407: Never Give UP. Never Quit. Bounce Back. With Travis Mills

This is Jocko podcast number 407 with Echo Charles, and me, Jocko Willink. Good evening, Echo.

Good evening.

We all face challenges. We all have setbacks. We all suffer. When these difficulties hit, some people break. They surrender. They let circumstances, fate, and events that unfold control their attitude, dictate their emotional state, and determine their destiny. They adopt a defeatist attitude of negativity. They accept failure. They curl up in a ball and wait for the clock to run out.

They quit.

But there are other people who are diametrically opposed to that attitude. People who, in spite of incredible challenges, adapt and overcome.

Of every person I have ever met in my life, Travis Mills has faced the most traumatic, intense, and brutal challenges a human being could face. And he faces these severe challenges continuously, every day, over and over again.

And yet, he has the best attitude of anyone I know or have ever known. His emotional state is always positive. His humor is always on point. His mentality is pure strength of will.

Despite suffering the most horrific wounds imaginable, he chooses his own destiny and is unstoppable in his drive and commitment to live life. Travis Mills is one of my friends, one of my heroes, and the most inspiring human being I have ever met.

Travis received injuries beyond all comprehension while serving in the US army in Afghanistan. An improvised explosive device big enough to destroy a vehicle ripped off his arms and legs, leaving him a quadruple amputee. In that moment of shock and despair when most people would be focused on themselves, Travis's first response was directing the medics tending to him to care for his fellow soldiers. Instead, he thought he was going to die.

Against the odds, and thanks to the skill and determination of those medics, he lived. But his battle was far from over. In fact, it was just beginning. Upon returning to America, he started an almost unbearable journey of recovery and recalibration. Countless surgeries, excruciating pain, hallucinations, fighting to stay alive.

Then he had to learn how to live again. He had to learn to utilize prosthetic limbs. He had to learn how to walk, eat, and accomplish seemingly ordinary tasks, like getting dressed and brushing his teeth.

He also had to recreate his identity now that he could no longer serve in his beloved army. And most important, he had to recalculate and reimagine how he could be the husband and father he knew his family deserved.

This was not an easy path. I cannot think of anything in life more difficult to overcome.

Yet Travis has achieved exactly that. He has excelled in every aspect of life. He is an author, a business owner, the Founder of a powerful charity organization, a speaker, and a devoted family man, he is a recognized source of laughter and light to all who encounter him.

Without question, Travis Mills has turned tragedy into triumph and victimhood into victory. In the game of life, Travis Mills is the undisputed champion.

And that right there is an excerpt from the forward, which I had the honor of writing to a new book, which is called bounce back. 12 warrior principles to reclaim and recalibrate your life, which is written by Travis Mills, the man himself. Travis has been on this podcast before, over six years ago, actually, episode 90, where we discussed his first book, which is called Tough as they Come. And if you haven't read that book or listen to that podcast, go listen to that podcast and read that book to learn about the life of Travis Mills. Where he came from, what he went through. But if you want to learn how he got through it and what he learned from it and the principles that he has to pass on, then get this book, Bounce Back. We can all learn so much from Travis, and it is an honor to have him here with us tonight to discuss his life and some of these lessons learned.

Travis, I mean, that was so good. I don't know what I should say, because you always. I mean, it's impressive. I'm over here with goosebumps, thinking, like, man, this guy sounds awesome. Who's ever. He. Whoever he's reading about, what a cool. I mean, I want to know that guy.

Hey, I'll tell you what, man, to be honest with you, I. I almost never talk in, like, absolute terms. Think about it, you know, it's really difficult to say someone is the most inspirational person you've ever met in your life. I don't throw those things out there lightly. But this is the truth, man. Like, I have never met anyone that inspires me as much as you do. And so, like I said, I don't speak in those terms. If you listen, I'm always very careful, you know, because when you say someone's, like, the best, you're basically dissing everyone else. Like, if I'm doing jiu jitsu with someone and they're really, really good, they might even be a world champion. I'll still be, like, careful about saying, oh, they're the best person I've ever trained with, because then there's some other people. You know what I mean?

I mean, I did. I. And I appreciate that because obviously, you wake up every day and look in the mirror at yourself. I mean, everybody gets motivated. Even my. My. My wife today, she. Before we Flew out here to old California. She took a picture of her watch was. It was 454. She goes, who am I, jocko? She's a little late, but either way, no. And I appreciate that. And I'll tell you, I'm pretty good at Jiu Jitsu myself. I was at the camp. I started on the white belt mat day one, you know, not knowing what I was doing. And by day two, I was on the black belt. So, I mean, it's pretty big deal.

How do you feel? Have you kept training?

I went one other time just because of scheduling. I plan on going next. Nope, not next week. No. Maybe next Wednesday. But no, I wasn't fun. It is fun, but what I. You know, there's people. One. One guy in particular did not like. When I tapped him out, he actually was pretty upset. And I saw him the other time, went and trained, and he wouldn't really make eye contact with me, but he was upset. And I get it because I'm handicapped, but what people don't realize is, like, we used to do ground fighting tactics, like, three days a week when I was in the military. So, like, I understand the concept. And with me, it's so hard. You either gotta choke me out. You know what I mean?

Yeah, it's not. You're difficult to leg lock.

Yeah.

You're difficult to arm lock.

Yeah.

You gotta choke you. You know what I realized when we were talking was for you to do exercise is like, there's only so many limited moves that you can do. And so, like, doing jiu jitsu, you totally were doing jiu jitsu. I mean, and that's got to be so much more fun than the kind of normal. I mean, for me, Jiu Jitsu is more fun than running, more fun than swimming. It's more fun than lift. It's more fun than any Echo Charles support. It's more fun than any form of exercise.

Yeah. Yes.

Oh, definitely. And I. I used more muscles I haven't used in years the next day.

Yeah.

But I was, like, playing it off. Like, I'm not. So, you know, I'm like, oh, let's go again. I'm ready. But then. Then I go to Pete's and where he trains in his gym there. He has a. He's like, I want to feel like it's Brazil. So the doors are closed, the windows are closed. He's probably had the. I think he had the heat on. Pumping humidity in the air somehow.

And then he plays. Did he play Brazil?

Oh, he did. Oh, he did. And I'm like. And I'm like, okay, how do I get more air in my lungs? Like, I was going against Ian.

Yeah.

I got to the point where I'm like, ian, you're not gonna tap me. But I'm, But I'm telling you right now, like, I can't breathe. Like, I'm gonna need to take a minute here.

Yeah. By the way.

Yeah.

Well, just saying that you can understand.

He didn't choke me. He didn't choke me out. Okay, but you're right, you're right. And then, and then like I, I spent like $50,000 on a brand new gym at my house. Got a sauna, my wife's got a peloton, I got a tonal machine. And let me tell you something, the two times I've worked out in there for the, for the gram, those posts have went very well. So you know what I'm saying? Like, do it for the grammar and for my health. I need to do it for my health.

Yeah, no, it's, it's awesome. And I know you were an athlete again, go listen to podcast 90 if you were, if you haven't, or get the book Tough as They Come. Because you were an athlete growing up. And like you, it's real obvious that you were an athlete growing up. When you trained, when I trained with you, like when I trained Jiu Jitsu with you, you can just feel you have, like, you're strong as hell and the way you move is like a little crazy.

And I think I actually punched you with my left. My left or my nub? Yeah, your eyes went right red. I was like, oh, this is how I die. Because the way you snap from like, oh, yeah, try this. And then to like, I'm gonna eat you. It scared me. I'm not gonna lie. I was like, oh, I'm so sorry. And you see the film, actually they have the video where I'm like, I'm sorry, you just keep going. I'm like, I just punched him right in the forehead.

That's the way Jiu Jitsu is. Jiu Jitsu is a full contact evolution. Like, you're going to get, you're going to get jacked, you're going to get punched. You're going to get hit in the face, head butted. Like everything's going to happen and it's just kind of the way it is.

And I mean, I just got my little arm, like a little bone there. That secret weapon. I love it.

Yeah, you definitely have some techniques to develop cuz like in Echo, like in his arm, his shorter arm. There's like a bone in there.

Yeah.

And it's. It's like. It's like having an elbow at the end of your arm or something like that. So when you grind it in there, it was not. It didn't feel good.

You'll say that show you when you were there or not that I pushed it into your chin.

But it's. It's some form of ho. That like when your bone breaks, it like grows funny. And they were supposed to like, it grew so hard, I mean, so pointed that it was bruising my skin from the inside out when I was putting my left or my right prosthetic arm on. And then they wanted to like cut you open and grind it down. And it would. Took me out of my recovery for like two weeks or something like that. And I said, no, I can't do that. So my buddy was like, just hit it on the table and it'll chip the bone. So I just like hit it on the table repeatedly for like 45 minutes until finally I was like, I think I might have rounded it out. And I did. I mean, it rounded out enough. Like, it doesn't bother me anymore.

Where are the chips?

They just float around, I think just in there.

Just got consumed.

Yeah.

So we were talking before we hit record, like, your reason behind writing this book. 12. Did I read the 12 Warrior Principles to Reclaim. Okay, so that's like the subtitle. 12 Warrior Principles to Reclaim and Recalibrate youe Life. Which can we say you took that from Jordan Peterson, who had the best selling book for the last 10 years.

This is the second time I heard this today. And I was like, I don't even read books, so I have no idea if that's what they did. Because I didn't pick that. The publisher was like, hey, we're gonna do this. And I was like, if that's what you think. But I don't know who that guy even is, okay? And here's the thing, I should, because it's embarrassing because I'm the drive down. My buddy Max, who lives in Temecula, he's a Paralympian.

In track and field and Navy corpsman. And I called him up, see how far he was away and whatnot. He goes, did you steal that? I'm like, I don't know what you're talking about. He goes, okay. And I'm like, no, seriously, I don't like, read books if it's not audible. So like, now I feel embarrassed where.

I'M like, well, well, not only do you write a book called 12 Rules for Life, he wrote another book that's called 12 More Rules.

Well, this is.

Yeah.

Well, did he cover the. You know what? I have no idea. I didn't do that. But I mean, look, the cool thing.

Is he would like. He would love this book. So I'll send him a copy of this thing.

I don't want him to get mad at me because I didn't even know he existed before.

That's probably what he'd be more mad about.

Yeah. But just. Cause I'm not a learned man.

He's been one of the most covered figures in the news for the past like five. Five years.

Right, right, right.

Yeah. We had him on this podcast he's been on a few times. First time he was on, he wasn't really popular yet.

Yeah.

And so, you know, he came on and it was sort of like, cool. He wasn't quite then. Then after that one, he just went, Richter. He did an interview with a BBC. And this woman was kind of questioning him and he was just kind of calm, cool and collected and. And she kept saying, so you're saying. And she would like take his words and kind of try and make them sound a little bit different.

Yeah.

And he was like, no, I'm not saying that. And it was just. It really was. It. It was an interesting interview to watch in it and it got tens of millions of views. And then his book came out and then it just all went crazy. And he became like a really, really popular guy. He's a super nice guy. He's Even to this day, like, he's a super nice guy. He's always been cool to me. He's been cool to us the whole time. Like, he didn't change, like when he became from just like a normal kind of person to a. He's got to be the most famous psychologist. Echo.

Yeah, I mean, I. I mean, before this book comes out on November 7th.

But yeah, once your book comes out.

But so. So here's the thing. Like, I. Yeah, I don't know. I didn't know this coming down. I catch your guys podcast when I can, when I have time to drive, but usually it's a lot of windshield time, so I catch the ones that I can, but I don't. I don't read a lot. Just like flipping pages is hard for me and it's like a total excuse. I know that.

Do you do audiobooks or something?

I do. I catch some audiobooks. I listen to this Book of Stream Ownership. I did.

I heard that one was good. Yeah.

Oh, real good. Real good. They got. There's two guys that narrate. They're just fantastic. But I do a lot of audiobooks just because it's. I can't, like, flip pages that well. And, I mean, I know it sounds soft to me, like, I probably could figure it out, but. But then, I don't know. Reading puts me asleep.

Yeah, reading. I read because I have to read. Sometimes I want to read. But, like, when I was growing up, I didn't read barely anything. Like, when I was in high school and stuff, I didn't read barely anything. I don't think I completed a book in high school.

I read one. I read one when I was.

Do you remember what it was?

Oh, I do.

What?

Where the Red Fern Grows. And let me tell you something, I want to ruin for everybody, but I'm going to. When those dogs died, it wrecked me. I walked across the hall to my sister's room, full tears. Dan Little and died.

Are you kidding me? And I quit reading the book about.

I don't know what the book is about.

Like, backwoods something. They like. They're like.

They're.

Is it about dogs? Is it like. Is it about humans or is like the dogs are humans?

No, no, it's humans. Then these two dogs are like hunting dogs.

Can they talk and stuff like that? No. Okay.

No, I don't think. I don't remember. It was fifth grade, but I do remember, like, I'm done reading. Like, this just ruined me. I'm out. You know what I mean? Like, if you read my first book, you're going to find out I got blown up. You know, it's sad. I didn't even see it coming. But, you know, it's weird being 36 now because I got two feet in the grave, you know?

I mean.

But like. I mean.

Sorry, you were. Yeah, I was, you know, just reviewing. Like I said, I reviewed. Re. Reviewed the first book I listened to when you were on the podcast again, and. Yeah. You were 25 when you got blowed up.

Yep. Yep. I didn't see it coming.

I know.

I mean, I always thought I retired from the military, but I didn't know I could just do it that fast.

Do not pass. Go. Go straight to medical retirement.

Just there. Just there. I just, you know, I want it. I got it, you know?

So going back to the question that I veered off on, what was kind of the reason that you ended up writing this book? You were saying this because people would ask you like, dude, how do you. Basically. Which I could see you probably get asked that thousands of days.

Yeah.

Like, how do you do it, man?

Yeah.

Oh, my gosh.

I mean, the worst. Yeah. People are always like, how do you do this? Or like, I don't know, like, how you're so able to. How you're able to just be so, you know, cool with it. And, you know, and I was always like, well, I have to, you know, like, real simple, to the point. Like, I have to. It's kind of like. And it's, you know, veering off. But like, at my foundation there, we bring out the. Sounded very, very Minnesota right there. And my foundation there. But I didn't mean to. But we did. The veterans that have been through.

You do, do ya?

Yeah. Oh, don't. You know? So we bring out the veterans and their families, physically injured veterans, and we show them how to do things adaptively. But everybody's always like, what do you do for post traumatic stress? And I was like, uh, well, there's these two programs that I highly recommend, Home Base and Warrior Path. And they have their own things set up, blah, blah, blah. Well, we became a chapter of Warrior Path program. So we offer it now. And when people were asking me, like, how do you do it? Like, this will be miserable and blah, blah, I'm like, well, I have to. And I was like, maybe I should break that down. And not only break it down, because I feel like a lot of times.

People will look at me like, oh, my gosh, why have this going on? But there's nothing compared to your situation. And I gotta remind them, like, your biggest problem is your biggest problem. You know what I mean? You can't compare what happened to me to what you're going through. So I took stories of.

Drug addiction. There was a sexual assault, like a child sexual assault case. There was a widower, cancer survivor, things like that. People go through every day a house fire and a divorce and how they got to the very bottom and then how they climbed their way back out. And then, because I had a collaborative authority, Kathy Huck, who's a research author, she went and found the medical. Because I said, you know, there's gotta be medical research and theories on why your mind does this or your brain's able to think a certain way. So we put those at the end of the chapters that we had in there.

Yeah, no, that was clever how you got someone that was smart, smart to help you in this book.

Because, you know, I left college because I couldn't I just couldn't focus on the whole schoolwork.

Yeah.

But then I found as long as I get blown up and I look handicapped and people are like, oh, my gosh, he can walk and talk. That's amazing. I can find someone to do the work for me, you know?

Guilt trip of me, too.

Oh, yeah, that's all my. I get pulled over all the time, like, oh, my foot got stuck. I'm sorry. I just couldn't feel it, you know? Heck, the state troopers in Maine gave me my own bay. Like, I got my own badge.

What are you driving? Driving a. Are you driving a Bronco?

I have the Bronco.

Is that thing like a raptor Bronco or just a regular.

No, they didn't have the wraparound when I bought it, so. But it's. It's all, you know, the wild, wild tracks and sasquatch dances.

It's all souped up.

It's awesome. I like it. And I drive that just in the. You know, it's gonna sound bougie, but I only drive in the summer. I don't want to get it like. I don't want to get it, like, any salt on it. So I drive it with the top off. And here's a dumb thing. I know we're veering here. The dumb thing is I waited. They were like, hey, for the 2021s, we can get you a soft top, not a hard top. Like, I want the hard top. That's what I put in for now I'm going to wait. So I got the hard top, and then I take the doors and top off all summer long, so I don't even use it. And then when the winter comes, I have a. I have a Yukon that I drive, an older Yukon. I got American flag grill in it, all blacked out. It's tinted illegally. But again, that special badge in my registration I keep inside the badge that the state troopers gave me. So I'm like, oh, it's in here.

If you can just find it.

Get out.

Jail free card. Monopoly's a game. But this is my life, you know?

Freaking awesome. Sorry. All right, so let's. Let's. Let's go into the book a little bit and.

Start with this section here. You say we all have a moment in our lives we'll never forget, a moment that completely changes our life's trajectory. For me, it was not the blistering hot day in Afghanistan on April 10, 2012, when I dropped my backpack and inadvertently set off an IED intended for a truck. It was not the day that nearly killed me and left me seriously injured. Although I will say that day was a really, really bad day at the office. No, My mom came some 18 months later, sitting alone at my in laws bedroom on a small Texas ranch. As I sat on the edge of the bed, I looked at a young soldier staring back at me from a small sterling silver picture frame. Sporting a bright orange baseball hat and a toothpaste ad worthy smile, the soldier stood proudly in uniform, flanked by his squad, grinning in the Afghan sun. That soldier was me, U. S. Army Staff Sergeant Travis Mills of the 82nd Airborne Division. The picture was only taken two years earlier, but it might as well have been another lifetime. I was no longer that man in the image and never would be again. That was the moment I felt helpless, enraged, despondent, afraid all at once. And we all have those moments. I had a hard realization. My military days were over and I would never wear a uniform again. I would never give orders to my men again. I would not fight for my country again. I was no longer Staff Sergeant Travis Mills, serving on his third tour of duty in Afghanistan. In the army, everything had been laid out for me. There was always a clear mission and a thorough strategy to execute it. I always knew what I needed to do and how to get it done. Now it was all just so unknown. I know I am not supposed to admit this, especially as a former member of the 82nd Airborne, but my eyes welled up. I blubbered between deep gulps of air, trying to catch my breath. Luckily, my wife Kelsey walked in at that moment. I used what was left of my right arm to wipe my eyes as she sat down next to me. As soon as I as soon as she saw my blotchy face, she looked into my eyes and rubbing my back, reassured me, everything is going to be okay. We have each other and you know we can get through anything. It's all going to be fine. She didn't say much else. She didn't have to. Just being there helped. I knew she was right. Kelsey and my daughter had been with me every step of the way while I recovered at Walter Reed Army Medical Center. My parents, her parents, and my extended family were also so supportive. My fellow soldiers had my back and still do. I knew I was one of the lucky ones. There were plenty of fellow soldiers who didn't get to go home. There were others who had made it but didn't have the kind of support that I had. Some still carried the weight of war, which seemed nearly impossible to get past in that moment in Kelsey's arms, I made the conscious decision not to let the enemy win. I had to grieve for that person in the picture, or I couldn't move forward. I thought, okay, I am no longer that Travis. That's the old Travis. The whiteboard has been erased. I have a pen in my hand, and I can totally start anew. I began to see life as two choices. You more move forward or backward. What I wanted in my life was in front of me. Not the one in that photo anymore, though the man in that photo was gone. To me, the choice was clear. Damn if I don't hate that. I will never feel the skin of my wife's hand in mine or throw my son in the air to catch him. But there was only one direction to go, and that was forward.

You know what struck me about that is, I mean, you have such a clear, distinct moment where you talk about that, but, like, that's where we're all at. Like, everyone. We're all at this point where you have to go forward. You can't wish for what was and what could have been and woulda, shoulda, coulda. That stuff doesn't help and doesn't move you anywhere. You had that, like, distinct moment.

