How To 10x Your Sleep Performance With Eight Sleep CEO Matteo Franceschetti

So let's talk about Eight Sleep a little bit. Talk about the company and how you ended up founding the company.

So when I was a teenager, I was a tennis player. I was playing tennis tournaments in Italy. So I have always been an athlete and in performance. And 5 years ago, I was the typical entrepreneur working long hours and wondering why Elon Musk is taking me to Mars with rockets, but I spend a third of my life on, on a piece of dumb foam. How can technology help me improve my sleep? And that is how everything started.

And so with Eight Sleep, I mean, this is— what were you doing previous to Eight Sleep? What were your other companies?

Yeah, I had 2 companies in clean tech, one in Europe and one in New York.

Got it. Okay. Can you talk about those companies a little bit? So clean tech, and what was the other company in New York?

Both in clean tech. It was the same model, one in Europe, then we sold it and we did it the same in New York, and our assets got acquired by Panasonic. We were developing large utility-scale solar plants. So we were trying to make the world a better place with solar energy.

Got it. So I mean, there's a trend there, right? Because clean tech, you're trying to make the world a better place. And now with Eight Sleep, still it's very much helping. So what is the story behind that? What's driven you to create these types of companies? Because it's not like I'm just going to go create SaaS products. There's a lot of logistics around this that would be too complex for me.

Yeah. Yeah, it's actually something I'm really proud of. I don't know if I was aware at the beginning of my career, but now when I look back and I think about the problems I tried to solve, I'm pretty proud of that. So yeah, at the time I leveraged my experience. I used to be a business lawyer and I was understanding project finance, which is what you need to really build these large solar plants. And I used that skill to build my first company. than the second one. And then my background as an athlete became the real driver for the current company. We are really a healthcare company hidden behind the form factor of a mattress or a mattress cover.

Got it. I love it. So yeah, let's talk about the products a little bit. I mean, you have— I mean, what are kind of the core products? And then how does your— how do they help people? Let's get a little more specific.

Yeah. So let's start from our vision. We want to do 2 things. We want to compress your sleep, And we want to save your life. So what if we could scan your body while you're asleep to detect any illness in your body? So these are the 2 things we want to achieve. How we are already achieving partially these 2 things is on one side, we dynamically thermoregulate your body as you sleep. So we change the temperature of your bed. Each side of the bed can have a different temperature. And through that, we can help you fall asleep faster, get more deep sleep. less wake-ups and less tosses and turns. There is already medical evidence that that is possible, plus our data is showing that. Second, all our products come with embedded sensors, and so we can detect and monitor everything about your heart rate, including HRV, respiration, and sleep.

Got it. I love that. So why is sleep so important? I mean, sleep's, you know, obviously there's a book, you know, Why We Sleep, And, um, you know, more and more people are getting into it. Um, but I mean, you know, what can you explain to people about the science of sleep and how like not sleeping can actually kill you?

Yeah, so let's start from the basics, which is, uh, health is based on 3 pillars: sleep, nutrition, and exercise. And actually sleep is really the foundation because if you start sleeping 2 hours per day, it doesn't matter what you eat and how much you train, probably you cannot even train, and very likely you will just eat a lot of junk food to compensate for the lack of energy coming from sleep deprivation. There is plenty of medical evidence that proves that sleep is the secret hack for your health and your longevity. First, there is a direct correlation with nutrition. So if you are sleep deprived, you will crave junk food and you will be insulin resistant. And so as a, as a result, you might end up eating more carbs, or as I was saying, junk food. Second, there are hormonal impacts directly connected to the quality of your sleep, but sleep is also correlated to Parkinson's, blood pressure, heart rate performance, and heart rate attacks, and many other functional dysfunctions of your body.

Got it. Okay. So I think, you know, what's interesting is, I mean, obviously there's sensors with Eight Sleep, there's, you know, different types of ways to measure. I— what are— I guess I'm interested, what's in your sleep stack, right? So what I mean by that are, you know, what types of tools are you using when you're going to sleep? So for example, I love my, my silk sleep mask, right? That, that's— this just feels so good when I go to bed. So what are you using?

