Making Social Media Work for Your Brand – Episode 9

This is CPG Insiders, the podcast that helps consumer packaged goods companies survive and thrive in business. Now your hosts, Mark Young and Rob Taylor. Welcome everybody, to this edition of CPG Insiders. I am your host, Mark Young, with my co host, Rob Taylor standing by. Hello, Rob. We've already been having fun before this show even started. Today we are going to talk about social media and we have none other than the director of social media from Jekyll and Hyde, which is Amanda Igerson.

Igerson, Right.

I got it.

You got it. What's the other way you say the name?

Igrishan Igorrishan.

Nice. Good job.

Thank you.

That was nice.

So we're going to move on. So obviously we're talking about consumer packaged goods now, Amanda. We get calls from clients who will say, we're just going to do social media to promote our product. So the first thing we need people to understand, social media is not an ad campaign. And gotta remember, people can't hear you shake your head.

It was pretty loud.

Not an ad campaign.

It's not an ad campaign. It's an adjunct, but it's an important adjunct and it's not right for everybody. So there are some products where we could do a lot of promotion for social media. There's other products where we don't. So I mean, as an example, if I'm selling a product, let's say for hemorrhoid pain, that's not a big social media play is depends what you want.

Your tone to be. I believe that all brands should have some form of social media just for increased brand awareness. Like you want people talking about your brand. And if you have a social media platform, you definitely have to monitor it, but you also have to know what kind of audience is going to be looking at it. Something like hemorrhoids might not be the biggest social media audience that you're going to get.

It's not.

It's not a big shareable thing because people aren't going to say, hey, here's my favorite hemorrhoid product.

No, but if you want to, if want to promote your brand on social media with a humorous undertone, which a lot of people do like now, big brands will do that, especially on Twitter. You could absolutely do something like hemorrhoids on social media.

Well, the first thing we need people to understand. So let's talk about how social media works. So the first thing is for most brands today, social media is how consumers talk to the brand, right?

Correct.

So if I'm angry at the brand, if I want to complain about the brand. If I want to say something isn't working for me, there's a really good chance that I'm not going to write a letter to the company. I'm going to get on social media and I'm going to say, your product didn't work for me. So from a very basic level, we need to be, what, covering all these platforms and engaging in those conversations?

Yes, absolutely. So instead of writing a heavily worded letter to the Better Business Bureau, people are going on social media and they're blowing it up, you know, with complaints, with things that they like about it, but those are constantly being retweeted by other users. So one comment turns into a million very, very quickly. A brand needs to be really on top of that, you know, not only to be the client success and the customer service and respond to the negative ones, but also to praise the. The ones that are talking really well about your brand or about your product.

Now, what about those negative comments? We want to be genuine. We want to be authentic. So we don't want to go through and necessarily delete them. We do want to delete them if they're using vulgar language and they're just irrational.

Yeah.

And, you know, I would actually encourage any of the clients that I work with to not delete any comments if you're getting trolled. If there's someone using, you know, vulgar language, you need to report that to whatever platform it is, whether it's Facebook or Instagram or Twitter, just so they have a record of it. But brands going on and just deleting negative comments because they say something bad about their product is actually a big red flag. And people will talk about how a brand won't answer their negative comments and are deleting them. And that can be. It's not good. It's really not good.

Well, when we look at a negative comment, isn't a negative comment an opportunity? And this is what I look at when somebody says, when somebody writes a complaint about your product, that's an opportunity for the company to show how much they care.

Yes.

So you can turn that negative into a positive.

Absolutely. Just responding to those people and showing that you're on top of it and you're listening to what your users are saying about your product says a lot about the company. It says that you actually care about what people are saying, and you recognize that these Twitter followers, these Facebook users, they represent all of your clients, not just one person. There could be a hundred people who feel the same way. So you answering that one question or responding to it could actually be answering a thousand.

I had recently. I'll tell you who impressed me with social media was American Airlines. And I usually fly Delta. I was on an American Airlines flight, It was about 8 o' clock at night, and the captain came out and he walked out and stood in the front of the airplane and started talking to everybody and offering free drinks to anybody who was former or active military. And he was just really cool. And I have a fairly large Twitter following and I had my phone in my hand and I just tweeted to AA that hey, I'm on one of your flights out of Detroit. And the captain's awesome. AA responded to me within three minutes.