Boom, you know?

And my thing is, I'm always a guy telling jokes make people feel comfortable. I'm always having a good, you know, good laugh. And at the hospital, I became a mentor, right? I was an older guy at 25. I was an old guy that got injured. I was a staff sergeant, a lot of privates. And, you know, when I was in the service, I had a clear, this is my job. It's my role. People look up to me. When I got injured. This is my job, my role. People look up to me. I wanted to retire. I fought to retire. I wanted to get out there as quick as possible, you know, with. Within the means of, like, I can do everything that I need to be able to do or required to do, but it's time to move on. And then I did, and I got home, and that picture was up there. And I never. I mean, this is. Honestly, this is the first time I've talked about, like, this book coming out is the first time I've talked about this moment, because I never showed that side of me. I don't know why. You know, everybody think, like, oh, it's okay, whatever, But. But no. Kelsey walked in, and I was just. Just tears just down my face, and I was like, I'm just not that guy. I'm no Longer. Staff Sergeant Travis Mills Leader of Combat Soldiers. You know, best job I ever had. And, and I just didn't know what I was gonna do. And you know, I, I wanted to retire the military. Good, bad or different people here on the news or in all this stuff. But the va, like I, I have a very, very, you know, well taken care of, like plan of care and, and I have a pension and things like that. So like, I'm good and I appreciate that. But just, I was lost. I was lost completely. And I didn't know what I was gonna do. And you know, luckily, I mean, I had some sort of foundation of. Okay, well, we started the foundation, we have speaking. That's starting to pick up for me. And my documentary was being done by Reese and Katie Norris and Reese was there helping me along as well as my father in law who works with me every day. And we lived in my in laws because our house in Maine wasn't built yet. But yeah, I play it off as, you know, we joke, we have fun. But when you think back, I'm like, you know, even taking a step further, like I'm always like, oh yeah, 19 months I recovered at Walter Reed. And then I was like, oh, it's like, that's 19 months. There were some days that were terrible. You know, the first day I walked was great. Second day I tried to walk, I couldn't, I fell over, my legs cramped up, I was, my muscles spasmed and I couldn't move. And I felt so defeated that day. And then, you know, after 19 months of being at Walter Reed, and then you forget. So I'm not sure if you guys have that in your life where you forget the tough times because you're like, oh, yeah, no, that was terrible. But it's like I can remember just sitting at the end of the bed saying like, who am I and what am I doing? You know, and this is, I mean, maybe on top, maybe not. I had a lady that came up to house sit across the lake from us at the foundation. Their friend was like, hey, you know what, by the way, you're a traveling nurse, but you should know there's a guy over here who's in the service. He lost both arms and legs and he's made something out of it. And she goes, what? Who's this guy? And this nurse was very excited, like very, like over the topic. Who is this? And she goes, his name's Travis Mills, but here's a picture of him. And she recognized the diamonds on my arm. She worked on me In Afghanistan. And now she has moved up, she's a volunteer. And I've had her speak a few times, you know, for the foundation. And she's admitted openly. She's embarrassed about it, but she admitted openly. When she was working on me on the table, she was in her head saying, like, why don't we let him die? He can die with some dignity. And it's the same thought I had when I woke up in the hospitals. Like, you know, this is my lieutenant Dan, right? My mom, like, why didn't I just die? How is this gonna be better? But then I gotta the hospital, I met every requirement they put in front of me to retire. And it's time to go on with my life. Okay, you're out. Go forth and do some, you know, good stuff. And I don't know what I'm gonna do. And it was a, it was a hard realization of, like, okay, I've done everything the military needs of me.

Now what?

Now what?

You know?

Yeah. And it's interesting. I was just thinking about by chance, this part of the book is in the forward of the book. It's not chapter one, it's in the forward. And it's like the lesson is you have to be moving forward. You, you have to be like thinking about, where am I gonna go now? And you know, I'm always talking to guys that are getting out of the military and you got to find your next mission, right? And so this is a classic case because when you're in Walter Reed, you have a mission. It's like, oh, I'm gonna freaking learn to walk. I'm gonna get on my big legs, I'm gonna do that. You gotta had a mission. Every single day you're trying to get something done, and then all of a sudden you did it all.

Yeah.

And you're like, okay, you're out, you're retired, out of the military. What are you gonna do now?

You know, I relied on my military training because when I was becoming an nco, they said, what's a job of an NCO Non commissioned officer? And it's to provide purpose and direction. And I forgot that, right. Somewhere along the way I forgot that I need to have my own purpose and direction. And then slowly but surely, after I got out and retired, was at my in law's house for the three months, then been to Michigan for three months, just trying to escape the hot summer, you know, and then moved up to Maine to our house. I had to find my purpose and my direction. I was going to go and And I mean, luckily, luckily I, you know, was able to kind of rely on a lot of my military training for that stuff. Just like the mindset stuff they teach you and things like that.

Get some. All right, now we're going to roll into these principles a little bit. And again, this book is. I'm going to read like a few little tiny sections of the book. The book has got all kinds of. Like you said, there's a lot of stories in here that you've. People that you've met, people that have overcome things similar to yours. And you kind of, you align and explain what they did to get through something and how you did that thing to get through it. And then you've got this sort of, what is the academic side explaining why that's happening. So it's an outstanding book to explain these principles, give multiple examples and then tell why it's happening. So it's an awesome book. Did a great job. The woman that helped you did a really good job.

Oh, yeah. I tell you what, the research authors, they are very thorough.

Yeah.

Like, I literally hired a PR firm for like, oh, yeah, I'm having a book. I'm a higher PR firm with some of the advance or whatever. And then year two hit and I was like, what I thought was gonna take six months. The first book took like five months, I think, and we had it done.

Yeah, she had to research some stuff. Oh, but it pays off.

Oh, I'm not, I'm not complaining. I'm just saying I was surprised that.

Yeah, she's gonna be thorough. Yeah, yeah. Checks.

I wish I would have been. I would have like checked the ground a little better, not just been like man's bags. Heavy. Screw this. Pop it down.

All right. Principle number one, that dog don't hunt. Stop torturing yourself and stop asking why. And you go into a story here. You got a buddy named David Vora, is. Am I saying that right? And he's got a thing called the Adaptive Training foundation in Dallas, Texas. And you went there and you were kind of hanging out. It wasn't. I don't think you went, did some training sessions, but you, you end up crashing a barbecue. There's like 20 guys that are going through this, this week long workshop. And you're sitting around, you know, having some burgers and some beers, and then the conversation starts to get a little bit heavy. And you go into this section here, it says one guy named Bruce who'd been injured in a car accident and paralyzed from the waist down. Spoke up, quote, I just have to keep going, because if I slow down, I'll just end up crying. The worst part of it all is that I don't understand why. Why it happened. Why it happened to me. Joe, the head counselor replied, let's dig into that. Oh, no, we won't, I thought. No, no, you don't, I said. This time allowed my outburst, surprising the group. I surprised myself, too. I meant to be lying back, just enjoying the bonfire. The counselor shot me a look and asked, what are you talking about? There's no. There's no digging into. Why? Because you're never going to get the answer you want. What do you mean? I get it. Bruce wants to understand why this was meant for him. At first, I did, too, but the truth is that dog don't hunt. What I mean by that is you're never going to get that answer, so why harp on it? You're only slowing yourself down from accepting something you can't change and moving on. As I live and breathe, I will never know the answer to why I had stood in that exact spot where there was an IED buried in the ground, waiting for me. It's a fight you are not going to win, ever. So why not make peace with it?

And you go on to explain, you know, talk more about that. But that. That principle right there, like, people will.

Will tear themselves apart asking that question over and over again, and there's nothing you can do about it.

No, there's. In, like. And I have admitted this openly, like, some nights, you know, like, you know, I'd say once every three, four months, not. Not continual. There's nights when it's dark and there's no sleep to be had right then. And your mind starts saying, like, I can't believe this. Rest my life. I have no arms and legs. Like, what in the hell? Like, how. How is this something that I was, you know, supposed to have happen to me or why this happened? And. And you have those. Those nights, and all I do is get up and go watch sports centers. I'm like, well, this is getting me nowhere, because you're still going to have some doubt and things like that and some wonder, but to sit there every day and to sit there and think, well, why this happened? Could it be because of this? Did I do this? Like, was it because of. And you never get the answer. Like, nobody's going to tell me why I got blown up. I mean, I know why I got. I mean, the bomb was here, right? But I'm saying, like, there's no rhyme or reason to it. And anytime I get thinking about it, that's when I'm just like, stop. There's nothing to be had here. Just misery, you know?

You know? So I did a podcast a long time ago about Lewis Puller Jr. Who was the son of Chesty Puller, the Marine. Louis Puller Jr. Got wounded in Vietnam, lost both of his legs, had his hands jacked up really bad. He lost his legs at, like, the hips. Came home, had a really hard recovery.

Just, you know, got addicted to alcohol, got addicted to painkillers.

Just really had a hard time. And he ended up writing this incredible book, which is called Fortunate Son. The book comes out, it gets a Pulitzer Prize. It's just, like, an incredible book. We covered the book on the podcast, and then he's participating in helping with the Vietnam Memorial Wall being built and judging the design and all this stuff. And then that thing gets dedicated, and he's kind of straightened his life back out, and then he falls out of his wheelchair. He gets hurt. They bring him to the hospital. He had stopped drinking, and they put him on, like, painkillers again. He goes right down a spiral. He ends up killing himself. This is Chesty Puller. Chesty Puller's son, who joined the Marine Corps. Like, his dad, ends up killing himself.

I did that podcast, and then like, a year later, I had another guy on my podcast, a guy named Jim Serlsley, Jim Searles. He was a guy was in Vietnam. He had volunteered for the Army. He didn't get drafted. He joined the Army. And when he got his orders after basic and he went to school as a tanker, he gets sent to Germany. Like, in the middle of Vietnam War, they sent him to Germany. And he's, like, getting done with his tour, and he says, hey, I feel like I should go to Vietnam. So he volunteers to go to Vietnam. His sergeant Major is like, you need to think about this for the weekend or whatever. And he thinks about over the weekend, it's like, I'm a soldier. I need to serve. Goes to Vietnam. He's in Vietnam for 11 months. Last month that he's there, he's.

Got his squad out, and they're set, checking security, and he's checking their perimeter, and he steps on a landmine, gets blown up, loses both of his legs, loses one arm. He comes on the podcast, and this dude just lived, like, an awesome life. Like, he came home. He came home. He spent nine months in rehab learning, learning to use his wheelchair, learning how to operate things, learn how to function, and then goes out, gets his real Estate license, starts a roofing company, gets married, has kids, like, hunts. Just lives an awesome life. And, you know, we go through his whole story and everything, and we get done with the podcast, and we're downstairs, we're here, but we're downstairs talking. And he says, we're talking. I said. I said, you know, like, how did you progress, like, so much? And he looked at me, he goes, have you ever heard of Lewis Puller Jr? And I said, yes, sir. You know, Jesse Puller Sonnet? And he said, I was in rehab with them. So they were both got wounded about the same time in Vietnam. They were both in rehab together. And he said, I accepted 100 what had happened to me, and I moved on. And he said, louis never really accepted it, and it just tore him up for his whole life. And this story that you tell here, like, I wish somebody would have been around to tell, like, Lewis Polar, like, hey, that dog, that dog don't hunt, man. You ain't gonna get an answer.

So it's weird to have this big smile, and I shouldn't have smile. I have the same kind of story in a way. So there's a gentleman who got both legs taken, one hand kind like, lost, like a top of a finger, you know, nothing, but he lost both legs. And he was pretty bitter, right? Angry, kind of like not somebody that the therapist really liked hanging out with. And we were out this barbecue one day, and I was talking, we were joking and everything, and he told me, you know what, Travis? You're part of the Everything's Great club. I said, what do you mean by that? He said, well, everything you. You do, you just act like everything just so great. And I mean, and I was kind of tired of this guy, to be honest with you. He was always just a whiner. And I looked at him, said, yeah, no, you're right. You're right. I act like everything's great because I realized I was given the chance to live through my injuries. I know that I can't go back in time to change them. And being, you know, 25 years old, I hope I have 50 years left, and I'd rather be me than be a miserable SOB and not be able to get over it. Like, you're acting like right now, and you have been all this time, but you've been here, and I don't think anybody could have punched this guy harder in the face than those words hit him. And, you know, and again, I mean, I normally tell a story a lot like, oh, you know, I told him this and he was like, oh, that's so amazing. But really, it, like, hit him because I was. I was tired of just kind of his attitude, and he was telling me, like, everything's so great. And I'm like, dude, it's not that bad. Like, I get to be with my daughter. I don't think I'd be the same person that my daughter wasn't there. And just letting him know, like, dude, I have 50 years left. I'm not sure how long you think you have left, but I'm pretty sure I got 50. I make the most of it. And I realize the gift that it was given when a lot of my friends didn't make it back home, and I can, you know, whatever. And then he. I hope he's doing a lot better. Seems to do a lot better now. And we're not, like, at each other. Like, yeah, he's been to the foundation and stuff like that. It's no big deal, you know? But I think maybe he just needed to hear that that day because he just. He was so bitter. And I'm like, dude, I would venture.

To say that the Everything Greats club is better than the Everything Sucks club.

Oh, yeah.

Right.

Yeah.

I mean, I think 10 out of 10 times, having the attitude of, like, oh, I'm actually thankful that I got to come home and not all my friends did. And, yeah, I got to. Got to deal with what I got to deal with, but I get to deal with it.

Yeah. And I think maybe you probably have a lot of people that, you know that not put inspired, but survivor's guilt's huge. And it blows my mind because it's like, you can feel bad that they are no longer with us. You can be, you know, sitting there and think about what the situation was and maybe what you could have done differently, but at the end of the day, you couldn't, because this is what happened. And I take it as I'm gonna do the best I can every day, not just for my family, you know, not just for my kids and my wife, but I'm gonna do it because they didn't make it back home, and they would hopefully live life to the fullest if I would have died over there in my honor as well. I think it's selfish slap in the face if I gave up myself because I was given this opportunity. And it really is a privilege to be given life. I mean, those doctors worked on me for, like, 14 hours, and they could have loosened up one tourniquet and said they gave blood from their veins. Right into me. And they did a mass call over the PA system in Kandahar. Anybody with a positive and universal blood run to the doors. And they just. They had to keep giving me tests because they didn't test the blood. They just needed it. They needed it now. So. But. But anyway, I mean, Survivor Guild gets me because I feel bad that people can't get out of their own way and accept, like, it's what happened. But you have the ability now to make the most out of life. It's kind of like the same Private Ryan. Like, tell me, you know, I'm a good. You know. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah, there you go.

Get off my soapbox here.

No, all good.

Echo. What are you thinking there?

No, I'm taking it all in. But, yeah, it's. It's funny because, like, all these concepts, and you always talk about these concepts on the. In these circumstances that are so heavy, you know, but then when they trickle down to, like, everyday stuff, too, as well, so it's, like, interesting to get that little remind. Huge reminder. That's what I'm thinking at this time.

Yeah, no doubt, no doubt. I'm gonna fast forward a little bit. There's a book, like I said, this is like a pragmatic book. This is like a field manual almost of sorts. If you would have consulted me on the name, it might have even been called the Field Manual, but you didn't. So, whatever.

I'm the worst. Yeah, I'm the worst.

But some of the stuff that you've got in here is like this section here. It says, are you ruminating too much? And you introduce the idea of ruminating a little bit earlier in the book. But it says. It says some signs that you may be overthinking what happened. Do you ponder, why did this happen to me and to my family? Do you think, what if I didn't do X, Y or Z? Would there have been a different outcome? Do you often wonder what life would look like if this hadn't happened? Do you play out the accident or incident in your head repeatedly? Do you feel that what happened was unfair? Do you blame yourself for doing something or not doing something that could have been done to avoid the trauma? So, again, these are. These are, like, pragmatic things to ask yourself if you find yourself going down this spiral, the what if spiral or the why spiral? You know, and that's exactly Jim Ser. Unfortunately, Jim Serley, he. He passed away, like, a year and a half ago or so. But that was the thing that he said Is like.

Can'T just keep asking, like, why. Why me? Woe is me. Why me? And this is the exact same message that you've got in this book. So, yeah, if you find yourself.

Is that the second time he said I plagiarized.

I didn't play to write.

Well, Jason didn't write this. Didn't write a book.

Okay.

But, you know, he.

Sorry. He.

He definitely. I mean, he clearly had a very similar attitude as you and clearly, like, made it through with. With some similar thoughts along the way. So it's pretty. It's pretty interesting. I didn't really think of that until I. I didn't think of it while I was reading the book. I didn't think of it until actually right now when we were talking. I was like, oh, yeah, this is the same stuff that Jim Sersley was saying.

I don't think I put a principle in there called yolo. But I'm telling you right now, people wonder why I do so much. I started a restaurant recently, and I have the marina that I bought. Just drinking whiskey one night. I thought, let's go in debt.

Good decision making.

Yeah, why not go in debt? And a few other things. And people like, why you do it? And I'm just like, well, they already said yolo, obviously, but I think I'm not afraid to try new things. And I've given the chance to live through my injury, so go after it. But. But, yeah, I just.

Again, though, those questions and all that, like, I don't. You know, I tell people some of my biggest regrets. You know, I quit college football. I wasn't gonna play college football, like, that much. Like, I should have probably played baseball, but I was so good at the position of sideline because I was there all season in Last Chance.

You.

If that was a documentary, we would have been on it because we actually won the. The championship. I didn't get the rings. I'm like, I'm just like a. Like a redshirt freshman, so I don't want the ring. Should have got it. And then I had a Ranger contract. All my buddies were going to go to the 82nd. They're like, hey, let's just go to the 82nd. They're letting us choose. And I was like, oh, it sounds great. So I went to the 82nd. 21 guys went to 1st Brigade to Iraq. One guy went to 4th Brigade to Afghanistan. I saw my basic training buddies. And then just like the gentlemen you're talking about that wanted to go overseas, My orders took me to Fort Hood the big army said, hey, you got over two years combat. But I had a newborn baby. That tax free money a staff sergeant ain't a bad thing to have to plus up my bank account. It was a nine month hitter and I was a weapons squad leader. So I'm supposed to be theoretically the most protected because I have the two big, you know, 240 Bravos. I'm in the middle of everything, like in middle of the formation.

Not that I ever cared about that. I was actually usually get in trouble for being the first one in the door, but that's because I love to fight. But.

I guess the point is like I don't have those questions anymore. My big questions are like, my wife gets pissed too. We're having our coffee. I'm like, hey, so what do you think we're having for dinner? And she's like, are you serious, dude?

That's a.

Are you serious?

That's a hostile question. It's the same thing at my house. I have to set, I have to be disciplined. Because when I come home, like been podcast, record the podcast, we get done, we train Jiu jitsu. Get down. Jiu jitsu. It's now like 6 o' clock at night. I didn't eat lunch, so I've been like fasting all day. Come home.

Yeah.

And bro, there's.

What?

There's literally one thing in the world I want to know and that's what's for dinner. You know what I mean? But if I come through that door and I don't talk about four other things, four other things before, and sometimes now I just investigate, bro, I'll be like, look in the oven, see if there's something in there. What is it? Can it be pid, you know, because that's what's for dinner, man. That does this. What you echo. You're nodding your head.

I can see how that could be.

For sure, but it doesn't. No issue.

I have learned that this is just total avoidance. Long time ago.

Yeah, okay.

Oh geez. We sit there, have our coffee. In the morning, she's just getting in the room. And I'm like, hey, what do you want to do for dinner? You think you know? And she's like, are you, are you serious right now? And I'm like, well, yeah, I mean, I'll go to the grocery store if you need, or we can go to the restaurant, it don't matter. But that's. Yeah, that's. That's not a question you should ask. Especially at 7:30 in the morning.

I Have a coffee, dude. Only dudes think about, like, what's for dinner at 7:30 in the morning, right? Am I right? Mostly dudes.

My wife, she's going New Zealand, right? So, like, I'm gonna start just using the crock pot, I think.

Do you not have Ubereats where you are?

