Infinite Banking Process in 2026

Welcome in, welcome in. We are live. Happy that you all are here. We're going to be discussing the infinite banking concept, infinite banking strategy, by simply showing a real policy that has been in force now for 8 years in September, we're literally in the anniversary month of this particular policy. So for those of you that are brand new tuning in on the YouTube channel, or those of you that are clients, subscribers to the Increase Academy, or you're part of another nonprofit group that's in collaboration with Finance Geek Ministry, or you've purchased any one of my courses in the past Or you're a loyal subscriber on my email newsletter, most likely you've been invited to the Zoom room and we get to hang out there. I am looking at those questions, those folks, and we're spending quality, quality time together. In addition, we're live on YouTube. So those of you that are coming in live, appreciate you being here. Those of you that are catching the recording, if this is the very first video that you're watching, this is going to be a little bit more in-depth. I'm gonna layer in some beginner foundations and fundamentals as it pertains to infinite banking, but more importantly, this is for people who have been doing the concept, getting ready to start practicing it, and you either want to see some proof, you want to see like a real policy that's been enforced for a number of years, you want to see how other people have been using their policy to build wealth, pay off debt, build wealth tax-free, leverage, you know, pay back loans, you name it, this policy contains that. And so I'm excited to share that with you. So we're not going to waste any more time, we're going to dive right into it. Got the numbers already set on the board. Starting on the left-hand side are the really base numbers, foundation numbers for this life insurance policy and the individual that we're going to be discussing about. So go back 8 years ago, that is when I, Denzel Rodriguez, started writing whole life insurance on other folks. I myself acquired a whole life policy on myself, so I was my own first customer and began to practice this in addition to my financial coaching business that I also started in 2018. So I was helping people primarily get out of debt, fix their credit, increase their cash flow, help them save more money, positioning them to invest at a later point in time. Meanwhile, I was personally putting money away into a whole life insurance contract, building it up. And then on the side, whenever I came across clients that were looking into infinite banking, they were interested in life insurance and coverage, I would then have conversations with them, partnered with different agencies over the last 8 years to help people put policies in force. In 2018, I believe I helped about maybe 10 people or so put life insurance in, in place. So those are going to be my oldest policies, is anyone that I helped in 2018. There was only a handful of people. I had just started helping folks towards the end of 2018, so really the last 3, 4 months of the year. In 2019, I want to say it helped about 100 families, maybe give or take. I think that resulted in maybe 80 policies, right? Because not all of those 100 families acquired a life insurance policy. But because of the YouTube channel and some of the partners that maybe they didn't work with me directly, but I referred them. So I do want to say it was probably over 100 families or so. So that's gonna be the next batch of oldest policies of case studies that I'm gonna be, you know, consistently producing and sharing with you all. And it's really, really cool. Infinite banking is a very, very slow process, especially in the first 3 to 5 years. So it's not a fast, sexy thing in the early years, and that tends to hold up a lot of people. Totally granted, makes total sense why most are either not qualified for the strategy or they're comparing it to other things That would make their money grow much faster, and so I'm going to prove that to be the case. I'm going to validate some of the feelings and emotions people have towards infinite banking. Like you're totally right; this makes sense. Then I'm gonna approach it from a different angle as to why it still makes sense, even though the quote unquote rate of return, the growth of the policy, is not attractive. In fact. It's it's less than attractive. It actually produces a negative return, usually in the first three to five years. A negative return, probably even longer than that. Some upwards of seven to ten years, depending on how you design a whole life insurance contract. That the the net rate of return on these things actually produce a negative. So. If we're just looking at one aspect, cash value in a life insurance contract— this is usually the most talked about thing in infinite banking— if you're just looking at that one measurement and you're comparing it to investing in the stock market, doing real estate, even something as simple as saving money in a savings account, you're absolutely going to do far better in all those other accounts over whole life insurance. But yet there's still tons of people doing this. And so we're going to dive into that and see why that is and look at this in its whole entirety of all the value-added pieces that goes into this. So looking at the board, left-hand side just simply breaks down all the details. Person started the policy at age 22. This is a female. Okay. Company we went with was MassMutual. MassMutual is one of the most reliable, recognized, largest preferred mutually owned whole life insurance carriers that You're able to specially design a whole life insurance contract towards cash value accumulation over death benefit. There are other carriers that I personally like. MassMutual and Guardian are my top 2. Those are my favorite. That's just my personal preference, but But there are companies like Lafayette, Ameritas, OneAmerica, Penn Mutual. These are some of your other popular carriers that most life insurance agents will use when discussing infinite banking concept, infinite banking strategy, where you're designing the policy to accumulate cash value much faster than 90+% of whole life policies that are sold in America today. So if you're someone that's coming across infinite banking for the first time, you have to understand that 90%, probably 95% almost, of whole life insurance contracts that are written today in America Are vastly different than a whole life insurance policy that is written for the purpose of practicing this concept, infinite banking. To be clear, infinite banking is not a product. You can't buy it off the shelf. You can't call any carrier and say, give me an infinite banking policy. They won't know what to do. So it's not something that you can literally just pick off a shelf and get. When you're looking into infinite banking, what you're literally doing is building a car from scratch, a literal car from scratch, and adding in all the components. That's what you're doing with an insurance agent. You are customizing this thing, layering so many different elements. There's so many conversations. There are a lot of moving parts, and that's the expectation I like to set with a lot of clients when I work with them. People are interested in this. I'm like, this is not something we're just taking off a shelf. Like, give me that model, give me this, you know, design. There's a lot that, that goes into it, and we have to have the right frameworks, the right mindset, the right comparisons, etc., etc., so that You do not get buyer's remorse years down the road. I have been blessed because of the way that I move as a business owner, as an individual, ethically in this, in this business. It can be tempting to write life insurance for anyone that comes through your door as a business owner because of the commissions that are attached to this. You can make a lot of money. Doing the wrong thing. That's the truth. You can make a lot of money in this business preaching infinite banking, let's say, but designing it like most Americans know to be the case. And what I mean by that is, let's say your premium on a whole life policy is $10,000 per year, for example. Let's say, let's say your premium is $10,000 per year. Okay, so you're committing to paying $10,000, contributing $10,000 into a whole life insurance contract every single year. And whatever the death benefit is, you're not really paying much mind to it because you were sold, let's say, IBC. Someone said Yep, I know how to do infinite banking. I'll design that policy for you. Because you don't know all the elements and how this thing fully works, you're getting your information pretty much directly from the agent. She or he is talking and explaining it to you, so you don't know what you don't know. This is unfortunate. This, this happens. My channel exists to expose this information. And help people learn more. So here's