Raw Feeding Studies EVERYWHERE: Oldest Living Dog, AnimalBiome, and Dr. Conor Brady — The Alternative Dog Moms

Welcome to Alternative Dog Moms Podcast. I'm Kimberly Gautier, the creator of Keep the Tail Wagging. For the past 9 years, I've been blogging about raw feeding, pet wellness, and life as a crazy dog mom. I've seen massive improvements in my dog's health since I started raising my dogs naturally, and I'm passionate about sharing my experience to help other pet parents.

I'm Erin Scott. For the past 9 years, I've been researching and learning everything I can about healing cancer, allergies, autoimmune, and history illnesses in both my dogs and myself, and I can't wait to share with you everything I've learned on this journey. As the Alternative Dog Moms, we're bringing you all the latest dog health news that we're following and sharing the tips, tricks, and resources we learn along the way. Now let's get started. Hello, Kimberly!

Hello, Erin! Nice 2-week break.

Yeah, long time no see. How was Johan's birthday?

Oh yes, there, yep, Johan had a birthday. Okay, but more importantly, Zoe had a birthday. Oh, she is my 10-year-old girl.

Happy birthday, Zoe.

The other day, um, well, actually yesterday, the dog walker— I don't know what her problem is with the dog walker, but when he shows up, she barks like crazy. But this last time when he brought Apollo back, she would not even make eye contact with him. And he was like, he was like, hey Zoe, how's it going? And she would not even make eye contact with him. She's just like, I don't like you. I don't. It is the funniest thing because Rigo loves, loved him. Apollo loves him. And I feel like Bella loves him because Apollo loves him. But Zoe's just like, yeah. I get in trouble when you're here because I'm always like, Zoe, stop barking, because she just barks incessantly. So now she's just decided she's going to ignore him because she's like, I get in trouble when you come here, so I don't like it. It's so funny. But yes, we didn't do anything special. I'm like that person that I don't go out and buy a special cake. I don't buy special treats. I don't make a special meal. I don't do anything for my birthday. I mean, I just— I'm not gonna— I just It marks the time. And so she is 10 years old. How's Nina?

Um, stable. It's been a bit of a roller coaster. We had kind of been doing really well. And then we like had a big setback. And then it took us like a week or two, like a week, 7, 8, 9 days to kind of like get stable again. And so I'm like always too paranoid to get too comfortable about where we're at. We've started feeding him from the Mine Pet Platter every meal now. And that seems to help. I guess there's a thing called aerophagia where they're inhaling air, like gulping air while they're eating. That seems like that's a piece of what's going on. And so the pet platter certainly helps with that, but that in and of itself hasn't cured things.

Can you explain how the pet platter helps?

Well—

'Cause does it slow him down?

Yeah, it slows him down so he's not gulping, 'cause even just eating, you know, out of a bowl, he was definitely kind of gulping it down. And so the last time he had a really bad episode, it was immediately right after he had finished eating, and it like started this like chain reaction of like gagging, kind of like almost like uncontrollable gagging. And then I think he panics there seems to be an element of, like, panic with him that, like, it's not gonna stop, and he gets, like, really freaked out. And of course, this happened, like, the one night I wasn't home. It was like we had a big fundraiser for the nonprofit that I volunteer with, and I get home and I'm, you know, tired and, you know, like, just want to sit down. And then Tim's like, there was an incident. And then it had started— it started again, like, at, like, 1 in the morning that night. He just starts with this. It's, it's— think of like hiccups but like gagging, and it just doesn't stop. And then sometimes he actually does just get hiccups too, which I had never— I've never seen a dog get hiccups, but he gets hiccups. So anyway, there's still an element of like reflux and swallowing things down, but it's mostly under control right now, right? But yeah, I— this has been quite a roller coaster.

I am very grateful to say that, um, knock on wood, everyone is healthy.

I'm so glad. And then we got all excited that we were gonna go meet this other dog, and then my husband got food poisoning. And he didn't like get food poisoning, he gave himself food poisoning. Once again, I left the house. There was a big event here in Baltimore this weekend called DogFest. The nonprofit I volunteer with, we had a booth at DogFest. And I come home and Tim's making— he made this awesome dinner. He made like a pot roast thing in the Instant Pot. And he sits down and he like goes to take a bite and he just like runs in the bathroom and starts throwing up. And now I'm like, oh God, what's wrong with the food? But apparently while I had been at Dog Fest all day, he made himself a sandwich with lunch meat that had been in the refrigerator since September.

Oh yeah.

And he's like, it didn't smell bad, it was just a little slimy. And he was sick for like 36 hours.

Oh, poor guy.

But in the meantime, I have now fallen in love with like 2 other dogs. So we now have like a lineup of 3 dogs that we want to meet as potential roommates for Nino.

