EP137. The beauty brand that wants its customers to buy less

I was recently interviewed by a journalist and when I told her my thoughts on sustainable beauty and the fact that the beauty industry needs to drive less consumption overall, her first question in response was, how can any beauty brand exist if they're encouraging their customers to buy less? Well, it's a valid question. I talk a lot about over consumption here on the Green Beauty Conversations podcast, and I often get up on my soapbox to complain that no one else at industry level is talking about it. But that doesn't mean I believe every beauty brand should shut down. Far from it. There's always been a demand for skincare, hair care, makeup, deodorants, perfume, and that demand isn't going to go away. But that also doesn't mean that each brand has to encourage their customers to buy dozens of each product that they sell. Now, I may sound like a complete utopian idealist saying this, but believe it or not, there are actually brands out there doing exactly this. They are far and few between. You'll struggle to find them unless you have insider knowledge, which of course you'll get by listening to this podcast. But they do exist, and today on the podcast I am speaking to Melody Reynolds, one of those brand founders who is actively trying to encourage her customers to buy less. And she's been doing so very successfully for eight years. So settle in for a fascinating episode to learn from a brand that is still prospering while asking their customers to stop buying so much. Welcome to Green Beauty Conversations, the podcast that challenges you to think about how you buy, use, make or sell your green beauty formulations. In my weekly episodes, I explore the sustainability of the beauty industry and encourage you to join me in changing the beauty industry for the better. I'm your host, Lorraine Dallmeier. I'm a chartered environmentalist, biologist and the CEO of award winning online organic cosmetic formulation school Formula Botanica. We have thousands and thousands of students in over 180 countries around the world who study with us to become organic beauty formulators and entrepreneurs. Visit our website@formulabotanica.com to try our free online formulation course. And if you want to be the first person to know what's happening in green beauty, make sure you subscribe to this podcast in your favorite podcast app. So in today's episode I'm joined by Melody Reynolds, founder of Elate Cosmetics. 20 years in the beauty industry and a vision of a world without single use Packaging empowered Melody to create Elate with a simple message. Our daily choices create global impact and choosing ethical products means a more positive result. Leaving A career in corporate beauty, she's been creating innovative beauty products since 2014 that encourage simplicity, self love, and empower everyone to make sustainable choices for their daily rituals. Her personal mission is to change the world one lipstick at a time. Hi, Melody. Welcome to the podcast. How are you doing today?

Hi. I'm really fantastic. How are you?

I'm good. I am so looking forward to this conversation. It's going to be awesome.

Me too. Thank you for having me.

Oh, no, I'm thrilled you're here. So let's start from the top. I've given you a bit of an introduction in the beginning, at the start of the podcast, but can you please introduce yourself and elate properly and briefly tell me why you started the brand? And of course, we're going to get into a lot more of this detail later on, but I'd love to hear what really inspired you to get started.

Absolutely. You know, I think that nothing can be brought down to a singular moment, but for me, the biggest thing that happened is I've been in the beauty industry for over 20 years, and I took a little bit of a hiatus back in 2010, and at that time I started examining, you know, lots of things in my life, as many of us do and probably have been doing over the last couple of years. But it coincided with me purchasing a product. It was a lipstick. I won't call out the brand, but I bought a lipstick mainly because I was feeling kind of down. And I think everyone can relate to that feeling kind of down. So I bought a lipstick. When I brought it home and unwrapped it, I actually created a pile of garbage in front of myself. I thought to myself, well, hang on a minute. I have this lipstick that I've just purchased because I was feeling kind of sad. I don't really actually want it. I'm probably not going to use it all up. I'm going to end up throwing it away and in front of me, before I'd even got to the end of using the lipstick, I've already created a huge pile of garbage. I got very sad because that's, you know, one of my go to emotions. But then I got really angry. I got angry that me as a consumer, not me as a beauty industry professional, but me as a consumer, was forced to contend with this pile of garbage from a product that I'd purchased and that I actually probably shouldn't have even purchased it. And so that was the seed that got planted that made me start rethinking everything that I knew about the industry. That I loved, that I had been in, you know, since I was a teenager, and really made me rethink how we could make the future of beauty different and better for everyone. And so with that seed, over the next four years, I created a business plan. I had no idea how to create a business plan. I was not a business person. But I started talking to all of my contacts in the industry, everyone from chemists to packaging experts to logistics, which I didn't even know what that word meant when I started. And then in 2014, I launched Elate Cosmetics from my spidery, freezing cold basement with my little toddler by my side as I packed boxes. And then we grew very organically because at that time in 2014, there were really only a handful of companies that were talking about sustainability within the beauty space. And I didn't even really know that word. Like, that was a word I discovered as I went through my journey of creating the products, which is a whole process in itself. But I think the main thing for me, I recognize that, yes, I've been in this industry for a long time, but I'm also a customer and a consumer. And I'd spent my whole life thinking that I was a really good environmental citizen. You know, I recycled. I was proclaimed recycling queen of my school when I was in grade four. And, you know, these are all things that kind of led up to me realizing that when you dig a little deeper, there's always something to improve underneath the surface. And I really wanted to make my mark not only on the beauty industry, but for business in general, that we should do and we can do better. And then Elate was born, and here we are.

