239: Ten Years - The Seasons of Pinch of Yum with Lindsay Ostrom

Foreign.

Welcome. Welcome to the Food Blogger Pro podcast, my friend. I'm Alexa, and on behalf of the entire Food Blogger Pro team, we are so thrilled and honored that you're here. Today's episode is just so, so good, you guys. Just one of my favorites. So if you're unaware, Food Blogger Pro, that's our membership site for food bloggers, was created Bjork Ostrom. And he's the guy that you typically hear interviewing people here on the podcast, as well as Lindsay Ostrom, who is the blogger extraordinaire behind the food blog Pinch of Yum. Lindsay started pinch of yum 10 years ago this year, which is just an incredible feat and she has built it into a popular, thriving blog business and brand. In this episode, you'll hear about the different seasons of Pinch of Yum and how Lindsay navigated them while building her blog into a business. And she covers it all for from running her blog as a side hustle, to transitioning it to being her full time gig, to hiring team members and to current day, you'll hear it all straight from Lindsay today. It's a really great episode. Just a really genuine from the heart discussion between two awesome people and I know you're going to love it. So without any further ado, Bjork, take it away.

Lindsay, welcome back to the podcast.

Well, thank you for having me.

Yep. I think that you are probably, and this makes sense, you are probably the most frequent guest, but it's almost like you are a, I would say a silent co host on the podcast because we talk about Pinch of Yam, we talk about the work that you're doing and you, you probably don't even know that. So it's good to actually have you on the podcast to get some information straight from the source. So good to have you back. Thanks for being here.

Yeah, thanks.

Uh, I am, we are actually in the same building, but I, I never do like in person interviews. We've done one or two before, you and I, but it's, it's almost easier to not be in the same room. So I ended up walking down the hallway. I've gone into another room. So we're. Same building. We could have done it in person, but we're going to split this up because it just feels a little bit more natural. And then I feel like I can be interviewing you as opposed to husband and wife sitting in the same room. So I'll try and I'll try and make this as, as much as possible like you are a guest on the podcast as opposed to Us sitting down at the table. But maybe that's a good thing. We'll see how it goes.

Yeah, I don't know if that's a bad thing. It's. I feel like a little of both is probably good.

Sounds good. I will sprinkle in a little of both. So we were chatting a little bit before hitting record on this, and we said, you know, we had a kind of a general idea of where we wanted to focus, but we said, what would it look like to. To talk about kind of where we are with Pinch of Yum right now, but also look back a little bit and analyze where Pinch of Yum has been? And my hope with the podcast, whenever, especially whenever we do an interview, is that we can have a conversation with somebody who can tell their story. And from that, people who are listening can pull out advice that they can apply to their story or tactical things that they can implement. And so I think it's both. And one is kind of story advice and hearing a story and applying that to our story, and then one is, like, on the ground, tactical advice. Here's a tip trick or advice that I would give to people. So what we're going to do for this episode is, is we're going to talk about Pinch of Yam and kind of the different seasons of Pinch of Yam and knowing that we're in a season right now where we're saying we're kind of looking forward and saying, what does the next iteration of Pinch of Yam look like? So if you were to look back at the different seasons of Pinch of Yam, could you kind of separate those out into chapters or. I don't know what you'd want to call them seasons, chapters. But would you be able to kind of put a marker in between different periods of time for Pinch of Yum?

Yeah, I think there for sure. I think there are some, like, lines that can be drawn to kind of segment different times in the story of Pinch of Yum and, like, the. The journey to get here where we are today. So I think probably the first one. The first one would just be like, it wasn't. It was my side hustle. Blogging was my side hustle. And even I would maybe even add like, a. Like a. Like, it's a 1a and 1b and 1a is like, it's my side hustle. And I don't really care about it, like, in the way of. I'm not trying to. Like, it's just purely a really random thing for fun. That's pretty much like exclusively 2009, like that doesn't really go. Or 2010. Um, just those first years. Like, it really is a short period of time because as soon as I started to do more of it and post more and like try more recipes and get into photography, it quickly snowballed into something that I was very interested in. But in the very beginning, it was pretty casual. It was kind of like, hey, I'll. I'll do this and you know, I'll go for a month without posting and then I'll. And then I'll post again. And it was just kind of dipping my toe in the water, I think. And then. Yeah, and then the 1B. So like the second part of that first phase is it's still not my full time job. I'm doing it as a side hustle. I was a teacher. I was a fourth grade teacher. Those of you that have followed along with Pinch of Yum for a period of time, like, you might know this already, but. So that's what I thought I was gonna do for the rest of my life. I was a fourth grade teacher and I really loved it. And I would just work on the blog on nights and weekends, working on recipes and photography and do all that outside of my. Outside of my normal 9 to 5, which was my job as a teacher. So I think that period of time while I was still teaching and also working on Pinch of Yum is, is also part of that, that first chunk of time. But even within, I don't know, I think that, that it hopefully makes sense what I'm saying. But even within that first chunk of time where, like Pinch of Yum wasn't my full time job, I was just doing it as a hobby. I feel like there's. Even within that, there's that the two sides of that where it's like I was just doing it and I was doing it and trying to make it into something.

