EP137: Finding Balance and Expansion through Tapping | Alex Ortner

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Care about from a unique perspective. 100% ownership for each and every circumstance we face in life, day in and day out. Hi, welcome to the Radical Responsibility podcast. My name is Fleet Mall, your host and I'm really happy to share with you today a conversation I had with Alex Ortner, one of the preeminent teachers of tapping. Maybe you haven't heard of tapping, but it's a kind of neurological yogic form that combines principles from Chinese medicine and acupuncture and modern psychology to really enhance our well being and, and really optimize our life performance. And it's pretty world renowned now, the whole tapping world and, and he's one of the producers of the annual World Tapping Summit and with his brother Nick or and his wife is also a preeminent teacher of tapping. So we had a great conversation about what is tapping, the benefits of tapping, how to really let our bodies know that you know that we're safe and how to learn to self regulate and you know, kind of take ownership for managing our own neurophysiology in such a way that we're able to be our best selves and live our best lives. So give tapping is really pretty amazing. I've taken on a personal practice of tapping since meeting with Alex and learning learning about it. I've heard about it for years but once I met I said I'm going to check this out, try it and I've been doing it on a regular basis and find it really helps enhance my own well being and just feeling resourced on a daily basis. So check out this episode with Alex Ortner from the Tapping Solution.

Welcome Alex.

It is so good to be here. Thank you for having me here.

Oh, we're thrilled to have you. Alex is the Chief Marketing Officer of the Tapping Solution and we're going to be talking about tapping today. But first I want to tell people a little bit more about your background and then we'll jump right into the conversation. Sound good?

Sounds great.

Yeah, great.

So Alex Ortner is Chief Marketing Officer and co owner of the Tapping Solution. He's a motivational speaker, a marketing expert, entrepreneur and author. He has produced first of their kind online programs such as the Tapping World Summit, a free annual worldwide online event that has been attended by over 2.5 million people over the last 10 years and the recently released the Tapping Solution app which features easy to follow tapping meditations. Alex and Tapping Solution team have raised over 1 million for tapping. Related charities such as Project Light, which aids genocide survivors in Rwanda, the Veterans Stress Project supporting veterans with PTSD and the Tapping Solution foundation with he and his siblings started in 2012 to support their community of Newton, Connecticut after the tragic shootings at the Sandy Hook Elementary School. He is also the author of the children's book Gorilla Thumps and Bear Hugs A Tapping Solution Children's Story and speaks to teachers and students through his foundation on how to use tapping to create balance, relieve stress and get better results in the classroom. So again, welcome Alex. It's really great to have you on this summit and we've been wanting to explore tapping for a while and the best year of your life. And so obviously your work in your life is really focused in the area of health and well being and healing and, and for all kinds of folks as well. You know, where there is, you know, significant trauma, but also just as a general health and well being practice. So what drew you into that area to begin with?

I mean, for me, the really the beginning of the journey for me was really about personal growth. I mean, I was lucky enough to go to a Tony Robbins seminar when I was 20 years old. I remember people telling me I was so lucky at the time and I realized looking back 21 years ago how much that transformed my life. But really when it comes to health and wellbeing, I know you asked about that topic and that being the topic for this day, Our journey into tapping really began with my brother when he was looking for solutions for some skin challenges that he was having. He was having allergy issues with his skin, just couldn't find solutions and was looking for different solutions online and came across tapping. And at that time with tapping, there wasn't the science and research that there is now. There was just this technique that people kept talking about and passing along because you were using it and getting just amazing results with. And he started to get results with it as well with the health challenges that he was dealing with. And so he went into going, well, how can I take this technique that's just kind of on the Internet right now and bring it out to more people at that time decided to make a documentary film. He actually spent two years making a documentary film. This was 15 plus years ago right after the Secret came out. And I think there was a million documentary films that were being made at that time. Everybody was like, oh, we're going to copy the Secret and make the next big hit. Nobody ever did. But that's really how we started our journey into this World of tapping. And so for me it was really always a matter of how can I find or use any kind of technique that can help me to better my life, that can help me to have less stress and anxiety, that can help me to be more focused, that can help me to really just be more of my full self. Because what I realized when I was 20 years old, when I went to that Tony Robbins seminar was that I actually had choice over my life. And I realized that there were techniques and tools and strategies that I could use better how I felt about myself, to better my health, to better my life, my thinking, all areas of my life. And so I've been passionate along with my brother and sister for the last 15 years. I know you mentioned 10 years of tapping World Summit. I think my bio is outdated. We're about to do our 15th annual Tapping World Summit. We've had years of doing this and really it's just been a passion to help other people with this technique to be able to, to change and improve their lives.

Wow, that's wonderful. It's amazing. Well, we share that in common of having gone to Tony Robbins training at a pivotal point in our lives and it made a huge difference for me specifically in my health and well being. I really wanted to create a shift. I've been attracted to his work for a lot of things, but I was getting older, I knew if I didn't really focus on my health and well being, it was going to go downhill. And, and it did create a huge shift for me. And, and you know, you mentioned choice and that's really what this summit is all about, embracing choice and making positive, healthy choices in all our lives. So we can really, you know, access the best version of ourselves and create the best life, whatever that is for each and every one of us. And it sounds like tapping could be a really great practice for dealing with stress and anxiety, for increasing overall health. I know it can work with even, you know, deep trauma and PTSD and so forth. But could you tell us just a little bit about what is tapping exactly? I mean, we hear tapping, you think of tapping. I know it has something to do with certain kind of acupressure points, but yeah, why don't you tell us about it?

