You Don’t Need an Online Business to Get Rich ⏐Holdco Bros. Ep. #197

Most of everything is not on the Internet, believe it or not, but that's, like, the most valuable stuff. I am so hyped on this idea. And someone needs to copy this. They send two letters per month to people paying $10 per month that tell a story. We're talking 310 grand a month. What? They're not doing paid ads. It's just word of mouth.

You're effectively piggybacking off of the USPS and the American taxpayer.

They run the business by themselves from their home.

I almost don't want to release this podcast episode because they're going to get freaking destroy.

All right, I want you to pull up thefloweredletters.com the flower letters. Yep. I am so hyped on this idea.

Okay.

And someone needs to copy this. Can I tell you what this business is?

Can I share my screen so that people can see it?

I can. Sure. Nick, what do women love more than romance novels? I'll answer that.

Money.

World War II. History. Okay. Fictional World War. I swear, every time I see my wife reading a book, it's about some terrible thing that happened during World War II. I don't know what it is. Okay. Like flies, honey. Okay? This business, this website, the flowerletters.com. they send two letters, like, handwritten in quotations, not actually, but appearing handwritten, two letters per month to people paying $10 per month that tell a story. They're like reading love letters between two people during World War II. And it has, like, stickers, it has, like, some artwork in there. It's really well done, really tastefully done. $10 a month, two letters per month. They have, like, six different themes or genres or storylines that you can follow. The churn is very low because it's like a book. They're like getting a book by letters. You don't want to cancel on month three because you don't know how it ends in month 12. And I know all the details of this business because I found a random blog article on USPS's blog, of all things, because they're a massive customer of usps. What are your immediate thoughts before I go further?

My immediate thoughts, honestly, I love the idea these guys are Mormons. And I went to the website to go look at it, and of course, the Clarks live in Utah, usa, and.

Have been married home. Brandon, our friend, PG Brother.

I love it. I think that this is going to the like. If you're looking at a spectrum of things right now, instant gratification is what everybody goes, for instance, instant. And this is zigging while others are zagging. It's not instant gratification, It's a trickle of letters that are coming in. And I think that's a really smart play. They're like, okay, you want everything right now. We're not going to do that. We're going to go back and play into this niche. So I think that's a really interesting framework, is like looking at what is popular right now and going the total opposite direction. And so anyways, yeah, I love that.

All right, so this is what their volume is like. This was a year ago. A year ago they had 31,000 active subscribers.

What?

Okay, $10 a month. 31,000. Yeah, we're talking 310 grand a month. This was a year ago. And they're only four years old. I would bet they're closer to 400 or 500 grand a month at this point. What? They're not doing paid ads. It's just word of mouth. It's just a good product.

Okay, $310,000 a month. And it's two letters a month.

Two letters a month. And the cost of a stamp at bulk is like less than 50 cents. The cost of the paper printing, like, for sure, it's under $2 all in. Like for your. Okay, so cogs.

Let's just say it's $2 all in. That's 60 grand a month of cogs. So their, their gross margins, $250,000 a month.

Yeah, 80%, give or take. 24 employees.

Well, did you know this? Like, in a lot of these businesses, you look at the cost of goods sold and their net, their gross margin, you're like, oh, they're freaking crushing it. And then you look at below the line and you're like, oh, that's why their gross margins are so good, is because they spend so much money on customer acquisition. They're on meta, they're on Google, they're doing pay per click, they're doing SEO, whatever. They're doing cold outreach. And so their net margins are. Are nowhere near as good because they've got to pay so much money to acquire customers. But you just said they're not spending any money on marketing.

That's what they said in this interview. I didn't see them on the Meta ads library. So let's just say. Let's just say back of the napkin, 5 million a year. Top line, $4 million a year. After their cogs come out, they still have 24 employees. Surely there are other costs. Right? 24 employees. Call it. I don't know, some of them are part time, some of them are full time. Let's say 75 grand a year. So I'm she bro. Like, I feel bad for them.

