Ep. 3005: Google Engineer Reveals the SEO Algorithm

Did you see this Matt Diggity post where he's just— he wrote that a Google engineer just revealed in court how their ranking algorithm actually works? Now, Google. Yeah. But on the other side, like—

They've had that for a while.

But also, who cares? Because like, because it's all changing quickly. Have they had this for a while? I didn't know that.

Remember the Google leaked document with 1,000-something documents or 2,000 or 4,000, whatever the number was, that broke down their algorithm?

We don't have to talk about it, but there's this ABC framework. Do you know what this is?

Uh-uh.

So I'm reading this for the first time. So a Google engineer just revealed in court how their ranking algorithm actually works. And it's way simpler than most how SEO experts see it. They use what's called the ABC framework. So number 1, A, anchors, so backlinks pointing to your page, B, body, how well your content matches to what people search for, C, clicks, how long people stay before going back to Google. Google calls this topicality, which is just their way of saying how relevant is this page compared to what someone searched for. Okay, so this is just I mean, I think of my YouTube channel at the same time, your YouTube channel, it's just how topical authority or how relevant is this content compared to what the user searched for and how long are people staying for and the click-through rate and all that. It's kind of the same thing.

It goes back to basic fundamentals. They're looking at usage more than anything else.

Yep. So no new news here despite what this Google engineer revealed, but do you want to pick the next one?

All right, next one. Let's see, I'm trying to load up.

Here, I'll give you one before you load it.

So the— Too many damn open tabs.

One thing I saw recently is that in your company, right? And I don't know how often you— how often do you appear at your company? Like to do like an all-hands meeting or something like that? Do you appear at all?

Oh no, you don't. You know, I learned about the all-hand meetings the same time, like, oh, who's showing up? Whole company. I was like, oh, okay.

So, so what? But how often does it happen?

Once a month? The all-hand meetings or how often I show up?

Both.

I don't know how often they do them.

Yeah.

And I don't know when I last showed up.

Okay, let me speak to my experience because we're a smaller company, right? And I'm actually in it right now operating, so I'm very much in the trenches, right? So what I've noticed, and I don't know if you'll be able to relate to this at all, I don't think you will be able to, but I've noticed that you've got to tell the stories and you've got to drive the narrative or else others will start to create their own, right? So let's say, you know, Recently we might've moved on from a couple people, right? And so I was talking to someone, it's like they start to create this narrative in their head, oh, like maybe the company's not doing well, or it's like, no, like I actually listed out like, no, it's this one, this performance over here, this happened over here. Oh, actually no, we're still working with this person over here, right? And you gotta, if you don't keep, if someone's not constantly communicating, it doesn't have to be you, Neil, something's like, people are gonna start to create stories in their head, right? Or like I heard this story a while back, it's like, oh, it seems like, You know, all Eric cares about is like the bottom line or something like that, right?

Really?

Or like, all Eric cares, like it doesn't seem like Eric cares or something like that, right?

And it's like, but wait, wait, wait, where are they getting this from?

They start to create narratives in their head, right? Until you break the narrative and you start to tell more stories and say how things are actually going and what the vision is, and you have to keep reinforcing it, it like, you can't carry the company forward. There needs to be someone leading and shouting from the top. And in your case, it's not you, but you still have someone that's constantly driving the cadence, you know what I mean?

Yes, we do. But why would you think that people within your organization get this narrative? Like, where do you think it's coming from?

Well, this— in this specific case, this person was frustrated. And once I talked to this person, like, you basically like talk them off a ledge, right? But in this person, they weren't. I think it's like once— sometimes when you're frustrated, it's easier to lash out. And it's like the moment you start to ask like, well, what evidence do you have that Eric doesn't care? Because like Eric's in it every day. Or like, do you have— do you have evidence that Eric put millions of dollars back into this company over the last couple of years to save the thing? Like, it hasn't really, you know what I mean? And so like, it's It's, um, oh, they don't care.