Well, I mean, it's. We do, but it's like. I mean, I can just go down. I'll be honest with you. I just go to the restaurant.

Oh, yeah, you got your own restaurant. What, are you kidding?

Kidding me? Yeah. But. But I'm telling you, I love the crock pot. I'm so fired up because at the grocery store, they already cut up all the onions and the peppers and the.

Like, everything I need thing with a crock pot for me.

Toss it in there.

When you get it, do the crock pot thing. To me, everything kind of tastes the same. The meat tastes the same. The. Everything tastes the same in that big bucket, right?

That's. That's spices. You got to add spices and different meat.

My wife's from England, so.

Okay.

Like, some things, like, spices are a little bit unfamiliar.

I'm gonna burn for that.

Echo.

Edit that out.

All right, principle number two. Unpack that rucksack, process what happened so you can grow from it. While when I tell people to stop asking why something bad happened, I don't mean shut the door on everything. You still need to process your experience and make sense of it. There's a difference between rumination and reflection, as well as merely overthinking and understanding. So this is. Again, I was. As soon as I got, you know, open this one up, I was like, oh, what does he mean by that? Because he just said, don't ask too many questions, and now he's saying, unpack it. So right out of the gate, you made a.

Reference. Is something that I say is, like, when people deal with loss, I tell them, remember, but don't dwell. Right? Like, hey, man, you want to remember your friends, but you don't want to dwell on it. And that's all you think about. And it's a similar message that you put in. In this chapter here about unpacking the rucksack. Like, you want to unpack the rucksack and make sure you comprehend what you went through, but you don't want to just, like, keep repacking it and unpacking it, repacking it and unplacking it type thing. Yeah.

And what I do is actually, I tell people when I get off stage, I got two life Lessons I live by. Right. The first one is this one. Don't dwell in the past, just reminisce it. I mean, I used to, you know, wake up in the hospital bed, hope, wish and pray this never happened. Close my eyes. They, this nightmare is gonna be over. I'm gonna wake up right now. And I never did wake up from that nightmare. Every time I open my eyes, I was in the hospital bed. And I realized early on, stop dwelling on it. Just reminisce. I had 25 years of arms and legs, you know, 25amazing years with arms and legs on, and then I didn't have any more. But I don't dwell on the fact I got blown up. I just. Like you said, remember? Right again. That's basically, you know, that's just what I do. Like, I'm like, hey, I played college football, I joined the military, I jumped out of airplanes and got paid to do it, you know, like, led some of the greatest guys overseas and had some of the most fun I'm ever going to, you know, ever had. But just because I got blown up doesn't mean my life was over. I just remember what I used to have and. And I. You know, this has been now over 11 years being injured, and I've had pretty incredible things happen since then too, you know?

Oh, yeah, for sure.

I mean, like being your. Your guys's friend.

Oh, you mean Echo's friend.

Okay. I grab my self esteem. I can't seem to reach it down there. Come up a little short over here, but it's okay.

That's really fine.

They can just stay down there. That's cool.

Little section in here. I'm gonna fast forward a little bit again. I'm fast forwarding through, like, most of the book. Obviously, I'm not gonna do the audiobook. Did you do the audiobook?

I did not this time.

You had an actor do it?

Yeah. Yeah.

I'm not angry. I'm just disappointed.

I would. I don't want to bother. I told you, I don't like. Look, I like being your friend.

There's. There's something.

Some people have a hard time reading stuff. Did you do the audiobook for this one?

I did.

Did you not like doing it Sucked.

I was it so. You know, so. I don't remember if I explained this on the last podcast, but my body overheats.

Mm.

I get hot.

So they stuck you in one of those booths to read this thing?

Yeah. AC had to get turned off so you don't hear the thing. I had to read A book three days in a row.

Yeah.

And they actually, after I was getting decent, they were like, okay, well, we got to read the first third of the book again. And I was like, awesome. Let's just. Let's just knock this out. And you know how you write something and you think like, okay, I wrote it. I know I wrote it. I was there when it was written, so I should be able to read it. And then you're putting like, instead of we are. It's like, yes, A weird. And they're like, no, that's not how it says in there. Like, yeah, let me try again. So we. Son of a. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of blooper outtakes where some, some words came out.

It's not any. It's not any. Yeah, it's not an easy thing to do for some people. Like, for me, it's. Honestly, it's easy for me to read stuff. I don't know why.

But, like, I've seen people that are the most conversational just really good to go. Then you put them to read something, you hand them like, hey, read this right now. And it's just like, brain lock.

Yeah. I mean, I do okay with it. Like, I could do the teleprompter and I could, I could have done it, but I just think that time wise, it didn't make sense. And they, they gave me like five voiceover people that had to choose from, so we picked the one that I think was the most interesting. I mean, I. Look, I've already said I appreciate just being your friend. So, like, I don't just be like, hey, can you do me another favor? You know that time I got blown up and you feel bad for me, so. No. So, like, I would have bothered you.

But next time bother me, I'll read it.

Absolutely. I got to write another book. I got to figure out what other thing I can see was successful out there.

Well, you know, Jordan Peterson did 12 more rules, so you can do 12 more warrior principles.

I might do. I might do 11 or 13. You know, maybe just go one up or one down. And then I'm just gonna do like seven minute abs.

Six minute abs.

Yeah, like, recap. Yeah, I'm all about the 8 minute abs. You know, I'm saying people don't really like this, this physique, this core is strong.

I'll tell you right now for rolling with you, because you, you, yeah, that's like your main body group.

I was surprised that the FX cameras that you guys use for. For origin and Everything for the. The camp, they record in slow motion because I mean I was moving so much faster than those videos on Instagram that were posted. Look, I mean I know I was to going a mile a minute, but I was like, man, those. Those cameras slow the frames down for sure.

It is a little bit weird like how fast you move like on the mat. It's kind of like a weird like kind of alien sensation. Did you get that?

Yeah.

Cuz you. There's a lot of stuff you're not used to.

Yeah, yeah. With me.

Oh yeah.

Yeah.

It's a weird.

I can make like a weird growl sound too. Like. And then that really gets them.

It is a weird thing to like when you start moving fast. It definitely like you said, I guess it's because you're not used to it. So you're not used to seeing like a body move in this really fast way. It's kind of. It's kind of a freak. Kind of freaked me out a little bit.

And like with the deco, he was saying and his birthday just hit, so happy birthday to him. But he was saying he was trying to reach for my wrist and he just kept coming up short of my wrist because that's not there. It's real.

Yeah, yeah, I saw. When I was watching him roll with you, I could see his like arm moving to grab. I would like to underhook your arm and it's not there. It's definitely takes some adjustments for the other guy as well.

Going back to the book here.

That's right. Yeah.

Talk it through. There are. There is a lot of benefits that comes with sharing your struggles with another human. The biggest being you find out you're not alone. When something bad happens to us, we tend to feel that we are the only ones dealing with it. And if you focus on the traumatic event itself, then yes, of course you are alone. As you literally. As you. As you were literally the only person experiencing that very event. However, if you change your perspective and focus on what comes with experience.

What you find is that everyone has experienced similar effects to some degree. When you share our feelings, you discover that you aren't really alone. That realization alone can lift the tremendous weight off your shoulders. Dude, it's like everybody's been through some. Well, so I trauma.

I got two stories for this. The first one, you know, like is it Good Will Hunting where he has to sit with a therapist. He won't talk to him and doesn't. He finally breaks him. Yeah, well, they had a social worker named Christie that they made everybody Talk, you know, you had to go to see her for an hour. And I went there and talked to her and we talked about football. She was Green Bay packers fan, I'm a Lions fan, you know, whatever. Clay Matthews, hair. Then she'd ask me a personal question and I'm like, yeah, no. And then we get talking about other stuff. And then we did it again. And I sat there for the hours, like, all right, well, time's up, I gotta go. Came back next time, about 20 minutes. And I said, I'll be honest with you. We're never gonna discuss anything, anything of real substance. I said, I didn't talk to mental health when they came into my room. And I literally gave the name that I gave her my name. Ranking social. Like, mental health came in. The first time I was sleeping.

Second time, Geneva Convention.

So second time they came in, I was like, kelsey goes, mental health's here, talk to you. I was still in the hospital, you know, I just shut my eyes, sleeping. Third time, eating a bowl of cereal with a makeshift arm, like. Like duct taped, like, with a spoon. And I'm eating and I see her come in and I know who she is. I saw her last time and I said, oh, you know, oh, shit. I don't know if I can swear and I can bleed, but whatever. And that's exactly what I said. And I fell back into my bed, like from sitting up. Fell right back and shut my eyes and pretended like I was snoring. And she walks away. What are you doing? And I gave him her name, ranking social. And she said, what? And I did it again. She goes, I don't understand. So that's what you tell the enemy if they capture you.

Take it.

So take it and leave. Or just leave, I don't care. Like, we're not. We're not going to do this. So that's my first time. And then I had a social worker as I got to outpatient, and the second time I went there for 20 minutes, said, look, never going to happen. So this isn't the movies. I got nothing to say to you. I appreciate what you do for people that need it. I don't need it. And that was it. And I got thinking about that, and I tell people probably not the right approach and blah, blah, blah.

So wait, did she never get anything out of you?

She released me. No, she never was going to. We're not going to be on that level. But I got thinking.

She didn't go full Robin Williams, Good Will Hunting and like, get you crying or anything?

No. What can she do? I mean, she was a nice person. I said, I appreciate what you're trying to do.

Yeah.

But what I realized.

Or, or.

Other side, I realized I had a community of my own. And I had Taylor Morris, who's a quadruple amputee. I had Drew Mullie, single leg amputee. And I had Bo Reichenbach, Navy seal, right, double leg amputee, as well as Josh Wetzel and Andrew Smith, both double leg amputees. And not just them, their spouses. And we were all the best of friends. We all dealt with everything together. We hung out every day and our kids hung out, you know, those of us that had kids at the time. And. And I realized in that, you know, looking back, because, yeah, you're right, that was. I was probably a jerk. So I didn't want to talk my feelings with her. I wasn't mean to her by any means. I was never rude. You know, I wasn't. She would never, like, if you asked her day, she wouldn't say I was a jerk or anything like that. I was just very like, hey, look, this is not the movies. This is not gonna happen. But I got thinking about it and I realized I had my community. And it wasn't just my community, it was me and Kelsey's community. Kelsey still is on a text chain with all the wives. They talk every day. The one lady, Jen, just had twins, kid number four and five, but her husband's only missing one leg, so it's like a paper cut. So they're fine. But. But I had my community to talk to every day and hang out with and go out to dinners and we always ate, you know, together and go around talk and things like that. And then take a step further. My alive day. I always hated my alive day. You know what that is? Maybe people out there listening, don't. But when the day you get injured, like car accident real bad or like me got blown up or whatever, that you almost died, that you live, they call it your live day. They want to celebrate it. Some guys drink heavily, some guys enjoy it. Other guys don't pay much attention. For the years I hated it, I was like, I don't want to talk about it. My birthday's in four days. You know, I'm fine. I'll wait for the actual day I was alive. But then by year eight, I think it was, I did an Instagram live and I got talking. I teared up and said, you know, at the end of it, I used to be pissed, used to hate this. I used to think this is the worst day ever. Why would I want to remember any of this, you know, instead of just, you know, move on. And I said, but then you realize how fortunate I am. And I look back at the years I've had to recover, to have my family, to have, have my friends, and to be here to watch my daughter grow, to be here and have my son, which would have never happened if I would have just died. I said, so at the end of it, for the alive day, I'm just more grateful than anything. And then Taylor, he's not the quad. He's very dry, very quiet and Navy EOD guy, great guy. He texts me, he goes, nailed it. You know, and that meant a lot that he said, because he doesn't. We don't talk feelings. And then the thing is, with my community, we didn't talk about feelings in general. Like all those folks. I got blown up. It was like, it's just like understood that we all thought it sucked, you.

Know, so we were all just like, baseline level suck.

We've all been there and that was like my community. So I, that's, that's the important thing. Well, you find a lot of guys that won't engage with somebody that's not military or don't. They're like, they're not gonna understand me. So I'm not gonna talk to him. And that's why the foundation, the Travis Mills foundation, shameless plug for my foundation here we have the PATH program, the warrior PATH program for first responders and combat veterans because it's led train, the trainer style, non clinical and it's one of the top in the nation. It teaches people how to struggle well, because we're all going to struggle. And about post traumatic growth, you know, how to understand what's going on and to fight through and to come out the other side better when you have an episode or when you feel that stuff. And I'm way off topic probably.

No, no, all good. That's. That's what we're here for, I think.

You know, with the community I had, I had a solid community, Some of the greatest friends I'm ever going to have, you know, and I get to see. Actually Danielle, we picked up today on the way here. Taylor couldn't come. I saw him from the plane. We talked a little bit through the door. And then.

Andrew and Tori are coming with their kids as well, so.

Pretty cool.

Yeah.

Fast forward a little bit again, I'm not gonna read the whole book, but it says focus on what's in your Control and what's not in your control. Let's use what is in our control to grow from. This is something I always have to refer back to. Always have to refer back to, like, hey, you got some things you can control in life and you got some things you can't. Usually we can control more than we think we can, but there are absolutely are things that are going to be totally out of control.

Yeah, like the five today, trying to drive down there.

Oh yeah, over the five.

I was so mad. I was like, oh no, I'm letting them down. I'm an hour late. And I was. But my driver was so sweet to take me cuz the car service, I screwed it up somehow. So like Uber down from whatever.

Was it an Uber you took down here? It was good times.

I gave the guy a big tip. Like I was like, dude, I'll tell. Like I gave him as much as like I tried to do a hundred. And like you can't do 100, you only do 98. I'm like 98 it is Jack.

You can't do more than 100.

I said I couldn't.

Huh. Maxing that thing out.

Principle three, point the finger and three fingers point back at you. Don't blame others, but be compassionate to yourself. You go in here, you talk about your program director. Director James. Is that at the foundation?

It is. He's a Marine that runs the path.

Program, Marine Corps 2009-2013. He was like one of the guys working on IEDs, finding IEDs. He got, you know, explosions, got some blast damage along the way. And I'm fast forward a little bit. You say he came back from his second deployment. He says, I was super angry. I woke up pissed at the world. And that's just the way I stayed 24 7. I don't know why, I didn't know why. I just knew that I was pissed. I was getting violent at work with junior Marines and verbal fits at home that just kept escalating. This among other things ultimately led to divorce. I left the Marine Corps in April 2013. But at that point I'd been diagnosed with PTSD, TBI and a bunch of other crap and was forced to seek treatment. Doctors put me on a zombie cocktail of medication. Eventually it came to a total of 17 different meds. Some for depression, some for anxiety, some for TBI related headaches, and a bunch of other pills to counter the side effects of the medication. I mean, this is just like kind of one of those horror stories you hear just getting medicated. He ends up, start drinking. He's. He starts feeling out of control. No matter how mad he was, I was at myself, I project anger on someone else. I think, who am I going to blame today? Because it can't be me. And you say that right there is a victim mentality. He ends up like, suicidal. And again, this is a long story that you tell in the book.

But then you say the biggest aha moment was when James realized he was accountable for himself. And this is one of the best definitions of extreme ownership I've ever heard. If I don't change my diaper, then I'm gonna have shitty pants. That's on me. I stopped looking outward to blame and started to look inward.

Change that diaper.

And you know, the funny. The thing is not funny, but the thing is with James, he actually, he's our coordinator for path. Like, he's like a big wig. Like. And there's like 10 locations around the nation for PATH program. And we, our numbers are very well, where they use us for a lot of examples. And I mean, where James was at, I think he tells a story. Does he tell a story about throwing a turkey?

He was at work at a grocery.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like, he threw a turkey. Threw a turkey at a customer.

Yep, at a customer. He tells that. Yeah, he. You could see he's come a long way and.

Oh, yeah. But. But again, yes, he has. Great guy. I mean, truly just a great guy. But he's getting remarried and they just, you know, moved into another. A new house. They just built a brand new house. But he's. He's that community that we're talking about too. Like, he's the one that leads this program for people that face this every day. So he's been there, lived it, done it, and he still works on himself every day. You know, it's a constant. It's constantly a recalibration in a focus.

Or refocus the contrast that you talk about in the book. And this is really important. I've talked about this as well, because this is clearly. This is this same principle as extreme ownership. You know, this is like you point one finger at someone else, there's three pointed back. You. It's the same thing. And then you talk about forgiveness. This is again, something that I address. And you say this, essentially everyone has regrets for things they did or didn't do. But you can't get hung up on these regrets or you will never get peace. Repeat after me. I am human and I make mistakes. Show yourself some grace. Accept the mistakes and Learn from them. Instead of dwelling and letting them hold you back, use them to propel yourself forward in a new direction. Life is trial and error. There's no handbook on how to live your life. Every time that you feel you may be beating yourself up, stop reflecting the situation and ask yourself, what can I learn from this situation and how can I do better? And the big thing, when I talk about forgiving yourself, if you think about, like, your relationship with your wife or your kids or whatever, if you don't learn how to forgive, like when they mess something up, it's never going to work. So if you can't forgive yourself for some mistake that you made in the past, you're going to have problems for a long time. So you gotta learn to get over it.

Yeah, I mean, that's what I do. Like, my son, he'll. He'll do something stupid, you know, obviously. And I'm like, look, you little six year old.

You little turd.

Actually, you know, it's hereditary. I kind of. I blame myself. Right. I gotta take the extreme ownership. He's a mama's boy and so am I, but I hate it. Oh, my daughter, me are best friends.

Well, he's only 6, right?

Yeah, yeah.

They. They're. He's gonna be that way for a bit.

I know, but here's the thing. We went to. I took him to a birthday party to his cousin's house, and he had to pick up like, the Nerf gun we brought his cousin. He picks it up, it's a big box. Hits himself in the neck. Oh, it hurts. And I'm like, it doesn't hurt. It's probably unpleasant for a second. You're fine. He goes, you're just mean. You're a mean dad. I'm like, no, I'm not. You're soft. And then we had a whole conversation. He's like, you want. This is how you want your friends to talk to you if you hurt yourself? And I'm like, yeah, yeah, I do. He's like, you're just mean, dad. Get in the car. And then, you know, later on, he was fine, but. But I'm like, I also, my daughter, like, hit her head at school in kindergarten and have huge goose egg on her. On her head.

No factor.

Yeah, she went out. Like, school calls. Oh, my. She hit her head. Probably should come get her. I came to get her. We're going out the parking lot, she's dancing and twirling. I said, you feel fine? She goes, yeah, all right, so take her back in school. I Said, look, I know how it looks, right? I was in an explosion. I'm probably like a hard ass. Like, my kids, fine. I went through a bomb. What was this? I said, but she's fine. And she passes out or something. Give us a call. But she's going back to class. And when my son, he had a thing at school where he got sick or something and he just wanted school, I feel like.

Yeah.

And my wife got the phone call and she called me and she beat me there for five minutes and she let him get out of school. It comes home, he's dancing and jumping upstairs, fired up, gonna turn on this and play this and whatever. I said, you know what, Kelsey? If I would have got there, I would have told him, dax, you can come home, no problem. You're gonna sit in my Yukon.

Why?

I go to all my meetings today at all the different, various places I gotta stop. And you're not getting my phone. You're not watching a movie. You're gonna sit there because you don't feel good. You can go at the class, play to friends, or you can come home with me. He would have took option one. She's making him soft.

Josh, here's some. Here's some advice that I've given to, like, a lot of my friends that have kids giving it to Leif. Lif is super fired up for this and he takes advantage of it. Every chance you get to pull your kids out of school and go do something cool, do it.

Oh, no, we're. We're in California until Tuesday.

Okay, cool.

Yeah, yeah, she's going to New Zealand for 16.

There you go. That's what I like to hear, man. The kids will never remember, like, some day at school where they learned about whatever. Yeah, but you go do something cool with your kids. Take them to work, let them hang out, go to wherever, like, take them fishing. Whatever you're gonna do with them. Yeah, it's gonna be a thousand times better and you're gonna learn more.

I just don't want him to go to the nurse's office. That's what I was mad about. No, you're fine.