Yeah, I, I— we could talk about that for hours, but trying to simplify. So first, I have a routine that starts a couple of hours before. So I try to do a, a thermal shock. So it's a hot and cold shower Or if I'm in a hotel where there is a sauna, I try to do a sauna and a cold bath. That thermal shock really helps me to relax. Once a week I take melatonin. I tend to take magnesium to relax my muscles. I change my lights 2 hours before going to bed and they keep dimming down every 30 minutes. My bed is thermoregulated, which is key. So the temperature at which I sleep is designed around my circadian cycle and I sleep in a completely dark bedroom around 71 degrees, but it changes during the night. And yeah, everything is optimized in my bedroom. I also use earplugs to make sure that there is 100%— that the environment is 100% quiet.

Wow, that's hardcore. So you mentioned— I think you mentioned sound baths, right? Did you mention to shock your body? Are you taking cold showers before you go to bed?

Yeah, 2 hours before, I do a shower where I keep switching between the max cold and really hot, 10 times, 30 seconds each. That is a good way to relax my body. Or if you are in a place where you can have access to a sauna and a cold plunge, I love that. That also helps me recover from fitness exercise.

Got it. So how have all these things improved your sleep score? Have you tried a before and after? You have to have, right?

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I have data about my sleep for the past 5 years. I also used to have restless legs, which is this feeling, sort of cramps you have in the middle of the night. You need to get out of bed and walk a little bit. I would say I have reduced my restless legs by probably 80%. I think I don't have hard data, but I think there is also a correlation with vitamin D. In particular, since when I moved to Miami, restless legs almost disappeared. And the only thing I really changed in my habits is just I get much more sun and sunlight exposure.

Got it. That's awesome. So let's talk about the business a little bit. So, you know, how do you guys make money? And, you know, whatever numbers you can share on the business growth rates, whatever, you know, this is your chance to brag.

Yeah. So we sell our product. Our product comes in 2 form factors. One is the whole mattress that gets shipped directly to your home, or you can just buy a mattress cover that retrofits your dumb mattress with our technology. You can buy online. So it's the direct-to-consumer business. Business is going great. So we keep growing at very strong multiples year over year. We are growing in a very efficient way. So our unit economics are solid and everything is working in the right direction. As a company, we raised $70 million from pretty good investors, Founders Fund, Khosla Ventures, Y Combinator, Craft Ventures and HTC.

Got it. Yeah. And so I'm just looking at some of your accolades here. One of the most innovative companies in consumer electronics by Fast Company, recognized by Time Magazine as one of the top inventions, um, and members of— a member of the Forbes Technology Council. So we'll come back to all this, but, um, you just mentioned moving to Miami. So obviously big tech migration to Miami. You were previously in New York, right? And then previously before that, you're in Italy. Anywhere else?

San Francisco. We have been there for a year, and then I have been a couple of months in China when we were setting up manufacturing. Got it.

Okay. So where does Miami stand compared to all these other places right now?

How much do you love it on a scale of 1 to 10? I love it 9, and I don't give a 10 just because I never give a 10. I like it. It's a cosmopolitan city. You have an international airport, but whenever we can really start traveling again. But more than anything, it's a city where I can practice outdoor activities and a lot of outdoor sport. As I was telling you, I have always been an athlete. In New York, for whatever reason, multiple reasons that we can talk about that, I was not doing a lot of sport. Yeah, I was doing fitness, so I was going to the gym, that kind of thing. But here I can really have on Sunday tennis meetings where I meet with people and we play tennis together. I'm learning a couple of other sports. And so I find it a much more And I'm lucky that now there are so many tech people. And I mean, just this morning I had 2 socially distanced meetings with 2 top tech people that are in the city.

That's awesome. So do you think you're going to be staying there long-term?

Oh yeah, 100%.

