Jimmy Rex: Why Success Without Fulfillment Will Leave You Empty

Focusing on the process, not the result.

Success without fulfillment is the ultimate failure. You control making calls. You control networking. You control knocking doors, whatever that looks like in your market. So the goal of life isn't to feel better. The goal of life is to just feel more. And so whatever's coming through is okay. And I don't judge it, and I'm okay with it. Only difference between the people that are doing it and the people that aren't is people that are doing it. They're just not afraid to take action, not needing to know if it's going to work. And I think men in general have this fear of just going for it.

I'm so excited to have you on my show. Thanks so much for coming out to Arizona. And I can't wait to learn more about you.

Yeah, let's get into it. I love it. Thanks for having me.

So I'm sitting here with Jimmy Rex. If you don't know him, he's just awesome. And we share a lot of similarities from our childhood and a lot of what drove us early on. And he now is a bestselling author, he's a speaker. And then you also run a men's group and community called We Are the they. And so a little bit about his past, and I'll let you kind of share the story. But starting off with feeling unworthy and just not feeling, like, good enough, and you always had to measure up to some invisible standard of perfection that is obviously impossible to achieve. So. And now you are all about connection and all about community and all about authenticity, vulnerability, and integrity and specialize in creating that feeling and that community for men. And I was looking up some stats earlier, and, you know, about 60% of men and women feel lonely in today's society. Even though we have all the technology and tools to be connected, most of us feel lonely. And suicide rates are also really high. And, you know, I. I went through periods in my life where I was suicidal and extremely lonely for many years. And so how did your life kind of start and where did that unworthiness stem from? From you. And then kind of share that journey that led you to great success. And you run a big team in Utah. You sold the most expensive home in Utah. $32 million, but still something was missing. And that ultimately led you into the community that you run today.

Yeah, no, that's a. Pretty much. That talks a lot about my story and some of the things that have driven me to do what I do now. Yeah, I think everybody has an innate feeling where our biggest Fears are, we are. The fear that we're not lovable and the fear that we're not good enough. Right. We're not going to be enough. And I think when we're little, things happen. And I think for some of us we're able to trace that back to these moments of really feeling like, oh, if I don't achieve, if I don't do this thing, then I won't get the love that I'm hoping to get. And for me it was when I was growing up, I was a, you know, my family was a big baseball family and my brother was like the two time state mvp. He, you know, played college baseball, all these things. And my dad got a lot of significance out of that. And he wanted, I think he wanted me to kind of experience that as well. He wanted to experience that through me. And so when I was 14 years old, he wanted, he heard about this family who held their kids back a year, so they were a year older in school. And so when you do that, you, you know, obviously in high school, you, you become a lot better. You, you're a lot bigger and stronger and faster. And so he really put a lot of pressure on me to do that. And ultimately the decision day came where I had to decide if I was going to do it or not. And I told him no, I didn't want to. And I remember he just looked at me in the eyes and he said, well, okay, just so you know, you'll never play again. You're not good enough. And all I heard was, you're not good enough. And as an adult who does a lot of self development and everything else, I know the power of words and affirmations. So at the time I just was like, okay, I'm going to prove him wrong. But I wrote on my hat for three years, I wrote, you're not good enough underneath my hat. And so it was, I was just ingraining into myself like, you know, you're not good enough no matter what. And so what happened is I ended up becoming a really good baseball player. I became very successful very fast in business and other things. But it was, I was always chasing this thing. And by the way, here's kind of, we talked about this a little bit. But the gift of this is it drove me to be, you know, very driven to be an achiever, to do a lot of cool things. Where it hurt me was in my personal relationships because I'd be, you know, it was never enough to just get the love from one person. It was never enough to just allow myself to be fulfilled. And I think, you know, Tony Robbins, one of my favorite quotes he says is, he says, success without fulfillment is the ultimate failure. I think that's so valid. And that probably explained a little bit of what I was experiencing or going through. In my 20s, I became, you know, one of the top realtors in the country. I was making a ton of money, I was having a ton of fun. I was going experiencing all these crazy things, but there was a little bit of an emptiness to it or this just an unfulfillment to it. And when I was, what was about six, seven years ago, I had the chance, you know, I'll just. For better or worse, I decided to do mushrooms for the first time with some friends. And. And in that experience, I think it unlocks things from your subconscious. And I saw this hat that I wore for three years in baseball in high school, and it said, you know, you're not good enough. And now I'm just like, oh my gosh, what have I done to myself? And the message came to me and, Hannah, you'll appreciate this because it came to me and it said, hey, this has served you. It no longer does. It's time to let it go. It wasn't. This is hurting you. This is not serving you. It was. This has served you. It no longer does. And so in that moment, I just kind of realized, like, oh, my gosh, I don't have to prove myself. I don't have to need everybody to love me. I used to go to a party, you know, and I'd go to every single person. Made me a great realtor, but I'd go to every single person and try to have a conversation, try to make sure that we were friends or whatever else. And this neediness, this need to get validated and all this really drove a lot of my decision making. And in that moment, I was able to just kind of release it. And so it was really beautiful. So since then, you know, it wasn't too long after that I started realizing, like, oh, I don't know if this real estate thing is, like, what I really want to do anymore. I. You mentioned in the intro that I sold the most expensive home ever in Utah. At that time, it was 32 and a half million dollars. And. And when that happened, I just knew there was something more I wanted to do. I wanted to use these skills and this knowledge that I'd accumulated. And kind of part of the gift, again of feeling like you're not good enough is I always felt like I was the problem. So I was hell bent on fixing it. So I hired every coach, I went to, every mastermind, I went to every event, read 400, 500 books on self development, hired a bunch of coaches. And in that I did learn a lot of cool things about, you know, human behavior and psychology and stuff like that. And so when I kind of had that experience, it kind of led me down this road of like, well, if I didn't do real estate, it was my whole identity, right. It was everything I did. And I was like, well, what if I didn't do this? What actually could I do to help people? And that's what led me to the men's group, which is what I do now, which is weird that they is. I had all these guys would reach out to me on Instagram and they'd just say stuff like, dude, where do I find a group of friends like you have? Or how do I connect with other men? I feel like I don't know, you know, where to go to find driven, successful guys to kind of do life with. And so that's where I kind of realized, oh, you're most qualified to help the person you once were. And this was a gift that I had. And so, yeah, I started this men's group 3 1/2 years ago and had the chance now to coach almost a thousand different men.

Wow, that is so cool. And then you guys do a combination of like retreats and then you do one on one coaching and then you have community aspect as well, right?

Correct. Yeah, it's. I try to put the. The main group is my leadership group. We put them in pockets of 50. And this was just my experience of going to all these other masterminds. I realized anytime it was over 50, it was hard to connect anything smaller. It's just, it felt like it was, you were given too much of your time to like a small group of people. And so 50 became that number where I said, if I get 50 guys together for a two year program, and yeah, we jump off cliffs, we go swim with tiger sharks, we go run with the bulls, we've been to Africa and Iceland and we just do a lot of crazy, fun adventures. And I've got a group coming to Arizona next month. We're going skydiving and we're going to put them through this challenge called the Masochi challenge, where it's one day that's so difficult that all your other days are easy in comparison. It's something I picked up from Bedros, Kuhlian and Jesse Itzler. And we're gonna kick their butts for, like, 12 hours straight. And you go through these things together, you form a special bond. But it also has a very spiritual element, and it has a lot of emotional stuff that we go through. And so it's been really cool to be able to do all this stuff and. Yeah. And so Those groups of 50, they get together every couple months in person. We have our weekly calls, and then we do these big adventure trips as well. So the combination of all of it is really what makes it so. Why it works so well.

That's awesome. I know. I. I definitely have struggled with relationships. Both, like, you know, spousal or what? I don't know. Dating, I guess you would call it.

