How to Reverse Aging with Danielle Stabley, MS, PA-C

Foreign. This is Danielle Stabley. Hello. And want to introduce yourself, Danielle?

Yes. I am a physician assistant. Started in the emergency room for 10 years prior to coming here at Allure. Have been working alongside of Dr. Moak in our wellness service lines and cosmetic service lines for the past seven years. Have a passion for increasing health healthy years to our patients lives. That's our mission and vision here. And became our medical director through Michigan over the past two years here in Allure. I do a lot of training and mentoring with our staff, getting them up to speed and getting our patients into more of the wellness services.

Okay, so we're going to talk about wellness. I'm going to go over the the way we're looking at it and then we're mostly going to spend our time on what can really be done to meet potentially meaningfully. Reverse, Reverse age. That's possible that we would define it. So step one is the basic health care. You know, got to be taking care of yourself, exercising, eating, health, maybe have some wellness things such as sauna, taking some supplements. That's stuff that you're doing now. And then after that comes some regenerative things such as we've done stem cell therapy, we try to reverse sleep apnea, we reverse circulation problems, we restore people's basically their hormones and we work on weight loss. That's all regenerative. Then there's don't die anything I expected such as cardiovascular include a stroke and heart attack, cancer and neurocognitive decline. I've done podcasts on that how we probably screen for these things. And the next level we're talking about today is how do we measure and reverse age. So we measure age in various ways. For heart age we can measure your own arterial stiffness or amount of plaque compared to other people of your sex, your race, your age. So if you're 50 years old and your heart looks like you're a 50 year old white female and your cardiovascular system looks like a 60 year old white female, we know that you're more likely to have a heart attack in the next 10 or 20 years. We can also measure a plaque burn. We actually can be a score. You have a 60 or higher brain. Same thing. We could do neural quantitative imaging. And how old is your brain versus your peers. We can also do something called a biologic age which is where they do several chemistry. You do about 40 chemistries and they see where your chemistry is aligned with other people in your age. And then we have something called epigenetic age which is where we look at there's methyl groups put on the C part of your, your DNA. And every year we add a certain amount of number, amount of a certain number of methyl groups. And there's a clock that records when we probably will die. We start seeing it. People age from when they're an embryo. So if somebody's going to live to be 100, when they're 80, their genes were aging slower than somebody lived to be 50. Okay, so the three stages we three or four steps we use for age reversal. We're doing it in stages in terms of how we're sequencing it out because it's kind of hard for people to keep up with the schedule. And yet I'm assuming that you're doing all the anti aging stuff and your other wellness things and you're seeing a doctor, maybe even a functional medicine doctor. This is somebody who wants to reverse potentially their genetic age and their biologic age. So step one is going to be involving what's called a senolytic drug. And these are drugs that kill off old cells in your body. There's a drug therapy for that. Part of that same step is you taking medications or molecules that turn on genes that slow down aging. One of the genes is called ampk, known as called sirtuin, and the molecules you'd use to turn those switches off. And there's another genetic pathway called mtor, that when it's turned on, we age faster. So we want to inhibit that. Then we have a thymus gland which sits behind a breastbone and it makes our T cells and these are part of immunity that helps protect us against cancer and aging. And we use a drug, an injection for that to restore the thymus gland. You want to talk about your typical patient who's starting on this voyage and they're already doing stuff like hrt. Yeah.

Most of our patients that come in, they've been with us for a little bit. We educate them on all the services that we offer. They're already doing some hormone replacement, weight loss. They want to feel good on the outside. Also on the inside, they want to have a little more energy, they want to live longer, they want to be there for their kids, be able to golf, you know, do things as we age and sometimes start feeling a little bit of joint aches. They just want to live longer, look better, feel better. So those patients, they're already optimizing that kind of baseline wellness level that you're talking about, and then they want to move to the next step and be around longer. So when that happens, I talk about, let's check your genetic age. Let's see where you're at now. And our goal is to do some things to make, make us reverse that age or get a little bit younger like you. I'm sure you've talked about how you reversed your cardiac age 16 years, how you reversed your brain age as well. So we still tell some of these success stories. And a lot of people don't realize that there are things out there to help them live longer. And it's our job to educate them that there are some things. It's kind of on the forefront. You're so innovative and constantly above on the studies. And now I get to let them know what we do. So I check their genetic age, see where they're at. You can go online the My DNA Age, like you said, it runs about $299. Get it in the mail. It's a little pink finger stick. Ship it off to the lab, Takes about six weeks to come back. And then in the meantime, I'll start them on the citic drugs like you talked about. So that's kind of phase one. Is the senolytic drugs into that a little bit. Yeah.