Yeah. Okay. Amazing. So I'm trying to— I'm trying to ask you these questions because I told you I'm going there next week. I'm trying to convince myself. So that's why I'm asking you these.

You will love it. Yeah, it's awesome.

I mean, I usually go like every quarter or so, so this time it's gonna be a little different.

We'll see.

Um, so okay, we talked about sleep tools, we talked about the— and by the way, just full disclosure, I have the, the COVID because I have a dumb mattress because I, you know, I love the firm mattresses. Um, but, um, it's, it's a great product, right? I mean, it's, it's— I use it on top of, you know, my other product to kind of measure my sleep, and I usually score around the same. So I'm curious to know, you mentioned sleep tools. What else are you doing? You know, how does your diet look? I'm just curious to know what your habits are so then people can figure out, you know, what they want to emulate.

Yeah, I'm pretty obsessed about everything about my health. So for nutrition, I use Levels that you can see on the screen right now. So I monitor my nutrition. I try to reduce any glucose spike because that has an impact on my longevity. I train almost every day. I tend to do high-intensity interval training and weightlifting. And so that can come in a bunch of different ways using products like Peloton or Tonal. I'm really into this thermal shock concept. So I just bought on Amazon a very cheap bathtub where I put water and I try to make it really, really cold. And so then I try to do a hot shower or I try to— I'm trying to build a cheap sauna. Here at home, um, to do that. And I'm on a keto diet. I have been on a keto diet for 2 years now. And, um, I'm also fasting. I fast 23 hours every day except for the weekend when I do 16:8.

Got it. Okay. So, so weekend is 16:8. So during the weekdays you're only eating one meal really?

Yeah. Got it. Okay.

That's awesome. Um, so, okay. That's amazing. You guys can take it for what it is. Your mileage may vary. You know, Matteo has his own style. You might have your own. What's working really well, going back to the business right now, what's working really well for you in terms of customer acquisition? I can see you're very active on Twitter, so.

Yeah, word of mouth, and that is connected to my activity on Twitter, right? If you follow me or if you follow the brand on Twitter, you will see there are so many people raving about the product, and that is really helping because our product is not an impulsive purchase. And so before buying, you want to hear from other people that have tried it that, yeah, this really makes a difference. We see plenty of our customers using an Oura Ring or a Whoop, and they report increases in their deep sleep by 20%, 40%. That is the best thing they could share, right? It's not even our own data, it's someone else's data proving that we are improving their sleep performance. So word of mouth.

Got it. Yeah, and that's actually how I heard of you guys. I think Twitter creates this thing where there's FOMO, so I have a Levels patch I have— the reason I have Levels is because of Twitter. The reason I have Eight Sleep is because of Twitter. Um, so I find that fascinating. Are you guys running any ads against, you know, those posts right now?

Nope, not right now. Everything is completely organic.

That's amazing. All right. Um, that's cool. And so what is— I guess I'm wondering too, you know, we talked about your diet, we talked about kind of the tools you have. How are you learning more about sleep? Like what resources are you going to? Are there any podcasts? Are there any books that you read? What do you recommend for people that want to learn more?

Yeah, so I mean, I think the basic is Why We Sleep. I think it's a great book, and 80/20, it gives you the fundamentals. In my case, I read a lot of medical papers and results from trials. There is Peter Attia, who is a doctor and talks, you know, touches multiple things in health, including sleep, which is really interesting.

Cool. So usually what I ask with this question is one tool, but we've mentioned Levels. We've talked about Eight Sleep, obviously. Um, what else? What, what are some other tools you'd recommend that, that have been incredible for you in the last year? So it could be like a Peloton bike or Tonal, like you've mentioned, you know, what do you got? I'm sure, cause I just know you have a bunch, so we're going to keep it open.