Romantic.

Romantic, yeah, Romantic. Thank you. Romantic relations. That's how good I am at relationships. I don't even know what to call it. And then also friendships, and especially being a very high driv, highly driven, overachiever type. That's so, like, I have to get better. I have to get better. I have to prove myself. I have to this. And then feeling like you're on your own and somebody's not there to save you. Right? Like, nobody's coming. My destiny is up to me, and I need to please people, and I. It's all on me. It was always very hard for me to connect with people, and I always kind of felt alone in a crowded room and that I was just not like anybody else and that nobody understood me. And it was a very, very lonely place. And in that darkness, like, to be alone is so dark. And it created also a codependency in me of I need aff and love from, like, men or a man or something like that, because I wasn't getting it from my family or my father or my brothers or. I didn't. I didn't have strong female friendships either. And early on in life, the female friends that I had abandoned me, you know, I would do something to annoy them, or they would get jealous that I hung out with another girl or something. And so it was always hard for. For me to connect. So what was that experience like for you growing up? Were you, like, very much. Did you struggle with anxiety and depression and things like that? Or were you just kind of focused? And were you. Did you have a bunch of friends?

Yeah, no, I. So I always would struggle with the romantic relationships in the sense that, like, I'll give you an example. I've been on over a thousand first dates. To give you an idea. Like, for me, it was this chase. And I was always just. I just was. I was doing anything to avoid the intimacy of a real relationship. So I would start a lot of relationships, but the second it started getting, you know, where you got to take your mask off and you got to be vulnerable, I was out, right? And so I would find ways to push him away. And I remember one time I was this girl I had a huge crush on. And that morning, I took a different girl to the BYU football game, posted a picture on Facebook that night, took her to the rodeo, and posted another picture with her on Facebook. Like, it's. I look back now, and I'm like, oh, my gosh, what was I doing? Like, you know, and I really liked that other girl, the second one. And it was like. So I was just terrible at being able to show somebody my affection, to put my walls down, to be able to trust the feminine wouldn't hurt me. And so what I did is, you know, what a lot of people do is they find ways to distract themselves. So for me, it was work. It was hanging out with my buddies. It was, you know, sports, travel. I've been to 114 countries. You know, I've been to about every major sporting event you can go to. And what I just didn't give myself space for was to be able to sit with myself. And I think the thing that I learned over the last several years, you know, really diving into this, is the power of just loving being with yourself and being. And doing nothing. And that's what I couldn't do. I couldn't hold still for two seconds. So every night, I was out doing something. I was throwing parties all the time. I was attending every networking event. That's how I became the number one realtor. I just knew everyone, and it's because I didn't want to sit with my own feelings. I didn't want to sit with some of these uncomfortable things that would come up for myself. And so the. What I had to work through is, you know, a little bit different. I actually was a happy kid. It was fun. I was having a blast. But none of it was really fulfilling. It's like a bucket with holes in it, right? And so you're constantly pouring in, and thank God I was good at doing that. But it gets to a point where you get kind of exhausted, and you get to this point where you're like, oh, I'm. I'd really like to just be okay with not needing to prove myself, not needing to be successful, to feel like I'm worthy of love. And. And so, yeah, that was the thing that I had to shift the most around.

What was the most pivotal moment in your life that was a rock bottom for you or something that happened that shifted you from just driving for more money, success, worthiness, to connection and love.

Yeah, I think it was a process watching my friends, some of my best friends, go through their own hell and kind of how they had to work through some things. And then I. You know, I was very observant always. And so I was always watching other people. But I watched a couple buddies almost blow up their families and make some really bad decisions. And there was a couple pivotal moments. One was, you know, I was with a buddy one night, we were all hanging out, and he came clean to his wife that he'd been cheating on her. And. And she had a nervous breakdown. And I remember in the middle of her breaking down and crying, she looked at me and she's like. Just stopped stone cold. And she's like, jimmy, for the sake of your future spouse, quit objectifying women. And went right back to this breakdown. I'm like, oh, shit. Like, that was pretty intense. And that was one watching. You know, I had these moments where I got to watch that same friend call this other friend into integrity. Became the greatest hour of my life. It was like, this dude is about to ruin his whole life. And this dude just knew every thought he had, everything he was experiencing, and he called him to be better. And I remember thinking, like, holy cow, I want to do that for other men. And that became a real impetus for my program and was just this ability to love somebody that way. Cause usually what we think, like, buddies do. And I've unfortunately been this friend in other parts of my life. But you see a friend of yours go off with some other girl, and he's married or something, and you don't stop him, and you just allow your friend to ruin his own life. And I look back at a couple of those situations where I saw that and I didn't do anything. And those friends sure enough ruined their life, and they're miserable and everything else. And it's like watching a friend call a friend to integrity instead and being like, dude, I love you enough to have a tough conversation right now, and you're gonna go through some hell. You're going to talk to your wife, but we're going to stand by you every step of the way. I think watching those experiences and seeing how much joy that brought, that's what got me like, okay, there's a lifestyle that I want to Live. That's how I want to make a difference in the world, is I want to help men experience this. This moment. And there's another experience I had. I went to Pelican Bay Prison. It's like the worst of the worst. If you remember the movie Training Day, he says, I'll send you to Pelican Bay. You know, it's like, um, anyway, long story short, I had the chance to go out there with, like, 30 other entrepreneurs, and we were gonna go teach the inmates, these dudes on death row, in for murder and stuff. And so we go out there. I remember, like, so nervous because I'm like, are they behind the cages and stuff? They're like, no, they're. They're in the open room. And so we come in, and I'm so nervous. And you have these ideas of how people are gonna be, you know, like, how this person's gonna react. And we come in, and they're like, all right, run in. And we all go running. And they're on both sides, just cheering us as we run in and we spend the whole day with. They could not have been more grateful. They could not have been more loving. And at one point, we had this exercise where all 100 of the inmates were on one side, the 30 entrepreneurs on the other. This exercise called Step to the Line. And basically, the instructor lady, this lady Kat, she was brilliant, and she created this series of questions, and she would ask them, and if it applied to you, you step into the line so you can just see, and she starts asking some of these questions. You start realizing real quick that there's a lot of grace that you've been given, that you've been pretty lucky to have the life that you have, and that, you know, you had some advantages that maybe you never recognized before. Like, she'd ask, like, if you had a. A parent tuck you in at least once a week, Step into the. Step to the line. And I think all 30 entrepreneurs step to the line. And like, one of the hundred inmates, right? And she's like, if you ever had a family member killed before your 18th birthday, step to the line. It's like two thirds of the inmates, not one of us. And question after question. And by the time you get done, it just was so humanizing to see. That changed me and realized, like, wow, like, there's some things here that maybe I've missed. And so I. I was again, I had 10 or 11, 15, these magical little moments of my life that kind of all, one by one, were changing me. But I think it more than any one moment, it's just these different experiences, one after another, like this, where it just, you really got to see life a different way. And my travels, I think helped a lot with that too. Because my whole life you're taught. I was raised in a specific religion, it was pretty strict. And then all of a sudden you travel, you start meeting these amazing people and maybe their morals don't fit what you think they should be, but they're some of the nicest, kindest humans you've ever met. And all of a sudden you're like, maybe there's some things I'm missing here. And it just, I just got really introspective about what I believed and what I didn't. And so it was all a beautiful mess.

Right. And so I, I also did mushrooms and did a medicine journey, you know, different from just taking them in high school for, for fun, which I don't know who would take those for fun because it is not fun for me.

There's nothing fun about it. It's work.