what happens ninety plus percent of the time: that ten grand, a hundred percent of it goes to cost of insurance whole life. As the agent, if they do this. 100% of your $10,000 goes to premium, cost of insurance, whole life protection. Then that agent, depending on their contract, let's say they have a commission of 100%. You just gave them a $10,000 check on your one policy. So they're gonna make $10,000 on that one policy if their commission is 100% off the base premium, right? They sold you infinite banking, but they did not design the policy to actually accommodate for this strategy. So they get a $10,000 check that the insurance company Pays the agent. You, the customer, you're looking at your policy year 1, and guess what? You have $0 in cash value. Okay, that's how most whole life policies are written, not for infinite banking. And some nefarious players out there who are doing something to this effect. Okay, now let's say you are a little more educated on life insurance and you understand that, hey, not— I don't think 100% of my money should be going to whole life insurance. And if you're speaking with the agent, you're wanting to do infinite banking, maybe They take 80% and put it towards cost of insurance. The other 20% goes towards cash value. In other words, paid-up additions is the legal terminology. That's still not Infinite banking from a policy design perspective. From a policy design perspective, that's still not infinite banking. Alright, this agent went from getting a $10,000 check. In this example, they're gonna make $8,000, right? Because 80% of your $10,000 went to cost of insurance, the other 20% cash value, $2,000. Went to cash value, and year 1, maybe your cash value is about maybe $1,500, right? That's still not infinite banking. So from an infinite banking policy design perspective, there is a range. This range exists between 60/40 and 90/10. 60/40 and 90/10 is going to be your general range, what I would consider IBC Qualified. Then from here, it's a matter of the person's age, health, finances, situation. This is where we are now entering customization. So where you're customizing this so far. Again, if anyone's got questions along the way, feel free to drop that in the chat. I will read those. Okay, so if an agent, he or she who understands infinite banking from a policy design perspective, what they are agreeing to do is take a massive haircut in their commission, in their ability to make money. Massive haircut. Same numbers, $10,000 premium. If it's a 60/40 split, meaning 60% of their money is going to cash value, or upwards of 90% is going into the PUA column, aka cash value, and anywhere from 10% to 40% is going to go towards base premium, which results in a Lower paycheck for the agent, but a massive difference for the customer in terms of cash value, period. There is no disputing this. This is all facts. This is all true, no matter the carrier, as long as it's mutually owned. I have my preferences. MassMutual and Guardian are my top 2 picks. Lafayette, Meritas, One America are probably gonna be my next picks. I think I put— personally, I put Penn Mutual last on the list. That's just my own personal preference, but it's usually gonna be Mass, Guardian, maybe Lafayette. Those are like my top 3. Whichever the carrier is, let's just say the agent's commission is 100% of base premium. And they do a design anywhere from 60/40 to 90/10, they're going to get a check anywhere from $1,000 to $4,000 on the base premium expense, which is going to result in the client having a starting cash value where they dump $10,000 in, and they're going to have upwards of as high as Like $8,000+ in cash value or $6,000-ish, $5,000 to $6,000 in the very first year. That is unheard of in the life insurance industry the way majority of agents write policies. You have to know this as a customer. I discovered this As a customer. I was a customer first before I started teaching this and sharing this online, because I was like, oh my goodness, I didn't know this. Most people, most gurus online say that you put money into a whole life insurance contract and the cash value year 1 is always 0. Year 2, sometimes 0 as well. It isn't by year 3 and you got a couple hundred dollars in there, and it usually takes about 12, 10 to 15 years before the total amount of money you've paid in premiums actually shows up in cash value. I gotta wait 10 to 15+ years for that to be the case. In many cases, we're talking really 15+ years, like even 20 years. before the total amount of premiums paid versus the amount of cash value is actually equal. So from a rate of return standpoint, that is horrible. You could have had your money sitting in a savings account and would— it would have generated a much better return. Make sense? Versus if you design it for cash accumulation first And the agent is willing to reduce their commission. This is where I'm saying, like, it's very tempting to not do that. Like, I, Denzel, could write anyone in here a whole life policy, make ten grand the base premium, and get ten thousand dollar checks left and right, left, right, and center all day long. But I don't do that. If someone has ten thousand dollars a year to contribute. Their premium is going to be anywhere from as low as $1,000 to about $2,500, maybe $3,000 is going to be their base premium cost, which will result— instead of me getting a $10,000 check, I'm only going to make about maybe $1,000 to $2,000. So I would have to write 5 more policies Just to make ten grand compared to an agent out there who's leveraging the marketing hype of infinite banking and making ten thousand, eight thousand, nine thousand, seven thousand per sale and just saying, yeah, that's an infinite banking design. Da da da da. You just have to wait this many, this many years, and and people are buying it. People are doing it left and right. I see policies that are horribly designed. They're 50/50 splits. They're 80— they're like really 20/80 splits. So 20% going to cash value, 80% going to base premium. I wouldn't have a problem with that if the customer was focused on death benefit. Because if you want a higher death benefit, you need a higher base premium, period. As it pertains to permanent insurance, that makes total sense. So I have no problem with any insurance agent out there who's doing 100% of the contributions going to base premium, or, or 80 or 90 or 70, if we're just focused on death benefit. But if you're using infinite banking as a way to bring in clients and not actually designing it according to the biggest reputable credible individuals who have paved the way for infinite banking and have written books on this and have taught this years and years, I'm telling you the The biggest experts in the world are going to agree with me. It's this range right here, 60/40 to 90/10. And this 90/10 could even be like a 95/5. You can go quite— you can push it a little bit past 90/10, but you really don't want to go past 60/40. You really don't. For me personally, in my 8-year career, I've never written a 60/40 design. Never. I typically don't go that far on the design in terms of cost of insurance to cash value. I typically will stay in the range of 75/25 to 90/10, so it's usually 10 to 25%. And again, depending on the person's health, if their health isn't as great, then it might be upwards of 30% of their total money that they're contributing going to cost of insurance. All right, so now that you understand that, let's look at this case study here for a 22-year-old female, perfect health. So got the best rating, Ultra Preferred. And the design is a 90/10 split. The whole life policy is an L100 with MassMutual. We have the ability to fund $15,000 per year. The MEC limit is $18,237.63 at issue. The death benefit at issue was $970,532.74 with a base premium of $1,583. So $15K, $1,583, very close 90/10 split. The MEC limit is $18,000. So in fact, this person could actually pay in a little bit more, uh, in the first couple years. After 8 years, the cash value is somewhere around $102,000. The only reason why I don't have the exact number is they're literally in their anniversary month, so there will be some changes. They're, you know, funding their policy, so these numbers are going to shift a little bit. Total amount that they have funded into their policy over the last 8 years is $113,572, including what they've already funded so far for this year. So we're in year— we're in the beginning of year 8, okay, 2018 to 2026. We're in the beginning of year 8, which means we're receiving dividends from year 7. Applying at the beginning of year eight in the month of September, 2026. Okay, there's any questions on that? Let me know. I'm gonna I'm gonna pause and just take a look to see if there is any questions so far. So this is a great question. It says, "Hi Denzel, can you refer me to any training and information for someone who would like to learn how to write these policies?" As a business