So, so tapping is based on, it's a combination of ancient Chinese acupressure, so pressure on different parts of the body and modern psychology. And it was something that was developed, first developed in the late 70s. Now I like to say it was developed in the late 70s. It's really more of A rediscovery, because when we're basing things on ancient Chinese acupressure, it really means it was around for a very long time. But what happened in the late 70s, there was a psychologist who was working, Roger Callahan, with a client who he really struggled with for a few years. He had a big water phobia, phobia, and she couldn't get through and he wasn't making progress. And he'd been reading about all this Chinese acupressure and all the points. And when he was working with her, she said, well, my stomach is really bothering me. And he remembered that the under the eye point had to do with the stomach. And so he had her tapping there. And then all of a sudden what she was feeling in her stomach was gone and that phobia that she had of water was gone. And he said, wait, there's something to this. And that's really where tapping came from. But really what we're doing with tapping. So as we said, tapping is literally tapping on different meridian points of the body. And there's a process, it's that procedure to it that we go through, through that process and really what we're doing when we're tapping, and I like to joke around that when my brother first came across tapping or learned about it from other people, that I was the first skeptic, right? Like most people, I said, what, are you kidding me? I'm going to tap on my face now and that's going to make a difference in my life. And of course, I was, you know, the younger brother going, what is my crazy brother doing? And then realize and start to see the results not only in other people's lives. And then I started to use it myself and said, hey, there's something really to this. But essentially what we're doing when we tap on these specific meridian points of the body is we're sending a calming signal to the amygdala of the brain. And I'm sure a lot of people know about this already, but it's worth repeating that whenever we are stressed or anxious or something comes up that is triggering us in some way, the amygdala in our brain is being triggered. And that's that fight or flight response center of the brain. And it's really what's challenging about that is it takes away our ability to access our prefrontal cortexes, which is where we make good decisions, which is where we can have forward thought of going, oh, you know what, I shouldn't eat this food, because this isn't Going to be good for my health. Or it's where we stop ourselves from saying something to another person that we shouldn't say because we're overly emotional. And what happens is when we actually tap on these meridian points of our body, what the research shows is it sends a calming signal to that amygdala in the brain, and it lets it know that it is safe and that it can relax. And that allows us to access the prefrontal cortex of our brain, to allow ourselves to be the full expression of who we are, to not be stuck.

In stress and anxiety and anger and overwhelm and all these different emotions. And so I think that's really the power of what this technique is. And what it does is it gives us power over what we often feel like we don't have power over so often in our lives today, when we're in these states of just complete overwhelm and anxiety because of an overload of information in our lives, we open up our phones and there's the news, there's social media, there's all this stuff going on at work. We really never get. Get to disconnect. And so we are in these constant states of stress and overwhelm. And what tapping allows us to do is to really take our power back and to say, hey, let me use this technique even for a minute, 3 minutes, 5 minutes, 10 minutes, and allow my body to know that it's safe, that it can relax so that I can once again go back to being myself and feeling safe. And so that's really what the tapping is doing. It's allowing us to calm our body and calm that part of our brain that feels like something is dangerous and unsafe.

Wow. And.

And so you mentioned, like, doing it for a minute, several minutes, 10 minutes. That was kind of my next question. So is this something like anytime you're kind of feeling anxious or over upregulated or you're getting triggered by something on the news, you could just start doing it to calm yourself? Or is this something you would do as a consistent practice where you do it long sessions? And what does it take? How much time does it take to really have the impact? And I think we'll go in there to consistency, but just the immediate time for the impact?

Yeah, well, like anything, it really depends on what challenges you're dealing with. As you kind of mentioned, tapping is very effective with trauma. There's lots of studies that show how effective it is with ptsd. And of course, if you're dealing with deeper challenges, then you're Going to want to spend more work. Those are the places where you might, you likely want to work with a professional to be able to get help. But I think you can get results literally in a minute. I'll give you an example. You know, over the last few months, we've really been doing a lot of reels on social media. What's happening? And the thing about reels is they force you to do them in 60 seconds. Right. And so you're forced to do it in that small amount of space. And it's been amazing to me to see the comments that people leave about how just 60 seconds of tapping could allow them to create a shift. Because even just the process of stopping and acknowledging what we're feeling and noticing what we're feeling and allowing that to process allows us to move forward in releasing and feeling better. So, you know, it's definitely a tool to have in your tool bag for when you want to.

When you're feeling stressed or anxious to be able to release things. But I also believe that creating consistency, like any practice, do you have a meditation practice, you have an exercise practice, anything, whenever you can create consistency is when you're going to get better results.

Yeah.

I can understand your brother's skeptic or your skepticism early on when your brother got into it, because it almost sounds too easy. Right. And, and, and I'm curious about, you know, you're, I'm sure you're familiar with Stephen Porges work, polyvagal theory. We've had him on lots of our summits and he talks about trauma as our, our nervous system, our neurophysiology kind of gets stuck. It gets stuck on, it gets stuck off. And, and therefore we're stuck in kind of continually reliving old patterns and stuff. And so I'm wondering if, if this tapping on these meridians and acupressure points is one way to kind of unblock or release or get things flowing again.

Yeah, absolutely. And I think when we first started helping people with tapping and teaching about tapping almost 15 years ago or about 15 years ago, we were really talking more about the energy system in the body, the meridians in the body, and how we are clearing stuck energy in our body. We can have stuck memories in our body, lots of different things in our body. Now I think as we've worked to modernize it and make it more mainstream, we've moved to talking more about brain science because not because we don't we know what it's doing in our energetic system and in our body, but we Also knew that we wanted to try to work with the skeptics, the people who wanted to know the research, who didn't care about the results. They said, well, show me the proof, tell me what's doing in the brain. And so we've talked more about the brain research, but yes, absolutely, what it is doing is causing a major shift in the energetic system of the body and how we're moving and clearing energy in the body. And so I think it's important, like anything to look at the mind and the body and how it's affecting both, because obviously we're never just affecting one or the other, we're affecting both and how they work together.

And so. Well, has it been what, what kind of research has been, has been done on tapping? Have there been like clinical trials and so forth?

Yeah, lots of clinical trials. I mean, you know, I'm not the science and research guy. There's, there's people with letters after their names that I don't have the PhDs and all that that do the research. But we really are pass about supporting them and funding some of those studies. And there are research. I'll give you one example of one research study when we talk about stress and anxiety, which has to do with cortisol. So cortisol, as many people know, is a stress hormone in the body. It's related to weight gain, it's related to lots of different things. And so in this particular study, they actually measured three groups of people where they measured their cortisol levels and then split them into those three groups. And one group actually just read magazines. The other group did nothing or no. So I should say, I think they did talk therapy, I should say. And then the third group did tapping. Now what was amazing was the results. The group that actually read magazines, their cortisol levels went up by 2%, which kind of made me laugh because I'm sure the magazines were stressful, there was news in there. And I can only imagine what it's like when people actually go and open up a phone, smartphone and actually read the news or go on social media and how much their stress levels goes up. But the group that did the talk therapy, their cortisol levels went down by 19%. The group that did the tapping, their cortisol levels went down by 43% in that same time period. So it shows that it was an almost double in terms of the rate of how cortisol went down in the body, which is a very physical.

