AI Marketing Loops That You Should Build Today

I was testing GPT-Sol 5.6, which came out last week. It's their latest frontier model versus Claude Fable 5. But before I go into that, Neil, earlier you were just talking about token maxing and all that, right?

Yeah.

I don't know if anybody on your team's doing this. I'm sure someone is, but the move now, if you want to save on tokens, is you're running something like an OpenRouter, which will route the different models. And maybe 5% of the time you're using a Sol 5.6 or Fable 5, which burns a lot of tokens. burns a lot of tokens. And then maybe 80% of the time you're using like an open model, like a GLM 5.2. And then yesterday, I think an American model or like a non-Chinese open model came out called Thinking Machines. They released it. So the move is to use something like that. And then maybe 15% of the time you're using like a ChatGPT 5.5 or Opus 4.8. And then by doing that, you're kind of having a good balance. And then the open router knows how to kind of route. The funny thing is, Neil, we're talking to— so at that dinner, one guy has almost like an individual CFO AI, okay? So it'll show you like, oh, how should I be saving money like a wealthy person? How should I handle my taxes like a wealthy person? It has all your connectors, right? All your bank accounts and things like that, right? And so he was like, yeah, we can't use open models. I was like, why can't you use open models? He's like, well, when you use the Chinese ones, because the Chinese ones are the best right now, He's like, they start to— you start to ask questions and they start to give you like communist responses, right? So, oh, you should just give your wealth away, right? Or like, oh, we don't look at it that way, right? They start to become very political responses. So he's like, yeah, for us, we can't use that right now. So we have to use the frontier ones. But I think, you know, looking at organizations like yours and mine, you know, you're going to have to have someone that's responsible for token optimization.

Dude, straight up. And then you went to 2 conferences, right? The second one was a social media conference.

I'm speaking at that Social Commerce Summit right after this. So I'm getting an Uber right after this and I'm going straight to speak.

Ah, so it was actually pretty good that I came on time for once.

Yes. Yes. It's pretty— well, I mean, Neil's, to be fair, Neil's usually not that bad. He's usually like, if he's late, he's like 3 minutes late.

It's not that bad. Yeah. But the worst is when I'm 3 minutes late in my own house.

Yeah. That's the worst. Yeah. And then he comes in on the phone too. And then I'm like, he comes in late. He's still on the phone right now. But anyway, yeah, that's the next conference.

Dude, it was so funny. So yesterday I'm recording videos in my house. So AJ, who Eric worked with in the past, Single Grain back in the day, does a lot of my video recording. So he comes in here with his brother, they're a team, and they have another third person and a few other employees who do like editing and stuff. So AJ comes into my house and all of a sudden, you know, I'm just on the phone. I'm, You know, trying to do some business deals. I'm like, you recording? He's like, no. I'm like, cool. So I get back to the business deals and I'm trying to close them. Then we record 3 or 4 videos, get a call from someone that I'm trying to close a deal with. I pick up the mic, I take off the mic. I'm like, we'll redo it. And then, you know, rinse and repeat. But I think I did that to him like 3 or 4 times in 2 hours. So—

Wow.

Yeah.

Did he say anything about it?

We didn't get as much as we wanted done. And then the England-Argentina game was starting, so I gave him and his brother lunch. So they were very happy because their bellies were full. And then I have a theater, so I was like, you guys want to watch the game here? They're like, sure. So they loved it and they were happy, and that probably made them forgive the time that I wasted during Hey, beauty's in the eye of the beholder.

To them, maybe you wasted, but to you, it was not wasteful.

Yeah.