Yeah, it's. It's interesting. So, as you know, there's a period of my time where I was really into songwriting, playing guitar. And I like to use that as an analogy sometimes because I think it helps to move us outside of a certain genre, in this case blogging, and to look at it from a different perspective. And I feel like it's similar to when you pick up a musical instrument, whether that be guitar or piano or violin. There's a period of time where it's like, gosh, this is, this is something I really love and I'm interested in doing it and I'll pick up and I'll play it and maybe set it down and not be super intentional about it. But then you might say, hey, you know what? Actually, like, I could go and play a show at a coffee shop. And you start to get more intentional about practicing and making sure that you are memorizing the songs that you're going to play and you're not having to look at sheet music to play those songs. And it feels like with Pinch of Yum, there's this period of time where it was kind of your hobby. Like this is a fun thing to do. I enjoy the process of it. I enjoy taking photos and doing recipes and posting. And then it kind of transitioned into this phase where now it's like people are looking at it. People tell you, hey, I made this recipe. And it kind of starts to become a thing and it switches over into being not just a little thing on the side, but a side hustle. And I'm interested to know what happened to switch that over. Was it exposure? Was it people telling you that they're following? Was it people commenting? Or was it just a drive to do something better?

I think all of the above. I think I just kind of got, got hooked. Like I got bit by the bug of all the things, you know, blogging and online related. But I think, yeah, for sure. Like I started to kind of build a community where like I knew I had people reading besides just, you know, my mom and my grandma or whatever. Actually, probably realistically my dad, he's like always been a great blog checker in the history of me blogging about various things. But yeah, I feel like there was just a shift that started to happen as people, as the blog gained traction then it also became more fun for me and became more exciting for me and was something that I like wanted to continue to build. So I think it was both. And I remember my mom and my sisters and I went on like a girls trip. Maybe it was a year after I had started Pinch of Yum. So I had been, you know, blogging kind of as a hobby very loosely for the first year. And then I remember on this vacation that I went on, we were on a cruise, which you don't get, like, great, I don't know, maybe now you do. But at the time it was like a really big deal to get Internet. I don't even know if I had a smartphone at that point. And so like, and I, and I definitely didn't bring a laptop or anything on this trip, but I remember paying to use like the, the cruise ship computer and like, super slow Internet.

Yeah.

Probably way. Exactly. But, like, paying way too much for this terrible Internet connection. Because I wanted to check, like, my stats. Like, I wanted to check, you know, hey, like, I had. I had drafted content in advance so that it would publish while I was gone. And then I kind of wanted to, like, go in and be working on it a little bit while I was on this vacation. And that was, for me, like, I think that was a moment where I just have that in my mind as a significant moment. Like, this is more than just like, I'm on vacation and I want to keep working on this. So I really was getting pulled. Feeling that pull towards it and feeling the tug towards doing more at that point. And I think it's all those things you mentioned. I think it was like getting more exposure. At the time, food sharing sites were really big. So like, food Gawker or taste spotting. And I would love to go into those sites and see, like, you know, how many people favorited my. Did it get accepted and then how many people liked it and how much traffic did I get from that. And. Yeah, and I think I just sort of got pulled in to all that stuff.

Yeah. What advice would you have? Well, before I ask that question, how much of that was you embracing? The grind versus the pull and desire to work on something that didn't feel like a grind? Because I think it's important to separate that out, because sometimes it feels like the message that we receive is like, you gotta embrace the grind, put your head down, you know, hustle, hustle, hustle. And at its worst, it can seem like, do work that you don't enjoy in order to be successful. But on the other side, I think there's a reality of people hustling doing work at its best. What it then becomes is this, like, desire to do something you really love doing and almost can't help but do in that stage, what was it? And could you separate it out into like a percentage? Was it 100%, I love to do this. 80, 20, what was it?