Amazing. What a fantastic beginning as well. Now, I'm very impressed with the fact that you talk a lot about sustainability and have been doing so for a long time because there are very few beauty brands who do this. And I spent some time on your website, and I think it's safe to summarize that you want your customers to buy less.

Yeah, that's. I mean, I'll tell you, any networking event that I go to with business people and I'm using quote, fingers will say, well, that's a really terrible business plan to get your customers to buy less. I will say I was very inspired, and this is quite timely because they've just been in the news for, you know, a beautiful philanthropic act. But I was very inspired by Patagonia as a company. I've always been a bit of a marketing buff. You know, I love Mad Men. I'm all about you know, this. This idea of. This psychology of buying on the POS side, but also on the not so positive side. You know, being a woman and being inundated with images of what beauty is supposed to be. For my whole life, marketing has always really fascinated me. And I. There was an ad that Patagonia took out. I don't even know how long ago it was now, but I was. I was quite a bit younger when I first saw it. It's really just a picture of one of their jackets, and the headline says, don't buy this jacket. And then underneath the jacket is like, all the reasons why you shouldn't buy their jacket. And I was so inspired by. And it just kind of stuck with me. I actually ripped it out. It's not here. I have the original ad that I saw in a magazine ripped out on my wall. Because what I loved about this was that this company was saying, hey, here's the thing we make, but we don't actually want you to buy it unless you really need it. And, like, that's what all the fine print was, was. Here's all the water that goes into making this jacket. Here's all the. The resources that are wasted. And what are you going to do with the jacket that you already own? Like, please don't buy this just because you think it looks nice. If you already have a jacket, you don't need to buy it. And so I actually have carried that. That philosophy with me from the very, very beginning, that if we as companies are convincing our customers to purchase only what is necessary, then that right away cuts our waste in almost half, because half of the things that people own, they don't really need, and they end up either putting in a storage locker and someone else has to sort through it at the end of their life, or they throw it away. And storage locker or landfill, it really doesn't matter. It just sits and it doesn't achieve its aim, which is being repurposed and reused and put back into the life cycle. Like everything in the universe, every molecule in the universe just wants to be repurposed and reused. We are all repurposed and reused molecules, right? Like, this is the natural order of the world, and. And every time we put something in the landfill, we're disrupting that. And so for me, it's about having my customers, number one, recognize that they are perfect, whole and complete, just as they are. Makeup is meant to be a tool of joy and adornment. So I'm never going to tell you that you need this lipstick if you want to have some joy in your life and you want to adorn yourself with a lipstick, then I hope you purchase mine because it is made in a more sustainable way. Or not just mine. There are lots of other companies out there making beautiful sustainable lipsticks. But the main thing is to remind everyone that if you have 20 lipsticks in your purse, I've done something wrong because that's too many. You're never going to use them all, and all of the energy that's gone to create those lipsticks is going to go to waste. And so I think for me, if we can really get to the root of the issue, which is over consumption, then not only do we all feel better, emotionally, mentally, physically, I feel better when I don't have stuff that I don't need, that I feel like I've been tricked into buying. But at the end of its life, there's so much less waste to deal with. What does that mean for me as a business? To be honest, it actually means more customer loyalty. So even though I'm not getting every Tom, Sally and Jane to buy seven lipsticks from me, my Tom, Sally's and Janes buy one lipstick from me. But they buy it consistently because even though they're not buying seven at a time, they come back and they always buy mine. And I think that that's something that is a true testament to the value that, that you are putting forth to your customers from an emotional perspective.