They're going to do whatever they want to do and they're going to think that, yeah, you know, what's best for them at that moment is what they—

Yeah. And it's hard to change that narrative, right? But if you're constantly driving it and you're trying to keep everyone aligned, then that's why it's important for you. Like someone needs to do it and you agree, right? Even though it's not you, someone's doing it.

Someone's doing it.

Yeah.

I think it's very important because it aligns everyone.

It is marketing.

It is marketing.

Yeah.

And it does get rid of misconceptions. And if you don't do it, then it's going to start to bubble up. And then what happens is people internally, they start talking and then it gets worse and worse and worse.

And then the story evolves. It's like telephone. It becomes crazier and crazier until you like show them how things are actually going and you tell them. So it's, in this case, it's good to be transparent. And this is why people talk about being the chief reminder officer or repeating your core values or repeating your mission over and over and over, because it's really easy to let it slide. Yeah, but go ahead.

So this is okay. So you have how many people within your organization, rough headcount?

Oh, 50-ish.

Okay. So if you have 50-ish people and certain people think that you, you yourself only care about ROI, if you don't participate in some of these, I wouldn't call them all hands, what ends up happening? Do they just keep spreading it? Does it get worse and worse for you?

I'll tell you when everything was destruction 4 or 5 years ago, Noah was part of this. Everything was destruction. We did the 2 acquisitions, right?

Okay.

started happening was like, it's— we had that one saboteur that was spreading this, oh, leadership hates you all. Eric doesn't believe in you. Eric actually hates you. And so, it starts to spread, right?

Yeah.

And then, what ends up happening is you start to talk to people during your exit interview. One guy's like, man, I just want us to win. He resigns the next day, right? And so, it starts to create this domino effect, this snowball effect. And if the snowball becomes too big, you can't push it down anymore, right? So, I learned at that moment, that I have to be involved in some way, shape, or form, right? Even if I'm in the back trying to drive things and say, hey, this is what the story is, this is what the vision is, that's, that's what you have to do. Otherwise, again, it starts to become its own monster. And then not only that, you're no longer focused on your customers. You're not even focused on your business anymore. You're focused on this crisis control thing.

Do you want to hear the craziest thing someone said about me the other day?

What?

So I don't know where they ended up reading this from, and they started telling some of our team members internally The new narrative was, Neil is killing people in India.

What? Yeah.

I'm like, I don't want anyone to die, but I'm like, where the heck are they getting this crap from? I'm like, I don't even go to India. How am I killing people? And someone came up to one of our colleagues, my coworkers at a conference, and they said, Neil's been killing people in India, like actually killing people. And then They knew that I'm not actually killing people in India. And then I was like, okay, it sucks that people are saying this, but like, what can I do if someone doesn't have common sense?

Yeah.

You know, like I can't solve this.

This is how these narratives, like that you got to just do what you can to control it. You can't force them to believe something, but at least you can get your point out. And I think it's important to get that point out.

Very important to get your point out. And I did address it with some of our internal people. Because even though they believe that I'm not killing people, right, which is a really far-stretched narrative, talk about me doing something in business or marketing. You can even try to say I'm doing unethical stuff. That could be potentially more believable, but like actually committing murder, like actually killing people in a country I barely ever go to. And they weren't saying like, I'm paying people. They're like, I'm actually like killing people. Yourself with your bare hands. I'm like, okay, you know, I don't know how to solve it, but I was like, look, I appreciate you guys believing that I'm not killing. I'm like, I can share my travel schedule with you guys. I can show you when I'm in India. I can share my passport stamps. And the reason I just said that is because it's like, I just want to nip it in the butt. Yeah.

You know, it's not nip it in the butt. It's the bud. I Googled this before.

Bud.

B-U-D. That's not the butt. I used to think it was the butt. It's not the butt.

It's not butt.

No, Google it. Bud. Yeah. B-U-D. Nip it in the bud, right, Noah?

I believe you.

Nip it in the butt.

Is it bud? No, B-U-D. Uh, Alex says nip it in the bud, dude.

I hope you don't say those on calls.

No.

Yeah, but I mean, that's like the stories you tell stories or else others will create their own. Um, so that and you don't want their narrative.