Showing of how tapping is affecting stress in the body. Because as we do the tapping and we lower cortisol levels in the body. We're reducing stress and allowing our body to balance out again. And that's just one study. There's lots of different studies on the brain. There's brain imaging studies that show how tapping affects with food cravings. Where you see somebody, they do brain scans when they're looking at particular foods where they have food cravings and you see the parts of the brain lighting up and then they do tapping. I forget what the amount of time is for. And they go back into the machines and they do the brain scans and they show them that food again. And the brain doesn't light up in the same way, so it's not having that same food craving that it had before. So there's lots and lots of different research studies in lots of different areas that are just so powerful in showing how tapping is actually affecting the brain, the body, our hormones, all the different levels in our body to allow us to create balance.

Yeah, that's fascinating. With everything we're learning, I mean, we're learning so much about the brain more all the time, and of course also learning what we don't know yet. But a lot of people are talking about a lot of these practices like tapping, breath work, meditation and other modalities. We're literally rewiring our brains. Right. And you know, we've often kind of talked about, you know, psychology and trying to understand behavior and habitual patterns and so forth. What, what I think more and more people realize today that all of our habits are represented by actual neural pathways in the brain and we can change those.

Right.

And, and so there's research demonstrating that tapping actually does rewire the brain ultimately.

Yeah. And this for me is where I feel like when we're talking about the best year of your life summit, whenever I think about going, ok, listening to this, in January, that time of the year when people are going, I want to change my life. For me, creating change in my life is really about consistency. I look at that with any area of your life. If you want to create a better life for yourself, you have to create more consistency in there. If you want to lose weight, you have to more consistently exercise and more consistently choose to eat better foods rather than poor quality foods. If you want to grow a business or improve your career, you want to more consistently do the things that move you in the direction of you want to go. And so really for me, tapping is a technique that allows you to create more consistency in your life because it allows you to actually do More of the things that you want to do in your life. When I look at consistency, there's a couple of things I know as we're looking at this in January and going, well, how do I actually make these resolutions and actually stick to them? For starters, I'd say, and this is a really important mindset shift for a lot of people is that so many people create resolutions at the beginning of the year. And really resolutions are meant to be an all the time practice to have. I personally look at what I want to create every single day. I do reviews every week, I do daily reviews, you know, I do monthly reviews. And so this idea of only looking at what we want to create as a once a year thing is something that doesn't create consistency in our lives. And so when we can actually look at what we want to create in our lives and create that clarity, and clarity is really so, so important to actually figure out what we want and then actually take action on those things. And again, this is where tapping can be so powerful in that we all have challenges in terms of what keeps us from taking action, right? Somebody wants to start a business, but they don't. Somebody wants to ask somebody out, but they don't. Somebody wants to go to the gym and start exercising, but they don't. And so it is our internal emotions, it's our limiting beliefs, it's what we believe about the world, ourselves. So many different things that keep us from actually taking action and moving forward in our lives. And when we use a technique like tapping to shift our energy in our body, to shift our brain, to shift our neural pathways, it allows us to take action also. Another thing I would say is once we become clear on the things we want to create in our lives and actually take action, the biggest challenge that most people have is that they feel like once they fail on those New Year's resolutions, that they're done, they failed. It's over with, really. When I look at every I've had the opportunity to work with incredibly successful people. I'm lucky. In our Tapping Solution app that Tony Robbins is our business partner. In app I've gotten to work with incredibly successful people. And it's not that they have incredible.

Focus on getting things done all the time. It's that they move past those failures and work to get back on track. It's that when they fall off course, they get back on track. I think that is such a key thing to focus on when you're thinking about your goals for 2023 and what you're going to create is to go, okay, I'm going to get knocked off track. What do I do to get back on track? What am I going to do when all of a sudden I'm really stressed and anxious and overwhelmed and I want. What am I going to do when I'm stressed and want to go for the food and start eating that junk food and don't want to take. You don't want to exercise again? Or when I feel like I've failed in my business and I don't want to do the next thing. What are you going to do to get back on track? And I think that is something that so many people miss is understanding that when you learn to regulate your emotional system, when you learn, have tools and strategies to actually work past your limiting beliefs, you can work to get back on track. It really is about going, okay, how do I figure out what I want to do? And then how do I get myself to more consistently work towards that thing? Right? More consistently. Because life is going to do everything it possibly can to knock you off track. But if you go, this is the thing I want, and then you make sure to focus on it every day and you take some action and you get knocked off track and this happens that. But you go, okay, no, wait, okay, let me do something to release this and get back on track and focus on it. And that is really, for me, the key to creating the life that we want to. Having the best year of your life at any point is to go, how can you get yourself with all the tools and techniques and strategies that you learn in this summit? How can you get yourself to more consistently do the things that move your life in the direction that you want? Not all the time. You're going to get knocked off. You're going to have periods where you go, a week, two weeks, and feeling totally off track, go. A month of getting off track, you go, okay, oh, I just realized I'm off track. What do I do to get myself back on track? Because just like it would be with exercise, you know, somebody goes, well, I don't know how to lose weight. I don't know what to do. And I go, well, have you tried exercising for 30 straight days? Have you created that level of consistency? Or have you tried having a salad or a smoothie or lowering the junk food for 30 days in a row? Well, no, sometimes it's a little bit of an oversimplification, but it really is about going, how can we create more consistency in our lives to create the life that we want? I think A tool like tapping allows us to have the emotional regulation so that we can stay focused and stay on track in the direction that we wanted it. We're ongoing.

Wow, Alex, you shared so much there and so important and you really covered the whole breadth of our ten day summer right there. And we should bring you back on day 10, which is all about how to create the plan to make all this.

And I can tell you when I, when it comes to this topic, I really am just so passionate and you're right, maybe I jumped into other areas but. But no, no, it's great.

It's really great.

Yeah.

And, and you know we actually, this summit was born out of the really reflections on the, on the research around how New Year's resolutions don't work for the vast majority of people. Like maybe 5% of people actually make them work in.

We think we understood some of the reasons that one, there's that lack of consistency. We think often we make these resolutions out of a sense of lack instead of connecting with our internal worth and innate goodness. Then we don't understand the science of habit change. We don't have the practices to create the consistency. And so many of us, when we're trying to make changes in our lives, we experience that one step forward, two steps back or two steps forward, one step back and see sawing back and forth like that. So how is it, and I get. If we can take our, our emotional life and our psychological life and have it instead of spiking all the time, if it can be a little more of an even ride and we know things like breath work and mindfulness, the research shows they create more emotional balance. So you're getting more of a. It's not like we're repressing our emotions. They're an important part of our life. But we get that balance. And I think that's what you're pointing to, that that could help you stay more on track and tapping, tapping could be part of that. So I know know tapping is also known as eft, emotional freedom technique. And you've talked about it being kind of an integration of acupressure and psychology. So could you talk about our emotional life and tapping and how they can help us kind of maybe get more a leadership position with ourselves and our own emotional life.