Like, I almost, I almost don't want to release this podcast episode because they're going to get freaking destroyed. What would stop somebody from coming in here? Investing. Even if you invested like a hundred thousand dollars in paid ads, how many customers would you get? You could easily target people on Facebook in particular. You go to Meta, you find people who are going to fit this profile and then you, you just said the churn is exceptionally low. You lock them in. I'll get that 50 grand back in what, a year? Less than a year. And I'm like, and I'm already cash flow positive in the first few months. If they're not doing any paid ads, like, look at their website. It's not like they don't look overly sophisticated. I think somebody could come in here and just blow this business out of the water just by spending on ads.

But I don't think this would like hurt them. I think that would grow the pie, you know, I think this is like a way of delivering this type of content that is innovative, new and unique, even though it's ironically using a very old fashioned way of communicating. I, I think that if someone were to come in and even if they didn't do paid ads, even though they just did a different genre, same style, same level of quality, post apocalyptic space opera, interstellar romance, renaissance Italy, like take, like just go to Amazon and take all the top categories for women sort, and then just pick one or five or ten, right? And take the same approach.

This is a really cool business. This is a really cool business. This is one of those businesses where they probably looked at each other a year in and were like, is this real? Like, is the, is the other shoe going to drop at some point? You know, like, you know what I mean? Like, hey, we just made a half a million dollars selling letters to people.

I think there's a good chance their net profit is over 2 million a year because at 24 employees, 75 grand each, that's 1.8 million a year. Like they could be doing 2 million.

I can't get to a scenario where they're not doing less than that. They're, dude, they're using the thing. We've talked about this like one of the largest subsidies, marketing subsidies that nobody talks about is the United States Postal Service. The true cost of sending these letters is much more than you're paying for a stamp. And that's their main cost. Like, that's their distribution channel. So you're effectively piggybacking off of the USPS and the American taxpayer to get your cogs so low that you're like, your net margins are $2 million a year. That's insane, dude.

And I looked at similar web of what their traffic is. They're getting 60,000 unique visitors per month. If you take a 3% conversion rate, that's 1800 per month times 10. 18,000 of MRR added every month at a 3% conversion rate.

Oh, my gosh.

4 years old in business.

So they're just relying on word of mouth and SEO. How long do you think it took them to get to this spot? Like, how long do you think it took them to get to 31,000? Because they started in 2020. We're in the middle of 2025. Was it like, oh, 31 divide by five, 6,000 a year for the first five years, or.

Well, it says they launched August 2020. Great timing. Okay. Perfect timing. Says, at first there were 38 subscribers who followed the romance of one couple. So they just had, like, one storyline to start through. Letters and postcards against the backdrop of historical events. Today, they have 31,000 subscribers. Since 2020, more than 1.8 million letters have been mailed. They run the business by themselves, or they used to from their home, and now they ship it from a warehouse in Orem. And they have four other series, like, four other storylines you can follow. And they say many of their customers subscribe to multiple at the same time. So we're talking 20, 30, 40, 50amonth from some customers instead of 10.

Dude, I have an amazing business idea to launch off of this.

Let's go.

Amazing. When I was a kid, my grandfather was really into chess. He was. He wasn't a grand master, but he was. I don't even remember what the rating system is, but he was. He was highly rated. He played chess all the time. He loved it. He taught me how to play chess. I'm not very good at it, but he taught me how to play chess. And every time I'd go over to his house, there'd be a chessboard on his table that was like, in the middle of a game. I don't remember the first time he told it to me, but I must have at some point been like, grandpa, why is that sitting there? And he explained to me that he had a pen pal that he would write letters to, and they were in the middle of a chess game. And the chess game would last probably months because they would send a letter and tell him, oh, I moved my knight from F2 to L7, or, you know, whatever the metric is.

Right? Dude, so good.

Oh, yeah, yeah. That's how he would play. And he had, like, a couple of friends that he was corresponding with. Why couldn't you bring that back with, like, a technology, I don't know, bent to it?

Why technology, you're saying? Because, like, how could you capture that value otherwise?

No, no, no, no. What I'm saying is the technology bent to me would be on the marketing side. It wouldn't necessarily be the way that they're experiencing the game together. Because, like, how do you acquire customers would be my.

I don't even know how.