Yeah, it's a lot of work. But that was one of the biggest transformational moments for me. And that allowed me for the first time to release so much of the hate and resentment that I had for my dad and my brothers and my mom and, and you know, the people that had hurt me in my childhood and start to see things from, see the pain and suffering in them. And then it also allowed me to actually like feel love for myself for the very first time and feel love for the little girl. And you know, I always was just self loathing and self hate and always bringing myself down. And that experience was required for me to actually. You can't explain it unless you do it. But when did you have that experience? At what point in your life? And it sounds like that was a pretty big transformation.

Yeah, that first night, I mean, when I saw my hat and realized what I'd been, you know, and it was just this transformation. Then I had a really healing moment with my dad, but it was December 7, 2018. I literally have it tattooed on my finger because it was the most profound experience that first journey. And I don't even like to talk about that stuff anymore because I don't think it's like for everybody. But I also wouldn't be doing justice to my own experience if I didn't share it, like it was that profound to help me. And so, you know, it's just one of those things that I just know, like people that are part of the self development community if you're really working to improve yourself every day, eventually it's going to lead you to there, because there's places you can't go without it, right? But for me, it was. Yeah, it was just profound. And I learned to love myself. I remember, you know, in a journey experience where I was like. I went in with intel, like, okay, what part of you don't you love, Jimmy? And I could tell there was just, like, a piece missing. And in that experience, I got the message. And the part of me that I didn't want to love was the part of me that was weak. I'd always kind of despised weak people. Like, get your shit together. You know, like, suck it up. Like, I was definitely that guy. And in that experience, I realized that I hated the part of me that was weak. And I never wanted to look at it. I never wanted to admit it. I wouldn't allow myself before then to be sad or tired or depressed or lonely. Any of those feelings, if they came up, I was very good at being able to push them down, right? And helped me be productive, but it didn't help me to heal myself. And so in that moment, I kind of just sat with myself for hours and just cried and just allowed myself to experience all that. And so now, anytime feelings come up, I put this in my book. I said, the goal of life isn't to feel better. The goal of life is to just feel more. And so whatever's coming through is okay, and I don't judge it, and I'm okay with it, and actually can appreciate these moments of weakness where I have to go, oh, I'm. This isn't good. And. And. But being able to sit with that, I think it works through you pretty quickly. And overall, you end up much happier.

Did you start working with Ed Mylett after that experience happened?

Yes, I started working with Ed about three years ago. So I have this theory in life that, like, if we can find. Well, okay, so there's a formula for change. I teach this to my guys. I'll say this real quick, because the fifth part is why I reached out to Ed. But number one is you have to kind of just basically take a moral stand. Like, what do I stand for? What's right? What's wrong? You have to really, you know, look at yourself and ask that question of, like, what do you believe in? The second one is, is to make changes. You have to figure out, all right, what do I need to stop doing? What do I need to start doing? The third piece is accountability. Have somebody that'll hold you accountable, which a coach can do, or a group or whatever. The fourth one is support. You have to do it through community. It's very hard to make change on your own. And then the fifth one is to find a mentor. And so for me, I. My real estate career took off. When I found the best coach and mentor, I kind of got lucky. But my first six months as a realtor, I sold, like, three houses. And then my next six months after I got my mentor, I sold 60 by the end of that year, and so I just crushed it. The next year, I sold almost 100 homes with one assistant, and I was off to the races. It was all because of this mentor I found. So I knew the value of coaching. But what a great mentor can do is they can just collapse time, what takes 10 years to figure out, you can, you know, maybe get it in half that time or even a. A tenth of that time. And so for me, I always go, all right, who is where I want to be? That used to be where I'm at now. And so for me, it was like, okay, I want to be where Ed's at. I want to be doing what he's doing. And so I found ways. I've always been really good at getting in the room. Sounds like you know how to do that as well. It's like, if I want to meet somebody and connect with them, I'll usually be able to do it. So I just found ways to create value in his life, to get around him. Next thing I know, I'm having dinner at his house. And then after that, you know, he opened up this opportunity to coach with him and took the plunge. And. And, yeah, and it's invaluable, the kind of stuff that you can pick up from somebody like that. And it's not like I learned a hundred things that changed my life. I just got to see a way that a man lives. And he. He had a really unique ability. One of the things that he does best is he. He's really good at helping you see you. So I remember we were in a crowded room one time. It was about 10 or 12 of us, and he looked at all of them, and he said, if I could get every one of you to just do the things I ask you to do the way that Jimmy does, he goes, it would change your whole life. He said, every time I give this guy something to go do, it's done. He goes and does it. He takes care of it. He's like, I've never met somebody with that skill better than that. And it just made me feel so seen and like, oh, yeah, I do do that. And so he instills this confidence that then allows you to just go to that next level. And so anytime you can get around a mentor or a coach, whether that's, you know, if you're dead broke and you're hearing this, like, read their book or watch their YouTube videos or whatever, if you can get to the next level, we can get some space around them some time. And then you got to invest with them, you know, as the. These people that are highly successful, they just, you know, I get. People ask me to go to lunch every day and I can't do it. I've got, you know, hundreds of men that pay me to give me their time and attention. And so, you know, you have to sometimes pay to play. And I've done that many a times. I've hired all the best coaches you can, and anytime I want to study a specific topic, I'll go hire the best in that business, whoever it is, and have them coach me, because I know I can, again, expedite my learning curve just so much by having them.

Yeah, having good mentors is the most important thing you could possibly do, in my opinion. And it's something that took me a long time to start to invest in myself. And I was watching one of your, I think it was one of your videos where you said, like, the best investment to make until you've made. Until you make a certain amount of money per year is back into yourself.

Yep.

Talk, like, say a little bit about that.

Yeah. I mean, so again, because I sell so many real estate properties to people, I get a lot of people reach out to me for investing advice. And, you know, the. I've got a deal right now. A guy sent me last night that I coach. He's like, can you, you know, walk through this and see if it's a good deal? And. And I always say the same thing to people. I said, if you're not already making like 3 or $400,000 a year, then the best investment you can make is in your own self to get better skills, knowledge, and network. Because you just don't make enough money to truly get ahead yet. I mean, you're making 100 grand, even 200 grand a year. Like, that's. You can have a good life, but if you want to start investing to, like, for. To really make a difference, you're just not making enough money. And especially with, you know, the stock market and real estate being so high in value right now. And so I tell all of them, I said, until you're making several hundred thousand dollars a year, the only thing you should be investing is back into yourself, Invest into getting a better network, into better skills and better knowledge, because nothing will change your life faster. And the next thing is into your own business. Right. Like most people, they want to invest or buy a real estate property or in it. Look, I sell plenty real estate, I own plenty of real estate. But at the end of the day, if you're trying to just buy a house, it's not going to change your life much for the next 10 years. It might long term. But if you can get a new skill, if you can get. So I look at for myself when I was selling real estate, you know, at the beginning of my career, I was closing about half of my appointments and I was selling, you know, 60, 70 homes a year, but I was only closing about half the people. And then I learned new skills. I learned how to read people, I learned about behavioral styles. I learned how to close people differently. And my closing rate went from 50 or 60% up to over 90%. And my income basically doubled just because I got that much better at closing. And so by investing in these real estate coaches and these mentors and going to these programs, little by little I learned how to do that. And I ended up making so much more money because of that. And the other powerful part about investing in yourself is when you invest in yourself, when the world's chaotic around you, it doesn't affect you because you know that you're the asset. So if all shit hits the fan tomorrow, like, I'm not afraid of where I'm going to get money from. Like, I thrive in chaos. I'm going to be able to absolutely find the opportunities that are there. And you get that confidence by investing in yourself and you become the asset as opposed to just relying upon somebody.

