The Most Copy-Paste Way to Build an Online Business⏐Ep. #224

The price tag you can put on that skill set is insane. There's projects that we've charged 100 grand for and they've done like five days. This is our one shot output.

Oh, my gosh. Did you even ask it to do that?

No, no, no. I didn't ask it to do any of this type of stuff. It just figured it out. My prompt was like tiny two sentences.

How long would the next site take to just copy and paste it?

If I click right, click duplicate, 10 seconds, you're done. That's it. Just with a lazy approach, you're out doing Reddit. TripAdvisor with Wingstop's own brand, $0 paid, costing basically nothing to build. This is all the pages we're ranking number one for.

People don't realize that sites like TripAdvisor and Yelp have millions of pages that took billions of dollars of software engineering and a decade of grinding. It can be done for 99% less and 99% faster today. All right, guys, this episode is as tactical as you get. And to those listening on audio, there's a big chunk of this that's very visual, but we made a special edit of the audio version and left in all the meat you don't need to see. So. So don't go to a different podcast. You're still gonna love this. And if you're on Spotify, watch the video version because we put the visual stuff in there. Or if you don't have a video podcast, just go to my YouTube. Watch the whole thing there. In this episode, we go from idea to vibe. Coding tools, shortcuts, growth hacks, how to copy paste these websites, how to find the design tools. If you're not a good designer, it's all in here. Please enjoy.

Page you turn in the book, it just captivates you, man. Like, my excitement couldn't be any greater. And then a few weeks later, it's even greater than that. It's just like the gift that keeps on giving. And I haven't literally. In 15 years of just building things, I've never, you know, experienced a feeling like this. As a entrepreneur, I just be able to be creative, have ideas, you know, to have the tools at disposal to be able to execute is just, you know, so fascinating and satisfying as well at the same time.

It is, yeah. So tell me about your directories and what made you want to start building those in the first place.

Sure.

For those listening, we'll describe everything that he's showing.

So Absolutely. Yeah. So the directory idea, really? I used to build projects, you know, very early on, you know, MySpace layouts, you know, then, you know, your dream movies of the world and figma to convert into HTML, the whole nine yards. And so I started to just sort of, you know, build some sites out. And then I came across AI. And what became really interesting with AI was the fact that you can create these programmatic SEO pages. And what we mean by programmatic is effectively, if you think about a directory like TripAdvisor, you know, every single URL, like, there's, you know, thousands of URLs. So you have, like, you know, TripAdvisor.com for every, you know, slash city. Then inside the city, you've got towns, and then towns, you've got, you know, restaurants and bars and clubs or whatever. You've got, like, it can go on forever. And no one is sitting there manually adding all these pages. Programmatic means that they're kind of just, you know, created automatically just on the flight. And so I enabled that to be very accessible for me, at least where I could just say to myself, okay, well, if I can just create content and the content can also be generated by AI, then technically I don't have to spend all that time creating all this type of content. I could just create, you know, thousands of web pages, send them into Google, and then get them to rank well. And so originally, I did this with a recipe site, guiltychef.com okay? So I just built the app. We released the app. 20,000 downloads, you know, real quick, unpaid downloads.

Paid freemium.

Yeah, it was. It was freemium. So we probably made, I think it was like, $8,000 or something, maybe in the first, like, week. It was, like, recurring revenue as well. So it was like, you know, it was insane. I just, you know, got obsessed with, you know, programmatic SEO because of AI, and guiltychef.com was born. So this site now ranks number one, just globally, for keywords. So if you just go to, like, even if I go to, like, an incognito tab, and let's say I type in Wagamama Crispy Chili Mushrooms recipe, you'll see, like, Guilty Chef is, like, number one right here. Organic. Above, like, Pinterest, Instagram, all these videos, Reddit, like, we're right here. And you open that up, this takes you to our site, and you get to see the actual recipe and the directions. And all this content was just generated through AI effectively. So, you know, the restaurants, the dishes, you can see, like, you know, these are restaurants. You open up a restaurant, then you have the Restaurant and the restaurant name. And so basically this is where the SEO kicks in. Like, people search Burger King recipes, you know, it will come up with this page. And so the idea, for me, it was, it was a simple idea which was there's nowhere to find recipes inspired by the restaurants you love. You, you have some websites like that, but they're normally people that have cooked.

Recipes at home and then they're not aggregated. There's not one website dedicated to that. Is that why it's called Guilty Chef? Because it's like unhealthy? Like restaurant recipes mostly?

That's a nice, good question, Guilty Chef. I can't remember where the name came from.

I think, like, you probably just were looking for good domain names and.

No, no, no, no, I wasn't. Like, that's the crazy thing about the SEO, that this has been the best performing SEO site of the two directors I'm going to show you. And the domain is like nothing to do with it. And that's what's wild. It's like people always think that you need a good. My next director I show you is all about the domain name. But like this one, like, it doesn't matter about domain name. So especially if you're starting a directory, don't go crazy about the domain name because it can just rank well, so long as your content is structured just using the basic things that you need. And when I say basic things, those are things like, you know, creating content, linking between the pages of your content, you know, using schema. So this is. Schema.org is like something that a lot of people don't know about. But if you look at schema here, there's different types of schema you can have. And what schema is, it's a series of, like, properties that Google looks for on a web page to see if there's information about that. So for restaurants, it might look for opening hours, or it might look for price range or payment methods and that.

And the more, the more boxes you check, like, the higher likelihood you are of ranking, right?

And so if you think about before AI, you'd have to first of all have a SEO strategist or someone who'd be like, this is what you need to do. Then you'd have to figure out, okay, well, which of these do I use? Then you have to go and, you know, create the content. And then you've got to have someone design the pages and develop those. That's like a team of four or five people already. And so now with like cursor and Claude code. I just go straight into it and I just say, hey, create me a category for restaurants and just make it, you know, compatible with, you know, schema and include all the relevant properties I need. And it will just do it in, like, seconds. And so that was like, if you take that method and you multiply it by like, you know, 100 or 1,000, you start to get like, all of these pages of content, and even the content is generated by AI. And that's the other thing is that people think that AI generated content can't rank in Google. They absolutely can. And in fact, this also ranks in LLM models as well. So ChatGPT and Claude will also pick up these recipes. If someone types in a certain recipe they have on my site and you check the sources, you'll come up with my content before, you know, some other, you know, recipe site.