I don't know how he did it the last time. I'm pretty sure he did it through, like, there's probably some international chess federation. And so, like, they have local chapters, and that's how we met people. But that would be the only technology component to it is like, okay, how do you acquire customers and match people up?

But I'll tell you how you find customers.

Oh, okay. Hello.

Dude, you buy banner ads on Chess.com and on the Chess.com app. These guys have, like, 26 million hits a month. It is the website. They have, like, 85% market share for playing chess. Did you just buy band?

Wait, did you just look that up as we were talking, or did you know that?

Yeah, no, I was like, I knew. Okay.

Rain Man.

Sorry, I take that back. They had 35 million visitors per month in June of 2020. In December 2022, they had 100 million users per month. 3x growth between 2020 and 2022.

Wow. Holy crap. That's an interesting framework going the opposite way from digital to analog and writing trends that are growing exponentially. Not even exponentially, but just, like, growing way faster than they should. So if chess is taking off, is there a way to take it from the digital to the analog? And the answer to that would be, yes. Do something like this, right? Like, hey, we'll assign you to a pen pal. Now, I could bastardize it and be like, oh, we'll just do it with AI and the AI will make the move and we'll send the letter. Like, yeah, you could do that. But really what you'd want to do is actually pair them with somebody who they're playing against.

Yeah, yeah. At their skill level.

Right, Right at their skill level. So there's a little bit of a marketplace component to it that would make it a little bit difficult. But I think you could solve that through like Facebook groups, dude. Like what you did with Texas snacks, right? You went and bought a buc ee's Facebook group. You, you could go and probably buy some chess groups, roll them up, merge them together. All of a sudden you got 10,000 members. You get a master list of everybody and their ratings. They pay five bucks a month and then you're the one that sends the correspondence between everybody. Right. Like you, you don't even ask them to send the correspondence. You're like, hey, just make the move. You can, you can submit it here digitally and then we will actually send the letter. You don't have to worry about going and getting the stamp or writing it or any of those things.

Yeah, interesting. I would want to test that because I feel like there is something magical about putting a letter in the mailbox. There's especially something magical about walking out to the mailbox and getting a letter. Right? Which in your scenario they would still experience that there is a lot of friction to, you know, Right. But maybe you order, you get a kit or something and it's like. A kit.

That's exactly what I was going to say.

Like post like pre stamped envelopes. It has the name and address on there and literally all you do is they have even have like kind of like, you know, some board games come with like a card of like things that you fill out to keep track of the score. You would have like a chess, a paper chessboard and they like draw arrows of their moves and they just mail it and it's like, it's. I feel like people are going to hear this and they're either going to think it's the stupidest idea they, they've ever heard and I respect that, but I hate them. Or the most genius idea that they've ever heard because it's just complete the opposite direction.

I think there's a lot of kids growing up who've never experienced getting a letter in the mail. They've gotten text messages, they've gotten emails, they've gotten FaceTimes, they've gotten like. But like, dude, there is something magical about a letter in the mail. They've probably gotten a lot of Amazon packages in the mail, but like a letter in the mail that's addressed to them, there's so yeah, chess is one thing, but like bringing back pen pals somehow with kids, I think that would be a really interesting thing.

Dude. What about like the flower letters but for kids? Like a kids book sent to Kids and you could do one of two ideas. You could do it one way like flower letters is one day you're reading stories about other people. Awesome. It could be a two way conversation where the the kid receives a letter with a pre stamped prepaid envelope and like a blank page and they could write back and like customize what happens in the story. Like a choose your own adventure kids book.

Oh, that's such a good idea. Do you remember when we were kids, grew up lds, the friend. Do you remember the Friend?

Of course.

Okay, so like we had this magazine in the church, it was the Friend. It was for kids and there was a section in the Friend that you always turn to. Do you remember?

Nope.

It was the stories at the end that the kids told. So kids could write in. And then every every month with the Friend issue there would be like a story from a kid and was like, this is Eduardo in Ecuador or this is Hans in Germany. And they would like yo.

Yeah, that was the best part. They do the same thing in the Liahona. Like just personal stories from people.

