The $50k/month Old School Business You Can Start for Next to Nothing⏐Ep. #274

As of right now, how many customers did you say you have?

4,100.

Oh, my gosh. Almost $50,000 a month recurring.

Yeah, about.

Oh, my goodness.

It's the most rewarding thing. It's absolutely crazy.

In less than six months, you're making tens of thousands of dollars a month in profit doing something that you love. What could be better than that?

What could be better? Seriously?

Yes. Business is hard. I'm not going to tell you. It's easy. Yeah, it's a grind. But it is worth it. And it's absolutely doable. Even if you end up hating it and you go back to your job. Fine.

Yeah.

But just learn for yourself if it was. If you're curious, answer the question. What a story I have for you today. This is Hannah down in Austin. She's been running this business for six months, and she's making about $30,000 a month in profit. Her startup costs were next to nothing. You know the story, guys. She wouldn't be on this podcast if it wasn't an amazing story. This is a business that anyone, male or female, could replicate in their own niche with their own passion. And if you want to copy this business, it is a great business to copy. And at the end of this, we talk about specific other niches that you could launch this exact same business with. And of course, most importantly, how to find a bunch of customers. It just has everything. It has all the elements. It's a lot of money in a short amount of time with almost no investment upfront. And she found her customers organically. No paid media whatsoever. Please enjoy. So why don't you just start by telling us who you are and what you do?

I am Hannah, and I'm, I guess, the founder of the Tiny Project. We're. Which is a culmination of a lot of things, but most importantly, I think to me, it's trying to encourage people to start Tiny. I guess a year ago, I had just quit my job and had started my own small tutoring company. And I was just so burnt out by working in corporate America and just the grind of it all. And I was like, I'll take a major pay cut just to be able to, I don't know, like, have autonomy over my life. I started working with students in executive functioning, which is where my background is at. And for the first time, like, in such a long time, I had all this capacity again, where I was, like, so inspired. And I was a very creative person when I was younger, but I never gave myself really the. The time to do that as I grew up. And so I just started getting creative again. I was making jams in my kitchen, and I was really craving this, like, community and connection with my neighbors. And I kind of had a moment where I was like, if I'm going to complain about not feeling connected to my Austin community that I'd grown up in, I'm not doing anything about it. So, like, let me try to do something about it before I. I was going to move. Basically, I was ready to head out. And, yeah, this was kind of my last stitch effort at connection. And I started selling jams in my front yard in my East Austin neighborhood. And. And it was silly. It kind of looked like a lemonade stand, but. And I called it the Tiny Farmer's Market. But in those first three hours in my yard, I had met more of my neighbors than I had in, like, the three years that I'd lived in that house. And it just completely sparked something inside of me. And I decided I would be really consistent with it and just show up every month on a Saturday, and I put up flyers in the neighborhood, and I would just say, hey, I'm here. I have free drinks for everybody. We can come hang out. And other vendors started to reach out. I started to post it on social media and other very small business owners. I mean, at the time, they weren't even businesses. They just had hobbies, and they were like, maybe I could sell. And I was like, absolutely, come on out. And it just started to blow up. And we have now we have 33 vendors that normally pack into the front and backyard of my house. And we always. We stick with the free drink. We now have, like, live music and face painting. And it's just, like, a really fun way to connect with the community. And then we always give back to a local charity or nonprofit. And so that's been something I'm also very passionate about. And while this was all happening and I was posting about it on social media, I was getting a lot of comments being like, oh, I wish this was near me, or I wish that I had this in my community. And obviously, I can't, you know, bring the Tiny Farmers market to other communities. Maybe. Maybe in the future. But for now, I was like, I can't bring it anywhere, but maybe I could start some sort of newsletter or, like, extend the community and connection further than my front yard, which was the goal of the whole thing. And so I started the Tiny Post, which was a snail mail club. And I just put together my art and a recipe that I was working on with my jams, a few stickers, and I put it all in a 1oz envelope and sent it out to anyone who signed up. And I charged $11 for it. And I just posted it on TikTok. And the first month, I got 50 people. This was in. This was in.

Wow.

Yeah, 50 people. I was like, beyond excited about. I was like, this is the best day ever. And at the time, I was like, my goal is to, by December, get this to 200 subscribers. And I was really, like, pushing for that.

So 11amonth. 11 per letter, basically, right?

Yes. With. With no turnover. 11amonth. And so I was like, I could get there. And I posted about it just consistently, and I shared a lot about why I was doing it and where the idea came from. And the second month we got 107 people. The third month we got 1200 people. The fourth month we got what, 2,500. What I know.

So sorry, is this. Did you get up to 2500 or you got 25 new people?

Sorry, I got up to 2500.

Oh, my gosh. Say those numbers for me again. So the first month was 50.

50. Second one was 107.

That's, you know, over a thousand dollars a month recurring. Okay.

Yes. And then October was our third month, and we got 2500. And then November, we hit 3200. December, we hit 3700. Oh, I got it wrong. August was 50.

I think you skipped 1200 on that second round.

Yes. Because then I was like, January is when we hit the 3,700. And then February, which is this month, we're prepping for 4,100, but people are still signing up. So we're prepared for 4,500. But it's like, I mean, truly completely changed my life and, oh, my gosh, it's been complete insanity.

But yeah, okay, so 50 people the first month, 100 and change the second month. So $1000 a month. And then from month two to three, you go from you 10x you go from 100 and change to 1200.

Yeah. Yes.

What happened in that month?

We had a viral video.

How viral?

It hit 1.1 million views.

Now, was that just you, like, building in public, like, or you like, overtly selling? What were you doing in this video?

I posted up my phone to tell my husband, because I'm kind of like you, I always have new ideas. And I posted up my phone, and he had just been through the ringer with me because I just started the tiny farmer's market. I started a tutoring company. I'm just, like, doing a million things. And I posted up my phone to be like, I'm starting one more thing. I'm just going to do something called a snail mail club.

So real quick, you were, like, secretly filming him as you told him about this business.