I think in that stage it was pretty heavily. I love to do this. I don't think there was really much feeling of like. Like obligation. Like, I need to do this because I'm. Because honestly, at that point, I didn't. I didn't have any idea in my mind of, like, I didn't have a goal to leave my day job. Like, I just love to do it. And. And so it was kind of like, I already loved to talk about food. And then you add in some. You Know, kind of addicting in a good and bad way, like metrics and, you know, like, social validation and. And then I think the hamster wheel starts and then you're, like, on it and you're running and. But for me, it never felt like. I don't think in that stage it ever felt like, gosh, I have to do this stuff that I really don't want to do. I did feel like my to do list was a mile long, but I loved it. I don't know. The weird thing is, like, if I went back and asked myself at the time, why are you doing this? And I don't know, I think I would just say, because I'm having fun growing this thing and because I love to talk to people about food. Like, I think that's what would have been, what I would have said. Whereas there are other times, and maybe we'll talk about this, you know, coming up. But, like, there are other seasons where it did feel more like a grind, and it was like, there is a clear goal I'm working towards, and in order to get to that goal, you know, this is what needs to happen. And even if I don't want to do it. But in the first, in the beginning, so much of it was just like, I was just like on a roller coaster ride. Like, I just was loving it and was having a lot of fun with these things that I had no experience with. And even social media in general was so, like, young at that point. Like, now we're all used to, like, Instagram likes and how many people watched your story and how many people pinned this and. But that felt like such a. A foreign concept or like a new thing at that time. So I think it was the combination of. I'm not sure if this is really answering your question, but I think it was the combination of, like, me really liking the work and also me really liking those metrics and watching them grow.

Yeah, it's. So Kevin, who is a coach that I worked with for a period of time, a business coach, one of the things that he would often talk about, and he was interviewed on the podcast as well, and we'll link to that in the show notes. But one of the things Kevin would often talk about is playing the game. And it's a helpful mindset for me to have as it relates to work, because I think it allows me to think of it not as work, which I think sometimes can seem like there's an obligation and it's heavy and it's not fun, but it's. But Playing the game kind of has a lightness to it. And it seems like in. In that phase, you were. It was really pure, like you were playing the game.

And, yeah, 100%.

It was fun to play a game.

Yeah, it was really fun. Yeah.

Yeah. And the advice then within that is both for myself and I think for people who listen, what are the ways that you can play a game with the work that you're doing? And it kind of reminds me of something you've talked about before on the podcast, but this idea of the trickster. Yeah. Can you talk about that for people who aren't familiar with that concept and where it comes from?

Yeah, and I will do my best with it. It's been a while since I read this book, but this comes from the book Big Magic by Elizabeth Gilbert. And in it she talks about this concept of there are kind of two ways to like your work, and especially I think your creative work, because that's what the whole book is about, is kind of creative inspiration and the life of an idea and things like that. So there's the trickster on the one side, and then there's the martyr. And the martyr, it's pretty clear what the martyr is. The martyr is like, I'm in the grind. This is really hard. And like, I kind of woe is me a little bit. Like, this is hard work, and I am working so hard. And that's kind of the framework of the martyr. And then the frame, the mental framework of the trickster is like, I'm playing the game, I'm having fun. Like, this is kind of like, nobody's making me do this. I'm choosing to do this and shifting that. You might be doing literally the exact same work, but having that mindset shift of, like, why you're doing it and. And what your. Feels a little simplistic to say, like, what your attitude is about. About a task. But, like, I think. I think her the main idea is like, find those things where you can really be a trickster. Like, a lot of the time where you can feel. And she also uses this term light on your feet. Like, that you are. Yeah. That you're like, you're just moving and going and work that you're producing and work that you're creating doesn't feel, like, heavy and hard. I say that with, like a huge asterisk because I, of course there's going to be times and there have been times for binge of yum and for me, where it does feel hard, it's really hard. So that's not at all to like diminish that. But I think there's just something really helpful. I'm the kind of person that easily goes down the spiral of like, oh, this is so hard. I'm working so hard. Nobody else is working as hard as, you know, that kind of thing can easily fall into martyr thinking. And so I think just having, setting those two frameworks out in front of me and saying like, okay, how can I really lean into the trickster side of my brain with the work that I'm doing and the content I'm creating? And, and I think during that phase it was, I was 100% trickster. Like I had no, that's because I had no. Like, I wasn't trying to get anywhere. I was literally doing it just to do it.

