#121 Forgotten Treasures, New Luxury: Circular Jewelry with Rouvenat’s Marie Berthelon Gaviard

Welcome to the Proteus Leader Show, a podcast for forward-looking leaders driving transformation in their organizations, within their teams, or for themselves. Your host today is a senior leader at Proteus International, a firm that partners with companies around the world to make true transformation easier through change consulting, leadership development, and executive coaching. If you're looking for fresh perspectives and practical insights, can take back to work today, you're in the right place. Enjoy the episode.

Welcome to the Proteus Leader Show, where we explore how to lead with clarity, courage, and humanity in a rapidly changing world. Today, I'm joined by a leader who is helping reshape what luxury means in the 21st century, Marie Bertelon. Marie is the co-founder and CEO of Rouvna, Historic French jewelry maison born in 1852 and relaunched in 2022 with a bold mission: to redefine luxury jewelry around modern and sustainable values. Rouvenat works with pierres anciennes, joaillerie nouvelle— old stones, new jewelry— and champions a circular vision of luxury encapsulated in the tagline: Rouvna invents a new luxury and the hashtag, hashtag circular jewelry. Before Rouvna, Marie spent over 20 years in leadership roles across some of the world's most prestigious luxury houses: Hermès in New York, Cartier in Paris, De Beers Jewellers in London, and senior executive and board roles with LVMH and Richemont. She has led global strategy, marketing, and development and has long been personally committed to responsible responsible and ethical business and to building and inspiring high-performing teams. In our conversation today, we'll explore why she chose to leave big luxury groups to embark on the Rouvenar adventure, how circularity and sustainability can coexist with beauty and craftsmanship, and what it takes to build a brand around forgotten treasures in a world still obsessed with the new. Let's dive in. Welcome to the show, Marie.

Thank you very much for having me, Marie. I'm very, very pleased to join you today.

Same here. You had what many would consider a dream career in luxury, senior roles at Hermès, Cartier, De Beers, LVMH, and Richemont. Can you take us to the moment where you decided to step away from these established giants? And co-create Rouvna? What was the turning point for you?

That's a very good question. I would say that to me, a turning point is the moment that is the result of a very long path. And in fact, I think in my career, I had different moments that led me to where I am today. And it's true that at the very beginning, I went for a more conventional, I would say, type of career. Following a business school, joining the leaders of the industry with Hermès and Cartier in very secure environments that helped me to grow a lot as a manager and as an expert of this industry. For a few decades, I had this very comfortable position that did fulfill me, but I also had the chance to face different situations that got me to changed my posture as well and realized the impact I could have as a manager. One of these defining moments was my first intervention for the International Women Forum that was created by Cartier. The very first edition happened probably like 15 years ago, and I was part of the first promotion, and I was mentoring and coaching young women entrepreneurs. I spent a whole year walking side by side with a young woman from Africa. She had an incredible project. She was like 28 years old. And I must say, I was like very admirative of what she was doing, what she was willing to achieve, the conviction she was putting in her project. She didn't have the tools, she didn't have the whole organization, but when I saw her will, her deep knowledge of what she wanted to achieve, I was very moved at the time.

Wow, it's amazing you give this example because we're celebrating International Women's Day this week, so this couldn't be a better timing. And thank you for everything you've done for young women.

Absolutely. As a woman, I was impressed. My personal and cultural background was not into entrepreneurship, not for women at least. And I must say, to see her was inspiring to me. So I think it's great to be open and to be able to be inspired by Many types of people. Sometimes you won't realize who is impacting you more. Another important moment in my career was when I was at De Beers. It was in 2011, and the world was starting to change, and people were really starting to consider the impact on the environment. But before that, really, we didn't realize what was going on. And De Beers was piloting for the LIFE program for the environment within LVMH. And I wanted to take this opportunity to be a pioneer within the group. with the LIFE program. And I found this experience striking because at first, everybody in the company was against. It was about reducing the carbon footprint, to rethink all the way to do visual merchandising, not to make waste, throw away all the materials we were using for the windows, etc. So it was in fact a deep change and everybody was very much against.

Hmm.

But suddenly, by creating a group of people, we managed to change the mindset and to create a group of advocates With a great energy. And after a few months, everybody wanted to join.