Yeah, but like I don't get the Weahon anymore. Or at least I don't, I don't read through it with my kids anymore. Just because we have like. We could go to.

You're a bad dad.

Some follow me. Yeah, I'm a bad dad. I don't believe in that stuff anymore. No, but we could, we can go to like living day scriptures or thumb follow Me or like the YouTube channels and we can watch that stuff. But like something with like that component of kids sharing stories and having a way to connect with other kids. I think that would be so cool to see. Like they took the time to write it. They have like a message that they're sending between one another that, that would be a really interesting. Even though like it could be the letters that they're. My son loves to read and he's just getting the letters in a series. Oh dude, that would be so cool. You could just take a book, license the book. This might be more expensive. You take the book, you license the book and then you just send them chapters, you know, one month at a time. And it's like, oh, they finished early. Well, they gotta wait for the next chapter. Yeah, that could be really cool.

I like the idea of making an interactive kid's story through letters using AI on the back end. But like the delivery is very old school. And so a kid gets a letter. Like a kid gets a letter with a story about a boy and his dog. Right. And Then the boy has some prompts, right, where he can change the outcome of the story. And he's given ideas of how to change it, right? But it's really up to him. The letter gets sent back, it gets put into a machine, gets opened automatically, scanned automatically, uploaded to ChatGPT automatically. Chat GPT knows the assignment rights back based on where the boy or the girl is taking the story. And then, you know, it uses a handwritten font, it makes it look personalized, it spits out a response, it mails it back to him. So. So the kid literally feels like someone is helping him write this story, but it's really AI but it doesn't feel like AI and then at the end of it, you get the frigging thing printed into a book. Dude. That's the upsell at the end, dude.

Okay, I have you one better. So remember last year we were talking about capturing stories in assisted living facilities. We've created an app and we are going to roll it out. It's called One Life Tale. One of the components to it though, that my brother in law created was if you as a family member want to gift somebody something. So let's say, hey, you know what, Carson. And Carson's probably too old for this at this point, but Carson's nine or 10. He's learning to read. I want to get Carson a gift for his birthday. I can go and enter information about Carson into this app and it will generate a story for Carson and then I can go to Barnes and Nobles and I can get it printed out and it will have like, pictures and it will be a story. And Carson is the, is the protagonist and he's reading about himself and I send it to him and it's like, oh, that's a really cool, thoughtful gift. In the same way you're saying the kid is helping write the story. It's like, yeah, I want to. I want to make sure I'm connected with my niece or my nephew or my cousins or whoever. Every month it sends me a prompt and it's like, when was the first time you met Carson? What's your favorite thing about Carson? What does he like to do? What have you and Carson like to do? And then it's sending them this, like, story that AI generated, obviously, but within the story, Carson's reading like, wait, how did it know that I love Skittles? How did it know that Nick and I actually went to the Rangers baseball game? You know what I mean? It's like weaving them into the story. I think that would be A really cool way to then bring families together who are distant, to feel like, oh yeah, we're close. I created that story with Carson.

Oh, that's good.

That's a really cool idea.

Oh, that's so good. Because, you know, it's so easy to think, well, AI can just do everything. AI is just going to do everything because it knows everything because it's all on the Internet, right? Most of everything is not on the Internet, believe it or not. Like the Internet doesn't know that the Bear Lake Boat Rentals place has more pontoon boat rentals than ski boat rentals. Like, the owner knows, the employee knows, but that's not on the Internet. That's not scraped by chat, GPT. So there's so much more institutional knowledge and one on one experiences that have never been recorded and will never been recorded. But that's like the most valuable stuff. Like I use this limitless pendant. I could not. Like, I would love to prompt it and say, write, write an autobiography based on everything that's happened since the day I put this pendant on. And it could, but it would be very, it would be like reading a research report. It would be very vanilla because it doesn't know, like, what's in my heart, what's in my mind. It doesn't know my insecurities. Like, it only knows things that I vocalize, which is kind of like, hey, babe, what's for dinner tonight? You know, like, that's not very tight. Or like talking about business ideas. Like, that's not the most important stuff. So what you're describing is merging those two worlds, right? Like, AI doesn't know that Carson and his cousin's first interaction was over, you know, throwing Skittles into the pond. AI doesn't know that, but that book could know that because of the, the human element that you're adding to the story, right?