So, well, I wish you all the best in choosing the right dog.

Yeah.

And that everything goes very well.

Yeah, I'm excited. I'm like nervous excited.

So let's, let's talk about the biggest story. Recently, which is Bobby. And Bobby passed away in October.

Yeah.

Yes, at 31 years old. And I laugh because this is so stupid. The veterinarians that I can't remember, they're— I think, I think Chambers and Salini. One of them has a YouTube channel, and the other one, um, I don't know if he runs a group of 18,000 vets or if he's just a member of the group. But in the article that I read, you know, he made a point of saying this was Chambers, that not one member of 18,000 believed that that dog was 31 years old. And to me, there's— okay, so there's a line. There are plenty of people who don't believe the dog was 31 years old. There are plenty of people who do believe the dog is 31 years old. I don't care how old that dog is. The dog looked old to me. I don't care specifically how old the dog was. And I think at this point it feels counterproductive to try and determine the age of the dog, especially after the other veterinarian pretty much said that there is no true definitive way to determine the age of the dog because the testing that you would use is, you know, depending upon the lab that you go to, there's just, it's just not really set in stone yes yet. You know, it needs more time.

You can't cut them open and count the rings. Yeah. Yeah.

It needs more fine-tuning. And I just feel like because in the video, if anyone has ever gone and watched the video from the veterinarian that, and as far as I know, initially publicly raised questions, I'm sure there are probably many others that raise questions, but this is the first thing that I saw. He made some very good points. Still didn't make me— I just, to me, I was more interested in how Bobby lived and I got that information and I'm grateful to the veterinarian who took the time to share that with me. But I found it just— his video was like, okay, well, those are some interesting questions. I learned about the testing. I can't, for the life of me, I can never remember the name. The type, the name.

Telomere? Is it telomere testing? Telomere.

Telemere testing, you know, that, you know, I learned a lot about the telemere testing. I learned about, you know, what the process was. And I want to give the name of the person, the veterinarian who I spoke with, who actually took the time to clarify quite a few things. Margarida Raposa. She's a veterinarian in Portugal. And so his comment about the telemere testing, that was a valid comment. And about you know, the fact that the dog owners were allowed to self-report. That wasn't accurate. While he did go and add Bobby's information, and this is the owner, add Bobby's information to the system, it wasn't one of those things where it was just sort of like, let's wake up one day, I'm going to add my dog and how old? 31. That wasn't what happened. Or at the time, I think the dog was 30. That wasn't what happened. There were two different systems in Portugal, and they decided to merge the systems into one because it made no sense to have two. And during the merge, some of the records just didn't transfer. And so they sent out queries and asked dog owners to go and re-add their pets' information to the system. And this was also probably done in this case because Bobby, you know, the Guinness Book was there and it's like, let's go ahead and just get, get that squared away. It wasn't done in this secret, sneaky, um, haha, look at what I'm doing type of situation as it's being painted out to be. So now they're, they're calling for an investigation, which I think is, it's cruel given that the family just lost their dog. Um, they're not, from what I see, looking for attention, I don't see what they would have gained. I mean, some people are, and I'll get to that in a second, some people are saying that others gained attention and used the situation, but the family themselves, it's not like they suddenly have a TV show on Animal Planet or something like that. They didn't, there was nothing to be gained for lying. It, you know, I just don't buy that. And the other argument that Dr. Becker and Rodney Habib promoted it because of their book, their book was already number one, right? A best-selling book all around the world, translated in I don't know how many different languages when this was reported. There are actually people out there that are saying that the two of them conspired with the family to create this entire story. Yeah, that this, all of it's just fake and they just— and kind of sort of like the amount of work in this day and age of social media where basically there are so many people who make a living off of debunking people. And I mean, and, and going after scammers, I, I mean, that just doesn't make sense to me. But the reason why I say I'm bringing them into this is because in both cases, so the video on YouTube and the article on The Guardian, in both cases, Dr. Becker was mentioned without being mentioned. So in the video, it was just, you know, a prominent holistic vet type of, you know, but just showing her picture and about how all of a sudden all of her branding is about Bobby. So that must mean that something nefarious is going on. And, you know, little snide comments in the video of, and then I guess the cat's here eating couscous. Hey, I thought carbs were bad, you know, type of, you know, snide comments. And it's like, Okay, so now we know what this is really about. And then the same thing in the article, Chambers, Dr. Chambers said that, you know, referenced, I don't know if it's specifically Dr. Becker, but a pet food zealot and saying that they were against pet food and wanted to prove that raw feeding was better, despite the fact that Bobbi wasn't fed a raw food diet. And so it feels like the only reason why they want to do this investigation is to prove someone wrong. And at that point, I just sort of feel like, at this, can't you just agree to disagree? It's clear. It's 1,000% clear that you are not going to change your mind or consider fresh food at all, which is fine. And if by chance there is a test and it comes back to prove that the dog is 31 or 31-ish, say maybe 25 to 30, just basically older. How much you want to bet they're just going to argue and say that something was wrong with the test. You know, it's not like, are they going to come forward and going, hey, my bad, Dr. Becker, I apologize. I had no idea. Tell us more about this dog. I just feel like it would have been more beneficial to anyone and everyone, veterinarians, dog owners, everyone to just learn more about the dog's life. Beyond the vague statements of, he ate, you know, what his owners ate, and he ate organic vegetables, and he went for walks, and he, he had low vaccinations. I mean, that's great, but so many people around the world can claim the exact same thing, and they're not getting the same amount of longevity. So there's so much more to learn, and it's such a disappointment to me that Instead of taking an opportunity to learn more about the dog, people are taking, you know, the opportunity to tear down someone who's not even associated— well, I guess is loosely associated with this family in that she promoted them. That's all.