Yeah. And there, you know, I love that you give the example of just the waves of how we go up and down with our emotions. And there. So there's two things when I think about when it comes to, to create emotional balance. It's number One, how do you make those lows and highs, not those lows, especially not peak so low. Right. Of course we want the highs to go higher, want to be happier, want to be more fulfilled. But how do you get those lows to not be so low? And the other thing is, how do you get those lows to not last so long? When we talk about consistency, we go, okay, well, how do I make it that when I go down and I get knocked off track or I'm sad or upset or depressed, whatever the case may be, how do I get that to be a one day thing rather than a three day thing, how do I get it to be that, oh, when I get knocked off track and I don't exercise that, it's a one day thing, not a two month thing. Right? So it's those ups and downs that we want to create emotional balance with and what tapping allows us to do when we tap and we lower the emotional intensity that we're feeling in these emotions and we lower the triggers, it allows ourselves to, number one, get out of those lows quicker and for those lows to not be as long. I like to actually remember one of the first times that I actually tapped and I think I finally tapped, I mentioned how I was resentful, to be honest, about with my brother, about how at that time he had left a real estate investing business. I had a business with my brother and my father. We'd been doing it for five years. This is 2007, when the market crashed and he got out first. And I was like, I'm stuck in this because you can't just sell a house quickly and get rid of it. I'm stuck in this. I was really resentful that he was able to leave. And when I was measuring, we always measure and I'll go through the actual tapping process in a few on a scale of 0 to 10. And I said, well, 10 being how number 10? Super resentful. And I was like, 20. I was like, no, no, there's no scale. I'm so upset, I'm so resentful that I'm there because I've been building up this resentment for so long. I'd been living in, holding it for so long because I was resentful that he had left to go do something initially to go into tapping and learn about these things. And so I was resentful about it. And so what I was able to do is with the tapping to release that emotional charge that I had in my body, to not feel that level of resistance Resentment. And that's when I first knew. I was like, okay, all right. My brother was right about this tapping thing. You know, it is working. I'm not so resentful. And there are certain emotions now in my life when somebody goes, you know, do you get anger? No, it's just not an emotion that I ever experience. I might be frustrated. I think that's an emotion that I then it's easy to experience when you're, you know, I got three kids, you know, nine, 11 and 13. I think it's easy to be frustrated. But I don't go into anger. I don't go into certain emotions because I've just removed them from my emotional vibration and how I feel. And so what we can do with the tab is, especially when we start to just work on those strong emotions. I know for somebody, if you regularly feel anger at high levels, overwhelm at high levels, stress at high levels, that you can go, how do you expect me to not be angry about this? How do you expect me to not be so overwhelmed? Well, that's what your body, your brain has been used to living. It's what you're used to, and it's what could get triggered easily. But when you use the tapping, you can actually have experiences. For example, let's say you get angry at your husband. Husband. Or your wife, your spouse because of little things that they do, you can actually have those same things happen without the emotional trigger happening when you do the tapping. And you rewire your brain, your body, your neural pathways to not create that same emotional experience from that action. Because you can have two different people have the same exact experience and one person get really angry about it, and one person not get angry about it. So there's our emotional system. And then the meaning. We get to those events and what tapping allows us to do is to no longer be so triggered emotionally by certain things that happen in our life that we get triggered by.

Wow.

Well, let's get to where the rubber meets the road here, Alex. So you talked about. You gave a great example. You know, you were kind of really resentful. You were. You were pretty upset. Yeah, I was. You were pretty stuck in that.

Yes.

How much tapping did you have to do to release that? How long did it take you to shift that? How much practice? How many days, weeks? Months?

Well, well.

So here's the beautiful thing about tapping. There can be one minute miracles, one minute wonders. Right. And. And I think what I would happen to me in that moment with the resentment was absolutely a one minute wonder. Where I shouldn't say one minute, I probably spent 20 minutes, 30 minutes tapping on the resentment that I was feeling, going through and really expressing what I was feeling. And I'll show people how to do that as we get into the tapping. And that allowed me to do it in that 20 or 30 minute period. As I mentioned, if you're working on childhood trauma and experiences you have where you've had chronic PTSD from childhood events, there are going to be layers that you work, work on, right? And so often when we are tapping, we're working on different layers of what we're feeling. And you know, we can, we can release one thing and then something else comes up, or we release one event that happened and we remember other events that happened. And so there can be layers to it. And that's really where it is about consistency and releasing things. And also one of the beautiful things we do with tapping is actually tap in positive emotions. Right? Anytime we want to release something, this is important for habits. When you're changing a particular habit you have, you want to replace it with a better habit. And so we, we can take negative emotions that we feel and go, okay, well, how can I tap in more positivity, how can I tap in more gratitude, how can I tap in more joy and actually bring those things in? Now we have to do that at a certain level. We can't just go, if you're at a level nine of anger, and I go, you know, tell me that you're really happy. And we go through the, through the points. You'd go, I'm not happy, I'm angry. Allow me to be angry. I don't want to be happy. But when we can get anger from a level to a 9, to a 8, to all of a sudden to a 5, to a 4, all of a sudden your brain starts to think differently and go, well, maybe I could look at this differently or maybe I could be happy. I guess I could, could allow some joy. And so I think it's important to understand the emotional spectrum of where we are, that when you, somebody's angry at a level 10, you just go, oh, calm down. You go, no, you can't just go calm down and go be happy from that spectrum. And so really it's about how can you move on that spectrum to a different place? Because if you're living your life at a level seven of anger or frustration or stress and a level five, that's life changing, you might go, well, you're still at a level five. Yeah, but that's Way different than being at a level seven when you can just create a gradual shift in the emotional level you're living on. You're able to access different parts of your brain, you're able to make better decisions in your life that allow you to live a better life. So it's not about clearing everything. It's about going, how can I make a shift to a place where I feel less of those really strong emotions, with less intensity density, and allow more joy and happiness and gratitude into my life?

Well, you mentioned the positive states just there, and I was about to ask that question because I was curious. I mean, I can see how tapping, you know, is, is calming the amygdala. So it's helping you release the fight or flight response and helping us, you know, and, and I, I can see over time with a practice consistency and working, you could you bring some of those emotional patternings that are really hijacking us and, and bring those more, more into balance. But I was curious if it could also be used for kind of imprinting positive states.