That's. That's. That's a different thing. That's. That's also like, the kids are learning to manipulate, right? They're learning to work the system. They're human beings that are learning to navigate through the. The. You know what I mean? Like, well, if I go here, I can come home, I can watch TV or whatever.

Yeah.

Dance around or whatever. You're saying he was doing so she's up the stairs.

Just, like, going upstairs, petting the dog. Like, having this good old time.

Yeah.

Five minutes after I got home.

Good. Smart kid, right? Kind of.

Oh, you don't feel good? It's like, yeah, I just.

Yeah.

Yeah, you're right. You don't feel good.

Yeah. There you go. Kids are crafty, but.

No, we. Yeah, we. My parents were like, every day you're at school, that's it. I'm like, I think. I think I'm dying, you know? You're fine.

I broke my. I was out in the woods with my dad, and we were cutting down wood for the fire, and the. The tree fell on my leg because I was an idiot. And. And so I was like, I think I hurt my leg. And my dad was like, you're fine. Toe the sled back. So we had, like, a sled filled with wood, so I had to, like, drag it back. And I was crawling kind of, like, with my hands and one leg, because my leg really hurt a lot. And, you know, I get back and, like, three days later, they took me to the hospital because I was still hopping around. And he had a broken leg. Yeah.

You know, our parents were tough. My dad. I broke my wrist. He's like, you're fine. He smacks it, and, like, boom. He goes.

He goes, you know what? I think we're gonna go check that out. But he had to, like, make sure by just, like, I was holding my. My left arm, I was like, no, I think it's broke. He's like, you're fine. Smacks it. He's like, yeah, we're gonna check that out.

Yep.

Yeah.

When they clear their throat like that, you know. You know something's wrong.

Principle 4. Snap your fingers, wiggle your toes, and get the out of bed. Create small, achievable goals for moving forward. When dealing with trauma, there may be days, weeks, that you don't feel like doing anything. You may feel so depressed and deflated that you may feel too paralyzed to do anything. My friend, that is called collateral damage. To which I say, snap your fingers and wiggle your toes. I can't do that for obvious reasons, but chances are that you can. The idea behind it is simple. Do one small thing to get you moving. That one small thing will get you motivated to go on to the next thing. The simple act of getting out of bed and getting out of bed will curtail whatever you got spinning in that mind of yours. The mere physicality of these actions should spur a mental shift as well. Once you stop being Physically and mentally stuck. And this is when you can start to take responsibility for your behavior. Choose to see something in your life that you can find a positive in every single day. Snap your fingers, wiggle your toes, get out of bed. It's a simple act that can remind you that life isn't that bad.

Now, we did, we did take from the idea of make your bed. Yeah, but it was like, you know, making your bed, like, set and goals. Maybe you just got to get out of bed first. So, like, we didn't.

You know, you made, you made Admiral McRaven. You know, you made him look bad here.

No.

Oh, hey, hey, Admiral. Hey, Admiral. Oh, you're just making your bed. What if you can't even get out of bed? Well, you went one step deeper.

We just wanted to include everybody. It's very inclusive here.

Just saying, it sounds like you're trying to one up him.

I can't snap my fingers. Look at my toes.

Sorry.

You got, you can. Like I said, this is really a pragmatic manual. You got a whole section on keeping you section on goals and creating goals. And then once you have a goal, you'll need some tips on to keep you going. You got things in here like, be flexible, be kind to yourself. Don't judge, be patient. Visualize achieving your goal. Have a support system. And you got expansions on all this. I'm just kind of burning through them. Celebrate the wins question, though.

So, like, right, look, I, I'm not silly. Like, I, I'm fortunate to know you outside of the podcast. Do you visualize all the success that you were like, you reach out to Pete. Hey, Pete, like your geese want to do something. And you're like, then now look at like all the drinks and all like, I'm drinking life's drink just because I like the flavor. But like, did you visualize, do you do that? Like all this? Except, I mean, I'm sure people know, obviously products are successful and then origin and everything like that.

Yeah.

No, I would say this.

So, like, when I try and make something, I don't over invest or over index or think it's going to be successful. I just try it. Like the first thing, like echelon front. Like, Leif and I weren't like, yo, like, we got to build a giant consulting company. Like, we were like, hey, let's see if anybody wants this information. And then as they wanted the information, like, oh, cool. People want disinformation. They need to learn how to lead. Okay, cool. How many people. Okay, well, let's Hire another instructor. Jp, come on board.

It does a fantastic job.

Well, thank you.

I've been able to sit through a couple of his. Yeah, he was in my restaurant.

Oh, jp.

He spoke for a big energy company that gives a lot of money, the foundation. And I walked in, I was like, joe, are you serious? Like, I'm a speaker too, you know. But no, I'm kidding. Joe Parrington, he actually, he got to do a lot with you when he's in New Hampshire.

Yeah, JP's phenomenal. Yeah, JP came on. Then Dave Burke, like, we just expanded. Expand, expanded. Same thing with, you know, origin. Like we were making geese. Okay. That's like one product. How are they doing? They were doing good. Well, let's make rash guards. No ghee. Okay, cool. Eventually it's like, hey, don't a lot of people wear jeans? Because it seems like everyone wears jeans. Let's try making jeans. Did we buy a jean factory immediately? No, we took a few years, then we bought a gene factory. But so for me, I don't like visualize blindly like, this is going to be great. I'm going to take a huge step in this direction. Same thing with all those supplements. It wasn't like we didn't come out with a line of supplements. We came out with two supplements. Right. And then did people like them? Are we, are they effective? Do they give people the, the benefits that we are saying? Like, yep, look at the up growing people. More people want them. Then we bring out another supplement. We bring out protein. So doing it a small way so that you don't have to be able to see really far in the future to visualize. For me, I'm just looking like, oh, there's an opportunity, let's give it a shot type thing. Make sense?

Yeah. But I, I'm just like, I visualize like, yeah, we're gonna, I'm gonna do this. It's gonna be awesome. Let's go big. My business partner Bill's always like, hey, let's just start small. And I'm like, no, no. I wanted to build this 200 person event center with a brewery underneath and it and a tasting room. And it was gonna be like 1.6 million dollar project. And. And then like one of the guys that's one of the partners, like, oh, it's kind of big, blah, blah, blah. So now we put it in a little four bay garage and like, about the vibes. I don't care about the vibes. Dogfish Head brewing sold for $180 million. That's where I'm going straight to the top.

Yeah.

But we're going to start. Slow it down.

Have you had any. Have you had any big failures yet?

Oh, yeah, yeah, I got one right now.

What was your biggest failure?

I went, okay, well, my arms and legs. I lost those, but didn't lose my ass on it.

Your biggest failure was looking for IUDs?

Yeah, no, no, I found that.

Okay. Big success there.

No, I wouldn't say failure.

There's.

The closing line I'm trying to do right now is not. I'm not putting much time and effort into it.

Have you. How much have you invested? Invested in it? Like, like a huge amount. A minimum amount.

I'm not sure what a huge amount is. For me, it's a huge amount. It's like 100,000.

Okay.

And I'm not too, like, you know, I don't work on it hard enough. That's why I told my wife. She's taken over.

So, again, to me, that's a lot of money to put into something when you may or may not have something that people really want. And there's only one. The only. The only group that can tell what the public wants is the public. So, you know, you can make something that every you think is the best thing, you know, the greatest thing in the world. And people are like, yo, we don't. We don't want this.

When I promote it and stuff, I sell. But my problem is I have a million different things going. So, like, it's me. Like, I understand. Like, it's. It's. The three fingers point back at me.

Yeah, yeah.

You know what I mean?

What's the name? Where can people buy the stuff so we can at least sell a little bit of it? Maybe you can get some of your hundred grand back.

Well, it's Rebel for good. Well, I mean, I. What I did was I. Because the main. Okay, so the military will give you a certain amount of money when you get blown up per limb. They cap it at two limbs total. And.

What? Yeah, they cap it at two limbs.

Okay. So it's. It's, It's. It's public knowledge. It's 50,000 per limb, but it's capped at a hundred thousand. And with that hundred thousand.

Dude.

I know, I know.

That is the most freaking ridiculous thing ever.

I don't know. I'm not trying to start a fight with anybody. There was some talks about going and saying, like, no, no, it's not right. But. But the point is, I was appreciative and it's Tax free. And what I did, instead of buy an Escalade or go out and buy some dumb, you know, something stupid, I flipped houses. No, no, no. I like Escalades. I'm just saying at the time. At the time, I was like the number one podcast in America, like, able to like buy an Escalade.

You know what I'm saying?

I'm just saying, Echo, you have the clout. I didn't. So I flipped houses and I had some real home runs. I flipped eight houses. Some were just like nothing. Just like, okay, bought it for 80,000, sold for 180,000. You know, like nothing to it before it got saturated. So then I bought the marina and I bought a cottage and. And I've done investments. Right. And I've worked and stuff like that. So what I did was like two. Two years ago in February, I decided I was gonna bet on myself. So I took money out of the stock market because I didn't like where it was heading. Great time to take it out. I bought an investment property in Florida and I put money into this company, but I just don't dedicate enough my time as I need to. So it's on me. But I'm. We have a store, main local store that's like in 17 stores that's going to go into.

So that's cool.

So we'll see. We'll start there and see how.

And if people want to order something today just to like try and maybe help you stay, I don't want to take away from it.

I don't think we have origin.

You know what I'm saying, bro? What is it?

What is Rebel For Good Dot com. It's all about. So Rebel for Good is like, here comes the pitch. What we came up for.

Yeah, I don't want to. I don't want to sell anything, but Rebel for Good is a good idea.

Was you go against the grain and you be a rebel, but you do good with it. Like, you know, you. I don't know. It's just what came up with. So. So, yeah, I mean, I'm not. I'm not upset about. I have another. Another company that I'm doing some contracting with that will. It'll work out. It'll all work out.

Which company is that? Or it's just.

It's just called One Alpha, One Off Outdoors. But it's like a. I'm doing like government bidding.

Okay, awesome.

Because they give, you know, disabled. I have all. Whatever. Yeah, I'm more quiet about that. Not quiet, but like, check. I'M disabled veteran, so I have a status.

You're disabled veteran.

Okay, well, cool. They put out my paper. I mean, I'm handy, capable though.

All right, we good? Does that, does that answer your visualization question?

It does. Because I sit there, I visualize a lot and I'm like, okay, cool. I'm building this, I'm building that. Like when I'm on like airplanes and stuff, stuff like that, that's what I'm doing. I'm like staring off into nothingness, you.

Know, Echo and I just did like a little recording and I was talking about being paranoid that I'm paranoid. I'm a paranoid person. Not in a paranoid, like, oh, I think everyone's trying to get me, but like paranoid. Like when I was in the SEAL teams, I think I'm paranoid I'm gonna forget a piece of gear. So I'd like check my gear five times and I would never forget anything. I paranoid I was gonna be late. So I'd have three alarm clocks. So I was never late. I'm paranoid that like, oh, I'm make horrible business decision, so I'm more cautious. Well, I shouldn't say that I'm not cautious, but I'm. But I don't over commit to things, so I don't think. I don't have an idea and think like, dude, dude, I just, I thought of the best, you know, widget ever. And I'm going to build a factory to make this widget. Like, we have what, four factories now at origin. But we started with one, you know what I mean? And grow. We didn't pool all of our money and borrow a bunch of money and leverage my house. And I'll do this, all this other stuff to get four factories in one shot. No, rebuilt one, then another one, then another one. So that's kind of same thing with Echelon Front. Like, there's a lot of people that work at Echelon Front. Now we have office building. We have like, we got a lot of stuff at Echelon, a lot of things going on. But we didn't start that way. We started small and growing. That's what I recommend people all the time to do with business is start small and grow.

That's. I should do that. You know, here's the thing. I should have probably did that when it came to like hitting a bomb, but I just dove right in. You know, I could just took one leg below in these, see if I like it.

Especially if you knew you're only gonna get. If you're Gonna get capped at two limbs.

Yeah.

They didn't tell you that? No, they didn't say like, hey, listen, if you're gonna lose limbs, just trying to hold fast at two, don't you think?

Okay, so everybody out there listening, like working hard and going about life. Don't you think, like, that's a little bit like even arrogant for me to take tell people in a way, bro.

I would have probably at this point written a book, said you're capped at two limbs. And the whole book would have been about this. This is freaking ridiculous, okay? The U.S. government, I mean, the amount of guys that lose more than two limbs is not a freaking big number. It's not like we can't pay the guys the other 50 grand or the other hundred grand for four freaking limbs. Come on.

Well, if you're listening to this and I'm kind of out some money right now, so I mean, if you, you want. No, I'm just kidding. No, I believe it's gonna like, we have made some money on it, right? I'm not like out a hundred thousand. But I also, I realized like it was stupid of me to not get.

Do you have a bunch of T shirts or whatever sitting around that you already made?

We have some stock. Yeah. Okay, yeah, shirts, there's hats, there's stuff.

Hey, but Everybody go to rebelforgood.com and buy some stuff.

There you go.

From this broke ass veteran.

That's right.

That over.

They didn't give me enough for my arms and legs being gone. I was just trying. No, no, I just, I'm not saying it's a failure. I'm just saying I don't. I think maybe I visualize, I visualize that I don't attack, you know?

Yeah.

Like, I'm like, oh, hey, we're gonna work on Rebel for good today. And then I was gonna do it tomorrow, but I gotta fly to Vegas and then I gotta fly to, you know, just my schedule gets me. So my wife would love me to.

Like slow down, chill down, chill out.

Well, just figure out what I want to actually do.

So do you know your purpose?

Yeah, I. Yep. Yeah.

Driving purpose.

There's a song about it. And I plan on just being a billionaire. I'm not sure I'm going to do that.

That's what you're visualizing.

I don't even know why. I mean, I just like this song. I want to be a billion. You know, they're so, you know, I'm saying yes.

Do you know?

Yeah, yeah, of course.

Yeah, everybody. No, I Don't know. I don't know. I just. I like being busy. I actually. I was talking with Pete just yesterday. I was driving and I was talking to Pete, and I said, you know, he said, oh, man, I've been meetings all day, and I'm sure maybe you were in the meetings with him or whatever, but they had meetings all day, and it's been a couple days. He's like, yeah, you know, so now I'm just gonna go home and maybe relax a bit. I'm like, yeah, but you like work. He goes, yeah. He was like, I love it. It's what I do. I'm like, I'm the same way. So, like, I call it work, but when you're the boss, it's not really work. You know, you show up, everybody's nice to me. You know, I go to the foundation. Hi, Travis. How you doing? I'm doing well. How are you? No one's like, hey, you didn't get this paper done.

They're like, what are you working on today? You're like, I'm gonna eat a piece of chicken.

And customer relations, you know, employee relations. But anyway, anyway, no, I. I just. We got way off topic there.

Right on. All good.

My bad.

All right, going back to getting back on track. Going back to principle number five. Stay within the guardrails, manage your emotions, and control your attitude. And you got a section in here that I. I gotta run through. When Robert was in grad school, he took an adaptive leadership class that always stayed with him, and it came in handy when he's in danger of losing his job. At that moment over lunch, he had so many emotions, control consuming him. I really wanted to scream, hey, you've set me up to fail. This is a guy that had, like, lost his job, or he. No, he was. He wasn't. Hadn't lost a job yet, but he was going to get fired. They told him he's gonna get fired. He wanted to scream, hey, you set me up to fail. You didn't even communicate what you wanted from me. I felt we didn't have an agreement on what I was supposed to do. Yet here I was being told I failed, but I didn't scream. I remember what I learned in that class as the adaptive leadership class. To get up on the balcony, get up high and look from above at a situation, get that perspective to get out of your head and leave your emotions on the floor so you can be more objective and resist having a hasty reaction. Going up on the balcony gave me the space and the presence of mind to get a broader picture and figure out a good plan forward. There may be something you want to say, but that doesn't mean you should say it. And being on the balcony gave me that time to think on my feet and respond the right way. This is something that I talk about all the time. Just being able to detach is what I call it. Being able to detach, not get caught up. Take a step back, pay attention to what's going on. So what you're talking about in this section of the book is, like, getting control of your emotions. And you got a bunch of, like, things, too, that you cover in here.

I mean, per our last conversation, I just. I literally realized that's my fault. I don't spend enough time on the product right now. I detached to look from above, and I was like, you know what? Actually, as I'm telling you guys this, it's my fault. I suck.

Yeah, well, you also probably get, like, emotional about, like, hey, this is gonna be a great product. And you don't take a step back and go, okay, hold on a second. Have I tested the market? Do I understand what people really want? Because you think you do. We all think. We do think in our gut. Like, everyone's gonna love this.

Well, I thought I had some stuff lined up, too, where it's gonna go into a big retail store automatically. And I had it all lined up. And then last minute did not work out that way. I was like, okay. Because I remember telling my wife, like, hey, I'm just going to bet on myself. You know, Just. I'm going to invest in myself.

There's a weird two thing, like, sometimes people have. And you probably have some of this too, is like, people that are so good and convincing that they convince themselves and then they convince everybody else that they're right. Like, I have to be careful that, like, I don't. I can be pretty persuasive about stuff. I can be so persuasive that I can persuade, like, echo, that, like, we're going to do something, and it doesn't make any sense. So I'm always, like, checking myself again. I'm paranoid. I'm paranoid that I might be wrong. And that keeps me a little bit more in check about things.

You got a couple things in here about when you talk about emotions, like breathing, you say, practice mindfulness.

Which, again, this is the research that was done.

No, but when I was reading it, I was kind of like, okay, here we go. But then you said, here's a typical initial conversation with many Former Marines. Hey, so we're doing some mindfulness for work before we work out today.

Oh.

So we're gonna go full on hippie. Ever shoot between breasts when you were behind the scope of a rifle? Well, that's mindfulness. So you kind of brought it down for us. Freaking knuckle draggers. I like that you talk about that mindfulness stuff. You talk about humor, using anger as a motivator, role playing you put in there. Just freaking awesome. Something we do all the time. And then just making sure. And again, you go into this. Get the book. Get the book out there. Because it talks about, like the actual methodology from going from like a negative thought to a positive thought. And this is some of the really good stuff to take away from the book. Principle six, make the time to be grateful for what you have. And then this is when the science. You have a little thing in here. It's called, you've got creative. It's called science. Lesson number one. We tend to be negative. Nancy's. I've got a little excerpt here. It's called negativity bias. We tend to remember and dwell from stressful negative experiences more than a positive, and to base our behaviors off of them, which is interesting. It goes into it here. Like, if you are out on the, you know, Serengeti plains and you watched, like your family get mauled by a lion back in the day, you'd be like, lions bad. I need to stay away from them. So that makes us dwell more on the negative than on the positive.

And I think that we do that as, just as humans we do that we've had at the foundation, thousands of families or thousands of people come, right? Hundreds of families. And I tend to imagine or I tend to relive the three or four that won't get invited back. Out of all the success stories we've had, all the spouses and the crying, and this is the best thing ever. My husband. This is the guy I married. Exactly the guy I married. And I haven't seen this guy since before he deployed. It was like four years prior. And I'm like, remember that one family that came here and like, they let their kids just ruin everything? That they used our brand new towels with the kids, poopy butt. And like just all, you know, it's like the dumbest thing ever. And I do that and I focus on that. Or it just, it's irritating that I do that. And then I had one comment made to me when my house got built. Garrison Ease Foundation, Karen Charitable Foundation. And tell him Towers were all together. They both built it. Very, very grateful to have the adaptive home. And I had an older gentleman come out because I had an elevator in my house. The elevator was donated, but I had an elevator. And the guy said, how many elevate. How many ramps are you putting on veterans houses? And you have an elevator in your house? He said, you're just building a shrine for yourself out there with your foundation. Damn. And that, like, sticks in my head because I've never taken a dollar from my foundation. I mean, I've never taken a bonus. I don't use any of the money for myself. Like, and if I did, nobody would say anything if I had a salary, but I don't. And, like, we raise quite a bit of money. We're very fortunate. People support and believe in us. But I literally go out for two hours now during a Tuesday lunch. I don't even eat lunch. I meet the families. I say hi, and then I take off and I go to different. I schedule other stuff because I don't want people to think I did it just so I can be out there and, like, look at me. Look at me. And, like, just some old. Some old guy. Matter of fact, he's a Vietnam vet, and he happened to be business partners with a friend of mine that I met. My plumber. I called my plumber. I got the guy's number.

