Using a Book to Increase Your Funnel Conversions and Profits with Jaime Smith

Hey friends, welcome to the Publish, Promote Profit podcast. I'm Rob Kosberg and every week I show you how to use a best selling book to grow your income and your impact. And if you're interested in having your own best selling book, I recorded a short video explaining our trademark process@bEGINMYBOOK.com alright, hey, welcome everybody. It's Rob here with another episode of our Publish Promote Profit podcast. We've been focused quite a bit recently on book funnels and I have the man today that at least from a technical standpoint, has been behind a lot of really successful book funnels. Jamie Smith is the founder of CF Pro Tools. It's a SaaS based software that allows you to quickly and easily add missing features to your click funnels pages. Now there are other funnel builders, but as most of you know, I've been a beta. I started as a beta user of clickfunnels way back in the early days and swear by it. So with users like Russell Brunson, Dean Grutch, Tony Robbins, Frank Kern, just to name a few, CF Pro Tools is the number one resource when you want to increase your funnel conversions, cart value, funnel profits, et cetera. There's 70 different tools add ons to choose from. So I think what we'll be speaking about with Jamie Today and his 15 years of experience in the online marketing space is going to be really helpful. So Jamie, thanks so much and welcome to the podcast. Thank you.

Glad to be here. Yeah, it's awesome.

As you know, I'm doing a book on book funnels and so, you know, we're in inner circle together, which is cool. And, and so thank you so much for responding to that. Maybe give us a little bit of the background first. Not so much of CF Pro Tools, which is kind of a cool story in itself, but of the tools that have been used with book funnels because I know that it really kind of originated with you and Russell working on his book funnels. So talk about that just a little if you could.

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I honestly, I think the very person that reached out to me that was looking for some help with a book funnel specifically was Dean Graziosi.

Okay.

And then Russell adopted some of the stuff I did for Dean and he's like, oh well, hey, we should totally do that. Was that like, hey, I've got a, I've got a book funnel and I'm charging, you know, it's a free plus shipping model and I'm charging, you know, 9.95 for shipping. But international customers, that's costing me like $20 to send them a book.

Right.

So I, I can't, I can't even break even on those customers. Is there anything that we can do that allows me to change how much I charge somebody based on what country that we're shipping it to or, you know, really is versus a domestic, you know, it's a US based order versus it's an international, it's going some. Some other country. And I said, absolutely. So that was one of the first things that I built out specifically for book funnels. And it's been used on, you know, all kinds of free plus shipping funnels or even just, you know, regular physical product funnels where, you know, you want to have a shipping charge to it. So we built that out initially for Dean and then I added it into CF Pro Tools add ons libraries and it's just called the international shipping add on. And you can just go in and say, hey, here's my core product. And when anybody buys this and they're from the US or they're from a domestic country, you define what countries those are, then this is the other product to add. And if they pick another country, then this is the other product ad. And that allows you to charge, you know, 9.95 for domestic or 1995 for international.

Nice.

It really allows people to make sure to cover those costs depending on where the customer's located.

Yeah, love it.

So, yeah, so that was kind of the, the launch into the, you know, kind of free plus shipping offers. And then, yeah, continue to work with Russell, especially on this newest iterations of all those book funnels. And figuring out how can we increase that average cart value so that we can pay more to acquire customers. And so doing things like being able to add multiple bump offers to the same order form and really make the bump offer stand out a little bit compared to the norm. You know, we got a lot of that are used to, especially in Russell's world, most of his customers are used to seeing funnels because he's promoting funnels all the time. And so just like anything else, you know, you get blind to the things that you know are, okay, that's a bump offer because it's got the yellow box with the border around it. It looks like everybody else's bump offer. Right. So we talked about, okay, well how can we make that different? How can we make it stand out, you know, versus just okay, I can change the color, I can remove the border or whatever. We made his. So it's, it's actually got an image of the product and it's got a paragraph about the product and it's got a button then to add or remove. And it just, it doesn't look like a normal bump. So it attracts more eyeballs and gets more people to pay attention and actually add those things to their cart. So yeah, just that's been kind of thing is that I've always focused on is, you know, what are the things that people can add that are going to improve their conversion rate as well as improve their average car value.

Awesome. Let's talk through the specifics there. So just for our listeners, the whole idea of a free plus shipping book funnel as I've been discussing is that it would self liquidate the ad expense. It's called a self liquidating offer. The idea is if it cost you $60 to acquire that book buyer, then ideally you want the average book buyer to spend $60 in the book funnel itself, which is not always easy to do. In fact, it's quite difficult to do especially if you're initial offer is only $7.95. So you, you mentioned one thing, the bump. You mentioned of course, the idea of the domestic versus foreign shipping. So talk me through what other options there are and talk me through even some specifics. Like what have you seen as far as like conversion rate increase or average cart value increase based on some of these changes?