Yeah, it's sad to see like a family's loss being hijacked in the media or in social media and this guy who is apparently a horse vet is just a member of the Royal College of Veterinarians. And, you know, it's not like he runs the organization or anything, like, and yet he's putting himself out there as like a spokesperson, which I think is kind of messed up. But, uh, yeah, this whole thing has just been so bizarre. And I don't know, all of it's very bizarre. Like, it's obviously an old dog and You know, I like your point of like, what was he eating? And just, and like, what specifically? And how, you know, like, let's just find out, like, how is this dog living rather than, you know, like, could you imagine? Remember, you know, just recently when Rodrigo passed and, you know, you had like a million views or something on Facebook of people sending you love. And could you imagine if those were all people trying to tear you down, or—

I, I couldn't. I mean, basically from that, 2 people came forward and said that I was using my dogs for clicks and views and, um, how disgusting that was. 2 people. I mean, it was disgusting that they would say that, but who cares? It was 2 bitter, angry, miserable people who— and I'm sure We see that everywhere, like in the world, in the social media world that we have today, we're always going to see that a segment of the population that just sees negativity wherever they look. But for the most part, people are human beings and they're kind. And I feel like in the dog lover community, in any community where people love animals, people can relate and understand and know what thing, what you're going through. But to sit there, like, if I had an entire group, like if someone came forward and said, yeah, I'm a member of a group of 18,000 people and none of us like her and we hate her stupid dog and we don't even think he's really dead. We think she's just pretending. I mean, it was, I would be flabbergasted. But, you know, I feel sad because I spoke to another person She is a vet student and an animal behaviorist, and she lives in Sweden. And she actually went to Portugal on her own dime and spent a week with the family and the dog and has videos and everything. And she also sent, she sent out stuff for, to test the dog. I don't know what the testing is for exactly. I don't know. I don't know if it is for the dogs.

Age.

Because my thing is like, how do you do that? I mean, I would— what, saliva, blood test, hair? I don't know. I haven't looked into that. And it just, it seems it's not like it's this DNA, like the doggy DNA test type of situation. But I spoke with her and she is just heartbroken about what's going on. And I was kind of confused because I was like, but you don't really even— it's not your dog. And these people. But, and her thing was that, you know, she, she was heartbroken because she was thinking about the family and she just felt really sad for the family. And I don't know how much time they spend on social media. I don't know if people have taken it upon themselves to reach out to them and contact them, as some idiots may be tempted to do. Hopefully that isn't the case, but it is. It's, it's, you know, I think that with anyone, if you I mean, you're my friend. If someone were saying really, you know, shoddy things on social media about you, I would be upset about that. I wouldn't be— so I can, I can understand that. But it is a tough one. But do you want to know what I learned? What's that? Oh my God, I'm so excited. So the veterinarian took the time. It was funny because we scheduled a time. I was up at 3 in the morning with my notepad ready to go. And when she, she wanted to do a Zoom and I was just like, I can't because every other people are sleeping. And she was just like, well, what time? I was like, well, it's 3, and other people are sleeping. And she was like, 3 AM? I'm like, yeah. And she's like, oh no, no, no, no, I'm not gonna have you up at 3 AM. And I was so grateful because I was exhausted. But, um, so we got back on at 11 AM my time, and it was the evening her time, and she was so amazing. But so I will try to be quick. Um, now about his diet, he did eat— so she wanted to clarify that there are some outlets that say he ate table scraps. She said that is not true. They cooked for him. He ate what they ate. So a lot of the articles that said that they like soaked the food to get the excess spices off, um, that was accurate. But she was like, if they went to, went and bought fish for themselves, they also bought fish for him too. Um, so he did eat what they ate. It was similar to a Mediterranean diet. So it was like, people are saying it's a Mediterranean diet. And I know that this is nitpicking, but the Portuguese diet is similar to a Mediterranean diet. And so that's in my research, that's that distinction was was very clear. But a lot of fish, a lot of protein. They raise their own vegetables. They do have nutrient-rich soil. They raise their own animals. So he was eating a good diet. And my questions were also like, well, did he fast? And how often did he eat? How much did he eat? All of that. He ate what he ate. And they were not— they were not using the animal diet formulator and spreadsheets to figure out his meals. They were, they were, you know, They were, you know, when they ate, he ate. And, you know, and it was one of those things. But he did fast, but it was not a set fasting system. They said that, you know, when I— because I wanted to know about, like, you know, well, they say he went for walks. How much, you know, how far, all of that. And it was like, no, he would sometimes just go wandering and go roaming. And so they were surrounded by eucalyptus woods, which I want to know what that smells like because I love the smell of eucalyptus. But, um, you know, but he would wander around and he would be gone for, you know, a couple days at a time and then come back.