Yeah, people need to understand, like, it's. People are asking questions on Google and Google is in the business of giving them answers. Yes. So if. If Google does not have enough answers to pull from and some of the best ones or some of the only ones are AI generated, it's going to show them, you know.

Absolutely, absolutely. I think there's too much, like, kind of opinion around whether sites rank or not or, you know, will SEO work with AI? But I think, like, there's no better thing than, like, seeing it in action. So I'm sure for yourself, Chris, and even like myself, I like facts. Right. And I feel like as a builder, I want to just see it for myself. Right. Because there's plenty of opinion out there. And so building a directory, this was a way of me seeing, okay, well can it actually work? It's like all the things I'm building and doing, all the iterations are just like me, you know, kind of poking at a curiosity I have. But also because I can now tap into AI, I can execute it so quickly that I can actually get a factual answer quicker than. Than me scrolling through X looking at opinions. You know what I mean?

Yeah, yeah.

So this is an example of like the, the SEO. So the orange is organic growth. So this means that there's zero paid traffic. So I'm spending $0 on marketing on this site.

So this is. This is guilty chef.com that you're showing me. Traffic.

Yeah, that's right. So guilty Shaft here.

What's the date we're looking at, like, August 2024 is when it starts ticking up.

Uh, yeah, yeah. So. So, yeah, so this was like, I kind of like, rebuilt the site around June. And so then Google, you know, probably around August. And then look, we're just getting like 5, 600, 800,000. And then I don't know what this huge spike was here, by the way. I have no idea. I've never figured that out. But there was a crazy spike here.

I think the most interesting part of this chart is the very middle between March and August 2024, you're adding pages, pages, pages, pages, and not getting any feedback from Google. Like, nothing is showing you that it's working, but you're just persisting, persisting, persisting. All of a sudden in August, oh, sign of life. You know, September. Ooh. And then it's literally, literally only up and to the right ever since. But, like, that's why SEO is so important, is because you need to be willing to be patient, play the long game. And it's not like it's costing you anything like 50 bucks a month for certain tools. A little bit of your time other than that, like, if you can be patient. Now you're at how many visits organically per month?

Almost 11,000 now.

Jeez Louise.

Yeah. And by the way, there's a paid side to the site as well, so people, People can also go on here and just, like, subscribe and generate their own recipes as well.

So there's only 160 pages on this site.

Yeah, yeah. There's not much at all on this site.

Well, imagine if you had 16,000.

You know what, Again, it's my fault because I just get like, I ran. This is almost like experiment, and it, like, performed better than I expected. And I was like, okay, I've got to, like, I've done the same thing. Yeah. So, yeah, you can see here, by the way, like, you know how we. By the way, Ahrefs as a tool is a great tool to get, like, you can get. You get a free account on there and you can just do keyword research. So you can go on, like, you know, keyword research up here. Keywords Explorer. And so if you just want to start directory in a certain niche, like, you could just type in, I don't know, let's just say, you know, recipes. Let's do something more niche. Let's say, you know, toddler recipes and you can search by different regions. But let's say, you know us, it will show you, like, what the search volume is and trends look like, you know, over a given period of time. And also what you want to look at here is, like, how easy is that keyword to rank for which Means that okay, well this is kind of a broad keyword which is pretty good. So if you can find the dot com, which actually I own toddler recipes.com as well.

Okay, good for you.

But I haven't, I haven't done anything with it yet. So nothing, nothing interesting yet. But there's, but you can just see that there's so many, you know, recipes. And why I found this interesting is because there's all of these are the long tail keywords.

So like toddler recipes.

So you're seeing like now look at the volume again, like you know, 900 searches per month, 600 searches per month. And like if you can come up number one, they will aggregate into like a, you know, decent audience. I'd really say like where, where this funnel becomes interesting and I haven't even like taken it to this level yet with my site is like, you know, traffic is one thing, but like email capture, you know, Google pixel, you know, the amount of retargeting that's possible. Even being able to, you know, I could go into the ingredient side of my webpage and then have brands bidding or like people at Walmart bidding for like spots. So like people click on, you know, pepper and it connected the Walmart site for you to buy it, you know, so when you start building in traffic, you hold the leverage. And I think that's the interesting strategic part of this type of business that I liked is that, you know, the traffic is yours, you know, and so like it speaks for itself. And so you can really trade against that becomes a currency and it can easily net you, you know, even if it starts off being 500, $600 a month, man, that's great. And then you can start growing that more and more and more and start to become something meaningful.

So you said you're also monetizing this. You have like a paid section of the site. How is that?

Yeah, the paid section. But it's nothing crazy right now because we're not really pushing people towards it. But like you can go on here and you can just like build your own recipes basically and like pay.

It's just a rapper.

Yeah, yeah, so it's just like, you know, it's just anthropic running in the background, just basically. Yeah, just you know, running the recipe and just create the recipe for you. So I can already see some bugs on it because I haven't been on it in like, you know, a few months. So. Yeah, but that's basically what it is.

Do you have ads on the site or is it Monetizing in any way or is you just letting.

No, no ads right now. So it's probably revenue wise, I think it's probably, probably just doing like maybe like 7, 800amonth, something like that. Like there's nothing crazy, but it's still like, you know, it's just still something cool. This comes in for organic traffic. So yeah, just like people who have. And a lot of it's funny because a lot of the customers are those that have like signed up at peak times, like maybe around, you know, holiday season, they're trying to look for recipes and they're paid like five bucks or something to join the site and the memberships are just running and they might not even be that active, but you know, they're just in there. And you know, that's the other interesting thing about these type of businesses is that, you know, if you create products that can get high volumes of traffic by very, you know, low increments of revenue, people are willing to pay because it's just there and you're likely to capture them. And also if you start to increase your traffic and you get those people coming in, those $5 start adding up and can become something meaningful.

