Sustainable Apparel for Conscious Women with Daniela Caine of Koryphae

Hello and welcome to this episode of Conscious Design. I'm your host, Ian Peterman, and author of the Conscious Design book. And today I'm very excited to basically continue our conversation with Daniela Cain. She's the founder of Corey Faye. She also does coaching and a lot of other amazing things. So welcome, and it's so good to have you to, to continue our conversation.

Yeah, I'm excited too. Like, I, I, I think I've told you before that, um, every time that we have conversations, there's just like these new light bulbs that are coming on because you've been thinking about this really thoroughly, obviously, and you, you walk the talk. And so there's like It always blows my mind. So I'm really excited to be able to continue the conversation.

Well, thank you. I, I love our conversations. It's always, always a treat. So I'm super excited we were able to do the Instagram Live. That was amazing. And now be able to do this, um, you know, we might just have to make it a regular thing somehow. So I would love that. Let's do it. Um, I would love though to have you talk a little bit about Corey Faye because I love what you're doing with your brand and kind of how, how you got that started. So all the people who listen to this podcast get to know a little bit more about what you're doing.

Yeah. Um, with your permission, I'd like to just step, uh, like 2 steps back saying where I'm, you know, what my background is because I kind of grew up just like you in the— well, not just you, like, but well, actually like you, because it was really running in your family. Um, while fashion or design has not run in my family, um, I grew up in the apparel industry. That's what I feel like. Once I, um, uh, started entering the workforce, I was working for, um, a very small and scrappy outdoor company in the north of Munich. which is where, where I'm from. I was born and bred. And, uh, and then I had this amazing jump to work for Adidas. Uh, I led one of the, or the biggest growth or volume category at Adidas, um, um, one of the design departments there. Uh, I then worked for Nike, Columbia Sportswear. And so I kind of like covered all of this. And while I love the— I love apparel design and I love design as a whole, however, my first trip to Asia to do us— to do the sourcing trip, uh, while I was working for the scrappy, scrappy outdoor company was to Bangladesh. And, um, and so it was like, um, I was very naive back then, and I didn't really understand how the industry functioned behind the veil. And I had this naive idea of, oh, it's like a fashion atelier, and it's like the sewing thing, and, and it's really beautiful. And I thought also that humans are ingenious enough to have figured out a way how to, how to, you know, machinize or how to automatically make commodity items like t-shirts and sweatshirts. I wasn't really thinking that humans would be making that. And so that was— granted, it was like end of the '90s, '96, '97, that I went there. And I was really shocked when I saw— when I first got my foot into this t-shirt manufacturer, and it was a multi-story, uh, multi-story building. And the sewing lines— people as far as the eye can see, and they're all hunched over the sewing machines and they are sewing. I mean, for people who don't know how this works or how a sewing line or production line works, um, people are sitting behind their sewing machines and they only sew one seam. And that they have a quota to get through, and they are sometimes punished or not even paid if they're not sewing enough of those seams. So, for example, they might just sew this one side seam, or just the shoulder seam, and then it's passed to the next station. So they are doing the same thing like a robot over and over and over again, and they are not allowed to look up because that you know, you can't make eye contact, or it's very shy. So it's very controlled environment, and it's not really made for humans. So that was my first experience in the apparel industry, and I had to compartmentalize because I said, this is not right, this is not according to my values, but I'm a small human being just starting out, having just studied that, and how— what can I do? Like, how can I make a change? I'm just— I don't even know what I'm doing yet.

Right.

And, uh, and, um, I— but I made a commitment to myself that, that I would only work for companies that would have ethical values similar as mine. And that's why— how I then worked, um, Um, with these larger companies, and they have more ethics installed because the social eye and the, you know, the customers are looking at them. And so they're forced. And there was this whole scandal around Nike and child labor. And so I was working for Adidas, and I mean, it was, it was a concern that this, you know, that what happened to Nike back in the day would happen to Adidas. So they were making clear, uh, attempt— not, not just attempts, they had all of these rules of what was allowed and what wasn't allowed. So that said, so I just wanted to set that up so that I was working for 20 years in the, in the global apparel industry. Uh, I love my job. I compartmentalized in a way like this. It is what life is. I am too small. I can't change anything. I can't have an impact. But what I can do is work, is choose to work for companies who, whether, you know, whether for their own, from their own heart or from, you know, their own values, or whether it is like put upon them from the outside, from society, they have to, they are following a more ethical way. Mm-hmm. Um, so that was the background. Um, and then I had tried to— I attempted to do my own thing 3 times, 4 times, I don't know. So, and always something kind of stopped me, something got in the way. Um, however, what then happened for me, for me personally, it's just my, my child, my daughter got sick. I kind of left the industry because I Wanted to be there for her and take care of her. And that got me onto a very spiritual path. And then full circle, and I changed my mindset and my way. This was really an orientation shift away from this idea. And I know that a lot of designers have that working in the industry. So my cat is having some fun with something. Is this very— do you hear that?