So during that time, he's so nervous, right?

You know, he, he was— maybe he was foraging, but he was just sort of like hanging out, living his life. And since they were in a small town, a small village, everyone knows each other. It was just, you know, it was just casual and just a different type of just low stress type of life. The other thing was he very, very low vaccinations, only rabies, nothing else. Although, you know, they do have cars and pollution, they have electricity towers. It's still nothing compared to like a big city. So it's still like very clean environment. And so I think a combination of just exercise and basically being allowed to be a dog, because that was one of the things that Rodney said at the Feed Real Summit is that he slept outside, he ate outside, you know, and it was just a different environment. And I think that as Americans, and this is why I just kept wanting, I wanted to know more because I wanted to compare Bobbi's life to that of my dogs and my dogs. I mean, granted, they do go on walks, we go on walks, you know, a couple of times times a day, and I take them to different places. We went on a sniff walk this morning, but everything is very regimented. I mean, Apollo would love for me to open the door and just be like, okay, I'll see you at 5, and just come and go as he pleases. But that would never happen where I am. Our dogs, they are allowed to be dogs within certain confines, and our dogs are exposed to more toxins, exposed to more chemicals. So I can now better understand the difference between Bobbi's life. And because my thing was that, you know, if we're all feeding fresh food, if we're all doing conservative vaccinations, if we're all, you know, making sure our dogs get exercise, if we're all choosing organic products, but yet our dogs, you know, if we're lucky, I mean, the outliers are 15 to 17 years for a dog of that size. But for the most part, dogs are passing away between 8 to 10, maybe 12 years.

Yeah, because wasn't he like a mastiff mix?

Yeah.

I mean, that's a big dog. Big dog.

So it's like, you know, it was— I thought it was important to really know that. And I wasn't alone. And I know that for, you know, some people it felt, you know, I think that because we live in the social media world, when you ask questions, especially in this situation where there were people out there asking questions in a way to disprove any questions people took as either you're attacking the family or you're attacking Dr. Becker and Rodney Habib. And that wasn't the case. I just wanted to know more because I was hoping to be able to pick up on some type of idea, another piece of the puzzle. To be able to apply to my dogs. And now I, you know, I know a lot better.

Yeah, I don't know why it's wrong to like want more information.

I do. It's funny because I was talking to the vet student who lives in Sweeton about that because she was just like, I don't understand why people don't believe. And I was like, because we don't see it. I mean, I was like, and I, we, because I was like, well, it's the same thing as an atheist who doesn't believe in God. And you— they tell you, well, prove to me. And it's like, I honestly wouldn't know how I would prove to an atheist that God exists because I just have always believed. It's just never occurred to me that God didn't exist. So it's just like, I can understand that people who say— and especially with science— that the average lifespan of a dog is, you know, maybe 10 years, 12 years, this is impossible. There's no way ever that a dog will live to that age. You need to show them. And right now there is no way to prove that to them. So they're not going to believe it. I think it's unfortunate that people have taken it a step further and turned it into a big conspiracy theory. And now they're, they're calling the family liars, but I can also understand that that's what they believe. If you believe that, if you believe that something is impossible, then, and people are coming out and saying, no, no, no, it is, and they have no proof that you will accept, then that's going to be your conclusion. They must be lying. I just, I don't think that they're lying. I think that it was an old dog, and it was an old dog, you know. I think that was very clear. And, you know, and now he's gone, and I just, I don't, I don't see the point in digging. I don't know what, what they hope to gain digging digging into this. So that's that. But it is— I do have an entire article about it, and, um, and I go into detail based on what I learned about. So if anyone wants to check it out, they are more than welcome.

I'll link it in the show notes.

So we had a conversation a few episodes ago, quite a few, about Animal Biome and their partnerships.