Yeah. And now what tools did you use to build this site?

This was built in webflow, but all of the sort of the AI components of it were built using cursor. And so that cursor I think can feel very daunting to people. So I've got it open here. You know, people can feel like this is like, you know, just for programs. And even I felt that way. And then when I actually went into it, really it's just like, think of it like imessage almost. You know, if you could just talk, you can create. And actually the power lies in that those that are creative and can express their ideas as opposed to those that are like technical. You don't have to be technical at all. And that's why I've set up, you know, I've got a school community, five day sprint. I've also got five daysprint.com where you can go on here and just set up your project and it will just give you like a one line string. Like if you set your project up there like this and you can just hit copy here and you can go into, just open up cursor, hit paste right here and hit enter. And this, this one line will set up your entire project for you. And so all you then have to go is do is go in there and just iterate the features that you Want, but, like, the context of your project is all in there. And that's how I feel like we should be building. Because there's so many interesting things that you can do with these projects. But you need a scaffolding. Right. And so Guilty Chef is like, think of that as a scaffold, which I was able to then use myself to build best dubai.com. so if you look, the sites are identical in terms of how they look. Right. Look like even a search literally doesn't even move.

Both on webflow.

These were both built like visuals are built in webflow and. But all the functions and functionality were like, through cursor.

Okay.

And I just connected them into webflow. Yeah.

So you live in Dubai. What gave you the idea to start this? Just like, do you see a different site that was similar?

Guilty Chef started working. So it'll be interesting to see what the AHREFS data shows us. But Guilty Chef started to work, and when it started to work, I got. I had already been in. So I moved to Dubai around the time I was building, actually. So I literally moved to Dubai here. Right. And I started to build the project and I started to see results around here. And then I was like, hold on a second. Like, this is interesting. This hadn't even started fully growing yet, but just some results around that time. I'd been in Dubai long enough to know that, okay, I'm always looking for places to eat, places to visit. There's no, not actually any great directory. And if you go to, like, Dubai's actual tourism site, it doesn't have. It's very. Their directory is very basic. Right. And it's very bloggy. It's like, it's not really immersive. And so I thought, okay, that's interesting. And so then I thought to myself, I started brainstorming and I started to brainstorm loads of words, but I didn't brainstorm Best Dubai. It was like, best restaurants Dubai or best things in Dubai things. Because I never thought the domain would be available.

Yeah.

And then from if out of nowhere, I just actually searched bestobuy.com and the domain was available for like 9.

That's the best feeling in the world when you type it in and you're like, it's not going to be available. I know it's not, but I just have to. And then it is. You, like, you've never clicked by faster.

Oh, yeah, right.

I mean Texas. Texas snacks dot com. Send eats dot com.

Wow.

I've got.

What's that second one? Send eats.

Send eats.

Okay.

Like ship food.

Yeah. Oi, that's nice.

It was a company that shipped food.

So dude, sometimes the domain will like just like spawn the idea for you. Like it would just come from. Cool domain.

Totally.

Yeah.

I am, I own the domain twiceused.com and like I thought someone could have like an Etsy for upcycled stuff, you.

Know, and so be@besttobuyer.com was available $900. And then the interesting thing was I then searched like other domain names similar for other countries and other towns. So like best saudi.com for example was $100,000. And so when I saw the price difference I was like, first of all, this is going to be like a very valuable domain. And secondly, I can't believe it's available. So I didn't talk to no one. I was, I'm not going to tell no one. I'm just going to buy it. And once I've got it, then I've got it. And so I bought it, got access. I was like, okay. I still couldn't believe it. And then it was like the mission to be like, okay, well what can we turn this.com into? And so with this one was focused a bit more like restaurants, hotels, malls, schools. Again, all this content AI generated. So like AI is aggregating Google reviews. AI is going and you know, getting the, you know, giving a scoring system, you know, picking up amenities and check in times and maps and all this type of content, FAQs. And again all of that is being connected to schema. So like you'd have a schema for you know, local business. And I'll just say to cursor, hey, I've got a local business site, I need schema implemented. Excuse me. And it'll just write the schema. We've started to see some meaningful organic results now. So again, $0 paid on advertising costing basically nothing to build. Like when I say nothing, I mean like less than $100 or something. And so if you go to, let's say we type in one of the keywords like Parker, Parker's is like a big restaurant here. Type in like Parker's Dubai reviews that we're number two below TripAdvisor now. Wow. In Google. And so that's, you know, coming up above Facebook, Zomato, Reddit, you know, all these other sites, OpenTable.

Okay, so if someone wanted to start a directory from scratch today, can you just show us like what your first steps would be? How would you start? What tools would you look to? What, how would you do research Et cetera.

Yeah, sure. So, first of all, I think Ahrefs is absolutely a great tool to you just to do keyword research, first of all. So I think, like, go and explore keywords.

I've been using Beehive for about two years, almost as long as they've been around. And I got to tell you, watching other creators stay stuck on basic newsletter platforms is painful. You're losing thousands of dollars because you don't know what your subscribers are worth. And when potential sponsors ask who reads your newsletter and you say entrepreneurs or moms, you lost the deal. But Beehive has a survey feature that's brilliant. You can set up a few questions about demographics and spending habits that you send them through right after they subscribe. So instead of telling sponsors, oh, I have five subscribers, you can say, I have 3,750 homeowners making over $75,000 a year who spend $200 plus per month on home improvement. And that's proof that their ideal customers are reading your newsletter. Go extract your email list from whatever platform you're stuck on, because it's probably costing you thousands in lost deals. Beehive makes migration easy. You can move all your emails in minutes so you can get paid what you're actually worth. Head to beehive.com Chris for 30% off your first three months. That's B E-E H I-I V.com Chris. You'll thank me later.

