Is Sui the new SOL? Why you should NOT ignore it

I find it very interesting. You'll speak to a lot of bitcoin maxis and most of them will just stay there. What made you venture outwards and look beyond Bitcoin?

Yeah, I think I realized very quickly that bitcoin's goal was just to stay there as a store of value and it was not ever going to be anything more than that. And for most people that's okay. For me, great. But I wanted, I saw the technology or the ideas. We have a technology at a lot greater ramification than just store value. I believe bitcoin is always going to be slow and that's a feature, not a bug by the way. It's going to stay the way it is. It's not going to innovate, it's just going to stay the way it is. Fine. But there is a new opportunity to actually coordinate the world's assets. As everything is going very, very digital, there needs to be this coordination layer that allows you to really coordinate users intentions around what they want to do with the assets in a very atomic and a very scalable way. Nobody was building that. I saw an opportunity to do that at Facebook, jumped at that with both hands, had a lot of fun. We didn't get to launch unfortunately for various reasons. But now with Mystin we can realize that dream and do that at a much accelerated pace than was ever possible. One of the things I'm most proud about that we invented recently was something called zklogin and also sponsored transactions. Zklogin allows you to use your existing Facebook account, Google account, any OAuth based Web2 account that you have to create a wallet and start transacting without warn about gas because sponsored transactions will cover the gas on your behalf. So you can build compelling Web2 experiences using SU without introducing people to the concept of wallets which I think are the dumbest thing ever created. Wallets should not exist. That's our view. Like quite frankly you should be able to onboard using your existing Web2 account, start transacting with crypto without ever have to worry about wallets and all the complexities of the infrastructure. Divorcing the infrastructure from the consumer is really going to be the barrier, right. That we have to solve. And we've solved that in an immensely great way at Mr. Labs and SUI. Ecosystem starting to grow. We have, we're seeing the amount of growth on web two accounts on the suite ecosystem significantly and I think Our view by 2030 Majority of games will have a form of ownership and it will be powered by SUI. So we want to onboard 3.3 billion gamers onto the platform.

Solana kind of, you know, came to fruition and came to the market, you know, three or four years ago already and they were the big newcomers. I think a lot of people consider Sui to be that right now, you know, in the last year at least. How difficult is it just to attract developers one and then users too because you know, a lot of people just ask why do we need another blockchain?

Yeah, from our perspective, I think sue has been around for a year and three to four months worthy number two behind Solana and non evm and that's growing really, really fast. Our view is not to think of ourselves as a competitor to Solana or other layer ones or whatever. Our view is much broader, quite frankly. SWE was designed from day one without any limitation on scale, the ability to scale horizontally. We're going after a bigger market, literally the coordination layer for the Internet. So a world where everyone owns assets that are digital, you need a layer to coordinate people's actions. But to do that at a world where it's very frictionless for the user to do so, that for us is a multi, multi trillion opportunity rather than a layer one which is a couple of billion dollar opportunity which I think is actually quite of value right now for us. We are going to keep building and everything we do, we recently announced Walrus which is another venture into that really. Now the Internet, once you've got coordination, you need a layer to store the world's assets as well. Beyond just coordinating the world assets, you need to be able to store websites, images and really define ownership around data as well. So as you see, we're building the layer of what the Internet of the future is going to be. The future of the Internet is going to be one where people own the protocols by which they interact with. Right? I own a piece of the Internet, right? I can't own TCP ip, I can't own Google and use Google, right? I, I own a piece of the Internet and for me to extract value from the Internet, I give back to the community and extract value in that sense. That is a very democratic view of the future. And that's one we're very, very excited about. And I think it's going to create a new form of, new form of economic models and opportunities for open source software that's never been possible before. I'm very, very excited about the opportunities.

What do you think of all the distractions then this year? You know, celebrity meme coins on Solana and And other chains, you know, Ethereum, they've all got them. There's a lot of degeneracy. I mean that's my own opinion.

Yeah.

What do you think about everything that's going on and is it a distraction or does it draw people in and potentially drive some adoption?

So I think the worst use case to onboard the mass market to is. Is that kind of activity, quite frankly. Right. People come in and the first thing you can do is buy something weird and funny and it doesn't really have much value. I think we're doing a disservice. Our focus has always been on building real enterprise value for people in the ecosystem. We announced a partner with USDC recently with Circle, who are going to allow stablecoins on sui, which I think now you have an account on SUI that allows you to just use your Google account to sign in. Now you can send money with just like email. So there's no need to have a wallet, no onboarding, no complex mechanisms. Our goal is to drive the 3.3 billion gamers into sue and anybody that wants to do any form of commerce into sui. So we're focused on real impactful use cases at the scale of the world rather than the minute world of Web3 that exists today. Now I'm not against everything that happens in Web three. I think they have their place and I also think you do need to have some element of experimentation in the web 3 space to figure out the real use cases. I just think let's be careful not to make that the defining product of the space. We don't have gas fees that spike through the roof. You don't have failing transactions that require you to try again and again. You don't have outages that go on for random times where you actually need to trade. You don't have a max throughput the network. You throw more hardware capacity to the network and it scales horizontally. There's stuff you expect from infrastructure which you don't get from Web three as a whole. And I think we're bringing that level of execution to web3 and I think it's about time.