opportunity? Yes. So you can message me directly, send me an email. I'm in partnership with an agency that can help you learn how to design policies going into the software portals on the agent side for the different carriers. So you'll be able to learn it that way. They're the most popular training program out there is the Nelson Nash Institute. I've never been a part of it, so I don't know if they actually go into policy design. I'm pretty sure they would, but it is like a membership, annual membership type community. So there is some upfront costs and fees, and there's like a certification. There's a whole nine. What I have is free. You just have to get your license. You have to pay for your— what is it— your E&O insurance. But the training itself is free, and support is free. You can team up with agents along the way. So he says, I've been a longtime subscriber. I've been interested in learning more about this concept. Let's see. But see it more as an additional stream of income once I'm ready. Is there any well-regarded industry certification? Yes. So the, the only certification specifically in the infinite banking space that is recognized by all the top players is the Nelson Nash Institute. Outside of Nelson Nash Institute, it would not be worth spending any money whatsoever to any other organization other than the Nelson Nash Institute. They have an investment program, they have training, they do workshops, they have an annual conference, they have a whole entire community. Technically, they're the— the founder is Nelson Nash. He's the founder technically of this concept. He coined it Infinite Banking Concept, or becoming your own banker. Right, and built an entire community around that. But that, that's, that's the only one that I would, I would see. Are you now writing these policies? Do you work with a broker or one single entity for the policies that you write? Any information or referral? Yep, absolutely. Just message me directly. I know you've been a longtime follower. I know you have my email, so definitely get a hold of me directly. Over the last 8 years, I've partnered with multiple different agencies because in the beginning I was not confident that I could design these policies. I was a customer first. I'm a financial coach, a content creator, so I was practicing it. And then because I'm someone that talks about what they're doing in their personal finances, that whenever infinite banking came up, I would have the conversation, I'd frame it— here's what I'm doing, here's how I think these things should be designed. Here's what I've learned so far. And then I passed to an agent that I trusted who designed my policies. That's Steve Parisi. He has a YouTube channel, IBC Global, so shout out to him. He's my mentor. I've sent all my clients, the majority of my clients over the last 8 years, to his agency. They have a phenomenal customer support team, you know, policy designers, the whole night, the whole nine. It's a white glove service, always appreciated. And I have my policies with them over the years as I gotten more and more confident learning how these things are supposed to be written, and then just partnering up with people who also know how to design these. And that's been a fun process. Okay, so let me come back. Case study here. Boom. First part, first 8 years of practicing infinite banking from a customer's perspective, right? This is a customer, 22-year-old female, right? Learning infinite banking on their own. Some of the core elements that allowed them to be successful was the areas of focus that they wanted to, you know, achieve with this product. First and foremost, they just wanted to save money. They realized that saving money in a bank is inefficient long term, not safe, right? Comment, everyone here, comment. Do you feel safe storing hundreds of thousands of dollars in major banks in America in 2026 today? How confident are you storing hundreds of thousands of dollars in your checking and savings accounts? We are now living in an era today where more and more just average Americans, average people more and more are storing their money in other institutions— brokerages accounts, whole life insurance, gold, silver, cash under their mattress. They're storing it in other forms of currency, going offshore. They're doing all— because the trust in the banking system is depleting on an annual basis. We know this. We've seen the biggest gurus in the world, your Robert Kiyosakis, your Grant Cardones of the world, have been shouting this from the rooftops for years and years. Parking and storing your money in a bank is just not safe anymore. Banks themselves do not store their money in banks. They store it in properly designed whole life insurance, which is why you can look at any major bank in America today And their number one tier asset is whole life insurance, period. So the premise of infinite banking is to become your own banker. It's like, okay, as an individual living in the United States, how can I mimic in a sense what banks do? On a huge scale, bring it down to a small scale in my own economy, my household economy. That— I think that's the premise of infinite banking, is becoming your own bank, essentially mimicking what banks do long term. And the product that's going to allow them to do that in the most efficient manner is going to be a properly designed whole life insurance contract. So this person, understanding that for the first year, for the first 8 years, their intent was simply saving money. We started out simply saving $522 a month for the first few years. This policy has the ability to contribute up to $15,000 in any given year. The first two years was somewhere around six thousand two hundred dollars. So they didn't fund in the max. It's kind of like comparing to a 401k. They didn't they didn't max out their 401k. They didn't max out their whole life contributions. This was something that hey, I can commit to saving this dollar amount on a consistent monthly basis. So if you have that parameter in your life where you're already saving money, at least $500 or more every month, every year, and you have a consistency of saving money, that's gonna be a healthy parameter for the infinite banking concept, for sure. The next is, what's the strategy? What are we going to use this policy for? This person said, well, I want to finance some of my college expense through this policy and also pay off student loans. So the money that we would normally pay extra toward a debt or money that we would normally borrow to finance expenses, they decided they're gonna park it in the whole life first, have the cash value grow, and then when they need some of that cash, they're gonna borrow against it and pay off debts and finance expenses. So that's what happened the first 3 years— first 8 years. So over an 8-year period, they took about $52,000+ in loans over the last 8 years, and they've contributed a total of $113,572. Over the last eight years, starting off at five twenty-two a month, which was about six thousand two hundred. That was like the first two three years. Then it increased. They started doing ten thousand per year as their income grew. As their income grew more, they've been doing fifteen thousand per year for about four years so far. Right, so that's the journey for this particular person. They started off at a lower amount, and as their income grew, they were able to save more money. So therefore, they were able to increase the amount of money that they could put into this policy. So now it's 2026, person's 29 years old turning 30. They have an internal rate of return of 4.2% plus Inside of the whole life policy on the cash value side. So 4.2%, it's not a lot, but understand that's a net internal rate of return. The gross rate that they've been getting is 6+% plus. So when you minus fees and costs, they're at 4.2% net growth on cash value each year. Their loan rate Is 5.51%. Okay, and I think we got someone that's off mute. If one of you guys please mute yourself. That's my Zoom user. I got you. All right, so loan rate 5.51%, that's the cost to borrow against the cash value. And we see how in year 8 moving forward, my internal growth is 4.2%, and we now have over $100,000 saved. They used $50,000 plus, they've paid all that back, and now we have over $100,000 of cash value. We're now discussing next moves. What's the next, you know, step, next strategy that they want to be able to implement? But as you can see, if we wanted to criticize this policy, which is important, you want to look at the pros and cons. Some of the pros is the death benefit. We have nearly a $1,000,000 death benefit. Because of this specially designed whole life, we don't stay at $970,000. Notice how it's 2026, we now have $1,084,000. So the, the death benefit has grown roughly by the amount of the cash value that has accumulated. So one of the biggest arguments, or one of the biggest criticisms On whole life insurance, which is, which