Yeah. And I'm gonna start this thing. And he fully didn't understand it. He didn't get it. He's a major business guy, mba, all the things. And I was like, I'm gonna do this little thing. It's gonna be fun. And then the video goes through the last three months and how it's just, like, grown so much and grown so much in the sense that it went from zero to a hundred. And I was showing, like, what we've done, and it was like a Hope Core video. I was just saying, like, this is the best thing ever.

And those are so hot right now.

And that's what I was going to say is so many of my videos are, like, they strike a chord with Hope Core. And I mean, I'm. I feel like I'm definitely perpetuating that because it's been the coolest thing ever. But those. That video just, like, hit the for you page. And honestly, it also started a lot of discourse of, like, what even is snail mail, which gave me a whole new platform of authority. Like what you were saying earlier of.

Like, we were just talking about this. Yeah.

Piece of authority, where I got to come in and be like, this is what snail mail is. This is what I do. This is what it means. Like, there was so much confusion in the comments that almost helped with it, where there was a lot of educational opportunities to be like, this is what I'm doing, and this is why it's so fun for me. And this is the story of the tiny farmers market, and it opened the doors for the story to kind of get out, I think, in some ways.

So on that video, the video of you filming your husband was that old. Did you take that when you first had the idea and you just posted it a few months later?

Yeah, I took it when I wasn't even really doing social media. I was, like, kind of nervous about it, but I was like, maybe I could use this in the future.

Yeah, that's so smart. And your husband, like, I'm assuming he's very supportive and awesome and whatever. It just, like, it broke his frame a little bit. He's like, huh?

Yeah. I mean, we're always talking about business ideas, and this is just such a. It's tailored to a very Specific type of, like, mostly women. He didn't know what it even was. I didn't even really know the full extent of what it is or what it could be. I definitely didn't think it could be this. But, yeah, he was supportive but confused, I think.

So what gave you the original idea? Like, where did you take inspiration from to get this?

I have seen on TikTok, I. I follow this wonderful woman who does poetry in the mail, and she sent out a tangible piece of poetry. I am like, the target audience for that type of stuff. Like, I love a tangible good. I love a letter in the mail, like any, like, stationary goods, those things. And so I saw her and I thought that was just the coolest thing. And it was so affordable that that was like such a. Like, the access to creativity and the access to somebody's art was so affordable. And I've always thought of, like, buying art as this almost unattainable thing. Her story and everything. I was really inspired by and I cannot remember her name for the life of me right now, but she does the Poet Club and. Or Poem Club. And it was super cool. And I thought, you know, maybe I could do that with my art. And I know that after I started it, I started to see a lot of other snail mail clubs that are similar and just different in, like, what their art is. It's like a really cool way to support an artist that you're inspired by. But that was where the initial idea came from.

Okay. Brittany Wilder. Is that her name?

I think so, yes.

I just looked it up. We'll link to that as well. Now, are you a customer of Poem Club?

I'm not. I need to be. I truly just haven't signed up for it.

Yeah.

But I know that she has, like, several thousand as well.

Yeah, I think it's great that you're not, because, I mean, this is just like confirmation bias. Like, you know, we like people that look like us. Like, that's something that I would do as well. Like, I've taken inspiration from other businesses and there's so much more research I could have done. I could have become a customer and ordered a few. And on Shopify, there's some tricks you can do where you can see the order number when you place it, and then you place another order exactly a week later. See that order number, subtract it, and you can calculate how many sales are doing a week. And then you can kind of guess how much their average order value is. And then you can multiply by 52 and say, wow, These guys are doing a million dollars a year or whatever. Like, there's so many things you can do to reverse engineer things.

Yeah.

But when I take inspiration from someone, like, if the idea just hits and it just feels right in my gut, I just do it right then.

Yeah, right. I started. I think I had the idea on, like, a Tuesday, and we started it a week later. Like, I try to support her in other ways. Like, I would, like, shouting her out and all the things that.

We're supporting her now.

Yes.

We're gonna link to it.

But I have a hard time as, like, a new artist, really having to find my style and what makes my art my art. And so I also distance myself a little bit from other people's things. Things just so I. My fear is that I'll take too much of it. And so I work on, like, also just being like, okay, I'm staying in my lane. These ideas are coming to me from me, and I think I'll get better at that as I move into my creativity. But right now, because I'm like, so early on in any of my creative passions, I'm like, I don't want to be influenced by anything. But the idea itself was totally her.

How much does she charge?

I'm not sure I want to say maybe eight or nine dollars.

Okay. And you just get a poem.

It's a poem. And I think there's sometimes a sticker in there. She has really cute, like, decorative aesthetics that go with it. And she's a poet, so it's her poem monthly. Yeah. We do something, like, definitely very different, but I think hers is $8 a month.

Okay. Has she ever talked about how many customers she has?

Yes. She's very open to, which is where I, like, drew a lot of inspiration. She's. She does these really beautiful, like, conversations with just her audience being like, this is why it's hard to be an artist, or this is what I'm thinking. I think she has somewhere in the thousands, though.

Wow. Is that part of what gave you this idea is you're like, holy crap, she's crushing it?

No, I mean, if I'm being completely honest, I didn't really have. This was not my main goal of growth or financial freedom.

Yeah. It was just a rabbit you were chasing that week.

Yeah, it was just a little idea. And I really. My goal was to connect people or to extend what I was so passionate about. And so I was still very much like, I'm growing this tutoring company, and it was growing at the time. So I Didn't really even have, like, the forethought to be like, do I even have time for this if it grows? I wasn't even thinking that it would grow and I would have to prioritize my time in some way.

Okay, so you went from 1, 1200 month 3 to what, 2500 month 4?

Yes.

What happened? There was. Was there another viral video or just not really.

I mean, my videos were doing really well, but there wasn't another viral video. In November, there was another viral video. And during all this time, it gets a little bit complicated on, like, when to go to a wait list or when to anticipate growth. And honestly, in October, had I cut it off? Because I truly, I panicked at 1200. I was going to cut it off at 400. I was freaking out so bad, and my husband was like, we're doing this. This will be so fun. But I kept it open until 1200. But then I went to a wait list, and our wait list had over 3,000 people on it. So we had maintained a lot of that growth. I learned a lot through a wait list. Not a lot of those people signed up. And there wasn't as much over as I expected. But, like, as these months happened, I think there was a lot of momentum from past months happening. And then honestly, I think with going to a waitlist, it created this kind of scarcity. Scarcity where like they, they wanted to sign up and it opened back up.