I'm so happy you're making this point, Marie, because change and transformation is at the core of what we do at Proteus. And we focus on the human side and change of mindset. And key ways is to create momentum with change agents and then the wider group follow.

Indeed. And we can spend a lot of time on change management. To me, like, it's the key. If you can have all the best ideas in the world, if you don't have the team and the core behind with great persons, you can walk by yourself, but you won't go far for sure.

Yes, it stays on paper.

Exactly. Maybe another of my points, and this is probably the one that led me to where I am today, was at Cartier. Cartier was called back by the CEO at the time, Cyril Vigneron, to join because he saw what I was doing at De Beers. With the Life program, and I did implement the first blockchain at De Beers as well. It's been a long journey. And he asked me to come back to be in charge of the jewelry, but also to implement sustainable practices. And I found I was perfectly legitimate to go for that because I had this view of LVMH, this other culture, plus I knew Cartier so well. It's been my family for years. So I joined convinced I would be able to make a big change at Cartier. And you started to. And I worked on it. And after probably a year and a half, I was like, okay, Cartier is a beautiful maison, but it is so big. The structure, the supply chain, the way to consider the business are so deeply anchored in the model that for the very first time in my life, I felt a bit powerless. And I could see that I wouldn't be able to make important changes. This is when an opportunity occurred. And I think for me, the shift is a conjunction of a long journey, a personal need, because I wanted to make things move faster, and an opportunity. Because at this very moment, some of my old colleagues started to think on their side on the impact they could have on the jewelry industry. And they called me and they were like, Marie, would you want to think about it with us? And I was like, oh, you know what, maybe it's the right moment. To quit the very comfortable position that is mine because I have the feeling inside, because this is the right time, because I see the right person around. And these opportunities do not happen all the time in life. So this is how I quit Cartier and I jumped in the unknown, probably also because I didn't know everything that was coming. But this is how I reached this point.

Got it. So on one end, you were frustrated because as a change agent, you couldn't lead the change as much as you wanted. And on the other side, maybe it's Timeliness, right? The opportunity, you being ready for that adventure.

Absolutely.

Fantastic.

Absolutely.

Now let's talk about Rouvna. So what I know about Rouvna is that it's a historic maison founded in 1852 and relaunched in 2022 with a very contemporary mission and a strong circular economy angle. So what is the story behind Rouvna and how did you land on this idea of Forgotten Treasures Becoming the Heart of a New Kind of Luxury.

So this started with an observation that I could make at Cartier, where I had the chance to purchase the stone together with a team of stone buyers and creative directors. It's a whole combination. And here I could see that all the big maisons in jewelry will look for standards and caliber, which means that, for example, if you buy sapphire, At Cartier, at Harry Winston, at De Beers, you will always have the same type of color whether you are in Paris, New York, Tokyo, London. No matter what, there is a promise of quality, constant colors, and standards.

Identical. You want identical versus unique.

Exactly. And when I was buying these stones, I could see in front of my eyes all these stones that were accepted because they were fitting in the standards, and then there were all other stones that were on the side that we didn't take because they were different, and that to me were the most interesting, the most intriguing, the more beautiful. And I could realize that in fact these stones, nobody is really doing anything with them because they are unique, it's small quantities, they deserve a specific mount, explanation, it's not easy.

Right.

And I had this frustration and I could see that this stone existed I was buying them actually with an amazing woman who is working with us today. And so I was, okay, there is a market here in terms of supply chain. There is a whole bunch of material that is not being used and that is beautiful. And today all the maisons in jewelry want to adapt the stone to the mount and will keep on digging the ground to extract new stones, whereas over 70% of the stones are already extracted from the ground. And sleep in the safe and vaults of stone dealers, auction maisons, clients as well.

What a waste.

Yes, what a waste. I'm sure you have a stone at home belonging to a grandmother, and we don't dare to touch it because it's not in the culture to transform. Luckily, the world is changing, and so I could see that on the market, at the same time, the behaviors were changing. People get more curious, they want to accept the change to remount pieces and to go for unique pieces. And so this is very much the beginning, I would say, of Rouvenat, to see that there is in the supply chain a stock available of beautiful unique treasures that are forgotten because nobody knows what to do with them. On the other hand, you have a need from the market because many clients are more mature, They are a bit tired with norms, normative jewelry, and they will be looking for more storytelling, more unique pieces, more soul in a way in their jewelry.