Nope.

Okay, good. Okay, um, from the apparel industry— sorry, I'm talking a lot— the apparel industry is the largest— it's, it's the second largest industry in the world and is wreaking havoc on people and planet, and I don't want anything to do with it anymore. To, oh, the apparel industry is the second largest industry in the world that touches literally every human being, and what if What if we use this as a force for good?

Right.

That's, that's how it started, with that orientation shift. Because why would I want to add any, anything to the enormous global production? Or, or the, you know, the— yeah, the numbers are crazy. I think I said it was like between 80 and 150 billion items of clothing that are produced each year. globally, worldwide, 64% is never worn, thrown away. So why would I want to add something to that? And the orientation shift— oh, it's the 2nd largest industry in the world, touches almost every human on the planet. And what if, what if I could just start, start small, just show how we could do it? So that's how it started.

And I love it. It's a journey. And I think it's important. I wanted you to share it. It's a— no, there's no direct path, right? There's no just like— and I feel like people will look at my path because I have a pretty direct path. Like, I decided I wanted— I knew what I wanted to do when I was 12, and I got an internship when I was 16. Like, I've just All right, I'm in. And that's like a path, but— and people are like, oh, that's amazing. But I also am not the norm. It's, it's more normal, I would say, to have these life experiences and go around. And yeah, you were in the fashion industry, but like you say, you, you tried and didn't— you're like, oh, I— Don't want to be involved at all. And now you've, you've gone through this process of arriving at, I do, and I can make a difference. It's, it's a complete 180 from your younger self of, I don't know, I'm small and I don't know too much and I can't do anything. And now you're like, well, I should do something. I am, I'm Not only should, but I am doing something and I want to improve it. And I think that's— and it's small, right? It's accepting like, oh, well, you're going to do your little bit and it's okay to do a little step. Like, it's— you don't have to be Adidas to make a difference.

Yeah.

You can be small and still make a difference, and it does make an impact. Even if it's you sell 100 pieces of amazing clothing, then you impact 100 people's lives. That's, that's still 100 people that are—

Yeah, yeah.

Enjoying what you've made. Their life has improved in some way, even a small way, right?

It's— Yeah, yeah.

Which I think your point though too, of like, well, Fashion touches everyone all the time.

Like, yeah, there's just some—

well, dude, like, we have pajamas, tribes, stuff to wear when we sleep. We have all the time to wear when we're awake.

All the time. And literally, I mean, there's just some indigenous tribes who might live in very remote areas, right? Maybe, you know. Yeah. So it, yeah, it's like the huge connector if you think about it. Wow. And there's so many people involved, um, from, you know, from the, from the farmer to, uh, to the spinner, to the dyer, to the weaver, to the cutter, to the pattern maker, to the sewers, to the embellishers, to the finishers, to the packers, to the You know, the ones who press it, then the ones who ship it. And so, um, oh, and the people who unpack it and open it in a store and merchandise it and put— and it starts, you know, and who designs it. So it's a huge industry.

And all those people are wearing clothes while they do that.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I mean, it's literally— you, you are— there's no way to not be touched by it in some way, unless you are, like you said, there's, there's probably some indigenous tribes somewhere hiding out that don't— they have no contact with anybody out in the outside world. I guess what, there's, there's like some islands off of India that are like no, no contact areas.

Yeah, and they might make it, you know, like they might make their Virgin, you know, they, uh, and so, yeah, so there's some form— they don't have an industry. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly.

