Eric Siu and Neil Patel discuss how to get your content into AI overviews. They recommend publishing fresh content regularly, adding summary bullet points to your pages, and using AI voice tools like VO3. They also cover account-based marketing and the Dream 100 sales approach for reaching high-value clients.
Chapters
But 95% of ChatGPT citations come from content less than 10 months old. Did you know that?
I did not know that, but I assumed it was fresh content. We noticed that the more fresh your content is, the more likely you are to get mentioned.
So then it's like, okay, if you build like a SaaS product, like with our product, it's like, okay, how do we help people refresh? How do we make sure that they have the best H1 titles to get into AI overviews, right? But that stuff also is going to change very quickly too, right? And so it's like playing whack-a-mole. You have to be on top of it. And this is why I like doing this podcast, because it forces us to be on top of it. I think if we didn't have this podcast, I feel like I'd be a little less on top of it. I don't know about you.
I don't think it— yeah, I'd probably be a little bit less, but one AI overview strategy that just works really well right now, but it'll be like playing whack-a-mole. If you look at any keyword that you're ranking on page 1 for, and it has an AI overview, look at what they're pulling for. And no joke, if you take your content that's on page 1 and you add in like 3 bullet points summarizing, including the answers to whatever they're pulling AI reviews for, We've noticed a drastic increase in getting mentioned in the AOR views within a few days of just making that change. So you're just adding 3 bullets towards the top of the article and you're letting them know, like, just, you know, in summary, CNBC does a good job of this. Like if you read an article, like, that's actually a bad article, that one's gated. Let's see, Archer drops 15% on $850. Okay, so it says key points and they'll just summarize 3 bullet points and then they go into article. The point I'm getting on is that's a really great way to just get included into the AOR views. We're seeing it super effective, but again, it's like whack-a-mole. Will that still be effective a month from now, 3 months from now? Who knows? We adjust as things change.
Yeah. I think if you're an SEO now, you just got to be Johnny-on-the-spot even faster, double or triple time faster. Speaking of AI content, by the way, did I show you, did I show you the, the Star Wars VO3? You've seen Star Wars, right?
Okay, this is a movie.
Yeah, this is another example where AI content is actually starting to beat human content. So I showed you the one where the the the poem that was AI assisted from my mom, right? So she wrote something in Chinese, three pages, and then AI made a poem that made everyone cry, right? But this is interesting because this is a VO generated vlog series of Greg the Stormtrooper. So check this out.
Orders just came in from Vader's bitch ass, and me and Greg are headed to Endor. Forest mission, easy terrain, little recon work.
Should be chill. Okay, Greg, I'm telling you, I've seen like. 5 of those little teddy bear looking things. One of them had a spear.
Well, guess they were real. I thought you were joking.
Is this all AI generated?
Uh-huh.
The whole video too?
Yeah. We got out, we got out! Greg chewed through the net like a psychopath and now the teddy bears are chasing us! They're throwing things! Greg, why are they so fast? Bro, we just got back from Endor, we still got leaves in our armor, and now Vader's bitch ass is sending us to Hoth. Greg, what'd you think?
Silent shrug.
Yeah, that's what I thought.
Bro, Greg!
Can you fucking drive? I swear, if we die in this tin can before we even freeze to death on Hoth— Alright.
No, that's pretty good. Wait, click.
We just landed.
Get your ass up!
I can't feel my arms. We are so dead. We're in the middle of an active firefight. People are screaming, stuff's exploding, and Greg's over there building a damn snowman.
Come on, this is pretty funny. This is funny.
It's pretty good.
So my, my, like, by the way, stormtroopers, I don't know about, like, I don't think I've ever seen stormtroopers with a personality before. So if you've seen Star Wars, I mean, if you haven't seen it, it's like these, these, uh, these soldiers in, in white, right? They're wearing like white armor, um, and, and they have these masks on, but This is VO3, and this is interesting 'cause I've heard from people 2, 3 weeks ago, oh yeah, VO's just not there, blah, blah, blah. It's again, the resistance. People will resist. So have you guys been using it for creative at all?
We do use it for creatives. We've actually made whole commercials using AI as well for our clients.
Yeah, but not VO3 though.
I have no idea what they ended up using to create it.
Yeah, VO3, if you pay $129 a month or whatever, You can text a prompt and it'll give you 8 seconds, right? And you can string things together and it comes out with audio too. So that audio is like Google creating the video and the audio.
Huh.
Yeah.
Dude, one thing I just realized having this conversation, as your company grows, like when you're asking some of these questions, I actually don't genuinely know the answer. Like when I say, when you're saying, did you use this technology? So then I'm like, I have no idea.
It's just too hard to Stay on top of it all.
Yeah, it's just too much in too many countries. It's like, uh-huh, okay.
Now I just ask, like, just tell me what's the most impressive thing you're doing right now with AI or your work? What's the most impressive thing you've done? What's the most impressive thing you're doing with AI right now? And again, how did you prepare for this call?
Yeah.