And what I've also found in the corporate world, you can tell your story And you can show facts. And even when you do that, some people may not believe you. Like when it's just like black and white. And I'll give you an example of this. I know someone, they had a business issue with someone in their organization and something happened with money or whatnot. And people didn't like him or her. They liked the other person and the other person was screwing over the team and wasn't going to pay them any more money. So then the person I know was making sure their team was getting paid, even if they had to put money out of pocket and people still hated them because the other person who screwed them over was saying bad things. And I'm like, so people are hating. on you when you are giving your team money and they're believing the guy who screwed them over. And I was like, no matter what you tell people, there's always going to be some people who don't believe the narrative, even if it's true and you show them data. They're just brainwashed.

Yeah. And the final thing on this, and we can move on, I think it's as long as you know that you're consistent with your behaviors and your habits every day, that's the best that you can ask for. And then you, again, you can't force someone to change their mind. And so all you can do is try to be the best person that you can be because people make up narratives. Like for example, yeah, Eric doesn't care about, oh yeah, all Eric cares about is like his ego and like, you know, creating content online and, you know, his personal brand or whatever.

I've never once seen that.

I could never care less, right? I just, we're doing it to drive more leads, right? And then like, it's, that's what I mean. Like as long as you know that you're doing your best, that's all.

Yeah. And I've also seen you create content that gets tons of views and you're like, I'm going to test this out. I'm like, Eric, why are you doing this? It gets tons of views. Month or two later, hey Eric, why'd you stop doing it? Gets tons of views, no revenue. Who cares for reviews if it does— who cares for views if it doesn't convert? Well, if you really cared for ego on your brand, you'd go back to creating the content.

I'd go all in on that all the time.

Yeah.

Yeah. I'd be a full-time creator.

You're doing lots of great—

exactly. Might even have an OnlyFans.

Dude, someone yesterday told me that they're going to get into OF.

Okay.

And I was like, like online finance? And then I was like, what's OF? And they're like, they're like, oh, OnlyFans. And I was like, oh, I thought you meant something with finance, 'cause I couldn't put two and two together. And the way they told me they were going to get into OnlyFans is they want to be an agency that helps people market their OnlyFans account. And I don't know much about it, but remember you and I were in Germany?

It's part of that German guy.

Yeah. And when we were in Germany, I was like, I think I met a kid who did this and he made a killing. Although when he made the OnlyFans people too much money, they got lazy and stopped working, which then reduced his income. But one quick thing before we switch topics. The problem with the narratives and stories and what people believe, I think social media creates a big problem today. And a prime example of this is you look at Middle East. So I saw this clip on Instagram that someone sent me, and I'm not trying to get political. I'm not saying I'm for Israel, for Gaza, or any of that. I'll keep my opinions to myself. But there was this lady who did an interview on Instagram and she was interviewing people, or at least I saw it on Instagram, who were in the LGBTQ+ group. And she was talking to them about Israel and they were hating on Israel. They were all about free Palestine. Israel's a terrible place in the Middle East. I'm not saying that's what I believe or anything like that. I'm just telling you what happened in the video. And she was like, uh, are you in the LGBTQ+? And they're like, yes, I am. You know, and they didn't all specify, uh, their preference. Doesn't matter. Um, it's, you know, whatever they personally prefer is what they personally prefer. And she shows them a clip of someone getting tortured. She's like, what do you see here? Oh, someone getting tortured. And they're like, they're in the Middle East. Do you know why they're getting tortured? And then she shows a picture of them pretty much being killed or getting actually really killed, which was sad.

Mm-hmm.

And they're like, oh, crazy. Like, what happened? They found out that the person was gay, so they killed him, which is terrible, right? Like, no one should ever be killed.

Yeah.

Uh, especially for that. It's just like, dude, what does that have to do— what, how does that harm you? It doesn't harm you. Let them be with their lives.

Yeah.

Right. And then they're like, do you know where this happened? And then they tell them, you know, in the Middle East and where. And they're like, do you know where the only place where you can be LGBTQ Plus in the Middle East and be supported. Israel, Israel, they have one of the largest parades.

Yeah.

