Interview: The School of Greatness with Lewis Howes

You're listening to Optimize with Bryan Johnson.

More wisdom in less time. Hi, this is Brian. Welcome back to the Optimal Living Interview series. Today I'm thrilled to be chatting with Lewis Howes about his new book, the School of Greatness. Subtitle A Real world Guide. The Living Bigger, Loving Deeper and Leaving a Legacy just came out. I got an advanced copy which I loved. Lewis Howes, you may know him from his podcast which is ridiculously popular, called the School of Greatness. Millions and millions of downloads over the last couple years since he launched it. He's also an online marketing expert, sought after business coach, podcast and webinar host, speaker and angel investor. He was also recognized in 2013 at the White House by President Obama as one of the top 100 entrepreneurs in the country under age 30. His book is a quick reading. Inspiring, fun, just young. Go out and get it and here's how to do it. Manifesto on greatness. I loved it. Louis, thanks for taking the time.

Brian, thanks so much for allowing me to share everything.

Right on. Well, you've been having fun for the last couple of years and lots of fun, man. Well, before then, I was joking with you before, as we were getting ready, the the School of Greatness has to be one of the coolest phrases ever. Tell us what you mean by that.

It's fun. You know, I was in transition from selling another company where I was creating these online courses around social media. It's kind of how I got started. But I realized that wasn't my passion anymore. It was something I did to get my message out there, but wasn't like what I wanted to do full time. So I sold that company and I'd gone through a pretty rough breakup. I'd moved to LA for a girl where it didn't work out and was going through like an off and on together breaking up thing. And then it eventually ended after a lot of emotional, dramatic late nights and things like that, conversations. And so I was in this transition. I was like, what do I want to do with my life right now? You know, this company is sold. No more relationship. I'm out in la. What am I doing? What do I really want? And I got back to the root of what makes me excited in life. And the things that inspire me is really living my dreams. Like the going after the things that call me in the world. Playing sports, you know, chasing my dream of playing the Olympics, you know, getting on stages, connecting with inspiring influencers from all around the world, like learning those stories about how people got to where they were. For me, that's, like, what it got back to, what I wanted to do with my life. And I remember one day asking a few different friends, Pat Flynn and Derek Halpern, and a few of the friends, Ramit Sethi, asking them, you know, what's driving a lot of leads and sales for you right now online? Like, what's the big thing that you feel like is a game changer? And they said, you know, Pat Flynn and Derek Halpern were like, man, my podcast, I'm getting so many more followers because of it, and really engaged prospects that are great, great customers and really getting results in their life. And I was like, really? And as I was driving around LA from New York City, where's where I was coming from before, I was driving in LA and stuck in traffic a lot. And I remember thinking, maybe this could be a great way to get a message out to people through a podcast. And so I was thinking of, what is the name that I want to call this? And I was thinking, you know, maybe the Lewis Howes show or the. I didn't want to do, like, an online business thing. I was like, what is the thing that I really want to talk about?

And.

And for me, it was greatness and being great. And I was like, well, what do I call it? The greatness podcast? This and that. And then I was like, you know what? I had a really hard time in school. I was always in the special needs classes. I had a tutor all through high school. I couldn't really read and write, and probably my junior and senior year in high school could read a little bit, but it was just very hard for me to read specifically out loud when a teacher would ask me to read. It was like I was sweating constantly because I was nervous because I didn't know how to say the simplest of words. I couldn't read them. And so for me, I struggled in school. But what I really knew was that learning and education and growth is one of the most powerful things. And I'm all about education, but just not the traditional type of school. So I said, you know what? I want to teach people about how to live in the school of greatness. And that's where it came about.

Right on.

That's awesome. So it was a long story.

That's great. I mean, brought me back to my sweaty days in high school. I was actually the nerd that could read easily, and I looked forward to that. But everything else, you're the guy that.

I sat next to you next to during the Scantron test. So that I could see the answers, probably.

I wanted to be cool, you know, football players working with me. This is good. Yeah, I was that guy. That's great. Literally 4 foot 11, 88 pounds as a freshman in high school.

Wow.

Smallest kid in school.

I was 6 3, 165 pounds, freshman in high school, probably so.