So you learned that of the 3,000 people, how many ended up paying, would you guess? On the wait list?

I think we had less than a thousand people sign up from the wait list.

Okay. How much time had elapsed between signing up and having to pay?

Oh, I want to say like maybe three weeks or two weeks.

It was okay.

It was a little bit longer. And also something that I totally made a mistake of. I just threw up a little Google form. Like, I wasn't even like thinking. But I didn't say that it cost money. And so I think a lot of people signed up lower intent that it was free. So that's something I learned there. But there was in the beginning, I think a lot of people, and I still sometimes get comments where they're like, oh, add me to the list. And it's. You have to communicate that, like, no, it's a service that I'm giving and I cost money.

Do people complain about the price? Is that a common complaint?

Never.

They don't push back.

I was thinking about it today. I was like, I don't know if he's going to ask about any like reviews. I've, I've never gotten any bad reviews or anything. We get cancellations. Like I, I plan on Cancel Like a 10% turnover rate, but it. We never hit 10%. We're probably closer to like maybe 5%.

Is that 5% per month? Like if you have a thousand one month, you have 950 the next.

Yeah.

Not including the new people. Okay, that's not bad. I mean a forever stamp. Do you use forever stamps or just. Okay, so I mean, what's that 60 cents now? 70.

78.

It's gone up so much. 78 cents. And then you've got your, you probably have really high quality stationery and envelopes. And I saw on your website you do stickers. You like your hard cost, not your time or your labor. But are we looking at like 2 to 3, 2 to $4 including stamp?

Yeah, I would say closer. Maybe like $3.

Okay.

Depending on if I want to like throw something really fun in there. But honestly the weight is what restricts us the most because you can't go over one ounce.

Just. So you only have to use one stamp.

Yes.

Right. 70% gross margins, give or take.

Yeah. Without labor.

And now you probably have quite the assembly line for packing these things.

Yeah.

You've learned the power of friends and family.

Yes. So in the beginning it was all my brothers and then my brother in law, so my husband's brother. And we were just doing it in the house and grinding them out. This month is the first month we've like really standardized and brought in more people and that has like truly been a huge game changer. It's just, it's too much to put on like one small group of people. And it's a lot more work than you would expect or like just a lot more time. Because it's so specific to one week. We do it in one singular week. But yeah, the, the labor is probably the most expensive piece. Actually the stamp is technically the most expensive. But after that it would be labor.

If you're like separating out all the duties, you're probably only spending like one to three minutes per envelope stuffing.

Yeah, we like, we have it down. I think it's difficult because you have to like, we do them in different steps. So like yeah, the stamp on and then we put the, we stamp our address and then we. The whole thing. But we normally can get about a thousand letters done in two and a half hours.

With how many people?

With six people.

Okay. Wow. So let's call it three hours. So 18 people hours for a thousand. Man, that's really good. That's solid.

Yeah.

And I'm. I'm sure you've looked into, like, machinery like automation. Like, is there really something for your specific use case?

There's not much out there. There is a machine that can fold the letters, like, inward, but you would still have to pack individually. And honestly, I think that's why this is something people love so much. And it.

100%.

It's because it's like they know I'm touching every single letter. Like, I am in there. Like, we are packing this and there's no way to make it. There's no way to make it quicker. And because of that, there's also nothing really on the market that's similar. I feel like. I mean, stationery is absolutely stunning. And you can get stationary, but it's never going to be a handwritten letter, you know?

Yeah. So I have to tell you a quick story. I. I had an idea for years, and it was called Chunky Mailers. And it was based on the premise that when we get something in the mail, even if it's marketing that has something in it, we will for sure open that thing. Yeah, right. It's just human psychology one on one. And so for years, I wanted to start this business called Chunky Mailers that was like a direct mail marketing company, but that didn't send postcards or. Or envelopes. It sent, you know, marketing flyers, materials, postcards in an envelope, that straw or a penny or figurine or something. Something thin enough it still has to be like a quarter inch or less. So it's machinable. If it's not, you have to spend like $3 instead of $0.70. Like, there's some technical things, but I partnered with a guy named Christian and my business partner Kirk, and they launched it. They had a different name. They did it for a few years. It did all right. But, like, I still think that this idea could be executed because direct mail is not dying. Like, it is effective. Depending on the offer and on the business and the targeting and all that, it is effective. Yeah. And I think that Chunky, Chunky Mailers, that's what I call that.

Yeah. When they put in like a credit card and you're like, should I just.

Open just in case it might. It might be real. I don't know.

Totally.

Like. Like, we're just getting offline more and more. And I think that you're writing a tidal wave right now that is not going anywhere. I've talked for a while about getting offline, but you're doing something different. You're doing something, like, physical. And I just think that's going to get more and more popular. I think it's so smart.

I think it's. It's. People need the. The thing to hold on to. It's like a tangible good where they're like, this was worth my money. This was worth my time. They know that there was care put into it. And I think as, like, I mean, we're seeing same thing, the shift in AI and all these things. It's like as that grows, this is. Feels like it's growing with it where there's more and more people that are like, I need a tangible good in my life. And so, yes, it feels like a small little, like, act of defiance to that.

Yeah. I mean, we need something to offset AI.

Yeah.

So as fast as AI is growing, we need something else growing fast to offset that. And I just interviewed a guy that sells beef jerky to gas stations, and his interview crushed because it was the opposite of AI and like, people are craving that, you know?

Yeah, I. Yeah, totally.

So you may have already said this, but what exactly is in each envelope?