Well, I wanted to jump back a little bit too because you, you mentioned your idea in your mind of, oh, well, we, we've met— clearly we have mechanized making clothing, right? It should be a machine, right? It can't be And I remember distinctly when I was a kid trying to figure out what machine, like how a sewing machine would just like make a shirt. Like, I couldn't, I was like, maybe it's possible. And I was like, remember internet came out and starting to try to read and finding out, oh, no, and looking at the sewing machines and looking at the final product, like, That, that doesn't really add up. There has to be— there's no like magic machine where you put in some fabric and it like cuts it, sews it, and puts out, here's a t-shirt.

Yeah, yeah, it doesn't, it doesn't exist. So here's the thing, it actually is existing now, but up until now, and it's not widespread yet, and it was before the Yeah, so it's called a SewBot, and they— what has been so difficult since the Industrial Revolution, which is actually how, like, the sewing machine kind of was the starting point, right?

100-year-old technology.

Yes, and it hasn't changed because it's the motor, the fine motor skills that are needed because the fabrics are not stable. The fabrics move.

Oh, right.

And yes, and so that's why you needed a human to actually do it. However, though, um, they— there now are, um, sewbots or robots, and I can send you a link maybe. Um, yeah, I can send you a link to a video of how this works. I think it is with, you know, air suction, and so the pattern pieces are being transported and, you know, to—

Mm-hmm.

So it's kind of a sewing— it is like a sewing line. But the transport is through air-sucked conveyor belts in a way. And so it moves from one station to the other. And so—

I'm learning something new.

Yeah.

Amazing.

Yeah. So it is.

You will send me the link. And for everybody listening, I will put the link in the— it will be in the description.

Yeah. Yeah. So, which was like a real crazy thing when I first saw that. I mean, the impact that it has on people in producing in countries is just enormous because they're like Bangladesh, for example, it is still over 80% of the industry is in apparel manufacturing. So, and you know, any innovation, it always, you know, it always moves us forward. So it's, I think things have to shift. And so there might be, you know, more higher skilled labor and Operators. So anyway, but it kind of freaked me out when I first saw that. Yes, jeans you can do, like denim you can do, t-shirts you can do, sweatshirts. So fairly simple things, even, you know, jeans are a little more complicated.

But they're kind of staple, right? They're— yeah, yeah, well, we make more of, right? I imagine we make more t-shirts than—

yeah. And the cost, the cost, the manufacturing cost is comparable to making things in Bangladesh, for example. So, and you can do it in the US.

Oh, wow.

So that's something that—

That's impressive.

So it's coming. It's coming.

Finally, it's coming.

Yeah.

What is this?

No way.

20— I don't know, I've been doing product design for 20 years, and that's— this is the first I've heard of a machine that could actually do it. Because I've seen, I've seen some that are like semi-automated where it's kind of you push a button and it'll do like really straight, simple, simple things, but it's all still like you said, there's still a person there. ready to intervene and correct or adjust because it just can't, can't handle fabric. That's, that's impressive. Learning, learning something new every day.

I know, it's— that's the cool thing. That is a cool thing. And I have gone completely, completely the opposite direction in a way.

Right.

With Korefei, um, because, um, I'm aligning, uh, with artisan, artisanal communities in India. And I was very, very, very fortunate and lucky because every, all of my sourcing and, and finding my partners happened during COVID Um, and it was via Zoom. And yes, and, um, so Yeah, I haven't even traveled, which is kind of— yeah, I haven't even had an opportunity to travel to India to meet with everyone in person. Um, I'm a German citizen and my green card— it's a long story. Um, any, any minute, any, any week now. Um, so that was— Yeah. Talking about these mindset shifts, what I, I had this assumption that in order to go to countries, um, or I didn't want to say outsource. However, if I wanted to make product, I wanted to make a difference, and I, and I made attempts to make product here in the US. And it didn't feel right for me because even though made in the US sounds very nice, it doesn't mean it's ethical. And I think there was just a huge— it's just a couple of months ago, like this huge discovery in the news that companies like Nordstrom's and, and What are some other ones? Like, well-known brands are making product in the US, and it is like sweatshop, and it's not being paid, and it's basically kind of slave labor conditions. So—

And I've heard, I've heard about companies using prison labor as another favorite for achieving Made in the US. Without having to actually pay for it.