Right. Yeah. And, and when, when to use the music analogy, when you just enjoy the process of like picking up your guitar and playing it. Or I'll go over to a coffee shop, Dunn Brothers, and there's a guy who comes and plays piano there. It's like he's not trying to sell CDs, he's not trying to get more followers on Instagram. My assumption is just he really likes playing piano. And in the, on a Wednesday afternoon at 1 o', clock, he'll go and sit down and play piano. And it, it's a different type of intent for your work. So my question then is, and I'm guessing this would maybe be in the next chapter. When do, when do you feel like, well, let's start with this. It'll be a two part question. What is the next chapter? And in that chapter, would that be a season where you started to need to use the concept of trickster as it relates to doing your creative work?

Well, okay, I'll just. You tell me if I'm answering your question or not or you can reroute me. But I think what, what happened from that initial playing the game, having a lot of fun, doing it just to do it kind of phase. Moving into the next phase. I would define the next phase as like when I left my job and pinch of yum became my full time thing. But that mindset changed before I got to that point. So like it for, in order for me to leave my job, obviously we needed to like there needed to be income generated from the blog. And that is, that takes some work. Like that's not gonna just happen by me being like do, do, do, I'm having so much fun, you know, and whatever. Like there needs to be some intention behind It. And so I do think some of the, I don't even know if it was really martyr thinking, it was just getting a little more intentional with some of that stuff leading into that transition. So for ex of the things that I did to help us be able to build an income from Pinch of Yam. And really it started as an experiment, which I think speaks to the trickster mentality. It started as like, I don't know if this is possible. And you saying, I don't know if this is possible. Both of us just kind of been shrugging our shoulders and being like, what if? Is this a thing? Can people make money from a food blog? Let's give it a try. And so it really, even at the outset had that trickster mentality. But then as we got closer, as we did start making money and as we got closer to the point of saying like, hey, maybe we're actually going to leave our jobs. I'm going to leave my job as a teacher to do this full time, then I feel like naturally things just become a little heavier. Like, can't just be doing whatever you want on a whim all the time because this is now going to be your livelihood. And actually it's interesting to go back to that book Big Magic, because one of the arguments that she makes in that book is that you shouldn't make your creative pursuit your job, which I did, but because you can't fully be, you know, in trickster mentality 247 with your, with your creative passion if it's also responsible for paying your bills. And kind of her argument is to let that be. Let that be its own thing. Obviously I took a different path and you know, I'm very happy with the path that we took and feel like people have to make that decision for themselves. But. But yeah, I do think that they're the. If it. If in the beginning it was 100% trickster, I think around the time where it started to be like, okay, I'm going to do this full time and pursue this full time. You know, then it becomes maybe more like 50, 50, 50% murder, 50% trickster, where you are doing things that you don't necessarily want to be doing. I remember writing Tasty Food Photography, which was a part of building our income, which in turn was a part of us being able to. Me being able to leave my, my day job and do this full time. And there were for sure times where like I wanted to go hang out with my friends and I didn't or I wanted to go to the gym and work out. And I was like, you know what, I need to work on this or wanted to watch a movie with you. And so there was definitely that started to get more into like the I'm making sacrifices to achieve a goal kind of mindset as opposed to just like I'm doing whatever because it's fun. I don't know. I feel like that shift into like income and like this being my full time thing or not, that has huge ramifications for where you. For the mindset.

Yep. Do you feel like in. In this second season where the work that you're, the creative work that you're doing started to be the income work that you were doing and therefore the weightiness of it maybe increased a little bit. Did you shift then to doing something else as a creative outlet, like replace that in any way or maybe if not in that season. Is that something you've done?

Yeah, that's a good question. I think now I have, you know, maybe in kind of the third and current phase, which we haven't fully talked about. But. But I don't think. I think in that time it was still kind of both and. Or I was like hustling so hard to make it work that I didn't really have time for any other extra creative thing. I think at that time it was like, this is my creative thing and this is my job. This is, this is. Or I'm trying to make it my job. It's both of those things together.

So let's, let's stay in that second chapter for a little bit and talk about a few things. Can you remember in that season, how did you go about prioritizing the work that you were doing? Because I remember transitioning out and it's like suddenly you go from showing up, you're doing work and you have a pretty clear idea of what it is that you need to do. And then you transitioned into a season of you show up and you just are picking kind of what you're doing and that being a really difficult thing.

Right.

What did that look like to transition into building your own list of priorities and making sure that you were working on the right thing?