Oh, I just wanted to hear from you about the role first. Yeah.
Fuck you.
Yeah.
Dude, when people waste my time like that, I just get so irritated.
Do you end the call?
No, I tend to do the call with multiple people.
Oh, got to go fast.
So then I just go on mute. No, I go on mute and then I just go do my thing and I go back to work and let them take care of it.
Take your camera off?
Yes.
If you're in B2B, here's the deal. LinkedIn account-based marketing sucks, but it doesn't have to. With Carrot, it allows you to create personalized ads towards your customers and also personalized landing pages that align with the ads. So you're going to have higher conversion rates. conversions and influence pipeline reporting to prove that your ABM works. So if you want to learn more, just go to karrot.ai and you can join the waitlist. Again, it's karrot.ai and we'll see you on the other side. I found this to be interesting. You remember the guy who wrote The Ultimate Sales Machine, Chet Holmes?
Yeah.
Okay. So he used to head up sales for Charlie Munger.
And so— Really?
Yeah.
So— Chet Holmes?
Yeah, Chet Holmes. And so he wrote this great book, The Ultimate Sales Machine, and the whole premise of the book, I'll kind of explain it here, but this is how Charlie Munger's sales leader can teach you about closing every single deal. So back, I think he was selling magazine ads, right? For one of, because they used to have a lot of magazine businesses. And so what happened initially was that they had a target list of about 167 people.
Okay.
And he would hit these people with new direct mail. He would hit them, he would call them, and he would just constantly hit these people up. He got nothing for the first month, nothing for the second month. I think it wasn't until maybe the 6th month or so that that he closed his first client of that 167 people. Who was that? Xerox.
Xerox was huge at the time, right?
Wow. And gradually, like the, as the year went on, I think he eventually got 29 out of the 167. Eventually he got all of these customers. So the whole premise of that book, The Ultimate Sales Machine, is you create this list of your dream 100 and you're constantly hitting them, but not just spamming them. You're thinking like, oh, Neil's really into the Green Bay Packers. Let me get him a jersey. Oh, they just won the other. Congrats on the trade for, you know, Congrats on trading away Aaron Rodgers. Maybe that's not a congrats, right? But my point is, you're aligned with what they're interested in, and you're sending them relevant personalized messaging on different channels. You can be SMSing them, you can be direct mailing them, but you're constantly hitting up this Dream 100. These are the top 100 people that you want to work with. And eventually over time, people will respect you and they'll work with you. They'll give you a chance. Because I remember probably earlier for you in your career too, When I had nothing, I would constantly hit, I would make 20 videos a day. Each video was about 15 to 20 minutes. I would upload the video. I didn't have Loom at the time and I would send, I would find their emails through using salesforcedata.com back then. I'd have their email and eventually I got clients, right? Because they respect you over time and you're just constantly hitting them with hopefully relevant content.
Yep.
What did you do?
So similar, but dude, when it comes to, this makes me remember the Frank Kern approach. Do you remember the Frank Kern approach where he would just deliver a cash bag to your, to your door?
A bag of cash?
Bag of cash. What did I say? Cash bag?
Cash bag.
Bag of cash.
Yeah.
And that would be his version of content to get people interested. And then from there, you know, he would sell them one or the other. Like, you're really going to give me $1,000 or $10,000? Like, you literally have someone there with just cash.
Yeah.
It's a different way of content, but that was just, it's just, it's a question is how can you just get creative and think outside the box?
Yeah.
And I don't think enough people in marketing really do that.
I think this is something you can actually Have AIs come up with good ideas and it's constantly scanning on what they're interested in and it creates you ideas on each one and you just want us to do it for you?
Yes, but the question is, is a lot, I believe a lot of people are going to start doing things like that. So the question is—
How do you stand out?
Yeah, how do you stand out?
Yeah.
I think that's the hardest part really in marketing because anything you can do, I can do. Anything I can do, you can do and other people can do. It's just a question of time and money. And if someone doesn't have those resources, Someone will fund it. You're going to have competition. So the real answer, the real question is, is how do you stand out? What makes you different than everyone else?
I think the bar's just going to get higher. Just like when we did YouTube like 5 years ago, it was much easier.
Yes.
And the bar's gone a lot higher now. We think a lot, we have to go to the studio, we have to think about the headline, we have to think about changing the headlines, we have to think about the packaging and all these things. I will say though, back in the day, so this was when I was like 25 years old, you were 26 or 27. You have to be opportunistic. And so when I saw that Zynga, the gaming company, was planning on getting into poker, I was like, hey Neil, I emailed them, they responded. I was like, let's get on a call. I was like, hey, hey Neil, Neil, let's get on this call, right? We got on the call. Unfortunately, they decided not to pursue it. But that just goes to show you that back in the day when we're still in our mid-20s, we didn't have like a lot going on. People would still respond to us. You already had a good established brand going, but I was still starting out my career.