Yes.

And that was another, you know, recent, like, how dare they And I didn't watch the entire video, but I went and watched it on YouTube where there were chapters. So I was able to just skip to the explanations of why they were partnering with these companies. And Carlton said something that I thought was really profound, and I'm going to see if I can find it because I want to make sure I quote him correctly.

So yeah, this was Dr. Odette Souter who hosted a conversation with Dr. Holly Ganz and Carlton, who is her husband and like chief investment officer type person. It was funny kind of getting the lay of the land of their relationship and the company and all. I appreciated that.

Yeah. Carlton says, without data, you're not going to get these large companies to change. And I thought that, you know, that ties into Bobby as well, where we can— you can scream the— well, you know, I'm going to do quote unquote facts to someone all day long. If they don't support your facts, if they don't believe your facts, If you're not speaking the same language that they're speaking, you're not going to get anywhere. And I know in the video at one point they said already they've inspired these companies to look more into fresh food because of what they're learning through the studies that they're doing, which is pretty exciting. And that's what I was hoping is that, you know, when I saw who they were partnering with, my thought was I wonder if they're going to be able to change their minds because they're going to be able to show them this. You're having scientists talking to scientists. What blew me away about this interview that, you know, Dr. Souter did is it feels like the scientists are really excited about working with Animal Biome.

Yeah.

And learning all of these things. And that really surprised me, especially about the fact that they wanted to start with cat stuff.

Yeah. So yeah, what some of the stuff I thought was really interesting and just such a good reminder, right, is how expensive what they're doing is. And that they have done other venture, venture capital raises and like, I don't know how any of that stuff works, but you know, they started with small investors and then they go to venture capitalists. But to do the scale of what they're doing, because they're the only people looking at animal biome stuff, you know, on this kind of scale, you know, it's expensive. The tests are expensive to conduct, scientific studies is expensive, the equipment is expensive. And, and so they had to get, you know, they interviewed multiple companies. They didn't just take any money that came along, you know. They wanted to, if they were going to take, accept money from, from corporations, you know, that it had to be something that, you know, aligned kind of with what they were doing. And, and of course, right, like they were even saying that they feed fresh food, you know, to their pets. But it's always a reminder that, you know, not everybody can afford to, to feed and care for our dogs that way. And that these companies might be looking for more targeted strains of things to mass produce, but but you know, there has to be some kind of option, or we should want there to be some kind of option for people who can't afford to always do what we're doing. And there's bigger conversations there too about like, well, why does it have to be so expensive and access to care and things like that? But at the end of the day, you know, it's still a capitalist society. So, you know, and I also just thought it was interesting that sometimes different companies hire them to conduct tests. And yeah, they said these companies didn't know what their products are doing to the microbiome until we showed them. And, uh, Dr. Holly actually wrote a paper that's called like Best Practices for Doing Microbiome Testing and Research because basically nobody else knew how to do this. And, you know, she was kind of like, I can't do as much as they want, like we physically can't, so I'm going to publish this paper to show other people how to do it like the right way. And anyway, I found it all fascinating.

When she mentioned that, you know, like, yes, of course, a poop transplant is going to be the ideal way to improve the microbiome. But she was like, there is just not possible for AnimalBiome to do that for every dog in this country. It's just, they just can't. And so they do need to start partnering. And I just look at it, it's, to me, it's so exciting because, you know, I get the, the us versus them type of mentality. However, I think that it's a dangerous attitude to have for too long. I feel like we're allowed to have it when we're new to raw feeding because we're so excited and passionate. But I think once you decide that you're going to start moving the needle forward, you need to be more inclusive. And, you know, I— someone sent me a survey recently about the ownership of dogs in America. And it said about 56% of American households have a dog, 36% have a cat, 9% have another animal, and then 25% have none. And I have no idea if that adds up to 100. I'm rounding up basically from what they sent to me. But basically, you know, everyone, you know, all of these, these are huge households in America who have a pet. And, you know, this attitude that people don't, you know, someone recently told me that they don't really believe that people love their dogs because, you know, they're just going to feed them whatever. And when their dog dies, they'll just go get another dog. And I was just sort of like, that's That's not how to make a change, I don't think. So believing that of people, and I know that it's easy to think that anyone who's buying kibble for their— how could you possibly think that that's ideal? But then how many of us thought that that was ideal for years at certain points in time? Yeah, you know, it's just like it wasn't until something happened where we realized— I mean, there are that the happy group that were like, no, it never made sense to me, and I'm just astounded by them because I wish that it didn't make sense to me either. But, you know, everyone's doing the best they can. And if it's true that only 5% of American households that would have a pet are feeding fresh food, then there needs to be a way to help those who can't, you know, and what an amazing way to inspire kibble companies to do better.

