EP56. Are Indie Beauty Brands Falling Behind on Sustainability?

Welcome to Green Beauty Conversations, the podcast that challenges you to think about how you buy, use, make and sell your natural beauty formulations. We tackle topics that will make you think and encourage debate about green beauty with your friends, followers or customers. I'm your host, Lorraine Dallmeyer. I'm a chartered environmentalist, biologist and the CEO of award winning online organic cosmetic formulation school, Formula Botanica. We have thousands of students in over 160 countries around the world who study with us to become organic beauty formulators and entrepreneurs. Visit our website@formulabotanica.com to try our free online formulation course. Today's podcast is a slightly controversial one in which we're going to explore whether the indie beauty sector is falling behind on sustainability. Recently, a lot of the big players have started to publicize their sustainability policies and push them out into the media, which made us wonder whether the indie sector was doing enough. It's very easy to think that the big multinationals are inherently bad and India is good, but that black and white view is not always the case. So we wanted to ask some challenging questions to encourage the whole indie beauty sector to do a lot more. So buckle up because this is going to be a hard hitting podcast. I'm joined today by my colleague Anna Green, who is Formula Botanica's membership site coordinator. And I think it's safe to say, isn't it, Anna, that the research we did for this podcast got us both quite fired up.

Hello, Lorraine. Yes, absolutely. It was very, very interesting, some of the things that we uncovered.

So do you want to start us off by setting the scene? Because I know you've done a fair bit of research on this and by talking about the sustainability commit made by some of the big brands in the beauty industry and what you discovered when you started researching big beauty and sustainability.

Yeah, so I looked at five of the large cosmetic corporation websites. L', Oreal, Unilever, Procter and Gamble, the Estee Lauder Group and Shiseido. And every single one of these companies addresses sustainability on their corporate websites and has information that is easy to find and is prominently displayed. All of these companies have also set themselves some kind of sustainability target and in most cases have created a detailed sustainability report with some comparisons of where they are currently and where they would like to be. Most addressed issues like packaging and carbon emissions. As both of these are quite current at the moment, the focus does tend to be a lot on manufacturing and sustainability, but I think some of them did take it a little bit broader. So I think we can gather from this that A lot of the environmental campaigning that has happened recently, especially around prominent issues such as plastic packaging waste, has impacted these corporations. There is also the issue of consumers who have become increasingly savvy on some of these topics, using their voices and asking these corporations questions repeatedly on their environmental and social impacts. I was pleasantly surprised to see social sustainability addressed on some of these websites, as corporate focus has traditionally been on production and reducing emissions. However, I was disappointed as I sort of dug a little deeper by the pledges and slightly uncomfortable at how social sustainability was framed. For example, one corporation has pledged to ensure that their key suppliers, employees are all getting a living wage by 2030. So that means that these global giants are currently aware that not everyone in their supply chain earns enough to live on.

Wow.

When you add to that some of the charitable initiatives that these corporations are using as part of this sustainability drive, it reinforces a savior narrative when in fact, if we paid everyone in the supply chain a living wage as a minimum, that would have a far greater social impact and reduce the need for charity completely.

Gosh, that's shocking, isn't it? That they're not paying everyone a living wage right now when many of these corporations make billions every single year.

It is really shocking. It is really shocking. Are the big players doing enough? This is a really complicated question and I'd love to hear your thoughts on this as well, Lorraine, because sustainability is complex. So whilst I would always welcome any positive change, some of these targets that they have set are for 10 years into the future. And I'm not sure that we have that much time to address some of these issues. And what these global corporations are doing well is highlighting sustainability with glossy websites and campaigns. Whether that translates to real change or not is really hard to judge.

Yeah, I agree. And there's been recently there's been a big splash in terms of all the press releases I've seen put out by these multinational giant talking about sustainability. So they obviously realize that people want to hear about this. But you're quite right, are they doing enough? And I guess, you know, on the flip side of that, we also want to explore in the podcast today, are indie brands doing enough? Really?

Yeah. So the, the one thing I will say about all of these global corporations is, as I said, it was easy to find this information and it was prominent. So they have got the message that people want to hear about this. So that is, you know, that is fantastic. Lorraine, I know you recently polled some of the members in one of our big free Facebook groups and asked them whether indie brands can ever be sustainable or whether it's simply too big a challenge for them. What were the results?