That's a bitter dude.

Well, let me tell you something. You want to see a Facebook troll? You got one in front of you. People give me a bad review at my restaurant. They're gonna find out you talk bad about my marina. We're gonna have a conversation. This gentleman, I got his phone number. I called him up. I said, hey, I'm not sure why you're saying this, but we're gonna have a conversation about it. How'd you get my number? I'm like, I know people don't worry about it. And he just. He just couldn't get over. They didn't understand what I was doing with the foundation. And now to this day, I still always think about that. I want to make sure people know, like, and I don't know why, but I'm like, hey, look, we raised. You know, I think we're going on $40 million of income donations and donations, and we're building and we're helping and supporting and building programs out. And I make sure every chance. Every chance I get, just, like, right now, I don't know. I feel compelled. But everybody knows, like, I and Kelsey, we have never taken a dollar Salary, a bonus, nothing. And we're never going to. But I want people. I don't know why that guy just got in my head. That was like when I was moving in my house.

Dude, that's case in point. People focus of all the people that have praised and been thankful for all the families that you've helped and everything. But you think about this one dude that talks shit about you.

Oh, I tell you what.

So case in point. Sometimes we focus on the negative. I know your book is correct. Science less. Lesson number one, silence. Lesson number two, this is your brain on gratitude. Studies have shown that practicing gratitude can have incredible results on the brain and mood. People have reported feeling happier, more motivated, and more content after adding the practice into their daily life. So you got that in there. Gratitude breed resilience. You give some science behind that. You give science. Lesson number four, really believe it. And you talk about Andrew Huberman, Dr. Andrew Huberman, and just the fact that he's like talking about when. When you go into a. What is it, an ice bath. You're talking about here? Yeah. For it to really work, you have to believe that it really works. You have to think that, like, this is good for me. And then it. Then it's like, more helpful.

I should know this about you, but do you do the ice plunges and all? Yeah, I thought so.

Why'd you think so?

Did you ever post about it or did we talk about it at camp?

I don't really. I don't really post about it.

No.

No.

All right, well, I didn't mean to bring it up here for the world.

No, no, there's. There's like a whole thing. There's a whole thing around, like, doing ice bath and posting about it, you know? Yeah, it's like, you can do that.

You know? Hey, if I don't post about it, did it really happen? That's the question, you know, but no, I do. I. I do. I do it every day. I have a sauna and a ice bath. So, yes, I do that stuff every day.

We have the sauna. My wife wants to get an ice. The ice bathroom. I'm not sure if I can get out of it, though. That's my problem.

You would need to get some kind of modifications or something to it, but they're not deep yet.

I can get up.

You could. You wouldn't drown in it.

I can get up.

Actually.

Know what?

You know what? You could definitely get out of it. Because I'm thinking about when I was rolling jiu jitsu with you. You have, like, this weird upper body mobility. You'd be able to, like, hook onto the side and yank yourself out.

I'm not so sure. It's weird. It's just. It's just how I am. But it's fine.

It's got to be weird, dude.

You'd probably like that ice bath, because I know you run hot because you. Because you don't have the, like, as much radiator as the rest of us.

Are, like, faster to my body.

Yeah. Yeah. So you would probably. It would probably feel really good to you.

Yeah, like, refreshing.

It does feel good. I mean, you know, all the stuff that you hear about it is true. Like, you get in there. It sucks when you get in there, and then you're just like, yo. And I used to not dunk my head under because I have, like, real bad something called surfer's ears. Have you ever heard of that?

I mean, I know what cauliflower. I know what surfers.

So surfer ears. It's the inside of your ear canal. You expose it to cold water a lot, and it gets. It starts to get bone growths, and it gets smaller and smaller and smaller. So, like, my ears. My ear canals are, like.

85% shut, and so I get ear infections easily. So. But now I just, like, plug my ears with my fingers and just go under, and it feels really good. But, yeah, my son. When my son was, like, 9 years old, we were at a surf contest, and they had the person there selling, like, earplugs because everyone gets surfers ear, and it's really bad out here in California. And he looked at my ears and he's like, dude. And then he goes, well, let me take a look at your son. And my son's like a maniac in the water. He would be in the water his whole life. And he, like, looks at my son's ear and he goes, I have never seen a child with ears like this.

His ears were already, like, 40% closed at age nine. Yeah. It was like, yo, bad father. Coming in hot.

Next principle. Get up battle, buddy. Never underestimate the power of a support system. We have to realize that while our individual experience may differ, the struggle is the same. 99.9% of all human beings struggle. It's just what we do. And then you quote a Harvard study.

Yeah, that's what. I have three doctorates. I'm a doctor three times over. Bates Unity and University of Main, Augusta. What my alma maters, Jack. I showed up for a day for one of them. The other one, I show up for dinner in a day for the.

And they gave you, like, honorary doctorates?

You know, they still count, but, yeah, I got. You don't have any. Honor.

I'm so impressed, bro. No, no.

What?

No. When I got done with the University of San Diego, I was like, I'm never going back to school.

No, no, no. I just went. I went for the graduation.

No, I don't. I don't know. Maybe I have too many arms and legs to get honorary degrees over here on my side.

Told what you got? It's up to me if you taking advice from me for anything. Hold what you got.

Harvard study, apparently the longest study on human behavior has found that overwhelmingly, people who have deep personal relationships with others are happier than people who don't. Translation, you could be a billionaire and have all the material things you want in life and still be miserable. Money will not bring you happiness. Status will not bring you happiness. Deep personal connections you have will. It does not just affect emotional health. It also affects your physical health. Health. One recent study found that seniors who consider themselves lonely have a 59% higher risk of physical and mental health decline and a 45% greater risk of death. Other studies likened loneliness to smoking 15 cigarettes a day.

Check.

What about dogs? Are dogs in the game for that? Like, don't dogs make. Don't dogs make, like, pets make you kind of happier, too?

Yeah, yeah.

You got dogs?

I do. I do. I got dogs. But I don't have a service dog. I don't want a service dog. I want to take a dog everywhere.

Everybody's got a service dog now.

Yeah.

You go into the airport and there's people that are, like, walking around with a service dog. You don't know why. They look, they seem to be healthy.

And you can't question it. That's the only thing you can't question is this service dog is jumping up and peeing on everything. But, no, I have. I have two dogs, and they're at my house. My wife made me. She made me. I went to that at a golf tournament out in Iowa. And our old dog, we had to put him down, and I was like, you can just do without me. It's cool. She's like, yeah, no. So I had to fly back from Iowa.

That's. The army soldier slips out sometimes. You're like, I gotta put the. Yeah, go ahead, take care of it. Yeah, I'll be back. And I'll be back next week.

So I had to fly home, knowing I was like, oh, yeah, so I'm gonna land, get Home. A vet's gonna come to our house and we're gonna kill my dog. So cool. So like I had to do that. And then I always joke around, like about service dogs. Like, everybody's like, you should get a service dog. I'm like, I, I got a dog, his name's Buddy. They're like, yeah, but we, we can get your dog that listens. And I get offended. So my dog Buddy was so good. I used to look at my dog and say, hey, Buddy, sit, like when you want, you know, and eventually he would sit down when you want it. Yeah. But no, we have, we have a fox red lab and have any. They're good dogs.

Check. But do you think they help people live longer? Echo Charles assessment that.

Well, I hear good things. I've heard about, you know, they give people all kinds of random pets and yeah, they get, they get like half because they have more of a purpose. They can take care of it, all this stuff.

But now the fact that they don't live past like 12, 13, is that when they have to go, Is that a bad thing?

Yeah, that feels like they might be jam somebody up for sure.

Yeah.

I've heard it with like dogs, cats, rabbits. You know, people just have a pet to take, take care of.

Yeah.

Kind of companionship scenario.

I think that, I think there's some truth to that. Yeah. It feels like some people like dogs better than people. Yeah.

Yeah. My wife was saying the other day we were, My family was having a discussion about like, what you would pay to like keep the dog alive and everything. And I think my oldest daughter, who's kind of cold blooded, she was like no more than thousand, you know, or something like that. And then, you know, my little daughter was like, oh, no. My son was like, dude, you, that's crazy. And then my wife says, I view our dog, I view Odin as one of my children. I was just like, yo, if this dog gets sick, I'm gonna be bankrupt.

Yeah, yeah. No, my, my. One of my, My friends, their dog had like cancer three year old dog and they spent like, I think eight grand on it.

Yeah.

And I'm like, why? You bought it for 300? Probably you can buy another lab, you.

Know, you can buy a lot of laps.

And then I'm like, I would never do that. And Kelsey looked at me, she goes, oh, oh, yeah you would.

Oh yeah you would.

Like she was on their side. And I'm like, nah, shut down.

Yeah, you got shut down.

What was your number?

Look, my wife's, you know, she's gonna make a call on that dog. You know what I'm saying?

Same as my number.

Back out of that conversation real quick. And my dog, you know it. You know, I'm the alpha. You know what I mean? In the house.

Yeah.

You know, like, I get. He listens to me the most, but he does like her more.

Now, let me ask you a question, because I don't. I never been to your house. Like, do you live in the country a little bit? I know. I know where we're at right now.

No, I live by the ocean.

But, like, do you like, I live you. Have you been in my house? I can't remember yet. Yeah, you did. Did you come for dinner?

No.

Okay, Thanks a lot. Appreciate that.

No, thank you.

I did. You didn't fly in quick enough. I remember because life and the ladies came up.

Yeah.

Anyway, so I can go out my back or my porch, and I have 20 acres with no neighbors, so I tinkle outside. That's what I do. But my dog walks over and pees on top of mine. That's when I get angry. I'm like, excuse me, dude, you know what I'm saying? Like, what do you. And the funny thing is, it's like the little dog first, he's just like a little 30.

So he kind of outflanked you, your dogs?

Well, he tries to, but then, you know, then I let him know, just. I don't know. That's a weird thing to bring up, but I get pissed. I'm like, what are you doing? Wait.

That's a flex, right? For dogs?

I think so.

Peeing over your pee, I think.

Dude, there was an MMA fighter a while ago that his nickname was show enough, the Master. Yeah. Remember that dude?

Yeah.

What was his real name?

Oh, the MMA fighter. The real Show.

No, there was a MMA fighter whose name was, you know, basically Bill Show Enough, the Master Smith or whatever his actual name was.

Oh, like a. Wait, I thought he was a regular martial artist, like traditional.

No, there was an MMA fighter whose nickname was Show Enough, the Master, which I have to say is like one of the top.

I saw Thug Nasty one again.

Yeah, he did, right? Yeah, yeah.

I didn't get to meet him yet, but he seems like a pretty decent guy.

Oh, yeah, he's a character. And that was a really good scrap, dude. He looked sharp and he's down there.

He got hit pretty good.

Well, yeah, he got cracked in the eye, but, dude, he. He.

Oh, he.

He looked really good in that fight.

That guy could not defend the take, and Dude.

This is a dude. That's like. The wrestling he's doing is like, with chickens right now. My boy Bryce, dude. Yeah, that dude's out wrestling chickens and going in the cage and jacking people up. God bless him.

Ty and Ian went out there. They had a great time. Oh, yeah, they. I think they FaceTimed me, actually. Yeah, but they had a great time hanging out with him.

Yeah, no, Bryce is good. A maniac dude, but yeah, he looked really good in that fight. Yeah, his nickname's Good Thug Nasty.

Well, Show Enough is from old movie.

Yeah, I kind of vaguely remember that.

Yeah, it's called the Last Dragon, which was the black. You know how they do like the black version of a, like, movie? It's like that. The black version of one of the Bruce Lee movies. So instead of Shogun, it was shown off.

Oh, that's legit right there. Yeah.

And that part. That movie's actually pretty. It's a comedy movie.

So it's like. Like Robin Hood and Robin Hood. Men in tights.

Yeah.

Kind of like a spoof. Kind of screaming the screen. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I gotcha. It's.

Is it a spoof? It's like kind of a spoof.

Yeah, yeah. Oh, it's a spoof.

Yeah, for sure.

No, I don't mean the bad way. No, no, it's.

It's a fun movie. It's old school, though. But that's where Show Enough came from. In fact, I always thought that too.

That.

That name is pretty dope.

Showing off the. Yeah, showing off the Master Z. Is that his full name in the movie?

Yes. If I'm not mistaken, man, I was a little kid.

But the thing is, it's real problem if you try and give yourself a nickname that's that. Badass. Right. You know, you can't give your nickname. You can't give yourself your own nickname. Like Nighthawk.

Which I think I just took from Step brothers, right? Step Brothers, he says. Like you call me Nighthawk or something.

Like Dragon.

Dragon. Yeah. You can't give yourself cool, cool nicknames. Doesn't work that way.

Principle eight.

Yeah. Back on. Back on.

One that I am familiar with from the SEAL teams. Never give up. Never quit. Ever push past your own personal best.

So when I came up with this, like, my slogan, if you will, is never, never give up. Never quit. I was doing sit ups after I got blown up, I was doing sit ups and I was 140 pounds, right. I lost 110 pounds my injury, and I was doing sit ups and they're recording me. And as I was doing these sit ups, the occupational therapist was like, hey, do you want to take a break? And I'm like, no, I'm never gonna take, I'm never gonna take a break. I said, I'm just never gonna give up, never gonna quit. And I just kept like ripping these sit ups out. And I mean, I was so weak, I, I mean, drugged up, look like a crackhead. And I was just like, that's where I came from.

So I'm never gonna stop.

Yeah.

Freaking awesome, man.

I'm a fast forward a little bit here. You say having a growth mindset. Psychologist Angela Lee Duckworth is the best selling author of Grit, Power of Passion and Perseverance. In it, Duckworth defines grit as perseverance and passion for long term goals. In her words, quote, grit entails working strenuously toward challenges, maintaining effort and interest over the years despite failing, failure, adversity and plateaus and progress. People are born with various levels of grit, but Duckworth contends that it is a trait that develops through experience. One key to improving it, as she points out in her TED Talk, is by shifting your mindset from a fixed to a growth orientation.

So you also have some tips in here about how to stick it out. Don't overthink it. And again, you get the book. Take your time.

You keep saying I have these tips, but you wrote the forward it's we now we have these tips.

Yeah, we have these tips in our book.

In our book.

Am I getting a cut? Well, I tell you what, in the contract.

Yeah, well, I think it was if you would have narrated. I think that's what was in the contract.

But yeah, Chuck, take your time. Always be curious. Be a 1 percenter. The 1% rule is the theories making tiny changes that add up. And we just covered something like that on the podcast. Be careful about perfectionism. And then you get to the fixed and growth mindsets here from another psychologist. You got all these psychologists near, but you don't have Jordan Peterson.

I just, yeah, well, I didn't, I didn't know if he would want to be in my.

Well, you didn't know he is 24 until 15 minutes ago.

He's like, hey, this is my 25 through 36. What the hell? And I'm like, oh, I didn't realize this is extension.

People with a fixed mindset, those who believe that abilities are absolute are less likely to flourish than those who believe that abilities can be developed. In other words, with a growth mindset, you, you see challenges as learning opportunities rather than as obstacles to overcome.

That's one of those things, man. You know people that are like that, like, you know people, like. I know people in my life where they like anything. They, like, look at it. They're like, I can do this. Like, I can figure this out. I can make this happen. That's a. It's a good thing to have.

Oh, yeah, definitely. I mean, that's what Pete really. I feel like, you know, Pete Roberts, I mean, I think he did that too, with like, the. Hey, we gotta bring manufacturing back. Let me go get this old piece of equipment that hasn't ran in 40 years. Yeah, let me just figure this out from nothing.

Which is freaking crazy. Well, I was gonna say that I was thinking about that too, when we were talking about, like, growing businesses. Like, origin started with one sewing. Actually, I think it was started with two sewing machines. Two, like, broken sewing machines that didn't work, you know, like, make them work. The loom, bro. The loom is crazy. Now we got six looms. I think one of five looms. One of them broke. But, yeah, that's some growth mindset, right? It's like, a lot of people are like, oh, you cannot manufacture here. You can't do this here. Oh, yes, we can't watch this.

You know, and not to, like, toot my own horn here, but let me.

Sounds like we're about to beat.

Beep. Okay, So I was the guy that would always, like, help somebody. Like, I look, I couldn't change the brakes that well. I could figure it out, but not, like, I was a mechanically inclined person. But when you lose your arms and legs and you have to literally explain to people what you need, like, you have to figure some shit out. So, like, for me now, after my injury, I have to break everything down to, like, how am I going to even, like, making, like, as simple as, like, making an egg sandwich in the morning. Not even egg. I can't crack eggs. So I'm saying, like a ham, cheese, you know? Like, I'm like, okay, I gotta get this out first. I gotta make sure I have this set up. And, like, I never did that before, right? I just, like, run to a wall and just try to, like. I can't figure it out. Let me just ask. I'll phone a friend. I'll Google it. But after being injured, like, I have to, like, think every single step of how I need to do something out before I do it, because if I don't, it can go real bad real quick.

So you gotta be more Patient. Patient and what's that word? Like proactively thinking about way you execute things. Yeah, yeah, because you can get, you can get like tripped up in a situation that's gonna be shitty.

Well, like, you know, it's funny you said shitty because I wasn't gonna say that. But like say I gotta use the restroom, right? I got a hook. I have. I gotta make sure I get my legs off the right way. My shorts gotta come off the right way. I gotta make sure I'm all set up so that after I take everything off I can put it all back on to like make sure I don't have to call someone to help me out. You know what I mean? And it's just like, it's all a process now. Which, which is fine, right? It's fine. It's like your new normal. I talk about you're find your new normal, but it's just I never had that before. But now it's like I can only get frustrated so much if I can't figure something out or so I can't get someone to help the way I need them to help because what's he gonna do for me?

Yeah, dude, your patience must be like level ninja.

For myself, other people, not so much. You know what I'm saying?

Not for your, not, not for your 6 year old son Dax.

Oh gosh.

Oh, patience is thin.

My daughter at college is like, I'll be right there, one sec. And here talking to her friend Ashley or Emily still. And I'm like, I don't know what you didn't get about when I said get over here. Just geez dad, just calm down. I can do it faster than you. I'm like, you know what you little. Turk, this is 12.

So it's, it's only going to, it's only going to get, it's going to get worse before it gets better. I'll tell you that much right now.

Principle number nine. Swim with the sharks, walk with the horses, make fear your friend. I'm gonna read a little section here. For me, the fear of failure hits home. When I was growing up and playing a lot of competitive sports, I never wanted to fail. And I took that fear to my military days as it, as it folded in nicely with the military's hard ass philosophy of always having a game face. I always wanted to make sure that I led from the front and never showed it weakness because if I did, my guys would lose faith in me. I knew that if that happened, they wouldn't follow my orders that were meant to keep them alive. That fear drove me. When I became injured, I was confronted with a new, seemingly impossible, insurmountable fear. How the hell was I going to take care of my wife and daughter with no legs and arms? Who did I think I was? Because I was certainly no longer Staff Sergeant Mills, fearless leader of combat soldiers. I was instead, lying in a bed, helpless, limbless, and jobless. That immediate fear I had in that hospital bed lasted for weeks, months even. No one saw it, though. I wouldn't let them. I wouldn't let fear win. I probably didn't handle this perfectly, but in the military, you're taught if you stop moving forward, you die. So even though I couldn't physically move forward, I knew I had to move on emotionally. I used this fear as a motivating factor to help me.

Yeah, here's getting into some steps that you've got here to help you overcome fear.