Because when we show you scientific evidence of how shitty your products are— exactly. I mean, and how they're actually harming the animals that you claim to care about and show like these happy photos of on your corporate investor website.

Yes. I mean, if the— if people— if these— if the veterinarians, if they— these companies, if they want to know science and if they are sitting here like there's no scientific evidence to support the benefit of fresh food And now you have someone who's sitting down with them and speaking their language and showing them in a lab, this is what your food does. What a powerful way to make an amazing contribution just to the future of dogs and cats. And then, you know, collaborating with other fresh food companies like Green Juju to push the needle forward, to give people ideas of what they can do. I think is, ah, it's nerd heaven. I love it.

I mean, we should want everybody to know about this, and we should want science to show how bad some of the products out are on the market because it's the only way to get them to change.

Yeah.

And we, you know, we should want everybody to know about this.

And I think it's— I think people are scared too.

I mean, I think people get scared when they start seeing these big corporation names into something that they know and trust. I'm like, can we just give all the credit and props to Dr. Holly and Carlton for even agreeing to come on and like explain these things?

Yeah, I mean, to me, the level of transparency is so appreciated because that is what we need. That's what we ask for. And I just, I don't like the, the, you know, like, how dare you sign up with these companies But then when you come out and you explain, this is what's going on, there's still a, well, I still don't trust, you know. And on one hand I understand, but on the other hand, it's like you, like you said, you have to give them props because it just shows that their, their desire to do, to make things better is so pure. And I, I really appreciate that. But I do think people are afraid because is, you know, I've heard this for years where a friend of mine, Krista Powell of Vibrant Canine, we used to joke about which kibble company is going to be the first one to come out with a raw food, you know, and what is it going to look like. Because it's like, eventually we're going to see someone, a company, scrape their website of anti-raw articles and come up with a raw food. And I remember people used to talk about, oh, they're starting to buy up, you know, because all of a sudden Sojos was purchased and an investment group got The Honest Kitchen. And it was just like, oh no, here they come. You know, the hoofbeats of the kibble companies are going to eat up all the raw and then they're going to shut them down. And then we're all going to be stuck with kibble. I mean, I truly believe that people are concerned about what's going to happen with the pet industry, especially given what we know of like, you know, the AAFCO organization and the FDA. It's just all of it is so depressing. But I hope that because there's science, because, you know, of what Dr. Ganz and Carlton are doing, they're able to make a shift, not just with these companies, because if one company makes the shift and it's popular, the other ones will fall right in line because no one wants to be left behind. But also the FDA, because if they are working closely with the FDA, then the FDA will fall in line as well. That hopefully, you know, maybe I'm being naive, but hopefully, you know, it won't happen tomorrow, but maybe in the decade or so, we will see a positive shift because I truly believe that the pet industry can still be a multi-billion dollar industry providing better quality food.

And I mean, at the end of the day, if you don't wanna support Animal Biome anymore, you know, Dr. Margo Roman sells poop through Legacy Biome. You can get your poop from her. And there are now other poop tests on the market, so you aren't, you know, they aren't the only ones. Only option out there. So I mean, at the end of the day, it's still a vote with your dollars situation.

Yeah, yeah, that's so very true. So Dr. Carnar-Brady, he's been busy.

So yeah, speaking of wanting to have scientific evidence that raw feeding is better than kibble feeding, I love this.

So let's— I'm going to read this. So Pet Insurance reports revealed the most common reasons for dogs visiting the vet today are skin, including scratching and atopy, ear and gut conditions, followed closely by dental problems. Over the last decade, numerous studies have revealed that feeding fresh/raw, non-kibble or canned, biologically appropriate, minimally processed food to dogs is associated with several health benefits, including less inflammation, atopy, and histamine in the dermal layers, as well as fewer ear conditions, dental disease, and gastrointestinal disease. So basically he wants to— he's funding, and it is now fully funded, an experiment comparing dry food to raw. And I'm very, very curious to see how this goes.

And kudos to Ruby and the team over at Feed Real because they set up a thing where if people signed up for the professional nutrition course that they would donate a portion to fund his study. And so that helped them get over the line.

Yeah, this is— I mean, it's— yeah, it's— I think it's one of those things where, of course, there's always going to be those people who are going to kowtow, you know, like, oh, this isn't, you know, because I don't— I can't remember how many dogs they plan on having in the study. I'm looking into the list and I can't see it. I just remember it from Facebook. But I think that, you know, ideally you are going to want to have like maybe a couple thousand dogs and you want to do this over maybe 5 to 10 years. And that's not what this study is going to be. But this is a start. This is a first study. Where it'll start giving us information. And then as we learn more, we'll gain more. And to me, it's just like something has to happen. I mean, it's— I mean, someone has to do something. We— if we really want to make a difference, I think people need to start putting their money where their mouth is. And I think often I hear people complaining about the fact that these studies are expensive, that raw food companies aren't really in a position to fund these studies because you're going to need millions of dollars. But here they have done it. They've raised $50,000. Well, they've $49,477 and it is 102% funded and there's still 10 more days. So if you still want to add even more money, you can, which is exciting.