So you're talking about the clinical side, I'll talk about the scientific side. So we have a pathway that basically protects us against cancer. It is called senolytic, sorry, senescence. So cells reproduce, reproduce, reproduce. And we have cells that last a long time in our body, such as our brain cells, fat cells maybe last five to seven years, brain cells a little longer. Our red blood cells may be 120 days, the lining of our mouth, maybe 15 days. So cells are turning over and being replaced by stem cells. But as these cells are turning over and over and over again, eventually some copy errors can occur. So the xerox copy of one cell to another, there's an error in it. When that happens, the cells program can stop growing, stop reproducing, Just lay there and wait to get killed off by your body's system. Called autophagy. Autophagy, auto eating. And when you're 18 years old and you go to sleep at night, you stop eating between say 10pm and 6am and your body is triggered to go through autophagy. And it goes up and cleans up those cells when you're 50. Doesn't happen at night. Might take two or three days of fasting. That's why you hear about intermittent fasting, which we're not doing. So these cells that are senescent start building up in our body, and that's what leads to arthritis, heart failure, degeneration of kidneys, older skin and senescent. Senolytic drugs are actually based on chemotherapy drugs because again, this is part of cancer and it's selectively killing off those cells that are mutated in the siling there. And the drugs we use are selected based on their history of being specific for the synthetic activity. Very short half life, meaning they don't last very long, your body about two hours. And we know the safety of them because they've been used for other uses. Two of them actually considered vitamins and one of them is actually a drug. So the course that we put people on and it goes through and destroys those cells. That way you have less of these senescent cells. And when those are gone, your healthy cells start growing again. Because when there's a pool of senescent cells, they're signaling other cells in immediate area, hey, there might be something wrong with this. Let's just stop growing and just kind of lay here until we get eaten up, which might not occur. Go to the kind of the protocol for that, if you would.

Yeah. So the desantinib is the first analytic. It comes from a compounding pharmacy. And you're going to take that pill every day for three days, once a quarter. And that will help clean up like he's talking about the dead dying cells. That one is prescription. There's two others that come from Amazon, Quercetin and Fisetin that I have. The patients go online, give them exactly which ones to buy, and at the same time that they do the dib, they will take the Corin, the Fisetin for three days, once a quarter. After they take that, I like to get them back in to do IV exosomes or IV stem cell more for wellness protocol. So you talk about how the dead dying cells are cleaned up. Now when we do IV stem cells, your internal repair system helps turn that back on and can really focus on the more healthy cells.

Let's go back to that. You said use exosomator stem cells. So stem cells, not to be aware, confusing embryonic stem cells, which we actually build from an embryo or human derived stem cells. So typical stem cells we're using are derived from your old fat. We take some fat out of you, maybe about a couple teaspoons, and then send it to the lab. They take the stem cells out and bank them for you. Or we can buy stem cells from that came from placentas that work in healthy D donors. Exosomes, on the other hand, are a product of stem cells there's an entire secretome of cells of these stem cells, a lot of things they secrete and one of them is exosomes. And exosomes seem to be one of the motors that drives things to heal from a stem cell, from a stem cell standpoint. So the idea is if we're killing off old cells and you take an exosome injection, you stimulate the sleeping stem cells that come back awake in your body. And that could be done typically IV or into a joint or something. So the next thing we look at is a gene called sirtuin, SIRT1 and it's silent inflammatory regulator type 1. And this gene, when it's turned on, it slows down aging in every animal tested and in human tissues. And the drug that's being studied for right now was a vitamin. The FDA just recently started banning it because they want it to be a drug to be prescribed and so get it. I bought a three year supply because I knew it was going to come in short. Five is called nmn. Now it's a NMN is a precursor to something called nad. And NAD turns on sirtuin. So we take na. NMN seems to be the most suitable version of it, but you can't take nad. This is right now something that's over the counter, but again not widely available as the FDA's going to prohibit the manufacturing of it so that a drug company can sell it to us probably for a bajillion dollars. And that is something that people would take 2 grams every day or 1 gram every day. It's being studied right now in different circumstances. That appears to make people more vital, more strong even. It's being studied in athletes and in the military. Make people work harder, faster, running longer. Another pathway is called ampk and the classic prototype for that is actually metformin, the diabetic drug. That metformin is being studied as an anti aging drug right now. We don't necessarily use it for that, but that is one of the drugs. The other one is called alpha ketoglutarate and that turns this, this pathway on gluten, those two. So then getting back to Danielle, the next thing she's looking at is called rapamycin. So we're going to go over rapamycin.