So each envelope has a postcard that is also an art print. So on one side it's an art print that I create, and then on the back side, it's a postcard and then a recipe card. One side is, like, artistic, and the other side is a recipe. We normally do two stickers depending on size, sometimes three because of the weight. And then we do a surprise paper goodie every month. So this last month, it was like a little collage pack, and it was all these individual pieces of collage. This month going forward is. Is we're connecting everybody through pen pal. So we're trying to connect everybody so that they have someone within this little network. And then my friend Hannah, who is also part of the labor cost, she creates these, like, beautiful little tarot cards, and she hand packs those and sends those to me. So those go in there. And then lastly. And like, the part that's most integral to why I started this and why I care so much about it is my letter. And it's normally just like a long letter about why I was inspired this month. Normally it has some sort of personal experience and I just am very vulnerable in it. And the whole point is to try to lead that to connection in some way or connect with people over that.

Is it kind of like a public journal entry?

Kind of, yeah. I would say it's Very similar to a journal entry. It's almost like a personal blog. A lot of it is, like, lessons I've learned, really trying to, you know, influence people to care about their communities, care about themselves. Just, like, feel good stuff.

Yeah.

And so that's what is. I'm trying to culminate that into the letter of just. It's. It obviously has to cost money because I have to make it. But outside of that, like, I hope it inspires people to also start tiny and to feel that hope and to. Despite all the things going on in the world, despite the heaviness that you can still create and you can feel inspired.

Yeah. I feel like we're kindred spirits in a way, because we have so many of the same ideologies. Like, just the word tiny. Like, that's what I try to make everything that I post about, like, approachable, like, to everyone. Right. And how starting small is great. Like, starting small is awesome. Don't be afraid to start small and to stay small. Don't be afraid to stay small, if that's what you want. You mentioned something at the end there about, like, despite the world being hard. Like, that's just my message to the world is like, yes, business is hard. I'm not going to tell you it's easy. Yeah, it's a grind. Like, you're going to fail a lot, but it is worth it. And it's like, absolutely doable.

Oh, my gosh.

Absolutely. Like, you can absolutely do it. It's approachable. Like, you should try it. Even if you end up hating it and you go back to your job. Fine.

Yeah.

But just learn for yourself. If it was for you. If you're curious, this. Answer the question.

Yeah, that's what I say. So much of snail mail, specifically because it's. It's so scalable, but it's also not scalable. Like, you could stay at 50 subscribers. You could stay at 10 subscribers. And when I was doing the first 50 subscribers I had, I. My cup was filled to a capacity that, like, I was so grateful and thankful. And I still feel that every time I drop off these letters, I'm like, what the hell? This is insane. But you could start this as a creative process and it could build into something. I think especially artists, they're really trying to find ways to commodify and make ends meet as artists. And I know that that is so difficult. And this is. There are so many people in this world that can afford $8, $9, $11 a month, and they want to support small artists. And this is just a perfect way to do it. You could do it as a side hustle. It could be, you know, 100 people, and it brings in an extra 500 bucks or whatever. And that is amazing.

Yeah. And you found these guys through free mediums, like TikTok, free content marketing, other.

Than just telling this. This same story. And it resonates with people. Yeah.

Have you ever done paid marketing?

We just started using Pinterest, and I did that because other people were putting my stuff on Pinterest, and so I was like, I guess I. I'll do this.

Yeah, I should own this.

I'm gonna put. Yeah. If I'm gonna send you guys stuff in the letters. So they were, like, taking my pictures off of Instagram and putting them on there. So I was like, all right, I guess I'll just start a Pinterest. So I've started doing Pinterest outside of that. No. Kind of what you were talking about with Chunky Mail. That is something we've been exploring because we had a Realtor reach out and ask us to do a tiny post for them. And in terms of the tiny post for the people that are signing up right now, like, I'll never put an advertisement in there. I think that would not align my mission. There are so many business owners that need that tangible touch point with their past clients, with new clients, clients, and they can afford to, you know, throw a few hundred bucks at this, you know, snail mail club. And if we throw a little letter in there and say, hey, this is from your Realtor, it's a kind touch point that they could, you know, see every month. And so we're kind of looking into maybe reaching out to other Realtors or. Or financial advisors, bankers. I feel like there could be a lot there as well with that tangible, you know, point. I think we might do one for a Run club, which I'm very excited about. But, yeah.

Oh, man. I'm, like, having all these realizations. Like, my wife is huge on Christmas cards every December. It's like this friction between us. I'm like, babe, it doesn't matter if that family we live next to 14 years ago doesn't get her card. They're not going to even know. It doesn't matter. It's not that deep. And she's like, they have to all go out. And then Conversely, we get 200 Christmas cards every year. And I love that. I enjoy catching up with people, but there's like, two families that write a note with theirs. Right. The Brock Banks and the Gilberts. I know who they are. And I read that note and even though, like, I probably wouldn't read their Facebook post, you know, it's just not out of, you know, it's out of sight, out of mind, but I read their note and I enjoy it. And so I have another friend locally who I get her mailers. She's a realtor. I get her mailers because I live in her area. And it's like this house is for sale, that house for sale. And it's a picture of her and she's great. If she were to send me like something chunky, right. With something in there with like a public journal entry, like, I had a rough month. You know, we had two closings fall through. Like a public journal entry about her business.

Yeah.

I'd be like, you know what? I'm going to share that everywhere.

Yeah.

I'm going to share this with everyone. Like, when I go to buy a house, I'm going to go to her. Yes. It's different, you know.

Yep. That like, vulnerability piece. It totally leads to connection. Yeah.

And a lot of times, like that extra 10 minutes of effort for her every month could pay off a thousandfold. You know, it doesn't always take a lot more work. It's just a different way of doing something.

Totally. Yeah.

So from like a first principles perspective is this concept of, you know, tiny letters, is it viable for men, like as an owner to start and for men to receive? Now, obviously I just told you that is interesting to me, but what are your thoughts on that?

No, I've actually, I talked to my husband so much and my brothers because we're all here in this, like, packing letters for hours together. I think that in the way that there's this loneliness epidemic happening for men, I mean, a man receiving a letter in the mail from another man, that is vulnerable. I can't even imagine how much good that could do for the world. I think there's also, like this narrative that men can't enjoy small, tiny, fun, cute things. And they absolutely can. Like, men have stickers, men have, you know, stationary. I think there's absolutely a way to conceptualize this for them. I'd love if men subscribe to my stuff. I can understand why they don't necessarily subscribe to it.

