Is The State of Presence Devoid of Emotional Content?

Sometimes when I hear you talk about presence, it seems like you are describing a state in which there is no mental or emotional content. And yet I experience emotions in presence. Perhaps sadness. When something happens that is difficult for another person, or at the news of the death of someone I love and I experience that emotion happening in present time. Isn't it possible for emotional experiences to arise in presence? Yes, you can have presence while the emotions are happening, or while, even while thoughts are happening. It means you're not totally lost in, totally identified with, totally drawn into the emotion or the thought. There is in the background a space of awareness that in the foreground there may be anger, sadness. And you are not totally lost in it. There's a space for it that you still sense. And you are essentially not the emotion, you're the awareness behind the emotion. You know that this emotion is there. The same thing can happen when the mind is active. You can talk and the mind can completely take over. And you become lost in your mind in a stream, either a stream of thinking or a stream of speaking. You can observe it. If you can't yet observe the mind stream in yourself. You can occasionally just quietly observe people talking to each other and especially people who are having a discussion. Because when you're having a usual discussion or disagreeing about something, there is not only the mind, there is also an emotion that goes with the mind stream. That's the disagreement. Why is there an emotion when people are having a discussion and they disagree? Why is there an emotion that goes with their mental positions? Well, because they identified with a mental position. That identify means their sense of self has become one with the thought. The consciousness, the I has identified with the form. Rather than realizing that it is formless. In essence, it has lost that knowledge. So consciousness is in a dreamlike state. Consciousness identifies with I, with the form. And so there is a self identification with a mental position or thought, which means anybody who questions or doubts or contradicts this mental position or thought is unconsciously regarded by the self identified thought structure which you have become. The ego is part of ego. Anybody who disagrees, contradicts, doubts, is unconsciously, not in so many words, but unconsciously regarded as an enemy. Because you are threatening. It's a delusion. But there's an unconscious belief that the other person is threatening my very being because the person is threatening my mental position with which I have identified. So you can. It's a very deeply unconscious process and it requires quite an alertness to see it in the moment that it happens in yourself. But perhaps Next time somebody comes to you and you're having a kind of disagreement about something. And suddenly you can feel an influx as you defend your position or contradict the other person or justify something, feel the emotion that flows into what you say. It will be some kind of either aggressive or defensive emotion that goes with it. Either some fear or some aggression. If you can be aware of that at that moment and realize what is happening, that you have identified with something in your mind believing that that is you, believing your very existence is threatened by somebody contradicting you, it's unconscious. That's why people get aggressive and negative energy flows. The moment somebody contradicts you, it just means somebody has a different opinion. But the ego can't allow a different opinion. Because the ego, its existence is threatened by a different opinion. Because ego's identification with thought and a mental position, this is on a personal level, this can become an entire war between nations, this similar pattern. So you can at first, you can see it. Let's say you're observing two people having a discussion and of course say you are not involved. Then it's easier for you to see that process at work and realize that usually both of them become drawn into a very negative confrontation simply because they hold different opinions. But for them, it's more than an opinion. It's their very self that's threatened. It's an illusion, but that's how it is perceived. So it's very fundamental and very basic to the huge amount of conflict that arises in human interactions. And it's basically so simple that it's just quite incomprehensible that people haven't realized by now that this is how it works. But the pattern is so deep seated that even people who are engaged in spiritual work for years still get drawn into that when their mental position is threatened. No matter how much spirituality there they are defending their very existence. Because the pattern is very deep. So alertness is required. If you don't want to carry on in that way for the rest of your life and be part of that madness, ultimately dysfunction, ultimately, because it creates continuous conflict and negative feelings and so on. And interferes with the true relationship with another human being. Be aware in yourself of this process when and as it happens. And for that you have to wait until the moment comes when somebody contradicts you or says no, you're not right, or I don't agree, or whatever they say. And then you have to be alert. What is it that comes up and wants to defeat the other or protect itself? So that is very Vital thing. But presence is required. The pattern is deep, very deep seated. Without the presence each time, every time it will take you over and you'll be lost. So alertness. I can't remember what the question was, but this is vital. Ah yes. Sometimes when I hear you talk about presence, it seems like you are describing a state in which there is no mental or emotional content. And yet I experience emotions in presence. So we have been talking now just about experiencing the absence of presence. And there is a mental emotional stream that comes up. You can do it to yourself. Also you can have a discussion with yourself, you can doubt yourself, you can have an argument with yourself. You can have one part of your mind accusing another part of your mind of being lazy, for example, of being not good enough. And then you have to have a similar argument with one part of you. Your mind splits itself into two and says you should know better by now, you should do better. Why did