Good. Right on. Yeah. Another conversation. I forgot to mention that Louis, his. One of his aspirations as a. As a little kid. I think you said you were 10 years old, on the couch with your dad and learned all American was who made the plays. And he said, I want to be an all American. Big dream of yours that you achieved in two sports. And you talk about how you overcame adversity in your book Decathlon and Football. Awesome stuff.

Thanks, man.

Okay, cool. Well, let's celebrate the school of greatness in what you've done to kind of basically create a huge number of mentors virtually and in person. And this book, as you said, is kind of your lecture notes from. I don't know how many podcasts you've done at this stage. A ton of them.

230 or something like that. Yeah.

Wow. Yeah. And your first podcast was with Robert Greene, right? Of mastery.

That's right. Mastery. Yeah.

Super cool. So super broad spectrum. And one of the things I like about your book that I want to talk about before we get into the details of how to go about achieving our greatness is you make the important point that although you feature a lot of guys who have, you know, and women who have achieved the gold medal standard of greatness, you talk about the fact that true greatness is within all of us. Can you tell us what that means and how you see it?

Yeah, I mean, you know, it's interesting. At the end of every episode, I ask people what their definition of greatness is, because everyone has a different definition. And, you know, greatness in my mind, isn't about making the most money or accumulating the most amount of accomplishments and accomplishments and success that people in the US Might think about. For me, greatness is discovering and making the most of the gifts we were born with. We're all unique, and therefore, we all have a unique gift. And when we discover and craft it and mold it and maximize our gifts to make the maximum amount of impact on the most people in the world. For me, I believe that's greatness. And anyone can do that. Anyone can mold their talents and gifts and improve upon what they were born with and learn new skills and develop it into this unique human being that we all are, and then we can go out there and, and serve the max amount of people possible, whether that's our family, our communities, the schools we go to, whether that's creating a video show like you do, or a podcast where you don't know how many people you're touching, but you continue to reach more and more people from that one talent that you have and you create and put out there. So I think again, it's figuring out what our talents are and serving the maximum amount of people with our gifts.

Yeah, that's awesome. And in the note, I riffed on one of the passages from the book where you articulate this and just the emphasis on the intrinsic who are you really? And then kind of the combination of there's kind of the maximum number and also the deepest number. And for me, one of my kind of heroes and people I think is great is my wife and what she's done to dedicate herself to our three year old son. And she's deliberately pressed pause on all the, you know, the big numbers and the Facebook likes and the podcast downloads and the money. But he's done just truly great stuff. A home birth and, you know, he's looked at his screen no longer than five minutes at a time over three years as we cultivate his attention and just crazy cool stuff. And I think it's really inspiring the way you frame it and the way I'm committed to framing it in my work, of what is your deepest essence and how do you express that in the most authentic way, independent of what external validation we might get. But go out and do what you're here to do as well as you can.

Right, exactly. I 100% agree. Getting me fired up, you know, it's interesting because, you know, listen, I get it. When I was 24, 25, just starting out, when I was broke on my sister's couch for a year and a half after my dream of playing football was over from an injury, the only thing I wanted was money so that I could feel like I was a grown man, like I was living on my sister's couch. I didn't want to have to rely on anyone else. So I was like, okay, I need to make a lot of money so I can have my own apartment, take care of myself and take care of my family and things like that. So my, my vision at that time was a little different than it is now. Just like my vision when I was 18 was to, you know, have a girlfriend and get a college scholarship. That's all I cared about. It wasn't like, how am I going to impact the maximum amount of people in the world? Although I think we all come from this place of love and wanting to serve people, whether or not we're doing it at the highest level, I think we all have that in us. Sometimes we get off track or we have other things to learn first before we really can bring that out. But, you know, for me, it continues to evolve. Once I made enough money to where I was taking care of my basic needs, I was kind of like, well, this really isn't everything. Why am I so focused on the money? And why don't I focus more on serving people? And so I was able to shift through the years once I started to get my needs met. But I think if you're broke, you're going to focus on creating something or finding a job or doing something where you have your needs met. And if you can do both, where you're serving your own passion, inspiring others, serving others and making money, that's when you hit the jackpot.

Yeah, that's awesome. And I again, in the note, I reflected on exactly that with Abraham Maslow and that need that we all have to actualize. And of course there's a hierarchy of we got to take care of certain things at different times. And for me, I'm the other side of 40 at this point. Hard to believe. 41 now go me and three young.

Though, got young energy.