Yeah.

But there's absolutely, like, I think a way to, you know, push it in that direction.

Yeah, yeah, 100%. Like, you could do one for about like classic cars. Right. For car lovers. And every, every month could have like a hand drawing picture of like A gorgeous, unique classic car. Or for golfing or for hunting or for survival tips. You know, I on Amazon last night with my boys buying a smelting furnace so we could take our aluminum cans and turn them into swords. You know, like, if I got a letter one month about how to do that, like handwritten, maybe even a QR code, I know this kind of goes against the purpose, but a QR code to a really cool YouTube video?

Totally.

You know, I saw this, this viral tweet last week, and I still don't know if the guy was trolling or not, but it was a picture of like a three ring binder, like a notebook. And it had every page, just had a thumbnail of a YouTube video and a QR code. And they were like, I give this to my kids so they can look at YouTube without all the toxic thumbnails and algorithms influencing them. And they can just scan the code and watch it. And I'm like, I don't know if he's trolling, but.

But there's an idea.

Yes, there's something to that. You know, merging the, like, not fully offline, not fully online, but merging the two.

Another thing that, that could be interesting too is like the dexterity piece of like, like a little craft that you fold or that you like origami or something like that where it like teaches you how to. I feel like Legos are very like huge in that realm. Like, I think there's so much more, like kids for kids. It could be a huge thing as well. And I've talked to a few people that, you know, might be going in that direction, but there's so many niches out there that these could be tailored to. And every single person, I think, loves receiving something in the mail that's not a bill or.

Oh, yeah, you know, I mean, you've got like a kiwi crate and crunch labs doing this with like activities for kids. Right? To like make engineering projects.

Yeah.

Shrink that down to an envelope.

Yeah. You know, it teaches them about the postal system. It teaches them about, you know, a stamp, how to write a letter, all those things. I think it could be really cool.

Is this idea about to save the United States Postal Service?

I think so. The usps, they're struggling on my last one and I was like, like, oh my God, really? Lab of a century.

Oh, heck yeah. Geez Louise. Okay, so kids, men. Like, I'm biased, but I totally think this, this could work for men. Like, not poetry, most likely, but anything that men like.

Yeah.

Do you have any metrics I know you probably know anecdotally, but any metrics on how shareable this is? Do you see people posting about it? Are they tagging? Are they tagging you? Are they sharing it offline? And you're just seeing customers show up that, that you don't know where they came from?

Yeah, so that's a hard piece to track. That, that specific piece of like, where are they coming from? We just added a question of like, are you coming from Instagram, TikTok or Pinterest? Which I would say. And then other, I would say most people are coming from that. Although we do sometimes get an email saying, like, oh, my mom showed me this, or, you know, I have to cancel my subscription because I just got signed up by somebody else as a gift. Like, I get a few of those online specifically. Like, that has grown, I think my account so much because people do unboxings of snail mail and they show my mail to other people and then people are interested in that. And it's, it's so helpful too, because I get to see in real time what they like and what they don't like and what they're confused by and what is really interesting to them. And in the same way that I still try to like, not consume every snail mail just so I don't get influenced in a, in a way, you know, problematic way, I. When I get to see those, those snail mail clubs, like, post about mine, it's so helpful to see what they really resonated with. And I know that a community that is like obsessed with snail mail clubs are junk journalers. Have you heard about junk journaling?

I am so locked in right now. You're saying, I have never heard about that. But I will say, I don't know what you're about to say, but my mom, Cindy, I love you. She is the most prolific journaler on this planet. Newspapers, local newspapers have written articles about her. Oh my God. She has hundreds of journals. She journals every day and has her entire life.

Oh, that is beautiful.

I want to hear this.

I love that. Yeah. So junk journaling is like, I think another one of those, like getting back to Analog, go in that anti air AI route and it's adding junk to a journal that you are writing in or not writing in. But you know, it's everything from like a receipt that you get at your local coffee shop to the ticket that got you on your plane. And it's everything. Anything can go into this. It's just paper goods and junk. So many of my letters are going into junk journals. And so that's also been a piece of like sometimes I'm like, you know, what is all this for? Like I don't want to just overwhelm someone with a bunch of, of paper goods that they have nowhere to put them. But this is one of those very creative places that a lot of the, the subscribers are, are using it for.

I'm like my mind is blown right now. I'm. Let's, let's side note, just for a minute, I'm going to share my screen. This is the Google trends and if you're listening on audio I'll describe it. This is the Google trends for junk journaling. The phrase junk journaling over the last five and then here's 22 years.

That's not surprised me.

Up and to the right now let's, let's see what this is. Snail mail. If we search that, you know, it's kind of been trending down and then back upwards again. But that's not really your industry. What would you call your industry?

Oh my gosh, I don't know. Paper stationary goods. I don't know.

Or like letter subscription maybe. I mean look at that. Letter subscription and junk journaling are. They look like mirror images of each other. Up and to the right. Have you heard of the flower letters?

No.

Oh, I did an episode about them last year. I'll link to it below. It's this couple out of Utah. They write books in letter format, like historical fiction books which my wife loves, that's her favorite genre, in letter format. So once, twice, three times a month you get letters that tell a story and their turn must be close to 1% because how does it end? Yeah, right. They don't have that. Yeah. And I think they're like one year series and then. But they, they'll do another series the next year. These guys are doing. My best friend did an interview with them. I just did a deep dive about them without actually talking to them. I'll post both, but they're. I think they're doing over 10 million a year.

That's amazing.

And it's like, it's like yours in that like it's beautiful stationary. I think it appears handwritten. It's a beautiful story. But my idea last year on this deep dive was like flower letters for any genre. For murder mysteries, for thrillers, for autobiographical novels or whatever. Or for men, whatever.

Totally.

I want to go back to the farmer's market for a minute. Of your 33 vendors, if you were to guess maybe you know, how many of them, like, started their business with your farmer's market. Like, if it weren't for your market, they would not have a business today.