Pay for it. Yeah. Yeah. And then the thing is also sadly, but it is just the truth is, um, either people don't have the motor skills, you know, aren't as skilled, um, or, you know, it is just, it's almost not feasible as a small brand to not completely outprice you if you pay if you want to pay ethically. Does that make sense?

Yeah.

Anyway, so I was, um, and then I had this assumption I had to have like a certain, certain minimum order quantity in order to go to countries like Bangladesh or India to make a difference and to pay, you know, pay well and, um, and make a difference. And, um, so through, again, like for me, it's all of this. It— I came to meet my, um, my partners there. And I'm working with 3 organizations. One is a nonprofit and 2 are— one is a woman-owned sourcing and development company in India and another one, they are very strong about the preservation of ancient artistry.

Oh, amazing.

And so I've been like all my products except there's one shirt where it is sourced cotton, like everything else is handloomed. Everything else is made by artisans on handlooms. There's no electricity. They're using the old, the old traditions, um, that has been passed down for generations, um, whether it is handloomed indigo denim and whether it is, um, the, the linen. Um, that, that I've been using. And that's based on this scientific study. So that was another component that came in on how Cori Faye started, um, was based on the scientific study about the vibrational frequencies of textiles. Um, and yes, yes, yes, I know, it's like all going quantum. Um, and It found— so they set a baseline. It was done by, uh, Dr. Heidi Yellen in 2004, and you can find it on the internet as well. And they set a baseline of the human body at 100 hertz or megahertz, and then they measured different textiles against it. They measured organic cotton, and it also clocked in at 100 Hz.

Yeah.

And then they measured, um, traditional cotton. When we said traditional cotton, it's with pesticides and fertilizers, all that stuff. And so that was lower, I think it was 70. Uh, they measured, uh, polyester, nylon, and it came in at 15. And they likened it to an ailing, diseasing body. And linen came in at 5,000, and so did wool.

I'm wearing linen right now. I love it.

There you go. You're on to something, seriously. So yeah, so that was the second component. So one was I wanted to make a difference for people, and then I wanted to be able to confidently talk about why it's different. And I have not in my 20 years in the apparel industry heard anybody talk about, um, about like the frequency or vibrational frequency, or if it's good for the body or bad for the body. It was just about drape and cost. Like hand feel, drape, cost, and does it look cute? And so that one, and that one was like the, the second component. So, um, high vibrational frequency, that's what I call it. It's a tagline: high vibrational, uh, high vibrational clothing for conscious women. Right now it's women's, women's at the moment only. Um, yeah, and so that's kind of— that was, that was that. And for me it was like, um, You know, if textiles have high vibrational frequencies and you can't wash that stuff out, it's just inherent. Um, like, how does the state of the maker influence the vibrations of the garment? And how does— and, and then it's, it's funny, you, uh, I would love for you to meet her. Um, uh, and she became a friend, but I was introduced to her woman who, um, uh, grew up in Nepal as a, as a girl, so it doesn't have as much value as boys. And so she was a very poor family, doesn't even know her birth date, and she was an enslaved, uh, child laborer in the apparel industry. So she fell asleep on a heap of clothes every night um, the stuff that she sewed that day and was just wondering, who in the world is wearing, is wearing these clothes that are woven with my suffering, with the energy of my suffering? And, um, and that is something that I can 100% stand behind. Like, we are not conscious yet. On large, we are not conscious yet. We are not conscious and aware that Our clothing has energy that can lift us up and that can break us down or bring us down. And, and just this idea, like, how does the person who makes this, the, the, the state in which they make this influence our own well-being? And we aren't well.

Hey, it's Ian here. So glad you're enjoying this episode of Conscious Design. If you want the full scoop on conscious design, what it is, how we do it, how you can do it, then check out our book. We wrote it so creative entrepreneurs like you can code social and environmental responsibility right into your brand's DNA. You can download the first chapter for free. Link is in the description. Enjoy the rest of the episode. Don't forget to like, subscribe, and share. Well, you think about like, and it's, it's funny, I haven't looked to see if there's any Any study on this, but maybe, maybe whoever did the vibrational study on, on fabrics would do this. But people always say, no matter what, even, even people that are extremely only into exact, like, science will be like, well, my mom makes the food better. Like that, just that, right? Grandma's food tastes better. Mom's food, like, it just—

Yeah.

Eating at home, it's better somehow.