That makes sense. I was actually going to ask you the question, you know, because so many people think that trying to get people to buy less and running a successful business, that those two things are incompatible, but I think you've just demonstrated that it isn't.

Yes, it's one of the things that I talk about, that sustainability, it's not just a philosophy, it's a business model. Right. And when you're looking for longevity, then that's what you need, you know, because sustainable means more than just talking about the environment or talking about packaging. It's also the longevity and the legacy of your business.

Absolutely. So how do you market your brand and your products then to reduce over consumption? How do you do that?

We've tried lots of things. You know, what is it called spaghetti marketing, when you just throw it at the wall and see if it sticks? I think one of the things that is so important is when you try and create a new concept for people, because it really is a new concept. It's a novel idea that my company says, hey, you don't. Here's all the Stuff we have, you don't actually need any of it. What there is, is there. There's a piece to educate on how to choose and how to be discerning about what goes in your beauty bag. And so from the beginning, we created this concept, and, you know, and again, I took some inspiration from another industry, from the fashion industry, and this idea of a capsule wardrobe. So if you're not sure what that means, it's, you know, paring down your wardrobe, avoiding fast fashion, and having things in your wardrobe that are really, truly classic, that are really trul. And so you only have like 30 things in your wardrobe. Which, the first time I heard this, I thought this was insane because I think I had 30 pairs of shoes. Right. You know, again, I'm an imperfect environmentalist, but at the end of the day, when I dove into what it meant, I realized that this idea of infinite choice is actually really taxing on our nervous systems. You know, if I throw up my closet and I have a hundred pairs of shoes, I actually, my biggest task for that morning is deciding what pair to wear. And we don't realize how much that affects us in our day. You know, when I open up my closet and I have five pairs of shoes, I know which one right away I'm going to wear. And I'm also more likely to take care of those shoes. I'm more likely to polish them and repair them and love them and actually have them love me. You know, the items we own have an energy exchange with us. And I do believe that that is something that happens. And so that. That capsule wardrobe concept, I thought to myself, because I did it, and I was like, oh, this is really fun. And then I thought to myself, well, hang on a minute. What if we can translate that into beauty? So we call it the capsule beauty bag. And so we started off with. With a similar steps in terms of how to get there. And it's, you know, number one, you have to identify what's your style, you know, and our style is kind of ever changing, but for the most part, I bet you and all of your listeners have kind of one style that you gravitate towards for most of the time. And so, you know, we have kind of a. Like, go to Pinterest or get some magazines or whatever it is. Pull up pictures that you like, and then you'll see themes. And so for me, for instance, my theme was always lots of blush and red lipstick. Those are the two things I always wear. I'm a big blush gal because I love the 80s and and that's just consistent. So when I opened up my beauty bag, I actually had like 20 shades of blush. I probably had 30 or 40 lipsticks. And I realized that I only ever used two shades. But I had all these shades because gravitating towards the product I love when I was over consuming, when I was mindlessly purchasing, that's what I would go for. So, you know, someone with their wardrobe may have a hundred T shirts or, you know, they may be, again, super into shoes or. So we gravitate towards these things that we like that make us feel good when we buy them, forgetting that it's actually the using of them that really makes you feel good and using something up. Oh, man. I don't know if you've ever finished a lipstick tube. I'm going to assume you have, but doesn't that feel great? You know, you've used something up until it's gone, its purpose has been fulfilled. And that feels so, so good. And so that is how we encourage our customers to buy less. It's this creating this concept and education around creating your capsule beauty bag. What are the things that you use consistently every single day? Sure, you're going to have a blue eyeliner throw in there once in a while because we want to have fun and play. But the five to eight items that you're going to use every single day, that's your capsule, and those are the things you're going to use up until they're gone. And then we are going to take responsibility for that packaging at the end of its life to complete the life cycle.

