The Unusual Way We Give Feedback at Our Companies

Do you think your feedback style is unusual and have you changed it over the years?

What do you mean by feedback style?

The way you give feedback to people is pretty direct, you would say?

Yeah.

Yeah. Talk about the unusual way that you give feedback at your company and if you've changed it at all over the years.

I was talking to someone the other day and she knew I was getting frustrated. She was telling me, she's like, Neil, the problem with you is if you're not working with someone who is really smart, and she's not saying I'm smart, Oh, she's implying it. I'm not saying that's true. If you're not working with someone who's really smart, you just don't get along with them and you don't have the patience and you're just ready to figure it out some other way.

True.

And I was like, eh, you probably have a good point. But yeah, I've always been direct. The reason I love working with her specifically is she's smart. And when I try to make a change or I want to do something, she'll provide me data really quickly and tell me if something, how much it can hurt the business based on the change I want to make or how much it could help.

So in essence, she's learned how to really work with you and what you like and what you don't like.

Yeah, but I don't work with her much at all. Like, I would say over a course of a year, on a normal year, I may only have 3 hours worth of conversations with her.

That's a lot. For the year. For the year. For the whole year. Okay, that's not a lot. That's not a lot. Yeah. The reason why I bring this up is because maybe a younger version of me in my mid-20s or so, I would care about what people think, right? And so what would happen is I would be inauthentic. And what happens is I start to sit on the side and I watch if they can figure it out. And the longer I wait, the more pissed off I get. I get more and more and more pissed off. I just wait and wait and wait and then I just explode, right? And then, so then the intensity comes out. The change now, I would say in our 30s or so, you've been doing it consistently, but I realized I'm just like, you know, someone might cry, someone might quit, someone might get emotional, but I'm not going to not be me. I'm going to be authentic, right? And we talked about it with my team recently. And then actually we had a meeting because someone's like, Oh, I'm worried about, you know, Eric's feedback style rubbing people the wrong way and people quitting. And actually, 2 people that worked with me for a while that really understand me was like, for one, you guys shouldn't try to protect people from Eric. Okay, that's wrong in an organization. I'm sure people tried to protect— have tried to protect the organization from you before, maybe, right?

Yes.

That's not the right way.

Still probably to this day.

Yeah. And I think that's actually the wrong thing to do, right? Because that sets a precedent. Oh, like, keep people away from Neil. Like, no, he's just trying to help. You have no other incentive than to just help the company. Yes.

And when I help, or when you help, We don't think it makes the person that we're helping look bad. We're just trying to accomplish the goal. And we look at it as one big team and it benefits everyone.

Yep.

And people take it, oh, if Neil or Eric, right? We have separate companies, but still they look at founders in general. If they had to help someone, someone didn't do their job. And we don't look at it that way. You know, I was talking to someone the other day and I was like, oh, you should, we really want this person. Because they're like, oh, I got this amazing person that we want to end up hiring. And they're like, oh, they're 50/50. And I was like, cool, before they can give you the no, I was like, let them talk to Mike or I, my co-founder, and we'll help close them. And most people look at that as, oh, well, if we have to get your help to close them, then we didn't do our job. And I'm like, no, you know, and I know what they're thinking without them saying, like, just put us on the phone and we'll help. Good job on finding them. Let's go. I don't care if someone did everything perfect or not. Work as a team and just solve all problems.

Yeah. And that's the founder's job to jump around and sprinkle the magic every now and then. And to wrap up my point here, someone else that has worked with me for about 5 years now was like, you know, when you're inauthentic before, you kind of just sat back and waited for people to figure it out. And I could tell you're getting more and more pissed off. And that led to destruction, right? She's like, yeah, like, no, you shouldn't change, right? And I'm like, yeah, and I won't change. And the thing is this, if the feedback you're giving or the feedback I'm giving, if it actually works, if it actually, If you give direct feedback, the best case scenario is they get better. Okay. The second best is they quit. Okay. The worst is if you don't give feedback and they stay, that is the worst. Right. And so that's why I think you need to figure out what works for you. It might like, they're like, my CEO is the way he gives feedback. He's so nice. It's, but it's, he's so nice, but it works. It's extremely—

Really?

Yeah. It's extremely direct, but it's so nice and it's extremely disarming. I was like, I don't have the patience for that, but it's so effective and it balances me out really well. Yeah.

You know, it's just like, hey, John, you're really terrible at this. Here's how you can fix it. But like saying it in a nice voice. I have learned one thing about myself.

All right, so I wanted to take a moment to tell you about my podcast co-host Neil's agency called NP Digital. And they work with a whole host of global companies or global organization. Also, Neil has SEO tools such as Ubersuggest and AnswerThePublic. All you have to do is go to npdigital.com to learn more. And we'll see you on the other side.

I am slowly starting to change how I give feedback in my personal life because I remember my daughter, Emma, she told me a few months ago, you know, we were sitting in bed, this was late at night. I like putting the kids to bed. She tells me, she's like, Daddy, you know, I can tell that you're getting— she's 5. She's like, Daddy, I can tell that you're getting really frustrated with me. And I'm like, yes, I'm getting frustrated. And I was stern with her 'cause I'm like, you're not listening. And I'm telling you certain things like, don't jump off the couch, you're gonna get hurt. And she's like, you keep doing it. And she's just like, well, you need to understand I'm a kid.

Wow.

And you need to be more patient with me. And you need to talk to me as if I'm your child and not an employee at your company.

Wow.

Because they hear some of my calls, right? Because it's like on speaker.

Yeah.

And I have a habit. I never really hold the phone to my ear. I'm always on speaker.

Yeah.

And I'm like, you are right. I need more patience because I feel bad.

She's 1,000% right.

Right?

Yeah.

And then I'm like, but you also need to listen once I I'm gonna tell you something once or twice because I'm telling you for your own good. And she's like, I'll try, but you also need to understand I'm a kid and sometimes I just can't help myself and do what I want to do even if you don't like it.

Wow.

And I was like, okay. And she is right, but I'm trying. But even with my children, I get frustrated after like the third time of telling them something.

Well, I wouldn't know. I don't have kids, but you would know way more than I do. All right, that's it for today, guys. Please don't forget to rate, review, subscribe. Go to marketingschool.io/agency to learn more about the Agency Owners Association to grow faster, and we'll see you tomorrow.