Yeah, I had never heard of this experiment.com to like basically crowdfund scientific studies. And I really like how they give you a breakdown of what all the money goes to. Like, they give you what the budget is. They break down the timeline of like how things are going to be done, when they're going to be done, when the paper will be ready. Like, I'm just totally nerding out on this.

Like, I think it's exciting. I think it's exciting. I think it's one of those things where I know that, you know, not everyone can contribute, but, you know, I think we can all benefit. And again, it's a start. And as this, you know, as especially since, you know, they pretty much funded this in record time and it, you know, people are seeing this happening, it'll give other people ideas. I'm certain that Dr. Brady will continue fund, you know, or, you know, basically, um, managing type of projects like this and keep going forward. But other people well, may start doing it as well. I compare it to, you know, the expos around the country. It feels like— I'm sure that there are plenty, but I always think of Dr. Lori Kozier and Healthy Dog Expo as being this annual expo that she put on, and then people started saying, gosh, I wish we had one of those in our area, and then someone did it, and now we're starting to see more and more people step forward.

Now I can't even afford to go to all of them, you know.

So it's like in And then, you know, you have Dr. Judy Morgan and her team are flying all around the country hosting expos. So, different people in different areas have an opportunity to attend a live event because, I mean, although, yes, you can get all of this information online, there's something very special about attending a live event and talking to people face-to-face. You just get really re-energized and you get ideas. The networking is so important, I think.

Ask your questions.

Yeah, I mean, it's just— it— you— that— it's like this feeling of not being alone, whereas when you— even though we're on social media together, it is very isolating. Um, but when you're talking to people face to face, it, you know, it's, it's a different experience. So I think that maybe we'll see, just as we've seen with the expos around the country, we'll see more people funding studies. I wouldn't be— I mean, I'm just gonna put this out here, but I, I bet you, um, like Chelsea Kent, I could totally see her do it with all the data that she has, um, from her company, from Parsley Pet. Just, I would not be surprised if she and, um, Roxanne Stone came forward and put— started, you know, crowdfunding for a study. That would be amazing. And then, of course, you know, as we just discussed, Animal Biome is doing all this amazing work. So, you know, I think that, you know, over the next few years, we're going to see some really astounding progress and information coming out.

Yeah, it's exciting. So I haven't watched a whole lot on TV recently, but I have watched Upload on Amazon Prime.

Okay, so what do you think? Because Upload stresses me out. I'm watching season 2 and I am so stressed out that I had to take a break. Because I want so much. I love Upload. I love season 1. But season 2 is very— I don't like it when people are going to get in trouble. And I feel like— I think I'm on episode 2. Someone's probably going to get in trouble. And I'm just like— and so, but I'm— yeah, I really like Upload. So I know— am I watching anything? I canceled my Disney+ membership. Oh yeah, it went from— it was like, you know, $80-something a year to now it's going to be like just under $150, I think $103 a year. And I don't watch Disney+ enough for that. The only reason why I got Disney+ was because of Marvel and Star Wars. And then because of the Marvel, the first phases of Marvel, so all the way through Avengers: Endgame, after that they were going to start having the TV shows. And so I, that's why I got Disney Plus, because I wanted to be able to keep up because they were going to be bridging these shows to new movies and I wanted to keep up with everything. But I haven't really liked any of the shows. So, and I never watch, I have all the movies, you know, so on Blu-ray, so I don't need to watch them. I mean, and even the Disney movies, which I love, Beauty and the Beast and Brave are my two favorites. I have those on Blu-ray. So I was just like, I just can't bring myself to spend the money on Disney+ when I don't really use it. HBO Max, on the other hand, that's my jam. I'm currently watching House of the Targaryen and it is so good. And then I love South Park so much. So yeah, so, but yeah, so I decided to cancel it. And I bought a new TV today. Oh, I know, I'm so excited. It was so inexpensive. It was like, uh, $200. Crazy for a 43-inch television. Years ago when we bought our first, I think it was like a 43-inch television, it was like $1,400.

Yeah, I mean, I can't believe how much they've come down.

And even better was the kid kid, because he was a kid, the kid gave me the receipt and he was just like, and keep this, and if it goes on sale for Black Friday, come in and we'll give you the money. And I was just like, okay, nice. I'm hoping for a 50% off sale.

Nice.