Try and find domain names as close as possible to the dot com, because I do think that gives you an added advantage. And so instant domainsearch.com is a great tool to use because if I just type like, the reason it's cool is because it gives you all the different, like, URLs available, like from one search. So you can see, like, the.com and like any other, you know, ones you like and the green ones obviously available. And so I love just using this site to find domains. Once you buy a domain and you've got, you know, the key, so spend some time on keyword research, like, really try and see, like, you know, what are the interesting trends here and what you. What you want to look for, just as a rule of thumb, are keywords with a low keyword difficulty and a higher search volume. And so if we actually looked right now here, and we said, let's just say, I know snacks and just search that. Since you mentioned snacks, do you have.

Like, a general ratio you look for, like, it needs to be under X difficulty and over Y search volume?

Absolutely, yeah. So, so I would say you want to keyword difficulty between 0 and 30. And so what I'll do is I'll come in here And I'll go, KD, keyword difficulty between 0 and 30. And then I would start there. And then the higher the search volume, the better. So this is actually crazy, by the way. Look at this. So like it's very rare. You see something like, wow, high protein snacks.

Nine keyword difficulty, 81,000 monthly searches.

So, so that's like, that's, that's a snatch. Like if you, if you can get like high protein snacks dot com. So like, literally, let's see, like if you can buy that, like, that's worth a shot considering the type of investment that people put into businesses. Like, people, sometimes I think about domain names is like, you know, how to price them or whatever. But I think like, if you would generally start a business, like a small business, minimum $10,000, you'd be considering like, maybe I'm gonna invest in starting a business. Right. Like in a small business loan. And so in this type of age where you can build things with AI and directories, like, if I saw, I would absolutely buy this if I saw that type of, you know, this type of.

It's $7,000. Yeah. The domain.

This would kill it though.

I love the strategy of searching for a very broad keyword.

Yeah.

And then looking at what it shows you and like letting your rabbit holes go crazy from that point. Right.

Yeah. Because also it can inspire like different ideas as well. So, you know, zero to 30 is a good keyword difficulty. And for search volume, by the way, this is, this is why I'm saying this is crazy is because normally I would say even like a thousand is like good. Right?

Because search volume.

Yeah. Like, you know, and this is 81,000. This 81,000. Yeah. So like, because if you see a lot of the keywords in my site, so they're not, they just aggregate. So like if I go into. Where were we? Like here.

Yeah. Because there's going to be a long tail of hundreds or thousands of variations of that keyword.

Exactly.

You're not only relying on toddler snacks.

Exactly. So like, look, spicy Korean Q wingstop. Like, I'll just show you. We're ranking number. This is all the pages we're ranking number one for. So like these are all number one in Google Organic. Right. And so like, wow, volume, volume. Like we only get 30 for noble wagyu tacos. But keyword difficulty zero. You know, even this one, I maybe get 42 visitors a month from this wingstop. But like, you know, it's volume is 80, but keyword difficulty is 0. And number one, and again, there's loads of those.00, 0. But like we're getting like 300, 250, 400 and they just aggregate. And again, this goes on for pages. So we've got pages of just like, you know, number one position just using this strategy. Now the thing is like, I think especially since recently I've been seeing how quickly you can build projects using Cursor. Like these two projects were built using webflow for their interface. And then I used cursor and Claude code for some of like these kind of like HTML elements. What I realized recently was to actually build things at Claude code. And cursor was cool, but I'm a designer, but I couldn't create something beautiful. And you've probably heard that there's this thing called AI slop, right? Like people just create just crazy things that AI renders. But if you look at this site and we can go into a bit of this with some live building in a minute, but all the UI here was built using cast iron Claude code. So none of this is using figma. Nothing here is using a single design tool. Like every single thing you're seeing here is done just through natural language. And the fascinating thing to me was simply the fact that I can just use my creativity in my mind and so long as I can explain it, I can get an output. And I think that's such a big lesson for people to take away. Even if you're building a directory or whatever, it's like, yes, domain is important, you know, keyword research is important, but this is like a stack of skills that you got to build up and you got to like look within yourself and think, okay, well, do I have a broad taste palette for what a good website or experience looks like? And if you do, then great, you should be able to explain that. Then it's about the communication. And so long as you can like take inspiration from other sites or other things you've seen and be able to just simply type it into a tool like cursor right here you can get outputs like this, but simply by saying to it, hey, can you add a blue card at the top of this card and also do this and it will just create it for you.

Do you only use cursor for projects like this or do you use replit, lovable, etc.

No, I just use cursor and Claude code. I find them much easier than Replit. Okay, well, I think so when you open up Cursor by default, you're going to get a blank screen. And that's what's like quite daunting for people is like, okay, where do I start? Because even when I was building, it's like, okay, yes, we understand, we might know what HTML is or CSS or whatever, but like, if you think about the modern web, they use frameworks that are like that called Next JS or Tailwind CSS or these have technical elements.

And I have no clue what any of that means, by the way.

Not even to this day. I don't really understand them at all.

And I think most of, most of my audience is like a little technical, but definitely not a software engineer. Kind of like me, right?

Exactly like us. Yeah, man. So I might go to Cursa and I'll go to Cursor and I will say I am building. So. So by the way, how you want to think about this is this is Cursor over here. And so Cursor is the software which has its own chat in it. Again, just using the Claude model. In here we have the terminal using Claude code. But even though they're inside the same software, they don't. These two chats don't talk to each other. So this thing over here has no idea what this did, and this has no idea what this does. So basically when I speak to Claude co, I use speak to Cursor about something on the right here. I might do market research with it. I might help it, excuse me, set up things for me. But then Claude Code will be the executor, right? I think Claude Cody will give me feedback. I'll give that feedback to Cursor and Cursor. Sort of like make sure that like all the work is done correctly.