Okay. So one thing I want to talk about, because what I talked about at Moz, and what I'm gonna be talking about today too, is this whole thought around, you know, sure, you can talk about AI all you want, but none of it's helpful unless the knowledge compounds. And a lot of people are talking about, you They're talking about skills, they're talking about evals, and the latest thing is loops. So I want to talk about some AI marketing loops that you can use and some that we actually have live right now. But first, I want to explain what a loop is. So when people at Claude or OpenCLAW talk about how they don't prompt anymore and what a loop is, what a loop ultimately is, it's a workflow that compounds. It's a workflow that learns off of itself, right? So the whole idea is, I might say that, oh, my target state, my goal is to get all of my pages on my website to 50 milliseconds. Now, the current state right now is 150 milliseconds. So the difference between that, 150 minus 50, it's 100 milliseconds, right? And so the whole idea is that the— that loop can continue to observe over time and it knows how to improve and make tweaks to it. And so I want to make this clear for everyone because I think everyone needs to be able to build be building loops. The other thing is we have our Loops Creator skill available on skillsdojo.com. So I bought skillsdojo.com and it's public to everyone. You can have your profile there. Neil can have his profile. It'll probably have no skills on it, but everyone can make a profile, right? So go get that Loops Creator skill. You should start making loops, but I'm going to give you some ideas here on what you could actually do. So let me share my screen in terms of what you can do. So here's my screen. So Here are a few marketing loops that we actually have live. So here's a CRO loop. So one that optimized the conversion rate on a site by 30% by the next 4 weeks, right? And the connectors you have might be Google Analytics 4, Gong. That's one example of a CRO loop. And I'm actually running this right now on singlebrain.com. If you go to singlebrain.com, there's actually a test that's running that this thing came up with. And I'll show you the little tweaks that it made. The other thing that I've kind of called out on this podcast already, Is this Mr. Siu sponsorship loop, right? So I personally get about 20 sponsorship requests a week. I don't want to deal with them, nor do I want my team dealing with them. So therefore, I reply saying everyone's— my minimums are $25K and handles it back and forth until they say yes or go away. I prefer the second one, the go away piece. But the best part is that they all report back on how they get better after each iteration. So it's like, oh, here's the tunings that we made today. Here's the tunings that we made. So it's constantly getting better. And it figures out what, how it should adjust the email responses based on what a lot of people are asking for. And then we have this AEO SEO loop that will ingest my content, my call transcripts, and look for TOFU, MOFU, BOFU content angles, and then draft it in the CMS. And then we use ClickFlow API for that to draft the content. And then we use Syed's WP Vibe MCP for WordPress. And then we have these other connectors. So my point in saying all this is that you can use these loops But I just want you to think about how does this apply to your business? What paid media loops can you make? What ad creative loops can you make? What SMS loops can you make? What email loops can you make? And then once you build the first one, you'll never look back. And then, you know, my whole thing now is I'm trying to get more people on my team to do this, but it's like pulling teeth sometimes. So just wanted to share that.

Cool. By the way, you know, Eric is in New York. You're in New York for the conference, investors, and then you go to Rome, right? I go to—

no, I fly to Milan on Friday.

Milan. All right. From New York?

Yeah.

Okay. So you go to Milan. Question for you is, do you tend to do your meetups and stuff when you're in other countries like Italy or no?

I think if I'm speaking at a conference, yes, but this one's vacation. So I don't think any meetups are going to happen in Lake Como.

Oh, so you're not really staying in Milan, you're just flying into Milan?

Flying into Milan, correct.

Got it. So during the vacation, how many hours are you gonna work?

I don't know. I mean, I can't stop myself from working. It's too— it's too fun.

So— You should try taking some time off. I think the best thing I did was go on a cruise ship.

Well, you were forced to take time off. I mean, I probably won't work that much, but for recruiting calls, I'll take them because, you know, it's a— that's a time thing.

Yeah, dude, the same. While we were actually doing this podcast, I was messaging someone for recruiting and they responded back to me. I'm like, oh, let me set up a call right away.

Yeah. And that's a big lesson. I think we should talk about that because you might think like, you know, you might have people that said, oh, we'll meet with you in a week or 2 weeks or whatever. But like, again, each week is 2% in a year. Like, why would you do that? Just meet right now and get it over with. Because those recruiting calls, they want to talk to you. Like, you'll know within the first 15 minutes if you want to work with this person or not.

Yeah. The hardest part that I end up having is when I get an email from someone and they just shoot me an email and I'm trying to do a deal, I tend to just pick up the phone and call them based on the number I have in the email and try to do it right then and there. But a lot of people don't like that. Most people want things scheduled.

Well, okay. I actually, I think that I've always said that's a strength of yours, Neil, So, and I think it actually gets you a lot more than like the people that complain. So what percent of people actually complain about it?

