, we had, we had this UPS facility, distribution, our distribution center in Detroit where we made all of our products shut down. These, the winter, I guess weather just like knocked them out right before Valentine's Day. And they didn't tell anybody. So now we have all these customers emailing us, being like, where's my order? Valentine's Day is coming. This is all I bought. And I don't know, like, I'm asking our manufacturer who also did our, our drop, our shipping, and they're like, we don't know. We sent them out, we promise. And they've just disappeared. So now what are we supposed to do? So now we're issuing thousands more orders again. Okay. So we're reissuing all these orders, people. And then we find out what happened and all of a sudden those get released. So we had. Yeah. So that, you know, that hurt. But it was also like a good customer loyalty, like showing that like we're going to do the right thing. Like financially it was, you know, it sucked. But I don't know, those are a few things that pop in mind over the last few years.

What else would you say that you wish you had known at the beginning of the journey? What I would have known or going into the next journey too. Because you're thinking about what you're going to do next too.

Yeah, I mean, I think what I would have know it had been nice knowing who the actual customer was out of the gate. Although we did find out pretty quickly. Yeah, you know, I think that would have been helpful. What I wish I would have known, I'm not sure. I guess just building community, like how important that piece is. I think, you know, I think something that I really taken away from you is like building community and group around the brand. And that was like something I did at these previous startups that I didn't do immediately with Ballsy. Oh yeah, it was weird. It's Just like, we had a very small team and we did a bunch of different things, and, like, that part fell by the wayside and everything else was working that I just didn't concentrate on that enough. And I really wish that we would have, because I think that would have, you know, further helped the brand in the. In the long run with ltv and just.

Could you share how you built community at Famebit and Google? How did you build community there? That transferred over.

Yeah. So at Famebit, we had a ton of micro influencers and, like, so what I would do is bring them together to share tips on how to shoot content. So it was like, all on the influence side of helping them grow. Help in influencer marketing at that time was like a totally new thing. So no one really knew how to do these branded integrations. So we would build community around bringing them together, teaching them. And then before that, I was at this company called Store Envy, which was E Commerce owners, and it was bringing them together for best practices and things like that. Yeah, so I think there's always, you.

Know, how do you translate that over to ballsy?

Yeah, I think that's. That's a really good question. I think for us, it was bringing together guys that could use our products that were out. Like, we had this slogan of live balls out. Right. It was like, guys that did extra and it maybe. Maybe it was, you know, they worked out a lot, but maybe it was like the accountant that was like, also in a metal band on the weekend. It was like, people that just did more. Right. And I think that would have been something if I would have stayed at Ballsy longer, something that I really would have leaned into because the humor and stuff was awesome.

Right.

It's super fun. But, like, I wanted to put more meat on the bone of, like, what does it mean to be a ballsy customer? Or live balls out and, like, do extra.

Yeah. See, I think that is a perfect approach to building community, where you throw the product out and you say, who's the person that would be most advantageous for me to have a big community of? And I'll just serve them. And for you, it's the guy who does extra.

Right.

And so the podcast or the YouTube channel or the social media page won't look like your product at all, but it will look like the type of media that the person that buys your product loves to consume.

Absolutely.

And then that becomes a distribution channel all on its own, and people don't get that piece of it. And I think it's. It's like the missing elixir in so many brands that break out.

So I'll add to that. I think it's not that, like, there's definitely people that don't get it, and I think there's. It's hard to do. It takes time. And like, for me, admittedly, like, Ballsy was growing so fast. It was like, to, like, spend all the extra time, like, trying to build this community. It just didn't. It never rose to the top of my priority list. But like, now starting a new brand, like, I'm like, we got to start with this stuff. Like, this is the stuff that's important and long lasting. And yeah, it takes a long time, but, like, it's. The juice is worth the squeeze.

Yeah, totally. So tell me what happened after the exit. So you sold in 21. There's this E Commerce boom. There's multiple different people bidding for brands. You're doing 15, $16 million in top line revenue. Yeah, life's supposed to be amazing post exit.

Sure.

The clouds part and it's sunshine and rainbows. What's life like after?

Yeah. So I stayed on for six months to help try and run the brand.