Yeah, so then this would be phase two. So now we're getting into the general inhibitors phase two. Rapamycin is also called into the compounding pharmacy. I typically give you a year supply, you take it once a week for two months at a time and then you take a two Month holiday. So I like to do it two months on, two months off. And that is going to be in addition to your senolytics that you do for three days in a row, once a quarter.

Okay. So the rapamycin goes after the genetic pathway and the protein pathway mtor. And MTOR was named after the drug is called mechanistic target of rapamycin. So rapamycin was discovered on the Easter island island called Rapa decades ago. They went to this island to find unique compounds. And this was actually an antifungal compound made by bacteria. So it would compete with fungus. And medical use since the 90s had meant for prevention of kidney transplant rejection after a kidney transplant. And then we discovered other uses for it. So it is the, it's being studied right now in something called, I think called the Pearl trial. Yeah, the Pearl trial at UCLA to see if this, what's the proper dosing to extend human lifespan. And if it does, every animal and plant, it's been studied in extended lifespan, anywhere from 5 to 30%. We haven't had that study done in humans yet. So it's a lot of evidence based medicine based on preliminary studies, evidentiary studies and then animal studies. So that's one of those things that's kind of out there yet that's commonly used in anti aging, anti aging practice. Then the next one comes after the idea of restoring the thymus gland. So back in the 90s, there's a study in University of Wisconsin by Dr. Rudman where he looked at human growth hormone, which is rare at that time. It's hard to get it for 60 year old men. And he measured features of aging at the time. We didn't have genetic clocks back then or biologic aging, but we had bone strength, bone density, weight, obesity, metabolic health, speed, thinking speed. He put him on growth hormone five days a week for I think it was six months. And those measures of aging actually went backwards. And that caught on to where people started buying growth hormone for anti aging purposes. And it became very popular. And this is a drug that costs roughly now about 15,000 a year. This led the FDA to restrict its use because what happened at that time is growth hormone was not abundant. It is now. They can make it by the bucket load. But back then it's kind of hard to make. And children that needed it to grow into normal stature, short stature, children would take it and there was a short supply. So they actually made that one of the only drugs that is regulated, that you cannot use it for any purpose other than growth hormone. Deficiency. So it really can't be used as an anti aging drug anymore because the FDA moved it to the FDCA and made it not legal for anti aging purposes. There are drugs that are analog to growth hormone. There's both growth hormone, Segrox, meaning they cause growth hormone, secreting growth hormone, releasing hormones and then analogs of growth hormone. We're using growth hormone release hormone if you want to redo that.

Yeah, that one's called Sermorelin. So that one is an injection. So the others are capsules that you take as pills orally. The Sermorelin is an injection. So it's five days a week for two months at a time. So you take it five days a week, you do a little injection in the stomach, kind of like our semaglutide subcutaneous injections. Five days a week for two months. Same thing.