But also we timed, you timed it right. Not even me. You saw the opportunity, you timed it right. I think that is a big part that people forget just in business and marketing. Timing is something that you can't always control, but if you get lucky on the timing, it can do wonders for you. But yes, you got to stand out. But if you can time things right, a lot of people aren't that Johnny-on-the-spot that you mentioned. They're not executing fast enough, and you can be one of the first people and feel like, oh, it's worth a call.
Yeah. Well, I mean, like, look, if you listen to this podcast, it's like, what do we start to talk about? Oh, oh, you know, somebody passed recently, or Neil's kids, for example, right? Like for sure, that's the topic that's on your mind, right? So how do you align with that? Oh, well, Neil's interested in buying things that makes his life easier and oh, he should get a Matic robot. Did you get yours yet?
It never arrived yet.
Oh, mine just got here on Monday, so it'll take a little longer. But my point is, it's like you just do a little more research and hopefully you can set some type of workflow up for you in the future. And I'll just point out when is a good time to message someone and when did they mention something compelling.
Yeah, and on a side note, because I know we're getting close to the end, I think we should end off on how, do you see how Google dropped the support for several rich result types to simplify their search results page?
No.
They're going back to the old day. Remember how Google used to just have 10 blue links? It was really simple. Then they integrated ads, then they had all these feature snippets and stuff like that, then AI overviews. You— I'm assuming most people would agree when you look at a Google search result page now, there's just a lot on there.
I don't think I usually click to the organic result anymore.
I still do. I skip most of the paid results. I do look at the AOR reviews, but I do skip to organic results. I, or I mean, I mainly skip over paid results most of the time. Most people do from all the data we've seen, but there's just too much from People also ask to the organic results, to videos, to images, to audio. And I'm not saying these things are bad for Google search results. It's just sometimes it's too overwhelming where they're including too much on a page. I do think it's a smart move to just simplify. We moved into a world where people just want the answers.
Yeah.
For their search queries. They don't want to just be bombarded with, you know, NASCAR logos everywhere.
And that's the way that I see That's how the web was in the beginning.
Yeah, and I think that's where it's gotten to in which there's just logos everywhere and it's just overwhelming. People just want simplified solutions that just give them the answer to their problems.
And when you say rich result types, are you talking about like the local pack or like what type of rich result types are you talking about?
They're testing removing quite a few and they're talking about what's being removed, book actions, course info, claim review, estimated salary, learning videos, special announcements, vehicle listings, So they're starting to just simplify things. I think what they're doing, if I had to guess, is removing the elements, the rich results for the stuff that people aren't really engaging with frequently.
Yeah. Let's end it on this one because we still have a couple minutes here to hit our 80. So you have this one on, there's a summer slowdown happening for marketing agencies each year, even if your traffic doesn't dip.
Yeah, for some reason in the marketing world, people tell me like, oh, summer's not that bad for us. We still see tons of traffic. I'm like, Yes, but look at how much revenue you close. And the more upstream you go, the more you'll see it because you live and die by the deal because one deal can make your business or crush your business. We really see it where that one deal, or we really see it where it's harder to get those big deals during the summer months because a lot of the people who sign off on that stuff are on vacations. And that's why we actually see there's a slowdown. We see it in the US, we see it in Europe. We don't see it as much in Asia, but we definitely see it in US, Europe, and Latin America.
Because in Asia, all we know how to do is work.
It applies to you too.
You're Asian too, technically. But speaking of which, are you guys going on vacation? Have you started to set up this, this like yearly vacation with your family? What's the deal?
Oh, I already have our vacations planned. They're in my calendar, technically.
Vacations?
Vacations.
Wow.
So next week I do New York, week after I do New York again for another event. Then the week after, Disneyland.
Okay.
Okay. Then I got to go to Hong Kong for another event. Then I got a break, which is nice. Then another week of a break. Then I had to go to Bogotá, it looks like. Then I got a break. I tend to spend more time with my kids during the summer. And then the week after, taking them to Hotel Coronado.
That's San Diego?
Uh-huh. So we'll do like the zoo and all that kind of stuff.
Oh, so you're doing local, like, staycations?
We do local staycations. Kids are really young. It's a pain to take them on a plane.
Yeah.
I don't, I haven't really tried it.
5 and 3, no?
6 and 4.
6.
Yeah.
I feel like I'm not a father, but I feel like that's a good age.
To take them on a plane?
Yeah. Is he as good as ChatGPT?
It could be, but I think it's just easier to do the staycations. We're waiting for both the kids to be 5 because that was the number Syed gave me. He's saying it's really easy to take them on trips once they're 5. Yeah. And they're happy with the local stuff. So we're just going to try staycations this year. Next year, because they'll be 5 and 7.
Wow.
So then, then we'll start thinking about trips that we can do on a plane. I am thinking this year sometime to taking the kids to Seattle to visit one of my buddies, Kevin, because his kids are the same age and our kids get along really well. And that's a short flight, 2 and a half hours. So I'm thinking that could work.
That's a good one.
All right. Cool.
Well, that's it for today, guys. Please don't forget to rate, review, subscribe, and we'll see you tomorrow.