Or even when we're trying to develop new habits, when we have that day, when it's a good day, when we did the run, we did the exercise and we feel good about it, can we use tapping to kind of imprint that and reinforce these new behavior patterns and the way we feel about them in the brain?

Yeah. So one of the things I talk about with consistency with habits is I use tapping on a daily basis, and it's something that I do every single morning. And there's two questions that I ask myself every morning. Number one, one, what am I feeling? How often do people stop to recognize what they're feeling in a day? And for all of us, whether you're parents like me or you have those morning stressors and you come into your day and you just go into your day rather than stopping to acknowledge what you're feeling. So I always stop to go, what am I feeling? And a lot of times I'm not feeling something bad. I might be like, oh, I feel great. So now I'm just going to do some positive tapping to just kind of reinforce and choose the emotions that I want to bring into my day. And sometimes I want different emotions, right? So let's say I was going to come do a summit interview like this. I want to go, oh, you know what? Maybe today I want to make sure I'm confident and that I'm present and so I can do that in the morning and tap those emotions in. Right. Or another day it might be Just that I want to feel joy, right? Or I want to feel. I'm going to be. I'm going to be hanging out with my kids. I want to feel joy so I can choose those emotions. I also in the morning ask myself, is there, Am I worried about what other people are going to say or think about me? And there's a particular question that I have in my planner, my time choose planner. So I can't remember exactly, but I read it every day. And am I worried about what somebody else is going to think or say about me or what I believe about myself? Because I believe that we hold ourselves back because of what we believe about ourselves or also what we believe other people think or believe or say about us. And so when we can acknowledge those beliefs about ourselves in the morning and go, okay, no, I realized today I'm worried about doing. If you're a coach, I'm worried about doing a post on social media because I feel like I have imposter syndrome and people are going to judge me. And you can acknowledge those things and release those things and go, you know, what's a new belief that I want to choose instead? Right? And again, that's something I write down every single day. I choose a belief that I want to have about myself to say. I could say something like, I'm working every day to help people to become the best versions of themselves, right? And it's something that I do and I go through the points and I go, I'm working every day to help people become the best versions of themselves. I'm allowing the work to come through me as a vehicle to help other people. So whatever that positive belief belief is you want to have by yourself, you can do that in the morning. So every morning I choose what's the positive emotion I want to have for myself that day, and what's the belief I want to have for my day by doing that in the morning, it allows me to start my day from an empowered place. Because as I said, if you come into your day with frustration or anger at a level seven or eight, you're not going to make the best decisions. You're not going to be present. I know we've all had days where we work eight hours, and at the end of the day, we feel like we got nothing done. We have days where we work three hours and we move mountains. And a lot of it has to do with the emotions we were bringing into that day and how we were showing up. And so if you can stop for five or 10 minutes in the morning and have a practice of tapping that allows you to lower those negative emotions, bring up the positive emotions, lower those negative beliefs you have about ourselves, of I'm not enough and what are people going to think about me? And people think I'm a fraud and choose beliefs we want to have about ourselves and tap those in. We get to allow ourselves to move into being the best version of ourselves. And sometimes. One thing I'll say about positive beliefs is sometimes people have a tough time saying a positive belief. Believe like, I am a great person, okay? If you don't believe that about yourself. What I like to do is do things like, I am becoming a better and better person every day of how we're becoming something that allows us to integrate that more fully and go, I am becoming a better speaker every day. I'm becoming a better writer every day. I'm getting smarter and smarter every day. If you don't believe you're smart, if you don't believe you're intelligent, just say, I am getting smarter, smarter every day. Every day. It allows us to have positive beliefs about ourselves that are, that feel congruent with ourselves, that allow us to move ourselves forward in a positive direction.

Wow, it's.

I mean, again, this almost sounds too good to be true. It sounds like you're handing us a simple key to our own physiology and nervous system and emotional life and brain and so forth. But I got, you know, I, I gotta, you know, I gotta take it at face value here. The research is there and I know it's, it's a worldwide movement, so. And it does integrate with a lot of other, other modalities. And, you know, I, I do a lot of work with prisoners and with incarcerated, our fellow incarcerated citizens, as well as with correctional officer, probation police officer, police first respond. And I can imagine this could be, you know, I'm going to look to figure out how to bring this into our work. It sounds really fascinating. I know you mentioned you got three kids and I know you all bring, bring this to children. And so I wonder if you guys. I know we have a lot of parents in our audience. I just want you to briefly mention the utility of this with kids.

Kids.

Yeah. And before I forget, you mentioned prisoners. And we actually have done work with prisoners. We have somebody in the northeast, I think it was state there, and that's done a lot of work with prisoners in tapping. And so we should definitely connect with that because I would love to do whatever we can, especially with our app, which is so accessible for people in prison to Be able to get them what they need to be able to help themselves. Right. This is such a self accessible tool they can use. So when it comes to kids, the powerful thing about kids is that unlike with adults, we don't have to do as much convincing on why does this work and what is a research. Kids are so malleable and listen to the things that you tell them and they try it out. And with kids I have a really fun. If you read my kids book, I like to introduce it to kids with animal points rather than just being the eyebrow point and the side of the eye and the under the eye they have animal point names. So it's like the lion cry point and the dragonfire point and the wolf's chin point where they go O and they howl and they love it. And so we introduced tapping with kids in a really fun and effective way way. And now the powerful thing about with kids is that they are so in tune with their emo, they're so able to feel their emotions and allow them to flow. Unlike so many of us adults who can stop and go or especially if you've held back your emotions for years and not allowed them to process that, it can be difficult to actually express those emotions. Kids are really great at. That's what they do, great. They cry when they want to cry, they laugh when they want to laugh, they're too loud when they want to, when they want to be. It's a great thing that allows them to process those emotions more easily. Now with kids, depending on the age, I think that's where a lot of times positive tapping can be more effective in helping them to ingrain positive beliefs about themselves. I think it'd be good to release some certain things negatively for short periods of time. But as you know, with a kid, if you tell a kid to focus on something negative, sometimes it can come out and be overly. It can be too much. If you're talking about a kid who feel like somebody was being mean at school and you start tapping with them, be like, even though so and so was so mean to me at school, they can kind of break down even more. And so it can be good to do that for short periods of time. But what I find really effective with kids is how we do the positive tapping so they can tap in positive emotions and positive beliefs and positive things into their life because they're able to take that in so well. And you know, I think we forget as adults that the language that we express to kids becomes their internal beliefs. Our beliefs that we tell Them become their internal beliefs. And so the more we can use a technique like tapping where they are actually saying positive beliefs and saying positive things to themselves and saying, I am enough and I'm a good kid and I'm likable and those kinds of things that then becomes their internal language. And so that's where I really find tapping to be so powerful. I know there's a lot of schools that use it at the beginning of the day in the classroom to really get kids centered and focused. And so it really is a powerful tool for kids to use on a regular basis.