Yeah. It's pulling out those pieces from you and your experience by asking you the right questions so that it can then create a story that allows you to be connected. I'm with you. Like, I think at first, like we went through the waves of AI and you're like, oh my gosh, AI is going to replace everything. Oh, this is going to change and it is going to change the world. But the more and more I'm learning about AI, I'm like, you know what? Yes, it's going to change everything, but it's just going to, it's just going to change our lives. It's not going to eliminate, like, there's not going to be mass. Yeah, layoffs. And we're just not going to be, we're not going to do anything that anymore. We're still going to have things that we need to work on and AI is not going to be able to pull out the things that we know are intrinsically valuable to us. So to me that's a cool framework.

I think a lot of people are justified in feeling scared that the human experience is going to turn into like a wall E experience just sitting in a bubble and robots and computers do all these things to us. But I don't think that's going to happen for the same reason that when ebooks were invented, physical books didn't go away. Physical books are thriving. They're doing better than ever. You just cannot replace in person, physical touch, feel, all those senses that are activated with an in person experience. You can't fully replace that. It will always be superior. Like an artificially generated experience or story or novel or whatever. Right.

I had a conversation with my brother in law this week. He's in the film industry, he's an editor, he's super creative. And I'm like, oh, are you using AI? And he's like, oh, absolutely not. Like, he just, he hates AI. And the more we talked about it, it was, well, you know, I totally see it from his perspective. It's like that's eliminating jobs in the entertainment space the nicest way possible from like a scarcity mindset. It's like, oh, AI is coming for me and I'm going to get eliminated. I was like, I was trying to help him see and understand. Like, well, here's the thing, like all the research that you do in order to write a script when you're planning the shoot and you need to know the location and the weather that's coming up and which shot might work. Like you're effectively just hiring an analyst. Why wouldn't you use it to do that? And now it's going to be so much cheaper to produce content and good content because good content is going to stand out more than bad content. You don't need a whole production company behind you. You don't need a whole studio behind you. You can go and create a show that used to cost $10 million for $10,000. It's going to take a while, I think, for him to kind of get there. But I actually think that's what's going to happen with AI is there's going to be an unlock of the large institutions aren't necessarily going to have the monopoly on Things that they used to individuals now are going to have the power and ability to create things that they otherwise hadn't been able to up until this point. It's going to give them a lot more freedom. So to your point, it's like, yeah, we're not going to have the Wally experience because we don't want the Wall E experience.

No, we don't. And some people think they do, but. But they don't.

No, they don't. I sold my companies, you've sold businesses. And like for the first week it's like, oh cool, I don't have to work. And then you're like, I gotta do something, I gotta, you know, I gotta go figure something out. Like, that's just the way we're wired. We like to work.

The pie just grows, right? It's like the same principle. I was listening to this other podcast, they were talking about Shopify. One of the big VCs passed on investing in Shopify because they crunched their numbers and they looked at the total e commerce market and they thought, man, pie in the sky scenario. If Shopify ever gets 20% of the E commerce market, it's only a billion dollar business and we want $100 billion business. So Path, what they didn't foresee is that the e commerce market would 20x in size and Shopify only has like 3% of it instead of 20%. But they're $100 billion business because the pie grew that much. So I think that's what AI is going to do is grow the pie. I think, you know, 10 years ago it was unfathomable to have a trillion dollar company. Now we have a handful of them. Right? Right now it's unfathomable to have a 10 or $100 trillion company. But as the pie continues to grow, there's going to be a lot more of them. Right? Because we're, we can't think about the future as the present looks today. It's going to look much different with a much bigger pie.

I literally just heard a podcast talking about this. Are you familiar with like Meta Meta's project Orion?

No.

So you've seen the Meta? Like is that like.

I think so. Anyway, keep going.

Yeah. You've seen the Meta Ray Ban glasses.

Yeah.