Else for this is a little bit of a segue. But for real estate agents. I own a real estate brokerage. I'm a real estate agent. Commercial and residential sales. And what would you recommend for them? Because it's a hard market right now. A lot of real estate agents are suffering and a lot of real estate investors are struggling too. But what, where did you go? What do you think is the best thing for them to really learn how to get their closing ratios up and build those better relationships?

Yeah, I mean, there's different coaches you can hire and mentors. And here's again, I would find the person. So what I did Is that all right? Who's the best in the country at this? Who's literally the best realtors in the country? And so I went and I shadowed a bunch of them. I went to San Diego and Texas, and I would go and hang out with these realtors, and they would share their whole thing with me because I wasn't a threat. I was in Utah, and I just said, hey, I want to come shadow you for a day or two. And I remember I ended up copying the system, this entire system of this agent in San Diego. I'd met him at this top performer event, and the dude ended up becoming. He was Chris Heller. He ended up becoming the CEO of Keller Williams. Like, the guy was the just a beast. And I just copied his whole program, what he did, right? And so, like, if you're like, if I was today, here's the thing that people need. In today's market, there's one thing that makes you stand out because, yeah, it's a little bit harder than it's been, but that's only because agents lack confidence in themselves. And I'll explain what I mean. When the market tanked in Utah or back when, you know, in 2007, 8, 9, I just realized I'm like, I need to get so good at this that I have an unwavering confidence that I'm their best choice. So when I would sit down with somebody, I would just have this confidence and say, look, I can't promise you your home's going to sell, but I can promise you that I'm the best chance you have of getting the amount of money you're trying to get out of your house. And if you'll sign this paperwork, let me go to work, I can guarantee you I will get your home sold, or we will know what to do to get your home sold if it's not selling. And I could say it in a way where I've truly believed it, and that's the part of it that people understand is like, I really did, to my core, believe I was the best agent. I was the absolute best choice they had. And so when I said it, you feel it. You're like, this dude, whether he is or isn't, he sure as hell thinks he is. At least there's something there. Because what people want when their market's down or homes aren't selling, you can't find a buyer for your house, or you can't find the house you're looking for, you want somebody that just has hope in it. And so I would just Again, come in with that confidence. And most agents lack confidence because they're not putting the effort in to know what to say, know how to say it, to find, you know, that they get the skills and talents they need. I mean, it's so easy to find nowadays. There's. I could. You know, there's five coaches that I would highly recommend studying. You got Bill Pipes, Mike Ferry, Tom Ferry, Brian Buffini. It's not even like. They're not even, like, tricky ones. It's just. Just go to the tried and true dudes and then go listen to, like. You know, one of the advantages I had coming up is we didn't have quite so much material to listen from. We didn't have podcasts and audiobooks and all this. So I had, like, five choices. I had five CDs in my car. I had Jim Rohn, Earl Nightingale, Zig Ziglar, Tony Robbins. I mean, it was like. And Robert Kiyosaki. And it was like I was going to listen to one of those five, and it was just. They were so simple, but, like, so much of, like, do X and Y and Z will be the result. And I think it gets. A lot of. It gets complicated right now. It's. It's a very noisy space. And so a lot of agents, they're just looking for that magic pill. But the truth is, is you just. Just get in there and learn how to grind, get. You get confident because you get deals closed. Like, I'd close so many deals that I knew I was going to close another deal. I would wake up every day. I literally asked myself the question. I'm like, all right, Jimmy, how many houses you gonna sell today? That was the asked. I got to the point where it wasn't like, am I going to sell a house this month? It was like, how many homes I'm going to sell today? And, you know, my last full year as an agent with three agents on my team, we sold 497 houses. We got to the point where it was. We were closing multiple homes a day. I had days where I sold 20 homes, you know, and. And it was this unwavering belief that I just. I'm the guy that's going to get this done. And so you just go in and do the work. And if it doesn't go well that day, you don't give a. Because, you know, tomorrow it's going to go good. And so too many agents, I think they focus on, like, the end result of, like, if I got a deal, if I got a check and I always, like I said, I felt good if I did my job. So if I made my three hours of prospecting calls, if I got in and made my, you know, just made my contacts that day, then I knew that was a great day. I never focused on what was coming out. And so to get that confident feeling, all I had to do was do my job and make those calls for three hours every day. And I think that was the difference, because if you're always, you know, like, a deal falls apart or inspection doesn't come through, your buyer cancels and the loan doesn't happen, when you get all depressed about it, it's really hard to get yourself back on the phones. So for me, it was just every day for five years. I never missed, but it was like, every day, no matter what. I did my job, and I never had to worry about the money. I knew it would be there as long as I did these things every day.

Yeah. Focusing on the process, not the result. Yeah, yeah.

What you control, Right. You control making calls, you control networking, you control knocking doors, whatever that looks like in your market.

Yeah. And so you had immense success. You're making, you know, one of the top agents in the entire country, but then you still didn't feel that fulfillment. And that's something that's happened to me in my life is, you know, being raised in a family that didn't have a lot of money. I thought money was the answer to everything. And that would make me worthy or that would make me have freedom or be happy, all those things. And then I achieved the amount that I wanted, which, when I was a kid was a hundred thousand. I was like, if I make a hundred thousand a year, everything will be perfect. Made a hundred thousand still unfulfilled. If I make a million dollars, everything will be perfect. Made a million dollars still unfulfilled. And so then I started realizing, just continuing to move the goal post to make more money isn't solving this. These holes inside of me, the bucket keeps draining, as you talked about. And that's where I really started to say, okay, let me go down the path of looking for the answers inside of me instead of outside of me and figure out why I feel so empty, why I feel so unfulfilled. And it was on that mushroom journey where I heard Joe Polish saying, the opposite of addiction is connection. And I realized how addicted I was. I was addicted to everything outside of me. Although highly functioning, I was addicted to success. I was addicted to money. I was addicted to relationships. I was addicted to food. I was addicted to being busy, like, all the things, right. And trying. It was in that moment where I realized how much pain I was in if I didn't have anything. Feeding me, filling my dopamine, right? Filling that bucket. And because I was just draining, if I was just sitting there with myself. And so why do you think so many people, despite. Especially, you know, men, which I think nowadays women are starting to take the lead or at least come up as equals in the world of success and entrepreneurship and wealth and things like that. Why do you think so many people are so unfulfilled despite their achievements or their success or their beauty or their looks or all of these things?