Wow, I can imagine.

So also a lot of people on our summer, a lot of our wonderful audience are mindfulness meditation practitioners, yoga practitioners, doing various kinds of breath work. And I'm wondering if people have been kind of integrating tapping into these other kind of health and well being disciplines.

Yeah, absolutely. There's so many different.

Techniques that you can use. I mean, for example, we combine tapping and meditation. We started combining it years ago together because it's really nice to tap with meditative music. Our app is all tapping meditation. So it's a combination of tapping and meditation. But I really believe in using any and all of the techniques that you can to create balance for yourself. Right. I'm somebody who loves to exercise. I grew up a soccer player as an athlete and I love to play soccer and I love to run. And there's things like, oh, you know what? I need more yoga in my life for more flexibility.

You need to integrate these different practices into your life to create balance. And sometimes that goes in ebbs and, and flows in terms of finding the thing that you need in a particular moment to help you create balance. I think that's what's so amazing about an event like you have here. And so many people like to combine different modalities and techniques that you can use in your life to help you create balance based on what you need in a particular moment.

And so what's great, it sounds like tapping could really help us be more consistent with those other disciplines as well.

Absolutely. I think because it helps us to regulate our emotional system, our emotions, and regulate our nervous system. Right. To feel more regular. And so it can help so many things like that. I know, for example, a lot of people struggle with meditation sometimes because they struggle to be still or to, or to get into that practice. So sometimes tapping before you do meditation can be really helpful because tapping is something that's more active. You're moving your body more. So if you're struggling to be still, it can help you to calm down and then you can go into meditation. So it's really nice to combine some of these practices together.

That makes a lot of sense. So in a moment, if you would, I'd like to invite you, Alex, to lead us through some tapping. But just before that, is there kind of a pathway to tapping or is there a, you know, like if somebody starts off with a tapping practice and they go, you know, is there some kind of like a path that people take with tapping?

I mean, there's certainly different things you can do. I wouldn't say there's a pathway. I mean, there are different strategies you can use to get into it. I would always say, you know, just start with what you're feeling most right now. I think stress and anxiety is always a really easy place to start because we all feel it so consistently in our lives. And stress and anxiety is not something that's going to go away, but really it's about how do we regulate our nervous system and allow ourselves to calm. I remember.

One of my favorite doctors, Dr. Mark Hyman, who's a friend of ours, wrote the forward to one of our books and he talked about there are three things you need for health. It's what you put in your body, it's exercise, and it's how you regulate your nervous system. I think that tapping, especially in this modern age, is something that's so important to do to regulate our nervous system so that we can have those down moments where we actually allow ourselves to relax. Relax and go into a parasympathetic nervous system response and not be stressed out, to rebalance. And so that's the place where I always like to start, is to go, hey, you know what? Just notice what you're feeling and tap on that and just acknowledge what you're feeling. As I said, when we do the tapping process, I think everyone will see what I mean by that, because we're not only tapping, but we're saying certain things as we do the tapping that allow us to connect to the emotions that we're feeling so we can express them in, release them, and allow them to move through us.

No, absolutely.

And you're absolutely right, the external stressors aren't going anyway anytime soon. You know, we've been through this pandemic, we got climate change, we got so much going on in the world, as well as whatever just happens ongoingly in our individual lives. And, you know, it's one of the messages of this summit. If we don't take ownership for regulating our own nervous system, it's being regulated by everybody but us, and that's often not a good way to live. Right.

So.

So any tools that can give us access, how to regulate our own nervous system is just, you know, it just changes everything.

It really is about how we can change our nervous system response so that regardless of what's going on in the exterior world, that we can still stay as calm as possible. We still want that stress response. You know, when. When there's a car coming at you and you're in the walkway and you got to jump out of the way, you want that amygdala to fire because it's going to react quickly. But for most of the things in our lives, with the news, social media, with what's going on at work, when somebody's upset with the kids, as much as we can calm our nervous system so we can deal with those exterior stresses and not be as stressed, that allows us to show up in bigger and better ways all the time. It's what allows us to create consistency with our exercise, with our businesses, with our jobs, with our relationships, with our kids in a way where we're not being overwhelmed by that external stimulus. Because, as you said, it's not going away anytime soon.

Yeah, wonderful.

Well, why don't you lead us in some tapping? Let's. Let's learn.

I would love to do that. I would love to do that. So. So as I go through this, I'll actually teach the tapping process as well. So I think the first thing we can all do is kind of sit up straight in our chairs. You know, put our feet down on the ground. If you are, you know, listening or sitting while you do this, if you're in the car or something like that, maybe you can still do the tapping in the car. But just don't close your eyes while we do this.

At any point, Tony Robbins would say, pull over.

Pull over. Exactly. He would absolutely say so. I see you've heard all those audios over the years. I think we're all wired to hear Tony's voice while we're in the car.

So just go ahead again. Let's go all together. Take a deep breath in. Together.

And breathe out and just notice what you're feeling in your body. Tapping is really effective with physical pain because so often we hold stress and anxiety in our body. So just notice if there's any tension in your body. How do your shoulders feel? How does your back feel? How does your stomach feel? And notice what your breathing is like. Is your breathing shallow or is it deep? Are you having deep belly breaths? Or is it shallow where you start to breathe in and you got to let it out? So just notice what your breathing is like. And what we're going to do is we want to tune into a particular emotion to begin with. So we'll start with stress, anxiety. Just notice what in your life right now is causing you stress or anxiety, whatever that might be. We don't need to judge it. Is it something at work? Are you feeling overwhelmed about all the things you have on your plate? Do you have stress in your relationship right now? Is it your kids? Are you stressed about your health? Or is there somebody in your life that you're stressed about, A parent who might not be well? What is it in your life that's causing you stress right now? And just notice that in your body. What we're going to do, what we always do when we start doing the tapping, is we measure on a scale of 0 to 10, where 10 is that it's absolutely super, super high. If I was talking about stress or anxiety or anxiety, I might say you're having an anxiety attack. At a level 10, zero is you get nothing. You're calm, you're Zen. There's no anxiety there at all. It might not be Zen, but you don't have any an. And just what is your gut instinct of what is the level of that from 0 to 10? 10 is really high and 0 is low. And we do this because we want to actually be able to see the results of how we're moving this emotion in our body. So everybody listening. If you have that in your mind, you can just say that to yourself or just write it down on a piece of paper. So what we're going to do now is start doing the tapping. We always start with the tapping on the side of the hand. What's often known as the karate chop point. With kids, I love to call it the karate chop point because they love. They picture doing a karate chop on. On a piece of wood. And we always start here. We start with what we call the setup statement. And the way the setup statement goes is you go even though. And you express what you're feeling. So even though I'm feeling all this anxiety. And then the rest of the statement would be, originally it was, I love and accept myself. Anyway, that was the original statement with tapping. Now, the challenge with that at times is not everyone feels comfortable saying that they love and accept themselves based on their own personal beliefs about themselves. So sometimes we can change up that language. I always love to change up that Language. Language initially, to maybe just say, even though I'm feeling all this anxiety, I accept what I'm feeling, or something along that line. So we'll start there, tap on the karate chat point. And so I'll say the statement, and everyone listening can go ahead and repeat after me as we do this. Again, tuning into what you're feeling right now.