Yeah, especially a big brand like that probably has dozens of people who are constantly monitoring their social media platforms. You have to. You have to be on top of it, because if you let something go for even a day without responding to it, it could be very negative.

That tweet I sent out, so that little tweet that I sent out saying A8 to American Airlines, saying, I like the pilot, and I was impressed. I went back and looked and that tweet reached 90,000 people.

Yeah.

So that was 90,000 people that they leveraged, hearing something good about their brand.

And especially after some of the very negative things I have gone around about airlines within the last year, just having something simple like that get out, that is great networking for that brand.

Now, I've also tweeted Delta Airlines, when something's gone wrong on a plane and heard nothing or maybe hear something three days later.

Yeah, it's always going to be harder to know the right thing to say to a negative comment because you don't want to sound condescending or placating. You actually want to solve this issue for whoever is bringing it up, but you have to do it in a very diplomatic way that's good for the brand and good for the client.

Yeah, for me, it's. Somebody complains about the product, it would be, geez, we're so sorry. That is not our typical experience with, with our clients. And I think in many cases try to take it offline.

Yeah, like, please reach out to us.

At infooandso or direct message me and we're going to send you new product.

Yeah, yeah, we'll work with you to get this resolved. But trying to, you know, address it on social media and then lead it to a more private conversation where you can actually get the problem addressed and resolved is probably the best way to go.

Now I see a Lot of brands. And Rob, you've seen this where the brand will start a social media account, they'll have a Facebook account, and every day they post pictures of their product and some reason why you ought to buy my product. What do you think of that, Amanda?

You know, it is a form of advertising that has worked in the past, but isn't the way to do social media. And social for a brand is about humanizing your brand. So it's about making it relatable and connectable to all these different people using it. I mean, if they wanted to hear a sales pitch, they could call the company or go to the website. You go on social media to see the funny things, even some of the near misses and the failures that a brand does. You want to see the human aspect of it.

So it's a good place for a brand to develop a personality or Persona.

Absolutely.

In social media.

Absolutely. And people don't want to see all perfection on social media. They want to see the things they like about the brand. But it's also okay to be a bit silly too. That's real, that's relatable. People like that. I mean, ads are supposed to be pristine, they're supposed to sell. Social is supposed to be human and humans aren't perfect.

Yeah. I think it's better accepted now too that you have a social media voice and it can be different than the regular brand voice.

Exactly.

Tend to expect that now where most brands at least a few years ago wanted it to be consistent across all platforms, it doesn't have to be that way anymore.

And when you're putting, especially on Instagram, when you're putting up different images, I feel that a lot of brands make the mistake of putting up an image that looks the same as all the other ones they've done. It looks too salesy. And so when you're scrolling through your Instagram feed and you see that, you just assume that it's an ad. You don't click on it because it's not engaging. It's just an image. Posting lots of different kinds of images, showing the people who work for you, showing the things that you're doing in your community, the outreach you're doing. That's what people want to see on social.

Well, that's what I say. Social media is a really good place to show the softer side of the company. As far as we support this cause. We are part of the breast cancer group, we're out cleaning a park or whatever the case is, to really be able to promote those things. Even I Think it's a good idea even to promote stuff that's going on internal. You know, show your people having fun at a Christmas, at your own Christmas party, and try to humanize the brand. But I do think one of the big mistakes people do is they think it's an advertising source where I'm just going to go post reasons to buy my product.

Exactly. It's. You don't, in social need to tell people to do something. You have to lead them to it, just kind of gently. You have to make it think that, make them think that it's their idea to engage with you and buy your product and be a part of that community. With ads, you're looking for sales. With social, you're looking to build loyalty, build a following.

There are companies that I'm seeing more of, and they're typically smaller, but sometimes they're a little larger. They're using Facebook as their website as opposed to using it as a social platform. They think that Facebook can replace owning your own URL and owning a web space where you can tell your more corporate story. And that's just a gross misunderstanding of how to use that tool. We were talking about this yesterday where it was, or was it two days ago about, you know, is social media necessary for a brand? And 10 years ago, we were getting that same question, do I really need a website? Because people didn't understand how to use it. And now, which is where Amanda comes in, is just helping people understand the value, that it's a place you need to be and it's a place you need to be well and be good.

You bring up a really good point. Ten years ago, people were asking us, well, do I have to have a website? No one questions having to have a website today. And you're probably right. Social media is where the website was 10 years ago, where people are asking, should I have it? And the answer is, yes, you should have it.