But I was going to, you know, because it was so much cheaper, because I was expecting to spend like $300 on a TV and it was $200, so I was like, oh well, I'll get myself a new Blu-ray player. Okay. World that's lost its mind, Blu-ray players have— they used to be like, you know, maybe $40, $50. No, that's what the DVD players are. The Blu-ray players now range between $100 and something all the way up to $450. Yes, that is the face that I had when I was at Best Buy today. What the hell does this $450 Blu-ray player do, you may ask. I did. I asked, does it play like 20 Blu-rays? Can I load it up with 20 Blu-rays and then talk to it? Go, hey Blu-ray, play, you know, Avengers: Endgame. I mean, is that why it's $450? No, it is not. It does not do any of that. And he's trying to explain it to me what it does, but I think the look on my face, he was just like, yeah, That's expensive. He just stopped and was like, yes. Because I'm looking at him like, it's more than twice the amount of the TV that I'm buying. What does it do? He's like, it's more for people who really like movies and they want that movie theater experience. And I'm like, I got a 70-inch at home. I got a movie theater. I could sit down, I can microwave some popcorn, there you go. I got some candy. That's my movie. Turn down the lights. But yeah, but I got, um, my TV. I usually get Samsungs, and I know this is going way too long, I apologize for anyone listening. Um, I usually get Samsung because it's one login and I don't want to have to learn a new login. Amazon now makes televisions. Oh, how are they not making televisions all along? And so yeah, there's a Fire TV, and so I can set it up with my Amazon And, and I could talk to it because it has— I don't want to say it because she's just over there.

But, um, and not to mention everybody who's listening will also know.

Exactly. And so, so that's what I'll be doing tonight is setting up my new television, and I'm super excited.

We had this kid, and you know, he was a kid, come to the door recently and was trying to sell us Verizon Fios. Because we're a Comcast neighborhood and I guess they're, you know, trying to drum up more customers. But my husband, despite how much, you know, he talks about the evils of Comcast, is a Comcast loyalist, so we were not persuaded. But I remember the kid said something like, oh, do you have a smart TV? And we were kind of like, yeah, it's not like Gifted and Talented. And he like busted out laughing. And because it is It's a smart TV, but it's probably from like 2017, 2016. It's not like a super fancy pants new one. We were looking at some of the TVs in Target recently. Again, we're like, wow, this is like 100 times better than our TV.

I cannot wait to take mine out of the box. I left it in the box. It's in my Kimberly's you know, she shed, which is basically the office of the house that's turned into my place with my dogs. And that's where I go and I watch my television. And I'm super excited to— I have the space for it. I'm so excited to set it up and talk to it and tell it this. And, and this is what's interesting. If anyone is listening, and this includes you, Aaron, if you're ever out shopping for a smart TV, make sure you get all the apps because not all of them come with all of the apps.

Oh, interesting.

So that when I was doing my little bit of research, which is basically reading reviews on Amazon and Best Buy, one of the most common complaints that people had was that I wish I would have known it didn't come with all the apps because I had to go out and buy like a, um, I don't know if they were buying a Fire Stick, but you know, just basically one of those was Roku, a Roku stick. Yeah, because— and that was one of my— like, my TV, um, oh, it's, it's bad. It's, it's a, it's a— yeah, it's a quote-unquote smart TV, but yeah, it's so tired. It is over, and it, it wants me to just stop. It takes forever for it to turn on, and so you can start using it. I can only do 2 apps on it— no, 3. I can do YouTube, I can do Netflix, and I can do Amazon Prime, but it stopped doing Hulu like a couple years ago because it just basically told me— it told me several years ago to update it, update Hulu, and I couldn't figure out how to do it. And then it finally just told me, we're not doing Hulu anymore. And I was just like, okay, smart TV. And so, but yeah, I found out that not all TVs have all the apps. So you can buy a TV and go home and set up and sit down and watch Hulu or or whatever your other favorite thing is, and if it doesn't have that, you have to go and buy something to plug into it to— so it can get it. So I feel like that's unacceptable in this day and age.

Absolutely unacceptable.

But then again, the TV was $200.

Yeah, I guess that's why there's so much cheaper.

So now I have to—

I'm—

I have a Blu-ray player, so I'm going to plug it in and see if it works with this fancy new— because that's what I was asking the kid. I was like, I have an old Blu-ray player, do you think it'll still work? And he was like, I don't want to tell you if it will 'cause then you'll hold me to it. And I'm like, yeah, not really. It's fine. I'm not gonna call customer service and say this kid, it's like, I'm not gonna ruin your life over it.

I want his head.

Exactly. I was like, Black Friday's coming. I can just come and get one.

All right, well, our TV talk was literally about TVs.

Yeah, there you go. All right, well, it was wonderful chatting with you.

All right, until next week.

Bye, guys.