Amazing. I love your philosophy behind it all. So one question that then comes up is you formulate and sell makeup products, which are notoriously hard to get right for customers because everyone wants different color palettes. So how do you cater for that diversity while still trying to keep the number of products you sell on your website to a minimum? Because I sat on your website and I added them all up and I think I got to about 30 or so. But, you know, a lot of makeup brands have way more than that. How do you cater for diversity?

Yeah, I mean, that's such an amazing question, you know, and when it comes to products that are specifically for complexion, so skin tones, we really reimagined what does a typical person wear every single day? And so you have a very broad spectrum. You have people that wear nothing, and then you have people that wear the full on, you know, seven products just on their complexion, and then kind of everybody in the middle. So what we did is Is we took the middle because people on the other end of the extreme, they're. We know that they're probably our customers once in a while, but the people that really will buy into the capsule beauty bag are really in the middle. And so for people in the middle, we generally like. And I'm including myself in this because I'm in the middle. We like light coverage products that have skincare ingredients that do more than one thing, because I want my beauty bag to actually have things in it that I can use in more than one place. So, you know, we make a concealer that's actually also under eye brightening, and we make that in as many shades as we possibly can to suit all skin tones, from the very, very lightest to the very, very deepest. Every year, we actually plug in shades to fill those holes because we are a small brand. You know, we're not. We don't have 50 shades of every single thing, but we're working towards building that palette to get there. Really, it's all about what our customers are asking for. So when we get requests for, oh, you know, we see you have this shade that's very deep, but there's a couple shades before it where we need one that has a cooler undertone. And then we'll say, okay, okay, we need to make that. We have a foundation that is more like a tinted moisturizer. And what we discovered is that most people really like that texture. And so although we want to appeal to everyone, we actually want to appeal to people that are in this band in the middle, and all of those people, regardless of their skin tones, we want them to be able to find a product. So with Complexion, we're focusing on very specific textures that we know most people like. And then from that, we create the broader shade range that we need to. When it comes to color, however, that's a bit of a bigger beast. And so we have, over the years, have had as many as 30 eyeshadows, and, you know, all the way down to just having eight. And what we do there is we really work with our customer base, and we actually really rely on them to provide us with feedback. You know, what shades are they using consistently every single day? We actually go back through our sales records as well and look at this particular shade, who bought it, and then we can also look at what Complexion products they bought. So we have an idea of what, you know, where their skin tone fits, and then terms of who's buying it. And so right now, our offerings actually are basically all the shades over the past eight years that the broadest range of skin tones has purchased consistently over and over again. You know, we talked about using up a lipstick earlier, but I mean, an eyeshadow, that's harder to use up, right? You know, it takes a little bit longer. And so people that are repurchasing those, we know that those are capsule beauty staples. And that's actually what we call them. We call them capsule beauty essentials. So these are the ones that go in the essential kits. And then usually once a year, we'll release what we call a statement collection. And this is when we gather feedback from our community and we have as broad a section of people as we can get and say, what color do you want in your beauty bag? And we always get like, oh, blue, you know, sparkly green or, you know, a deep, deep purple. And we're like, okay, okay. And so we actually have a voting system where people can vote on colors to release. We release them and then again we watch what people are purchasing for the most part. What we found over eight years is that those statement colors, everybody wants them, but they don't repurchase them. And so again, because we're focused on that, creating the products you're going to use every day. There are tons of beauty brands out there that make wonderful products in lime green and electric blue. And I love them too. But that's not what we're going to make. We're, we're the staple in your beauty bag. Because I want to be the staple for as many skin tones as possible, rather than having 30 shades that are just going to be for a select few.

That makes total sense. So talking about feedback from your customers, then how have your customers responded to the overall messaging of just buy this capsule range? Let's not over consume. Let's, let's do good by the environment.