Yeah, it's hard, honestly. That's my first answer on that. We've all been taught from a young age, like, you know, you did well in school and your parents rewarded you, you did bad, and they didn't talk to you or something, right? Or maybe you just saw somebody else's life and you thought, man, that person's got it made. I mean, look what we, you know, we. We are taught to want to achieve this material success. And one of the gifts that you got. One of the gifts that I got was getting material success at a very young age. Like, it's one thing to never have money and be like, oh, man, like, I don't need that, or whatever, but it's another thing when you get there and you go, oh, this actually doesn't work. This. This. This isn't what's going to make me happy. And, you know, you can buy a new car in three days later. It's just a car in your garage. You really can. Like, there's a few things. You know, one thing that kind of helped me start to. Is the more I got connected. The first time I took my mask off, I remember and got vulnerable. And I remember thinking, man, if they knew who I was, they would not love me. And that's, by the way, that's the number one sentiment I get from the guys that joined my program. If they knew who I really was, they wouldn't love me. And when they're able to take that mask off, so I go through this whole weekend with them where they're able to do that, and they get seen in that space and they get loved in that space, then a lot of them for the first time are feeling loved. Because when we wear the mask, the problem is we know people are only loving the version of them we're showing. And so we don't trust the love. Even when we get It. And so when you can take that down and you can like, all of a sudden you're like, oh. Then all of a sudden material success can be fun because you're like, wait, I can do so much good with this. I can actually connect more. And you know, I just bought my new house. I, a month ago I closed on it. And you know, it's almost a full acre it's going to have. It's already got tennis courts and pickleball courts and putting in a pool. The whole reason I want the house. And it's funny because I bought a house there in 2006, almost the same neighborhood. It's a really nice part of my community. And I bought that house in 2006 and I was stretched to make the payment. It had a pool, the whole thing. I hated that house because it stressed me. I bought it for all the wrong reasons to show people I was successful. It's just the total wrong vibe, wrong energy. I think we swam twice. I'm not even joking. Like, I just hated the damn house because it stressed me out all the time. This time around, it's like, I did it stress free. I put down, you know, almost enough so that I don't ever have to worry about the payment. I. I just, I'm buying it with this sole purpose of making it a place where families and people can come gather and all the guys I coach once a week will have a family night and then we'll have a barbecue and they bring their kids. And I'm just. It's the energy of which I've done it this time is all for connection instead of trying to get significance. And so it's just this completely different vibe and it's got a completely different purpose. And so I am a big believer in having the things you want, having nice things, experiencing nice things, but it's the energy of which why you're trying to do it. And it's like. And so for me that's the whole difference. And I think for a lot of people that's really hard. It's like, you know, if you have money and you're not happy, then you're really in trouble because you're like, wait, this was supposed to make me happy. So that's what forces people to go inward and go, okay, I better try to figure out how to fix this internally, because externally is never going to work. And you know, you can date a million hot women, you can, you know, travel over the world and do all these things, but until you start to love yourself, until you truly do, then none of it matters. I mean, it can be fun. It's, you know, I don't, I wouldn't say I was miserable, but there's just a piece missing. And I think we all get to that point, thankfully for you and I, you know, I think that is an advantage of getting that success at a young age because you just realize, like, I don't have to chase it anymore. You know, Matt Damon gives a famous speech when he won the Oscar for Goodwill hunting. He said, I'm so glad I achieved this at such a young age because I would have chased my whole life trying to achieve it and realized it was an empty chase. And so that's kind of that principle.

Yeah. And it's, it's what sets people apart for self actualization, like truly reaching your highest potential and raising your levels of consciousness. And that's such a deep message for me is I want to help people achieve their highest potential. And not just I'm going to make the most money or I'm going to have the coolest this, but in their relationship, in their health, in their happiness and their fulfillment, in their purpose and their service. Right. In all these areas. And because that's what, that's the journey I'm on. But until you hit financial success and you have your needs met, then you don't realize, like, oh, there's a lot more to this game. Like, there's so many more levels of consciousness and most people don't even get to the first part of not being in fight or flight because they need to make money. And so if you can help, like I like to help people get rich financially just so they can figure out that that's not everything, but it is a requirement, like, to have some level of financial stability and freedom is a requirement for you to be able to raise your consciousness and focus your energy on other things. And there's so much potential in this world that most people don't ever get to explore. And I think that everybody should be able to. To explore.

Yeah, no, you're exactly right. There's, you know, again, Tony Robbins talks about this, but it's like the bottom level is like survival and then you go to satisfaction, then you go to success, and then ultimately is fulfillment. Right. And it's, yeah, it's. If you're figuring out where your food's going to be coming from tomorrow, it's really hard to think bigger picture, to think about helping other people and all those kinds of things. And so I think I agree with what you're saying is like, the gift of my life now is watching these guys go through my program and. And meet friends for a lifetime, come into integrity with their spouses or families, like, love themselves for the first time, you know, and. And just all these different things that come with that. And it's so much more fulfilling than anything I could ever get out of myself. And that's, I think, why I've been so driven to kind of go this way with stuff.

Yeah, you're. You get the helper's high. I get the helper's eye a lot. But that in itself can become an addiction.

Sure.

You know.

Yeah. It's really easy to not have to ever look at yourself if you. If you're just worrying about everybody else. Right. Things like that. Or just, like, start to feel like you're the reason these things are happening. I had a experience with one of the people closest to me a couple years ago, cut me out of his life. And I was kind of, like, you know, offended, but also, like, how dare him? Or, like, see how he does without me. And the truth is, he did better without me. And I had to have this very humbling experience where I went, oh, maybe some people are better off without you, Jimmy. If you're not willing to show up the right way, if you can't be, like, you know, really be out of your own, people might be better off without you. And it humbled me big time. I had to realize, like, oh. And it forced me to look at myself in ways I never would have otherwise, because I'd started feeling like I was pretty damn special. And so you got to be careful of that, too.

Yeah. And that brings a good point of how do you. I think the most important decision you could possibly make in your life is the partner you choose and the friends that you're around. Right. You're the average. You're the average of the 105 people that you spend the most time with. And so how do you advise or how do people, like, know what relationships in their life are toxic? First evaluate that. And then how do you recommend people cut those toxic relations out of their life? Like, this person that cut you out. They had to. There was so much codependence or reliability or bond or obligation or comfort. All these things that we establish in a relationship with someone, especially the longer that relationship goes on. And it can be very, very difficult to understand. Like, this relationship is toxic for me, and it's actually dragging me down. And if it's dragging you down, you're probably Dragging the other person down too. And how do you evaluate that and then cut that person out and make that decision?

Yeah, well, that particular person too, it was. They worked for me for almost 15 years and, you know, and they kind of always. I was the one that paid for all this stuff. I was the one that, you know, came up with all this stuff. And they just kind of would basically handle the leads that came in and close them and things like that. And where it got complicated was me feeling like, well, I'm trying to pour into this person. Like, I felt like I was always trying to help them because I love them, you know, and they were like, well, this person's held me back because it hasn't given me the chance to really go and be my own person. And so what was cool with that particular case is he and I rekindled back in the fall this year, and we're as close as ever now. I just spent two days watching his son wrestle, you know, in the state tournament. And it's really cool. We have this beautiful appreciation for each other that maybe we didn't before, I think, but those are hard to get to. So, like any relationship, though, if you want to know if it's toxic in your life, like, you can honestly ask your question. Number one is, can I fully be myself around this person? Can I fully be myself? Like, am I watching what I say? Am I changing my actions? And if you're not fully 100% yourself, then that's a good sign that maybe this is not a healthy relationship. The second one is, how do I feel when I'm with them? Like, literally, it's that simple. This person make me happier, do they make me feel bad about myself? Do I feel uplifted when I'm with them? And, you know, whether that's a romantic relationship or a friend. And I've had, you know, romantic relationships where the girls just tearing you down all the time. And I think there's some subconscious things going where they don't have. Feel worthy of, like, being with you or whatever. So they're like, if I can tear them down to my level. And friends will do that too, right? They'll, you know, I'll give you a quick example. A lot of guy friends, they'll kind of nag their buddies or make them look bad or, you know, kind of make them look small or whatever, especially on girls and stuff. And with my friend group, it is the opposite. We are like, we. That is 100% a no go. We had a. One of my buddies there's like six of us hanging out. I have six close, close friends from high school. We were hanging out last Christmas, and one of my buddies, kids, he's like 8 or 9, he was making fun of his dad, who's like one of my best friends, and he was basically making fun of him. And so what most guys would do is kind of laugh about it, piggyback on it a little bit. And I just stalked him. I said, hey, man, let me just tell you a little bit about your dad for a second. And I sat and I told him story after story of his dad, how cool he was in high school, how we all wanted to be his dad, how he was the most generous one. He pulled all the girls, had all the best, and you see the kid kind of let me. Then all my other buddies started dog piling on that. And so we spent like 15 minutes just talking this dude up to his son. And he called us that night. He called me after he dropped his son off. He's with his mom, and he's just. He's super emotional. He's crying. He goes, dude, my kid has never looked at me that way. Thank you so much. And it's like, those are the kind of friends you want to be around. Do they build you up? Do they make you look good? Or, you know, how do they. How are you spoken about in a room if you're not there? If somebody's talking about one of my friends and I'm there, that's going to be a problem. Like, we're going to call them out, and most people just won't say anything, or they. Or they'll just kind of go along with it. And, you know, I know there's been rooms where my name's been brought up in a negative light, and it's got back to me. One of my buddies said something along the lines of like, dude, you obviously don't know Jimmy very well, because let me tell you what I know about Jimmy. And, you know, and the people just shut up. And those are the kinds of friendships I think you want to look for. But how do you feel with them? Do they make you a better person? Do they support you? And then also, how do people react when you give them good news? Like, if people are truly happy for you? You know, my friends, I got a buddy that one of my best friends called me the other day, and he's like, dude, I invested in this thing a couple of years ago. Remember this thing? I invested, and it was spent, like, put like 200 grand into it. He said, Bro, it's worth like $3 million now. And we're just celebrating. We're talking about. We're laughing our asses off. And it was awesome. I was. It was like, he knew he could call me and that. That would be celebrated. Whereas a lot of people might be like, whoa, why don't you tell me about it? Or, wait, what? Like, what is this? And it was just pure love, you know, love for this guy. And I'm so happy that he's. His life will be a little bit better now. And so that's the main things I could tell you that you should look for in your relationships.