That didn't pan out the way that I had hoped.

But, like, it's interesting because things changed because you're making a face like you can't say much. Yeah, yeah, I understand. I've signed those documents too in the past. Yeah.

Yes. So I think all I can say is, like, when you grow a brand like that, like, it feels like another child. Right. And then like, when you hand that child over, like, there's certain emotions and things, and it's like, no, like, my baby likes it like this.

Like, my baby's gluten free.

Yes. This is how. How it works, you know? And they're like, no, no, we're gonna try these different things. Like, that's hard. Yes. Super hard. Especially when, you know, there's not a lot of listening to, you know, past.

Experience and you're not the owner anymore, so. So you have to scream.

Doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Which I was reminded. So.

Yeah, I think that was hard at first. Is like, yeah, well, like, the outcome is like the dream, right? Like, you know, supposedly this is what, you know, you built the company to do, but it's hard to take that first step back. So once I finally was just like, okay, I got to rip the band aid off and like that.

Give it to them.

Give it to them. It's. It's theirs to do what they want. To do with. And now I got to move on. So there was a bit of, you know, transition during that, and then I would say, like, the next, like, six months or so was just really nice. I spent a lot of time with my family. We did more traveling than I ever done in my life. And I was just, I guess, kind of distracted from business. I was just enjoying the moment and.

Like, being with friends and family, money, you had enough. No responsibilities, you can do whatever you want. Month.

It was. It was very nice. But I would say after that six month mark, it's like, okay, what am I gonna do with the rest of my life?

How old are you here?

I'm 40.

You're 40. Okay. So, yeah. You're gonna be around for another 50 years.

Yeah.

You're not even at half time and you're like, oh, right, I have to do something. 50 years.

It's amazing how quickly that creeps back in. You know, I think a lot of people think, like, once that happens, it's. It's just like, you never worry about anything anymore. And that's not true because I think the people that get to these positions. Right. Like, have that internally. Like, you didn't just get here.

Yeah. You have.

You have drive to want to do.

Something, but you had drive at Google, you had drive at fame that, like, you. You had drive. Yeah. To be good at something. And now you're just sitting on the sidelines and it's not like you played baseball and you're. You just. Just. You're old and done.

Yeah. Right.

Gary Vaynerchuk said to me once, he was like, aren't you glad he didn't become an athlete? And I was like, no. He's like, aren't you glad you didn't play baseball? No, no, I wish I was playing first base for the Indians right now. And he goes, ryan, athletes have to retire at 35.

Yeah.

We get to play this game forever.

That's a great way.

And when you sell, there's a new. Like, there's a different game. You got to find out what the game is.

Yes.

What's my game? I knew I wanted to play the game. I got to play the game. I kind of won the game.

Yep. Now what the heck do I do now?

What that?

And can you do it again? Right. And I think that's where a lot of the stress comes in. It's like, okay, like, this was great, but, like, now, one, what do I do? And two, can I do it again? And that's a lot of pressure at Least it's been.

I get it. And like you said, it's, it's even beyond first world problems. It's like 1% problem.

I feel embarrassed even saying it out loud. Like, it's just like.

But it's, but it is very real.

Yeah.

And I think, I think, I think it's easier to say out loud when you recognize that everybody has that voice that, am I gonna look like an idiot? Because once you've made it, to some extent, looking like an idiot is worse than when you look like an idiot and no one cares. Right. When a celebrity gets canceled, it's a bigger fall than if you say something dumb on the Internet and your friends are like, dude, yeah, you can't say that. That's very, that's very different. Like, that's a. Like it's the same action.

Sure.

One is very risky and the other is a non issue that no one ever brings up for the rest of your life and you never think about it again. And so I think when you've had a certain level of success, you're. You're now playing with. You have a different skill set. But there's much more to lose.

Yeah.

Right. There's more capital, there's more goodwill, there's more confidence, there's more reputation, there's more relationships. All of those things can be lost. Absolutely. And I've experienced losing them. And it sucks to sit on the sidelines. It sucks to lose those things. And so sometimes you just feel like, paralyzed. The only option that has no pain is to start another thing. And it work. And so now there's pressure, a lot of pressure. Right.