Oh, I would like, hate to put words in anybody's mouth, but I, I do know specifically at least, like, I would say at least like 10 vendors have started at the tiny farmers market. I would say almost all of them have at least grown at the tiny farmers market. And 33 is how many we fit into the yard. But we normally have a list of like 200 that are wanting to come in every month. Wow. So we do. We keep a percentage of them for about. We, we try to do about like three to four months where they have a spot and then we kind of push them on their way and like, encourage them onto the next step and let in new people.

Okay. So give or take 2/3 were already selling beforehand. Like, probably not in a retail store, but from their home on Venmo, Friends and family. And then one third of them heard about your, your farmer's market, and they're like, you know what that sourdough I make? Yeah, I'm gonna sell it there.

Yes, definitely.

Right? And I think that's more common than people think. I mean, we, we live in a small community in dfw and this community started a farmer's market for the first time ever, like three years ago, maybe five years ago. And it sparked a conversation with my wife and I and we were like, you know what? What, that's cool. Like, we didn't have anything to sell. We're an entrepreneurial family. We're always selling something. But we didn't have anything for the farmer's market. And my wife loves to bake. She's excellent at it. So we had this conversation where it's like, why don't we use this as an opportunity to teach our kids business and baking and do it at the same time? Like, it'll just be good. It's like every other Saturday for six months out of the year. And that, like, turned into this full fledged business called Oven Love. And she sold online and my daughter would go with her every other Saturday. And it was just this amazing experience to teach our kids business. And we never would have done it if this farmer's market never opened up two minutes from our house. Now, of course, there's tons of farmers markets everywhere, but it was, it was the proximity and it was the lack of friction that caused that. And I imagine a lot of your vendors are like, they walk there, they're so close to you, right?

Yes. It's very close. It feels so, like it feels so different than any other market because it's in a front yard. Like, we're just. It's like showing up to your friend's house and having like a little party. Like, it feels very. I pride myself in making sure that it feels very welcoming to everybody. And we also do a donation based vendor fee so that it doesn't hinder anybody who's never started out, who doesn't know if they're going to sell anything. Although I always tell people you are going to. So. Yeah, we do a donation base so that people feel even more comfortable coming in and starting out small, you know.

Okay. So they can pay you for their space. Whatever they want.

Yeah.

What would you say in averages, every.

Single person, if they've been to an event, they always pay 30. I do a recommendation of $30. Every single person pays $30 or more. But if they start out, I would say sometimes they'll give, you know, 10 or five or maybe they'll not pay at all and they'll just say, hey, I'm coming, but I don't have the money for it. But if they've come once, every single person has always spent again.

I think it's important that people pay something.

Yeah.

$5. Right. Just because there's. There's stakes. Like more stakes than just their time or their ingredient.

Right. The people not coming or not showing up. Yeah. Especially when there's so many people that would like to be there. That's always like such a pang when somebody doesn't show up. And I'm like, dang, the spot that someone really, really wanted.

Yeah. Are you and. Or your neighbors making any money on this or is this just a passion project?

Well, the people that are vending, I think they make pretty good money.

Yeah. Yeah, I would hope so. But what about you?

Oh, me? So I have a booth at the event and I make. I make a couple thousand normally.

Okay. They're selling jams.

Selling jams. My art. Sometimes I'll do salts. I did vanilla extract. Like that's kind of my creative outlet is whatever I'm wanting to create that month. And so that booth does really well for me. But in terms of what I expect of the tiny farmers market, I don't expect it to be like an income to bring in a bunch of income, but it does bring in a little bit of money. And then I try to put the vendor fees back in. Like last time we had, it was really cold, so we had heaters and things like that. I want it to be a unique experience.

Yeah.

Okay, take off.

And most people are just walking. Like, it's mostly just your neighborhood.

No, I would say a lot of people come from all over now.

That's awesome.

Yeah. Our last event, I think we had almost 800 people come.

Holy cow. How do you keep track of that?

We. So my husband, he is amazing and so stressed all the time about the amount of, like, he's so scared we're going to impede traffic. So sometimes you'll see him out there, like in a full vest. And so he does a lot of, like, kind of counting and seeing people come in and out and he gets like some ballpark numbers. It's definitely hard. But we also have started implementing, like, I buy bags for the event and I can see how many bags we've.

How many you gave away.

Gave away. Yeah.

It's funny, your husband reminds me of me because we. My wife is always having events at our house with her friends and we live on a busy street, so everyone has to park in our driveway, which is limited. And so she'll be like, yeah, oh, I'm doing that cookbook club tonight. You know that, right? I'm like, like, copa club.

You're like, okay.

And she's probably told me 13 times, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, how many people are coming? She's like, oh, 17. I'm like, anyone riding together? I'm like, babe, babe. We have to plan the driveway. Like, they're gonna get stuck. It just rained. And so I'm like out there like taking keys, like playing valet. Like, I get stressed out about it. And she's like, we're having a party.

Yeah, totally that. Yep.

So a couple thousand bucks in three hours.

Yeah.

With jams and homemade, you know, vanilla extract. That's impressive.

Yeah, I definitely, like, that's a whole other thing that I feel just so grateful for because it was. That was also just a creative outlet. But now I have a TikTok following that. Like I said, like, people just really show up and it's so wonderful. And so I normally try to make like a lot of things because I hate to sell out, but it's also been very fun. And now actually my husband just quit his job to go full time with the tiny project.

That's amazing.

And so now he can help me make jams, which has been wonderful.

What was he doing?

He was an AI consultant.

Oh, wow. Okay.

So we are doing full 180, like a little jar for just a four ounce jar. I charge $10.

Okay. I swear I go to farmer's markets and I. I'm just like, my, I'm usually cheap. Like, that's my baseline is just cheap.

Yes.

But I go to a farmer's market and I want to support people. And I'm like, you get this. You get this. I bought sourdough the other day and I'm like, yeah, let me get that one, let me get that one. Let me get that. I got three loaves. And he's like, all right, $56.

I'm like, yes, it can be.

I should have looked at the price. Holy crap.

And you start to see, like, where that cost come from and, like, how appreciative you are. Like, you're like, oh, this person spent so much time on this.

Yeah. All this money was hard.