Yeah.

If you think about it, well, you're— for most people, their mom and their grandma love them a lot, right? And they make their— they're not being like, I hate you, I hate you. They're— they are putting their love in what they're making. So, and we know, I think, and it's— I wouldn't say The, the average person really thinks about it, but like, I've been looking at quantum mechanics since I could read.

That's so amazing.

And actually understand it. And it just, this idea of vibration and like all that, all those kinds of concepts, I think we're like the study that you said, we're slowly going, okay, well, yeah, the theory works and oh, it's impacting this or There's, um, in Japan, I forget the name of the guy who, who does it. He's, he's like the water guy.

Yeah, what's his name? Yes.

Um, but even to the snowflake, he can make a snowflake a different shape based on that energetic, the vibrational quality of it. And I think he's, he's the same person, or he Maybe he worked with a person.

Let's find out. Like, I need to know now because this bugs me that we both of us can't. It's like the science, or it's water frequency that he studies.

And then there's a study of like the plants, which has been repeated over and over again, again, is that if you have 2 plants and you Tell one, I love you, or happy words, kind words, words of affirmation, any of that. And then you do the opposite to the other plant in the same room next to each other.

Mm-hmm.

One dies and one thrives. And so just like, and those are, you know, and people kind of push, push that away. But that, but that particular one with plants has been repeated over and over and over. Like they do it, We've had some of the schools or friends whose kids have gone to school have done that as an experiment, as a kid in a school. Like, it's not— but we kind of isolate, oh, well, that's plants, right? It couldn't be anything else. It's just plants, right? Or maybe your kid. Instead, well, if it affects the plants, Yeah. Like, what, what else do you think that this could affect?

Yeah, it affects the water structure too. I, you know, like, it's, um, yeah, you, it, I think the worst is, um, neglect. Like, even worse than— so, same what you said. Yeah, I think that's the third. It's like, I love you, I hate you, and the other one is neglect. And the neglected water, it turns foul, something like that. And then there was other things where then freeze it and, you know, the loved ones have these beautiful crystals. We don't— yeah, we are not as a, as a whole, as a society, we are not really conscious of, of that yet. Um, we don't—

we're scratching the surface. I think, like, I don't even know when the idea of quantum mechanics. I mean, the idea that we're talking about has been around for thousands of years. If you look at, you know, like the Vedic books, like it's there. But even quantum mechanics, I don't— I think it started to come from Einstein, like in his later years.

Yeah.

It was a theory that he was a part of, I believe. But that's been, you know, 50 years since he was, he was even starting. That was, that idea was really starting. So it's slowly, slowly coming about.

Yeah.

Which is interesting. It's, I would love talking about and hearing about all of that quantum, quantum entanglement. And yes, yeah, so interesting. Because it's, yeah, hard, hard to look at.

Yeah, it's, it's true. I think for me what was mind-boggling, and that was part of my spiritual journey, and, and the scientific and the quantum part of that was like a huge influence for me, um, and this idea that everything is energy. Like when we are talking about frequency, frequency is information and it's energy and everything. And when you hear like everything in the universe is energy and you're like, ah yeah, but I can see you and you are made of matter and that's real. And so, but when I understood that we are way more energy than we are matter, And it's just an illusion that our eyes, we're seeing like the 3-dimensional reality. But if we like look at the hand and, and anything in the universe, and we drill down to its most basic component or building block, it's the, um, subatomic particle, which is made out of 99.99999% energy and only 0.000001% matter. 1% matter. So yeah, we are literally way more energy, uh, than we are matter, and I'm sure at some point we'll figure out how to harness that in a way more efficient way.

Um, I hope so. There's so much of it there.

Yes, kind of crazy. And, um, yeah, and that Like these influences that we cannot see, we can only perceive, like Mama's, like Mom's food or Grandma's food is better, just tastes better.

Just like it more.

Yeah.

Better.

Yeah. Or I mean, I have this with my husband. He has his, he has his like health tracker. I call it his boss. It's a Whoop. I don't know if you, have you heard of the Whoop?

No.