Well, if I'm honest, and I always am, in the beginning, people were like, what, what do you mean? I, I remember specifically having, because we do one on one consultations with people if they want it. You know, I do remember having some, some people that I was consulting with specifically saying, okay, so you showed me four lipsticks, I like them all, I want to buy them all. And I would say, okay, like that's great, but are you gonna wear all four lipsticks? Like, and I would kind of dive in a little bit deeper. And I remember getting resistance of them saying, like, you, money. And I'm like, no, no, not that I don't want your money, but I want, I want you to be sure, like I know these all seem appealing right now, but let's focus on what are you going to wear every day, you know, and then in a few weeks, if you do want that second one because it's your date light lipstick, let's do that. So I did have some resistance, and I think it is because we have been conditioned to buy. It's capitalism at its worst, unfortunately. Right. You know, that there is, I do believe that there is a good side to capitalism or conscious capitalism or intentional capitalism, but there is a dark side. And part of it is that we don't even realize how we have been conditioned to purchase. And so over the years, we've been able to develop some tools that do help people think differently about the things that they buy. And luckily, not only our industry, but lots of other industries have started to catch up. And not that they're necessarily saying don't buy our product or buy less, but they're saying, you know, be conscious about what you buy. And, you know, we as a company are conscious about what goes into it. And so I think that people are more open to the idea now. And we actually do have a really great following of people that are like, look at how minimal my makeup is. And, you know, here's my five minute makeup routine. I'm a big believer that if it takes you more than five minutes, like, that's too much. You know, I mean, when, when it's a special, a special event, what I'm talking about is daily, right? Two minutes, I'm out the door. And I think that that is really appealing to people as well, is that, you know, this idea of the ritual of self care. You know, we do have those moments where we're taking time and we're taking breaths, but then we also have moments when, you know what, I just want to put this on. So I'm like, yeah, I feel great, I feel bright, I feel shiny, and I'm out the door now. And I think that, you know, a lot of things have culminated to make that happen and to make people recognize that, you know, buying less is better for your mental health, it's better for your wallet, and it's actually better for the space on your bathroom counter, you know, because we can all use more space.

Yes, that we can. Now, speaking of partnerships and relationships, which you touched on earlier, you've partnered with other brands to provide an ethical marketplace, which I thought was fascinating. So what is it? What inspired you to start it and how does it work?

Well, one of the things that we talk about with sustainability is you know, when you look into something, you have to look deeper than the surface. And once you're below the surface, you should look even deeper. And part of the beauty industry that no one really talks about, and this is becoming a thing right now, is, you know, the whole buzzword around transparency and what does transparency mean? And so for me, looking deeper has always been into logistics and supply chain and the cost of shipping, not just in financial figures, but in environmental figures. We are a certified carbon neutral company. What does that mean? You know, when, when people see that seal, they immediately think, oh, they have zero carbon emissions. Well, no, that's not true. We do have carbon emissions because there's carbon. You cannot have a zero, you know, emissions company. It just, it is impossible with the technology that we currently have. So we actually pay to offset our carbon emissions, which is what brings us to carbon neutrality or even carbon positivity, if we can get there. And so it's about educating people around what it means. And so we love brands. One of the things that I love is collaborating with brands either within my industry or outside of my industry. We've done collaborations with skincare brands, with other makeup brands, with clothing brands. And for me, it's all about that vetting. I'm a busy person. I run two businesses, I have two children, I have a partner. I have to have time for myself. I like to climb mountains and play the ukulele and, you know, within all of these things, when do I have time to research the brands that I want to support? So I really just have to go by face value, by what they're saying. But because I am also an insider, I do happen to know that a lot of it is marketing and, dare I say the big G word, greenwashing. People don't have time to really dive as deep as I know that some of them would want to. For me, it was like, hey, shampoo and conditioner bar brand. I love what you're doing. Let's talk. Because I have time in the course of my day to dive deep with the brand owner and to find out exactly what's going on and within their logistics, within their ingredients. Well, I see you use fragrance. Tell me what that is. I see that you do this, tell me how you do that. And because I'm able to vet these people from the inside out, rather than just from reading on their website, we feel super comfortable saying we support this brand and we're actually going to sell it to you through an ethical marketplace. So that way, when you're buying elate, and you want to buy this brand that we support, it's just one carbon footprint of a box being shipped to you. And so that was really where the idea came from, was that we could provide pre vetted companies for, you know, our customers who are really busy, who already trust us and know that we are, you know, doing the best that we can. Not that we're perfect, but that we're doing the best that we can and have them, you know, get a box full of things that they would buy from three other places and eliminate the emissions that go from shipping from all of us. The brands that we partnered with were super on board. The other thing, because I'm sure there'll be, you know, industry professionals listening to this, is that drop shipping is such a pain in the butt, you know, for a small brand like myself, like, and it's so well intentioned, right? It's very well intentioned for a marketplace that has a huge reach and a huge following to drop shipping. But in my mind, as a small business owner, it's not something that I can get behind because it means that I'm doing a lot of the work on my end just to sit on your platform, which is fine, but it just doesn't work for me. And so we also actually act as like a wholesale partner for those brands. So not only are we partnering to benefit our customers, but it benefits the brand too, because we purchase and hold inventory. So that way, you know, that brand also has financial sustainability. And I think, like, that's the key piece to collaborations is that it can't just be, you know, it has to be win win. It has to be good for both of us and not just in the sense that, oh, my audience is bigger than your audience, because let's be honest, the online playground is not what it once was. And, you know, reach doesn't really count for a whole lot anymore. What counts is customers in the door, purchasing your product in a way that is meaningful, in the way that is impactful to both of your businesses without being so impactful on the environment.