Sure, absolutely. You know, one of the things that I've seen that is pretty effective on really all funnel, specifically on free plus shipping offer funnels, that works well. And for example, one example I can think of is with Dean Graziosi. He has a journal pack that he has and he offers the Journal in like five different colors. So the offer on the front end is okay, you can get one journal and we're going to send it to you for free. Just cover the cost of the shipping. Or if you want to buy a bundle of all five colors of the journal, then that's like $35 and we'll ship that out to you. And what that allows them to do is now give the customer a choice on the front end of spending more money. And what we do to make that more attractive is we actually just put what we call the bestseller highlight around that product. So normally clickfunnels, you get, you know, radio buttons for choose product one or product two. And it's pretty plain and it's just the name of the product. With this it puts a box around the product you want to highlight with the yellow background and a black border around it. So it kind of pops off the page. It's got a little shadow behind it.

Like a best value kind of thing.

Exactly. Yeah. So it just kind of stands out. Let you put a little headline above it that I recommend. Always going with something like most popular or best choice. That kind of social proof that, hey, this is what everybody else is getting. So that's what I should get too. Right. So that allows, you know, first off, they come in because it's a free plus shipping and you attracted them with the free. But then they get the choice to spend more money and they can see that, oh, other people are buying this thing, that's a higher value. And so instead of just spending the 995 to cover shipping costs, now they can spend 40 bucks on just the initial offer before they even get to the bumps. Yeah, that works really well. And we've seen that bestseller highlight work in other funnels as well. You know, especially Trey Llewellyn uses it quite a bit for his physical product funnels where, you know, I'm going to offer them to buy one of something for free plus shipping, or they can buy 2 or 3 or 5 or 10 and then highlight, say the five pack option is the most popular and it gets more people to take that. I've had multiple people report to me that just by adding just that one add on where you know, they're highlighting a higher value product, that they've doubled their, doubled their average cart value by just highlighting which product they want people to pick.

Very cool.

I tend to think from a psychology perspective, it just makes people take that extra second to look for the best value.

Yeah.

And when they're doing that, they're already trying to figure out how can I spend my money in the right way. So yeah, that one is really effective.

Yeah.

So Jamie, offer a little bit and how you can tweak it to support that, but it works well.

Before you go on to the next one, talk to me a little bit about CF Pro Tools. If, if someone hasn't used CF Pro Tools and they're interested in maybe using it, do you have like examples of how these various tools are used? Like did. Do you help the people, like talk me through what they can find when they go to CF Pro Tools because unless they're listening to this podcast and learning about book funnels, they're going to be like, I don't know what to do. Right.

So absolutely.

I imagine you have tools within it for that.

Yeah, absolutely. So every add on in the system, so when you come, you can just go to cfprotools.com and click the get started button. Put in your email in that lets you create a free account that's got a limited set of add ons available. Or from there you can pick a plan for what we call the VIP club subscription. And there's 70 different add ons you can choose from there. Each one of them comes with demos of like, here's what it does and here's how to set it up and use it. But I think probably the most valuable thing is when you get into the CRO tool software. On the dashboard there's a training and resource resources section. And in there I've actually got two separate videos that's total about five hours of training.

Wow.

That walk through every step of Russell's traffic secrets funnel.

Nice.

And what we did to set it up to be the most successful that we can. So every add on that we used is outlined in those training videos. So if you really wanted to do, if you wanted to kind of model the expert, you know, if you want to funnel hack Russell, that's really kind of the best way to get started. Just go in, watch those. I'll tell you exactly what add ons we use to make it do the things that Russell does. And then you can kind of model that quickly and easily.

That is beautiful, dude. Thank you. Thanks for that, that explanation. Okay, so, so let's move on. So we got the choosing the product that's even before the bump, which is very, very cool. You know, talk to me about anything special with bumps and then go from there.

Yeah, I think the key with the bumps, at a minimum, there's a few different ways to go, but at a minimum, allowing somebody to choose more, more than one is a good thing. And we've seen that be very successful with Russell's funnels. You know, initially it was just, okay, it's an offer and a bump and that was it. You know, you're gonna buy the physical product, the physical book, and we'll ship down it to you. Oh, and hey, if you'd like the audiobook, check the box and we'll add it to your order and you'll get it right away.

Gotcha.

That I think works really, really well. Anytime you can offer an immediate delivery as a bunk offer because most people that are buying books are trying to solve a problem and they're in that pain right now. And you're going to ship them a book, but they might not get it for two weeks. And if you can give them an option to immediately receive the information and solve the problem today instead of waiting two weeks. You know, that's a pretty attractive offer. So we always like to go with that. But then you can, you know, add additional bumps as well. Maybe it's another package, another course, another high value product that you have sitting on the shelf that you could deliver to somebody with minimal effort, but to them it has a really high perceived value and it's only available when you're buying it along with this other package.