But from our standpoint, it's not just about being there, which is what Amanda was talking about earlier, where you have. And we had a client that was like this a couple of years ago that had the social media platforms down and built out, but they weren't watching them constantly. And there was so much negative and it hurt them, it set them back. It's not like a website is something you can set and forget and update periodically. Social, you need to be on constantly, and it's better to have somebody else doing that for you that's not so personally attached to the brand. So they're taking comments to heart. If you have a third party, an agency or whomever, they can put some distance between themselves and the negativity or any of the firestorms that can come up.

There's another thing that happens, too, and sometimes we see clients that will say, well, we have somebody in house that's going to respond to that stuff, and the receptionist is going to stay up on that or whatever the case is.

Amanda's laughing.

And she is laughing. And the reason she's laughing is because when it becomes one of the 15 jobs that somebody internally has to do, it becomes a job that doesn't get done.

Right? Absolutely.

Because the phone ringing takes precedent over somebody posted a comment.

Right. And I think that's a really common misconception that businesses do because they think, you know, social media. I have my own account and I check it, you know, whenever I want something.

Right. Because I've got somebody who's. Who's always on Facebook all the time anyways. They must know how to do this.

It'll be so easy. It'll just be one of those jobs that you'll just add into the slew of other things that you need to do. And unfortunately, having a social media account for a brand is equivalent to getting an untrained puppy and then deciding, like, I don't want to watch it, I don't want to monitor it. I'll just let it go and it'll be fine. And then you come back and everything's a mess because it's torn into stuff. Like, you have to. You have to really spend time with your social media accounts. You really need to engage with your customers. You have to be vigilant on it, otherwise it'll reflect negatively on the brand.

And you know what you're doing. Because. So it's kind of funny that. Oh, because my receptionist is always on Facebook, she's an expert about Facebook. It's like, no. Being on Facebook no more makes you an expert on Facebook than watching the doctor's TV show is going to make you a surgeon.

Oh, yeah. I watch Grey's Anatomy so I can be a doctor.

Exactly. It's a skill set. So what are some of the things that people can do to sell products through social media? You know, we've talked about building the brand and building the Persona and answering the problems. But can we also move product?

Oh, absolutely. Social media is becoming a hub for people to actually buy products to. I mean, Facebook allows you to actually sell on Facebook if you want. Facebook has their own shop page, Instagram. Now being linked with Facebook you can do a similar thing, but you don't have to. You can still drive people to your website. And the way you do that is to get people to care about your brand, to build that following, to engage them with assets and images that people want to get involved with. They want to see user reviews. They want to see influencers using your product and talking about them. It's. I mean, think of Jenny Craig having celebrities, you know, 10 years ago, talking about how much weight they lost on Jenny Craig to get people to sign up for the program. Now, it's not necessarily about celebrities. It's just about these normal people, influencers on social media, people that followers can trust because they're kind of wild cards. They can say something awesome about your brand and they can say something horrible about your brand. But that's why people like them, because they're trustworthy.

Yeah. Because they're not considered to be being paid to do it.

Right. And these influencers will review a brand on the fly. They'll talk about them. You don't necessarily have to reach out to them and ask them to do it, hand the money to do it. People are out there talking about your product, talking about your brand. You just need to be aware of it. You have to be listening so that you can respond, so you can engage, so you can get people to see you as a person and not as just some building that's shooting out products that are, you know, selling to the masses. Look at the Girl Scouts. You want to buy from those little girls. They're cute, they're endearing, you want to support them. You can do that with social, too.

So we've got a lot of different platforms. Major platforms being Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Pinterest. Does a company have to cover all of them? What is the right ones? What's different about them?

No, you don't need to have a social account for all of them. It really depends on your product. If you have a brand or a product that is large enough, like we're talking multi million dollars, you should have, you know, at least some sort of Persona on the top three. And we're talking about Instagram, Facebook and Twitter. And those do need to be monitored. For Pinterest, you really need a product that people can see and reach out and touch, something that can be added to board, something that's visually stimulating.

So let's say that I had a beauty product.

Yes, that would be great for Pinterest. People can leave reviews on it. They can add it to their boards of products. They want to use for their wedding day or for prom. You have a lot of different facets.

That you can use. Here's the best way to use this eye makeup or styles to different hairstyles with this hair styling gel or whatever the case is.