is a fact, is that if and when you die, you do not get the cash value when you die. The cash value dies with you inside of your whole life insurance contract. The only thing you receive is the what? The face amount, a total face amount death benefit. This is a fact. Please don't get this confused. I myself got this a little confused early on in my career. Now I fully grasp it. Cash value is a living benefit, so you can only use your cash value while you're living. Cash value is essentially a line of credit against your death benefit. It's essentially what it is. Now, what I'm going to say is not the legal proper thing to say, but it's how my brain makes sense of the math and, and how it actually pans out. Over time. I see the cash value over time adding to the death benefit. So I might say something like the cash value becomes the death benefit. Again, that's not the right way to say it. I don't know another way to say it without getting in trouble, so to speak. But that's why I'm making my disclosures here. This is not the right way to say this, but the cash value column, as it increases over time, so does the death benefit. The death benefit doesn't stay fixed. Now, normally permanent life insurance is a fixed death benefit, just like term insurance is a fixed death benefit. So most people have never heard of the concept or the possibility that you can be contributing to a whole life insurance contract and over time your death benefit increases without having to go through medical underwriting, without having to apply for anything. So this person, 22 years old, Their death benefits started at $970,000. It grew to $1,084,000. Let's look at the math on that. $1,084,424 minus $970,532.74. So it grew by $113,891.26. My cash value is what? 102,556. So when— so if this person dies today, what do they get? Do they get $970,000? Do they get— or do they get $1,084,424? They get $1 million. They get $1,084,424. They don't get the $102,556. That dies with the policy. But if I started at $970,000 and my death benefit grew by the amount more than the amount of the cash value, what does that look like to you? Does it look like— Well, in a way it looks like the cash value became part of the death benefit, and the heir, the beneficiary, gets this total face amount. It would make sense if you started at $970,000, 8 years later you're still at $970,000, your cash value is at $102,000. Person passes away, that's gonna feel like, yeah, uh, I, I lose this 102 because 102 plus 970 is more closer to that million number. Let me know in the comments if that makes sense. Again, I don't know the legal way, proper way of explaining that, but to me, that's how I understand Death benefit, paid-up additions, cash value. Cash value is paying up additional death benefit that I own in advance without me having to qualify or go through more underwriting. So my death benefit is going to rise with me over time. I end up obtaining the full total face amount death benefit. But you can't say— you can't legally say you get the cash value and the death benefit. You can't say that. So that's a fact. But the missing story is, well, did the death benefit stay fixed the entire Duration of that contract, or did it increase? What happened? What happened over time with it? Okay, so let me see if there's some questions. Someone said there's no sound. Is that still the case? Zoom user says they have no sound. I think that's that's a you issue. Let me get a quick comment. Let me know if my audio is good. Look at some questions here. Timothy says, at what point, if at all? And I gotta look, I gotta make this smaller. Let's go like this. There we go. At what point, if at all, do you recommend starting to use dividends and/or policy loan to cover the base premium to make self-sustaining? So what Timothy is asking here on a life insurance policy, so one of the things that you can do when you are overfunding a whole life insurance contract is that maybe, you know, 20 years into it, 15, depends on how much you've stored into it, But you can do what's called a premium offset or a reduced paid-up. So to answer your question, Timothy, I would say the only time it makes sense when someone's asking When is it recommended to use dividends or policy loan to cover the base premium? I wouldn't use a policy loan to cover the base premium. I would use the dividend increase each year to cover the cost of insurance only if that person doesn't have the ability to fund the policy themselves that year but still wants to be able to fund the policy. Okay, Timothy? The second option is let's say Timothy no longer wants to contribute into his whole life insurance policy. I would then say, well, let's look into a reduced paid-up option so that there's no more cost associated with the whole life insurance. You keep your death benefit, you keep your cash value, and now your policy is just going to be growing by a steady 4, 5.5% plus for the rest of your life, completely tax-free. And your death benefit is going to keep going up, but there's no more cost associated with it. That's pretty powerful. I think that's very efficient for some people that are like, okay, now that I funded this according to what I initially set out to do, now I'm going to redirect those funds towards more investments, get greater rate of return, and this policy is going to be my reserve capital account, my emergency fund, account, my liquid account. All right, great question. Jay says, figuring out when to leverage the IBC policy loan to pay down debt, not pay off because the debt is too large, but then figuring out when to repay the IBC loan and thus stopping your paydown velocity banking process with the original debt. I think what you're trying to say here is And you can, you can clarify for me, but I think what you're trying to say is for those of you who are doing velocity banking and infinite banking together, sometimes there might be a confusion as to, well, when do I stop using the line of credit and actually do more loans, or should I do less loans and more velocity? I think that's kind of what you're saying there. And my general motivation, like my general framework, if I'm someone who is doing velocity banking and infinite banking together, because I've added the infinite banking part, what you have to understand is infinite banking is the superior strategy over velocity. In my opinion, it's superior. Eventually, I want velocity banking in my life to become obsolete where I don't need to use those tools anymore because my whole life insurance policy is so big, so large, and the cost to borrow is literally nothing. It actually is a positive when I borrow, not a negative. That I don't want to interrupt that growth for the sake of velocity banking. Velocity banking needs to complement infinite banking more than infinite banking needs to complement velocity. That's how I view it. Velocity banking is complementing infinite banking once you get it going. This is why it's so important to make sure that we have the capital to fund an infinite banking policy, that we're going to commit to a timeline, that all these things are in place and we're disciplined. We don't want velocity banking to force infinite banking. It needs to just complement it. That if you're ever a little bit short on capital or you want to juice up the cash value a little bit more, you've got this tool that you can leverage at a relatively low rate. Now this money is growing forever in the policy. You borrow out of the policy, dump it back into the line of credit, you're paying down debt, right? So that's how I view that. All right, answered your question there. Perfect. Thank you very much, Timothy. There's sound. Boom. It makes sense. It's all in however the contract is written. Yes, I would say most Of the work is proper policy design. The nice part about designing a policy properly for an individual is that the individual could mess up a couple times, let's say, and recover much easier than an improperly designed policy. Going back to my example, Of the $10,000. Say you're funding $10,000 per year into a policy, and one example has a $1,500 base, and the other person has a $5,000 base, but they're both putting in the same amount, $10,000. This person is paying $5,000 in base, this person's paying $1,500 in base. If both of these people get in a financial crisis in their life and they're unable to do $10,000 but they can pay in $3,000, which base is more efficient for the $3,000? Obviously, the lower number. Versus if this person with a $5,000 base can only have $3,000, what are they going to have to do? They're going to have to borrow from somewhere to pay that base premium. Borrow from the cash value, borrow from the line of credit, borrow from a credit card. They're going to borrow from a friend, family, To pay for that base. Now, do most people do that? No. What ends up happening is the policy will lapse, and so now this whole concept gets destroyed. Versus the