And what do you recommend for people who are afraid to cut relationships out of their life, whether it's their romantic relationship or a friendship? Like, how do they take that leap of faith?

Yeah, it's. Well, if you don't replace it with something, you're gonna. You're going to feel that vacancy or that void, and it's gonna be really hard not to go, want to fill it up again. Even with the toxic person, our brains are hardwired to keep us safe. And what I mean by that is it really looks for familiar patterns. Our brain is not wired to make us happy. And so, unfortunately, I used to work at the center for Women and Children in Crisis. I watched 200 women come through that place. I watched 200 go back to their abuser. It was really depressing for me. But what happens is our brain will look for what it knows. And so if the person doesn't understand this and they can't go, hey, you need to find something that's going to make you happy. And we do that through gratitude. You do that through looking for what else is, what's going right in your life. And you do that through feeling that vacancy. When you break up with somebody or you leave a friendship, having support that's healthy for you, it doesn't necessarily mean running the next romantic partner, but you have friends that are truly supportive and that aren't toxic and that, like, make you feel loved. And then also the ultimate is to be able to just love yourself and be able to give that to yourself, which is easier said than done. But that's. That's the best way to get out of those relationships. And also just understanding, I think this helps me a lot, is understanding that not every relationship has to be forever. Like, quit giving this expectation that you, you know, some. Some friendships or some relationships are just for a season. And I've had friends that were like, I love them dearly and we'll never hang out again. Like those friends. Like we, I needed them at that point, they needed me. But it's okay also to recognize that like, you know what, I moved on past that friendship. I'm not better than them. It's just I'm in a different place. They're in a different place now. And so I think just having that understanding that not everything needs to be forever helps you get out of those places.

Yeah, I, my, my friend yesterday was, told me she was, she's my best friend. She said she was feeling sad because, you know, her and her boyfriend recently broke up and she was going to be alone on Valentine's Day. And I sent her flowers and a love note and called her and just like being that, that support and it's so important, but it is hard. You know, she's my best friend and one of my only true friends. I have. I've got a handful of great women in my life. But how do you make friends as an adult?

So there's a. By the way, I talk about this in my book, Mel Robbins new book, Let Them. She talks about chapters 11, 12, 13. She talks about how to make friends as an adult. So I would recommend going and reading my book on friendship and then also reading Mel's. It's interesting because when we're little, we have so society. One of the most important things for making friendships is proximity. And the problem we have as adults is it's not set up for us. Like when you're a kid, it's like you're going to school with the same kids, you're playing in sports team. So you're just around each other, you're going to church together. But as an adult, you have to force those connections. You have to find them. And so honestly, the best thing you can do is is find proximity to the type of people you want to be around. I had recently a buddy on my podcast. He ended up joining my men's group. And the whole reason that he ended up in my group is because he saw a picture of me and my friends on Facebook one day and said, I want to be in that friend group. And then he found ways to get around us. It's. He tells the story. It's hilarious. I was doing real estate full time, so he kept calling me to buy a house. But he realized very quickly that I was serious about it. And so I was just dog hounding him for like lead follow up. So then he called my other buddy that was in the photo who did car washes and he went and started getting his car washed with him and then became friends. And that dude today is a close friend of ours. He just went through my program for two and a half years. In fact, we're all going, me and him are the groomsmen for the dude that does the car washes. He's getting married next month and we're all going to Cabo for his bachelor party. And the point is he found proximity though. You got to get around people. And so that's why with what I do now with we are the they, it's pretty easy to get around other like minded people, people that are driven, people that sign up and go, I want to be a good friend. I want to, you know, improve my life. And that's why it's worked so well. These like last week was waste management down here. There was five guys that, from my group that came down with their spouses together. And one of the guys, you know, he'd never had a close friend in his life. He was like, before the program he gave this full 30 minute speech that's on my website about it. But what, what you need to do to find good friends is you got to find people that have that same like direction you're going, right? It doesn't matter where they've been, it matters where they want to go. And then you've got to be like minded and just unfortunately as adults you have to force the activity. So you either have to join a group or a situation where stuff's just going to be happening. And that's the beauty of weird that they for example is it's just forced on you. Every single three months we're getting together for three days, we're going to be on a call every week, we're going to be doing these things together. You can't help but become friends with these people. Whereas a normal situation, you either have to be the one inviting. And people always want to say like I just want people to invite me to do this. It's like they're not going to probably. So you've got to be willing to just put yourself out there, just like go out there. And I always say whatever you want more of give it away. So if you want to be, have a lot of friends, be a great friend. It's really hard not to like someone that keeps making your life better. So there's someone at your office that you really want to be friends with, start doing little things for them and they'll be like, damn, I, I really like this person. And then all of a sudden you'll become friends, but you've got to again, whatever you want, more give away. So if you want to be a good friend, just. Or if you want to have good friends, be a good friend.

Yeah, I think joining the communities is the, the biggest hack in for personal, like connection, relationships, business growth, personal development. I mean, I just started joining masterminds and different groups probably about a year ago where I really started to write the checks and get into the groups that were the people that I wanted to be like or the people that were already like me. And that's where almost all of my friends, like my strongest relationships and people I would call family today are through those connections and through those masterminds, because those are. And some of them you join and you're like, ah, this isn't really my vibe. Right. Like there's some great people, but not really for me. And then like I joined Genius Network, I'm like, oh, every person in here is my person and this is my family and this is my home. And it's priceless. It's absolutely priceless. And yeah, I mean, it's hard because Mel Robbins talks about that. It's proximity is number one. But it's not just proximity because you know, people that are around your co workers, this person just had a baby, you're single, going out with your friends, or this person's a grandmother. And so you have to be at similar phases in your life and wanting the same thing like you said. And so that's what's so nice about the communities or the masterminds that are really aligned with your core values, your vision, your mission and the things that are important to you. And it's so important. And people, you know, spend a lot of money to have that connection. But that connection is what it's all about.