Yes, so I recently ran a completely non scientific poll in our big free skincare entrepreneur mastermind group on Facebook in which I asked whether indie brands can ever be sustainable or not. Now, the reason I put up this poll is because I found that indie brands were starting to engage with some of the content on my own personal social media channels on Instagram and Facebook where I talk a lot about sustainability. And they were telling me that it was all just too hard. And that made me wonder, is this a wider issue? Do more people feel this way? So over 100 people voted to the question, can indie brands be sustainable? And 84% of people said yes, they can. They can be sustainable in how they operate through the ingredients they use, the manufacturing methods they use, the shipping methods they implement, and the packaging and resources they rely on. However, most people then said it would be a big challenge to be sustainable. So I wrote down just a few of the comments that people made because I thought this was really interesting to highlight. One person said, I'd like to hope that indie brands can be sustainable, but just looking at all the raw materials and packaging we use, I'm just not sure it's possible yet. And another person commented and said, I don't think any brand or person can do it all. Until consumers put their money where their mouth is and are willing to pay the high costs of a genuinely sustainable product, it will be hard and get harder to maintain a truly sustainable business. And then I think this final comment really summarised a lot of the feedback I received where someone said it is possible to become sustainable in certain areas, but but I think it's far more difficult for small brands. So as you can see, the majority of indie brands would say, yes, we can be sustainable. But once you delve into the details, a lot of them basically either say, a we're too small to truly do the right thing, which is a statement I fundamentally disagree with, or B it's going to be really hard to get there, which they are undoubtedly correct about. So I guess moving on from that, I'd like to talk about indie brands that are going for sustainability in quite a big way. Anna, have you seen any examples of indie brands getting it right from a sustainability perspective and what are they doing to embrace sustainability at their core?

Yeah, so there are a few indie brands who keep sustainability in mind in everything that they do and they communicate this really well with their customer. Most of these brands will choose one area of sustainability to focus on in their brand, but they also touch on other areas of sustainability. So it is a well rounded effort. One of my personal favorites is Beauty Kitchen, who are pioneering the fight against packaging waste. We have interviewed Joe Chidley, the founder, on the podcast before, and Beauty Kitchen is moving towards a circular economy with their innovative refillable packaging. Upcircle are another brand doing great things and they specialize in using cosmetic ingredients that are by products of the food and juicing industries. They initially started their brand making coffee scrubs from discarded coffee grounds from London cafes and they've now expanded their range to include different ingredients and products. And last but not least, our graduates by Bee Beauty have a fantastic sustainability section on their website where they talk about auditing their materials, they speak honestly about some of the pros and cons of packaging, such as glass and so much more. I think they would be the first to say that getting where they are now has been a journey and a process. But because they truly believe in making the industry more sustainable and their brand more sustainable, they persevere and they're constantly making those changes.

Those are three great brands and as you said, you know, we've had Jo on the podcast and she and Stuart, who run Beauty Kitchen, are doing amazing work. I think they're rolling out a thousand refilling stations in the UK soon. And Elsie and Dom from Bybie, well, we're super proud of them. I mean, they are just superstars in the Formula Botanica graduate community. And Anna from upcircle is actually coming on the podcast soon as well. So, yeah, fantastic brands doing fantastic things and I hope they inspire lots of people.

They are all phenomenal and they've all had such a journey within the industry. When you look at the journey they've been on, you know, like I said, when it came to Bybee, it's been a journey for them. They didn't just start out and be able to do all of these things. This has been a process. But they've passed, persevered and they've, you know, keep thinking about sustainability and everything they do. So now we've looked at what the mainstream industry is doing alongside the indie beauty sector. Is indie Beauty falling behind on sustainability?

So yes and no, I think. And I think this also brings us to the crux of our podcast today, really, because as you just showed us, there are a number of indie brands out there doing an amazing job on sustainability and embedding it into the core, the sort of very soul of their business. But similarly, there are Thousands who haven't fully yet embraced the concept and think it's too hard or simply out of their grasp. So I suppose my initial response is, no, I don't think the indie sector is doing enough. But then I started to think more about what the big brands were doing and I took a step back to really critically look at their commitments, because on paper they sound amazing. And I'm not surprised. Some of these big brands have put a huge push behind their sustainability press releases, and I'm not surprised that so many news outlets have run with them unquestioningly, because it does really sound very impressive. But actually, they still ultimately want you to buy and consume as many personal care products as you possibly can. And that ambition is not sustainable in the slightest. So let's take l' Oreal as an example. They say in their new sustainability commitments that they have profoundly transformed the company to bring sustainability to its core. But I would argue that instead they're in the process of profoundly transforming the company to bring sustainability to its operations from 2030 onwards, which is 10 years away. So let's take just one of their commitments as an example, in which they say that by 2030 no ingredients will be linked to deforestation. Does that mean that we as consumers should accept that that won't be the case for the next decade? Or they've said that by 2030 they will hold flat total land occupancy, vital to the sourcing of ingredients, compared to 2019. WHO said that 2019 was a good comparison? Why not rewild some of their footprint by 2030 instead? And how big is this footprint anyway? I couldn't find that information in their sustainability report, but it must be vast. We're still a decade away from 2030, and I would have hoped for some more short term, ambitious targets, because honestly, these big players have had decades to catch up with environmental management. And just as you said at the beginning of the podcast, Anna, you know the social commitments as well. It shouldn't take a decade to pay your supply chain and your employees a living wage. And secondly, as a beauty brand, your operations absolutely need to be sustainable. But this is a minimum baseline. The big brand's reach extends well beyond their operations. The way people consume the lotions and cleansers and moisturizers that they make is part of that sustainability ethos. And that's where I think the mainstream is falling flat and indie is doing a better job. So I suppose to summarize, indie beauty brands, I think have a huge opportunity, absolutely enormous. And I can't say this enough because they can seize the conversation and run with it to flatten these big players. Ultimately, because we can talk in the indie sector about low consumption beauty, multipurpose beauty, multifunctional beauty, simple and longer lasting formulations, because that's what it means to put sustainability at your core. It's not just how you operate, although that is very important, but it's the minimum level of importance. It's also about how the world consumes your products. And I'm simply not seeing the mainstream beauty industry really grasp this concept. So we've seen brands currently talk about sustainability within the current economic paradigm of unlimited economic growth with finite resources. So do you think sustainability can ever truly be achieved within these principles? And what are some of the emerging alternative approaches that are being highlighted?