Well, people don't realize that sites like TripAdvisor and Yelp have not thousands, not hundreds of thousands, millions of pages. That took billions of dollars of software engineering and a decade of grinding. And don't get me wrong, it's still going to be a lot of grinding to create millions of pages with Vibe coding app. But it can be done for 99% less and 99% faster today.

Yeah, absolutely. And that was the thing. I'm spinning out products like daily, right? Like the directory that best to buy. Like I will probably build a new one within two or three days. You know, we'll re, we'll rebuild it and make it even better and get to a ranking better in Google. And so you can. This is where, you know, Chris, a guy like you is perfect for your type of brain. Right. Someone who has ideas, wants to wake up better just execute. Like, this is made for the people have ideas. And I'm sure, you know, everyone in your audience is like that, where they're just like, I want to execute this. And then you actually can execute quicker and prove your point and demo it to someone faster than actually just saying, hey, like, what do you think about this idea? You know, like, don't. If your gut says do it, just execute. And you will. The time it's going to take to try to explain it someone, you can just get the job done.

Yeah. Let's say that, for instance, to get this site up and running takes three hours of tinkering and vibe coding.

Right.

It's not perfect, but it's good enough to hit publish and to put it on a custom domain. If you wanted to take that site and you like the look of it, you like the database that it's pulling from, but you just want to make like, ketotoddler snacks dot com. Okay. Or something entirely different, like horse. Horsefeed dot com. Right. Whatever. How many hours or how much effort do you think it would take to use one of these apps to just copy and paste it in a different vertical?

Do you want to see it?

If the first version took three hours, how long would the next site take? Because I'm still waiting for a good reason why people aren't vibe coding, like, thousands of directory sites. Like, not a directory site with thousands of pages, but thousands of them.

Okay, so let's say we had this project here called Protein Snacks. If right click and I click duplicate, and my new site is called layer duplicate. 10 seconds, 5 seconds. Okay, that was like maybe 10 seconds. 15 seconds maybe. And now I can rename this to, you know, Toddler Snacks. You're done. That's it? That's your question?

Well, so I guess you still got to swap out, like, pictures and branding and stuff, right?

Yes, but that, like, the features, the functionality, they all live. This is a beautiful thing about cursor and Claude code is creating files like it's files you like all. All these sites, like, like facebook.com it's just a series of files. Like, just code written inside the files. Like, this is what it's creating for you. So it's creating entire application. Like, if someone says, oh, I exited my app for, like, you know, Snapchat for. For $15 billion, they sold a folder. You know what I mean?

Yeah.

Like that.

Yeah.

Yes. There's a database that's like, that's it. Like, yeah, that is not, it's not complicated. But also it's like, you know, we, this era right now of building allows us all to open our eyes and wake up and say, oh, like that's it. Yeah, that is really it. And now the tools that are available, you can create so much value as well with them.

It's unbelievable, you know. Now the last time I posted the directory episode, some people in the comments were like, oh, this is irrelevant now AI's removing the need for directories. What would you say to them?

No, not at all, man. I think like, no, like we've just seen it ourselves. Look, by the way, we're seeing, right? This is like live data we're looking at, right? With like these sites that we just, I just showed you guys as well, has gone now these graphs where this is like in real time. It's growing, you know, it's still growing, it's still going up. And so, man, absolutely not. There's like. And this is. The US is one of the biggest locations for traffic for us as well. You know, that's like a global market. So, yeah, I'd say, I'd say, you know, very much like directories are a moneymaker.

There's always going to be a need to remove friction to getting from point A to point B, from getting question asked to question answered.

Right.

And directories just makes that easier, period. End of story. People ask about like AI SEO and there's many a guru out there selling like AI SEO courses, but really, at the end of the day, good SEO is good AI SEO. Like it's really the same thing.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Yeah, yeah. Because there's a misconception right now where people, the obvious kind of argument is while search engines are going to die and everyone's using ChatGPT, first of all, that no one's killing off Google right now. You know what I mean? Like, so really Average Joe's like, you know, no matter what we've achieved, like, we're not a trillion dollar company, right? So like, we don't have any right to bet against them or like say anything. Let them, let them do what they're doing and they're gonna fight to protect themselves. Let them do it. And also the, the space we're in, we're seeing how volatile it is in terms of the businesses. Like, you know, OpenAI one day is hyping something up and then, you know, it falls a bit short and then Google Feels like it's falling behind and it kills it. With the image model, like it's a constant, you know, tug of war between different companies. So let people do what they're doing. Search is very much around, and even the same strategy schema is what is being used to pull up data inside ChatGPT and Claude as well. So if you go into. Let's open up right now and let's just type in, you know, give me a recipe for Wingstop Korean Wingstop Q Wings. Right. And let's just see what it comes out with. I don't know if I put the web search version on, but let's see.

Don't get me started on ChatGPT5.

Oh, man. I know. You know what? I. I actually haven't even used it that much. Like, I've been using Claude so much, but people have been telling me it's like horrible. Look at the. What? Yeah, this is fast Internet as well. Okay. So let's just let this run for a second. But let's see. So this is Chat GPT just giving us information. Okay, so now let's say give me your sources. So I write like such a pun as well, isn't it?

Yeah. All right, so I mean, how long ago did Google add that feature where it will answer your question for you without you having to click through a website? That was five years, pretty recently. I feel like it was not the AI answers I'm talking about.

If you ask like, all right, all right, yeah.

What's the capital of Malaysia? And it would just. Instead of clicking through what back then, everyone was like, oh, like websites are dead. Google doesn't want us to click through to. It's like, no, websites are doing great.

Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. Absolutely.

Chat GPT has, what is it like, hundreds of millions of daily active users. And to everyone saying, like, Google's dying, Google's dead. Look at. Go to similar web type in google.com. they're great. They're doing fine.

Yeah, yeah.

Billions of people using Google every day, dude.