Obviously some networks have, have struggled at times, especially when they do just get a huge amount of users and a huge amount of transactions and you know, volume. When do you become battle tested? When does that happen? Pusui and like, I mean you say now it hasn't happened, but it could happen right, where you just get a huge influx of users and it's going to test your system and that's good question.

Well, certainly the, the, the amount of users in web3 today is so low that the outages are happening now are pitiful like it should not be happening. There aren't enough users in web3 to take suite down. Right. So the amount of scale that, you know, leading L1s proposed to have is just not there. We've found that, you know, you might say you're having 100 million transactions hitting the network, but realistically it's not. The numbers are way, way smaller. We benchmark SUI in the limited in the main net configuration, which is our smallest configuration to 297,000 transfers per second. That is more than Visa, Amex, MasterCard combined. So we have ample block space to take on existing payments Rails and if that's not enough, validators can double capacity, triple capacity. We've proven that. You add seven times the capacity, use 7x throughput and you increase the latency by zero. So there's no increase in latency. That's how scale works. So we have no worries about being able to take on the world's demands. But I think the other networks do, which is why they have to quote a TPS or they have to quote these numbers to show that they've got some element of ability to deal with demand. But we've seen when any kind of reasonable transactions, any kind of volume, meaningful volume, comes onto the network, the networks usually go down. I mean, sue has never gone down. We never had any outage. And I hope that stays like that forever. But infrastructure is very hard to run and operate. I'm not using that as a chance to bash other networks. It's hard to run distributed systems. But our hope is we keep on having the excellence in execution engineering that we built up in working some of the largest institutions in the world.

Just in terms of bringing Web2 or the wider world into SUI or into the blockchain ecosystem. Do you see stablecoins playing a very important part in this? Now you guys have announced this partnership with usdc. Will you be open to other stablecoins and is that the, the impetus for, for bringing the rest of the financial system?

Yeah, I think having a variety of stablecoins is going to be critical. Having as many stablecoins as possible is actually only giving consumers more choice in, you know, which stablecoins they want to use for certain kind of use cases. So I think they're going to be the underpinning pieces that are going to allow you to drive real consumer use cases. Paying for milk or paying for produce in something stable is the way to Go. And also stablecoins perhaps give people in other countries who have unstable currencies access to stable currency as a way to hedge the economic uncertainties that they deal with. So I think they're very going to be very important.

What's the vision for SWE in the future? I mean, would I be able to log into my Facebook account or something like that and use it to tap and pay for everyday goods?

Absolutely. I think you'll be able to do that before the end of the year. Okay, fantastic.

I'll hold you to that.

Yes, absolutely. I mean we have Stash. If you go to getstash.com you can log in with your. You can sign in with your Google account and you already have the ability to have a wallet and you choose a username so you don't have to worry about addresses. So your name can be Matt at stash and people can send you money instantly. We're going to be implementing on and off ramps into it directly and also USDC is going to be on it. So now you have a way to email money to anybody you want to. They can receive that money and start and go on and off ramp with it immediately rather than have to worry about wallets and downloads. That's our vision and that's very unique to swe. Our goal is mass adoption and you go where the consumers are and don't tell them to come into web3world.

When you look at bringing this many people in across the world, obviously regulators are going to start looking at things like this. If I can just log into a blockchain based system with a web2 or a web2 profile that. Does proof of personhood matter and how will you navigate the complexities of financial rules and the ability to transact without maybe not having the right licenses in that country?

Yeah, I've always maintained that blockchains are the best content distribution networks for money. It's DRM for money. And then you hack onto that. The fact that it's a great irrefutable record of what has happened, unlike cash, that is really untraceable. So I think it augments the experience, the ability to actually deal with compliance rather than the opposite which has been what's been sold. Our view on SU is you actually have the ability to build in interesting compliance mechanisms for your tokens. If you want, you can have closed loop tokens. If you don't want your tokens to go out of a circum circulation, you can have trading pools that are KYC. So if you don't have a P morgan.com account. You cannot trade in a particular trading pool versus others. So you can build in public verifiable compliance rules on chain for certain assets and have some completely permissionless and free. So look forward to what people build on suite. I think that's an interesting world, but I think having a public ledger that can enforce these rules in a very transparent and verifiable way is way better than the obtuse and hidden way that we have it today. Quite frankly, It.