Can I ask a quick question there?

Yep, go ahead.

So is it helpful to vocalize? I mean, to speak in silently yourself, or is it actually helpful to vocalize out loud when you're doing it?

So here's the beauty of tapping. You can do it without vocalizing it if you're struggling with it. But like anything, when we vocalize it, we allow it to release more even. I mean, you think about when we go to a therapist or, you know, and we talk about our challenges, it helps us to just vocalize what we're feeling. And so when we can actually put a voice to what we're feeling, it's really powerful and healthy to release. There's a lot of different reasons for why tapping works. The points do matter. There's studies that show that these points are, if you did random points, it doesn't work the same. There's the tapping, there's the statements that we're saying. There's a bit of a hypnotic effect of the repetition of what we're doing. There's lots of different reasons for why tapping is really effective. But yes, it definitely matters to say the statements out loud, if you can. If somebody's listening to this in the work environment right now and they don't want to say it out loud, that's fine. Just say it in your head to yourself, whatever it is you're feeling. So we're going to do a basic round here. Yourself, I'm starting on the side of the hand, even though I'm feeling all this anxiety. And fleet, you can choose to repeat after me or you can stay silent about it and let everyone do it. It's really up to you about how.

You want to do it.

Right?

Yeah.

I'll repeat after you.

Just model for people. So great.

That sounds good. So tapping on the side of the hand, even though I'm feeling all this anxiety in my body, Even though I'm.

Feeling all this anxiety in my body.

I accept how I'm feeling right now.

I accept how I'm feeling feeling right now.

We do this three times. Even though I'm feeling all this anxiety.

In my body, even though I feel all this anxiety in my body, I.

Choose to stop and breathe in this moment.

I choose to stop and breathe in this moment.

Even though I'm feeling all this anxiety in my body.

Even though I'm feeling all this anxiety.

In my body, I choose to stop and breathe in this moment.

I choose to stop and breathe in this moment.

And so now we're going to move to the different points that we start. We're going to start on the eyebrow point. Now, when I tap, I do one hand only to show so people can see my face. But you can do both hands, so it's on both sides. So I'm going to. It's the eyebrow point or your eyebrow ends. So we're going to start here and here. We can do a simple setup, statement, or we'll just continue. So just repeat after me. All this anxiety in my body.

All this anxiety in my body.

I'll move to the side of the eye. I'm feeling all this anxiety in my body.

I'm feeling all this anxiety in my body.

We're going to go under the eye and here. Fleet, you don't have to necessarily fill in the sentence, but we can allow. You can say this yourself, but for every. Everybody listening, say all this anxiety about. And then to yourself or out loud, say what it's about. So voice what you're feeling.

I'm feeling all this anxiety in my body actually about a presentation I have to do this afternoon.

There you go.

Perfect, right? So when we give a voice to what we're feeling under the nose. All this anxiety in my body.

I'm feeling all this anxiety in my.

Body about this presentation I need to do this afternoon.

Chin point. But I choose to stop and breathe in this moment.

And I choose to stop and breathe in this moment.

Collarbone point. So collarbone point. If you find the collarbone and you go down an inch and out an inch, it's really like a soft point right there. It's not right on the collarbone. You can do one side, other both sides. You can do it. You know, you can do both with one hand, like I like to do a lot of times. So all this anxiety in my body.

I'm feeling all this anxiety in my body.

Then we're going to go under the arm. So this is about the bra line for women, about a hand width underneath the arm armpit for men. So all this anxiety in my body.

I'm feeling all this anxiety in my body. About a crazy.

Now the top of the head is the last one we'll continue going through. And here there's lots of different points you can move around, stay in one spot. And all this anxiety in my body.

I'm feeling all this anxiety in my body.

We're back to the eyebrow point. About all the things I have going on in my life.

About all these things I have going on in my life.

Side of the eye. I I'm worried about how things things will work out.

I'm learning about how things will work out.

Under the eye. I'm worried things won't go well I'm.

Worried things won't go well under the.

So I'm stressed about how things will.

Go I'm stressed about how things might go.

Chin point. I feel like I'm often stressing about.

The future I feel like I'm often stressing about the future.

Cobblepoint. Because I'm balancing so much in my life.

Because I'm balancing so much in my life.

Under the arm. And there's so much going on in the world right now.

And there's so much going on in the world right now.

Top of the head. It feels like there's stress around every corner.

It feels like there's stress around every corner.

Back to the eyebrow point. And I'm just struggling to find balance.

And I'm just struggling to find balance.

Side of the eye. But I choose to stop and breathe.

In this moment But I choose to stop and breathe in this moment under.

The eye and allow my brain and body to relax and allow my brain.

And body to relax under the nose.

To let it know that I am safe.

To let it know that I am safe.

Chin point. And that I can figure this out.

And that I can figure this out at one point.

So I choose to stop and breathe in this moment.

I choose to stop and breathe in this moment.

Under the arm. I can figure out anything Challenges I.

Can figure out any challenges.

Stop of the head and move my way forward.

And move my way forward.

Back to that brow point. I've got this.

I've got this Side of the eye.

I know I can do this.

I know I can do this.

Under the eye. Everything will be okay.

Everything will be okay.

Under the nose. So I choose to let my brain know that I am safe.

I choose to let my brain know that I am safe.

Chin point. And my body know that it can breathe.

And my body knows that it can breathe.

Common point. Everything is going to be okay.

Everything is going to be okay.

Under the arm. So I can stop and be present in this moment.

I can stop and be present in this moment.

Top of the head. Knowing that everything will be okay.

