"Most People Waste Their Lives, Do THIS Instead" - Alex Hormozi

What experiences or things I've done in the past can I transfer that are close enough to this new thing? At least if I can try and be aware of how much something might influence me, then at least gives me the, the wherewithal to say, okay, warning flags. This is a sensitive subject that your dad always wanted for you. Be extra careful around decisions that impact— that go in this direction. There are 3 major buckets that, that people use to blame. Think about it like an onion. This is the best analogy I can get. The outer layer is circumstances. So they're going to blame money, they're going to blame time, they're going to blame some particular aspect of the thing that they're buying that's not perfect for them, whatever it is. Underneath of that, they're going to blame other people. They're going to blame their partner, their spouse, their kids, their wife, their coworker, their whatever. And then the final layer is that you have somebody. So if I make you realize like, okay, well, the difference between self-made millionaires and you is that you both started at zero. So what's the difference? They decided to do something.

What does it mean to Alex to own your future?

My goal personally has been to dissect decisions and think like, is this a decision that I'm making because I believe this or because of what I want other people to think about me as a result of this decision? And we're social beings. We care about what other people think. And I don't think we're ever going to like get completely rid of that from us. I mean, you'd have to be, you know, Gandhi or whoever, you know, Buddha, right? But at least if I can try and be aware of how much something might influence me, then at least gives me the wherewithal to say, okay, warning flags. This is a sensitive subject that your dad always wanted for you. Be extra careful around decisions that impact, that go in this direction. And so, I can just take that extra pause of space and say, okay, is this really me or is this because I want him to think this about me? Wow. And like, Dad is really just a foil. It could be your brother, your sister, your spouse, your ex-wife, you know what I mean? That rival or the competitor, whoever it is. The moment that I realized this in my life was I was 19 years old, and at the time I was an angry 19-year-old like some of us are, and probably unrightfully so. But I really disliked both my parents really heavily. And I remember thinking to myself, like, they messed me up. I have all these anger issues. Like, I hate everyone. I'm a lone wolf, whatever. And I remember catching myself blaming them and thinking to myself, that means that I give them all the power in my life. Like, wherever, wherever I point the finger of blame is also where the power follows. It's like power follows blame. And so I was like, well, what am I going to do about it? Because maybe they did wrong. It doesn't really matter. It's only me who can, who can own my own future because otherwise they're going to own my future for the rest of my life. And then the people that I hated the most owned me. That was the thing. So like, so it was like, so these people that I hated and blamed, then flipping it from the blame to they own me, they have power over me. I was like, I never want them to have power over me. And then that was actually the first real crack I had in like the dam of trying to like make my own life and start. That was when I decided to not be pre-med. Because that was what my dad wanted me to be. And like, there were many steps on this, you know, this journey. But the first one of like just not being a doctor like him and being— just saying like, I want to get into business because it's like, I'm way more interested in this stuff. Like, you can imagine, I was like shaking to try and tell my dad this.

How do you get to the point where you go, wow, thank God they did that, because it drove me to be stronger, faster, more innovative, more creative? And now you get to, you know, own your decisions.

One of the exercises I do when I have these decisions where I'm like, I feel like I'm pulled in multiple directions. The thing I know I want to do, I have been trained myself to do, that's not the thing I want to do, is I just try and name the person who's stopping me from doing it. And so I remember there was like when I was selling one of the businesses, this was like the first massive deal that we were going to go through. I started playing these voices of just one particular entrepreneur that I know, and I was like, he's going to think that this isn't enough money. Now, mind you, it was a big exit and it's totally made up in my mind, but I had to write down his name and say like, will I let This person stopped me from exiting this company. And when I saw it, it just seemed so small. And I was like, no, I'm not going to give him that kind of power over my life. I'm going to give it— this guy is going to influence my decisions, going to change the rest of my life because of a voice I have in my head that he doesn't even know I'm thinking about him.

And you know what? Before we go any further, it sounds so silly as you write it. Once you wrote it down, it was silly. But how strong are those voices? Says, oh, you're too young for this. You're too old for this. Right? All of it. You had someone said, you don't sell that company unless it's $200 million. Yeah. And you're getting lots of zeros.

Yeah.

And you're like questioning it until you wrote it down and go, am I going to allow him? And I think, I think that's a big takeaway today is if something is holding you back in your life and you think it's your own insecurities, it of course it is, or your own beliefs.

Yeah.