Amazing. You have such an incredible set of ethics behind your brand. You obviously have such a fantastic brand strategy there. It's exciting to hear how you, you marry this concept of buy less, but the business is still doing well and obviously the ethical marketplace plays a role in that. So I have one final big question. It's a big one. First of all, what do you feel is most broken about the beauty industry? And what would you like to see in the future in terms of sustainability for the Beauty industry.

Oh, my goodness, Lorraine, that's such a big. Those are two big questions. You said one big question. Those are two big questions.

I snuck to in.

So what do I feel is the most broken? I mean, in all honesty, it is the marketing piece. I'm probably going to get a little bit emotional because this is. It's an emotional thing. You know, we are taught regardless of gender, regardless of your ethnicity, regardless of who you are or where you live, we are inundated with images of what beauty is supposed to be. As soon as we can see, as soon as we can notice other people, even from children's books, you know, things are getting better now. But. But there's this idea of this perf. Of what is expected and what is the acceptable face of a person. It's so incredibly damaging. I know from a personal perspective, you know, I've had to do a lot of work around being comfortable with who I am and what I look like based on the fact that, you know, you. You grow up and you go to the. I remember very distinctly going to the grocery store with my grandmother and seeing like a Cosmopolitan and as like a little girl, first of all, being like, oh, this person is half naked on this magazine. But also, I guess that's what I'm supposed to look like when I grow up. And that's never stopped. We've become aware of it. We're aware of the damage that this does for teenagers. We're aware of the damage that this does to. To young adults. And. And we're even more aware of. Of the damage it does to women as we are aging. I shouldn't say women people as we are aging. And I think that we can really do better. I think that we're starting to. I think that we are on the right track, and I think that when we stop using images of humans as marketing campaigns, then we will truly be successful. And what I mean by that is it's okay to show humans using your product, but it's not okay to venerate a specific ideal to our customers. And what's mostly important is to let everyone know that it is okay to use the product in whatever way you want to. Another thing that sticks out for me is when I was 19, I was managing my very first salon. It was one of my first jobs in the beauty industry. And I had just gotten my makeup artist certificate, and I was super pumped about it, and I was feeling really creative. And I went into work and I actually had done my face up. Like, I think it's the I think it's Aladdin Sane, David Bowie's cover album, when he's got the, the like lightning bolt across the street.

Ziggy Stardust.