And they're thinking of the planet too.

They will care. I had this conviction that the supply chain and the market are ready for a new adventure and that Rovena had to play something about it. But then I went for a lot of tests. Because, you know, I think there is a big difference between what you believe and what is the reality. And I could challenge my ideas. And to be honest, it took me over a year to think of the business model, to challenge it, to discuss with experts in the industry, and at the end, to really find the right community around me. I see that entrepreneurial adventure as a collective adventure almost. And I saw that around me were many advocates. With the same belief as I'd had that jewelry could be doing beautiful objects, but to do them in a beautiful way as well, with lots of respect, with lots of caring for what is already existing. And this is how Rouvenat became the very first entreprise à mission. I know this is a very French word, but this is a status that came with a law. And in fact, in your corporate status, you have a mission even before doing turnover. And for me, this was what I wanted to achieve with Rouvenat. At Cartier, I had this frustration of not being able to change quick enough, and I was sure, and I am still sure, that you can do a beautiful business, but you can do it with lots of respect for the people around you, for the stones, for the materials, and for your industry. And so the mission of Rouvenat is to revalorize human and natural resources All along the supply chain. I do believe in that with all my heart. I believe you can share one point of margin with the person who will look for the stone for you. It's not much for you, but it will change the whole industry. And I hope the model will prove right. Wow, beautiful.

For our listeners, this is a corporation with a mission that you said so beautifully. And I heard A few things you needed to surround yourself with the right people and really meet that need and belief with a lot of iteration to validate your ideas. I think it will be music to the ears of a lot of entrepreneurs. And finally, really following that mission at the core and driving that change in the industry.

That was very interesting to see that at first the people around could be skeptical as well. We come back to what you said about managing the change. It's not really in the culture of jewelry, to look for ancient stones, to do unique pieces. And so it was interesting to see how much you can like ping-pong and discuss with sparring partners who will at some moments disturb you, because when you have a strong belief, it's not easy to listen to somebody go for something completely different. But at the end of the day, after long discussions, we managed to create really a team of advocates That are now our best supports, people from finance, people from the world of stones, but also some business angels that are really of great strategic support.

Amazing. And that leads me to my next question, because you really have worked at the center of the global jewelry and luxury ecosystems for decades, right? And from that vantage point, how do you see the tension, or perhaps the synergy, between traditional luxury And sustainability? Where is the industry doing well and where is it lacking behind?

Well, it's a beautiful question, Marie. I think overall the jewelry industry is a bit late. Like when you talk about circularity, you will think about fashion, about everything that goes fast. Jewelry is a bit particular because in the global mindset and culture, everybody believes Jewelry is already durable in a way, and it's because jewelry is something that will pass through generations. So in the future, it is durable, but the supply is not really durable because again, about digging the ground in some places where there are wars or conflicts and the working conditions can be very tough. But people do not really want to look at that. And I would say the industry doesn't really need to look at that because the clients in luxury jewelry are not so tough as they can be on fashion, for example, because we don't see the big risk. So I would say the industry wants to, of course, improve, but they don't have emergency to do so quickly and to do so deeply. What I see today in the world of jewelry, there are beautiful initiatives. The RJC, Responsible Jewelry Council, was founded in 2005 And it was a major shift in the industry because it talked about conflict-free stones, which is one of the big impacts for jewelry. You don't want to finance wars with your precious stones, of course. There is now the Watch and Jewelry Initiative 2030 that has been built with Kering, Cartier, and some other maisons. And this is great. Honestly, I'm very happy that the industry is going in this way, but To me, they are more like building bridges between luxury and sustainability. I love the word you are using when you talk about synergy or creative tension, because I believe this whole way to bring sustainability into jewelry must go deeply. It's not only putting a bandage on a broken arm.

Yeah.

It is more about rethinking completely A model to create something that has a meaning and a purpose. It's not because you try to do a bit good here and a bit good there. So this is what we try to do at Rouvenat, and this is why I told you we spent more than a year and a half to work on the business model, because we really try to transform it completely.

Yes.