And like, there's such an important. I think one of the biggest keywords that I learned that had a massive impact on like the outcomes I've got my businesses is two words, value capture. Meaning, like there are times when there's shifts happening and things are going on where there's a tremendous amount of value capture opportunity. Right. Like, you know, while this is all happening right now. Yes. There are some businesses that are just AI wrappers that maybe in two years might be cured by a ChatGPT app. Or a Canva app or something, but it doesn't matter. Like right now, no, you can capture an audience. You can get direct your audience through social media. You can go viral for something just by posting reels and being engaging, you know, you can create. And also, we underestimate how many people are on the planet. There's so many people with different problems they're trying to solve so many niches within niches that you can just tap into and just create so much value and capitalize on it, you know, and not only that, by the way, forget even the product conversation. Like just showing, showing what I've just showed you guys right now, for example, like this, I'm. The projects I'm showing you, I'm doing as hobbies. But in my agency, we're doing projects worth millions of dollars using these type of skill sets, right? Where businesses will come to us and say, hey, can you build this for us? We've got such and such problem. I would go through a process using Claude code and cursor, but the price tag you can put on that skill set is insane, right? Like insane. Like this projects that we've charged 100 grand for and they've been done like five days, you know, and that's like incomprehensible. It's like better than drug money, you know, just by learning these skills, you know what I mean? I'm just trying to compare it to something.

No, no, no. I mean, think of apps like Calendly, right?

Yeah.

This guy in Atlanta built Calendly. Nothing did it like that. Now there's a million Calendly clones. And then about two years ago, Google comes out with their own Calendly feature and everyone's like, calendly's dead. It's dead. Calendly's crushing it. Like, first movers advantage, having a moat, having traction, having loyal customers is very, very real. Right? And the other framework that I kind of just thought of is, let's say you build a wrapper today that becomes obsolete in two years. But that wrapper was like the first thing you really built with your hands. And it feels good and it got you kind of addicted to that feeling of building and creating. But by the time that app or whatever it is that you built two years from now becomes obsolete, you won't care because you will have. You'll be on project number nine by then. It will be irrelevant to you. And that's the whole point. Like, we don't build a wrapper to retire with it. We build a wrapper to Taste, entrepreneurship, and to become addicted to it and then to build things that only get better in time.

That's the best point, I think, of this whole episode, man, is what you just said. Right there is like, the value of the skill and the experience and that, like I said at the very beginning. I said at the very beginning, like, how I'm feeling now is like, I can't compare it to any type of thing I felt before. You know, whether it's building or designing or creating. Like, by building with AI, I think everyone should experience it just to know the feeling I'm talking about. It's like. It's like when you experience something and, like, you can't explain to someone else unless they've experienced it. Right. Like any type of, you know, experience, whether it's traveling or whatever. I think this is like that, which is you've got to do it, and you will. You'll feel a very particular feeling. It's like an ignition being started in your body.

Yeah.

Of like, whoa. It's like a whole new brain unlock. Because you don't realize how many I. How many times our brain actually just stops an idea and doesn't go further than that because we already know in ourselves. Well, I'm not technical. I can't afford to get a developer. And so we just, like, kind of be like, meh, and we just kind of carry on, and then if someone else does it, we kind of look at it a bit jealous. Right. Like, it's a. No. It's been. It's been that human condition for so many years that we've got to unwind that and to undo that. You've got to start building. And in fact, you will unlock such a new version of yourself that is confident, a version of yourself that starts building and creating and you actually feel, like, happier around the world. I feel like so much more energized for my family and loved ones because I'm having fun. You know what I mean?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And the results are in real time, by the way. Yeah.

Right. Have you ever heard a story, like, on Twitter or anywhere, read an article about an entrepreneur that built something that later became irrelevant, and he just, like, became broke, penniless, declared bankruptcy, and died a miserable man. I've never read that story. I've read stories about, you know, I built this app and then Facebook, like, put me out of business, and by the time they're telling that story, they're a billionaire from something else.

Yeah.

It just doesn't happen.

Yes, absolutely, man. And you probably Experienced that so many times with your businesses, right? Well, like the, you only go upwards like that, you know, you fail up.

Well, well. And on the, the other side of that argument is the opposite where like in 2010 I opened an iPhone repair store and I was just like counting down the days. I'm like this, you know, these screens are going to become unbreakable or they're going to change. You know, technology is evolving so fast. Like I got to get it while the getting's good. And I sold it two years later and I don't regret that. And then I got into the iPhone parts sales business where I sold wholesale iPhone parts. And I had the same fear. I'm like, I'm in the same vertical. I'm just higher up the supply chain and these are become unbreakable. And then I'd read an article about Gorilla Glass or this new OtterBox case is like, yep, any day now. Guess What? It's been 15 years. There's 30,000 iPhone repair shops. All of my competitors that sold iPhone parts are like, many of them are still around. They're crushing it. Like most opportunities stick around for a while. And so when we make these excuses like why did I build a wrapper? It's just, it's redundant to ChatGPT. It's going to be out. There's a thousand recipe wrapper apps on the app store. Like, you need to understand that that's not a real excuse. That's you coming up with excuses to feel better about not doing it. So you can go to bed that night and think, you know what, I didn't build that wrapper. But it's okay because it would have failed. So I'll just try something else. Like, no, just freaking do it. Like it's like $20 a month for these software products.

Even when, when they release like a max plan, like $200 a month. People are like $200 a year. But you're comparing it to Spotify subscription. Like you got to look at the productivity value.

How much was your tuition? 2,000amonth at university.