Thank you. This week, the history. So I talked about the Rudman study. Well, after that came the Fahey study in 2019, September. Dr. Fahey, he was an expert in cryobiology where he knew how to freeze things and he was trying to make a freezable, a freeze dried version of growth hormone didn't have to be refrigerated. And he was also working on restoring thymus glands with growth hormones. And he was doing Dr. Horvath's work. Dr. Horvath was the inventor of the epigenetic clock in 2014. So they worked on a project that can this potentially reverse the epigenetic clock. So we put adult men again in their 50s. The reason they use men is that men require less growth hormone than women. So it's a cost issue. This is a self funded study. They put men on growth hormone about five days a week along with two medications to mitigate a side effect of growth hormone. So blood sugar creeps up. So they put them on metformin and DHEA as well. And they did it for six months. They measured their genetic age at the beginning of the study and then aged one year chronologically. They measured their age at the end of the study. So a year later they had gone backwards 1.5 years. In other words, they aged backwards 2.5 years. They actually physically aged another year or chronologically aged another year. So it went backwards two and a half years. That was called the TRIM X study. There's another TRAMEX study going on right now. They have opened up to women. It's ongoing, it is self funded. So if you enter it, you can ask to enter it and then you have to pay for the medicine. I Think it costs you about $20,000 a year. But this is not practical. And again, they're under an FDA review process where they can do this. In the study, we're not using growth hormone because it's been banned by our government again for another reason. Maybe it doesn't make any sense. And the government doesn't even recognize aging as a disease. That's something that right now there's a big study called pain trial where they're trying to demonstrate to the FDA that aging is in fact should be considered disease if we can modify it. So that's ongoing. So kind of wrapping that up, we go through the wellness is assumed. We're not going to treat somebody that's not already working on their health, working on their weight, working on their exercise. They've already made sure that they don't have some disease of their heart, disease of the brain. They've got cancer going on. Those things need to be dressed very, very first for longevity. So we want to get an ultrasound of the arteries or cat's handed arteries to see how old your heart is. Want to make sure you don't cancer doing a full body mri, maybe a liquid biopsy and then measure the age of the brain, which we have available now in Michigan for the first time. It's called neuroquant through bionic imaging in South Field. And then after that we address whether we need to do some issue with the joints. We know if somebody has one joint arthritis that impairs mobility in their normal weight, they lose 1.8 healthy years of life and they're overweight and have one joint, it's 3.6 years. So obviously we want to fix that. If they have sleep apnea and their score is over 30, we know their lifestyle is shortened by 6.4 years. So we want to fix that. If they have venous stasis, which is a circulation problem, well, we can check that with this vigil or an ultrasound and make sure we fix that because that has an impact on long difference. We want to do all that stuff first, but then we also want to start rolling the clock backwards. We're doing other things. And you know, Daniel, I've presented my personal history before. So I started this journey in 2017. In 2017 I was 53, 61 now. So before my birthday and I decided that in order to accomplish things my life I needed to accomplish, I needed 400 quarters, which is 100 years. So I set my leave the earth day at 153. Then a backwards engineer how to make it happen. So at that time genetic clocks weren't widely available. Some of these things were new. So I had to learn. It started going all over the country, you know, outside of the country to figure out what people are doing to measure age and reverse it. And I have my family heart disease where the men died young of heart disease. My dad had his first stroke at 44, his bypass at 45, and I had the heart attack gene. I have the heart attack gene and I had a little bit of atherosclerosis, probably from a period when I was ill 10 years. But I had something going on in my life and my heart age was two years older than me. So I did an aggressive intervention. I saw Joel Khan and Bingham Farms here in Michigan and he worked with me to get my cardiac age reverse and went from two years older than me to 14 years younger. So I changed at 16 years. Then I measured my brain age Alpius in San Diego, that's Peter Diamandis company And it's kind of related to Fountain Life right now. You might have heard about life, he's in that with Tony Robbins now. So I measured my brain age and my brain age was at the 88 percentile from age, which is good, higher number is better. I did a one year intervention to reverse my brain age that my mother had Alzheimer's and reversed my brain age where I'm now at that 95 percentile per 20 year old. So I really can't get Alzheimer's in the next 20, 30 years. Then I made sure I didn't have cancer, did cancer genetic tests. I really had much risk for cancer. My big risk is heart disease and diabetes. I looked at my bone age, my bones were good age, but right now my bone density is at the highest percentile for a 20 year old. My VO2 max, which is my ability to exert force, that's a device I would go to Wayne State, get myself measure for my baselines. My VO2 max is 51, which is at the 90 percentile for a 30 year old when I keep it there. And I'm stronger than I ever have been in my life, at least as strong as I was when I was 35. But I really wasn't focusing on strength training then, so I'm actually stronger than I was then. And my, my biologic age in the last 28 months has aged by 10 months and my genes are going backwards. So my genetic age was slightly older than I am and now it's substantially younger. So my genetic age on average five years over A course of a couple years. And I still have gray hair, still bald. But even in the animal studies, the animals would grow their hair back and their gray would get darkened. We're probably not going to see that in humans. And there's certain things that probably won't change. The unfortunate not to have arthritis. I did have it in my spine, my neck spine, so I had surgery on that. But my other joints are pretty healthy. So I preventatively do PRP in my joints because I have a genetic risk for knee arthritis. I did my genetic testing, and I'm just trying to stay on top of this because I'm in when if I want to live to 153. I'm 61 now. I got a long ways to go. Nine years and I've got to make sure my teeth are good. I want to eat with my own teeth. I want to be mobile under my own horse. I want to be a badass at 100, which means I got to be badass now. And that's. That's the game plan. I think we're see that one of the biggest industries in healthcare is going to be the ability to live longer. And what I've noticed the pattern is most people love their money and their things more than themselves. And there's a subset of the population that loves themselves more than their money and things. Those are our patients. They're coming in here to get some cosmetic stuff, but they also want to look better on the inside. I'll give you a classic example. I'll see somebody. I'm underwater, and I'll see somebody with a big boat, sexy, expensive boat, and the engine. Maybe the trophy girlfriend. And they're smoking and obese and drinking too much. They love their stuff more than themselves. And they're gonna. They're not gonna live to 100, not gonna 80. So you put your back. And I'm not saying that's a wrong thing to do. Not at all. That's not what I'm doing. I do drive the nice boat, but life's doing pretty good.