But write down— I love that. I'm going to do that next time is literally write down, am I not going to do this because of What helps fuel the confidence to keep going? I believe— I'm going to digress here. I believe pressure. Yeah. At least with me, when I'm under pressure, I can resort back to the man I used to be.

To own my own decision rather than listen to someone else versus what keeps me going in terms of the bigger goal.

Yeah, I think the first—

first one.

Yeah.

So I'm a big believer, and this is a little bit contrarian, that proof is the best type of evidence for a trait. And so rather than say like, I'm, I'm honest, I'm honest, I'm honest, but like, you're a crook. Like, all the evidence points to the fact that you're a crook. Like, I think that when you say that on some level, you don't believe you because you know that's not true.

Yeah.

And so I try and look at, okay, what experiences or things I've done in the past can I transfer that are close enough to this new thing? So if I built a sales team at a weight loss company and then I really want to do this new gig that's at a chiropractor joint and it's also building a sales team, can I say that that skill is going to transfer? I have high confidence that I'll be successful in this thing. That would make sense for me. If I had built 6 sales teams over my career, I'd probably be even more confident. Right. And so the thing is, is like if I'm listening—

borrowing confidence from another experience. Yeah.

And so the, the, The problem is, what do you do when you're at zero? When you're like, I'm not confident, I haven't done anything good, right? I've got no achievements to my name, etc. I think that you're delusional because it's like, if you were able, like, all you have to do is chunk down and think, okay, well, what did I, what did I do? Like, let's be real. What did I do today that was good? Well, I woke up. Okay, cool. I got out of bed. There's no advantage to being overestimated unless you're weak, right? But right now, no one will see you coming. If you have nothing going for you, it's another way of saying that you have nothing to lose. And so it means that you have endless shots on goal. And so you should be the most prone to taking action because there's nothing holding you back. What do you have to lose?

The reason I ask you that is because I have similar fears and no one would ever think that. And it doesn't mean it should stop you from moving forward. It doesn't stop you. You still get up every day. You still love what you do. You still move forward. You still make mistakes. You still have some fears. You still wake up some mornings and go, what the hell am I doing? Right? Isn't enough? Is that— when you sold your last company, you could have been done. You and Leila could be doing whatever you want. You went right back in investing the money and buying companies.

So what you just said about taking the action anyway, right? I think that going back to what we were saying earlier about giving yourself that proof, that evidence, it's like all you have to do is get the first piece of evidence. And so it's like if you just take one action, then you can start labeling yourself as like, I am somebody who takes action because I have this proof right here. And so it's, it's just stacking. And then you stack 2 or 3 of those and you're like, you know what, I'm on a streak. And then you're like, I am the type of person who does these things. And you said the mindset preceding the action, right? Yeah, this is the, this is the That I was trying to get to. If the actions lead to the mindset, then it means that the actions give you the evidence of the mindset you should have. And so that's a really good point, right? I love that. And so that gives like the actions become your evidence. And so if you're like, well, I have no evidence, then it's like, then you can make evidence. And that's how— and guess what? That's how everyone else did it.

Upstream, how do you get people to get out of that uncertainty mode so they can make clear decisions?

So I have a couple of mental exercises that I actually go through for this. And so I try and reframe reality in a couple of ways. One of them is I try and play out the absolute hypothetical worst scenario, right? And so the worst scenario is I die. Okay, then I won't be worried about it because I'll be dead, right? It won't affect me. Okay, so like one degree less than that, it's like, okay, well, what if I go like I'm, I'm reduced to that? I have absolutely nothing. It's like, okay, well, real talk, there are homeless kitchens and there are, there are places that I could, that I could crash and eat and whatever. I'm like, okay, so I probably won't starve. So actually, probably won't die in the actual worst case scenario. And when you look at people for subjective well-being in poorer countries, there's often people who are happier on average than us in the US. I reframe it as like, well, what problem are we solving? And so if it's like, well, I'm worried about AI, is it going to take my job and, and will I lose all the money? It's like, well, you'll probably be just about as happy and unhappy as you are right now because all of those things presuppose a single assumption, which is that your circumstances dictate your mood or your happiness. If— and you, all you have to do is listen to, you know, anybody who's made lots of money, whatever, whatever the thing is for you. They got the Grammy, they made the movie, that whatever it is, right? They all get there and they're like, it didn't make me any happier. Yeah, right.

Change the thing.

We asked these questions about what if all these circumstances change, but it has an underlying assumption that because the circumstances change, I'm going to become less happy. And that's what our fear comes from. Viktor Frankl in the Holocaust. And I think about these examples because, like, I try and think of hypothetical extremes or like the millions of people who have been slaves in general across countries, across time periods. I use it as an example of how bad circumstances can be. And yet humans continue to survive.