You know, the first thing people ask me after we exit it, what you do, you gonna do next?

Yeah. Right.

Oh, like, I don't know. Yeah, I'm gonna take a breather. But like, everyone's, you know, literally the.

Day we brought Esther home from the hospital, yeah. She's. She's four days old, Right. And a friend comes over and holds her and goes, are you gonna have more? I don't know.

Give me a second.

I just started.

It's unbelievable how quickly those questions. Yeah.

And that's, that's how it kind of feels. People are like, what? Like, what are you going to do next? Because they're projecting this idea of all your confidence must be like, exponentially bigger.

Sure.

And you got this big bank account now, and you, you must know that the next thing is going to win even bigger because you have a skill set now. And in your head you're like, was it Good timing. Was it my partner? Did I find lighting in a bottle? Was it the economic situation? Like, yeah.

Every other question. Don't know.

And so all that uncertainty is just.

Like, there it is. Yeah. I mean, I've never dealt with anxiety in my. Like, I just never.

I didn't before my exit either.

Isn't that weird? And I just, like, I'm so glad you said that.

I just. It was the first time I thought, like, oh, I didn't have any anxiety in my life before I sold a.

Company I didn't like. And it's.

That is so messed up. It is messed up that now I'm embarrassed.

Like, I've listened to so many podcasts, like, as Ballsy was coming. I was never stressed before.

Before, I was rich.

Now I'm rich.

I have all these problems and I'm stressed. It's a hard life. Even us, a straight white men with money.

This episode might get. Might get you canceled there.

Hopefully fall.

No.

Yeah.

You know, it's just. It's interesting, though, because I had listened to people that had said that before Ballsy and been like, I had those thoughts, like, what a bunch of to.

Yeah.

Really. But it's just different levels, different devils.

And so, like, to compound it more now, it's also lonely.

Yeah.

Because there's really nobody you can talk about. No.

I think this is the first time I've really said this out loud other than to my wife. Like, I just. It's not something I like to talk about. It's a weird thing to talk about. So. Especially now. And now we're doing it on your podcast. Okay. Not behind the scenes. Yeah.

Only a few people listen.

Yeah.

So let's. Then let's flip it completely. Right. Like. Well, hold on. I don't know what you can say. So I'm gonna. I'm gonna. I'm gonna go here for a minute. Okay. You're not in charge of Ballsy anymore. Other people are in charge of Ballsy. You separated because you. They wanted to do it differently than you, and it's their baby now. But I know from the sidelines it can still be like, yeah, it's done this way. You do it this way.

Absolutely.

So now you turn around and you've got the next thing that you're looking for.

Sure.

You may or may not know what that is, but do you take that same approach into the next thing, or do you have to think about it differently? Like, what is different for you? Round two.

So I am working on something new now, I think where I started was reassessing what I love doing about Ballsy and why it got to where it was, was. And again, it wasn't so much around the product, it was around the brand.

Yeah.

And that's just like I know a lot of people like start with, you know, with a who or with a product. For me, like I kind of need what is the brand that's going to get me insight excited in a space that I feel like is not exciting.

Right.

Like where can I do something differently that I'm going to be excited about.

It, that no one else really like that question. That's a really good question. What can I be excited about in a space that isn't exciting? Because you did it once with personal care. Yeah. Right. And I think like I'm doing, I think I'm doing that with supplements right now. And, and you might say like Jeremy's Razors did it with razors.

Sure.

Right. That's a really good question. So how did you go about answering that?

So the short answer is laundry. The long answer is I started with products that my manufacturer that I had a great relationship could build. Right. Because I was like, I have such a good relationship, let's lean into that. And I have a non compete on personal care stuff. So I was like, all right, what can he do? And he does laundry stuff. And I was like, I just started looking at the space and I'm like, this is the worst space ever.

It's so boring.

There's no cool brands like drops. I don't know if you've seen Drops. Like he had that like cool bathtub moment. Like what has happened since then?

Right, right.

Nothing. Like, so there's just no fun.

It's a great business though, because he was cool at a, in a space that wasn't cool. But you're right, they haven't done anything since then.