But say too, some. Some patients I was talking to, my brother actually is talking about, you know, do you love your money more than yourself? And he's like, no, but I love my life more than my money. I love my family, you know, more than my money. And I thought that was an interesting perspective too, to think about even yourself. Maybe you would say, I love my life or my family even more than my money.

Right. So you want to. I want to extend that as long as possible.

Exactly.

Grandchildren at 11 months and 3 years old and you know, it'd be nice to see their kids.

Yeah, I think it's interesting too how we know, really you talk about your genetic age, at what age are you going to be diagnosed with heart disease? It's like 40s, 50s, you know. So we know, okay, we got to prevent heart disease, we got to get that CIMT early on, you got to be exercising early on, you got to take care of yourself and eating healthier early, early on. And then we know with that genetic clock, it's almost like a ticking time bomb. Six thousand and seventies, you could get cancer. That's what people die of, cancer at that age. So why not earlier on do that full body MRI and detect if you're going to have a small, small tumor that is not palpable yet, you know, or do that liquid biopsy early on before you get to that ticking time Bob, where cancers are typically diagnosed. And then in your 80s, that's when it's going to be Alzheimer's dementia. That's what patients are dying of. So why not early on do that neuro quantitative test MRI of the brain and start doing some things early on to help stimulate brain function and prevent Alzheimer's disease. People don't realize that you can actually prevent these things or we know when they're going to happen and so when is the time to start doing it?

So just a public service announcement, the full body MRI throughout the country you can get prenupo and their chains is Google Pernuvo. Full body MRI in Michigan. They can't really open here because Congress does not allow new MRIs. Our star state doesn't. But there's a place called Bionic MRI. Dr. Ringwald who's passed away, he started it and I just got an announcement from his son that they reduced price from 2900 to 2200 or 2300 somewhere in there. And it's not just the full body MRI for cancer, it's also the brain measurement. So the neuro quantum. So it's kind of a new thing that's rolled out. I know he says through the end of December. So I'm going to go get mine done again. I did last year, probably sooner than I need to, but I want to get this. I have not done my brain in two years. So if you get in there before the end of the year, I know they like the business because this is a hard business being there's something that people know of and they've reduced the price a lot. It does get Read by a radiologist. The nurse practitioner. Dr. Will review your results with you and the radiologist. And I can't communicate that, but they do. They do a great job. Really proud of them. So get in there. Daniel, I appreciate your time.