Yeah. And you see that there's almost an educational piece that comes with, like, going to a tiny farmers market or even getting mail. Like, there's like, when someone is doing the, the work behind it, it makes sense why it costs more.

What other ideas outside of poetry, outside of what you're doing in the snail bell business, what other ideas do you think there are that other people could. Could capitalize on? Like, surely you've had to, like, rein yourself in. You're like, I should send letters about this or that.

Yeah. So what I'm very thankful for is because I left it so open ended on the paper good. And what goes into it. I get to be very creative in what that paper good is. And so I feel like I have been able to explore a lot of my ideas that way. One of those things is like any sort of, like, build your own aspect time, what we were talking about with snail mail for men, but like little, like garlands or things that you can like, put up in your house somewhere. I'm very inspired by that. I'm very inspired by, like Valentine's or creating seasonal stuff, seasonal things for people to buy. My goal at the end of the year is to really, like, launch a true stationery brand. That would be very exciting for me. But in terms of like, snail mail specifically, I get to meet with so many people now when I do my little pick my brain sessions and some of the ideas that I've heard from other people that are inspiring to me, like one person. She's been a photographer her whole life and she has no place to put all of her photography. And so she wanted to send it out into the world. And so she's sending, like, original pieces of photography that she just has no space for. I thought that was really interesting. There's somebody else that I've talked to that creates similar in like the storyline, but you're jumping in on like, almost like a little like video game kind of like it's called Crossing something. Crossing. I forget the name of it. Animal Crossing. It's almost like you're. You become a little character inside of this small town and you get. Get bread and you get these things and you can trade them and things like that. So I think that's very cool.

That is cool.

And then I'm always looking for opportunities to like, ex connect the mailers within each other, if that makes sense. I think that the pen pal aspect is very cool for people. And so that's what I get really inspired by is like, how can I take all these subscribers and have them be connected in some capacity? So that's been like an idea I've been really working with.

Well, that should probably help churn too, if they're connected.

Exactly.

On the poem club. And with you, are you. And they only shipping out stuff that stays offline. Or is that letter posted online anywhere? Or is her poem posted online anywhere? Because I think that could be a critical part of this. Like, this will never be on you a little bit.

Yeah. So I don't post any of my. You couldn't, like, see it digitally. I'm even protective of it when I'm making content. I typically don't show a lot of it before people get it because I want it to be like a surprise. But I don't think that she puts it online either. However, there is one caveat to that that I. She does and that I'm very inspired by is. Is creating an archive of your letters so people can go into the past and purchase letters. So I'm. I'm really inspired by that and I'm going to try to do something similar to that in the next year because I do get a lot of people that are like, I wish I had last month's letter. And because my letters are so different month to month month, I think that sometimes people sign up and they don't get that letter and then they're like, oh, I wish I could have that. And so I think having an archive shop is a really great way to. You still have access to it, but it's still tangible goods and it's not virtual.

Yeah. Well, what if you had a second price point where you know it's $11 for what you offer and then like 16 for twice a month, One of your new stuff and then one of an archive piece.

Totally.

It doesn't put any more lift on you to create new stuff.

Yeah.

It's more lift to ship, and they're less profitable. But your average order value would go up. It's. Yeah, it's funny because you're telling me all these ideas, and, like, I'm thinking, like, all right, viral marketing. She could put ads in the letters. She could put a QR code, and if they share it, then they'll get an affiliate. And it's like, chris, stop.

Like, it's hard, though. This is hard to stay grounded.

It is hard, but it's like. I think that's why you're so successful, is because you're not, like, pulling every monetization lever that you could. Like, you're keeping it pure.

And consumers, they're so smart. They know what.

Yeah.

They know where your intentions are at. And I had. I had a company ask to put advertisements in, and I'm pretty sure it would have been a great financial offer, but that completely deteriorates the entire mission behind it. And so maintaining. Honestly, that's been the hardest part of being, like, a business owner. I think, for the tiny project in this year is. Is maintaining that mission with the tiny farmers market, with, you know, the tiny post, all of. All of those pieces, and making sure that it. It still aligns completely. Because, yeah, the consumers, they know what you're doing, and that's why they care about it.

Yeah. I'm gonna do something I don't normally do, and that's try to give you a piece of advice, even though you're, like, clearly winning at this. But this is the most hypocritical advice I've ever given anyone. Okay. You have these amazing ideas. You know, go for realtors, do this as a service, offer this as a business. I mean, your market penetration is, like, 7,000 people out of, like, 180 million female Americans.

Yeah.

You know, like, you could only do this forever, and it would be tens, if not hundreds of millions of dollars and never expanding outside of it, just being more creative, making this month a little better than last month. Like, if. And once again, completely hypocritical. And I would probably not do this, but if I were you, I would try to, like, just keep doing exactly what you're doing.

Yeah.

But, like, a little better every time, you know?

Yeah, I. That's helpful advice because, I mean, I think with trends, with everything that's been my biggest fear is I'm like, you know, maybe snail mail is just this trend. And I got A viral video at the right time. But I. You know, when I sit here and I get to talk about it, I think there is this, like, deeper thing behind it that people are really craving, and that's what inspires me the most. And so if I get to do this the rest of my life, I. I've already won every single thing. I feel beyond.

Oh, yeah.

Thankful.

I mean, as of right now, how many customers did you say you have?

4,100.

Oh, my gosh. All right, so almost $50,000 a month recurring. And I'm just gonna guess, like, half of that is profit. 25, 30,000.

Yeah, about.

Oh, my goodness.

Yeah.

Oh. And it just feels like. I know it's. I've had a logistics company. I've stood in the assembly line alongside my hourly employees and packed. Packed thousands of boxes of peanut butter or chocolate or. We've shipped everything, mostly food. I've been there, and it actually feels, like, really good. Like, it is a grind, but it just feels so good to produce and to take it to the post office and never see it again. Right.

Oh, my gosh. I always say I'm like, it's the best day because I get to see all the hard work. I get to see what 4,000 letters looks like. 4,000 people. And then I get to send it off into the ether and just pray it gets to you. And it just feels like this, like, crazy relief and just producing something. Something in the world that I care about or, like, it feels meaningful. It's. It's the most rewarding thing. It's absolutely crazy. And it's not at all what I expected my life to be.