Where it just tracks like everything. It's like a little bit of a biohacker. It tracks everything. It tracks his HRV and it tracks his recovery and how well he slept at night. And besides his work, he's like, he's an athlete and he loves downhill biking. And so everything is really focused around that. And when we go to a restaurant, like my recovery was really bad. But when I make the food, and even if it's somewhat identical, and I know that in restaurants they put more stuff in it to make it taste a certain way to bring people back. And, um, we, uh, I'll try to cook quite clean, but then his recovery is there. So yeah, like, it's so interesting, uh, just to, yeah, just to notice this. Just to notice that.

Yeah, I think it's a very interesting additional layer, right? Because a lot of— we think about user experience, right? As designers, we're thinking about the person who's going to use the product and how are they going to use it? How is it going to impact their life, right? And even concepts like human-centered design, which has been around for probably 20, 30 years now, um, that is really focused on a lot of the physical, right? It's just the physical.

Mm-hmm.

And it's not really looking at— because what you're, you know, when we talk about the vibration of something and how that affects your state of mind, like, we're— what we're really, really talking about is kind of the emotional level. And it's super funny because I was— the podcast I just recorded before this, we talked about something called emotional durability and this concept of how do you design something that you actually want to keep and take care of. And the example she used is An instrument. So if you play an instrument and you like it, right, you create this beautiful music, you have this attachment. Like, it's— you may not use it every day. Like, I have a violin. I haven't played it very much for the last 10 years, but I still love— like, it's great. I keep it. I take care of it. It is in the proper temperature. Like, there's— it's more than just an object. And part of it is because when I, when I do play it, I really enjoy it. Like, it, it makes me happier. It makes me, makes me, um, enjoy that, that moment a lot. So the same thinking about this, you're, you're doing the same thing, and they're doing it to a different product of how do we make this product enjoyable on as many levels as possible.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. You are doing that and you're adding this, this level of, well, how does, how do these clothes actually impact your emotional state for the day? Which is like, I think a lot to think about, right? It's, it's more than most because we think about surface level of, oh, you'll enjoy using this. But to then go to like, now we have a study, right? You're like, oh, there's a study done on the vibration. How do we pick material that actually improves on this? Level that we are not even— we don't typically perceive at all, really. I mean, it's right, you go into a store, you're like, oh, I try on clothes, I don't know this one. At most you can be like, oh, I like the feel of linen, it feels not like, you know, that. And that's been, um, when I wear linen, it's like, oh, this is nice, I like it. But there's no like But there's no like quantifiable, like nobody's been like, well, until you of course have been helping tell people about this, there's not been like this clear line of, oh well, it's because of this. It's always just like, oh, it must be because it's, you know, it's fancy, right? Or that like, that's what we can go with. It's super high quality, fancy fabric. And that's like the general description. So I love that you're like, well, yeah, sure. And like, there's— there is more to it than just it's expensive. And I think that is also something that people think of, oh, well, it's expensive, therefore it's good quality, therefore it's better for you. And like, Mm-hmm. I don't know, there's plenty of fashion brands that are also making polyester Clothing.

Very expensive.

It's very expensive. And it's not, it's not that it's not better. Like, physically, when you feel the fabric, it doesn't feel better.

Yeah. And you know, it's so— it's— I had, I had on my, on my Instagram Live a couple of weeks or months ago, a yoga instructor, or she— well, now she's an entrepreneur, and she helps other entrepreneurs. But she has been in the yoga industry for 20 years, worked with Nike and as a consultant, Oprah. I mean, she had done everything you can do in that space.

Amazing.

And, and we're talking about, you know, what we're talking about today. And she said, it's like, it's so interesting if polyester, which all of the athletic brands are using polyester, Um, and we— and a lot of people choose, and it's, it's comfortable, it's stretchy, uh, and you can— it wicks your sweat away. Why do we have sweat? Um, but I digress. And so she said what it was a good idea that we're in 105-degree heated rooms wearing polyester on, and our pores are open. Our skin is the largest organ on our body, and we have this on the entire time. Like, and we breathe, you know, the mats are made— were made out of specific materials. The, the blocks, the yoga blocks, are out of a synthetic material. So— She said, sometimes I could swear that the yoga block was melting underneath my, my palms. And, and we're breathing that in. And okay, well, like, let's just go with the breathing it in. The microfiber pollution is enormous. And you just—

Right.