And you can learn like that in like a week now. And the fact that if a CTO came to you, you try to hire a developer and all go to an agency and pay $100,000 to an agency or like 10 grand a month to like a developer. And they came to you and said, hey, I'll do this work for you, but I'll bring you 10 of my other amazing friends who also do this. So yeah, 100 grands worth of value A month. But I'll give it to you for like, 200. You'd, like, you'd build that person a home to live with you. You know what I mean? Like, that's literally what these, like, services are like. And by the way, your story reminded me of two things. One is, I think it was at Belkin or Ankur, like, with the leads, because when they did that, when. When the iPhone was obviously out, they started releasing, you know, their own sort of, like, you know, accessories and stuff. And one of the biggest questions that he'd get asked from investors were like, well, Apple are just going to release their own and just put them in their stores. And I think his insight was so simple but interesting, which was, let's say the iPhone accessories market is like a $2 billion market. That's like, not a market worth going for for a company the size of Apple. Right. And so even about $2 billion market to, like, nobody is like a $2 billion market. And so you create the entire lane just by taking a part of a market that big company otherwise wouldn't even need to go for. Go for because not worth their time. And so sometimes we, like, can discount how valuable ideas are, whether they're worth pursuing because we just think that someone else might do it because within their business, you know, itself.

Yeah.

And the other thing is, is I think, like, the time we're in is the most related best to the way Jeff Bezos set up Amazon. And not from a cliche perspective, just from a very, very, like, you know, clear example. He explains that when he set up Amazon, like, he saw this sort of uptick in Internet usage, and then he figured that so much of the infrastructure had already been built for him. Like, the postal service existed, you know, payment processing existed. Now the Internet existed. And so all he had to do is kind of like, you know, put a wrapper around them and so ride the tide away, dude. Amazon is a wrapper, you know what I mean? In, like, a lot of ways. And so because you're just tying together infrastructure and so APIs, these aren't postal services, not credit. You have stripe. It's one string of, like, numbers that you need to integrate into your app. Like OpenAI same. The API keys are all you need to have to stitch these things together and be able to explain to cursor or Claude code what you want to do with them. And you can kill it.

Almost every business is a wrapper. And you're talking about Amazon. I was thinking about the biggest companies in the world that are Consumer brands. Back to the conversation about paying $200 a month for the, the most expensive version of ChatGPT or, or Cloud or whatever. Let's look at the most valuable consumer brands in the world, Apple. Why are they so valuable? Because the products they sell back to Value Capture offer a 100x differential on what it costs for versus the value people get out of it, right? My $3,000 MacBook Pro is going on year five. It runs like the day I bought it. Like, how much wealth have I created on that little keyboard, right? That's why I think of it.

That's why.

So if you want to think of the most, like they become so valuable, I should say, like the, the market cap of a company is directly correlated to the amount of value that their products offer people. So if, if Apple wanted to be stingy, right, and say, you know, our customers get so much value out of these MacBook Pros, we're going to make them $30,000 because they're still going to get 10x value out of them instead of 100x. They wouldn't be as valuable, period. End of story. They wouldn't sell as many of them and their net market cap as a result of this change would drop significantly. So with that same framework, OpenAI, like four years in is worth half a trillion dollars. They're not even publicly traded yet. Their last round was $500 billion. One take is like, oh my gosh, that's. We're so frothy right now. We're like, we're recession coming, we're at the top. And the other take is like, whatever they're selling to consumers, I need to buy because that valuation is directly correlated to the value that their products offer. So whatever the most expensive plan is, I want a 100x return on my investment. Why would I pay for the $20 a month plan? Now, this is assuming that you use it and it doesn't just sit there unused. If you use it on a regular basis, you might as well go to the most expensive monthly version and treat it as a Harvard education, because that's a lot more than $200 a month, dude.

That's where people are. You come in, man, with like, like free content like this that's out there for people to get. You know, there's no room that you can walk into to get that type of information that you're providing. You know, video after video, you know, everything you're saying on this episode as well, man. That's what it is, you know, and you can ingest that. And again you take that then to your point. Use the tools in the way you want to. But okay, I learned this from this episode. Now I'm going to do this over here and like that's how you're going to get your value by like opening up your ears and your mind and then I. Being creative in the way you execute with it.

Yeah, it's on the Internet.

When we did this search in for this recipe in Chat GPT, I then asked it for its sources and Guilty Chef was number one. And so it goes to show that like, yeah, I've been hearing people say as well, you need like LLM txt file. There's none of that in my. Yeah, I've got SEO schema. It's like you said, some of the HTML is broken right now. Like I need to fix it. Like it's even got bugs. Yeah, just ship the damn thing. And you're ranking number one on Google and number one on ChatGPT. And so just imagine if you're. I put a little, if I just worked on this every day and I put more effort into it. Like it could, there's so many more things that could probably come off the back of it, but just with like a lazy approach, quote unquote, like you're out doing Reddit or you know, TripAdvisor with a Wingstop's own brand, you know, because they are not even like investing time into the right content or strategy. Yeah, Here, here's our protein next page.

Oh, okay. We have a product.

Yeah, this is our one shot output. So 50 plus best protein snacks.

Wow, that's incredible.

Yeah, probably probably needs a little bit of a UI work, but you can see it. So that's incredible.

And it's pulling in actual high protein snacks. RX Bar, Quest Nutrition. It's funny that that number one, the chocolate chip cookie protein bar. I eat two of those every single day.

Oh, do you?

I like, I, I survive on those.

Maybe even knows when they're cool.

They're good, they're good.

Like share buy.

That is crazy.

Again, look, it's all SEO content by the way.

You know, you could just have affiliate links to the Amazon variants of these. That is crazy.

And then it has, then it has a compare comparison chart here. It's made, there's done a comparison UI for us. So like you know which one's the highest protein now. Now by the way, if you wanted to actually look protein per dollar, like this has gone crazy with this. But if you wanted to like it's Got a whole, like lead capture form here.

Wow. Protein dollar filtering. Oh, my gosh. Did you even ask it to do that?

No, no, no. That's what I'm saying. Like, you don't. I didn't ask you to do any of this type of stuff. Like, it just figured it out. Like it just goes off and it just works because I told it to be like the best SEO. You saw my prom. My prompt was like tiny. It was like what I actually said. My words were like one tooth, four words, like two sentences.

Yeah.