Right.

So, you know, we generally like to see, you know, going from a, you know, say a 995 for the core offer, free plus shipping, and then a 27 to $37 bump for usually an audio book or an audio plus the PDF and then going to either a 47 or a $97 additional bump that may be an additional course that you know is going to augment and help them solve that problem faster or other problem.

That's a checkbox that, that's just like.

Just a check. Yeah, that's.

That's very cool. I hadn't even seen that. So. Yeah, so it's basically a larger bump box on that first page that offers bumps.

Yeah, you put multiple boxes basically that you, you know, however many offers you want to make. I definitely don't want to go too crazy with it. Ten different bumps. But you know, two to three is what I would normally recommend. You know, more than the one tends to increase value get too much, it tends to throw people off. But yeah, you just. With clickfunnels, you get the option to add one bump to the page and then they don't really support the feature beyond that.

Right.

With Save bluetools, I've just set it up so that you can add as many bumps as you want to to your order form. You just insert a new bump element for every one of your bumps and then you tag that element in the ClickFunnels editor to say it's this product ID when they check the box that I want to add and this product ID when they check this box. So it lets you add as many as you want and then, you know, along that you can. There's a couple different ways to do that. There's one add on that's just called the Multiple bumps add on. Super simple. It's your normal yellow background, you know, black border bump boxes and you can add multiple to your page. The one we've done with Russell is, is a combination of a few add ons, but we call it the Add remove product. So instead of being an actual bump Element. It's just a button on the page that when you click it, it adds that product to your order. And when you click a button, then it replaces the button with one to remove the product. If somebody wants to get rid of it, then they click remove, and it just swaps those things out. And you can put as many of those on your page as you want as well. And you just attach it to a bump product. You say when they click this button, it adds this product. When they click rem, removes that product, and do that as many times as you want. So we use that with Russell's funnels, and it's been great to give people that option, but then you're in complete control of the design. So it's not the traditional, you know, yellow box with the black border.

Gotcha, gotcha. Love that. Those two are very unique. And I can immediately see how, you know, both the. Choosing your product and offering multiple bumps would absolutely raise average cart value. So what about your upsells, then? Upsell is an upsell. Is an upsell. Or are there some interesting things that you can do with CF Pro Tools there?

Yeah, there's definitely some interesting things you can do there. Before I forget, the other thing that I would recommend if your offer works well for on the bump, is there's another option that we call the bump quantity, which puts a drop down into the bump itself to say, okay, I want to buy this thing. And when they check the box, it says, oh, how many would you like? And for each one they add, it increases the price.

That's cool.

And so, you know, if you're doing things like T shirts and physical products, obviously. Yeah, it's just great to be able to say, oh, yeah, I like that. Oh, I can pick five of them. Sure, I'll pick five.

Yeah.

So that's another good thing to look at for bumps to anytime you can allow somebody to spend more money, it's a good thing. And make it simple for them to do. That's a good thing.

Very cool.

And as far as the upsells, one of the things that, you know, obviously Russell does a great job of teaching upsells and what it should be, you know, how do you solve the next problem? They're going to have that. But one thing that we've done that kind of makes it unique with his products is we really want people to buy the audiobook versions of all of the books. But. And so that's one of the bump offers is you can say, oh, hey, you know, I've got two Other books and you can buy. Get the dot Com Secrets book plus Traffic secrets plus expert secrets on the bump itself on the order form. But if somebody doesn't choose that, we'd still like them to have the option to do it on the next upsell page. Because the upsell after the initial book is, hey, do you want to buy. Buy the box set of the books? I've got my box set with two additional, Three additional books actually for Russell.

Yeah.

And if you want to buy that, then, you know, click here. Oh, by the way, and we call them, we call it the OTO Bump. There's actually two additional bumps on the OTO page as well. So it's not just buying one product, it's, oh, I want to add this, the audiobook pack. I didn't buy it the first time, but okay, I see it again. And what we do is we've got an add on that allows the OTO page to know, did somebody buy the bump on the front end? And if they did, don't show them this offer because they already got it.

Very smart.

But if they didn't buy it, then show them this offer. And if they didn't buy it or they did buy it, then show them this other offer instead. So it just allows us to kind of tailor that OTO page based on what they purchased on the front end and then to offer them additional features on an oto. So it's not again, they have the option to spend $97 or up to $300 just on that first OTO.

I love that. Now I'm going to be interviewing R in a, in a couple of weeks about the latest and stuff that he's doing. I know he's writing another book, which is very interesting as well. Do you have any idea what his average cart value is based on?