person who had a $1,500 base, minimum premium, max cash value design, and they can only pay in $3,000. We just lower the funding down to $3,000. $1,500 covered their base for the year. The policy's paid. Anything above base is optional, not required. Anything above base is optional, not required. So this allows— when you, when you properly design a policy for max funding and cash value accumulation, you allow for errors. to occur. When you're dealing with human beings, human beings are going to make errors, they're going to make mistakes, right? But when you design such a high base, that can create risk for the individual. Okay, so continuing on here with this case here, and what I'm going to do is I'm going to share my screen now. I'm going to show you how the policy was Originally designed to do, and how the policy has actually performed over the last eight years. So we're going to start there. This will give you even more insight. I think you're going to enjoy this. So here is the original. Illustration written 8 years ago showing this individual paying into their policy monthly, $522 a month, and how they can do that over a 30-plus year period. So this is what was originally designed. Hey, you're going to be saving $522 a month. You can go up as your income grows. But this is our minimum. So 8 years in policy, year 8, if they would have continued down this track, their cash value would be $50,121. Right, not bad. But far from what? A rate of return in that aspect. Because if we do $6,264 times 8 years, that's $50,112. So right about year 8, by the end— because look, total cash value end year. So by the end of year 8 going into year 9, if they continued to do $6,264, their policy would break even roughly by year 8. Okay, now in 2018, the dividend rate with MassMutual, I think was close to like 6.5%, maybe, maybe like 6.6% even. I think it was quite high. And, and then I think by like 2020 all the way through 2023, interest rates went down all the way to about 6% flat. So the rate of return actually went down with MassMutual and really all the whole life carriers after COVID. When interest rates began to shoot back up, 2023, 2024, 2025, then the rate started to recover. I think in 2026, I think MassMutual's dividend rate is now at either 6.2% or 6.4%. So this was assuming this rate of return was assuming that this person was going to get, you know, over 6%, 6.5% every year for 8 years. That didn't happen. Okay, so now this is an updated illustration. Now, 20— this is a 2025 illustration showing what the cash value will look like now by the end of year 8. So it shows a loan for $18,812. That's actually much less now, and it's about to be fully paid off. So What I did was, you know, try to give it like a little estimate and just said, okay, $83,744 plus $18,812, and that's how I got my $102,556. Okay, now if we look at year 9, the cash value is Estimated to be at about $123,770. So it is right on par to still breaking even despite the rate of return going down for multiple years being less than 6.5, 6.6%. Right, if we were to take the total amount they've paid in, $113,572 is what they've contributed, minus that from $102,556 is the estimated cash value, we're short about $11,000. And then going into year— like, it's somewhere between in year 8 and like beginning year 9 that we're gonna see a break-even. So for this policy, despite paying in less money each year in the beginning, right, we paid in less money in the, in the early years, then we began to increase our funding by years 4, 5, and 6, and we've stayed consistently paying paying in $15,000 despite taking loans out, this policy is on track to break even between year 8 and year 9. So that's actually really good, uh, despite the rate of return actually going down. So we have to factor that in. The rate of return actually went down. And mind you, like I said earlier, the rate of return is already bad when it comes to whole life. So why are people still doing it? Why are people still practicing this strategy, yet the rate of return is so horrible? Why do banks and corporations and high net worth individuals— there's been a book written about this, What Would the Rockefellers Do? There's Become Your Own Banker. There's The And Asset. There's about 5 or 10 solid books on this strategy. So you got high net worth people, you got politicians, you've got the wealthiest families in the world, and you got banks all buying whole life. Yet the rate of return, which is what the gurus out there, the financial coaches or financial advisors that speak against whole life insurance as to why it's so horrible, their biggest complaint is the rate of return. Makes total sense. Not disagreeing with that. So I actually will concede to that point, but yet people are still purchasing it. So are they being scammed? Are they being misinformed? I just showed you an actual policy, 8 years in force now. I showed you how the rate of return actually went down. I showed you that it's taking roughly 8 to 10— 8 to 9 years just for this policy to break even. Based on what they've funded into it. Where's the value in this if the rate of return is so bad? Well, let's start to list out the different values here. First, tax-deferred growth. The dividends inside of a life insurance contract is a what's called return of premium. So it's classified like a refund in your, in your policy based off the cost of insurance that you paid. The insurance company gives you some of that money back. They call it a dividend, but it's not taxed under the IRS codes. that have been written to protect permanent life insurance policies. So that's one aspect— tax-deferred growth. Death benefit protection. That's a value. With this design, we're using a combination of term insurance and whole life. So we're actually using the best of both worlds. We're using term insurance to reduce the insurance expense And permanent insurance to have guaranteed coverage for this person's entire life. So death benefit protection. All right, legacy planning. The more wealth this person builds, the more protection they're going to have to, you know, acquire. And then when they eventually pass away, Depending on how many millions of dollars they leave behind, they're going to have probably an estate tax problem. Well, life insurance is tax-free income to the beneficiaries. The beneficiaries can use that to offset the taxes when the wealth transfers. That's another value. Safety. Safety is a major concern for your average American today. Most Americans are waking up to the fact that saving money in a bank is no longer efficient. Parking my money in a checking account, a savings account earning less than 1%, is not efficient. So although the rate of return is not great in a whole life insurance contract, the first 5, 7, 8 years. But notice how moving forward, the internal rate of return after expenses and costs is this 4.2% or more tax-deferred. So this will outperform Gotta go 10+ years to prove this, but this will outperform CDs, bonds, treasuries, right? Checking account and savings account, or Even high-yield savings accounts. These are the only accounts that should ever be compared to a whole life return, the rate of return inside of a whole life contract. It should only be compared to CDs, bonds, treasuries, checking accounts, savings accounts, high-yield savings accounts, and even money market accounts. Money market accounts. Whole life will outperform all of these, but will not, will not outperform real estate, investing in the S&P 500 or, you know, index funds. And this is where the financial coaches, gurus, advisors, professionals are, you know, educating the client incorrectly, is they're saying, Denzel, don't buy whole life, don't put your— don't put $15,000 into whole life, take that $15,000, put it into S&P 500, it's gonna grow at You know, triple that rate of return. It's gonna get eight. You're gonna get ten. You're gonna get twelve percent rate of return on average. You're gonna end up with far more money. Yes, that is true on paper, on a spreadsheet, over a thirty-plus year period of time. No doubt. Not arguing that. I concede to that every day, every day of the week. But now. We have to look at this called the asset allocation. The asset allocation. Majority of Americans are not going to put 100% of their money into index funds or the S&P 500. Most Americans are not going to do that. Most Americans have a 60/40 split: 60% stocks, ETFs, 40% bonds. Why? Because they're creating balance, right? If I invest 15 grand in the S&P and it produces a negative return, So I lose 100% of my money, right? It goes down, say, by however much the market went negative— 10%, 15%. So I lose money. So what do you do? Well, typically you make a split. Most advisors, depending on your risk levels, you might go 90/10, 80/20, 70/30, 60/40, 50/50. Right, depending on how much risk you want to take. So what I educate the client on is, hey, how much of your money is sitting