And then a lot of the people in that video were like, oh, I had to do my research still and double check. And I was like, oh my God.

Which I think is a fair statement though. Sure.

They should verify. Yeah, they should verify, but they didn't want to change their tune. Yeah. And they're just like, so, well, if this is true, what would you think?

Yeah.

Yeah. But even then they didn't want to admit that they were wrong and they wanted to stick with their stance.

They're in violation.

It's a what?

It's a narrative violation.

Yes. And I was just like, so someone's showing you facts and you can just Google right then and there. And some of them were actually open and they changed their mind. But a lot of people were just stuck in their ways and weren't open to the concept of change. I'm not saying they had to change right there, but just being open to it.

Dude, you know what's funny? So this morning I was getting my blood drawn, right? And I had like a Russian nurse helping me. She's like, you know what the problem with America today is? We're too liberal here, right? She's like, she's like, the good thing about Putin is that he sets the tone. And like, he's just— she was making the same point around the— it's really easy to brainwash people, especially people that are early 20s or teens or so. Right. And they start to follow— like, that's why social media, this stuff blows up and it's really easy to just change someone's mind and then almost like corrupt it a little bit because people don't— they just look at whatever TikTok they see and then they're like, oh yeah, okay, that makes sense. I can get with that. And then all of a sudden, you know, you have a growing population of people who seem to be brainwashed. But anyway, this is not a political show.

No, but if you go to places like Germany and places in Europe, posting misinformation or something that's defaming against another individual could cause—

Do you see the British guy that got arrested this week?

No.

He had a sign that said, and by the way, we're not saying we support or not support, but he's basically, I think he was calling out saying that if you're trans, like basically you are mentally ill. So he wrote that, right? But in America, that's freedom of speech, right?

Yes.

And so again, we're not saying we agree or disagree, right? But there's a video of him getting arrested and he's like, I haven't done anything. Like, I just had a sign that said that, right? I'm not inciting violence or anything. It wasn't saying like, let's go destroy them or anything. He was just saying that, right? And so that's what's happening. That's what you're saying, right?

Yes. But in Germany and places like that, you're seeing certain countries have laws where if you say things that can be hurtful, you can get in trouble. Or example of like the mental illness one that you said, you can get in trouble for it. But the way I think things need to be adjusted from a marketing standpoint, at least a bit from a business perspective, if people are just putting out misinformation, and when I mean misinformation, like 2 2 is 8, right? We all know 2 2 is 4. Like when something is like factually, but on purpose you're saying it's intentional, there should be a way for things to just get scrubbed.

Yeah. Yeah.

Because I think there's just way too much misinformation on the internet that is screwing up marketing for so many companies. Like, we see this as an example of social media. We're seeing a huge trend of companies starting to pay us money to do their social media marketing for stuff that would be considered boring and ugly. And these are publicly traded companies. They're not in the sexiest verticals. They're doing this for stuff that helps with earning calls, investor relations, CEO reputation of them talking about things like, you know, being green or saving the earth or be more energy efficient because they're worried about false narratives that people put online about a corporation that can just be off.

I think, look, if there's any takeaway from this and then we can move, finally move on after this, is the storytellers are often the ones that can really drive change in the world, right? You look at Martin Luther King, for example, good storyteller, right? You can even say that the, this, the Zohan, whoever the New York like candidate, right?

Yeah.

Really good at inspiring people. And like he is telling a story and he's rallying people. Right. And again, we're not saying right or wrong on any side, but the better you are at storytelling, like go read this book called Storyworthy, great book. The more you're going to be able to get the things that you want done, whether it's— and hopefully it's good stuff. Yes.

And the more extreme your story is, the more likely it is to resonate with a portion of the audience.

Yeah. And the more you talk to a broader audience, for example, Eat the rich, right? Like that's a story that seems to resonate very quickly with like the broader audience, and the wealth gap is increasing. That's easy to get behind, right? And then all of a sudden, then you get revolution, right? Yes. And I hope that doesn't happen. But yeah, so we're going to end the episode here. See you guys later. Please don't forget to rate, view, subscribe.