Number one, know what your fear is. Is there something in your life you want to change but don't? Knowledge is power. Number two, acknowledge that a bit of fear. Fear is good. It means it is taking you out of your comfort zone. Getting comfortable with. Get comfortable with being uncomfortable. Know that it is normal to feel this way, and many people feel fear. You are not alone. These two right here. Making sure that people know that, like, that's okay, and acknowledging that it's good. I've had that. I originally had that conversation with guys in the teams, like, especially, like, young guys. Like, you could see, like, before and op, like, it was first couple ops on deployment, you could see they're, like, real nervous and just being like, hey, dude, got some butterflies in your stomach there home. You just went to the bathroom four times in the last 15 minutes, and it's like, no, I'm good. It's like, hey, bro, it is good. Like, you should feel afraid. You should be, like, nervous because you're gonna get. Getting ready to go out into combat. And I had that same conversation with. With quite a few MMA fighters before fighting in, like, in the ufc, where, you know, they might have all those guys. Like, you don't get to the UFC without having competed your whole life in wrestling or in jiu jitsu or in whatever. And so they're. They're. They feel real comfortable. And then all of a sudden, you get to the UFC, dude, it's 100%. They're going to be nervous because it's the UFC, and you see them get nervous and just being able to tell them, hey, man, you're feeling nervous, huh, Dude, I don't know, man. It's like, hey, man, it's good. That's your body getting ready. You're bonding. Your mind getting ready for combat. It's okay.

Well, it's heightened senses too, right?

Yeah, exactly. Your body, your mind getting ready. Yeah, it's freaking. It's how it should be.

Number four, share your fear with others who will understand what you are going through. Number five, stop negative thinking in its tracks. Number six, plan.

Number seven, call it. Realize that you have a choice to get over fear or not. Number eight, give yourself a big hoo ya for going for it. Now you use the term huya. Why did you use the term huya?

Super great question for my collaborative author, Kathy.

Okay, just because we know that in the army you say hua.

Yeah, I say airborne. I never said huah.

And as a matter of fact, fact, the only place they say huya is in the SEAL teams. They've started to say it in other places now in the Navy.

Maybe that's because SEAL teams are the best. You know, maybe if they had a movie out, you know, that I would have been able to see, I would have tried to go for real SEAL team.

If only there were more books about the SEAL team, you know what I'm saying?

You know what I'm saying?

I'll get right to work. Yeah.

Thank you. Thank you. Well, no, I'm not in high school anymore. I mean, I had my choice. They even didn't have the best reputation when I was looking at the services.

Did you even know what the SEAL teams were when you were looking at the services?

No, I was looking at Rangers and special Forces. And then I had the Ranger contract and I could, I feel like I could have did it, but they were just like, they're like, they just, they got me.

You and I had that conversation on the first time is like, you were definitely a way better athlete than I was. Like, not even close. But for some reason I was like cocky enough to think like, I'll make it through that training. And for some reason you were like, oh, not sure, which is a weird thing.

It was just like they were like, oh, hey, we go send you whatever unit you want. Because they were just trying to plus you and stuff to go overseas. And they were like, you're gonna go there? It should be six months. Wait here. And I was like, we're all like, well, we gotta get in the fight right now. I shipped out a week later. Like, like those guys went like the next day.

Yeah.

And then we, we still hung out with them, like, at UNC Chapel Hill, all my friends. And I'm like, oh, my gosh.

It's weird that in 2006, you thought you knew needed to, like, hurry up and get in the fight. The war had already been going on for five years, and it was going to go on for another 15.

Well, because, you know, that one time I got blown up, I didn't know the future. It's kind of the same situation there. Like, I didn't know how long it was gonna be, but the drill sergeant's.

Like, you gotta get over there in 2006, bro. I mean, there was no slowing down in sight. It wasn't like this, you know, 10.

Foot tall and bulletproof.

Yeah, that's what happens when you're a young kid.

Yeah, but how old were you?

So were you, like, 19 when you enlisted, or were you 20?

I was 18, but then I turned 19 in basic.

Because you went to one year or. No, you only went to, like, half. Well, yeah.

Yeah. Semester and a half, Shack. I only have a year and a half left. Like. Like, if I would now, it's probably expired, but I only had a year and a half left for, like, a degree. If I would have because I did college job. I kept reenlisted to go to college.

You got three doctorates. Why do you care anymore?

Oh, I don't. Yeah. No, I'm not going. I literally had my daughter doing, like. She was doing math like. Like last year, and they were doing this common core thing. And I'm like, what is this?

Yeah.

And it's like, well, Danny does it this way, and Susan does it this way. I said, chloe, cross out Susan's name and put. My dad and I showed her how to do long division. She's like, this is so much easier. I'm like, yeah. So next day, like, she got to show her class, like, long. The teacher goes, that's what we're trying to get you guys to do. And Chloe's like, yeah, this is. My dad said this is his philosophy, how he does it.

The Common Core thing is definitely strange.

Yeah.

It's like, have you seen it yet, Echo? Your kids might be too old or too young. No. So you're like, wait a second. Just subtract one. You know? And they're like, well, no, what you need to do is add two and then remove three, and then you're gonna get the answer of minus one. Like, it's just real strange.

Yeah, I. You know, I don't like feeling dumb at sixth grade or fifth Grade math, you know, And I'm just like, nah, just cross it out. Say, my dad says, this is how he does it.

You're gonna have a fun time with the parent teacher's class conference.

I did. I did get yelled at with my wife because, said, Chloe, when you go to school tomorrow, like, this was. This was last year, sixth grade. I said, when you go to school, just tell him that your dad, you know, owns a few businesses. He's, you know, and in my 35 years of being alive, at times. 35, I said, I've never used this once a day in my life, so just let them know that I own these businesses, and I've never used this crap ever, so I'm glad you're learning it. And Kelsey goes, you can't say that. I'm like, okay.

I. I would go to parent teacher night. I haven't done in a while. But when the last time I went, I, like, took selfies with all the teachers, you know, like, with a. With a crazy face, and sent them to them, because then my kids were like, what are you doing? My daughters. My son didn't. I didn't even do it because it wouldn't, like, phase him. He'd just be like, whatever, you know? But my daughters. I took crazy, like, selfies with all their teachers, you know, let me get a spirit selfie with you.

Number nine. Debrief. Think about how you would improve. Show a growth mindset.

Oh, I was gonna touch on something quick with. With the previous one when it says, like, you know, I wouldn't let, like, anybody see what was going on. Like, I had my community, but I thought it was a Japanese philosopher that said, like, there's your friends that know you. There's, like, your spouse that knows your intimate friends. There are people how that people know you, how your friends know you, then actually who you really are. For six months, I couldn't look in a mirror at myself. I just wouldn't. I literally would brush my teeth off to the side because I couldn't. I couldn't see just as little arm as I was brushing my teeth with a prosthetic. And it was, like, so hard for me. But nobody knew that because I was in the bathroom by myself when I was doing that. And like I said, I probably didn't do the mental health thing the right way, but.

Yeah, but I wonder if, like, the prescription would be like, oh, you should have told your wife, or you should have told your friends or something like that.

I mean, I'm sure somebody else is feeling like, now you're deformed. Like, I was deformed, mutated in a way. I still am, but I got. I can accept this is who I. This is my body now, you know? But. But I mean, as far as, like, have the community and have people you rely on and stuff like that, like, that's advice I need to take, because at the time, I couldn't even. I didn't look in a mirror at all. If it wasn't, like, neck up, I wasn't looking.

Damn.

Yeah.

And it took you, like, six months, you're saying, to, like, where you're, like, started to accept it.

Yeah. Kind of like, okay, well, this isn't changing. I went to bed every night. Hope it's gonna change. It hasn't changed yet. I don't think it's gonna grow back. And. Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, I hate to bring the mood down. I mean, I didn't mean that in a bad way. No, but sometimes, you know, it takes.

Well, you were talking earlier about, like, that feeling, like, okay, this must be a dream, and I'm just gonna wake up, and it's gonna be over. And, you know, we've all probably had bad dreams where we, like, wake up and you're so relieved that it was a dream, and you're just, like, after a while, you keep wanting to have that feeling and ain't happening.

And I was okay. Like, I was accepting my injuries, and I was getting better. I was working out, but it was, like, just. There was different things, you know, there's different things. Like, I actually think in this book. In the picture section. Like, the picture with the orange hats in there.

Yeah, yeah.

You know, and I like the picture now, but at the time, I was like, no, I can't. I remember having that kind of go viral with Jenna. Put me on Fox News and. And. And all that stuff, that picture. And my sergeant major called me. I was in Launch Tool, and I said, sergeant major, I'm so sorry. That picture. I shouldn't have had that hat on. I was out of regulation. I understand. If I got to get a demotion, like, best job I ever had. I appreciate it, but I apologize for. He's like, mills, you crazy son of a. What are you talking about? I was like, well, I have a baseball cap on outside. Like, yeah, I shouldn't have had that on. I'm sorry. And he was just like, I think you're good. I'm like, oh, okay. Never mind. Forget what I said then.

Jenna trying to get you in trouble.

Principle 10 A new normal. Your vulnerability is your strength. Vulnerability is defined as the ability or the chance of being. Being physically or emotionally wounded. In the military, we don't like vulnerability since it can imply that you're in danger, you're in a weak position. Being vulnerable is the very thing you didn't want to be as a soldier. After all, when a soldier is vulnerable, in a vulnerable position, you can get killed. Vulnerable to the enemy, vulnerable to attack. We were trained to not be vulnerable. Yet in real life, it takes on a different meaning. While being vulnerable on the battlefield means weakness, being vulnerable with yourself doesn't have to mean. Mean you're weak. In fact, it can mean the opposite. Being vulnerable is strength. What do you mean by that?

Well, I mean, like, opening up. Like, I mean, just when I was saying my. My alive day, how I hated it, it irritated me. I didn't want to celebrate it. And then all of a sudden I said, you know, but after the last eight years or whatever it was, whatever live day it was, I realized, like, it's a thank you for all the hard work that went into my recovery. Doctors, nurses, staff therapist at Walter Reed, you know, prosthetist, everybody. That got me back where I was at. And it was a more gratitude of what was done to save my life rather than anger of being injured or thinking about the day I got blown up as, like, a positive. And then, like, having Taylor, like, hey, man, nailed it. Like that, man. Taylor doesn't say very much like, he's a good guy, but he's pretty dry, quiet, hilarious. But, you know, and him just saying that, like, just nailed it. I think it's all he texted me. I was like, man, that's cool that. That we can, you know, have that. He felt the same way, but never. We never voiced it.

But, you know, I like, you know, I say I was negotiate from position of strength. You know, I don't know if that's true or not, because a lot of times I feel like I'm just trying to be on the same level. I don't want to be above or, like, do this because I'm in power, but I find myself using my story, having me to, like, help mentor people and talk to them. So, like, I use the vulnerability of my story, but it's never like, on the same level as somebody where I'm like. Like, I'm not asking people for their, you know, advice on my injuries. And maybe I need to do better about that because I'm more of, like, I want to be the mentor, not the mentoree. If you will, you know, unless it's you, I talk, you know, you two out.

But when I'm like, I know you feel. I sprained my ankle last week, so I kind of. Let me give you some, some advice on mental toughness.

Right, right. No, I get it. I get it. That's right. You did crawl with a broken leg eight miles and then. Yeah. Then walk up the hill to school and back up the hill home with a broken leg for five days. I heard the whole story. I get it. I know about, I know that you.

Don'T know about vulnerability like I do, bro.

Yeah, well, I tell you what, I tell you what. Have your arms, legs taken away and have to use the restroom and have the corpsman have to help you every time.

Yeah.

You are vulnerable.

Yeah.

And that was like the worst, like literally the worst time, like the worst part of my life. Having to like with that part. Soon as I got my arm was like, never again.

Yeah.

Cuz they have these surgeries out there. Like they'll put steel rods in my arm and they're like. It's called osteointegration. But I'd be without an arm for like. Nope, one day's too long.

What would the purpose of the steel rods going in your arm? B.

Gets rid of the socket completely and then the hand hooks right into it. And they just, they do it with the legs too. A lot of people you see with legs like that, they have steel rods come on their leg called.

Oh, no kidding.

And like, it helps with the overheating because I have three layers on my legs that like, don't sweat, you know, like it's up my inner thigh.

So you're saying there'd be a metal protrusion coming out of your body?

Yeah. Yeah.

How do they, like keep it sealed and not getting infected?

Well, there's a ton of medication I think you gotta take just in case. But they're trying to redo the, the dermatology. The dermatologists are doing like skin and they're trying to make it like your skin on your. Either your fingernails skin or your gums. Try to change it to that. But I'm just, I'm not gonna.

But you're not doing it because you're not gonna go without an arm.

Yeah, without arm. I'm not gonna go without legs for nine months. That's what it takes usually, so it's cool. But this is what it is.

Yeah. Plus things are advancing so fast now that you could probably wait like another two, three, four years. They'll have some new advancements.

Well, stem cell, they're actually regrowing people's limbs. They just can't figure out how to make it stop. Crazy stuff going on right now.

So you just grow like the biggest arm ever.

Well, I mean, I don't want that.

You like, echo over here.

Oh, look at this guy. This guy.

I think that's length. I think you just won't. You have a real long arm right. After a while.

So for real, they can take stem cells and your arm.

I'm growing. I met a Navy doctor that was at, I think, NIH doing that. And he was like, hey, this is coming in the next, like 10 to 15 years. And like, it's your nerves, it's your body. But I don't know. I mean, two of the. Two of the guys that are quadruple amputees got double arm transplants. So, like, there was five of us, now there's only three. So two quit our club.

And the arms are functional and working and.

Yeah.

Can they grab things?

Kinda. Kinda. They do a lot more sandwiching, you know, like pinching it. If they're happy, I'm great. They're happy. Happy for them.

I just know. I just know replacing nerves or connecting nerves is really freaking hard.

Centimeter a month for 18 months and that's it. So like this little guy, what are you gonna do? This one I'd probably get something. But then I was like, I guess one of his hand on which really kind of freaks me out and not talking bad about the people that do it. Like, please, if you're listening and you're like, well, I have that done. Good for you. But I don't know.

Yeah. And again, probably if you wait like three years, five years, stuff is advancing so quickly now that things will probably just improve a ton. Like, I got neck surgery many years ago, and just after I got neck surgery, they came out with like replacement discs, like little vertebrae that you can put in there. And it was like, experimental. And I knew a couple guys get it, got it and everything. And one of my friends got pretty bad problems with it. Didn't work out good. But now, like a bunch of people have gotten it and it works really good. And this was over the span of 10 years. So the advances that. And things are improving so much faster right now. Like just with technology is just improving so rapidly because like, AI, you can have AI working on some problem while you're not having to do anything. You know, you just like, yeah, run the, run the. The protocols or whatever.

They're doing 3D printing now for socket fits. And they're like, they fit better than the molds that they're doing.

Damn.

Yeah, well, I mean that's. I don't have it, but that's what I've been told.

But you might eventually get something like that, you know.

Let me tell you something. Vietnam vets, they come in with their old sea legs and they come in with their old, you know, body powered hooks. Like hey, check out this. Like this hand spins three. Oh my gosh, look at that. Isn't that cool? You want that? No. What I got works. And then I get told like, hey, they got this new thing. I'm like, cool, I'm that Vietnam vet now. I'm like, no, I got work.

How long did it take you to learn how to work the hand?

So it took me, well, I mean five weeks to get a hand. And they have like this, the sensors hook to my arm. So I like had to flex certain way for it to make it work.

The sensors that are in hook to your arm, they're like. Are they like pads that you push into?

Yeah.

That you push and do basically kinda like.

Yeah.

So it's like a button in there? Yeah, of sorts.

Make a fish real quick, make a fist, rev the engine like on a, on a motorcycle. So this muscle right here, I have that and the muscle down. If you go down, the muscle down here. So if I twitch this muscle slow, it opens. If I flex it, like if I flex it towards the ceiling, if I flex it up fast, it rotates and then I go down slow and then down fast.

Got it. And. But you don't think about that anymore.

I mean sometimes kinda. But like people. Cuz I can't feel. So when I grab something like this, can I have to like watch what I'm doing.

Okay.

You know what I mean? I was in the VA bathroom like when I first retired and I was taking a pee, not paying attention. I just grabbed right a hold of myself and I about passed out from the pain and I had to like breathe through it. Like okay, we gotta breathe, breathe this out because I need to, I need, I need to unflex this. I need to flex his hand up slowly. I really gotta stop grabbing my wiener at the urinal right now.

Because I almost passed out from the pain. I mean it was.

Sorry.

So if you like tense your arm because you're in pain that it does grab harder and all of a sudden you're seeing a real pickle.

Yeah, yeah. It's not, it's not good. It's not good. But I remember, like, in the bathroom, like, breathing it out, like, okay, like, talking myself off the ledge. Like, this. This. This is not good. Yeah. I'm just happy no one walked in on me talking to myself at the urinal. Like, let go. Just like. We're just gonna let go right now.

That's off the rails anyway. Sorry.

All right, well, okay. So, yeah, go. Things happen, right? Like, the other night, my one arm. I have a couple arms, and I usually put one on the charger, and I wear one, and I switch them out. Well, I had the one on longer than I thought, so it died. So I had my arm on with a hook. I had to go upstairs. 10:30 at night, right? Everybody's already in bed. I'm up watching college football or something. I grabbed my other arm. I go out to the elevator. I try to switch the hook out. The hook falls on the ground. Okay, Now, I don't have. So now, right, what I have is my hook on the ground. I'm my wheelchair, and I can't reach it. Well, then I switch out the hand. I switch this arm out, and I'm like, okay, I'm just gonna switch it out quick and get the one that's powered. So I put the one that has a power on. I can't get that. I knocked the other arm onto the ground. So I'm, like, trying to fall on my chair, like, brushing it over against the wall. I got to go downstairs, I got to drive over and get my hand, put my hand on this arm. Get to work. Pick up the other arm, pick the hook up, take the hand off, put the hook on anybody. But again, this is all, like, I'm banging and clanging stuff. We're waking everybody up. But, like, that's where you gotta stay patient, right? I mean, it wasn't like, grabbing myself, like, passing out from pain, but, wow, mad. And that's when you're like, why is this my life? Like, are you kidding me right now? But I made it work.

Mm.

You know.

How long does that. How long does the power in the arm last?

For about a day and a half. Okay, day and half. Two days.

And you got two of them on rotation.

Yeah, yeah, I have a few of them.

All right.

Because then when I go to get them, they're like. Sometimes like, well, you want another one? I'm like, well, yeah. And then they look at me funny. I'm like, you ever had no hands and then have one not work? And then you need one because you don't have them. Yeah, they're like, no, no. I'm like, yeah, well, that's. That's me.

So give me another one.

So I'll take another, please.

Within the guidelines.

Principle 11 Serve Find your. For Find your voice, build on your strengths and live. Meaning flee. So this is where we start talking. This is.

Ptg, Post Traumatic Growth.

I'm no expert, so I point at PATH founder. And this is P A T H founder Josh Goldberg, who wrote Struggle. Well, to better explain how this happens a great deal of the time, people who go through these difficult life experiences, these traumas and these losses often reported in the aftermath of that experience. Going through the post. The process of post traumatic growth. This leads them to report that their life had changed for the better in terms of it being more authentic and more meaningful and more purposeful than it was before they had the experience. They talk about growing in terms of their sense of hope for the future. A recognition of the value of deeper relationships with other people, a sense of personal strength. The idea that nothing can be permanently not. The idea that nothing can permanently knock us down. An appreciation for the small and big things in life and spiritual and existential growth. The idea that they are now asking and reflecting upon the deepest questions that life can offer us. Who am I? Why am I here and where do I belong? And that's what Post Traumatic Growth describes and what the entire science and concept behind it are all about. So this is just like the opposite of. Well, maybe it's not the opposite of, but it's a different take on post traumatic stress disorder, which is like, I got a real problem because of this bad thing happened to me. This is, hey, this bad thing happened to me and I'm actually better because of it.

And then the. Did I not spell out what PATH meant in there?

It's not in here. I found it on your website. Absolutely. It is progressive and alternative training for helping heroes.

So that's the. That's the nonprofit that we partner with and we have the. There's like 10 facilities around the nation and that's for combat veterans and.

It'S for first responders. And it's a week, week long course. We get a big grant. Avalon, Avalon Action Alliance. Anyway, we get a grant for it. And then there's places like throughout the nation that do it. And it's one of the best in the nation. And I love. I look, I know we have it. My foundation. So I'm like, oh, it's the best in the nation. But. But really it is. I Mean the amount of letters we get from either the person that came or the family members, spouses, moms, dads, about the change they actually see in the person that came to the program.

It just lifts you up. You know, I mean we had a few people say like this is my last thing. I was going to commit suicide after this.

