LinkedIn marketing secrets nobody told you about - with Grant Jamison. EP #285

G', day, guys. It's Den Lenny here, host of the how to Scale a Video Business podcast. Now we're going to do jump into part two of an interview we started last week with Grant Jamieson from Lift Video. And if you haven't watched that, please go and watch or listen to that back. And Grant runs Lift Video Productions in Melbourne. And the interview last week was about his journey from being a freelance videographer to running a video business. And this week I wanted to ask Grant about imposter syndrome and how he manages that feeling of being an imposter. And he shares some really key insights which I know are going to be very helpful for you. The other thing we talk about in detail is his LinkedIn strategy and how he's really dominated his niche in LinkedIn and even during a niche change and a shift in direction, how quickly he was able to do that, exactly how he did it. And I think some really useful insights to help you if you're looking at LinkedIn as a means of getting new business. So hope you enjoyed this interview and please make sure you like and subscribe if you're watching this on YouTube. And if you have not already done so, please leave us a review on itunes or whatever platform you use to listen to this podcast. Anyway, guys, enjoy the show.

Well, Grant, we run out of time last week and we were just getting into LinkedIn and marketing, but as we wrapped that up, we finished recording and then we talked, started talking about self doubt. And I thought it'd be a great place to begin this week's episode because I know I still have imposter syndrome and have self doubt. It doesn't happen every day. But tell me about your journey with that because it's very real, isn't it?

Oh, so real. And I know we were just talking about this podcast and how, you know, you listen to all these other people, like, oh my gosh, everyone's doing so amazing. Like, what am I doing? And then you reflect on your journey. Oh, actually, maybe I have come a fair way, even though I still feel like I've got a long way to go. But yeah, self doubt's a huge one for me. I imagine other videographers as well. It's kind of hard when you're in the moment every day and there's like emails coming in and jobs to do. You kind of forget to take a step back and reflect on the wins you've had. And that's why the weekly wins are so great in our group. But you need to take that time to Just reflect and go, oh, actually a year ago for me, I was a bit stuck. I think we were in Covid as well. Don't want to talk about that, but a bit stuck with who we were working with. And the engineering and manufacturing wasn't really working. And now we've actually come a pretty long way. But if you don't take a moment to step back and really think about that and go, yeah, actually I'm doing all right, then I think it's easy to get into that hole of self doubt, anxiety. And then for me, like, I didn't really want to. There were a few days where I just didn't want to do anything at all. And I think it's really easy to fall into that, that whole.

Yeah, yeah. And I mean, how does, how does being part of the vba, you know, for someone who doesn't know what it is or has heard me rabbit on about it, but they're kind of like not really sure what it is. What are some of the things that, that you find to be beneficial, being part of a community like that?

The most valuable part of the VBA for me is having a group of other video business owners who are at a similar level or even doing better than me, which is great. I love surrounding myself with people who are doing better than me, but who understand where you're coming from, what you've been through. Because they're either going through it themselves or they've been through it and so they can, you can kind of bounce off each other, give support to each other. I call, like sometimes I have calls outside the VBA with some of the guys catching up. So, yeah, it's a pretty great little tight knit circle.

Yeah, no, it's cool. I mean, I agree and it sounds weird for me to say because it's my group, but I'm very proud of just creating an environment and a framework and a space. I often think of the VBA as, I mean, yeah, we've got amazing training and all the kind of tools that you need to build a business, but I often feel like it's a men's shed. It's like a place where you can come and no matter how you're feeling.

You'Re never really alone.

No, absolutely. And yeah, it's a bit of a men's shed. Women are welcome too, of course, but it's a great place just to share what's happening and if things aren't going so well as well, which was happening particularly during COVID Oh my goodness. But it was a really kind of a safe space just to share what's happening and just get some support and rely on kind of other people just to give you a bit of a pep talk, you know, sometimes you need it.