Uh, less like 1%. It's not that many.

Worth the trade-off?

Yeah, yeah, I still do it. I can't—

How much more has that gotten you in life? Because it's not something I do, but I think it's something that's very helpful. I just, it's just not in my personality to do that.

Dude, so I'll give you an example from yesterday. Uh, I started going through my email.

Real quick, if you want to acquire customers faster and more efficiently this year with the latest strategies and tactics, then check out singlegrain.com. That is my ad agency. Again, www.singlegrain.com. Check it out. And if it seems like a fit, we'll get in touch and help you with a free marketing plan.

People who introduced me to potential clients that never followed up. All right. So. I literally started calling, like no joke. I started calling and I think I got through like 18 calls. Out of 18 calls, I got ahold of 3 people, okay? Out of the 3 people, one was like, oh yeah, we're actually going to be putting out an RFP for marketing really soon. We have a $30 million ad budget. This is great timing. And I was like, cool, where are you based? And they're like, oh, we're in San Francisco. I'm like, cool, I'll fly to San Francisco. My team can fly to meet you. And they're like, oh, we should do it. They're like, what works for you in August? And now we're already going back and forth on it by just calling. Now, I could have had AI go look for all those emails, but I already knew the main ones that people send me, like who are the main people that send me intros. I just look up their name and I just go through the threads to see if they ever responded. But today in like afternoon, I have a lunch meeting, but right after that I'll go back to calling all the ones that didn't answer.

I think you should do both, right? I'm not talking about you. I'm just— I think for people you do both. I think one, you do it manually, but then you have the AI that's constantly once a month, it's looking at all the deals that maybe stalled out or you didn't follow up with. Because I, for me, I need a reminder. I'm not as detail-oriented as Neil. Neil's like very high on detail-oriented. I think like 90+%— I'm 6%. So it's, I need both to keep me going. But, um, I, again, whether it's to do a deal or whether it's to recruit someone, the move is to get on the phone sooner than later and not wait to set up a call. By the way, I think it's a huge red flag if you're trying to recruit someone who's more senior or a leader, And they book on your calendar 1 to 2 weeks out, I'm like, what are you doing? Right? The will is not there. And then therefore that's a red flag. Yeah.

And then also when I cold call people to try to get deals, I do not leave messages because what I found is if you leave messages, at least with my personality type, I want to get ahold of people. And then if people I don't get ahold of, I leave messages and they keep calling, they're more likely to get irritated. But because I didn't leave a message, They probably don't know who I am. So eventually they answer and they don't get irritated as much.

What percent of people do you call that actually know who you are?

Like that I'm randomly cold calling?

Uh-huh.

In, for marketing or for business deals as well? Like business deals, like it could be finance.

Business deals, I feel like it's way higher. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

In marketing it's really high. Call it like 60, 70%. Uh-huh. Uh, in business, maybe like 5%?

Really?

Uh-huh. Wait, wait, wait, wait.

Let's clear this up for people. So when you say doing deals, I assume you mean M&A deals, correct?

No, I'm talking about deals like, let's say I want more line of credit from a bank and, you know, something like that. Something random like that, like 5%.

Okay. So marketing, it's 60, 70%. Yeah.

If it's an M&A deal, Probably 60, 70% as well, if not maybe higher.

Okay. Well, there you go, guys. The branding that Neil's been doing for quite a while now, that pays off. Yeah.