It's the most effective one that you've seen.

There's this one and there's one out of Massachusetts called Home Base that I believe in as well. It's a two week program. This is a one week and then follow ons. And you know, it's cool because it's trained the trainer. I mean everybody wants to train their trainer. It's people that have been through the program that actually did serve, whether they're. We have some state troopers as well as combat veterans that lead it. And I, you know, the thing is you have to fill out the paperwork yourself. Like if say, say your wife thinks you should go and she hits up the website, she fills it out, doesn't matter. This person has to want to go. And if, if you sign up, you'll get in, but just. They're on a little bit of a back order. So they're expanding right now. I mean. Yeah. And this isn't like any big secret. I think we're buying another facility to actually run just path out of where? Just down the road actually. So actually it's, it's down the road from, from the, the camp, the emergency. Okay, so we're talking like three, no, not even three miles. Probably a mile and a half from. From where the merger camp is.

Will it be a year round camp?

Yeah. Oh yeah. Okay. Yeah, yeah. But we're.

I think we put the op. We're about to put the offer in.

Okay.

But I mean it could fall through. But we're trying to find a facility so we can do Instead of the 12 weeks we do now at least 24 weeks because there's nine days that is total for the path guides. But, but we're trying to do that full time because it's, it's. There's so much need right now.

Yeah.

And, and they're opening the program for a few other people. I don't think I can go into that right now, but they're opening the program for, for more people to be able to do it.

Good, good. No, just reading about it sounds like an awesome program. And again you got more information here in the book about it, so that's, that's cool. Going back to the book here it says, like I said, at the end of the day, you get one go around in life. You get one chance to make your mark. How do you want to leave your mark on this world? The answer should give you purpose. If that's being a coach and giving your all to the students or being a parent and being the best darn parent there is, then how can you be better at that every day? And that leads to the, the final principle. Principle number 12, make it a daily practice. Ask yourself what is stopping you from recalibrating? Resilience isn't something that you get. Get like a sticker or a badge and then you carry around for your life. You need to continue to work at it and you will want to because we all need it again and again. Hopefully by now you have learned that pain is good and important, never fun or easy, but we can learn from it and build a resilience for it. Science shows that we can develop and improve our resilience, but it requires practice and consistency.

Yeah, I think this is, you know, the, the biggest message or the underlying message in the book is like, we all have the ability to get better, stronger. And recognizing that the pain and suffering that you have, first of all, you're going to have it. You're going to have it in life, doesn't matter. You're going to have it. There's going to be pain, there's going to be suffering. You're going to face disease, you're going to lose people, you're going to lose. You're going to have to freaking fly home and put down your dog. Like things are going to suck sometimes. And you got to be able to deal with those things. And this is another interesting point on that. Every day is a choice. Humans make about 35,000 conscious decisions each day. Each decision, of course, can change your life in a big, in big ways and smalls, for better or worse. While I couldn't stop that IED from doing its job that day, I can stop it from detracting from the rest of my life from those decisions. You have a choice of how to react. Do you choose to be angry, isolated, fearful, untrusting, or do you choose to be hopeful, fearless and trusting?

Yeah, I mean that right there. Recognizing that, you have the ability to decide which way you're going to go.

And the thing is with the book is we, like you said, we have other people's stories too. You know, people go through divorce, house fires, cancer. You know, we all face something in life. Like you said, there's, you know, there's just things that happen to us and it's how we want to react to them. It's how we want to get through them. And it's not like unheard of. Like, I'm not the only person to get blown up, lose my arms and legs. As unique as it is, I'm not the only one. And I had a guy that came to the hospital to tell me I'm not a bad person. God doesn't hate me. Nothing I did in life made me deserve this and that I was going to be a. Okay, I was going to learn how to walk, dry feed myself. And he was the second ever quadruple apt, you know, and moreover than that, he was a marine. So I was like, man, if he can figure it out, I can't be that hard, you know. No, good guy, good guy. Todd nicely. And that's the thing, like people have all, you know, probably bad, say, been there, done that. But people, people, they face the same problems. Whether they think they're alone or not, or they believe that no one's out there like them. There's somebody out there most likely been through it. And, you know, that's what I was trying to do with, with this is, is try to highlight my story in my outlook, but using other people's stories and their outlook. And then like you said, I got all this, like I missed out on the most important psychologist, apparently. I apologize.

Yeah.

But you know, maybe, maybe next time.

Maybe next book, the next 12 rules of warrior Resilience. You can get in there.

Yeah.

Yeah. No, it's, that's what I said. It's like such a good guidebook. And, and you're right, I didn't, you know, when I was highlighting what to read and after I read the book, I wanted to kind of focus on the principles themselves today. But the stories that you've got in the book, and they're not all your stories. There are your stories, but a lot of them are stories of people that, you know, people that you've worked with, people that have come through, through and they've got their, their struggles that they've been through, whether it's losing a spouse and then losing a child. Like you got a woman in there that suffered through, that you got, you know, victims of disease, people that have been through, you know, got severe ptsd.

So there's the sergeant major that he lost a lot of guys.

Yeah, yeah. 20, I think you said 22 guys.

Yeah. A lot more wounded too. Yeah, yeah. He had, he's, he's One of our path guides, actually.

Yeah, that's so like. Like, what better guy.

Yeah.

To be able to talk and help. Help people out for that.

And I wasn't criticizing how you did this. I just meant. Oh, I appreciate the fact you're highlighting this. I didn't want to be.

No, it didn't come across that at all. They just reminded me.

Grabbed your knife when I said it.

When you mentioned that, I remember thinking consciously, like, okay, there's these stories that will definitely be able to show examples. But we'd just be like, I might as well just read the book. Might as well just do the audiobook. Which is apparently what you wanted me to do anyways.

Well, yeah. Sorry. You know what? I'm the worst. Ask my wife. She'll tell you.

Only when I ask her what's for dinner at seven o' clock in the morning.

Yeah, it's not a good move. Don't need PATH to tell you that.

Every day is about control. A major plot point in this book is that you can't change what happened to you, nor make it go away, but you can control your attitude. After all, you don't want to fall into the category of learned helplessness or victimhood. Here are a few ways to stave off helplessness, and you got a bunch of them here. Be optimistic. Have a creative outlet. Get walking. Any exercise is good. You got this thing. Practice a Japanese thing called forest bathing or shinrin yoku, which is like going out into the wilderness, which is awesome.

Yeah, I think that was my idea, probably.

Yeah, for sure.

While you're at it, walk to the gym. Be grateful. Like, these are the key components that you've got so much about. Gaining and maintaining resilience is about practicing it. And life gives us many opportunities to practice. Am I right? Once you make resilience a daily practice, it will become second nature. And with that inevitable next crisis or challenge, you will be that much stronger and prepared to take it on. It will be about how to put the next foot in front of the other and keep you going. Always bounce back. And just to close out the book, I want to read one little section from the. From the epilogue. It just says, as you finish this book, I want to leave you with this message. You are a lot more resilient than you think you are. And there are things that you can choose to do to allow that resilience to bloom. Are you ready to make that choice?

Man, I sound like a genius. Whenever you guys do this, I'm telling.

You what a little bit of A miracle co worker over here.

Yeah. I'm telling you. What? Yeah, yeah.

No, man, it is. It's because, honestly, think about what you've been through. Think about. About where you're at now. Like, you've got some freaking lessons learned to pass on, and you pass them on in the book. Are you ready to make that choice? And that's, like, the question, right? And like I said, you're living proof that it truly is a choice.

Yeah.

Our attitude, our perspective, our ability to bounce back, that's on us, you know? So this book is going to help a lot of people, and it's gonna. Look, you don't need to be in one of these severe moments right now to be like, oh, well, I don't really have any trauma right now, so I don't need this book.

A.

This stuff is effective for, as Echo pointed out, like, every day. What? Like what? Little. Oh, you lost your job. That's not. That's probably not gonna leave, like, some big traumatic mark on you. But guess what? You gotta make some adjustments in life. Right? You got some things you have to get through. You might go through, like, a relationship issue. Maybe you get, you know, you split up from your girlfriend if you're 19 years old. That can be traumatic when you're 19, right. Or you're getting a divorce. Like, things that may not seem as severe as, like, what guys in the military might go through. There's still. The principles in this book are going to be able to help you out. And what's really nice is when you do face something that's more severe, when you lose a loved one, when there's some horrible disease that enters your world, you'll. You'll definitely have some tools to work through that stuff. And I think this is gonna help out so many people.

Well, I appreciate that. Also, I was thinking, what is. What is your nickname? Because I was about to call you Big Mac because you're the secret sauce baby.

You know what I'm saying? Is that.

No, my. My nickname is just. My nickname is just Jocko.

Just Jocko.

My parents gave me that nickname before I was even born.

I know two other nicknames, but for me.

Yeah.

Oh, what are they?

Mothra.

Oh, that's an old school one. Yep.

And the other one is Way of the streets.

Dang old school. So I remember Mothra. Yeah. Why did I come up with that?

I don't know what it was.

Well, Mothra is the bad guy on who? Godzilla.

The bad guy on Godzilla. But there was so Echo's brother had a social media platform before any of these other social media media platforms were around. And it was almost. It was. Honestly, it would seem like there was 30 people on it, right? That's what it seemed like to me. It was probably thousands, but, like, yeah, they're the.

Like, we would kind of all interact with each other.

There was just a small group of people that I actually knew the people. And for some reason.

There was some, like. Probably some talking about, like, being Godzilla or something. And then I came back with, like, well, a Mothra. And I'm. He's probably something stupid like. Like that. And then what was the other one? A Way of the Streets. Where did that come from?

I forget where it was, but to me, that one was like, the one that I would use from time to time.

Oh, yeah, the Streets. Just Way of the Streets. I forget it might be because we made that old advertisement for victory MMA where I was like.

In the streets, I was saying that Jiu Jitsu is good, like on the mat, in the cage, or in the streets.

Okay, so to correct Jaco, because I remember way better. So he said. Well, his closing line in one of the videos was, gi. No GI or In the Streets. And then it says. Then he says, making things work. Making people hurt. That's what Jocko said, his closing. And then. But then it came up later. I forget what, like, what we're doing or what. I don't know. But it was written like, Way of the Straight. I think you signed something on it. It was like Way of the.

And one time you said, when we're gonna go train, and you're like, oh, yeah, I'm gonna be there at noon or whatever. And then. And then I would, like, talk some trash or whatever, and you'd be like, whatever, then I'll see you at noon. Ghee or no gi, then. Period.

Period.

Period. Wait for a little while. Or of course, in the Streets.

In the Streets.

So I don't know if I'm Secret Sauce, but I can make some stuff work, make people hurt in the Streets.

That's right.

That's in the Streets.

You know, I found that as much as I really appreciate the ghee that I got at camp, it's better be no gi, because no can GI choke me.

Yeah, well, you're. You're at a disadvantage with me because you can't grab. You can't grab the ghee. So you're much better off. No GI for sure.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, I don't mind they wear a gi. I'm just saying. I Don't want to wear one. It sets me up for failure.

Yeah, no, ghee is not good for you.

I thought we're going naked. You know, just like see who's really dedicated enough.

You know, you can, you can claim victory. I'm not, I'm not getting into.

Unless you shot the old self esteem, but okay, that's cool. Cool, cool. And I've been slim fasting. I don't know if you noticed.

You've been what? Slim fasting, sun fasting.

Slim fasting. Yeah.

Jack.

No, actually I, I tried to do the rtds, but then I just, I drink too much of them. Like this is not reducing any calories. Well, I did like the crush. Like how crushable these are that story. Because I, I find myself, I'm like, I'm on my third, my third jock.

I'll go.

And I've had any water today. Yeah, you know, it's like, it's one o' clock in the afternoon. I'm like, I know.

Yeah. You're going to be awake for 19 hours.

Yeah.

Yeah. You definitely got to be. You definitely got to be a little bit careful on that. That's what I find. Like I had one. Normally I don't drink them like after like maybe two o' clock occasionally during the week, if I'm going to train that, then I'll drink one on the way here. But then you exert so much energy you're just going to be tired. But if I'm just not doing anything and I drink one, bruh, that's, that's.

Basically what I just ride around, do a bunch of phone calls and conference meetings and stuff. And I just drink them.

Yeah.

Because, you know, I work out for the gram, but that's it.

You know.

And then it looks like the one video that you guys put out looks like actually I'm choking you out. You're telling me what to do. And it looks like I'm actually getting you people like, oh my gosh, can't believe you choked him out. Like. Yeah, I know. Yeah, I know. That was all, that was all make believe.

Yeah.

So you got this book, man. Order it. What did we hit? Everything else. You got, you got the Travis Mills foundation, right?

Yeah.

You got the campus up in maine. Travis mills foundation.org. this is a. I've been there. It. You know, I've met a bunch of people that have been through the programs. You do everything up there. Cooking, baking, martial arts, ropes course, cycling, horse riding, shooting, hiking, golf, massage therapy, ice fishing, yoga, archery, kayaking, canoeing. Boating, fly fishing, bass fishing, pottery, painting, and snowshoeing to list a few of the freaking activities that people can do up there.

Bringing out a dog sled in the wintertime. Let people ride on a dog sled. That's actually pretty. It's pretty legit.

Yeah. That sounds awesome.

I mean. I mean, the other stuff's kind of cool, too, I guess.

Yeah.

But no, I. Look, I appreciate just the chance. Chance to hang out with you guys. You guys are always awesome. And, you know, with the book coming out, I'm fired up for it because I get asked all the time how I do it, and I thought, let me just figure out how I can show people how I do it or how they can do anything that's hard in life, because we all have, you know, we all have struggles and things like that that we go through where you could use a little guiding light. And, I mean.

I got tired of just saying, like. Well, I just do. You know, I have to. You have two choices, right? The real Oliver Twitter situation. Get better or don't.

What's the Oliver Twist situation?

Isn't that. That's a Robert. That's a forest. Damn it. Oliver Twist, bro.

He just.

He just.

Made a metaphor. You didn't know.

No, it wasn't Oliver Twist. I'm thinking about Robert. Or the Fred. Damn it. I'm a doctor, okay? I'm a doctor of three.

What? I wonder what metaphor you could have been thinking of.

You know, the.

The. The forest. Both paths in the forest. It's like Robert Redford.

Maybe Robert Redford's an actor.

Exactly. He says it. No, it's Robert Frost.

Oh, Robert.

Robert Frost.

Two roads diverged in yellow wood.

Yeah. What path I had to take. Get better or not. Oliver Twist. I was like, please sell. I want some more.

Shit.

Well, it's just like Oliver Twist. And of course, I'm over here like, yeah, just like Oliver Twist, bro. You know, it was just like a brilliant metaphor.

I did not.

Oliver.

Just like Annie, dude.

Yeah.

Fiddler on the Roof.

Yeah. Tomorrow, if you want it to. You know, if you let it. Just. If you let it. Bet your bottom dollar.

What else do you got going on? You got Rebel for good. So we talked about that. Yeah, everyone's gonna buy rebelforgood.com. they're gonna go and buy it.

They're gonna love these shirts. They got the backwards. Turn their life around.

There you go. So you can see that. You got the marina. Got the Lakeside. Lakeside Lodge and Marina in East Winthrop, Maine.

She's like a. We Just named it Lakeside Lodge because he's called Lakeside Motel and Cabins. And Norman Bates really didn't help us out with the whole motel thing.

Yeah, yeah.

But we're actually doing a remodel right now. But it's going fun. It closes down like two weeks. We have, like, the main building open, but.

So lakesidelodge.com but people come in there in this in the springtime, start coming back up to Maine for vacation.

That's like number one, like, fishing lake. So we have a lot of fishermen that come, like, number one, Bass Lake in Maine on a lot of charts.

No kidding.

Yeah, I don't fish. So when people come in the office, like, hey, where they catching the fish at? I'm like, in the water. They're like, yeah, but where? Like, between the top and the bottom. I'm pretty sure they're like, what do you know? What do you. What do you catch? Like, what do you. I'm like, I catch a buzz on my boat sometimes, but, like, that's accidental. I don't try to do that. But they get. They get a little irritated.

And then you have the restaurant.

Restaurant. Yeah, the restaurant.

Duck pub dot com.

Yes, It's White Buck. White Duck pub dot com. I looked it up.

Sure it's not white duck?

No, I'm not sure, but I'm pretty sure. Anyways, if you Google White Duck Pub, you'll find it.

Yeah.

What do you. What's the main deal going on there?

Just American bistro open year round. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Eleven and nine every day. And we're made from scratch kitchen. So nothing's ever frozen. Like, our wings take, like 13 hours to make. We sell a lot of them. We sold over 10,000 burgers the first year. This year we're like crushing that.

Damn.

And we have burger of the. Like. We have only one burger on the menu. It's not like you can get like this kind of burger and that kind of burger. It's like, we have the White Duck Brew Pub burger.

What's the. What is the deal? What's just really good, but like, what is on a white duck burger?

Lettuce, tomato, onion, Lettuce, tomato, onions.

Just like. It's a basic deal.

It's not basic.

It's not gourmet.

Oh, it's gourmet for sure.

It's like how you cook it.

Yeah. And it's made with love. That's the kicker. So. And we have poutine. So, like, our number one seller is actually the burger. Second thing we sell most of is actually Bacon. And third is potatoes. Hmm.

Do you do breakfast or no?

No.

So how do you sell so much bacon on the burgers?

I think we just. That's. I think that's why everything tastes good. I think we just bake everything. It's like thick cut, delicious, like, organic, whatever. Bacon of awesomeness. And then. Yeah. And then up the hill, I own.

Well, me and some. Me and some buddies, we own a couple more buildings. We're putting a brewery in, and then eventually a distillery. I was in Arizona where JP Was speaking, actually, with jp And I was speaking as well, but I was with JP There. And we had a booth right next to Mama Lee's booth. We actually split the fundraising. 150,000 to each of us. Was really nice. Tarl Yarber. Put it on.

Nice. Oh, yeah, yeah.

And this guy walks by. He's all tatted up, and he's pretty buff, and he walks by. I'm like, hey, look, I'm not a piece of meat. Stop looking at my. Look at me like that, okay? My wife's a jealous type, too, so it's not gonna happen. And the guy was even looking at me, he's like, what? What? I'm like, I saw you checking my legs out. Okay. Looks are free. But that's all you're gonna get from me, bud. And just, like, hit a conversation off. Turns out his name's John Peasy Peasley and his wife Sarah. Fantastic people. He is the biggest independent brewery distillery owner in Arizona. He has Grand Canyon River Brewing and spirits.

Sure.

And he's like, dude, I'll show you how to do it all. So he's like, give me, like. Like, he flew out of my gala. He hung out for a week.

That's awesome.

Good, dude. So you're gonna build that?

Oh, awesome.

Yeah. And he does jiu jitsu. He met Pete and Amanda at the. At the gala, but.

So you're gonna do a brewery making beer. Is it just beer? Is it, like, whiskey or something else?

So here's the thing. You take beer, when it goes bad, you can turn it within two weeks into vodka, gin, whiskey. Takes four years for a whiskey, but you can turn it all into that. That's people do. So you can, like, go to the local distribution centers that got to send, like, all the old beer back. Instead of them paying to send it back, they'll just give it to you.

No kidding.

Then you get a crushing machine. You crush it down.

Crush beer.

You crush the beer down, right? So they crush the cans.

Oh, okay.

Then you take the cans Turn those in for the aluminum prices and then you get all this old beer and two weeks later you got all the stuff made for vodka, gin, whatever.

Are you the first person to think of this?

No, that's what John told me. And people do it all the time. But like this guy Pumpkinhead is a big beer that comes out. This guy had so much surplus, he knows what to do with it. And he made ice pick vodka.

Boom.

Yeah.

So that's what, you're going down that path as well.

Yeah.

But here's the beauty, right? Like I'm not, I'm an equal owner, right? But I know my value is, is in these pearly whites. I smile, I shake some hands, I put some money in. Right. So out of the, the owners of the brewery, we have one guy, that his son's a brewmaster and he's going to be like, help out, work there. We have the other guy, he's put money in, he's a builder, he's going to build it all. The other guy is me. And I'm just going to like shake hands, make deals and hey, drink my beers. I have no arms and legs. People just feel bad for me. I spoke to like the national whole builders association or something out in Vegas and like they love me and they'll bring me back. And I'm like, hey guys, I need all you guys to buy my beer and sell it. And all of a sudden, Dogfish Head Brewing is not the only one that sold for $108 million. What?