Oh man. I was constantly reworking my, my schedule and constantly doing like, I think I've talked about this before somewhere on Food Blogger Pro, but this idea that actually I think you talked to me about this Bjork, like the idea of upside down triangle and like the biggest thing going at the top, the most important thing going at the top. And, and that's where you need to spend. You know, if you think about an upside down triangle being like kind of a map of your time, like whatever is most important should be at the top and therefore should, should also take up the majority of your time. Um, I was constantly, you know, kind of reprocessing through that. Um, one thing I remember thinking after I left, officially left my teaching job, went into blogging full time, was like, what am I? How, how is it that I was able to basically do what I'm doing now, but also hold a full time job? Like, like essentially I had half the time and was doing the same amount, getting the same amount done as what. And I felt like I was working so hard and I was working so hard. Um, but like, I think, I think what I found for myself is that I needed boundaries. And one of the things that, that was actually advantageous about also having a day job while I was blogging is that I naturally had boundaries. I didn't have five hours to spend writing a post. I had like 30 minutes before I went to, literally before I drove off to school for the day. And that's what I would do when I had my teaching job. And so there was even a point after I left my teaching job where I was like, you know what? I'm going to go back to that. Even though I don't have to go to school anymore, like, I don't have to get up and do this in 30 minutes in the morning. That was a really efficient way to do it. And so I'm gonna put that boundary back on myself or put that like those parameters back. I think setting some boundaries, like that was really helpful for me and necessary because otherwise I was just spending way too much time doing things that, that were kind of. Not that they didn't matter, but were like a little bit superfluous to like the main tasks at hand. And we're eating up all of this time.

Yeah, I think eating up time. And then also I think there's something to be said about eating up brain space. Like this is a little bit of a. It's not exactly what you're saying, but I think there are also things that we have living in our head that we think are going to take a lot longer than they actually do. But if you say, okay, I have this block of time, I'm going to do it and I'm going to take care of it, then you're able to move through it actually pretty quickly. I feel like, like we have, we had a light that was out in our garage door. Opener. And I was like, gosh, this is just this project. And every time we'd go in the garage, I'd think of it and it takes like five minutes. And. And it was just me saying, like, okay, I'm going to move through this and take care of it. But idea being that usually a project doesn't need to take as long as we think it's going to take. And. And if you put those boundaries on yourself, then you, then you will realize your efficiency in a way that you don't. If you're like, oh, I have. My goal today is to write a post and I have eight hours, it's like, well, there's a really good chance that you will fill that time if you give yourself that amount of time. So one of the questions that I have related to this period of time, this chapter, kind of the second season, when you think back to that, what would your advice be for people who are doing similar work in terms of the things that actually were the most valuable? Things? Like when you look back and you say, you know, let's say it was two, three, four years, what were the things that were most impactful? Now, being two, three, four years outside of that chapter where you look back and you're like, I am so thankful that I did these because they helped to set the business up for success.

I think there are three things that kind of come to my mind and they don't really fit into, like, I can't. They're just kind of random things. They don't fit into a category neatly. But so the first thing is just content, which feels obvious. This is a content. I'm a, you know, pinch of yum is a content business. Like, that's how we do. What we do is by continuing to either refine existing content, produce new content. And so I feel like anything I did during that time related to content that was 100% my most important thing. The second thing is that happened during that time. It was starting to bring other people into the business. And I think maybe the subtext of that is paying attention to where I was most valuable and where I was, my skills were being best used and then where they weren't or like where I was struggling. And I feel like that didn't really exist before this particular phase. Like the phase when I'm like, now it's just me every day. Like, I don't have any social interaction. Like, I just. And actually that's something I really remember about this time was just being really lonely. I just remember, like, yeah, I just felt like I loved what I was doing, and I was also really lonely during the day, just not like, not talking to anybody. And. And I think paying attention to those things was an important part of that. So for me, that meant like, realizing, hey, I. I need some support doing this, this, and this, which I think at the time was probably like, you know, email processing or comments kind of community management stuff. Like, in order for me to keep doing content, this is where I. So I need more social interaction in my life in order for me to, like, thrive. And so what that led to was then hiring someone, and then it also led to the decision to start teaching workshops, which kind of leads me to my third thing that I feel like was most important was just paying attention to some of those things and then making changes accordingly. Like, hey, this is a season where I feel like, where that's something that. That's a need that I hear from people, and it's something that I feel like I have information that could help people and it would feel good for me to do this. So I don't know. Those are kind of in no particular order, I guess, or maybe content. The order of content should go, you know, be first should be the most important. But I think. I think it was a really important time for me to. To work really hard on the content. And I'm so thankful for all of that. And then it was also, I'm so thankful for the. For just, like, paying attention to what my day looked like, to where I needed help in the business and, like, where I wasn't thriving, and then kind of bringing those pieces in in the form of hiring someone, you know, getting a studio and starting to teach some workshops and, like, changing up the type of work that I'm doing. So it's not just. I think I paid attention to the tension that I felt and then tried to think of some creative solutions that benefited me, that benefited other people. And I'm really glad for that, for that paying attention.