And instead, instead of trying to adapt nature to the craft, we want you to adapt the craft to nature. And this is a complete change in paradigm. And again, it goes back to the mission. I believe in respecting the nature, everything that is around us. I think this is how people and materials can shine. So if you put a stone on the right mount, this stone will be able to shine. You don't need to cut it again, you don't need to polish this way or this way. And this is what we do at Rouvenat by having a certain number of mounts But they are all eco-created so that they can welcome any type of stone. And I think it's very different. And this is when I really talk about synergy. And again, thank you for your question, because if you just try to put things on top of the other, the result won't be so natural. When things come for a reason with a purpose, then it will have a specific soul and mission, maybe.

Yes, I can feel the big difference, right? Because it's not incremental, in addition to, on the side, you add the sustainability team. With Rouvna, it's really at the core of what you do, why you exist almost, you know. So that's so beautifully said. And as a co-founder and CEO, I feel like you're not just building a brand, but a culture and a business model rooted in responsible circular practices. And so I'm very curious about what role do you hope Rouvenat will play in shaping the future of luxury, as it's such a different approach?

Yes, this is the interesting part when you are a startup. At some point you need to be more humble, of course, because as a maison we are still small. But it is true that I see something, a bright future for Rouvenat. And as a corporate with a mission, I really hope we will be able to impact the whole industry. So by creating this circular approach in the stone industry, we've been building a new supply chain by showing and being able to prove that a stone is ancient. Whereas today everybody wants to see where the stone comes from, we want to say when the stone was taken from the ground, thinking that Everything that is over 10 years, 20 years, 30 years old is always better than something that will be taken today. And so we've been creating this supply of ancient stones that is all put into a blockchain today for Rouvenat, but everything we do is open. So our blockchain is open source, and the way to source the ancient stone is also very open.

Okay.

And I think in a way, when you do something like that, there are so many available stones around That it's okay if other maisons join us and that we will be much stronger together. And this is not such a popular way to work in today's world of jewelry, but to me, this is how the future should be shaped so that everybody can access these ancient stones. And just as an example, we've created recently a supply for ancient diamonds, and we are now opening it to two other maisons of jewelry, sister maisons. And we do it very openly because this is the finality. In a way of what we do. So we could have a certification for ancient stone from Rouvenat. Wow.

That reminds me of what you told me about Rouvenat and that he was such an innovator at his time. And in a way, having that name, I'm sure it's going to bring you luck and you can drive that innovation within the entire industry.

Yes, I hope it will work, but it's always very interesting to see how much passion and creativity will create communities. and federate around the project. You can approach sustainability as a major constraint and it becomes something heavy, and then you lose the pleasure and the joy. And when you buy a piece of jewelry, everything should be about pleasure and joy. So this is when the constraint can be turned into a creative mindset and go over this problematic situation instead of being guilty, instead of being heavy, You go for, okay, let's make it fun. Let's make it creative. Let's make it joyful. And I think it is part of the soul of Froufna Maison today. We try to embrace everything that we do with this mindset of creativity, openness, and I hope that it shows.

It shows. I can feel it through the screen, like that joy, pleasure, and creativity, really using that new supply chain model to make pieces more unique with better stories and beauty. So. Thank you for sharing that. We love leaving our listeners with some practical tips. So I'm thinking about listeners who would want to bring more sustainability thinking into their own organizations, whether they work in luxury or not. What are 3 to 4 practical actions they can start taking now to move from good intentions to real change? And if you can add a tip or two for women leaders, As we are in this special celebration of International Women's Day, I welcome them.

Maybe the first thing is to say that as women, we can make things differently. It took me some time to be like, okay, as a woman, I can do that with my children, with my life. I was fearing not to be able to do it. And I think, in fact, we can embrace entrepreneurship, we can embrace change and probably sustainability. like nobody else. So, you're a woman, I truly believe we have a different view on things. We can challenge business models. And to me, it's a strength and it's important to trust ourselves. Everything that we can have in terms of intuition and different way of feeling things, give it a go. Something I would say as well is that action is key and I love action. I'm always looking for things.

Yes.