Yeah. And you know, and people say, well, why do you pay to have friends? It's like, it's not that like that at all is you have to, somebody has to put this thing together. And so if I can get access to that. And the only way to have a barrier of entry is you do have to pay to play sometimes. So for example, like I used to joke around, I'd never join a club that would take me as a member. And the joke is like, you just, I don't want to join the mastermind. That's 200 bucks a month or 100 bucks a month because I'm going to be around a bunch of people that can afford a mastermind. It's 100 bucks a month. And there's just as much as, like, where I'm at in life. We're just not going to be on the same. Like, the same things. Right. So I've paid. You know, I joined the 100 million mastermind. I came down here to do a podcast with Cody Sperber, and he's like, bro, you need to join this. And it was 100 grand, but I just sold that big, expensive house where I made my, you know, big commission. So I had the extra money, so I said, you know what? I'm gonna do it. And in that one event, I became very close friends with seven or eight guys that changed my whole life. You know, Pace Morby and Dan Fleischman, and I met Ed Milette through that, all these different guys that really have been able to help me just. Just help so many other people in my life. And so you do have to sometimes just take a chance on, you know what? I'm going to put myself in a new room. I'm going to put myself in a place where everyone there is going to inspire me somehow. And when you're around that many inspiring people, you can't help but be inspired.

Yeah, I'm in a genius. That's 100 grand, too. And it's the best group of people I've ever been around. You know, they're just amazing people.

Something to be said about somebody's willing to invest in themselves like that.

Yeah. Yeah. And then you really, like, take it seriously, and you really are out there to, like, help each other and get to know each other. And we were talking about it yesterday. We were in the Mastermind, and they're talking. Joe was talking about how you could say the same advice on a podcast for free, and someone listening to it isn't going to go implement it, but you charge them $50,000 in consulting, and they're going to go implement it, and it's going to change their life because they're invested and things like that. So it's so important to really have skin in the game in these things that you do, and that's how you actually get the most result out of it. And cheap things just aren't usually very valuable. Yeah. So. So relationships. I want to talk a little bit about relationships because you're. You've never been married?

I've never been married. No.

And no kids.

No kids.

Okay. And how old are you?

I'm 43.

43. Okay. So I'm almost 29, and I've never been married. No kids. I never. My parents had not. I wouldn't call the happy marriage, and my siblings and I weren't exactly close. So I think there is a lot of that trauma I probably carry with me. I think you mentioned it. It's like the chip on the shoulder and not feeling worthy or loved was served as a great advantage to becoming successful and to being driven and all those things. But it does hurt a lot in the relationship side of things. And I still, to this day, struggle immensely with relationships. And sometimes I think I have it figured out, and then I wake up one day and I'm like, I don't want to be with this person and I break up with them or whatever. So what does that journey look like for you? And why do you think so many driven and successful people struggle with relationships? And how can they work on that to actually, like, find love?

Yeah, so there's a couple things. One is the same skill set that makes you very successful in business usually screws you over in personal relationships. Like, if you try to apply those same tactics in which somebody like me did forever, then you're. It doesn't work. And there's a whole series of books and people smarter than me that can explain that. But that is basically one of the things. And so I think the first thing is understanding that. The second thing is, yeah, we all have either advantages or disadvantages from our youth that are going to make us more prone to stay or be in relationships. Right. And I think for some of us, until we really excavate that part of us that is hurting us in our personal relationships, we'll just keep sabotaging our relationships or breaking up. Wake up one day, like you said, and you're like, yeah, I'm not gonna be in this relationship. And so I think it's important to try to, like, learn that about ourselves. And then I just think, like, I went to a Tony Robbins event last year. It's his one event of the year. He does it every other year. It's again, it's like $80,000 for one week in Maui. And it's all about relationships. And one of the most important things I learned, and I didn't really understand this until then, and it's going to sound stupid that I didn't know this, but I just never realized that they're actually probably pretty hard to be in a good relationship. Like, you have to work really hard at it. And to me, it was always like, if I have to work this hard, it's not the right person. I'll just move on that's what I always used to think until that it's like I have my job right now. I believe it's my dream job. I've, I truly wake up every day and I can't believe this is what I get to do for work and that I get the rewards of it that I do. But it's the hardest thing I've ever done. And I think a great marriage or a great relationship is very similar where it's not great because there's no problems. It's not great because it's super easy. It's great because you just are fully committed to the thing and you're investing in it and you're putting all this time and effort and energy into it and because of that it becomes this great marriage. And Tony says, like when you're in the tunnel, he calls it, whether it's with your job or with a personal relationship. The problem is, is you just don't know when it's going to end. You don't know when you're going to get on the other side of it. So I think most of us, if we could see, oh, eventually I'm going to get to this place where this person where we just work like we don't really fight a whole lot anymore. We don't really have these differences that we have or you know, we've learned how to work with each other's differences. But when you're in it, it's just like, feels like this never ending thing. And if again, if you knew when it was going to end, you'd probably be fine with it. And so the key is to have faith about it and really just keep pushing through it. But I don't know that's, I've been, you know, I've, I've hired some of the top relationship experts on the planet. Stefano Safandos, Neil Strauss, Sadia Khan. I've had literally some of the smartest human. David Dieta is another one. I've hired the way the superior man. And there's just all these little things I just never knew and they're not teaching this stuff. And so that's part of the problem is nobody really knows how to have these great relationships I was seeing. So for me as I've started learning these things, I've started just seeing, oh, these are things that I'm not doing very well. These are things that I've, you know, in the past I've been worried about the wrong thing or I've been trying to validate myself through my relationship. And so I think it's just a learning as much as possible and then applying it when you get in the relationships and trying to, instead of trying to have a perfect relationship, like trying to see it as a really beautiful thing that you get to grow through. And I think that helps. That's what I'm currently doing.

So what do you think is the most challenging thing about being a man in today's society?

Men have been punished for doing the things that they should be rewarded for. And so it's very. So sometimes as a man, so for example, you know, a healthy man is very in touch with both his masculine and his feminine. He's able to self soothe, he's able to be a rock for the people in his life. But it's also been a problem for that man to be able to go and where does he get his support from? Who does he talk to? And in the past, these places didn't really exist very well. It's been very difficult for men to be able to open up and be vulnerable because you don't want to be vulnerable to your woman. Then you make her unsafe and you know, you can't just go spill everything onto her. That's why you need strong male relationships to help each other. And so I think the hardest thing for men is that I think that they've, you know, I read recently on Twitter this week, 45% of young men 18 to 25 have never asked a girl out in person. 45%. They're terrified because of the MeToo movement. Men are. You know, Chris Williamson said this on my podcast. He said men are being punished for the hierarchy or the, that used to be in existence with men. It's like it's never been better for women in the entire world than in 2025 in the United States of America. It's, they've never had more opportunity, more been more protected, been more safe. It doesn't mean it's perfect, but it's never been better if you compare it to any other time frame in any other civilization. But men are being treated, you know, sometimes and I think the pendulum swinging, hopefully it seems like it, but you know, think about that. Like, men are terrified to approach a woman in person. They don't want to look creepy. They don't want to end up on somebody's Instagram, like, look at this guy trying to hit on me. Whatever, all these different things. And granted there was like a lot of male behavior that needed to go away. That, like from the past that thankfully I think has been eradicated a lot of that. I shared one on my podcast the other day. This girl, have you seen this girl on Tick Tock that she's a cart girl and she just leaves her phone when these guys come to get their food from the cart. And they are appalling, like the things they say to her. The super attractive of cart girl. And so it's still, obviously you know, the misogyny is, and everything is, is out there. But I think that men again have been punished for a lot of things. And so these younger generation, it's almost like hasn't been okay to just be a man and they start feeling guilty, I think. Who was it recently? Oh, Eric Weinstein on a podcast recently talked about how his son, 17 years old, like all these young men are going to the right politically because the left has demonized them for just being men. Like it's made it wrong to be white, to be a man, to be straight, all these different things. And so they've really been sold this idea that like they're just hopeless and they're, they're wrong about just existing. And so, you know, with what's happened politically over the last 612 months, it's really shifted the pendulum back to this place that I think is, is more healthy now. And so hopefully that'll help men have more confidence to approach and to be self sufficient. Because what brings confidence in a man is trying stuff and failing and figuring out you're okay and working through things and then all of a sudden you solve a problem. Like when you get competence, that gives you confidence and you need the courage to just try the competence in the first place to try something. Be willing to fail, be willing to take action. One of the best things Ed ever said to me when he was coaching me is he said, jimmy, the only difference between the people are doing it and the people that aren't is people that are doing it. They're just not afraid to take action, not needing to know if it's going to work. And I think men in general have this fear of just going for it, whether it's approaching a girl or approaching a job or starting a business, whatever it might be. And so I think that's going to be a shift that hopefully keeps continuing. But I think that's what's been the most difficult thing for men.