you do this? You did well. I couldn't help it. No presence. So yes, there can be presence when there are thoughts and emotions. And it is vital that there should be presence in the background. Which means just you're aware that certain emotions are coming through you and you are not the emotion but you're the awareness. You're aware that certain thoughts are there, you're aware that you have an opinion, you're aware that you're voicing your opinion, that's fine, but you are not in the opinion. Your sense of self isn't in the opinion. Your sense of self is the awareness. And then you can express an opinion and you can say the universe is in essence consciousness. And then the other person says that's a load of rubbish or whatever they say. Mumbo jumbo. You are talking mumbo jumbo. Where is the show me the consciousness or whatever the flat footed materialist is saying to you. And then observe, see whether you actually know that you the universe, which means you ultimately comes down to you as this is where you experience the universe as yourself. Do you know that the universe is consciousness or do you just believe that the universe at that moment are you the consciousness or are you the belief that you are conscious? If you are the belief then you are the thought and then you will be defending yourself. So you'll be shouting back at the other person, they are narrow minded bigots or there is an awareness in the background and then you say the universe is conscious, the other person there is a load of rubbish. Then you say, well I'm sure in your perception that the universe is not consciousness. That's fine. Why should you believe that if that's not within your reality? Find you are entitled to believing that the universe is a soup of chemicals. That's your reality. I'm perfectly comfortable to allow you your reality of living in a soup of chemicals or whatever atoms floating around whatever it is, or the gray matter of the brain producing the illusion of consciousness or whatever. Fine. No defensiveness anymore and no negative feelings. This is why I liked when Obama said you don't need to be disagreeable to disagree. You don't need to become disagreeable when you disagree. The deeper implication is you're not identified with your mental position. He couldn't say that because nobody would understand what he's talking about. So well, only some people would understand. There's awareness in the background, so presence or awareness is there while things happen in the foreground. The foreground can be your thoughts, the foreground can be your emotions. The foreground can be whatever is happening around you. And so your perceptions of whatever is happening outside. There's also, you're not perceiving through the screen of concepts or thoughts, you're perceiving through. You are the awareness, not the thoughts. And even if a thought comes and says that person looks weird, then you just realize it's just a thought in your head. And when you're finally communicating with that person, you can still be the awareness and communicate as awareness rather than communicate as if the thought this person is weird were the reality. Ureas is just a thought that came into the head. And you don't impose the thought on the person and then relate to that person as if it were true. And you say, and suddenly you're talking to this weird person. What are you going to. Everything. It'll distort everything. Or you want something, but the thought says, this person could be helpful to me. Or whatever the ego says, that's a thought. Be there as the spacious presence. Now the question is, yes, of course there can be presence while thoughts happen or emotions happen, including sadness or anger. But the questioner asks, it seems like you are describing a state in which there is no mental or emotional content. There is also the possibility of presence becoming so intensified at times that all thoughts and emotions become obliterated. This is very different from suppressing emotions or thoughts. It's simply that the presence that arises becomes so intense that thoughts or emotions don't arise. And usually it could happen in a limit situation, as existentialist philosophers call it, when life or death situation could happen. That presence sometimes can become so intense or it can become for no reason at all, it can happen. And you're simply sitting in your room and suddenly there's no thought whatsoever. There's no emotion. There's just an intense aliveness. It's not. You haven't deadened yourself, because that is, sometimes people believe if you have no emotion, you're dead. You haven't deadened yourself. There's an intense aliveness, a different kind of aliveness than the emotion, a vibrantly alive field of intense consciousness. So that can arise sometimes, and it's beautiful. I sometimes spend periods of time without thought and without emotion. And it's beautiful. Nature walking around nature. Or with nothing particular to think about, why think? Or sitting in a cafe drinking a cup of coffee, why think? Just be the alert presence. So you have the presence can be there without thought and emotion. At times that will happen. Or presence can be there as a background to whatever emotions or thoughts are there. And presence can be lost completely, in which case all you have is thoughts and emotions. And you will believe that you are the thought and the emotion. That's the unconscious state. So for us, it's important to be there as the emotions happen. And I suggest you work particularly with people, talking to people, exchange of opinions and viewpoints, observing aggression, observing defensiveness, observing negativity flowing into just because somebody has not the same opinion that you have. And then don't condemn yourself and say, oh, I shouldn't be feeling this. No, just again, observe that. Observe that. Suddenly you've become angry with this person. And instead of saying, oh, dear, I failed miserably in my spiritual practice. No, just say, okay, I just noticing that you're no longer in it. You're already out of it when you notice it. So be compassionate with yourself. But the important thing is you're aware. So we all know the famous joke about the person. When you tell the person, why are you so angry? The person says, I am not angry. And that's of course, a typical example of somebody who doesn't know, has absolutely no awareness in the middle of anger, denies that there's anger.