Right. But like going back to like a hemorrhoid cream, probably not something that you really want to see a whole lot of images of on Pinterest. Pretty visual.

So let's say that I'm dealing with some type of nutritional supplement or over the counter medication. What would be the right type of platforms for that?

Depends what it's for. If you're talking about nutrition, something that has to do with diet, health and wellness, those are really big things right now. You could absolutely utilize all four of those social media platforms, but in different ways. Twitter would probably be the least engagement you're going to get because if you have something regarding health and wellness, you are open to a lot of different ways to advertise that to engage with your followers. You can show people with your product out and about doing things. Transformation pictures, before and after testimonials, things that you can add assets to that will get a lot of followings. You can use keywords and hashtags to get your brand in front of other people. Looking for the same things with Twitter, Twitter is much more conversational.

It's very immediate.

Yeah. A lot less about the images. So if you're trying to sell a product and you really want to sell different images, different lifestyle assets with it, Twitter is probably not your best, your best place to do that.

And then what about Instagram?

Instagram is becoming the go to platform. It used to be Facebook, but Instagram is now the up and coming most popular platform out there. It used to be just pictures, you know, less about what you're feeling and thinking that day and more about what you're experiencing. And brands are now starting to get that and figuring out that you can humanize your brand really well with a inspiring image of some sort of.

So we're talking about Facebook. One of the misconceptions that some clients have is that the only people on social media are under 25 years old. That certainly isn't the case today.

No.

Would Facebook probably be the. Would you call Facebook the oldest of the platforms as far as demographically?

Yes. Yes, I would probably because Facebook has been around long enough that there's multiple generations that are actively using it still. Instagram is newer. Twitter, I believe, has really gone through a growth within the last five years. And there's a bunch of different kinds of users. Obviously a lot of political figures and celebrities use Twitter.

President Trump has established Twitter.

Yes. Yes. So he is.

Whether you like him or not, he has dominated Twitter.

And news is a huge thing on Twitter too. Like if you want up to date stuff, Twitter is the place to go. But it's the fastest moving of the three. So you could look at your feed and refresh it and have to go two or three scrolls down to find that one tweet that you were looking for. Because it's updating so so quickly. With Instagram and Facebook, it moves a little bit more slowly. Facebook probably the slowest. People are still updating you about their day, about their children. Facebook is becoming, I believe, less engaging than the other two.

Well, Facebook, if I was selling a product, let's say my customer base was 45 plus or 55 plus. Is Facebook the place I'm going?

Then Facebook would probably be your best bet. Yes. I do believe though, even though that you are looking at an older demographic, it would be wise to establish your brand on places like Twitter and Instagram. Maybe not update it as often, but definitely keep an eye on it. Because the younger generations now are going to be your clients soon. You want them to know about your brand when they get to that age.

But that 45, 55 person, that 65 year old, 70 year old grandma, she's on Facebook, she's looking at pictures of the grandkids so she can keep up with where the kids and where the grandkids are. And you're seeing a lot of action there. But that older demo is probably not over at Instagram. Instagram's really a little more younger. If we were chasing a younger demo.

Yeah, Instagram's definitely a younger demo and it's evolving a bit. You are seeing older people on Instagram, but it's not nearly as popular for an older generation as Facebook is. They've been on Facebook longer, they understand it more.

And Twitter seems to cover the whole gamut, age wise. Yes, it seems like you've got kids on Twitter and you've got 80 year olds on Twitter. Twitter seems to be very topic driven to me. More than age driven.

Yeah, Twitter is definitely topic driven. Again, it's a lot coming at you really fast. So there are some people that. That's not their scene. They are not people who tweet. They don't put their own things up there, but they like to see it happen, they like to watch it happen. They like to see what the headlines are and what people are talking about. So even if you're not necessarily engaging on Twitter, most people have a Twitter account and go on there.

See, I rarely go on Facebook. I find Facebook just to be boring.

It's a bit boring now with the other options available.

Yeah, because it just, it's just everybody putting up memes and photos and it's just so slow. Where Twitter to me is just rapid. It's just fast.

Yeah, it's like a stream of consciousness.

And 20 new things come in in 10 seconds.

Yes.

Where Facebook is just slow and lagging now, the, the way the platforms operate has changed big time. So it used to be if you had 10,000 followers and you put your post on Twitter, or not Twitter, but on Facebook and you had 10,000 followers, then your post would go out to your 10,000 followers.