You know, but then the framework. So because I installed the framework from here, basically that gave me the entire prompt for Claude code, which I just copy and pasted. So like this exact thing right here. Yeah, this thing. Like if I open up a text file, this is the prompt effectively to create that Right. Prompt for Claude code. I don't know how to write that. But the most valuable way to use AI is to get the AI to talk to the AI, so you get it to write to itself, you know, and so I'm saying to it, I'm going to cast on saying this is what I want. It then goes and does research, says, okay, well, here's what you need to say to Claude code. Because Claude code is the best at programming. And then because Claude code is so good at programming and Cursor understands, I talked to Claude code, it knows how to talk to it, and it's already ingested what I want that I've just given it two sentences and it's from two sentences has created me this, this entire thing. And now from here, the protein calculator.

Oh my gosh, it's got a interactive calculator. Holy crap, it actually works. I mean, you could create like high iron drinks, low iron. Oh, yes, high carb snacks, low carbs. Like, you can create hundreds of variants of just like the insert, you know, macro, nutrient plus type of food.

Crazy, right? And like now it hasn't even created like a single web page for us. But if I said to create a single page for one of these, it will do that in a few minutes. And then if I wanted to connect it to data again, remember when we set this up, we already gave it our Supabase credential here. We gave it our Supabase credentials, which is our database. Right? So you go to supabase.com and just connect it. And so now it already has a database. If I said to, it said to it, now go and go into Supabase, create a table and connect live data to it using Fhircl you can go do research and put it in my database and and now I've got like live information that like users can, can, can use. So by the way, let me just show you a quick little thing here. Like if you want to change some of the design. So like no, let's actually say we want to change some of the buy now button. So let's say I want the buy now. So now micro iterations you can do directly Claude code, right? So like these tiny little things, you don't need to keep going to cursor. So curse is more for like building features, functionality, things like that. But like does this is how I design now. So I might look at this. And by the way, another great hack for design is use dribbble. Like Dribbble is basically like a designer's inspiration tool. But Dribbble have this hidden page that used to be public, right? There's this page that no one on the site can you find it now. But the page is still public. It's buckets. And the reason it's such a cool page is because these are effectively private folders that people are creating with things they like. And so it's like seeing people's private Pinterest pins. But these are. People are saving design things they like. And so yeah, I go by the way, for context. I use Dribble religiously every morning. Like it's a part of just. I don't have to think about it. I'm so obsessed with like visuals and design that this is just like go to. I need to know what designs are looking like. And so you go in here and we can even type in something to search by. Let's say I go here and type in like, you know, E commerce for example and it would just give me a load of inspiration pages just for e comm design. And so I might see something here that I like the look of, let's say, okay, great, I like this. So you have to do an animation, didn't it? But let's say you find a page like you like the look of, you can use that as inspiration for your own site. So you don't even need a paid.

Account, just copy paste.

Don't need a paid account. Well, what you can actually do is I can go. I'm gonna. Let's see if this works. I'm gonna save image. I'm gonna go to my project. Let's test this guy. I haven't done this type of thing in a while, so it'd be fun to see with you guys. If it works in here, let's just create a folder called like, you know, design Reference and let's save it. And I'm going to say let's see if you can pick up the colors and anything from here. So let's say. So you can see now since because I've added it to my local file cursor is connected to your local. Just your computer. Right. So look, Design Reference has an image in there. Now that image I just added. So I'm going to say I've added a folder to the project called Design Reference with an image ref in it. I want you to take inspiration from this UI and apply it to the products grid ui. So we want to see if it can change this design based on this inspiration. So look, it will read the image now. So find the image there. It's reading the design image. Reading image. So Claude code can do that. You can actually look at the image visually.

Right.

And you can try and figure out what's in there. Now we'll just. Now we'll look at this page. So this is, this is why designing like this is so cool, is because everything happens live. So you can go and find inspiration. You can put it in a folder and just tell Claude code what you want and we'll see what it does and what it comes out like. There you go. So it's updated the design for us. So it took this inspiration here that sent it. It picked out the key components, so the colors and everything. And then, you know, still applying some design styles here. But it's trying to copy as much of that as possible to get it to match what we saw. So you can just like throw in design inspiration as well. Like, you know, I know just copy things. And so let's just. Let me just stop it there for a minute. Just show you something. Like if I said, you know, change add to cart button to red and make borders square, it's also change the borders in other areas as well.

Yeah.

Based on. Yeah, it just automatically just tries to figure out how to match the styles. Yeah, one of square borders on the add to cart page. I wanted the square borders on add to cart button. So if it makes mistakes, you can also say to it, oh, I didn't want you to do that. I want you to do this. And it would just say, oh, sorry, we can undo changes or whatever. See that? It just applied it to these pages, these buttons. Yeah, but this is how I've designed this entire, like, platform. So like, you know, everything here has been designed Just using this type of like, you know, way of speaking to it and iterating. Yeah man, it's just, it's not. You could just take this now but our whole directory.

That's so good. Like I just want to like cancel my. I just like Susan, cancel my calls. I'm building. I. I don't, I don't even know a Susan but if I had an in person assistant. Yeah, dude, you've over delivered. This is really good. This is, this is going to be a banger. Thank you.

No.

Where can people find you or whatever you're building?

Yeah, man. You can go to 5daysprint.com use the number 5 if you want to do anything. The stuff I just showed you like, you know, you can get. Just go to new project, just sign up there and you can just you know, generate your own project and get that one liner and you're good to go. And then school.com 5daysprint. I'll give you the links as well but like those are the two areas that you can jump in on and just connect with me.

We'll link to it for sure.

I appreciate you man. Thank you so much.

Hey guys, if you're still listening to this, it's probably because you haven't had a chance to take your AirPods out. You're still mowing the lawn, you're still driving, what have you. If you're still here with me, I would really, really love and appreciate a five star review on Spotify, Apple or wherever you get your podcast. It would mean a lot if you want to go the extra mile. Share this episode with a friend that might have an interest in starting a business. It would mean a ton. Hope you have the best day of your life today.