in bonds, treasuries, high-yield savings, checking, money market, CDs? How much of money is sitting there, and how much are you allocating to that? However much that is, I then show them how whole life will outperform that over any 10+ year period despite having insurance expense attached to it. Because of that internal rate of return increasing over time, it's going to beat these products. And I have guarantees. So that's the next factor. So I have guarantees. I have a guaranteed death benefit. I have guaranteed cash value growth. Cash value never goes down, only goes up every single year. It's just a matter of how fast that increases over time. And so I'm not trying as an agent, as a financial coach, as a content Creator, I'm not trying to get people to compare what their stock portfolio is doing compared to their whole life. No, no, no. I'm looking at their asset allocation. What are you doing to protect your portfolio? Usually you buy bonds or you stick your money in cash. I'm saying take that portion, put it in the whole life. You get additional protections— death benefit. Guaranteed liquidity, guaranteed cash value growth, dividends, right? And, and tax-free growth and tax-free use of the money via policy loans and withdrawals up to the cost basis. So why not do that? That's where we begin to see the different values. But if you just measure it by that one linear piece of information, rate of return, Whole life loses every day. Whole life loses every day. Most of the time, you have to be a terrible investor to get less than an average rate of return of 4 to 5%. You got to be a terrible investor. So for this individual, not being an investor, not knowing how to invest, not really caring much about investing. Can park their money in this account and now use it for some of the immediate things in their life that, that come up— student loans, financing college expenses, debt payoff, and just overall just saving money, just building up that account. So we're 29 years old, we see all these different values here, got over $100 grand. Now we begin to do something that you ultimately cannot do with any other account as efficiently as a whole life insurance contract, okay? And that's going to be arbitrage, or another word is offsetting. Creating like a positive arbitrage sense. So we know we have a loan rate of 5.51%, we have an internal growth rate on the cash value of 4.2%. I'm going to use $100,000 in my example here. Say I have $100,000 of cash value. If we use velocity banking rules, We're only gonna max borrow about 2/3. We're gonna leave 30+% alone. So I'm gonna do— I'm gonna go low, and let's say we take a loan for $50 grand. Okay, loan, 5.51%. Let's do the math on that. So 50 times 5.51%. 5.1%. The cost to borrow in a year is $2,755. My cash value, I'll use that number, 4.2. $100,000 times 4.2% growth is going to be $4,000. $4,000. $2,755. So I pay $2,755 out of pocket. The insurance company then credits me $4,200 into my cash value. That created a wash. That's technically zero cost to borrow. See that? So it grows— cash value grows by $1,400. $45,000. Alright, or technically it grew, but it's gonna be $104,200, but you paid $2,075, so you profit $1,455 in 1 year just internally. Here's where most financial professionals don't dive into this part is, well, okay, just because I have $100,000 growing in cash value and you're only looking at the rate of return in the cash value. The next question is, what did the client do? What did the individual do with this $100,000 of cash value? They just— did they just look at it and let it grow, or did they put it to work in another location? So let's say you take $50,000 and we do something popular That a lot of people talk about online, and you do private money lending, and you earn 15%, anywhere between 15% and 10%. Usually minimum, the rates are around 10% to 12%. If you get a little higher, maybe you're in a smaller deal. The smaller the amount of investors, typically the higher the rate of return. Usually. Or the more money you put in, the higher return you'll, you'll get depending on how the syndication is set up. So $50,000 times 10% is $5,000 in a year, right? Sometimes private money deals are only 6 months long. Or they're 2 years long, or 3, or 5, whatever it is. So let's just say we're gonna borrow $50,000 and we're gonna earn principal and interest payments, right? But we're gonna earn an additional $5,000 to $7,500. Now we know this money will be taxed, okay? But the original seed money will not. Right, so $5,000 to $7,500 plus $4,200 growth in the cash value, we can use the earnings to pay the $2,755 of interest In the policy. You see how that happens? So that means what? On the anniversary date, all that $42,000 goes into the cash value. Now I have $104,200 of cash value plus the $15,000 that I contribute that next year into it. And I'm basically using this private money lending deal as I'm getting payments, and I can repay the loan. If I begin to repay the loan back, if I get payments 30 days from investing in the $50K and I start to get payments immediately, or 6 months later the payments start, whatever it is, guess what? You can stick those payments back into the policy. That's going to reduce your interest costs. For the year. So now when we start to look at, okay, not only do I have one asset that's growing safe, low rate of return, tax-free, cool, but then I'm also putting the money to work and getting a much higher return over here, and it didn't cost me anything to borrow. Because whatever I pay in cost gets offset by the growth of the policy and the rate of return that I'm earning. That's the biggest factor there as it pertains to whole life, biggest unique factor that you really can't do with other accounts as efficiently as this. Sure, you have margin accounts But those have more limitations, right? You can get a margin call at any time. You can only typically borrow 50% of the account's value, and the interest rates are going to be higher. So there's more restrictions versus in a whole life. I will never have to worry about a margin call. My rate of return is guaranteed. I get uninterrupted growth regardless of how much loans I have outstanding. And I can borrow upwards of 90% of the available cash value. So not 50%, but upwards of 90% of the available cash value. And there's no required paybacks like with 401 loans or whatever the case. Powerful stuff. Let me pause, see some questions. Let's see. Hey Denzel, jumped on late. Am I able to send you my policy so you can let me know if they are set up properly or if I need to make changes? Thanks in advance. Absolutely, email me. The name is familiar, so you most likely have my information. Definitely email me your, your original policy design, and if you can get the agent to produce an in-force illustration, get that over to me as well. So I can see how you funded it, how it was originally designed, and we see if there needs to be a tweak or if you want to reduce funding in that and start a new policy that's designed a little more efficiently. So there's, you know, different ways to handle it. I will say this. I am a big advocate that this is almost with any whole life policy, even if it was poorly designed, that if you're like 10 years into your policy, 15+ years in, even if it was poorly designed, it's earning probably 4+% or more conservatively. So, and if it's already been funded for that many years Whatever the premium is, like, I'm not really going to be leaning towards canceling that policy or 1035 exchange. It would take a lot for me as an agent to do that for someone. Most of the time I'm going to convince them not to do that, and we're going to look at either doing a reduced paid-up to relieve yourself of the obligation of premium and then redirect that premium and cost towards a new policy That's better designed for cash value accumulation. Okay, Jay says, do you pay the loan back or add to your PUA in the event you don't have to do both, or in the event you're unable to do both? Okay, so Jay, in the event I'm unable to pay my loan on the anniversary date And add them to the PUAs, what do you do? Perfect example right here on this case study. So let me share with you. So for this person, their anniversary date is coming up. Literally, it's September, so their anniversary day is already here. So they have to pay their policy this month. All right, you have 30 days To pay your policy. Stay with me. They have $15,000 to contribute this year into their policy, so that's what they're going to fund. And I think they have like Say we have like $10,000 left in loans. I know what you guys saw earlier, that it was at $18,000, but it's less than that as of right now. So say they have a $10,000 loan outstanding, which means there's some interest. Let's say they have about $1,000 of interest that, that needs to be paid. So we have $10,000 outstanding, we have $15,000 to fund, and we have $1,000 of interest. So