It does pay off when you're doing deals. People take the phone calls, they're much more flexible. I'll give a real-life example of this. So I had an agency that I wanted to buy in 2024. It's 2026 now, depending on when you're listening to this. They wanted some unrealistic number and they were just like, we're going to change because of AI and we're going to grow so much faster, way more profit. You guys know the pitch. I kept in touch with them and they kept in touch with me. I typically always keep in touch with anyone that I reach out to, especially if they have a good business. If they have a crap business, sadly, I don't really keep too much in touch. And as I kept in touch, they kept growing but not getting what they're looking for. And then I kept in touch and I was like, I'm like, so, you know, how's life? And then they were responding and then they have some financial issues. They've had it for a while. So the company's healthy, but when you take on debt and you owe money, in many cases, even if the founder has a good business, they don't get to make any money because you have to pay off the debt first. So I was like, look, I'm like, how's your debt? You still have it? We're paying it off, but we have another year or so. I was like, so why not just do a deal? If I do a deal and give you cash upfront, you'll make money, you'll pay off your debt, and then you can make money over the next few years. And they're like, we need to get to X number. And I'm like, but your business isn't worth X number. And they're like, what if we just make more profit? And I'm like, sure, I can do an earnout where if you make that profit, I'll give you X dollar amount. But if you don't, I can't give it to you because it's just unrealistic. And they're like, all right, let's do it. And I was like, sounds good. Let's have our team look at all the numbers again, just make sure there's no hair on the deal, like you're not getting sued or anything. But assuming all is good, we should have no problem closing the deal. And it's just by staying in touch. Most of my deals that I get, it's always from staying in touch. If I look at most of our M&A, I never get the deal the first time I try to get the deal. I tend to get the deal on the second or third time. Because people come to reality with how things are going. You know, there was a company in Mexico that I tried buying really hard and the guy's just like, we're going to grow so much because of influencers. We're going to, you know, we're going to get, we're just going to do extremely well. And it was a creative agency and they worked with some of the biggest brands in Latin America. Amazing work. And then the guy didn't end up hitting the numbers from influencer marketing, this new service that he was adding on. Then he said he's not worried about AI, they're going to do so much better. Then he had to end up making changes to a lot of his senior leadership because they didn't adapt with AI and they've been flat. I know I can turn that company around because I can cross-sell their services to a lot of my customers. We do have creative globally, but they do different types of creative, not just digital. You know, there's creative like boots and billboards or experience stuff where people bring out a digital truck. And, you know, do a marketing campaign right when people are walking in for the FIFA game in Mexico City, right? So they do some different types of creative stuff that we don't do. And I just look at it and I was like, you would grow faster being under our agency. We can pay you, but I can't pay you on the numbers that you were doing 6, 7 years ago. It's just unrealistic.

You know, this is no different than going back to the follow-up thing. This is no different than dating as well. So You might not get who you're looking for, but it takes a couple of shots. And the same thing, this is why John Maxwell says the fortune is in the follow-up, right? Usually, you're not going to get on the first shot. Maybe they might go with somebody else, but people end up respecting the person that doesn't go away. You're almost continually pestering them, and then maybe not— as long as you're not annoying, it's okay, right? So maybe you don't want to pester them, but you're constantly following up. And inevitably, they're going to be like, to Neil's point earlier, oh, Timing is really good right now. We actually have an RFP. Oh, actually, yeah, we're going to sack our agency right now. We're going to work, like we're down to have a conversation with you. But a lot of this is just a series of conversations, which is why Neil might've said he only makes like one of these like outreaches a couple months ago, right? But reality, he's making like 20+ calls a day, probably more than that. Neil, you probably make more than like, probably like 40+ calls a day, knowing you.

No, I don't think I make 40+ calls a day or anywhere near that. But It has to be more than 20, but it's definitely not 40. Are you talking about the people I'm trying to do deals with, or are you talking about to team members?

In general, overall.

Yeah, I do over 40 a day. I thought you meant just like cold outreach. I'm like, yeah, there's no way I do 40.

No, 20 is already a lot. Like, first of all, 20 is a lot, okay? So like, you might be thinking as a founder right now, or a marketer listening to this, yeah, I have nothing else to do today. I think I'm done with work. It was like, no, you could— have you made 20 calls today? Have you even made 5 calls today, right? And then the other thing is, if you're calling your team members, keeping that rotation going, you're staying connected with your team members because you're not in an office environment. And so even if you spend— because when you call me, it's usually like very, very quick, like 2 to 5 minutes or so. But that 2 to 5 minutes, especially if you're calling your team members, they really respect that and they feel more connected to you. And I think that's a good retention mechanism too.

Yeah. But, and it's also, if you can't stay in touch with your team and all the people you're doing deals with, then They're going to leave you. Why should they work with you? What's the point of working with people if you're not going to stay in touch and figure out how to help them?

Yeah.

That's it. Thank you guys for listening in. We'll see you tomorrow.