I get a young energy. A three year old son, you know, is the next stage in my evolution anyway of, okay, cool. Wow. What's it like to serve him profoundly? And no one knows when I'm hanging out and going on an hour adventure with him every morning to give my wife time to meditate and do all that.

And.

And that's not a measurable thing yet. That's such a cool inherent part of our own greatness. And Legos are fun too. So, you know, it all comes together. But. But I love it and I love the arc. And it's one of the things I like about your book is that it's unabashedly you and what you're committed to. And I think everyone's gonna enjoy it. And I think particularly individuals who just got that fire and are looking to find that traction and what you've done and how you've embodied these ideals. And one of the things I'm excited to talk about, just hustle, got clear on what you want and willing to do whatever it takes to make it happen is just awesome. So. Yeah, right on. Well, eight lessons is What Louis walks us through in the book, I'm going to just quickly go through them, Louis, and we'll talk about a few of my favorites. So one, to create a vision. Two, turn adversity into advantage. Three, cultivate a champions mindset. Four, develop hustle. Hashtag my favorite one right there. Five, master your body. Six, practice positive habits. Seven, build a winning team. And eight, be of service to others. And of course, each one of those lessons has its own chapter. Louis walks through a different mentor in each one and kind of ties it all together in a practical way with a bunch of exercises, et cetera. I want to start with vision. Tell us why vision is number one and why it's so important.

You know, here's the thing. If we want to be great at anything, and if you think of any leader or world class athlete or scientist or author, anything, anyone who's done anything great in the world, they didn't just show up when they were, you know, 30 years old to the super bowl and win the Super Bowl. It didn't just happen randomly. They probably had a vision when they were five like I did of playing in the super bowl or playing the World Series or winning a gold medal. They had a vision and they literally had a 25 year game plan where every day they hustled, they did whatever it took to build a team around them, to learn, to grow, to get to that one moment where there's an opportunity, a chance to win the biggest game of their life. And they had a very clear vision. You think of, you know, a president of the United States. They didn't just like get into politics because they thought it was fun. And you know, it wasn't just like this easy path for them always. They probably were, you know, student president when they were in middle school and got into this a very early age and thought, you one day I want to be, you know, running the country or running my state. And they had a very clear vision about getting there. You know my book, this was an eight year vision I had eight years ago and I read a book called the Four Hour Workweek. It was in, I was on my sister's couch. It was the Christmas of 2007, going to 2008. I remember after reading it, I said, one day I'm going to become great friends with Tim Ferriss, the guy who wrote this book. Whoever his agent is, I'm going to figure out who his agent is and he's going to, I'm going to become good friends with him and he's going to Be an agent for me, and I'm going to write a book that one day inspires millions of people to create possibility in their life, in their business, and whatever in their world. The way this book right now created a possibility and a whole new way of thinking that I didn't even know was possible in my world. And that was eight years prior to today. I had that essentially eight years in Christmas. And now I'm good friends with Tim Ferriss. His agent is my agent and my book is out. And it didn't just like, oh, you know, I just show up yesterday and say, I'm going to write this book and just whip it together. It was a vision. And I think again, it doesn't matter. If you're looking for the relationship of your dreams, you have the vision of what that person looks like, the characteristics, who they are and when you see them. And that usually means you need to become that vision yourself to receive that same partner that you're looking for in a relationship. And then when you see that person, you know that this is the person. Or when you see someone who's not that vision, it's a very clear barometer for you to tell you, okay, this is not my vision, so I'm not going to go on a second date with this person. As opposed to people that don't have a vision in relationships, they'll date anyone because they're like, well, this is nice and this is great and it's good connection and, you know, the intimacy is fun, but when there's. It doesn't match up to. If you have a vision and that does not match up to it, that person will not continue seeing that person in that format. So vision is one of the most powerful things. If you don't have a clear vision, you are just wandering through life aimlessly, getting the scraps of life that are coming your way and reacting to things in life and being confused. You know, I talked to a lot of people like, well, I don't really know what I want. I don't know what my dream is, or I'm just not happy with what I have. And when I ask them, well, what do you want? They're like, well, I'm not sure. I kind of want this, I kind of want that. And that's what you get kind of results as opposed to being very clear about the results you get. Not saying it's going to be easy to get the result, but that's going to be a great guide for you to say yes and no to things that come along the way.

That's awesome. You talk about, first of all. That's awesome. Your own articulated vision and where you are vis a vis where you were eight years ago. Well done. High five.