Knowing that everything will be be okay.

We can just stop there and take a deep breath in.

And breathe out.

Again. We just kind of notice what we're feeling in our body. We started off by checking in with our body and just feeling, you know, is there any tension in our body? A lot of times people will start tapping on one issue and they'll go, oh, you know what? My knee feels better. I have this knee pain. All of a sudden it feels better. Or we check in with our breathing. I noticed that for me, those last breaths that I took at the the end, we're much deeper belly breaths. Right. A lot of times when we're feeling stress or anxiety, we can't breathe that deep in our body, just doesn't allow it. So we're not breathing deeply. And I noticed at the end of the tapping there that I can breathe a little bit deeper. And so we also want to do is once again want to go back and just tune into the emotion that we're feeling initially if we were anxious about a particular thing. Fleet, you gave the example of a talk you have to give if that was what you started with in the beginning. We kind of check in again and go, well, how anxious am I about this unlevel of 0 to 10. We go, you know what, maybe you're at a 4 now instead of a 7. Maybe you're at a. Maybe you just move down one point, a 6 instead of a 7. Or sometimes most of the time, 90, 95% of the time or more, people go down, but sometimes they go up. But when they go up, it's just information. Sometimes it's something else came up. Right, so something came up where? In your example.

You were speaking worried about a talk you had to give, and all of a sudden you realize how limited your time is in getting it done and something else. So something came up and you go, oh, that's just information to let us know that we need to focus on that and tap on that now to release what we're feeling there. But most of the time, we create a bit of a shift in how we're feeling. So, fleet, how was that for you? How do you feel different or what kind of shift did you have during that tap?

Yeah, absolutely. So I self measured around somewhere around a six or seven initially, and I'd say I'm down around a two or three now. I definitely felt things open up in the body, felt my breath deepen, just feel this natural flow in the body. Whereas before I was feeling. I was definitely. I do a lot of embodiment work I felt in my body before, but it was a bit, you know, it was a bit, you know, I'm feeling that anxiety, right. It was there, and now it's like, you know, it's slowing down. There's more flow, there's more breath, you.

Know, and there's a much more of a positive sense that, okay, I can do this.

Yeah. And what happens a lot of times, I'm sure there are people watching who are yawning. Yawning is very common when people do tapping, because as your body releases and relaxes, it can yawn.

And start yawning. Yeah, exactly where you. You know, sometimes, you know, before I get on a. On a interview like this, I'll do tapping ahead of time, and I have to. There you go. See, there you go. I triggered it for you. I have to remind myself, or I'll do tapping, and then I'll be like, yawning before I go to do something. Because my body's relaxed. Right. Sometimes we like to laugh. People will have gas sometimes because they just. Their body relaxes. And so our body just, you know, goes into a calmer state. Right. And really what we're doing is we're allowing our body to feel safe. We're allowing it to recognize that we're not in a dangerous situation. So often our amygdala is triggered when we're not in unsafe situations. And so the more we can allow our bodies to relax and feel safe and go, oh, you know what? I feel safe, so now I can make better choices. And you saw, part of what we did in the tapping as we were going is we actually made choices. We focus on the negative first and what we were feeling. And then we started to make choices about breathing more deeply and choices about how we wanted to look at things. And so we can go through that process in shift. And what often comes oftentimes happens, especially when somebody is really high at a really strong emotion or anger, resentment, whatever it might be, and they go, oh, no, I'm just so angry. I can't believe they did this to me. They start doing the tapping and different thoughts come into their brain. They start thinking different things because they go, oh, well, you know what? Maybe I didn't think about the stress that they're under and what they're feeling, and maybe I could be a little more compassionate about what's going on in their life. We start to access different parts of our brain, and it really just allows us, as we said, to create emotional freedom for ourselves. So that we can show up as the best version of ourselves because it's my belief that all of us have the ability to be happier, to be healthier, to be more successful. But all of these stresses and anxieties and worries and limiting beliefs that get in our way, and when we can reduce the intensity of those things and shift some of those beliefs, we become the full expression of who we are. It's not, you know, people like to say, well, I'm not good at this, or I'm not smart enough. No, it's not that you or not everyone has the capacity to do more. And so I think a technique like tapping just allows us to be more of who we truly are.

So use, you know, kind of a progression of affirmations and dialogue and self talk as, as you're leading me through, leading us through that exercise, where can people become familiar with that? Is that in your apps or how can people learn to do that part of it?

I think the easiest way to learn to do it because for years we used to be focused on teaching people how to tap. Right. Because it is, it's something. You can learn it just in five minutes and do it on yourself. But where people struggles with the language and going, well, what do I say? How do I know how to find the right language? And sometimes it can be more challenging to find different ways because we're stuck in our own model of the world and our own things. And so, yes, the Tapping Solution app is the really, it's the easiest way to do it. You open up your iPhone or your Android, you go to the App Store or Google Play, you just look up the tapping solution, you download it. It's free to download. You get lots of, I mean, free tapping meditations in there. I think there's 30 or 40 or 50, there is a premium level, but lots of free stuff that can guide you in that process. There's tutorials in there on how to do the tapping and you can start to immediately feel and you can track the result. That's a fun thing too about an app. You can track the results just like we did here and see the results. That's really why we created an app is because our mission has always been to make tapping accessible to every man, woman and child on the planet. And so to be able to access something on your phone where you needed it and you can use it at any point is about as easy as it gets nowadays. So that's what I would recommend if somebody wants to try the tapping further.

Wow.

Well, thank you so much and really encourage people to check out the tapping solution and the tapping solution app and Nick and Alex Ortner's work. And I know your wife is involved in the work as well.

My wife does trauma work. Yeah, she's a specialist in trauma and my sister Jessica as well. My partners in the tapping solution is myself, my brother, my. My sister Jessica.

Oh, your sister Jessica. That's what I was thinking of.

Yeah.

And your wife is involved in trauma work?

Yeah, my wife does separate work with tapping. She does trauma work. Yeah. Specifically on. On childhood sexual trauma is what she's.

Wow, that's really a tough area.

Well, thank you so much Alex for being part of our the best year of your life summit. And you offered so much. Really, you covered all the topics for the full 10 days.

Yeah, I didn't mention.

It's great.

And we should, we should bring you back for day 10 about how. Okay. Now how do you do all this? Right. And so. But no, this has been really great and really practical and just encourage people to check out your work and, and your summit that will be coming up in February, I think. In February. Yeah. So I just. Thank you so much. It's been great to be with you today.

Thank you. It's been an honor and a privilege. I really appreciate it.

Be well.

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