And look, I agree. I would love to see more women in the vba. We've had a couple come and go. We have more women in the UP level program and I'm not sure why that is and I'd love for there to be more women in the group, but the fact is it's mostly men and that's why I call it a men's shed. But most importantly, I think there's a real genuine care and support and I think that's important because the self doubt because I feel like building a business is such an emotionally challenging journey at times. And you know, you've got a partner and she works full time and she works shifts and you're trying to balance your life. And I mean, how do you find running a business now, five years in from where you were five years ago, what are some of the things you noticed to be easier, but what are some of the newer challenges you find? Because you know, when you build a business right, you just, you scale and then you create more problems.

Yeah, 100%. So I'm finding myself, I'm a lot more confident when I talk to clients. I'm a lot more confident when I talk to new clients. I'm improving on the sales side of things. Like just on a call thinking, yeah, I've gotten rid of that whole. I was kind of scared of sales and I felt kind of sleazy about it.

Yeah. I remember having a number of conversations. You were like, oh, I just don't know what to say, you know, and we spent quite a long time. But it's great that you're sharing this because you learn to be better at sales.

Yeah, 100%. So I've really. Now I feel a lot more comfortable and I think of it less of like a sales call as more like, you know, I'm helping, I'm guiding a new client into the video space. So, yeah, a lot more confident with that. But yeah, definitely new struggles. Of course, finding I'm spending a lot more time working than I was freelancing. Like with freelancing, I was just kind of like, yep, edit's done, go home. And so balancing that work life thing at the moment is another. Definitely another challenge that's popped up.

Yeah. So let's go back to LinkedIn because one of the things that I think is a real Challenge for videographers and creatives is creativity is a spontaneous thing. It's, it's ideas, it's, let's do something different, let's find a fresh way to approach a subject. I think we have a bias towards monotony, a bias towards anything that seems like we've done it before. And yet on LinkedIn, you've got to be consistently reaching out to people kind of with the same message over and over again. How have you managed to switch your brain off from being a creative, always wanting to do something new? Because I believe one of the reasons you've been so successful on LinkedIn, and I think your LinkedIn game is absolutely on point, is that you are consistent with the types of content you put out, when you put it out, and how you connect with people. And I think you built some systems around that. But how did you approach that as a creative person?

Yeah, well, I mean, first of all, I've got heaps of ideas. Most of them go in my ideas list on my notes app and I never look at them again.

But I guess in terms of the approach we, I, I started out kind of being really self conscious about posting on LinkedIn. Like, I felt like, what's people gonna think? I felt really awkward about it and I quickly realized that no one really cares. But what I did with that was I essentially made a batch of content based on the Ask Framework Den, which is where we kind of, you ask customers like, what are their biggest challenges, what do they most want to achieve in their roles, that kind of thing. So firstly, I'd ask those questions and I'd try to make some monthly content around that once a month. And I'd hand that to my virtual assistant and she would post it for me, which removed that block of, you know, you're about to post, you go, oh, actually, you know, no one really cares. I'm not going to post that. You know, this isn't good enough. It removes that because it's done. So that's how I first got over it. And then I started to feel a lot more confident about LinkedIn. After a couple of months of having my virtual assistant consistently posted post for me, I felt a lot more confident about it and I started posting myself and then I started to track the content that was working and versus the content that wasn't. And I found that most of the content that was working was a little bit of like me talking on camera, educating, like educational kind of content, like what kind of videos are best for your brand, why you should use customer Case studies in your brand, that kind of stuff was, was popular. And on those sales calls people would mention that even if they'd never engaged, they'd be like, hey, I saw you did those how to videos, so that was great. And then I started posting a lot more behind the scenes imagery as well. And that gets a ton of engagement. So every time I go on a shoot I'm like, you know, back in my right, gotta take a photo. And I just posted on LinkedIn, tag the client, tag the company and that, that goes into their network as well. And then my third kind of pillar of content and I'm still working on this is like customer video testimonials and they're hugely popular as well.