Yeah. Thank you. Thank you.

And just the beginning.

Journey, man.

What's that?

And it's just the beginning. Yeah. This has been a journey. It's a. It's a journey. And again, our visions are. We're allowed to change our visions. It's like, it's okay if it changes, but I think we need to have these principles that we stand on as the vision of our life. Like, okay, I'm going to be in integrity. I'm going to be my word. I'm going to be kind to people. I'm going to come from love, you know, I'm going to be there for my family. I think it's good for us to have these basic visions for our life as our, you know, as our guides to make decisions in general. We may not know, like, what job we want to have or the career path, but. And that's okay if that changes and shifts, but I think it's important to have, like, a vision for your life in general.

Yep. That's awesome. And then one of the ideas I liked that I pulled out in the note was your certificate of achievement.

Yeah.

The coa. Can you tell us about that?

Yes. You know, a lot of these things that I learned in business I got from my sports background. And when I would play on great football teams, specifically in football, we would do this on some great teams. The beginning of the season, the first day, we'd all be in the locker room, the coach, before we put on the pads, before we talked about, you know, the routes were running, anything like that, the coach would get the whiteboard or the chalkboard up and say, what is our vision? What do we want to achieve in the next three to four months at the end of the season? And we would come up with it together. So, you know, usually the coach would say, here's what I want. I want us to win a championship, or, I want us to go this many wins, or, I want us to win the league. I want us to make the playoffs, you know, depending on where we're at. And then we would either align to the vision or we would share a different vision, but we would come up with a vision together as a team. So we all knew what we were doing. And we would have this, like, this essentially goal that we put up with, the date of when we wanted to achieve it. So we knew when the Championship game was we would put it up there, and we would all sign the board as a commitment to ourselves for what our vision was and what we were going to achieve, as if it would already happen. So I did this after I got out of sports, I did this for myself. I started putting, you know, this certificate of achievement that I called it, where I was like, okay, I'm gonna sign and date the time that I want to achieve making my first $5,000 with a speech. Cause I was terrified to speak. And I went to public speaking class every single week, a thing called Toastmasters, which I think you might be aware of. And I was like, no one is ever gonna pay me to speak right now. Like, I'm horrible. I can't even get up in front of 20 people without sweating and looking down on my notes constantly. But I was like, you know what? I'm going to create a challenge for myself, a vision, a goal for myself. So nine months down the road, I put, you know, the date nine months away. I signed it, and I said, you know, I will. I will make $5,000 per speech by this date. And I signed it as if it was happening that day. So you've received $5,000. This is to award you this. This amount. And literally, I looked at that. I printed it out on nice paper. I put it up on my wall right by my mirror and another one by my bed. And I looked at it almost throughout. All throughout. All the whole day when I wake up, when I go to sleep, and I envision that certificate as it already happened, nine months away. And every week, I would prepare and train and hustle like a maniac to become the person I needed to become for that to be a reality for me. And I didn't get it on the, you know, right on that day. It happened, like, shortly after, I believe. But I don't think I would have created those results had I been clear on creating this certificate for myself and then taking those daily actions I needed to. If I was just like, yeah, one day I want to make five grand, maybe would have happened, you know, a few years down the road, but not as intentional as it did by doing this exercise with a certificate of achievement.

That's awesome. In the book, you say, okay, so what do you want to do over the next six months or three months or 12 months, whatever the right frame is. Get clear on that. And this is. We talk about it in an episode with Heidi Grant Halvorsen, who wrote the most popular blog post in Harvard Business reviews history on goals and the number one thing that she says is what successful people do differently is the blog post. Number one is they're specific. And I love the way that you highlight that of look, you got to be specific. What do you want and when do you want it by? And then you also make the point of it should scare you, but it should also be possible, you should be able to do it. And a whole nother conversation around the science behind that that I've been getting into lately. But I love that. And then you mentioned the Hustle like a maniac, I believe you said, which we're going to get to in a moment, which is just so awesome. And then you also said that you wanted to create the daily actions. And I think you do a really good job, a great job of you've obviously demonstrated it in your life and I think in the book. I love the way you unpack it where you connect. Okay. This is your vision of what you want to achieve. Certificate of achievement style. Awesome. Then what are you gonna do day in and day out to make that reality? Yeah, I just, I talk, you know.