I'm going to switch. Yeah, completely here. Love this conversation. Sales, influence, impact. I feel we are in a, in an era where sales is considered bad when it simultaneously, it is the oxygen for every successful business that exists in your life. Your evolution of sales, what drives you and what could drive others to fall in love with sales through your lens?

So I see sales as helping the person you're speaking to realize that they are in power. There are 3 major buckets that that people use to blame, right? We said earlier about where the finger of blame goes, so does the power. Think about it like an onion. This is the best analogy I can give. The outer layer is circumstances. So they're going to blame money, they're going to blame time, they're going to blame some particular aspect of the thing that they're buying that's not perfect for them, whatever it is. Underneath of that, they're going to blame other people. They're going to blame their partner, their spouse, their kids, their wife, their coworker, their whatever. And then the final layer is that you have somebody. So if I make you realize like, okay, well, the difference between self-made millionaires and you is that you both started at zero.

So what's the difference?

And so what I think you want is you're thinking you need permission, but what you actually need is support.

I love those two layers. And what's the center piece?

The center layer is avoidance. So now you're talking to a person in power. So it's like, okay, it's not the time, it's not the money, it's not someone else. It's not— yeah, it's not other people. What they try and then do is like, ah, I'm gonna think about it, I'm not sure, right? It's avoidance. It just feels like making an informed decision with somebody who is an expert who helps you make the best decision for you.

Yeah.

And you know what? And this is what I, what I train all the salespeople to do. I was like, my goal is that you help the person that you're speaking to decide, not that they buy. Well, there's two things that can fix it. One is years and years of training, of trying to fix your tonality, pausing at the right time, speaking fast if I really want to get someone really excited, or slowing down so that you really pay attention to what I'm saying right now. Right? Like you can shift how you're feeling. Like pros can do that because they've trained for it. But if you're a beginner, there's one thing that's even more powerful than that, which is just you just believe in it, right? Because if you don't believe in it, you know what? You shouldn't sell it. That's the real— like, if you don't believe in it, you shouldn't sell it. And the problem is so many people sell things they don't believe in to make a paycheck.

And that's why sales get a bad name.

Exactly.

What if tomorrow, if we challenge you to say, how can I fall in love with this business? How can I fall in love with my product? And if you don't love it, Here's what I'll tell you. Just go fix it. All right, fix it.

I love this. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna go real deep on this real quick. It's usually the biggest, most obvious thing is that the, like, the sandwich shop isn't doing well. They're like, it's our marketing, it's, it's the location. I was like, your sandwiches just aren't that good. That's all it is. They're just not, they're just not good enough. That's all. Like, they're like, we just need more customers. I was like, if you serve the customers you had well enough, you wouldn't have this conversation with me. My understanding of the level of effort that is required to make something that is world-class or excellent has continued to move up my bar and my expectation of self. And so like the guy who has the sandwich shop, I sometimes I sit down at places, I'm like, how did someone think this is my life's work? So conviction is the— like, if you've gotten anything from what Dean and I were just talking about, is that conviction is the number one secret ingredient to sales, is that you actually have to believe. And the thing is, is the first person you always have to sell is yourself. And most people actually aren't sold. Number one. Number two is that conviction itself is not binary. It's not do you believe or do you not believe, it's how much do you believe, how deep do you believe, right?

Yeah.

And so you can look at a sales team and I can say like, he's a, he's a 2 out of 10, he's a 4 out of 10. If I were to just judge them based on how much they believe in the product, that would map significantly more to what their closing percentage was more than anything else.

Wow.

But the cool thing is, is that because conviction is measurable and it is changeable, it's also something that you can work on. And you can outwork your self-doubt. If I didn't think the book was good, that I would work on the book until I thought it was good, and then my doubt would go away because I have evidence.

Wow.

That I've done this thing to make it exceptional. And so if someone then says, I think your book's shit, I would just say like, well, here's all the evidence of all the things that I did. Like, I rewrote—

going back all the way to— he's talking about the beginning.

100%.

I can go in front of half a million people and I think I can feel what they need. And it's because I had to feel what my dad needed. I had to do it through empathy and compassion. It wasn't just a torrent normal father-son relationship. And I think I get to sell the way I sell. I get to care the way I care. I get to build. I've built 13 different companies. I get to do all that because of that shit I went through. So it took me a long time to get there, and that was a long answer, but hopefully that helps somebody today.

It was a real answer.