But before going for something so deep, I think it's very important to think carefully. And take the time for thinking carefully about it. Think deeply, test your ideas, your concept, think about the objections. Because as you said before, Marie, people can be reactive to change, always convinced about it. And for sure, when you bring a new idea, you will be very much challenged. And you can go through any type of challenge if you are like 3,000% convinced yourself. About all the answers so you can convince your industry. So, I think it sometimes can feel a bit long, but, you know, this ping-pong way to challenge, to think through deeply what you want to achieve is very important so you are well prepared. At the beginning, I was doing it a lot by myself, but you see very quickly that you need to be surrounded by people with another point of view, with other perspectives, with other— Your priorities, and you can't ignore that.

So, it's preparation and collaboration to get all those challenges and questions.

To me, it's take the time to surround yourself and be sure you can count on a few people around you that will be able to tell you the truth, to support you, to think with you. But to have these advocates, particularly if you want to bring a change in your organization, will make you much more powerful, I believe. Because you will be like a real team conveying one idea in different manners. So the surrounding to me is key.

Yes.

Maybe another one would be to dare to go. Once you think, you thought through it, and you have people around you, dare to go because it's never completely perfect. Particularly when you want to talk about sustainability, it's hard because you can't be perfect. What I do a lot at Rouvenat is to say that I go to progress. And I go for it with lots of humility. And I see that I tend maybe to do something absolutely perfectly and to have the business model that is flawless. But in the meantime, let's try to improve year on year. And so we have tools to measure our improvement. We like to say, okay, now we have 95% of the stones that are more than 20 years old, so that you start somewhere. Otherwise, you will never start. And your idea will stay like that. So let's accept to be humble and at some point to go for it and to show how you will be progressing, accepting that it's not necessarily perfect.

Hmm.

This inspires this idea for when you are an entrepreneur and you want to go for sustainability, it is key to have a big picture and to be very clear on what you want to achieve, what is your goal, but it's great as well to accept to do baby steps.

Yes.

Sometimes, because this way you can be able to test, to adjust a lot, to pivot, to improve, to listen. And I think that big picture, baby steps, and some bold moves.

Wow.

So many insights. The first one you said is embrace, if you're a woman, embrace it because you have strengths that nobody else has. Then think before you act. Be prepared with the challenges and getting inputs from different people.

Think and think twice.

Think twice, yes. Surround yourself. And I would say, we talked about that before the podcast, but with people who are different from you, who can complement maybe and avoid blind spots you might have. Then daring greatly, right? That book from Brené Brown is always close to my Mind, but like daring. Even if you're not perfect, you're not fully ready, you need to go for it. And that final idea you said, big picture, baby steps. I think it's helpful because if you only see the top of the mountain, it feels almost impossible to get there. But then step after step, you get closer to the top.

Absolutely. And for that, you need a great team. One thing I find fantastic in entrepreneurship is that you can hire people who will share your vision. Uh, you might say, and they will take the ownership and it becomes their challenge. And to me, I think I've been revisiting completely the management overall in a startup like that, not only because I hire mostly women, but also because I am very impressed and inspired by the people in my team now that will be taking your idea and create something that is even different from what you had in mind, but that is beautiful. And to me, this capacity of having great women around me, taking ownership for what they do, coming with proposals, creativity, and joy is a fantastic experience, really.

I'm so excited thinking about Rouvenat, and thank you so much, Marie, for this conversation, because I believe you've shown us that luxury doesn't have to be about excess or constant newness. It can be about respect. For materials, for history, for craftsmanship, for the people and the planet. So your journey from major luxury groups to co-founding Rouvna brings the circular economy to life in a very tangible, beautiful way and offers a hopeful model for how other leaders and brands might rethink what value really means. So for those listening who would like to learn more, You can discover Rouvna's Worlds and its Pierre Ancienne Joaillerie Nouvelle at rouvna.com and follow @rouvnaofficial on social media, Instagram. And if you'd like more support in evolving your own leadership and your organization toward a more sustainable future, we'd love to welcome you at proteus-international.com. Thank you for tuning in, and until next time, here's to creating the sustainable leadership you truly want. Merci, Marie.

Thank you so much, Marie, and good luck to Proteus International.

Thank you so much.

Bye-bye.

Thanks for listening to the Proteus Leader Show. We hope you're leaving with ideas you can put to use on your team, in your organization, or in your own career. To learn more about how we support true transformation through change consulting, leadership development, and executive coaching, visit us at proteus-international.com. Until next time.