And I think at its core, what it is is figuring out ways to make what you're doing sustainable. Because so much of the success, especially with if you're building something around content, but really, if you're building anything, so much of that has to do with sticking with it for a long period of time, and it's really hard to do. To do that and not burn out, like, even if it's something that you love doing, I think there is this potential, especially for people, like the people that listen to this podcast and for you and me to Work hard enough to the point where we will get traction or maybe won't get traction, and then burn out because of that. And I think being aware of the tension points, like you said, and working to resolve those is really critical to preserving yourself and your sanity so you can continue to do work and enjoy the work in some way. And then also important to point out, like, I think in that period of time, that second chapter, it's easy to, as you start to think about doing some of those other things, bringing a team on, potentially doing a different type of work, like workshops, you can forget about, like, the core element of what you do, which is content. And I think that's important to point out as well, like, this idea of not getting too distracted. And you were able to do that, where you're able to do workshops, but it's not like you switched over and just did workshops. Like, there's this balance between, okay, doing this workshops but continuing to keep, like, the main engine running. In the case of Pinch Yum, that was producing content and publishing recipes. So you kind of hinted at it, but my guess is that next phase kind of has to do with that idea of Pinch of Yum not just being you. Can you talk about when you knew that that was a transition that you had to make and how you went about doing that?

Yeah, I think that next. And I feel like it's more than just like, a team have. Bringing a team in. I feel like for me, a lot of the. The next phase or the current phase is driven by, like, life circumstances and, you know, people that have followed us for a long time know, like, we. We, like, had a really difficult season in 2016, 2017, time after losing our. Our son and then had our daughter in 20. Gosh, it was 2018. And. And I feel like that. I don't know, I just. It's different for me now, and it's. I'm in a different season because of things going on in our family life and, you know, in our specific situation. It's like having a baby and. But also it was true in the season of, like, going through a really hard time. And I feel like it's this new season of realizing that it's almost like realizing my own limitations in a way. Like, in a way that I've never realized them before. And I think, you know, everyone's story is different. And to someone that is in the midst of, like, building up, you know, their blog or their following or what, or their YouTube, whatever they're doing, and currently also have, you know, Have a family or like have that happening simultaneously. Like, that's going to be a different story and unique to each person. But for us, the story was like that building phase and then kind of like the now this is my full time job and I'm, you know, and I'm learning how to do this on my own phase. Like, both of those happened in a time where we had relatively low amounts of other commitments and now we have different things pulling for our attention. And so it, for me it seems like, I know it seems like, oh, this is about, you know, personally what. But I feel like for me they all intersect. And I'm realizing a, I don't, I don't have as much time to give anymore. Like, I don't have as much time and as much energy as I did when I was, you know, 27. And this was my full. And I had just left teaching to do this full time. You know, like this. My life now looks really different. And so, and then the like B would be just. There are probably some ways that I'm then holding back Pinch of yum from. From where it could go and from the value that it could provide just because of my time limitations. And I think all of it, it's one big puzzle. But like all of it works together with, you know, the realization like, hey, maybe it is time to bring even more people on the team and what would it look like to, you know, what does my role look like moving forward and like, where am I having fun and where am I most valuable and where can other people thrive and what feels good to followers and people that have followed us all the way along? And so I think, I don't even remember what your initial question was, but just like setting the stage for that stage, which is now is just. I imagine it as like a juggling kind of a juggling act. And there are new balls that I'm juggling. It's not just the balls of, of pinch of yum anymore. Like there are some new pretty important balls. And I just heard this quote the other day. I think I. Someone might need to fact check me on this. I think it was like a Nora Roberts quote. But she from I don't know if it's recent or a long time ago, but it's about, it's about balance and like, how do you balance writing and family and all of these things. Someone asked her and she said, she said it's a juggling act. And what you have to understand is that some of the balls that you're juggling are plastic, and some are glass. Maybe this is, like, a widely known thing. I don't know. Have you ever heard this before?

I've never heard just from you. Yeah.

Okay. Oh, okay. Did I tell you this already?

I've heard it from somewhere. Maybe. Maybe it wasn't you.