altogether, that's $26,000. This person doesn't have $26,000 at the moment, but they do have $15,000 and they do have $1,000. So what I tell my clients is you max fund First, right, pay interest out of pocket. So in addition to them saving already $15,000 per year, they're also going to need to come up with another $1,000 to cover their loan interest so that their cash value doesn't— I don't want to interrupt the cash value growth by pulling from there to cover this $1,000 expense. I'd rather them come out of pocket. But if they're unable to come out of pocket to cover their loan interest, but we have the $15,000, well, we can take a loan, right? We can take an additional loan of $1,000 to pay the interest. I would be fine with doing that. Because again, it won't interrupt my growth at all. It won't cannibalize the policy. So I prefer max fund my policy, pay interest out of pocket, and I'll begin to pay loan back over time. That's what this person did. They had upwards of $50,000 or more in loans, and they kept max funding and paying loan interest every single year. The cash value kept growing, and over time they were paying back their loans in the policy as they made more and more money. And now we're at the tipping point where they're about to pay off their loans fully, max fund the policy, pay whatever loan interest is remaining And keep it moving. So going into year 8 now, going from 2026 September is beginning of year 8 moving forward, they're going to have a paid-off policy, over $100,000 in cash value. It's fully funded for the year. They paid the loan interest. Now they can think about the next move that they want to do. How do I want to reborrow this money again? And when I go to reborrow this time It won't matter how long I have the loan outstanding because of the growth now inside of the cash value will be higher than the loan interest costs. Okay. Is PML the same as being the owner on mortgage security notes? Technically no. So if you're If you're getting involved in a private money lending offer with a syndication, usually you're just lending money either to the, the business, and then they either put you in first lien position on the asset that they're acquiring with your, with your money, and then paying you a rate of return. So you're not necessarily the owner of that asset. Okay, there are ways where you can be the lender and the owner of a mortgage note. So that's if you yourself is gonna say, all right, I'm gonna take my $50 grand and go buy a note. So now you're the owner of the note and you're the receiver of the payments of that, of that note. Coming back to you, but you're not really partnered up with anybody. So you didn't like lend money to anybody, you just bought the note direct from the bank or another company that buys and sells notes, right? So hopefully that cleared that up. Okay, beautiful. Okay. What else, guys? Any other questions? We're— we're— that kind of wraps up this case study and just covering infinite banking over 8 years now, how, you know, an everyday individual can do this at a very young age. The older you get, yeah, the more expensive whole life becomes. So the numbers may change. I, I would say someone in their mid to late 60s, 70s, whole life becomes more and more, you know, unattractive, where it's like, you know, depending on that person's health, um, it just, it just may not be as, as efficient. So if I'm talking to someone in their mid-60s 70s and they have children in their 30s or 40s, I would say, okay, if you want to practice infinite banking, it might be worth your time to get a son or daughter involved, niece or nephew, right, grandchildren, uh, someone younger than you that is healthier. Um, cost of insurance is going to be You know, cheaper. You can be in control of that policy, but you're just leveraging that person's younger age and health. But you're in control of the cash value, you're the owner, and then at the time of your death, it transfers ownership to them, and then they become the owner of that policy. And that's a great way to leave a massive inheritance by behind is you decided to fund an asset for your children or your children's children. And like, it's like a huge gift to, to them. I have clients that do this. I can think of many moms that I'm working with where they— let's just say they were uninsurable, or based on their age, the cost, the time that it takes just didn't make sense. So they put it on their son, they put on their daughter, they're funding it, they're using it to their advantage while living because cash value is a living benefit. And it's like a wealth-building tool for the next generation. They— that thing grows so much they never have to, you know, go to a bank ever again. They can borrow from themselves. And then pay themselves back the interest that they would have paid to the institution. That's another big value add with infinite banking, is that you're learning how to recover all of the interest costs that you send to other institutions that you could be sending to a company that you're a mutual owner in. So as a whole life customer I am a mutual owner with MassMutual. So when they profit, I profit. They only pay the policyholders and the owners of the company and those who have equity and whatnot, you know, the employees and stuff. But that's it. So when they profit, I profit. And it gets to a point where once you hit the break-even point, you're now getting new money. So it's not recycled old money of your premiums. You're getting back all your premiums plus new money, which would technically be the profits of the company. So for this person here on the board, they're about to break even in terms of what they funded and where their cash value is at. So when they break even, this is another critic. A lot of a criticism that you will hear about from other financial professionals is they'll say, "Are the dividends old money?" Or new money? And I tell them it's old money before breakeven. Okay, then it's new money after Break-even. See that? Prime example. If I have $113,572 in cash value and I pay $15,000 into my policy That would increase my cash value by that $15,000. Okay, and let's just say the prior year, $113,572 before the contribution of $15,000, my policy grew by 4.5%. So that $5,110.74 Would be new money because my money's break-even. I've already paid in $113,572 in premiums. I have $113,572 in cash value. My policy grows by 4.5%, $5,110. That $5,110 is new money. That's profit that I get to participate in with the insurance carrier. That's new money, not, not a return of premium. Because when I pay $15,000 in that new year, guess what? Now 100% of that shows up in the cash value. So I get a return of premium there because it increased my cash value by $15,000, but I also had a surplus, which was the guaranteed growth, right? Because this policy was written in 2018, the guaranteed rate is 4%. Today, the guaranteed rates are at 3.75% and as low as 3%, I believe, or maybe 2.5% or something like that. Maybe it goes down as low as 2%, but with Mass and Guardian right now today, it's around 3%, 3.5%, 3.75%, depending on how you design the policy. So dividend— so guaranteed rates went down shortly after COVID in 2022. Things changed. But this person still gets their 4%. So if you have a policy, a whole life that was written Prior to 2022, most likely you're getting a guaranteed rate of return of 4% plus whatever dividends are. So hopefully that answers that question. That's another criticism that gets applied, but it's not telling the whole story because it's like, yes, prior to the break-even is old money. It's just a recycled return of premium. Then you break even. Now you're all— you're getting a surplus Plus a return of premium. Every dollar you paid towards insurance is increasing your death benefit, and it's increasing your cash value with new dollars. It's actually quite incredible. Thank you, Jay, appreciate your comment there. If you are a controller of a younger relative's policy, can you use it For infinite banking, or are there restrictions? There's no restrictions, right, Andy? So as long as you set it up where you're the owner, so you're the policy owner, but your son or daughter is the insured, you're just using them, you're using their body and their health rating, their age. So now you have a body younger than you, you have insurable interest because they're a loved one, they're a family member. Close to you, so there's insurable interest, and you control— you're in charge of paying the premiums, not them. You're in charge of the cash value, not them. The only time they become owner of the policy is if you die or you transfer ownership to them as a gift. Right, and essentially that'll end up being the case. It'll be a total gift to them. You leave them with hundreds of thousands of dollars of living benefit cash value and maybe $1,000,000 or more of death benefits. It's awesome. So no restrictions for the owner in terms of how