This isn't like being the secret, you know, it's not like, oh, let's just visualize it and it'll come to us. This is. No, this is what me and you like is the Hustle. Like you gotta visualize it. Then you gotta map out every single day on how it's going to come true and with you taking those actions.

Exactly. So tell us about your I'm all about masterpiece days. I talk a lot about that. The way you frame it is really cool. You talk about it and you say, look, we need to have two different perfect days. We need to have the macro level. Look, this is my perfect day. If I can wave a magic wand, this is what it would look like.

Yeah.

Then you have the micro perfect day of this is what I'm going to do tomorrow to bring that vision to fruition. Can you tell us exactly about that?

Yeah. You know, I'm a big believer in visualization and dreaming. I think a lot of us have so much chatter and noise in our minds constantly that we don't take the time to dream about what life could be like and what we actually want. And so that may sound a little woo woo or this and that, but for me, visualization has been one of the main keys for my success is dreaming about things, feeling the experiences, making them feel so real in my mind, in my heart, like going through the emotions of it happening and then it almost always happens, like almost everything I dream of happens. And that's why I feel like I'm the luckiest guy in the world, because I'm living my dreams. And so what I tell people to do is, if they don't know what they want or not happy with where they're at, is literally take out a piece of paper and. Or just record, you know, in your iPhone or something for a minute what your perfect day would look like. You know, if you could have anything you want, if you could spend time with anyone you want to spend time with. If you're with the woman or the man of your dreams, you're traveling the world, you're with your family, you know, whatever it is your perfect day is, write it down or speak it out loud and record it, and then listen back to that. And literally, from every moment, from the moment you wake up, what are the sheets you wake up in? What's the bed like? Where, you know, are your windows open? Are they shut? Are you looking out of the ocean? Be so, like, you know, detailed but broad as well with anything that could happen in this perfect day. Go all the way through your day to the moment you go to sleep, to the last thing you say and the last thing you dream about before you go to bed. And just as an exercise, do this. And if you're listening right now, I recommend doing it. Go over your perfect day of what this could look like and write it out. Then, okay, you've got this in front of you. This is the dream. It's kind of like the vision map in your brain and your heart of what you want in your life. And obviously, this is going to change. If this was the same thing every day, it might get boring. So this is just kind of like a guide that could evolve and change. But you got to start with something from that. What I say is, well, you know, something I learned from sports as well on great football teams, I would show up to practice in the locker room, there would be an itinerary of the next three hours every 10 to 15 minutes. What we were doing, because we had a vision, we had a dream that we all wanted to achieve. So our coaches would map out the itinerary of everything we needed to work on in order for that dream to come true. And so we would look over the itinerary before practice. I knew exactly what we were creating. Every 5 to 10 to 15 minutes was intentional towards getting us towards our results. And there wasn't, like, let's just show up to practice and see what we want to do next. No we had timelines, we had to fit it all in. And we were structured, we were organized. We had great habits that we followed. And that's what made us better human beings, better athletes. So I recommend doing the same thing for your life. Be intentional about your time. Don't just wake up whenever you want. Don't just go about the day and react towards things. Be intentional about what you're creating. So I wake up at 7:00am what do I do for the next 30 minutes? Okay, I go running for the first 30 minutes of my day, then I come back 7:30 to 7:45. I shower 7:45 to 8. You know, I brush my teeth and get my tea, go through and write down from the moment you wake up to the moment you go to bed, every 15, 30, 60 minute increments of how you're going to fit in this dream, this vision for your perfect day, in your day with an itinerary. And that'll be so much more powerful and intentional with the time you have to create the things of this dream day and make it a reality.

I love it. And then in the process, create that vision. Bring that vision to fruition by making sure we squeeze in the. Well, what do you need to do on a daily basis to make that outcome a byproduct of your, you know, perfect masterpiece days?

Exactly. And again, I get it. Like, you may have this dream where but you're still, you've got three kids and you're working two jobs and you're thinking to yourself, well, Louis, I don't have the time for this. I understand. And that's why you still want to map it out so you can start thinking, well, how can I fit the first hour of my day as my perfect day for that first hour at least, when all my other time is booked up with everything else I have. But at least carve out some time where it's part of your perfect day. Then find another hour. Like, create a new schedule for yourself so you can fit in a 30 minute segment where you get to go walk in the park because that's part of your perfect day. Or you get to go be with your kids and not be distracted about work something and start building out this itinerary where it shifts and evolves until you make it completely your perfect day.