Like, you know, and so to me is like, can you make something as hated and terrible as laundry fun and exciting? So then I started going down that path of like, what, what would that look like? So that's where I'm starting to stink. You know, sink my teeth into talk.

About the brand at all.

Yeah. So yes. So the brand is called Slay. So like don't do your laundry, Slay your laundry. And.

The pro, you can already start to get kind of a feel of what it's going to be.

Yeah.

So in the product. I don't know if you've ever seen these before, but they're called detergent sheets. So imagine a dryer Sheet, but made out of detergent. So if you ask 10 people on the street, probably, you know, three of. Three of them maybe have heard of it. It's starting to become a thing. But all of those brands, again, it's just like eco friendly. Everything's great. It's just all the same. So this, the product is called Holy Sheet. So just being.

I love this fun.

Right? Like, and, you know, thinking about different content. Like, you know, if we get people on Tick Tock, every time they throw one in, they just got to say holy sheets. Like, it's just fun. It, like, brings a smile to your face of something that is not fun.

Yeah. And I'm thinking what. At first I was like, I don't know how you're gonna make laundry fun.

Yeah.

But then as. As soon as you started talking about it, now I'm seeing all these ideas, like, I'm imagining. Remember Billy Mace? Of course they don't make him like him anymore.

No, they don't.

You know, he was such a pitchman and he was so fun to watch.

Yes.

And I imagine a guy like him talking about Oxiclean.

Yeah.

But if you just swapped out Oxiclean for slay.

Yeah.

It'd been like, we. We slayed the stain. The stainless slay.

Yeah.

I mean, that. That would work really well. That's.

That's the plan.

And no one's done it fun since Billy Mays.

I don't think so. Yeah. So that's kind of the plan, you know, and I think around that as well. So we've got these wool dryer ball balls are called Fluffy As. So it's just again, like putting a smile on people's face through product. But then also, like, in our content, we're doing a bunch of memes and just funny stuff around laundry. Right. Things that people can relate to. So, yeah, we're gonna. We're gonna try and make this terrible chore fun.

This was fun.

It was fun. It's great. Sitting down with you.

Any way that the audience can support you can follow along with a new brand launch. Yeah. So money can hire you for things.

All of the above, please. So the brand is Slay laundry.com. so if you go there now, you can put your email on, you know, on the list for. For launch notices. And we also have a Facebook group. I'd highly recommend people to go that. So it's Sleigh Laundry on Facebook and you can join the laundry Slayers and basically documenting, you know, a lot of the process of, like, bringing the brand to life.

That's awesome.

Yeah. You're.

You're doing the traffic, Trying.

Yeah, I'm trying to, man.

That's awesome.

Yeah.

I'm really excited for it, man. It's great to see you.

Yeah. Good to see you as well. Thank you.

There's a few key takeaways to remember from this episode. Number one, Adam served a person. He didn't just sell a product. Now, people buy a lot of products, but it's hard to market products. It's easy to market to people. This is counterintuitive when you're starting your first company or when you haven't had your first million or even when you're trying to scale past 1 million for the first time. But the more you can focus on the person, the faster your company will grow. Number two, the chips stay on the table for at least a year because you're building an asset. You're not just building a cash flow machine. This too is counterintuitive with a lot of brand builders because a lot of us got into this game for freedom. But you're keeping all the chips on the table for a year while you build this asset and you make your money. When you have your exit, and if you do it well, it's reasonable to expect that you could have at least a seven figure exit. And number three, build the business you want. Just make it fun. If you like having fun, make it super serious. If you want it super serious, like you can build whatever you want. There's so much abundance. There's so much opportunity. Your business cannot, should not and doesn't have to look like everybody else's. It should look like what you want to exist in this world. So whenever you're ready to build that, come join us in the 1%@capitalism.com 1. We can help you get clear on your idea. Have a profitable Launch, get to 100 sales a day so that you're consistently pacing at least $10,000 a month. And then over the next few years, you can build an asset that you can sell. And if you want to hang out with Adam and myself in person, Adam is a member of the capitalist pigs. That's my mastermind, which you can find out about@capitalism.com pigs. Thanks so much for watching. I'll see you guys on the next episode.