No, but that's. That's okay. That's great. I mean, in less than six months, you're making tens of thousands of dollars a month in profit.

Yeah.

Doing something that you love. What could be better than that?

What could be better? Seriously?

I forgot to ask you one thing about junk journaling. Is it just, like. It's like, journaling plus scrapbooking, like, just to, like.

Exactly that. Yeah. Some people are journaling, like, actually writing. And some people don't even write. They just. Yeah, they just.

Oh, really?

Some things in there, and it's memories of, like, you know, if you go on a trip and you see all the things in there, you remember what's in there. I've. I've kind of tried to get into it. I'm strapped on time is what I'm realizing. But, like, I think it could be a very therapeutic, fun thing and a lot of people are into it right now. Yeah.

And they're not like scanning or printing anything. It's literally like a blank journal where they shove like receipts in ticket stubs and then they just like refer back to it every now and then to memory?

I think so I think just like seeing what your trip was to Paris that one time, or sometimes people break it down into days, sometimes it's like months. Like. Yeah. And there's a whole other market for junk journaling now because now, you know, junk journalers. Junk journalers are creating their own journals that are more conducive. Like they can open up all the way and they're easier to use. And yeah, like washi tape, specifically for junk journaling. There's so many other avenues that are being, I think, built out because of junk journaling as well.

Now, when it comes to your short form videos that have done well, I'm curious at like, how, how much of a student of the game are you on short form video? And like, how tactical are you being with the edits, with the retention, the hook, the payoff? Are you being really tactical? Have been learning and I say learning, like just swiping reels like all of us do for years that way. Or do you have experience or are you just like throwing it against the wall?

I throw it at the wall and I hope it sticks. That's. I've learned.

I've.

I'm realizing after about a year of posting, especially when I go back and I look at my past videos, I'm like, okay, I've definitely learned some things. I think some of that is like, I am a little bit more concise in the way that I talk. I'm a little bit faster. I really put myself in front of the camera. But I'm learning based off of how my videos do. I don't do much learning based off of like watching other content creators. If I like something, I'll be like, oh, that's a, that's a good idea. Like, I'll show this piece or something like that. But in terms of what I've learned, it's truly been, I think through like how my followers have received it and that's validated my experience in it. And what I found is people just, they crave vulnerability and they crave authenticity. And sometimes that's really hard because I. Sometimes I'm like, am I being fully authentic? And that's why I like love sharing the numbers and things because I want to inspire people to do it themselves. But one of my best videos was Sharing a colossal mistake that I made in November when I spilled red wine over, like, all of the letters.

Right.

The first off date. And people just, they loved that I was sharing that. And then all the letters ended up being overweight, so we had to re stamp every single letter. And it was just, honestly, it was like a hell on earth experience. And I was transparent with it and I shared it. And I was like, if you have a drop or two of red wine on your letter, I'm so sorry. And people just like, they were like, I hope mine has red wine.

Like, I got one.

I got one. So excited.

And golden ticket.

Yeah. And it really validated my experience with it because I was like, okay, I don't need to hide this from people. And, like, I can share exactly what made this month a little bit difficult. And, you know, balancing that with, like, not being, you know, appreciative of everything, but at the same time being like, oh, it wasn't all rainbows and sunshine. And that was the month that I ended up getting a studio because I was like, I can't ever have the letters in my house again. It scared me too bad. So, yeah.

Yeah.

Sharing all of that with them.

Oh, that's awesome. Speaking of golden ticket, you should incorporate that, like, you know, one person every month wins some sort of an award. Oh, really?

This month is our first month. We have a golden ticket, and it gives you and your pen pal a free year of the tiny post.

Oh, man, that's awesome. Yeah, you should, you should test it with other things, like $100Amazon gift card, like something not related and just see if that. If that plays a role. Or have you had a month where you noticed like, unusually low churn or high churn and you were able to correlate that to something you did that month that you can learn from?

Honestly, no. The only thing that I would say I was surprised by was the wait list and it not turning over as many people. I was, I was surprised that we planned to have a lot more subscribers that month. And I felt a little discouraged when we. We did. I mean, we had like over a thousand new subscribers, but I was just a little bit shocked because we had 3,000 on the waitlist. And the lesson I learned there was that I needed to share on the Google Doc how much this cost. And there was. I learned a lot about that educational piece of explaining what they are getting and why they are getting it. A lot of people were confused in the beginning. They. I think because we don't use the US Postal system as much as we used to. But I, I got a lot of emails in the beginning being like, like, I don't have a tracking number for this. Like, I can't find it. And so part of my TikTok became this place of explaining what the postal system is explaining, you know, why you can't receive a tracking number on a 1 ounce letter. You know, a lot of my videos, when I get to talk about my experience with the postal workers and like, when I get to go in there and show, like, talk to them about how we need to get, you know, 4,000 letters through the door. And that piece, I think was, was helpful too, in learning what was working and what wasn't working.

Yeah, that's very interesting. I'm proud to say that I am your newest customer. Oh, I just purchased.

You might have to share it with your wife a little bit because I don't know how.

Yeah, but I get to open it. I get to look at it first and then I'll let her look at it maybe for a minute.

Yeah, I'm very excited about it.

This one, I think I'm like, I'm out. Like, I'm ready to take a nap. This was amazing. I've been intellectually stimulated.

Yay.

You're awesome. This is a great business and you're doing a great service.

Like, thank you.

What, what an amazing way to leave your mark on the world is to encourage entrepreneurship with your farmer's market. Right. And then delight people in the mail.

Yeah, that's my hope. That is absolutely my hope.

That's amazing. Well, Hannah, where can people find you if they have questions or where's the best place to reach you?

The best place to reach me is on my Instagram. I'm Hannah underscore the tinyproject. And on TikTok, I'm Hannah the Tiny Project. And then if anyone wants to email me, they can email me@hannahinyproject.org okay.

We will link to both of those. Thank you for your time.

Thank you so much.