Yes, it was Ziggy Star. That's right. And I was so inspired. I was like, oh, I'm gonna do something crazy like that. And so I did my makeup in a very crazy way. And I remember specifically one of the salon customers being like, that doesn't look pretty. You're supposed to look pretty. And I was so like, oh, okay. And I never did my makeup like that again to go into the salon. And I do remember, like, I felt so great that morning. I was like, I, this is me. I am so creative and I really love how I look today. And just a single person telling me that that's not pretty, that's not how you're supposed to look totally turned me the other way. And I was an adult already, right? I was like a 19 year old where I'm supposed to be an adult. I don't know that I actually was an adult, but I could vote and I could drink alcohol. So clearly I was an adult at that point. And I think that, you know, and it wasn't that man's fault. He also had an idea of what the acceptable face of me should be. And so I think that that is the biggest failure. I do think we are getting better, but I think that a more successful. Now to the second question. A more successful and sustainable beauty industry is one where we attack that problem at the root. Because when we can stop showing people that they will be good enough, when they will be pretty enough, when they will be acceptable, when they buy X, Y, Z, if we can stop doing that, then we attack that route of over consumption or we attack overconsumption at its root and then everything else falls into place. Because it doesn't matter how sustainable your package is, if people are buying too much of it, then it's actually moot. It doesn't matter if we have a perfect supply chain from beginning to end. If people are over consuming our products, they're eventually going to end up in the wrong place. And so more sustainability always starts with curbing over consumption and always ends with taking responsibility for the life cycle of the products that we create. As a company, I have so much hope. I don't mean this to sound doomy and gloomy. We are on the right track. You know, there, there's a very famous quote. Just as the, the arc of history bends towards justice, the arc of the economy bends towards sustainability. So for us, we're always getting better. As a society thing, things are way better now than they were 50 years ago, than they were 100 years ago. And in terms of sustainability, we are on the right track, but we need to remove the marketing from it. We need to make it a standalone mission as a beauty industry, as a capitalist, you know, economy. We need to make it stand alone that we are doing this to make the world a better place to leave it better than we found it, not as a marketing tactic. And I think once we can all agree to do that and once we can unite, then we will achieve the goal. And the goal is just happy, healthy people, families, communities, and world.

And I think it's visionaries like yourself who will drive us there. You are very inspirational. I love hearing all about your brand. And if any of our listeners want to learn more about you and about Elate, where can they do so?

Oh, my goodness. On the world wide Web. I'm not sure if you've heard of it. I know, right? I am not a digitally native person. I didn't grow up with the Internet. But I'll tell you, I love it now. So you can find my brand@elatebeauty.com we also have a skincare brand that is refillable. It's called fosterskincare.com and you can find me on Instagram. I'm Elodie elated. You know, I hang out there and post things about my kids and my pontifications about being an imperfect environmentalist. So I'd love to see you.

I'd love it. We will add all those links in the show notes. Melody, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. It's been an absolute pleasure talking to you.

Thank you, Lorraine, you are delightful. And thank you for all the work you are doing within our industry. You know, I mean, you call me a visionary, I'll slap that back at you. You do so much for all of us as brand owners and founders, and you're a real leader. And your voice and the voices you elevate are what will make us drive the future of beauty forward.

Oh, gosh. Thank you very much. I've never had a guest end the podcast like that. I love it. Thank you so much, Melanie.

Thank you.

I would love to hear your thoughts on this episode. How do you feel about buying from a brand that wants you to buy less? Does this sit right with you from a business perspective? Do you applaud Melody's ethics? How many other brands do you know who are also doing this? Please do Come and leave me a comment on our social channels as both the Formula Botanica team and I love hearing from you. Thank you for joining Melody and I for this latest episode of Green Beauty Conversations. I really hope you enjoyed it, and if you did, please do leave us a five star review so that other people can enjoy these conversations too. Make sure you subscribe to our podcasts on Apple Podcasts or Spotify or whatever your favorite podcast app is, and stay tuned for the next episode. Follow formula botanica at formulabotanica on Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, TikTok, Twitter, or LinkedIn and come and give me a follow at Lorraine Dharmaer on Instagram. Visit our website@formulabotanica.com and sign up for our free online formulation course today.