That's awesome. Just the incremental improvement over time rather than the binary on or off. I can't have it all tomorrow, so screw it.

It's probably not going to all happen tomorrow. Specifically, if you're don't Tell me. It could.

I'm kidding.

It could happen. But. It could happen. But, you know, if you're not. If you don't have all the flexibility and all the money in the world right now, or the time or whatever it may be, you've got to create. That may take some time.

Yep. Love it. Okay, so that's our first lesson, Vision. Talk to us about the second. Adversity.

You know, adversity is as long as we're breathing and as long as we're alive, there will be adversity. And I don't know anyone's life that just had everything so natural and easy that came to them, that I don't know any baby that never. That just walked from the moment they got out of the mother's womb and never had to cry, never felt any pain and got, you know, new calculus at 4 years old, there's going to be some adversity no matter what, as long as we're alive. Now, the greatest people in the world learn how to use this adversity as part of their advantage. They use it as their story. They use it as their motivator. They use it to learn, to grow, to get better. And some people get held back by their adversity. It really pulls them down. It keeps them in a funk. It keeps them in a place of pity and self doubt and insecurities where they don't take risks and they don't grow and they don't learn. They just stay safe because they don't want to get hurt anymore. So you've got to learn to say, okay, you know, every year something is going to happen that's challenging or that's hard or it might be painful or might be upsetting or, you know, someone might pass away. There's going to be something. My parents might get a divorce. Something is going to happen. Whether you wanted to or not. There will be challenges and maybe it's going to look different for you than someone else. Maybe your challenges are all internal and emotional and maybe someone else's are all external and physical. But no matter what, there's going to be challenges along the way. So you got to learn to really embrace this and just recognize it when. When everything hits the fan and it all seems to be not going your way, you need to just take a moment to smile and laugh and say, you know what? This is gonna be a great story. One day when, you know, in five to 10 years when people ask me how I did it, I'll tell this story and it's gonna inspire Someone else who's going through the same thing. You know, I was talking to a friend of mine, Rob Bell. I don't know if you've interviewed Rob Bell, who's an author as well.

He.

I asked him and I was like, what's something about you that most people probably wouldn't know? And he said, you know, I don't really get too mad about things. You know, I don't really get too down on too much. You know, I don't react too much when people try to attack me for what I'm doing or this and that or when everything goes wrong. I kind of just laugh and smile because I know it's going to be a great story to tell in my next book or the next time I'm on stage speaking. It's going to be a great story and it's going to inspire people. And that's what. That's what inspires people is the adversities we overcome. Not that we had everything so easy. So it's all about reframing and repositioning the story you tell yourself when things happen. What I say is for you, not to you.

That's great. And I think just the insight. I know when I used to be terrified of everything in high school and whatever, I thought it was just me. I thought that something was wrong with me because I experienced those things. And the biggest lessons I've learned among them have been the fact that it isn't just me. And that idea of the Brene Brown, Kristin Neff common humanity concept of, look, we're all suffering, we're all struggling. I know you've shared some of your personal stories, which is so. And you didn't to start this chat today. You know, we all struggle. And I think when we're able to see that common humanity, and rather than shame ourselves because we are the ones that are currently struggling, we can celebrate it and say, look, I'm up to good things. And this is going to be the interesting part of my hero's journey when I retell it in 2, 5, 10, or whatever years. Right?

Exactly. That's it.

And then you reference Ryan Holiday, the obstacles, the way, and literally training ourselves to eat those challenges, like an energy bar, Right? That's what makes us stronger.

That's it. That's where we get the most growth.

Let's do this.