Right.

Okay. Today if I have 10,000 followers and I put a post up, how many people will see that post?

Those 10,000 followers as well as, I mean, depends, are you using hashtags or not? Because that'll get it in front of people too. But the followers of your followers are now going to have access to it as well.

Right. But I'm referring to more that the way how Facebook is now trimming down. How many people get to see it because they now want you to pay.

They want you to pay. So Facebook is limiting the reach, the organic reach that a post is gonna have because now they have found, all platforms have found that people will pay good money to put that post in front of more people. And you can monitor it a little bit better that way too.

You're putting money, it's what, around 2 to 6% that actually see it?

Yeah, it's.

There's an algorithm I understand, based on how popular it is.

Based on how popular it is. Again, the keywords, the hashtags, the things that you're using will get it in front of more people. But just an ordinary post isn't going to have the reach that it used to.

So you put something on Twitter, let's say, or on Facebook, let's say you have 100 followers and you're a business, not an individual, and you post something on your business page, you have 100 people there. Probably two to six people are going to get to see it. Now they can go to your page and see it, but for it to appear in their feedback. Yeah, it's only going to be somewhere around two to six people.

Yeah, I mean, it might be more, but you're probably close to the number there.

So even though a few years back there, there have been. There have been a few brands that have launched their consumer brand in social media because they did outrageous things and they did outrageous videos and stuff. But even those opportunities have changed now because now when you put those posts out, as you said, they realize you're not an individual, you're a company.

Yes.

So we want you to spend money to post it.

Correct.

Now, by the way, if you're a celebrity, then you're going to reach everybody. Because social media is very celebrity driven. And it's in social media's best interest to let people see what Kim Kardashian's having for lunch.

Exactly. Guessing it's not a lot. She looks hungry.

But regardless of what she's eating, it's in their best interest because people want to see that. But if Kim Kardashian was selling her shoe line, she's going to need to put money into that machine to get those tweets or those Facebook posts to go out.

Absolutely.

So no matter what we do, when we look at this, I think one of the things people need to understand, it's not a free advertising platform.

No. And you need to be there. I mean, I think the key takeaways of this is you need to be there. It's not free like we used to.

It's not a set it and forget it platform.

But I think we have to understand that it's not posted. Like you said, set it and forget it. Post some stuff. And all of a sudden, I've got this free ad platform. It's not free because you have to put a lot of time and effort into it. And it's not free because in today's world, you're going to have to pay.

To boost these posts and the time and energy it takes to get something running. And Amanda can speak a little bit more to this, but you've always said something that I think is a great way to put it. If you don't have a following, you're yelling into an empty room.

Yes.

And that's. That's key to social media being successful. You need to build that audience, which takes a lot of work.

Yeah, it does. It takes. Takes a lot of work. And I think people believe that they can just. It's just that easy. You're going to put your brand on the social media, and by the next day, you're going to make, you know, 2 million sales and you're going to have all these followers. But it's not about that. You really do need to build your community. You got to reach out to people. That you want to actually be buying your product, you need to engage them and you also need to be very vigilant on keeping up with your competition on social media.

So real quick, how do you build that following? So if a client comes into you and they don't have a social media presence and they're selling, let's say they have a beauty product right now, they have no followers or they have 1000 followers. How do you build that following?

Well, one of the best ways is obviously you have to research, you know, you need to find out what keywords and hashtags is going to put your brand in front of the people that would want to buy it. So hashtag beauty makeup, hashtag eyeliner, things that are going to, or it might.

Even be like wedding day.

Wedding day. Like the things that you really want people to start thinking about and associating your product with. But you need to also look at your top competition on these social media channels and see who is following them, see what they are doing. And you need to really stay on top of that because you don't want to copy your competition, but you also want to reach out to the same type of followers. So building that community involves getting yourself in front of people with. You really do need great imagery, you need good content, you need good keywords. And then you also need to have a good landing page, a website to drive these people back to, to buy your product. Everything has to work together.

So if I was talking about my beauty product and I was talking about, let's say I had some photographs of some beautiful brides using this makeup, then I would post something about wedding day. I would use a hashtag, you know, wedding day. So then other people are now out looking at those hashtags and they come across my post. So they weren't looking for me, they were looking for information about weddings.

Yes.