I think the fact you've got themes and you're tracking them is, you know, you're actually a great marketer, Grant, you know, you maybe don't realize it, but Mark, a great marketer doesn't think, they test, they test different bits of content. And a true marketer and a business owner who's got the idea of scale in mind, he starts to run their business by the numbers. They start to run their business based on data. And that data can be simply how many likes that I get on that post, how many people looked at that post? And we had one of the calls we had just a week or two ago in the vba, one of our weekly coaching calls. I think we just reviewed what you've been doing on LinkedIn and I think a lot of the group were just like, oh wow. They just look to what you were doing and go, I wish I could do that. Which kind of comes back to how we started this call. When you, sometimes you don't realize how far you've come until you have a chat like this or on the call last week when we just reviewed your page and your messaging was on point, your description was on point and it's working. So, you know, very well done to you because it's, it takes a lot of work. And, and what, what are some of the things where, where is some of the resistance that you felt when you were kind of figuring that stuff out?

Yeah, I mean, so I, I, so basically at the start of this year I was like, I wanted to dedicate to LinkedIn, I knew I did, but I still was, I felt really self conscious about posting, like, just like, I don't know what it was, just some imposter syndrome or like, who am I to be talking to these brands about video production? But once you get past that, then for Me, it was just right. Here's a pain point. I know I can help them with it. Here's how we help it. And I just post that content or pass it to my virtual assistant who posted it for me. Just to remove that block of actually posting. That was probably the biggest thing. And then also coming up with ideas for content as well. Because for my audience, like, video is only one part of their job. So it's not like I'm expecting tons and tons of engagement, but for it helps stay top of mind when they're sort of on LinkedIn and they see something. And honestly, I have gotten in discovery calls comments from people who never engaged with anything, and they say, oh, I've watched a couple of your videos. That's really helpful. I'd love for you to share me a bit more about how we could.

Do X. Yeah, isn't it interesting? LinkedIn is one of those strange platforms where if you look at Instagram or Facebook, you know, whenever someone posts something, there seems to be a ton of like, they're like, like vultures liking stuff and commenting. And so you get that kind of endorphin hit that like, oh, at least my content's being seen. Even if that content's been seen by other filmmakers, which are never going to spend any money with you, you. You find yourself getting a kind of hit. And actually it was Corey, one of our other members of the group, who commented a few weeks ago, saying, you know, you get this endorphin hit from Facebook and Instagram that you don't get from LinkedIn. But actually, statistically, there are way more people observing your content on LinkedIn who never comment, who never engage. And if you think about that, it's because they're busy. If they're in Marcoms, they're busy. They might log onto LinkedIn when they're sitting on the bus or sitting on the train and they see stuff, but you're making them aware of you. And it's that awareness that, that builds a relationship.

And I think, you know, there's a kind of a trifecta of awareness at the top of the triangle and trust in the bottom corner and in the middle. The bit that people forget about is nurture is like you can't just connect with someone, expect them to know instantly that they want to work with you. And the nurturing comes in the form of what is the mere exposure effect. Like, the more times you're exposed to a product, brand or service, the more you build trust. And I think that's what you're doing very well. And I remember you sharing this with the guys in the group. It's just like, I've got this document and I put down ideas and we put that as week one and this one is week two. And I think you started with just like one post a week, didn't you?

Yeah, 100%. So. Well, originally I started with I was going to go five posts a week, so just smashed it out of the park. And that did not work at all, like immediately, like day two, I was like, oh, no, don't worry about it. So it really was about starting small. So one post a week. And I think I did that for like two months. Just one post a week. I had heaps of content ready to go and then I went up to two times a week and I still could manage that. And then three times a week. And that was where I was like, right, I can't do any more than this. And so that's kind of where I am now, is still just posting three times, two to three times a week. And at the same time messaging people who I might not have. I might have connected with, but haven't messaged in a while, been a couple of months. Maybe they liked one of my posts. I might just message them and say, hey, we didn't get a chance to speak. How are you going? How are things that company? So that's been kind of the approach we're taking now. And yeah, it seems, it seems to be working.

Another, another cool thing to do that I've been testing is.