you use that cash value. Right, so if you're a father, if you're a mother, you can have a policy on yourself, policy on your spouse, policy on all your kids, policy on all your kids' kids, and you can be the owner of all of them. And then you begin to teach them, or you allow me to teach them for you. Once they become mature and responsible enough to fund the policy themselves, boom, transfer ownership to them. There's a one-time tax liability Because it was your money that you were funding, not theirs. So the growth inside of the whole life, once it transfers ownership, they'll have a tax liability on just the growth of the whole life. So it's not going to be a huge dollar amount. So they pay that tax one time. Now their contributions into the policy all grow tax-free, tax-deferred. Makes sense. Any other questions? We're gonna wrap up here. Appreciate everyone's time here. Hopefully this was a nice, you know, overall breakdown of the strategy, how it works, how you can fund it. We highlighted pros and cons. I'm not one to shy away from the cons of whole life. They're they're there. They're right in front of us. It's important to address it and and still decide to move forward because of all these other benefits that that come with it. And you're playing a long game. It's not a short game. It's a it's a long game. We're eight years in, but which still still feels like we're just getting started with with this particular client here on the board. So even though we're eight years in, eight years long time. That's how long I've been on YouTube now. Eight years. But I feel like I'm just getting started now. I feel like I'm better when it comes to communicating things now. And, you know, I've studied, I've gotten better, worked with so many people over the years. So it— you get better and better with time. Says, I tend to confuse infinite banking and velocity banking. What's the difference? Infinite banking is specifically Encompassing whole life insurance as the product, and then infinite banking is the strategy in terms of what you do with a whole life insurance contract. Velocity banking is specifically looking at banking products provided by banks, actual banks. So credit cards, personal lines of credits, home equity lines of credits, firstly and secondly. Business lines of credits, right? Those are tools that we can get from the bank, sometimes for free, sometimes there's some cost associated with it. You need credit in order to get these products, and you're using the products provided by the banks to either accelerate debt, right, pay less in interest, consolidate debt, increase cash flow, improve your credit score. Or you're leveraging debt, like an SBA loan or a personal loan, credit card, and you're leveraging debt to acquire an asset or buy a business or make an investment somewhere that would create more income for you. So that's velocity. Both of these concepts actually can come together and accelerate your wealth even faster. Velocity is helping you increase cash flow, pay less in interest, have capital reserves. Infinite banking is allowing you to preserve that capital over time at a cheaper cost and with all these other benefits of coverage, protection, etc., etc. Okay, Does a strategy exist where you can use your HELOC to fund IBC Would the HELOC need to be at zero to begin that process? Preferably yes, Jay, preferably. Because you can, you can think of it as, okay, instead of using velocity banking to pay off debt directly, what if I use my velocity banking tool to fund the policy first, then borrow against the policy to then pay off a debt or fund an investment, and I'll just keep using the velocity to pay back the loans, pay back the interest, and you're just juicing up this, this account over many years, you get to a point where you no longer need to use the HELOCs. You sort of, um, wean yourself off of the HELOC product over time. So yes, that is a strategy. Now, do we use 100% Of your money to fund an IBC policy? I would say no. I would like to see the person have first year's capital in cash available. Also, the insurance company is going to ask you, where is the money coming from? How are you going to fund your whole life insurance contract? The way we get approved is age, health, and income. So we have to prove our ability to pay this whole life in order to get approved. You have to have the health and be healthy enough to get it, and the cost will be based off your age. Okay, so you got those 3 things: age, health, finances. If you tell the insurance company, I'm using debt To fund the whole life, they may not approve it. Well, I would say 100% of the time they're not going to approve that. So we wouldn't verbally say that, that we're going to use debt to fund the whole life. But technically you can, once you got the approval. Technically you can use equity in your home. It's as good as cash. You can use a check from a credit card that turns credit into cash. You can use a personal line of credit, business line of credit, loan from a friend or a family member. You technically have the freedom to fund your whole life however you want, as long as it's legal and lawful. You can fund your policy however you want, as long as it's legal and lawful. Okay. So again, I'm not just gonna Say, yeah, I'm going to use my HELOC to max fund my PALT. No, but you can do that as a precaution. For those of you who have first lien HELOCs, all-in-one loans, you're using the checking account function. All your income is driving into the line of credit. And so when your policy is due, you're pulling from the line of credit to pay your whole life. So there's no problem there, there's no restriction there. It's just the language, and you're not just going to openly tell MassMutual, yeah, I'm using debt from the equity of my home to fund this policy. There's nothing technically stopping me from doing it once I have the policy in place, once I have the approval. So that's important. But ideally, I don't want to— again, because I'm an influencer, right? I'm a teacher. I don't want that to be the go-to thing for anyone here and those catching the recording, or to pull this out of context. So that's why I'm very careful with that, that I'm not teaching that as a As the go-to. It's almost like a precautionary, like a backup. It's like, okay, if I'm short on my funding this year, but I have $50,000 in my HELOC and it's at zero, and I only have $10,000 to fund my policy, but I need to do $5,000, I see nothing wrong with pulling $5,000 from your HELOC to fund the policy. And then you can always just pay back the HELOC with velocity banking. Right now your policy is fully funded. And you're earning interest on all that money rather than waiting for you to accumulate, uh, the money. You pay a little bit of interest to, to, to do that. Oh, skip the comment. I see. Thank you so much for explaining. Absolutely. Will you show us more examples of the power of combining the 2? Yes, I have a playlist on my YouTube channel titled Velocity Banking, Infinite Banking Combined. Please check that out. So, um, you know, over time I add to that. Yep. Is someone able to get their license and write policies while living outside the United States? Yes and no. You, you have to be in the US, so you have to have a permanent residence in the United States. So if you're like 6 months out of the country, 6 months in the US, that would work. You have to get licensed in your resident state that you live in. So that would be important. So you got to first do the testing, right? Pass the test, get licensed in the state that you're a permanent resident in. If you don't have a permanent residency in the United States, then no. But if you do the whole 6-month strategy where you have a permanent residence here, but then you're also living abroad, You know, half the time out of the year, then yes, you can do that. Good. We're gonna close it out here. Thank you for your time. God bless you all. Appreciate this. We're gonna keep this going, right? Every week, every Friday typically. If you are a client, if you're on my email list, if you're part of the Increase Academy, you get to hang out with me on Zoom. Right, where I'm seeing questions, and you can even come off mute sometimes. We can hang out there. All right, so reach out, click the links below. See you. Have some fun. Continue growing. Those of you who are clients, this is a consistent reminder. If you— if it's been a while, you haven't been on my calendar, now's the time. Book a call. My calendar is wide open. I've literally been creating a greater focus on spending time with more people on these one-on-one calls. So please reach out if it's been a while, if you invested in any one of my programs in the past, if you got a policy with me in the past and it's just been a while, you want to touch base, you have access to me, okay? I'm not untouchable. You can literally access me anytime. Alright, God bless you. Talk soon. Bye now.