Augmented reality, right. So Orion's basically, it's augmented reality. It was the acquired podcast actually. And they had seen sort of a preview of it and they were like, once I saw that, I knew that is the future. Okay. But they were doing some analysis and they're like, the amount of money that Meta has spent and is continuing to spend investing in the Orion project, even if they had the adoption that the iPhone had starting in 2008 through today, they wouldn't be caps full of positive until 2045. So it's like an 18 year investment. Right. And these are glasses that have augmented reality, and not only augmented reality, but you don't need AirPods. They actually feed the audio through the frame of the glasses and you can listen to things, things pop up on the screen, you can have text conversations. It kind of rethinks the way that we interface with technology. And their point was like, this is going to change the way that we interface with technology. But if Meta's right, which, I mean, Mark's done a freaking phenomenal job of being right, then it's not going to be the iPhone market. It's going to be a totally different category that's going to be whatever, $2 trillion and they're going to pay back much sooner than that. But it's our inability to understand compound growth and exponential growth that sometimes holds us back from understanding the opportunity that's in front of us.

Yeah, it's not going to be the iPhone market, it's going to be the market of people that have eyes. Right?

Yeah.

Like AI is. AI is not disrupting technology, it's disrupting human labor, which is the biggest market in the world. Every job that everyone does, it's going to take a slice of that. So you just have to think about it differently.

Different.

All right, we'll call this the vibe code idea of the week. Someone should use replit or whatever to go vibe code one or both of these ideas. I have two of them. I can't just do one. You ready?

I'm ready, dude. Yes.

You've got thenot.com, you've got zola.com, massive wedding marketplaces. Right. If I own a wedding venue or if I'm a wedding photographer, I gotta list my services there. Agreed, Agreed. I think someone needs to vibe code a marketplace or a directory for random off the wall niche wedding services, for instance. And I've posted content about a lot of these. There is a donkey in Arizona that they call the beer burrow. Right. And people having a wedding, they rent out this donkey for $700 for a day. They put beers on the donkey's back because donkeys are meant to hold hundreds of pounds. And the donkey just walks around the wedding and people grab beers off its back and it's a gimmick. But it's extremely profitable because it's extremely Instagrammable and it goes viral all the time. Okay. Or you've got charcuterie carts, right? Or you've got like those 360 degree photo booths or you've got like a vintage camper photo booth or like fake tattoo bars or like they have authentic Italian pizza trucks that only cater to weddings. All these random one off things that people increasingly want more and more because they want their wedding to be unique, instagramable. They, they don't want it to be like all their friends weddings. It needs to be different, needs to have a beer burrow. I think there needs to be a zola or the knot.com for all of these random things. That is just the go to for like the long tail wedding niches and services. What do you think?

Okay, so what are you building? You're building the website or you're building the like backend platform that is facilitating the transactions between them? Because the Knot.com you're, you're going through the knot, right? Like they're not just, you're not going there and saying like oh, Joe Bob Smith does XYZ for weddings. I'm going to go contact Joe Bob Smith. You know what I mean?

So I feel like it would start as a directory and it would morph into a marketplace, right? We all know marketplaces are hard, so we're going to start it as a directory. We're just going to scrape very simply, we're going to scrape all of these random one off services. We're going to use Replit to put it in a database and display it in an attractive way. And then you can sort of, you can filter and anyone that's about to get married can go to this website and look at all these cool. And it's free marketing. You're sending free leads to these people, right? And then over time as you build traction and as you build a name for yourself, then you reach out to the people that are getting leads and you're like, hey, you're getting leads from my website. I'm going to charge you now or I'm going to take you off the website. That's the business.

Wow, that's really cool. This is how I think you would do it. You would start in a market, let's say you're in Dallas. You do things that don't scale. So you find Your list of 50 people or companies that are off the wall. Would you call it the Beer borough?

Beer borough. You got a puppy Cuddle corner You got a white wedding bounce castle.