That's the school of greatness. That's where we learn. That's where we learn the biggest lessons that move us forward and to the next level, whatever that level is. Without that adversity we wouldn't be able to get to the next level. There would be nothing challenging us. You know, without fear, we wouldn't be able to be courageous. And that's interesting. You know, also, Rob Bell gave a talk one time, I mentioned him twice now, but he gave a talk earlier this summer where he mentioned that scientists have discovered. I think I'm going to be pretty close to the stat that he said scientists discovered or realize that the universe is made up of 94% of this thing called dark matter, this matter, that we don't know what it is, we don't know what it's made up of. It's physically dark looking. You know, it's these black holes, it's these other things. The universe, the universe that surrounds our world is 94% dark matter. And the scientists, again, don't know exactly what it is, but they know that without this dark dark matter, this darkness, this uncertainty, that we would not be able to function and we would not be alive. And so you got to think about this as a reflection of your life. Like, without all the darkness that we've gone through, both emotionally, mentally, the physical challenges we've gone through, the heartaches, the breakups, the broken bones, without this darkness, we wouldn't be who we are in this very moment. And if you ask a lot of successful people, you know, you've had all these horrible things that have happened to you. You've been sexually abused or parents been divorced or you're an orphan, you know, you ask all these people who have made it to the next level and the highest levels, you say all these things happen to you. Would you ever go back and change any of these things? And they say, absolutely not. Because it's made me who I am and it taught me the lessons I needed to be able to get to this level. So I think you got to look at this adversity as really the key to your greatness. If you want to be great, that's awesome.

And again, the second lesson, turn adversity into advantage. So just practically speaking, as you're listening, what challenges are you facing? How can you turn that poison into medicine? That reframe is just huge. So I mentioned already in our chat and while we were chatting before, my favorite lesson, Hustle.

Yes.

I think you said you were going to write a book called Hustle, which.

This book was going to be called Hustle. Originally, I pitched it to my agent. I was like, I want to write a book on Hustle because I feel like I wouldn't be Where I'm at today in sports and business and life without this one thing, Hustle. And I really feel like that's all I'm, you know, that's the thing I'm good at the most is, like, hustling, and in the positive sense of the word. And he was like, I'm not gonna put a book out that has the word hustle on the COVID He's like, I'm just not gonna do it. He's more of an old school guy. So I think he thought of the word as a little different. And funny enough is my publisher, Rodale is putting out a book titled Hustle in, like, six months that another friend of mine wrote. And I was like, that's funny that, you know, we both had the same thought process. But, yeah, Hustle, man, this is. This is. You know, I would say my bread and butter is I was never the best athlete, was never the tallest or the fastest or the strongest or the. Or any of that, but I was willing to dive into for the loose balls all the time. And I was willing to dive for more loose balls and sacrifice my body more than any other athlete that I was aware of, at least in my circle. And that's what got me on the team early on, and that's what got me a starting job, and that's what got me into winning big games, was because I was willing to do what no one else was most of the time. And I look at my transitioning from sports into business, and again, I was not, you know, the best athlete on my team in college, but I went to go play professional football where no one else on my team did. And it's because I was willing to network with scouts and go to all the combines and train for three months in the middle of school to go try out for the NFL and the Arena Football League. And I was willing to. I was creating DVDs and passing them out to the scouts one by one, introducing myself, building relationships, following up. I was doing whatever it took. And that's what I did in business as well. I was building relationships. I wasn't the smartest. I didn't know anything about online marketing or design or coding or anything, but I was able to build relationships and add value to people. And I found that a great, great asset to getting the results I wanted. And so I look at my life and business now as like, diving for the loose balls of life. It's. You know, I think it's Angela. Is it? Angela Duckworth, I think, is the one who's Got this very popular TED Talk, probably in the top 15 or something. And she says the key to success, there's the key to success comes down to one thing. She calls it grit. Grit. And this is what the top leaders in the world have. The top CEOs of Fortune 100 companies, top athletes, they have this thing called grit that the rest don't have who are at that level or who don't get to that level. And for me, that everything she explains for me is what I've been explaining is hustle my whole life. It's kind of that willingness to do whatever it takes, that perseverance, but that sacrifice to do it no one else wants to do because it's painful, it hurts, it's extra time, it's late night stuff, it's whatever. But that is the difference maker. And when you compound that, you know this better than anyone, Brian. When you compound this over 5, 10, 20 years of that hustle and that energy, you're gonna build so much momentum that you're gonna be at the top of your game in your industry or whatever it may be, because you are willing to do that just a little extra like you were willing to, as opposed to just run to go get the ball. You were willing to dive and get a little scrape on your elbow to save the ball, because that's what's going to actually help you score that final point in the game and make the difference for you to win or lose because you've got a scrape on your elbow. And for me, that's powerful.

I love it. Yeah. All of that. Amen. Angela Duckworth Grit, the phrase that she uses to describe it that I love, is intense passion plus intense persistence. It's kind of her formula for grit.

That's good.