Anna, I think this is a fascinating question, and even though I'm obviously not an economics expert, all my research so far leads me to believe that sustainability seems very difficult or even impossible to achieve within our current economic and social systems. And there are alternatives that have been proposed. For example, there is the idea of degrowth, which emphasizes the need to reduce global consumption and production in line with planetary boundaries. Another interesting concept is donor economics, which again moves away from GDP growth as an economic measure to a focus on meeting the needs of everyone in the world within the planet's available resources. So there are alternative ways of thinking emerging and becoming more prominent. Moving back to the cosmetics industry, currently even those brands with a strong focus on sustainability are still having to function within the current political, economic and social structures. So there is always a compromise happening even when we are making some progress. So it's very complicated, but there are new ways of thinking emerging.

Yeah, and these are fascinating concepts that you talk about, Anna, because you know, I've been reading a fair bit about degrowth recently and there's quite a lot going on with people talking about it on Twitter. I love this idea of us focusing on improving human well being rather than this constant economic growth because ultimately, you know, we don't need a ten step skincare regime at night. We can make do with multi purpose, longer lasting products that still have a great effect on the skin. And same goes for hair care and makeup. And I think we do need to start thinking about those planetary boundaries that you mentioned. I don't know if you've ever done one of those tests online where they look at how many planets would be required if everyone lived like you, but I have and it wasn't pretty. I think we needed two planet Earths and you know, I have solar panels and we don't really travel anywhere and we grow our own food. So, I mean, obviously there's a lot more we need to do as well. So I think ultimately, the whole industry, the whole world really needs to start thinking about how we change the way that we view consumerism. So I think that whilst the big beauty brands are doing a lot in terms of sustainability and they're talking a good talk, they need to walk that walk a little bit further than just their operations. And I want to see the indie brands starting to do that as well. Basically, they need to start thinking about sustainability and how they bring it into their brands, rather than just simply saying, it's all too hard, we're too small. So the beauty industry has a long way to go, doesn't it?

It does, absolutely. But I would like to emphasize that whatever the size of the brand, you know, whatever the resources the brand has access to, as a very baseline, like you said, they can start by being honest with themselves about how their processes are impacting the environment and they can look at making simple changes from there. That is a very baseline that everybody can do. And we can do this as individual consumers as well. Like you said, we can look at our own and then set ourselves some targets. Nothing has to be achieved overnight, but everybody can make simple changes now.

Yeah, agreed. And everyone can communicate about it as well, which is a point, I think, that you highlighted earlier about how the big brands, they're very, very good at communicating because obviously they also realize that the reputational benefits that come from this. But I'd like to see indie brands really start to talk about it more as well, because although it is a huge topic, sustainability is big and scary, but it's something that we all have to do. And as long as we realize that no one's ever going to be perfect and that it's a journey, not a destination, then I think that's how the industry has to move forward. And as I said, there's a massive opportunity for indie brands here, and I really hope they take it.

Totally agree. The opportunity is huge to really do something from an authentic perspective and to look at things that they really are passionate about changing within their own brand.

Absolutely. Well, thank you for joining me on the podcast today, Anna. It was great to have you here again.

Thank you so much for having me, Lorraine.

So I hope this podcast has fired you up to come and tell us on our social channels what you think. Can indie beauty be truly sustainable? Are the big players doing enough? Do you feel excited about the opportunities for small brands to truly embed sustainability at their core and not just in their operations. The Formula Botanica team and I love hearing from you, so come and tell us your views. And please do come and leave us a comment. Thank you for joining Anna and I for this latest episode of Green Beauty Conversations where we explored whether the indie sector is falling behind on sustainability or not. I hope you enjoyed it. Make sure you subscribe to our podcast on itunes or Spotify and stay tuned for the next episode. Follow Formula Botanica Formula Botanica on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, Pinterest or LinkedIn. We are everywhere. Visit our website@formulabotanica.com and sign up for our free online formulation course today.

Sam.