Yeah. I think it's just important to point out as well, you talk about your story of reversing heart age, reversing brain age. That certainly does not come easy.

Right.

So these patients that come in, you know, they're not expecting to not eat healthy, exercise, do additional things and get healthier. You know, get healthier or live longer or reverse their age. So the patients that come see us, they're already. They're coming in maybe for some Botox and filler. They're coming in because they're. They want to take care of themselves. And then from there we convert them into the wellness, the hormone replacement. They want to take care of themselves. They want to feel better, have more energy. Maybe they want to lose the weight. A lot of them don't know that we can reverse this early on, but they kind of move through the cycle in our business and then continue to feel better. And that's when they can, you know, get into the age reversal program. But I'm. What I wanted to point out is that it doesn't come easy. Our patients that start this program, they're not going to all of a sudden, you know, they're not looking for a magic pill. This is something that you have to work at like you do every day.

So I'm going to kind of recap some things that people might want to get started on testing. I think that's a good place to start. So for cardiac testing, there's two things I recommend. One is called a cimt. Cry it into media thickness. That's an ultrasound. If you Google Bail donee B A L E based D O N E E N. There's a group of doctors that belong to Bail Donine that can measure for you. We have it here at Lure. We have some doctors in our areas that do the same thing. Then there's Clery C L E E R L Y. There's Clery centers all over the country. That's a CT scan. It's about 1500. The ultrasound about 300. So both are good to the heart. Full body MRI. I talked about prenovo here in Michigan. Bionic MRI. The testing, we use mydnah, mydnah.com. there's also truage. Those are both epigenetic tests. And then the biologic age. There's two that I'm familiar with. Now, the biologic age is imperfect. None of these tests are perfect. But there's the Function Health. They're a newer company founded by Dr. Mark Hyman and others. That's $500. And it gives you not only your biologic age, but it also gives you over a hundred other chemical markers. And there's one, David Sinclair's company, things called Inner Age, which I'm not sure about. That one I did a few years ago. So I would recommend the function health. That's $500. It's done at any local quest you don't need a prescription for. You actually go online and sign up for it. I just did mine again last month. Test came back fast, so I'm not gonna recommend the other one. This one is Fast Function Function Health. So it's Function Health. Google that and you can sign up for it. And there is a little bit of a waiting list, but it's usually a day or two before you can get signed up for it.

When you move to the age reversal medications, it's a newer program, so I think the price is really reasonable. But plan on it's about 4,500 for the year for our old age deferred. I also like how you called it that before Old age deferred. For this program, it's around $4,500. I like to do it in phases so that patients can understand, you know, what they're taking and how they're going to feel. I haven't seen many side effects, but again, it's not a magic weight loss pill. This is something that you have to be disciplined with and you're going to work at and something that is going to be part of your life, you know, going forward, that you really want to live longer, eat healthier exercise.

The thing that happens is that you don't really feel anything, but it's maybe the lack of feeling stuff. So I'm 61 and my physical performance is like something in 30s, but I remember that. So it's not like I'm feeling something different. But I know I'm faster than men my age. I can know I can lift way more weight than most men my age. I'm not that muscular. I'm just like, I've got a low body fat. I have some muscle, but I'm not a big bodybuilder. But I can lift more weight than most guys. And my muscles are younger, so you don't feel something notably different. But just like even in cosmetic stuff, when we do something and get rid of people's wrinkles. They remember looking like that. They don't like think they look different anyway. They look at pictures. That's why we use measurements.

What it means to have old age deferred.

Right.

Because it's how you feel. You might think, okay, I'm old at 60, I don't feel old. I'm deferring that, looking old and feeling old until I'm a hundred.

I get around my peers and they're all my age or they're growing and I'm like, I really don't feel that. The noticeable thing I, I did feel one thing and one thing only. When I first did the senolytic drugs. There was a certain sequence of things I do when I travel. I was immediately able to do way more push ups. So I'll do like more 60 pushups then 50 and then 40. And when I did the senolytics, my media went up to 75 and 80 for the first one. Then I went was on my elliptical. I met my proper speed, proper friction and my heart rate should have been 126 or 116. And I had that permanently increased the friction since that time. So versus say five years ago. It's easier for me on the elliptical now because my biologic and genetic age and my muscle age has gone backwards and I'm stronger than I was five years. I mean I'm noticeably stronger, but I'm not that much bigger. My weight is Approximately, say I'm 190 pounds, about 8% body fat hasn't fluctuated much, but the muscles are more like.