Dude, that's amazing. Okay, so that you're like, you're in Dallas and you individually reach out to these people, and you're like, this is what I'm doing. Can I put you on my directory? And they would say, yes. So you test it first and just see how you would set up this directory. Because in order for it to get traction, like, you've got to get. You've got to build SEO to it. Like, you can't just throw it up and have it necessarily work. But going back to the directories, ideas that we had before, you're using it as a lead funnel for these businesses to use you for essentially, marketing services. Once you build in Dallas, then you would. I would go to other markets to actually test it, but I would start small. I would go in one market, do something that doesn't scale, see how it works, and then scale it.

Yeah, I like starting in one local market. I don't think you need to ask permission, though. You just throw them up on the website with their contact info and everything. It's permissionless. And then you could even use paid ads. You'd have to come out of pocket, but you could use paid ads to women that are about to get married to push traffic to it. Like, you're doing free marketing for all of these people that you're listing, but then you're coming back and charging for them. Premium placement, banner ads, whatever.

I guess I was saying, like, do it, but I would still reach out to them to do that. What you're saying is like, hey, I already got you here. Are you willing to spend. Give me a hundred dollars this month so I can run it? Yeah, it's.

Hey, I listed you. You're welcome.

Yep, yep. I listen to you. This is the idea. I'm not just a, like, random person who's like, I have this idea that I'm going to execute. Like, no, you show them you're a serious person, and then you go to them and you're like, if you pay me $250 this month, I'm gonna go run paid ads, and we're gonna see kind of what comes from this.

I love this idea because a year ago, it wasn't approachable to 98% of people listening to this. Because this is a pretty heavy website. There's kind of a lot going on here. But I know for a fact, because I've built other directory websites that you could build this with AI. You could Vibe code it with natural language. The next Vibe Code idea I have is I really like the idea of white labeling. A vibe coding service like Lovable or Replit. I think Lovable is starting to offer white labeling. And so here's the idea, here's the whole idea. A vibe coding app that's just white labeled, Lovable, replit, whatever. Because we don't know how to build a vibe coding app that's way above our heads. But it's for a certain niche. Right? So call it Lovable for video game designing. And it does everything that all these apps can already do. It's not special. It's just a wrapper instead of a ChatGPT wrapper. It's a vibe coding wrapper. And I want to make a video game. Kids want to make them, adults want to make them. It could be simple like Pac Man. It could be more complex. But how cool would it be to play a game that you built?

Dude, I was just talking to my brother in law about this this week. Like they love fantasy novels and they've always been like, I want to write a fantasy book. And in order to do that you had to get like concept art and you had to write the thing. And. And now with like Mid Journey and Chat cpc, you could write your own fantasy novel and have it actually turn out the way that you're hoping that it would turn out. I would add one thing to it. I think there's like a freemium or just like a really cheap model, which is what you just said. Like, I'll help you vibe code it through a wrapper. Cool. And I don't know exactly how you'd build it, but there's probably like specific things you need to have in the game. And so you'd build that into the prompt and the rapper would make sure that it's like, oh, have you thought about your security architecture? Or oh, you didn't actually talk about all the attributes of your character. Make sure you do X, Y and Z. Right. So there's a way to build that out. But then I would have an upsell because it's really easy to build the first 80% or 90%. It's that last 10 or 20% that you can vibe code to. And it's like, why don't. I don't know how to have this integrate with Supabase. I don't, I don't know exactly how to create a stripe payment that integrates with this. And so that upcharge would then hook you up with somebody who is a technical person. They're an engineer and they can get you the last 10 to 20%.

Yeah, that makes sense.

That's a great idea.

I love it. That's all she wrote.

Remember we were talking about the game that I play with my kids that I created? I had somebody email me and was like, hey, I spent a couple hours on this. Loved what you guys were talking about. I created the game. So he, like, he went on lovable, or was it replit one of those two and just vibe coded it? He vibe coded it and sent it to me as like a thank you. He's. And he's been playing with his kids and not using it frequently. Yeah, it's freaking cool.

Have you. Have you used it yet?

Yeah, it's not exactly the way that I played the game. Like, the trivia categories are a lot broader. I was just doing geography and Minecraft, but the categories, you guys are really broad. But, yeah, I've used it and it works. It's cool. I think it's really cool.

That's awesome. All right, what'd you think? Please share it with a friend and we'll see you next time on the Kerner Office.