Yeah, I felt like I just heard it for the first time when I heard it a couple days ago. So this is feeling fresh to me. But I don't know. Maybe I've been saying this all along. Who even knows? So, like, some of the ear balls are plastic. Some of them are glass. And then how you do it, like, how you make it all work is by knowing which is which. Which ones can you drop? And it's not even like what she says in this quote is, like, the plastic ones can be dropped, and they're gonna bounce, they're gonna be okay, and then you can pick them up again later. It's not. It doesn't have to mean, like, drop forever. But a glass ball, whether that's a part of your business, like, for example, the content of pinch of Yum is kind of a glass ball. Like, we can't just stop producing content. But also, me being a mom and being the best I can be for my daughter is also a glass ball. And so figuring out those things that can be dropped, that can be maybe even. Okay, I'm expanding on her analogy now in her quote. But, like, that can be tossed to other people, and that's a circus now.

There's multiple jugglers.

Exactly.

Right?

Yes. And animals. Sage is involved for sure.

And there's clowns. And you want to make sure not to.

There's no clowns.

The daughter. Glass balls to the clowns.

No. No clowns. Oh, my gosh. But, yeah, I think that's the. That's the phase that we're in now with Binge of young is like, what does it look like moving forward? What does it. What are the balls we're juggling? Which ones are glass, which ones are plastic, which ones. Which ones perform better in other people's hands, and which ones are best for me to hold on to?

Yeah. And I think a really good example of that and one that we've kind of already gone through. So you had this super cool studio in Minneapolis. It was maybe 20 minutes from where we lived, a little bit longer if there's bad traffic for people who attended a workshop, you know, it was like, exposed brick and timber, lots of light. It was really cool. And that's where you did workshops. But entering into this new Season we had this realization of like there's this, a commitment level that goes into workshops and to keeping up this studio that isn't super closely located to our house. And so that was a decision that was made that like, if you look at the long equation and if there's, you know, variables, not to get too mathy, but like if each area is a variable, there would be a workshop variable. And we said we're going to bring that down to zero because we're okay removing that, taking that down to zero in order to distribute some of those resources in other areas. So like now we live five minutes from home and we're not doing workshops. And that was a change and a shift that was made where it's like there's a sacrifice on the Pinch of Yum side that then is able to, you were able to distribute that like the resources behind that into other areas. And I think all of it goes back to this idea of what you'd mentioned before. And I think this is an important point to pull out and to shine a light on this idea of being light on your feet and saying like, there has to be this constant evolution to you as an individual and how you work and naturally therefore the thing that you're building and working on. And I think this is the important thing to point out. It doesn't mean that, that it's like worse or that there's a sacrifice made. It just means that it's not going to be the same as it was three years ago. And I think being able to be light on your feet, to have the trickster mentality and to instead of thinking, ah, like we're not going to do workshops anymore, that's going to be terrible. It's like, well, how do we, how do we shift this and actually create something that is, that is better? Like it's, it's, it's net, net something that, that is more positive and, and, and almost. And you had mentioned the idea of a puzzle, but like it's putting all of the pieces out and saying like, how do we approach this puzzle in a way where we can create something that's even better across the board? And that's a really challenging, abstract, hard thing to do. But I think it's important for creatives, business owners, individuals, whatever category you'd put yourself in, because you have to constantly evolve and change. And I think Pinch of Yum now is coming up to the 10 year mark. And so it's interesting to step back and think about that. What are the ways that we've had to do that and to encourage other people, other creators to do that as well. Anything else?

Yeah, I want to say this because I think it ties in and kind of be applied for people who are listening. Like, so some. Something that. A piece of advice that I got that has just been really significant for me is this idea that what got you from point A to point B isn't going to be what gets you from point B to point C. Or maybe a better way to say it is, like, what made you thrive from point A to point B isn't going to be what helps you thrive from point B to point C. Idea being just embracing this, this concept of seasons. Like, there is an A to a B and then there is a B to a C and then there is a C to a D. And for me, like, some of the. And for people listening, like, for me, a lot of it in the beginning was this mega hustle. Like, and I think what people often want to do is either glorify or villainize that, like, hustle. You gotta hustle. You gotta do it. You gotta work so hard. You gotta get, you know, show up every day and do it and whatever, or relax. It's okay to give yourself a break, you know, so, like, there's one or the other. And I think my challenge to people listening is to try to acknowledge the both things of each of those pieces that you're considering and think about.

You.

Know, where they fit in the. In the. Okay, we're using a lot of puzzle analogy, but, like, it's both a puzzle and a timeline. Like, if you think of your growth and your journey as kind of a graph, literally, like a line with a point A, a point B, a point C, maybe going up, maybe going down, maybe staying the same. Like, what you need in each of those segments of your line graph is going to be different. And in one season, it might be hustle. Like, it might be put your head down. Like, you're not playing games. You're really getting the job done. And in another season, it might be like, what we need is to let go of the studio. That's what it was for us in this latest season is like, we need to let that plastic ball drop. It's going to be okay. We can pick something up again later if we want to, if we need to. So I just really like that idea of. Of what got you from point A to point B doesn't have to be what. What makes you thrive and what makes you move forward in the best next way from point B to point C. Love that.