And how do you evaluate if somebody is the right person for you?

Romantically?

Yeah. And wit. And, and what's that timeline like? Like what? You know what, what's your strategy there?

Well, you're asking the Wrong guy. But no, I. You know, I think there's a couple. One thing that's been cool is I have studied so much on relationships just because it was the piece of me that I couldn't figure out. Right. I haven't, you know, been able to get to. And so for me, I really have studied this a lot. And I don't think that there's a right way to do relationships. I think for most people, it's honestly putting yourself out there, finding somebody that has the same values as you. And. And then it's. And I know this sounds lame, but it really is, like. And then it's just committing to do it and see, like, be in the relationship and see. And be all in, and then you kind of know whether or not it's going to work. I know in my life, the relationships where I've had regret is when I maybe wasn't all in. In. And you're like, oh, maybe that would have worked. But the ones where I go all in, even if I make plenty of mistakes, you don't regret it because, you know, you gave everything. I think that's the same way with anything. So I think just. And that's a big problem with today's society is we. I had the founder of Tinder on my podcast. I've had, you know, the founder of MySpace, some of these big companies, and. And they kind of all say the same thing is like, all of them say that, like, they don't want their kids using these apps. Like, there's a real societal problem with the way that we were never supposed to have access to as many people as we do now. Right. Like, as to as many opportunities as we do now. And it does cause real problems in dating. And so I think having open, honest conversations early about what. What you expect out of each other, I think is really important.

Yeah. I think it's just so hard to trust in today's society. And. And then, especially if you have it all on paper, like you, it's. I get grass is greener syndrome because it's like, at this point in my life, it. It feels like I could have whatever I want, basically because I can. But at this point in my life, I think we all have a shelf life. Right. As you start to get older, your pool starts to drop. But if you're a successful, young, pretty, kind, nice, loyal, smart girl, you have a lot of options. And you also have men throwing themselves at you 24 hours a day, so it becomes really hard to. And same with men. Right. Men who are Successful and good looking and powerful. And I see it because I'm friends with all of them and I see the things that a lot of them do behind closed doors or who are in relationships or whatever. And it makes, it makes it very hard for me to trust both, you know, men because of what I see, but then also myself because of what I think. And so it's a. Yeah, I haven't mastered that quite yet either.

But it's tricky. I mean, dating, you know, it is, it's tricky nowadays. And I don't, I think ultimately that's why I say like, deciding is probably the most important piece and then whatever you can do to make your partner feel safe. And sometimes we suck at it in relationships, but like, I think the more we create an opportunity where we can openly say what we need, right? Like some relationships, they don't give a if you have a thousand guys on Instagram trying to blow up your DMs, but then other people, you know, they might, absolutely might be a deal breaker for them. And so it's just talking about different things or whatever that might look like and creating as much safety as you can. You know, I think I know from the guy's standpoint what I try to do in relationships now and you know, things I haven't been good at in the past is create safety and make sure they feel seen and understood. And, and so I'm always playing those things like, okay, what is going on here? And you know, I've. I literally just got back from Sayulito. I went to a three day event. I was a student at a mastermind down there two weeks ago. The whole thing is about how to like not be reactive when your woman's coming at you with heat and stuff. Because as men we suck at this stuff. It was like embodiment work is what it's called a lot of. And you like sit on the ocean and just kind of take it all in for hours on end and things like that. But being able to withstand that fire. And so it's just learning, you know, And I feel like I. If you feel like you suck at relationships, I would study David Dita, Tony Robbins and G.S. youngblood. Those are the three guys I think are the best at helping men understand it and really understand how to stand in your power, how to attract people to you, how to create safety for the feminine, how to build polarity in a relationship so that, you know. Because I think women, at their core, they want to just be with one man. And I think as long as you create that for them. I think men, I do think they can create that relationship. I have so many healthy relationships around me, family and friends. I have a lot of people that have built these beautiful relationships. And so like, I don't look at this and go, oh, that's not possible. I actually think it's very possible. I think it's. The default would be to have a great relationship. We all want it. That's the nice thing. Right. But it does take a lot of work to get there.

Yeah. Well, thank you. I know we are. Have to wrap up here, but. Yeah, and one more thing to note on that is I think the. For me, a lot of the relationships I was in, I was that person that kept going back to the familiar, toxic, controlling, you know, type of relationship. And then I started to do a lot of transformational work and personal development, introspective work like that. And then I was into a relationship that was for the first time, not that. And it was so free and so abundant and so independent and just like real unconditional type love. And I think the biggest thing, the key there was the honesty. Like, we were so honest with each other and we were so authentic. And we. We opened up all of our demons and all of our most shameful things and all of our. All like the, the devil and the angel on our shoulders and like the. The crazy, you know, horrible thoughts that we think or the horrible things that we had done or the weird desires that we had or like all these different things. And it was such a safe place to be able to take off that mask with your partner and to truly be free and authentic and. And be who you are. And. And I think, because that's where it really comes from is it's. It's not necessarily the act that hurts so bad that ends relationships. It's the betrayal. And once you break a promise or you lie or you deceive, then I don't think that that's something that you can really come back from because it's really hard to regain trust. So I think just honesty is the best you could possibly be and just be authentic. And if first you have to get honest with yourself, you have to take the mask off for yourself and learn to love yourself. Because it's going to be impossible to truly give or receive love from somebody if you can't give it or receive it from yourself first.

Yeah, no, I agree. 100. I know every regret I've had in relationships is when you break trust somehow. Right. And it's damn near impossible to get back fully. You can. I've seen it happen, but it's. It's a lot harder trail to go down than just not breaking it in first. The first place.

Yeah, but. Awesome. Last question. If you go back and give advice to your younger self, what would it be?

You know, the questions of one, that the only thing that I would go tell my. Because, by the way, I believe that life is just a complete, beautiful mess. And I want all of it. I want the good, I want the bad, I want all the. And I wouldn't change anything in my life. I really wouldn't. Because if I tried to make my life what it is today, I would have screwed it up. If I was purposely, you know, had this all planned to get here, it just got here by its own. And I needed all the mistakes. So I wouldn't say anything to my younger self because I wouldn't want to screw that up. But I will say that I would go back and tell my younger self to not sell any of my real estate. No, that's the one thing I would say. Because I sold a bunch of real estate. I didn't need to. And, you know, it's. I knew better and I sold it anyway. And so that's the one thing I'd say. But I wouldn't change anything. I really wouldn't. Like, I. The end result is just like, I've been able to have these within my program. I've had probably a couple dozen of these moments. It's just like you see a guy for the first time, like, open up and break down and feel loved in that space. Or I've had these moments where I just. Without going into details on all of them, but like. And I call them these little picture perfect moments. And so whenever I have one, I try to really take it in because what it helps me realize is no matter what I did in my past, all the. All the problems, all the errors I made, whatever, all of that was worth it because it got to me, this perfect moment today. And I've had so many of those now that, like, I know those would have never happened if I hadn't gone through this whole path that I did. And so I try to just pay attention to these moments in life where you're like, what a perfect freaking moment. It just makes you so grateful for everything that's happened to get you there.

Thank you.

Thank you.