You know, it's been a minute since I've looked at that and I'd hate to even speculate at this point. I know we saw a significant increase when we switched from his kind of verse version books and funnels to adding in the things like we did with the having the multiple bumps and then having the bump offers on the OTO pages. I think we saw you probably. I think I wanna say we saw about a 50% increase in the average cart value by making those changes. So, yeah, it definitely makes it much easier to acquire more customers when you can spend 50% more on your ads and still break even. So.

Love it, love it. Very, very good. Awesome. What else am I missing? We have the, you know, These funnel elements, we're gonna, you know, use this, this recording and a lot of the information for our kind of funnel tools section of my book. And so what else, what else am I missing? And, and that could be helpful to increase average order value, conversion rate, all of that.

Yeah, for sure. I definitely think the big ones are, like I said, the international shipping. Being able to cover that cost on the upfront is probably the best place to start. And I think the majority of people that are operating any sort of physical product funnel will want to do that if they're going to accept international orders. We have the option if you don't want to accept international orders, you can actually use another add on that says, hey, I want to preset United States as my country. And they can't choose anything else, so they know right away that this is only valid for us. So you can kind of limit things that way.

Good.

And. But being able to cover that cost has been a key. I've had numerous people reach out to me like, this is killing me. I'm, you know, I'm paying twice as much to ship it internationally and I just can't. I can't cover the cost. So that's the big one. Yeah. The bumps and then, you know, I think the keys are, you know, are coming up with those just well crafted offers on the back end. OTOs always are the way to increase your profits. And it's. That's just boils down to the, you know, pure psychology of the funnel itself. I'd love to say that's magic tools that make those better, but it's really all about.

They help, though. Those tools help, man.

Yeah, they do. And I, and I'm still amazed when people reach out sometimes and say, like, oh man, I just added this one thing and it. I got a 50 increase in my conversion rate.

Yeah.

And, you know, it's the simple stuff that, that makes all the difference. And. But yeah, being able to add multiple bumps and, and being able to add bump offers to your OTOs is also a great way to go.

Yeah, I never heard that. That's very cool. I love that.

Yeah. Yeah. It's just that, you know, it's. It's for the customer. It's super simple. They're just clicking a button and then you click a big buy button when they're finished. Like, okay, y. You're getting this one thing when you click the big buy button, but you want to add this and this.

Oh, yeah.

They click a button a couple times and they click buy and then it Just adds it all at the same time and then looking at ways to, you know, the other things that we do that can help to increase kind of the front end but also the long term, you know, because I'm a big fan of recurring revenue, it's always beneficial. So anytime you can offer somebody a subscription it's great. And you know, sometimes you don't want to, you don't want to charge them the full amount up front but you might want to collect a little bit and or do a $1 trial because you hey, I at least want to ping the card and make sure it's valid.

Yeah, it's good card.

And so I've got a group of add ons that you can use with either on the order form to do what we call a paid trial where you know, hey, mine, $97 a month subscription but you get your first month for just a dollar. So it actually as far as clickfunnels is concerned it adds two products to the order. A one time charge for the $1 and then a trial subscription for the $97 a month month. So to the customer it's just one transaction. But To ClickFunnels it's two different products. You can do that same thing on Otos as well and group them together and I've seen that be really effective with some physical product funnels to add recurring revenue trade loan uses this. Perry Belchers used this quite a bit in his, some of his survival, you know he's got some survival clubs and stuff like that where it's like oh hey we want to send you this thing, it's $7 for this and then it's just going to enroll you for this 27 month recurring revenue subscription and it works great and so but it allows you to you know, cover that cost for sending the free gift.

Yeah.

Or at least ping the car to make sure yep, this customer is valid and this is going to continue to go. Right. And so yeah, those, those sorts of things work really well.

Awesome, Great Jamie, thanks. Thanks for all the stuff you shared. Obviously they can go to cfprotools.com anywhere else. Any other links that we'd like to send them or, or just cfprotools.com is the place to go.

That's the one, that's the place to go and get started and you know get there and see the quick demo video on the page. You know and it actually talk about some of Russell's funnels and Deans and Tony's on there. So get to see some examples and you know, use those if nothing else is, you know something to model.

So yeah, love it. Love it buddy. Thank you. Thank you so much for sharing. Really appreciate it. It was good stuff and you know I use CF Pro tools as well so I'm going to go on and talk to my tech guy and see what other ways we can use it. So very cool.

There you go. Awesome. Thanks so much Rob. I really appreciate it.

Appreciate it. Hey thanks for listening in on the Publish Promote Profit podcast. If you enjoyed it, please take a minute and like and subscribe to the podcast because every week I bring you either great guests or great teaching to help you to grow your income and your impact with the best selling book. And if you're a interested in having your own best selling book, check out my short video which explains our trademark process@bEGINMYBOOK.COM.