This content was created by Eric Siu. This content was uploaded by Eric Siu. This is a YouTube interview titled "Books Are a Waste of Time | Leila Hormozi" (created 2024-06-14). The excerpt records a dialogue between entrepreneur Leila Hormozi and an interviewer (labeled "Speaker B"). They discuss company-building and people operations—how Leila approaches hiring, culture, and leadership at acquisition.com and lessons from building Gym Launch—arguing for learning-by-doing and first-principles thinking over consuming popular business books, experiments in people management, and her views on mentorship. Metadata includes a YouTube thumbnail and the 2024-06-14 creation timestamp.
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I realized that there was so much bad advice that I was taking in through a lot of media I was consuming. I feel like I learned much more through doing rather than consuming these fluffy bullshit books. I feel like I waste way more time reading. I was like, I'm just gonna find out for myself. I just realized I have to trust myself a lot more and also trust that I'll fail, but that I can figure it out. It can't be that hard.
So you spoke at the event that I had last year. Thank you. And one of the things I think you were asked on stage was, who do you look up to? And your answer was no one, right? So go ahead.
I hate that question.
I like the answer though. Like, so the answer is more impressive to me. It's like, what is the grand vision here? Right? Because like Alex's mission is to educate, right? I'm just wondering like, what are the primary drivers for you? What's the end vision?
So education is a real thing. I think we're both really passionate about that. I think for me, you know, something that we've talked about a lot is like there's an internal and an external mission. And I think that Alex has a mission that's for the greater community.
Mm-hmm.
And my mission with acquisition.com is how do I build a $10, $20, $100 billion company through encouraging people, really caring about people, helping people develop, helping people grow.
Yeah.
And not turning into one of these very punishing organizations. Typical PE, typical big corporate.
Yeah.
Typical bureaucracy, which I understand why that accumulates over time. I know we'll get there, but I want to get there in a way that builds a culture based off praise, not punishment. Mm-hmm. And that's really what I, I focus on is like everything that we've built, everyone always looks at the tactics and the funnel and the sales and this and that. And I'm just like, that's fine. It's a waste of fucking time though, because the reason that we have built this, it is the team.
Yeah.
It's the team. It's not like me and Alex are in there doing all that stuff all day. It's the team. And why is it that we're able to get people that are so talented and that want to work here and they stay a decently long time, you know, and they're very loyal and it's because of the way we treat them. And it's because I think that I innately did a lot of things because I just really actually care about people. And then I realized why it works and it's so contrary to most management that's taught that I just really want to I don't wanna talk about right now. I just wanna do it. And then in 10 years people will be like, how'd you do it? And then I'll be like, there's proof.
New book, The Acquisition Way. So there's this book I've been pushing right now, Scaling People from the Stripe COO. So that's like the new modern day, like high output management, right?
Okay. Is it?
Yeah. But then maybe you got the next one.
I don't know.
Like, so we'll see.
We'll see what you got. I'd be really interested what his is about.
Hers.
Hers.
It's, it's sorry, it's really good. Um, you just mentioned education also being part of your mission too. So I guess what is in your learning stack? Because here's the thing, we've talked a lot about operations in this one, like recruiting team and all that, right? People might be, oh my God, that's boring. But like, that is everything, right?
Yeah, it's a lot. Here's the thing also is actually, I think is really interesting is like, I think people assume that Alex doesn't give a fuck about any of that stuff and that I don't know anything about what he's doing. And we're both like absolute experts in both.
Yep.
You know what I'm saying? But we just split our roles.
Yep.
And go ahead. Yeah. No, so I just think it's, uh, it is interesting because I think people like label it as my domain. Like, I know how to sell and market shit. You know what I mean? And like people see it, him, and they're like, oh, he has no idea. He knows how to do all that.
I think humans just like to label things simply.
100%.
Yeah. And like, and the problem with marketing and sales is like, it is sexier, but it's like, this is the shit that matters. At the end of the day. Um, but anyway, how do you get better at your job? That's the question.
You mean like, do I consume something? Do I have mentors? Do I—
Yeah, just any— because I just think you're a very good operator. Like, yes, you're good at sales and marketing, but like the people, like the stuff you're saying, like clearly you've put a lot of work into this. So you can say I read nothing, right? It's just all experience.
So it's actually really interesting. It brings me to like a conversation I had with one one of our, like, he's basically family, Dr. Kashey, which I think it's just like a morphous character we talk about, where I said, like, I feel like I learn much more through doing rather than consuming these fluffy bullshit books. Like, I feel like I waste way more time reading. And if there's anything I've learned from him, it's that most of the best books were written 100 years ago.
Hmm.
And so I actually only read books that Dr. Kashey recommends because he reads books books by the people who came up with the ideas, not the people who have iterated on them. And so after that, we had a few conversations. He was like, you do learn more by doing. And you probably learn faster than anybody because you have an environment, which is a company, where you can experiment on a daily, weekly, monthly basis and then get the immediate feedback from it.
Yep.
Versus reading a book and like having a, you know, something shared there. So I think I actually look at what I'm doing in the company as an experiment. Every time a people situation arises, actually something arose today that was very upsetting to me, and I was like, how could I deal with this to get this outcome in a way that is least punishing for all? And so I called up Dr. Kashey and I talked him through it and said, I think this is what I'm gonna do. And he had a few pieces of feedback, and then I was like, okay, this is— we met with some other people and we were like, this is the plan we're going to go forward with, and then we'll see how it works. And that's feedback. And so I think that a lot of it is approaching people management with an experimental point of view more than like, I'm going to do this because people that are successful do this and they say it works.
Yep.
You know, and I think that's what has taught me so much, has just been approaching everything as an experiment and then taking those learnings and then applying them going forward. I think that's been what's most helpful. And I think also just leaning into, for me, I realized that there was so much bad advice that I was taking in through a lot of forms of media I was consuming, books I was consuming. And so I was like, fuck, I'm just gonna find out for myself. You know what I mean?
Yep.
And I think taking a very like first principles approach to everything, even with building acquisition.com, you know, everyone's like, you really need to get a mentor in private equity. I'm like, why the fuck would I want a mentor in private equity?
Yeah.
Like, have you seen what their businesses and lives look like in most of them? And they're, a lot of them are arrogant assholes. I don't want one of those people as my mentor.
Mm-hmm.
I don't wanna build a team like theirs who feels handcuffed and like they have to stay at their job because they're just paid a lot of money. So I was like, I'll figure it out. It can't be that hard. Yeah. Like, yeah. First principles thinking, like, don't buy a shitty company.
Yeah.
You know what I mean? Like, okay, if the founder hates the company, probably shouldn't buy it. Yeah. Like, so I think I just approach most things like that. Like, I know that we overcomplicate things and I think that the reason, Eric, that I feel like I, approach it like that is because in building Gym Launch, so many of the decisions that I made with such little experience, just based off first principles thinking, ended up being the best decisions. And the ones that where I leaned on someone else, where I did something from a book, where from a podcast, some successful person said, those ended up never working out for me. Yeah. And I think I just realized I have to trust myself a lot more and also trust that I'll fail. Yeah. But that I can figure it out.
'Cause also, 'cause you have the most context too.
I have the most context on me. You know, even when I get— I have people that are worth billions of dollars and they give me a piece of very absolute advice. I'm like, if he had all the context, he wouldn't have given me that advice.
Yeah, because this is a problem with advice. It's based on their experience.