If no, if somebody wonders what even is microfiber pollution, and, you know, it's so tiny, we don't need— go with a lint roller over your yoga pants, and then you'll see the microfiber pollution. That's there. I mean, it's everywhere. It's in our waterways, it's in, it's in the air. We breathe that stuff in. Um, I— yeah, we're talking about plastic bottles that are going out in the ocean, and I think that there is a— it's an enormous problem.

Yeah.

And what does it do to our— what does all of this plastic— and there are studies done, I mean, you can read it up. We ingest about a credit card amount of plastic every week. Every week.

I just saw that again on some article I just read. They were mentioning—

It's not a year.

Right, right. Yeah, that's, that's every single week. So you're eating 52 credit cards.

Yeah.

A year.

And so, you know, I'm sometimes wondering, what does this do on our hormonal— on our— to our hormones as human society? I know, like, this male sperm count has gone down like 50% in the last 20 years. I'm not saying it's—

There's another study, uh, the plastic, it acts as an estrogen. In your body.

Yeah, so you wonder, you know, what— sometimes I wonder, really. I know we have— it's a very political issue about like gender dysphoria and, and like these gender issues, but I'm just, I'm wondering, um, how much is this contributing to the issue if, you know, for women On birth control pills and the estrogen is in the waterways and, and, and, but as you said, and then all the plastic is also acting as an estrogen in our, in our bodies. What does it do to other human beings? Anyway, we could go on forever on this, but it's like, just like, let's be curious. Just a wonder, what if, like, what other implications Does this have?

Well, it's, it's one of those things, right? Because people also are like, well, we know the answer. Like, no, we don't. We don't. We, we, we are constantly on a global scale experimenting. And we do not know. Sometimes we, sometimes we won't know until 20 years later. And we're like, oh, That happened. Got it. It's, it's there.

And it's a total evolution, right? And there's no conspiracy. I don't think that there is a conspiracy. I think everybody for the most part is just doing the best they can with the information and knowledge that we have. And I, you know, I worked in the athletic industry and really it increased— like, did it help increase performance for athletes? Maybe, who knows, maybe it's just like a constant evolution of getting better. Um, but it was— it was all of this done to improve the performance of the athlete? 100%. 100%.

Right, there wasn't a secret plan to poison everyone.

No.

It's performance-based.

It's—

I've known some designers and that's in the athletic world, and it's all— I've never had an inkling that, oh, there's like some master plan to ruin all that. Like, it's all about performance. It's every waking moment working on your project. It's all about how do we make something that improves performance. Like, that's it.

Totally.

That's— that is your goal. That is your— your marketing team is depending on you to make something that at least, if not even just psychologically helps their performance, somehow helps.

Yes.

So they can go sell it. Like, that's—

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. And there are, there are power powers, or, or it's, uh, capitalism. And when it comes to fast fashion, polyester was just the entryway because it's cheap. Oh yeah. It's cheap and there is infinite, uh, resource. You can infinitely pull that oil out of there, it seems like almost, uh, out of the earth and make cheap clothes. And this is how fast fashion has become like so, so enormously big. And if companies like Shein Are the most influential. I mean, this is crazy. Like, most influential brands, like, of— was it this year or last year? It's just insane. But it is— it would not be possible. And do I think it's about performance? Uh-uh. It's just about selling more. Yeah, it's just selling as fast and cheaply as you can. And this is where the— this is where the 64% of products that are never being worn comes from, I believe, or they're worn for a TikTok and then thrown away.

Yeah. And I think, you know, this is interesting, right? Because I approach sustainability a little bit differently, I feel, than a lot of people, because there's a lot of people really focus almost in an exclusive way that like, oh, well, everything has to be biodegradable. Or everything has to be recyclable, or instead of looking at it in a broad sense. And I think kind of that the initial pure idea, right, is, well, could polyester be used in a way that could enhance some area? Probably. Yeah, there's, there's, there is probably a perfect application for it. It should be used in that area.

Mm-hmm.

But should it be used everywhere? And that's where it's like this hard— people, people like to have these black and white lines of like polyester is evil all the time, or, you know, everything needs to be this one way. And it's like, well, we live in this world where if we haven't figured out by now, black and white doesn't work.

Yeah, like that nuance. We're— yeah, we're very nuanced. Human beings.