The more you post, the more your network sort of shares what you're doing. And a really good sort of tactic, and I'm sure you do this, is that if you see someone who likes your post, who you don't know is I go and then connect with them and I just say, hey, Bill, you know, really good of you to like my post on this subject matter. We'd love to connect and learn a bit more about what you do. And I find that's a really good way of just expanding the network. And it's not, it's not creepy and it's not sleazy because I think if you do it in the right tone, people don't mind you expanding Networks.

Yeah, no, 100%. And the other thing you can also do is just engaging with other people's content and commenting and then, yeah, being more present on LinkedIn because if you comment on someone else's post or a company post, then other people connected with them see you as well. So if you can comment with some value or add some value to another post. And that's another good strategy as well.

And so talking a bit about. And you don't need to show your numbers, obviously, but. But you've had. Beginning of this year. It was. There was a tough couple of months where I think definitely in transition phase.

Yeah.

But you know, what I wanted to kind of get into here was a little bit about. There's still a roller coaster in business, and it's a roller coaster of mindset and emotions and holding your nerve when things seem like they're not working. But I think if we think back six months to where you. Six months ago, to where you are today. What. What's happened. What. What's happened in that journey. And it may be a bit longer than six months, but I recall a period this early this year where you were like, man, this is just like, not working.

Yeah, 100%. So basically started well. We had Covid over the Christmas break here in Melbourne and everything was shut down, which is a real pain. But let's move on from that. So I had a bunch of projects push back, blah, blah, blah, blah. The biggest thing that happened was probably in March, one of my biggest clients at the time was like, hey, we're putting a stop on video content. And I just hired someone full time basically to help manage this one client. So that was a bit shit. I was like, oh, I know I'm laughing, but that's.

I'm laughing because, like, life's a bitch, right? That's exactly. That's typically what happens.

I couldn't believe it was like, within a week of each other. I was like, is this for real? I couldn't believe it. So that was a huge challenge. So, yeah, there was definitely a bit of scrambling on my part. Definitely lit a bit of a fire under me to really push hard on the marketing, the sales, asking for referrals from other clients, asking for video testimonials and sharing those, posting more on LinkedIn, writing the guides.

All that stuff was really. I had to do it. I had no choice. It was either sink or swim because I had this full time and I had to pay him first.

And I didn't pay myself for that first month that he was on as well. I was like, no, I just want to make sure he gets paid and then I can look after myself. And now six months on of doing that, things are looking much better. That client came back, which is great. Um, but it kind of was like a, you know, an old ex returning and you'd moved on, so.

No, just kidding. They're lovely. But it was kind of like I'd done so much work on the marketing sales, that I realized, hey, actually, I don't have to rely on one or two big clients anymore. So I was really thankful for that. And a couple of new clients come in, and I was having a blast. We started having a blast working with them.

Yeah, it's. It's interesting, isn't it? You know, this growth only happens when there's pain. Right. You never learn anything when everything is going great. It's when things are not going great. And I think this is an important lesson for anyone listening, is that clients don't stay forever. And you might have an amazing client who's been giving you great work for years, and they love you, but it just takes one person to leave, and that gig is over. And it's happened to me, and I know it's happened to you, and it's happened to probably every single person in the vba. But the lesson from that is that you get to go. Right. There's a big risk in my business. There's a vulnerability here. What do I need to do to take that vulnerability away? And that's exactly what you did. You went out, you created marketing material, you looked at different sectors, you started pushing into those sectors, you started winning work. And then.

That client came back in a slightly different form. But. But how great is that? That. That that particular client was your main client For a long time, they were the majority of your work, and now they've come back and they're an important client to you, but they're just a number. They're. They're one of many. And I think that is probably one of the greatest achievements in lift video, because you've built resilience into. Into what you're doing.

Yeah. And looking back, it was a real. Yeah, it definitely forced me to make that change. I had no choice.

Yeah. And this is the thing about the cruel mistress that is business, is that you can never, ever get too comfortable. And as soon as you get comfortable, she whips the rug from under you. But tell me now, I mean, you must have learned a lot this year in terms of resilience and realizing how tough you are as a business owner. Because I remember, you know, you maybe a year ago talking about wanting to hire someone but being very fearful of it because you weren't sure how to communicate what you wanted doing and build systems, but you did end up finding someone. Tell me about that process and how that's impacted your life and business now.