A youthful muscle and that's great. And you are disciplined, working out every day even when you're traveling to the other locations, making sure that you get your workout in.

Yeah, I mean that's the thing. It's not easy. So there's foods I will always avoid and I do cheat once in a while, but I generally don't. I feel like I drink a little too much because when I travel tend to go out and drink. So I'm kind of watching that, the exercising, I'm really diligent about that. I rarely take a cheat day, just do something every day and that's something that you know, if you're going to do this stuff, that's a big part of it.

Yeah. And I think results can be endless. I mean you talk about 16 years, that's extremely disciplined. Someone who wants to add four, five, six, seven years, that could be priceless to them.

Yeah. So one of our. I'm Allowed to talk about Mark. He's a good friend of mine and he's been a visor of our practice for a while. He was worried about Alzheimer's. His mother got Alzheimer's in her 60s. I think he's about 63 now. And when he first started working with us, he's a little out of shape. Not a little. He was out of shape, wasn't exercising, a little overweight.

Sleep apnea.

Yeah, sleep apnea. And he was coming out here and doing some coaching with me and really helped us build our vein practice back a decade ago. And I started talking to him about, hey, you know, let's get healthy. You're my coach, but let me coach you on your health. He lost the weight, got healthier, then he started participating in some of our stuff. He had a bad sleep apnea school, we fixed that. He had some joint issues. We took care of those. We put him on some HRT and his wife. He was the most disciplined lifestyle change guy I ever saw though. He went from no running to he's going to start exercising every day. He went from eating horrible to became a vegan. Now, I'm not saying you should go become a vegan. His genetics said he should. His cholesterol dropped like a rock. His weight dropped like a rock. His strength went up. His brain age. His brain age changed so dramatically, his brain was actually in little trouble. So he had no cognitive issues whatsoever. But his score was in a lower percentile for his age. Now it's an upper percentile. I mean, it was a pretty. It was like in a year. Changed very fast. Maybe largely due to the sleep apnea being resolved or cured. His glycolic age. His glycolic age, which is the age of your. It's a special test. I'm not going to get into that. It went back so far that the CEO of the company makes it called him and said, what's going on? He actually went back 29 years old. His genetic age went back about three years in one year. So that was kind of fun. He was one of the guys beside myself because he's my friend that we were first working on this with. And he said, you know, Dr. Wilk, you really gotta offer this to other people. And we decided to make this a product that we can, we can offer to people to add years to our community. South.

Yeah, it seems now, you know, middle age, it's like 80s, you know, we're living longer now because we take care of ourselves earlier on.

Well, you know, Mick Jagger is jumping across the screen dancing away. He's doing something. You know, it's not just diet and exercising. I mean he could just have Eugene but probably he's seen the top doctors in the world and this is, you know, the reality is this is happening. I go to a lot of anti aging groups and it, it's happening. It's not mainstream. Your family doctor, they're not going to talk to you about this. In fact it's almost like a threat to general medicine because if we are super healthy at 60, don't really need a doctor to be doing your A1Cs and your testing and manage your, your blood pressure aggressively and doing all kinds of tests. So healthcare is not going to love this, but it's, it's coming.

It is all cash pay. It's, it's loving your life or your self more than your money.

Spend your money on health insurance with your like your car insurance, your home insurance, your car insured, not checking your oil, your home insurance not making sure you're getting on fire. But a catastrophe occurs and that's what healthcare insurance is supposed to do. It's not designed to make you live longer. So don't expect your insurance going to pay for stuff that makes you live longer. It's really not in their interest.

Even your gym membership, you know, that you talk about or the healthy foods at Whole Foods or the grocery store, hormone replacement, you know, unfortunately is not covered by insurance. The sleep apnea is going to be catch pay but the, the weight loss, you know, for patients that don't have a BMI over 40 or 35. So it's that definitely something that it's out here, it's there, it's available for you. You just got to come in and take advantage of it.

Very much. Thanks Danielle.