Or class reunion or you know, whatever, New Year's Eve party, whatever the case is. I'm keywording this and hashtagginess so I can bring people into my universe. And then they need to see something that they find attractive, which is not just a sales pitch. It needs to be something more. Like, these guys are cool. I get these guys. This is a cool brand. I'm going to follow these people and.

Utilizing other brands too. Like if you are selling a beauty product and you have models wearing Vera Wang wedding dresses, bag Vera Wang in it, get in front of her followers, give a shout out to her and her beautiful dresses, say, hey, don't these models look great in These dresses with our product on their face. It's a way to utilize another brand's following without being their competition, without stepping on their toes, giving a shout out to them, working with them and their followers.

So I think the bottom line is you have to be there. It's a lot more complicated than people.

Think it is.

And it takes a lot of work. It takes a tremendous amount of work. The upside of it for the brands is if you're a brand with a hundred thousand followers, that's your own. It's almost like your own TV network.

Yes. Yeah.

You've cultivated your own media at that point. So you are creating a universe or you're creating a tribe.

Yeah. You have your own solar system of.

People that are loyal to your brand that you have the ability to talk to. The last thing I'm going to throw at people here and Rob, you might have some input on this. Sometimes when you build these social media followings, they become a tremendous source of free market research.

Absolutely.

You can source ideas, information. I know one of our clients did that. As far as what colors they were going to produce in their line, it was good way to, you know, check the pulse and see where you need to go or see if you're doing something right with your product or your messaging.

Right. Tell us, tell us new ways you use our product that we never thought of.

It's a very natural way to crowdsource innovation. Yeah.

You can learn a lot about your customers through the social media. And you'll. And what you'll learn is you'll learn that people are using your products in ways you didn't know. And you'll find that they have other applications you didn't know. You'll find that there's other people out there that you didn't know that were in your demographic that all of a sudden you find, well, look at this group over here, seems to really like my product. I had no idea. And I'll give you an example of one of these. We had a hair care product where it was like a super hold hairspray and hair gel. And they found out through social media that they were like the favorite hairspray amongst the punk rock group because it was so solid that it could cement their hair. So all of a sudden they've got this new niche of selling their hairspray to the punk rock crowd because of the hairstyle. So, I mean, you can learn a lot about your customers. Any last thoughts from either one of you?

Well, just going on that. Another thing that brands, I think Brands really need to start doing more of and you see really successful brands doing it is acknowledging your following. Someone tags you in a post in their story and they're saying something great about it. Don't just like it. Retweet it, you know, repost it, put it on your story, Give a shout out to them, Give photo credit to some of your brand or some of your followers that are using your brand and tagging you in it. You'll get in front of their followers that way and you'll expand your reach.

Yeah, I mean, from the media. It's all about interaction and engagement. And if you use the little click or heart or whatever, the icon, thumb up, heart, whatever, you're missing a huge opportunity to engage with somebody who is voluntarily saying something about voluntarily coming to your brand. It's a big miss, huge opportunity to grow your voice and grow your brand.

And you can do research into like more than just seeing what the demographic is. Take a look at some of your followers pages, see what their following is, utilize that. Tag them in something, tell them thank you. You know, get in front of their audience as well. They're going out of their way to say something great about your brand. You know, use that. Use that for your sales for your benefit.

As we build your own universe, as you start to build your own following, there's another thing we can do, and this is more on the paid side of social media. But let's say you have 10,000 followers. We can create a picture of those 10,000 followers. So we can use your actual customers to say, this is our customer now. We can build a campaign that says, go find me people who look exactly like these people.

Yeah. You can pull analytics reports to tell you the nitty gritty of all of your followers. You know where they're located, you know, the general area, the age group, man or woman. Like there's lots of things that you can pull and then utilize either on social more or even in digital or traditional aspects of advertising.

Well, Amanda, thanks for being with Rob and I here on CPG Insiders. If you have any questions for social media, you can always reach out to talk to someone here at Jekyll and Hyde Advertising. You can talk to Amanda just go to our website, which is jekyllhyde labs.com Correct. Or to CB or to CPG insiders.com youm can reach us through there.

There are links back to the site. It's probably an easier one to spell out.

Absolutely. And that's it till the next episode. Thanks for listening. If you're looking to greatly increase sales on your CPG product, don't hesitate to contact us at Jekyll and Hyde Advertising and Marketing, by the way, the only advertising agency with a guaranteed result. Just go to jekyllhideagency.com or feel free to give us a call at 800542.

Sam.