There's— yeah, the human experience is not black and white. And I, I think we're slowly getting there, like realizing it's— and I think it's, it's great, right? This, this movement of you be whoever you want, right? Because we're all a rainbow. Great. And can we apply that to everything? Like, there's— there is A rainbow, everything, everything is a spectrum. Literally, the light that we see is a spectrum. Like, we don't see— if somebody sees black and white, they're like, oh, you have something wrong with your eyesight. How can we help you to see the whole range? Because there's more than black and white.

Yes.

And I think that approach of like, okay, well, here it applies here, but it does not apply everywhere. And I think that's where polyester became this, oh, well, just, you know, stick it on everything. And now you have Shein and then—

And even— and yeah, yeah, really. Yeah, totally. But what it also is, is it's really every— you have these polyester cotton t-shirts, you have these polyester and nylon is pretty much blended into Everything, and what it does, it it is to bring the cost down. A, but it also brings the quality down. So it might be easy care, or that's like the marketing thing. It's easy care. It's wrinkle free. Ya da da. And you think, oh, this is amazing. The problem is you wear it a couple of times, and it just looks doesn't look nice anymore.

Yeah, it doesn't matter if it doesn't have wrinkles. It's It's pilling and it's— Yeah, exactly.

And like the seams are twisting and, you know.

Yes, yes, I've had that. Like, oh well, I guess, yeah, I guess my seam is now almost in my belly button.

On my back. It used to be over here. And so like, awesome. Yeah, you have, but this is what it is. So, and, and it doesn't only happen for cheap brands or fast fashion brands. It happens literally everywhere. So I guess as like this big, big takeaway is it's almost like the food industry, right? Just buy where you can pronounce and understand what the ingredients are. If there's too much stuff in it, probably is not so great. So Buy your nice cotton t-shirt, and maybe you have some elastane in it. Okay, great. You know, buy wool and don't buy acrylic because nothing with acrylic will look good after 3 times of wear and you'll have to throw it away. So it's like throwing money away. Um, yeah, buy linen, buy organic cotton, um, buy regenerative, you know, like buy silk, even though silk has lower, lower vibrational frequency too. Not sure why that is. Interesting. Yeah, yeah. But buy things where you know where it's coming from, right? Where you at least have an idea what— where it's come from. And it will be better for you.

Yeah, I think, I think that's a great analogy. Treat your clothes like food. Read the, read the ingredients. See what's in it. And find, and you know, if you can't pronounce it, it's probably questionable.

Oh yes.

Amazing. Amazing. Well, this has been a blast. It's been great chatting with you again. I'm so glad we were able to keep the conversation going. Yeah. Um, for just to, to make sure anybody that's listening to this and wants to check out your clothing brand or what you're doing. Where's the best place to find you and everything you do?

Yeah, so, um, Corey Faye website. It's very hard, it's a little harder to, uh, spell. Means leader, by the way. It's from ancient Greek. Um, that's on the, on the website. I all— that's the website. I'll send that information to you. Maybe you can put it in the show notes. Absolutely. Um, and then under my name itself, Um, I've got a website too. I'm focusing working on designers more in a coaching facility. Um, yeah, enough coaching capacity. Um, yeah, and I'm on Instagram, I'm on LinkedIn.

Easy to find.

Easy. Yeah, easy to find. Easy to find.

Perfect. And we'll— I will make sure we'll, we'll have links to everything Thank you. Show notes for everyone so you can just click and find, find everything. And we'll all— we'll find that research study and we'll get that in there too, because that's—

Yeah, I'll send you that and I'll send you the info about the SOBOTS.

Yes, yes, we'll have both of those for everyone listening and watching. We'll have those links for you guys as well. And yeah, thank you so much. I really appreciate you having the Taking the time to chat some more.

Yeah. Oh, one last thing, if I may.

Absolutely.

If people want to, uh, experience their own vibrations, like the vibrations in your own body, the best way, and a kind of the precursor to meditation, people are interested, I do these free community breathwork sessions. I'm having one tomorrow, actually. Usually they end the first— the, sorry, last Thursday of each month at 7 PM Pacific. But I have one tomorrow.

Perfect. Well, we should get that link put in there as well for people who want to join you whenever you're doing that. Yeah.

Amazing. Yeah.

Amazing.

Yeah, it's very exciting. Very exciting. Thank you so much for having me.

Of course, of course. Thanks for being on.

Yes, thank you. All right.