Oh, so good. Yeah. So I was pretty afraid of hiring someone, like just having to pay someone else every single month no matter what. I was like, oh my goodness, I can't do that. What? Um, but I did realize, like, I knew deep down that I had to do it to have any chance of growing. So I knew I had to do it. It just took me a while to build up the courage to make the call. But I did do it. I'm glad I did because we got a great videographer now. He does a lot of the shooting and editing and he loves the, he loves that stuff, which I'd kind of grown tired of. But I'm, you know, I can still help where I need to. But yeah, it's really freed up my time to focus on marketing and sales, which I wouldn't be able to do if I was still editing three days a week and shooting. You know what I mean?

And from a kind of financial point of view.

The biggest fear was, oh my God, I've got to pay this person every month. What, you know, what if I can't? But, and actually in hiring this guy, you've, you've created more time and space to be more consistent with your sales marketing. What impact is that having on your sales and your.

And your business made us more money?

Funny, isn't it?

Exactly. That's. And it took me, even though it's so simple, it does take you a while to realize that, oh, actually now that I've got time, I can focus on earning us more revenue, more jobs, more projects, and I can afford to pay someone else to sit on the tools and do that. So it's so simple. It just took me a while, I guess, to really build up the courage to, to make the leap.

And in terms of percentages, how much do you think you've grown since you've changed direction and brought in your full time employee? And you've had.

Four very consistent sales months, a number that probably.

Is pretty cool from a kind of sales target perspective.

Yeah, I mean, particularly going from a freelance videographer. I mean, we're doing like three times, four times what I was when I was a freelancer, which is great. But this year, I mean, compared to the last financial year, we're probably up by about 40 or 50%, something around there. I mean, I'm not great with numbers.

But those are healthy. Those are healthy growth.

Numbers.

Yeah. Slum steady is really what it's been.

And I think that's very important.

A lot of What I see online is like, hey, there's like again, this kind of get rich quick with video type concept. But in the book Great by Choice by Jim Collins, which is one of the bibles we reflect on in the VBA is businesses is a long. It's a 30 year game. You know, you'll be doing this in 30 years from now, so you've got plenty of time. And I think, you know, a 50% growth at this stage is really healthy. You probably won't keep growing at 50% each year, but if you grew at 20% each year and maintained it and had the opportunity to, I think it's like you've got to be able to. It's like being in a little boat. Okay. And being on the ocean. Anyone can be on the ocean when it's flat calm. But what if a big storm rolls in? How resilient are you at being able to handle whatever's thrown at you? And I think that's one of the many lessons that you've been shown in the last two years. I mean you were in lockdown for the longest time, you hired someone, you changed niche direction, but yet you're still here. And I know we were talking before the call about cash flow and that being a constant challenge and it's a constant challenge for most businesses because of the nature of the video production game is that even if you're billing 50% up front, you're not always getting the projects can take three or four months in some cases. And so that is just something that's. Your next challenge is to manage the cash flow in a way that I've got this expression, what you focus on expands. And if you are still editing and shooting, that's all you'd be focusing on. Now you're a business owner, you're looking strategically at the big picture for the year. What is the financial goal? How are you going to get there? What resources do you have in your team? And I think it's incredible, mate. I think you should be very, very proud of, of what you've achieved because it's, it's a hell of a journey in a fairly short amount of time.

Yeah, no, it's, it's been pretty crazy to be honest. And yeah, still a long way to go, but exciting and yeah, kind of loving it or like I feel a lot more relaxed now than I probably was at the start of the year. Feeling pretty, pretty stressed the first quarter of this year, but yeah, feeling a lot more confident going forward now.

That's awesome. Thanks so much. For sharing your story, Grant. I'm sure those people listening to this will find this to be very beneficial. And thanks for being so open.

Amazing. Thanks for having me, Dan.