What?

But then do you know the name of your brewing beer?

They're gonna call it Castle Island Brewery.

Castle Island.

Nope. That's a lie. That's a lie. That's a different, that's a different road that I drive on. It's gonna be called Island Park Brewing. I gotta get that out of my head.

Island Park Brewing.

Island Park. Because right across from where my restaurant is, there's a fridge.

Make sure you get the URL for that like immediately.

Yeah.

Cuz otherwise someone's gonna buy it as soon as they hear this and they're gonna sell it back to you for $100,000.

All right? Because I want to, I want to be called Humble Beginnings. Anyway, I want Humble Beginnings Brewery. But. Okay, well, so I might buy that too. We'll see.

Buy that both?

Yeah. No, I mean, I don't know. I just. My wife wants me to slow down. But this is all stuff that I have business partners in that we all know our role. Kind of like I'm not gonna go there. And lug kegs. You know, I would. I'm just handicapped, but I definitely will promote it and try to get more people to drink it, but.

But you won't lug kegs.

I mean, I kick one over and kind of, you know, push it. That's my ability.

Awesome, man. Well, does that get us up to speed? Are we there? We up to.

I mean, I just hope everybody wants to come hang out with me in. In Maine, because it gets lonely up there. Winters are long. Best time to visit's not in February. If you guys go there in February, I won't be there, but you're more than welcome.

Where do you go? Do you go somewhere else for real?

For like. Yeah.

Arizona or something?

No, Florida. Florida? Yeah. Just. Just, like, for a week.

Yeah.

Like, the kids get a school week off, we go. When I say a week, I mean, my wife pushes it to, like, 10 days, which really turns into, like, two weeks.

Good. But I like it.

We have a rental property outside of Disney, so.

Sweet. Hey, where can people find you? So you got travismills.org that's you.

That's me.

You got Travis Mills foundation.org.

Yeah.

And then you got lakeside lodging.com. you got the White Duck Pub, or pub and brewery, something.com. we're really not sure. 100%, I think.

I think I'll. Yeah, yeah, just Travis mills.org. the website has all the little tiles, I believe.

I don't know.

Then you got. You're on Twitter, you're on Facebook, you're on Instagram.

I tell you what, Instagram been growing. I've been doing some fun videos.

Yeah.

Taking a page out of your guys's book. I was like, hey, Ian Dow actually set me up with. With Evan.

Okay.

Ian's like, look, this guy's. He's talented. You're gonna love him. He's my roommate now. He's gonna come do videos for you. I said, look, all I want is reels. I want shorts and reels. And he's been doing pretty well.

Yeah, no, he's. He's cutting some good stuff, man.

But that's at SG at ssg.

Travis Mills. And then you're on Facebook, you're on Twitter, and you're. Apparently, you're in love with yourself on the gram is what I just heard.

I'm not.

I want a bunch of reels of myself.

Yeah. Nothing wrong with that. I mean, do you know how much. Let me tell you something. Before I see any of my videos on Facebook and Instagram, I see you sitting, talking To a mic, giving motivation, like, every day. Oh, but you don't want that. Okay. I see the difference. Yeah. I'm like, hey, I want that in my life. And you're like, I don't want. It just kind of happens.

I don't know what Echo's doing over there. He's got a camera. It looks like maybe. Maybe he's got. Gonna do something with it.

I'm just. I'm just here to say what I'm gonna say in the microphone.

I'm just saying it, dude.

Yeah. I don't know.

I don't know what's gonna happen. I do my part, you know, you're not lugging kegs. I'm not turning on the camera. I'm just here doing what I'm supposed to do.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Shaq.

An echo. Charles?

Yes.

Any questions?

I don't. Oh, how do you power your arm? You like us?

So it's something like that. See the little. The little gold things in there? Yeah. It's a magnetic charger. So, yeah, it lights up. It lights up green. And when it lit, when the little lights on is green, it means it's charging. When it shuts off, it's done.

Is that carbon fiber?

It is, yeah.

I love carbon fiber.

Go ahead. You can touch it. It's not right for me.

If you notice, the Mango mayhem can.

Carbon fiber the old one.

The old one? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Nothing. Nothing.

Not the new one. We got denied the carbon fiber.

Yeah. It is what it is. Good to see you.

Always good to see you too. And I'm not sure we're supposed to talk about the. Any of the beef stuff or. No. Is that. Yeah, man.

Yeah.

I mean, I was.

Some steak.

I was so fortunate that you were like, hey, yo, I'm gonna start this beef company. You can be a part of it if you want. And I'm like. I'm all about it. I'm all about. About it.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I didn't start it, but luckily, actually, Brian kind of spearheaded that thing, and he made connections with Jeff, and they put together, so. Colorado craft beef.

That's right.

Colorado craft beef.

I have that going on too.

Yeah.

I'm saying that because I. The last investment I did where I told my wife to believe in me, you know, I'm saying.

Yeah, yeah.

Rebel for good Dot com.

No, no. Which I. You're trying to recover from that. Yeah, man. It's awesome. Great people, great company. Great steaks. The steaks are freaking delicious.

So did they do jiu jitsu before or they just tried it that time when they came to the camp.

No, I think he's kind of, like, into training now.

Yeah.

You know, so I hope everybody out.

There, like, listening, knows when they come to. When they come to the camp. The jiu jitsu camp over there in Camp Laurel in Maine. I'm only 20 minutes down the road, so I will. I come out and I heckle.

You know, we should do something, like, where people can swing by, you know, you go by the factory. We should do something like. Just like come by or something. Come by the facility, you know, every.

Like every Friday. Because I'm not sure what days you guys are doing it now, but every Friday. Friday. Like, the families always leave. So I guess just open, getting clean. But it's open.

Check it to it. That'd be cool for people to come and check it out. Maybe like, get to meet you and stuff like that. That'd be pretty cool. I mean, you come down to camp so people can meet you there, but.

Well, I felt bad. I didn't even go to the purple and the blue belt, you know, straight to black.

Yeah, that's how you roll. Yeah, that's.

Some people are like, it took me 20 years to get over here. I, like, took me day two.

Yeah. You know, so Colorado craft beef. Look, you're gonna be. You need some steak. Get yourself some steak, people.

There it is.

Travis, any closing thoughts, bro?

You know, look, everybody's biggest problems are. Biggest problem. My problems don't outweigh anybody else's. Whatever Jocko or Echo go through don't outweigh anybody else's. And we're all in this together. So I hope that this podcast has been fun as well as, you know, maybe opened your eyes to new ways to think about your situations that you go through or loved ones go through. And if you want to get the book, bounce back, by all means, go ahead. But if this is enough information, take it. Take it and run with it, because you got legs to do that. I got running legs, too. It just takes me a while to put them on.

Well, I can tell you that if you got something out of this podcast, you should definitely get the book, because the book has.

Infinitely more information, infinitely more stories, details that are really going to help everyone out. So, yeah, man, get the book. And Travis, man, thank you once again. It's always an honor to be able to talk to you, be able to have you. Thanks for joining us. Thanks for writing these books. Both these books are awesome. And, you know, thanks for your service. Thanks for Your sacrifice. Thanks for the service and sacrifice of your family. And most of all, bro, thanks for being an inspiration to everybody.

I appreciate you. You guys are so awesome. Say nice things. I'm telling you what he's got to say. Secret sauce, all Big Mac over there. But on top of that, on top of that, I will say I appreciate the fact that you have the book. And it's all, like, went through and highlighted because I talked with Jenna. I said, hey, so, yeah, she's like, you gonna come promote your book and come down? I was like, yeah, absolutely. What'd you think about it? She goes, oh, I got a PDF. I'm like, I gave Leif, like, the, like, the third or second edition ever handed out. He goes, yeah, it's buried on my desk. She had no idea he even had it since camp. Just saying.

When are you going down there?

Well, I'm gonna try to line a.

Few things up so she'll have time to read it. Yeah.

Oh, yeah, no, she's already read that, I think. PDF I sent her, like, the manuscript, but the point was, I'm glad that you actually care about it. And Pete was, like, talking about how he cares about it, but then I talked to life, and he's like, yeah, it's on my desk. I'm sorry I didn't tell you, dude.

I was. My dad was at my house. This was, like, a few years ago when I only had one book, the book Extreme Ownership. And, like, my dad was over my house, and I don't know what he said or whatever, and he's like, yeah, need to take Extreme Ownership, he said to me. And I was like, have you even read the book? And he was like, yeah, I could see immediately he hadn't read. And I was like, bro. Like, hey, dad, you might want to check it out before you start trying to talk smack to me.

That's like my. My wife. Someone will say, like, oh, my gosh, your husband. When? And he said this in his presentation. And she just goes like, yeah. She's never seen me speak ever.

Oh, really?

Yeah, she don't care.

Yeah, she doesn't care. She's heard enough.

She's out by the pool, just hanging out, waiting for me to go on another work trip.

Oh, man. Awesome. Yeah, man. Like I said, thanks for coming. Appreciate it. Appreciate everything you do, man. And you're my hero.

Quit it.

Thank you, bro.

Let me blush. You're my hero. You guys both are so awesome. Thank you, guys.

Thanks, bro.

And with that, Travis Mills has left the building.

Yes.

And Left us.

With some lessons and some leadership and some inspiration.

Yep.

Literally nothing to complain about on earth. Yeah.

You know which one stuck with me? Which, like, in day to day, that dog don't hunt. Sometimes, bro, you gotta just gotta let it go. And, you know, you get. And I get it. And I said that thing earlier for a reason where it's like, it trickles down to your everyday life, because that's what most of us are dealing with most of the time.

And I tried to make that point at the end. Like, just because you might feel like you're not going through any major problems right now. It's still. There's. You are going through things, and these things will help you with everything that you're dealing with. And one of those things for sure is that dog don't hunt.

Even the small problems. Even. And even Travis, he does such a good job in. In saying, hey, I realize my situation is very extreme compared to other people's bad situations. And really, he's. I'll even go one further and be like, hey, these principles apply to things that you wouldn't even look at and be like, oh, that's a bad situation. Just like you. It's a. It's a way to choose to look at certain situations if they don't go the way that you wanted them to go in that moment. Super small situations. If you're just the idea. If you just take that one where that dog don't hunt, bro, the idea of just. Just let it go, bro. Just let it go. Instead of looking. You know how they say, don't look behind, look forward? You know, move forward, bruh. That's a big deal. When you can remember it.

Yeah.

It helps you a lot.

For sure. For sure. And when you. When you can do it with something as severe as what Travis has been. Been through, it means that the rest of us can do it over some much, much smaller things and medium things and big things. And that's the point that he made was like, oh, your biggest problem is like, your biggest problem. I. I remember that. What the lesson I learned from that or the time I learned that was with my kids.

Yeah.

And like, I was in the teams, we had war going on and people were getting killed. And like my daughter, you know, whatever. One of my daughters was like, oh, my God, let's see. On a test in school or whatever in third grade. Yeah, that's really. And I'm. My attitude, like, for a split second, this doesn't matter. And then I realized, oh, this is the biggest problem. That she has in the world, and this is her world. That's another thing I always try to remember, Pete. We look essentially, are we all in the same world? Yes, we are. Sure. But everyone's in their own world. And whatever's going on in your world is what's going on in your world. Well, the rest of the world doesn't even matter compared to what's going on in your world, so. Especially you get those teenage years, like you're 16 years old. You get dumped by your girlfriend. Those dudes get broke up, bro.

Yeah.

Mentally. So for those dudes and females, too. Girls happens to them, too. So tons of lessons. You know, we forgot to mention that. Also, you know, Travis Mills was talking about all the different things that he's involved. He's also in Jocko Fuel, by the way. You know, so he's one of the. One of the shareholders over at Jocko Fuel. So if you want to support Jocko Fuel, it's going to help out across the board, all aspects. Hydrate greens. You the greens, man. Underrated. Maybe. Not even underrated. Just maybe I need to do a better job of telling people about the greens. The greens are the best. Yeah. Hands down. We got go rtd. We already talked about that.

Moak can't drink too many. Echo just pointed out. I think you got to really try because I think. I think if you are drinking four a day, you're good.

Yeah.

Well. Yeah, so. And what I really meant because. Only because. Because I rethought about it. The whole thing. When I said it, too. I was like, wait, that. That. I don't even know if me saying it the way I did is as accurate as the message I was trying to say, given what Travis said. Because he was talking about, like, oh, I want to stay slim. And, you know, when you're. When you're running a calorie deficit. Right. You ever heard of that?

Yeah. Yeah.

Run a calorie deficit because you want to lose weight. Right. The. Right. The correct way and all this stuff. What I'm saying is if you're not necessarily, quote unquote, focusing on a calorie deficit, or if you are focusing on calorie deficit, but you're like, I'll just drink these mokes because they're. You know, it's better than eating like a whole freaking double burger with cheese and bacon or something like this from.

The white duck in.

Or where.

Yeah.

Or what have you. You just got to be careful with that, because if you're pounding.

Yeah.

4 or 5 milks a day because they're good. And you're like, oh yeah, freaking. I'm cleared hot. Yeah, I got the green light as you guys say.

The cool thing about a mo though and I, I experienced this today. No, I experienced it last night. I got home like kind of late from jiu jitsu, from training and so I had a lunch, late lunch at like 2:30. And my late lunch was just like, I was like, oh, I'm just gonna have something light cuz we'll have dinner in a little while and we're gonna have steaks. So let's fire it up. So I'll just have a moke. So I had a RTD milk and, and honestly I had a protein cookie, I had a mole cookie. But then, then three hours go by and it's time for a ribeye steak by the way. So I'm fired up, you know.

And.

I didn't eat the whole thing. I ate like half of it, you know. Okay, got that Primal beef. I was all fired up.

Yeah.

Primalbeef.com got myself a ribeye, you know what I mean? So I'm all fired up and it's delicious but I was full already. Full. So anyways, jockofuel.com go there, get your stuff, get what you need. Get it's cold season coming. Get your immunity gigs back up, get your cold war on, get your vitamin D. Make sure you're taking that. You can get this stuff at Wawa. You can get Vitamin Shop, gnc, Military commissaries, AES, Hannaford Dash, Doors, Wake Fern, shoprite, HB down in tes been doing us right. Same with Meer up in the Midwest, Harris Teeter, Lifetime Fitness, Shields, small gyms all over the place. Jiu Jitsu gyms if you want to sell Jocko Fuel, CrossFit gyms. You want to sell Jocko Fuel. JF Sales, jockofuel.com Give your clients what they need to get better. So we got that going for us also. You're just talking about Origin USA tonight, talking about Origin usa making stuff in America. We got factories in America, that's what we got. We don't have slave labor overseas in dangerous factory settings. Breathing chemicals, dumping chemicals into the atmosphere and into the water, which is what they're doing in the clothes that you're buying if you're not buying from Origin USA. So go to OriginUSA.com, help the national security of this country by bringing back manufacturing. What else do you need to know? Oh, you want to know what we have? We have Workout Gear, we have jiu jitsu gear. We have rash guards, GIs, we have t shirts, hoodies, heavy hoodies, light hoodies, medium hoodies, Kilo hoodies, jeans, heavy jeans, Factory light jeans, Delta boots, hats. You just go there, go there, get some American made stuff.

Help across the board. We also have another store that's been very creatively named Choco store.

Oh, yeah, chocolatestore.com. that's the discipline equals freedom branch of this whole representation thing that we're doing on the path. So, yeah, this week was freedom good.

You know, all.

All that type of stuff. So Jocko store.com is where you get it. Also, there's a subscription scenario. Don't want to forget about that. You want a new shirt every month, new design, a little bit more, you know, interesting type designs. Little layers in there. That's where you can get it.

Can you get the old shirts?

You can get the past shirts? Yes, if you subscribe. Like if you subs. Shirt locker. You subscribe right now. But you want this. You also want the shirt from last year. I don't know, October, whatever. Last year. Yes, you can get it.

The reason I asked that is because I believe there were some backdoor channels utilized by my children to get past shirts. And I thought they pulled some strings.

Yeah.

Which they did, apparently.

Yes, they did.

So my point in saying that, though, is the designs are at a level of coolness that even my own children.

We'Re like, yo, gotta represent that. Oh, yeah, yeah. There's a few. One. Hey, there's a few of them. And it's interesting because it's been going on for what, I don't know, a while, more than a year. So there's like a backlog of designs that people just kind of are not familiar with. So they'll see, like, me or someone, you know, someone from the beginning days or whatever wearing would be like, hey, where'd that shirt come from? Like, oh, what did you know? Where did I get that shirt? Where do I get that shirt? That's where you get it. That's the first answer.

First world problem. Good shirts.

Yeah.

The toxic productivity shirt.

Oh, yeah.

So there you go. Some good shirts. Subscription shirt locker jocastore.com primalbeef.com get that. Get that beef from the Shenandoah Valley or coloradocraft Beef dot com. Get that beef from the Colorado goodness. We also have underground podcast. Jocko underground.com. we answer your questions. It costs $8.18 a month. That's a. We can own it. It's a platform that we Own if you can't afford it, we still want you there. Assistancecounterground.com check it out. YouTube. Subscribe Psychological Warfare. Get it Flipside Canvas. Dakota Meyer Making cool stuff to hang on your wall. Bunch of books. Obviously the books for today bounce back 12 warrior principles to reclaim and recalibrate your life. So get this book. Gonna help you with everything that you're doing. Also the last book that he wrote, which is phenomenal. Tough as they come, man. Just check out podcast 90, but get that book as well. And then obviously I've written a bunch of books. You might want to check those out as well. Especially those kids books. Come on.

Look, you want to stay on a crappy path and not get books for yourself. Don't want to get disciplined. Freedom Field Manual. You don't want to get leadership strategy and tactics revised expanded edition. Okay, okay, that's fine. You don't want to do it. You want to stay on a rut. Okay, but if don't do that to your kids or the neighbor's kids or your nephew. Right? Get them the warrior kid books. Get a Mikey and the Dragons. That's what we're talking about. Ashlon front ashfront.com we have a leadership consultancy. We can help your business, we can help your team. We can help you in life, in everything that you do by teaching you leadership. We can come into your organization. Go to agilonfront.com to check that out. We also have the Extreme Ownership academy online. It's extremeownership.com that's going to help you in life, it's going to help you in business, it's going to help you with your family, it's going to help you interacting with other human beings. It's going to help you lead yourself to victory. Extreme ownership.com and if you want to help service members active and retired, you want to help their families, you want to help gold star families, check out Mark Lee's mom, Mama Lee. She got a charity organization. If you want to donate or you want to get involved, go to America's mighty warriors.org she is helping out so many people with that program. Also check out heroes and horses.org Micah Fink taking people into the dang backwoods of Montana where they get lost so they can get found. And Jimmy May's got his organization beyond the brotherhood.org and obviously, obviously travismills foundation.org you heard what he's doing.

And if you want to connect with us, Travis is on Instagram apparently making his shorts reels and he's on Twitter @SG TravisMills. That stands for staff sergeant. And echoes there as well. As am I. Echoes Attic with Charles. I'm at Jocko. Just be careful because there's an algorithm that's trying to grab you by the back of the neck and kill you. That's what's going on, so don't let it happen.

Thanks once again to Travis for joining us, the ultimate human being.

Honored to talk to you and have you as a friend. Thank you for being who you are and thanks to all the men and women in the military. Thank you for your service, especially grateful for all of the recalibrated warriors who have served and sacrificed so much. Thank you all for our freedom. And also thanks to our police and law enforcement, firefighters, paramedics, EMTs, dispatchers, correctional officers, Border Patrol, Secret Service, and all first responders. Thank you for your service here on the home front to keep us safe every day and everyone else out there.

I know life is a struggle. Struggle. You're gonna face struggle. And it can be rough. It can be really rough. But don't forget that while you can't choose the trauma that you are dealt.

You can choose how you respond to it.

And if Travis Mills can carry on like Travis Mills carries on, then I think we can all step up every day and get after it.

And until next time, Zeko and Jocko out.