I like that. So good. So powerful. What's the idea? We've obviously only touched on a few of the lessons, but what's the idea, your favorite idea that we haven't discussed yet?

Well, I would say the first one, creative vision, is extremely powerful. And also the last one would be the two most important things, I think. I mean, they're all important. They're all the eight characteristics of greatness that I've seen from interviewing a couple hundred of these great men and women in all over the world and all these different industries. But I think the last one, principle number eight, which is live a life of service, I feel like that can be the most rewarding. And again, my definition of greatness is to maximize your gifts and make the most of them, to live your dreams and then impact the max amount of people in the world with those. Those gifts. So if we're just serving ourselves, if we're only serving ourselves and we're not figuring out ways in every moment to be of service to other people in the world, then I think it's a big mistake. And I think we're, at the end of the day, going to be very unfulfilled. And something I heard a few years ago is that the getting is in the giving. The getting is in the giving. And when we. When we give, we're actually receiving way more than when we just get. So when we start to reframe that, you know, whenever I'm in service, whenever I'm doing community service or just opening the door for a stranger, you know, I feel great about myself. You know, it's almost selfish to give because you feel so good about things you're creating for other people. But when you're just so focused on yourself only all the time, then I think it's just, you know, we have this work.

We were.

We have the gift to be alive. This planet is available for us as a gift, and I think we owe so much back to the planet, into life, and that it's our duty to. To be of service.

Amen to that. Use our greatest gifts and greatest service to the world is one of the phrases I come back to all the time. And I just love those bookends. Create a vision that inspires you and be of service and optimally, maximally impact those around you, starting with yourself, your family, your community, extending into your world on your terms and whatever that means for you and having the courage to do whatever that is in the most authentic way. Louis, appreciate you. So School of Greatness just came out. If you enjoyed this chat, you're going to love the book, and I'm fired up for you. The fun's just.

Thanks, man. Thank you, man. I'm super pumped. And it's just the beginning.

Yeah. Okay, so then, in addition, obviously, search School of Greatness. If you're one of the few human beings alive that haven't subscribed to that podcast yet, go get on it. ITunes, Stitcher, SoundCloud, all those places, and then Lewishouse.com best place. That's it.

That's it, man.

Louis, which is L e w I s howse h o w e-s.com thrilled to be connected. Appreciate you taking the time.

Yeah. And if you're. Are you on Instagram, Brian?

You know I'm not, but you're blowing up on Instagram too. Where are you there?

Well, I'm Louishouse on Instagram, but I was gonna say as a challenge for people, this is in, you know, it's in Barnes and Noble right now. It's. If you're listening to this, the first week of this coming out of my book, then it's in the front carousel, the front. It's called the Octagon of Barnes and Noble. That first kind of stand right when you walk in. It's been nationwide in the US in that first stand. So if you're there and you go to Barnes and Noble after listening to this, take a picture with yourself with the book and tag me on Instagram and maybe we'll. Maybe Brian will be on there by that time. And then tag Brian on there as well to let him know you saw the book and hopefully got the book there. After listening to this episode, I'd love to see who connects with me there.

Right on, man. Exciting. Well, congrats on all the success and excited to see what transpires in the decades ahead.

Thank you, Brian. Appreciate it, man.

Isn't it a bit odd we went from math to science to history, but somehow missed the class on how to live? For some wacky reason, optimal living 101 never made the schedule. Of course, it's too late to go back and change that and you're too busy to read full time to catch up.

Yet.

If you're like us, you're all about optimizing your life and actualizing your potential. So imagine this. Imagine having someone read the best books on optimal living and pulling out the big ideas that can truly change your life. You know those sections you asterisk and underline and mark all up? Then imagine that guy me, connecting those ideas to other great books and helping you apply them to your life today. Well, that's what I do is something we call Philosopher's Notes, where I break down each great book into a simple 6 page PDF, 20 minute MP3 and 10 minute Philosopher's Notes TV episode. Then imagine me taking the absolute best big idea from those great books and sharing them with you in fun, inspiring, super practical optimal living 101 classes on stuff like purpose 101, confidence 101, business 101, meditation 101, that sort of thing. You got a personal trainer? I'm kind of like your personal philosopher. Ancient wisdom plus Modern science plus complex common sense plus virtue plus mastery plus fun. That's what our optimized membership program is all about. We'd love to have you join us. Check us out at BrianJohnson. Me join.