I think of going through school as an example, and it's such a linear process. It's like you elementary school, you have middle school, you have high school, you have college. And the idea of getting through high school and then going back to your freshman year and doing it again, it wouldn't make any sense because you're a different person. And I think we lose some of that kind of progression mentality when we get into the work that we do. But I think there has to be something similar where you have these. These seasons that you're working through, much like you would in school, and you're constantly evolving, not only the level of work that you're doing, but also how you approach that work, how much time you have for that work, your relationship to that work. And. And I think it's kind of a great note to end on, to kind of reflect on that. But before we do, I want to know, Lindsay, if you. Like, in this point in your life right now, for people that are listening to the podcast, if you were to just step back, it could be related to this. It could be outside of this, speaking to fellow creatives, do you have anything that you'd say as kind of last words of wisdom or advice for people who are, in some ways, along this journey with you?

I feel like what I'm just learning, like, really hardcore in this season is like, you can't do everything, and that's okay. Like, that is. We are humans and we are, like, created and by nature have limitations. We have to eat, we have to sleep. We need relationships, and we also need and want meaningful work. And a lot of us, for a lot of us, it's creative work. And I think that a lot of people. Myself. Okay, I'll speak for myself. I think for myself, I have that combination of, like, drive and ambition and also this desire to, like, create really beautiful things to where I can be very particular about how things are and, like, really hard on myself when, you know, things aren't as good as they should be. And I think I'm in a season of needing to just acknowledge some of my limitations as a human being. I'm not a robot. I'm a human being. I have limitations, and so do you. If you are listening, I hope there are no robots listening. I hope you're all humans. And, like, I hope there.

I actually hope there are a few robots listening. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, we. That's a conversation for another time.

Bjork.

This is Bjork and I. Is recurring weird thing he loves robots. And I do not love robots. Anyways, that's my. That's. Those are. That's what I want to end with is just like, you can't do everything. Embrace the things. Embrace. Hold on tightly to the glass balls. Not too tightly. They'll break. But, you know, like, hold on. Take good care of your glass balls. And it's okay to let those plastic ones and you can pick them up later if you need to.

That's awesome. Obviously, people can follow along on Pinch of Yum on different social channels, but then you also have your personal Instagram. Do you want to talk about that? Lindsay? It's a. Is it Lindsay Momstrom? Is that right?

Oh, my gosh. You jerk. No, it's. So I am unable if someone from Instagram is listening and you want to try to get me the Lindsay Ostrom handle on Instagram.

It's not used. But we can't get it.

It's not used. It's. We've literally. We try to get it like once a month. But anyways, I feel like I've said that before on the podcast, but no. So my personal Instagram is Lindsay M. My middle name is Marie, so M. Lindsay M. Ostrom. People always think then that my name is Lindsay Mostrom. It's not. Or a lot of people think it's Mom. That's why Bjork is trolling me by saying Lindsay Momstrom. Anyways, it's Lindsay M. Ostrom. Oh, brother.

It's such a. Like. Oh, yeah, you. You talk about, like, mom stuff on there. So it's like, it's like a little play on words. Momstrom.

No, it's not Momstrom. It's Lindsay M. Ostrom. Okay. Anyways, that's my. That's my personal Instagram account. That's where, like, I've separated. Just. Yeah, just my personal life, what's happening in our family, and things like that. So I have that. And then obviously Pinch of Yum is our. What we've been talking about here. And that handle on Instagram is a great place if you love to cook, which if you're listening to this podcast, I'm guessing that you do. So we'd love to have you follow.

Awesome. Linds, thanks so much for coming on the podcast and sharing a little bit. And as you know, love having you on here. So you are welcome back anytime.

Well, thank you. Appreciate it.

Thanks.

And that's a wrap, my friend. Thanks for tuning into this. This episode of the Food Blogger Pro podcast this week. I hope you enjoyed this episode just as much as I did. You know, I thought that the juggling glass and plastic balls analogy was just so spot on and helpful. Such a cool way of viewing the things that need to get done in a business. And if this episode spoke to you in any way, or if you have any questions, we encourage you to leave a comment@foodbloggerpro.com 239 that's also where you can find the show notes for this episode episode with any relevant links and resources. Again, that's foodbloggerpro.com 239 we appreciate you being part of our podcast community so, so much, and we'll see you back here next Tuesday. But until then, make it a great week.

Sam.