Yeah. So, I mean, I love my, I love my Peloton bike. I have, I had it for a while. Um, I recently got Tonal. And I use customized programs, my own program, and I really, really love it. It's extremely effective. I have a Nitro Ice gun for massage. It is great. I have the NormaTec boots, which they compress my legs and is great at night before going to bed. And, and then I'm building this sauna and ice plunge. To improve my performance and levels.

Does anybody ever just call you a machine?

Yeah, I try everything. I'm, I'm, I'm crazy. And then I try tons of supplements. Yeah, anything you can think of.

Got it. I love it. And so just, just so people know too, your, uh, your partner is also your spouse, correct?

Yeah, we have 3 co-founders. One of the co-founders, uh, is Alexandra, and she's also my wife.

Got it. Okay. So talk about that because sometimes I'll have people on the podcast and they just talk about the dynamics and how they make it work, right? So how do you guys make it work? Because I'm sure you've had to navigate a couple of things.

Yeah. I'll tell you a funny story. So for personal stuff, we use WhatsApp and obviously for business, we use Slack. And so sometimes I might be on Slack complaining about something that we need to move it faster or something that didn't match the bar. And on the other side, I'm WhatsApping her like, what do we have for dinner tonight? And so we really live in these 2 dimensions. And then there is this rule where I— we need to treat each other like if we were colleagues. And so maybe it's 9:30 PM, that for us is late because we go to sleep pretty early. And I cannot really talk about business because the rule is, is not that you would be talking to a colleague about business randomly right now unless there is an urgency, but I can still Slack her. And so maybe sometimes we are reading or we are on the couch And I cannot talk about work, but I start slacking her and I, and I can feel and hear the phone vibrating.

Ah, that's amazing. Okay. So you've compartmentalized it and then, you know, Slack strictly business, WhatsApp personal. And then when you come home, can't talk about business. Do you guys do anything else? Cause I know one of my friends, he runs, um, he takes the Traction Entrepreneur's Operating System and runs those meetings every week.

Right.

Talk about issues and things like that. Do you guys do anything like that?

Yeah, I have. a one-on-one weekly with Alexandra because she reports to me. And yeah, she needs to prepare her agenda. She sends me the agenda and we discuss. And then usually what we do in our case, we also like to spend Saturday morning, we have breakfast, the two of us. And usually that is a moment where we allow each other to talk about work again.

Ah.

And so Saturday is for me because I'm the one who always wants to talk about work because my brain is always going, but instead sometimes she needs her own space to think. She's different from me.

Yeah.

And so we have these rules.

Got it. That's awesome. Okay. So it sounds like there's the official kind of reporting structure, the one-on-ones there, and then, you know, you guys have your morning breakfast. Okay. That makes total sense. Um, so you talked about Why We Sleep as a book you'd recommend. What's one more book you recommend to the audience? Could be business or personal.

Uh, The Almanac of Naval, I think, is, uh, is great. Or The Daily Stoics, I really like. And then there is the book of Nike, Shoe Dog.

What was the last one? What's that one about?

Uh, it's the story of Nike.

Oh, got it, got it. Oh, Shoe Dog, Shoe Dog. Got it, got it.

Yeah, yeah, cool.

Final question from my side: what's the most compelling thing you've read, watched, or listened to recently?

I just finished The Daily Stoic, which is this summary from Seneca and many other philosophers from thousands of years ago. And to me, it's still surprising how the problems of humanity and of us as human beings were exactly the same, right? People were jealous. People were struggling to find focus. People were struggling to focus on what really matters or sticking to their principles. And it's weird, like, you know, Thousands of years went by, but as human beings, we are still exactly the same. And these people thousands of years ago were able to be as reflective and thoughtful as we could be today.

I love it. All right. Well, Matteo, this has been awesome. What's the best way for people to find you online?

Follow me on Twitter. Just go on eightsleep.com. That is where you will find my tweet. Eight Sleep is like eight, like the number. So E-I-G-H-T. Sleep.com and check out the product.

Yeah. Highly recommended everyone. I'm not getting paid to say this by the way. Um, so Mateo, thanks so much for doing this.

I love it. Thank you.

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