1412: Global Hibernation, Self-Management After 2 Years & Coronavirus vs Economy

I started investing in real estate to supplement our retirement for the cash flow process. I currently own 10 properties and an additional 10 with my husband. So 20 total. We found the Creating Wealth Show Jason Hartman through my husband going on the.

Internet and looking around for something like this.

Welcome to the Creating wealth show with Jason Hartman. You're about to learn a new slant on investing, some exciting techniques and fresh new approaches to the world's most historically proven asset class that will enable you to create more wealth and freedom than you ever thought possible. Jason is a genuine, self made multimillionaire who's actually been there and done it.

He's a successful investor, lender, developer and.

Entrepreneur who's owned properties in 11 states, had hundreds of tenants, and been involved in thousands of real estate transactions. This program will help you follow in Jason's footsteps on the road to your financial independence Day. You really can do it. And now, here's your host, Jason Hartman with the complete solution for real estate investors.

Welcome to episode 1412. 1412 and welcome to.

I just. I'm speechless. Honestly. For one time, I am almost speechless. Not completely, but welcome to witnessing history. This is absolutely astonishing what is happening around the world and in the US There are credible rumors that say we will see the President announce a domestic flight ban, where planes in the US flying domestically are grounded. That we will see a quarantine measure of some sort. And the Fed yesterday, Jerome Powell was out with a rate cut basically to zero. Zero. Yes, zero. This shows us that the Federal Reserve is desperate. They have used their ammunition already. And what should have happened for this to play out better than it probably will is they should have raised rates, okay, raised rates before, raised them gradually so that the economy could absorb them and then they could lower them. Now, in a crisis situation, and we are most definitely in a crisis situation, the economy of planet Earth is going into hibernation mode. Hibernation. You know, bears, they hibernate in the winter, right? Other animals hibernate as well. And what happens when they hibernate? Their systems go to very low level of activity, just enough activity to keep the organism alive. Very slow heart rate, appetite goes away, and the animal just goes to sleep for a long slumber and then wakes up. And that's, that's what we have. That's what the economy is going into hibernation mode. Yesterday, when Jerome Powell was speaking, you could almost hear in his voice the kind of this, I don't know, this sort of desperate vibe where he was just reading a script and, and he wanted probably to Say something else. But maybe, you know, maybe it would have been imprudent to do that. Absolutely. The Chinese have this saying, may you live in interesting times. And, boy, we are definitely living in interesting times. So what is the best case scenario? What is the worst case scenario? Remember Warren Buffett's philosophy, right? Buy on fear, sell on greed. Right? Buy on fear, sell on greed. And so the best case scenario is probably something along these lines. Maybe we'll have a domestic travel ban. We will have a, and I should say flight ban. Maybe we will have quarantine measures. I hear that they've already enacted those in Puerto Rico. People cannot leave the house after 6pm or before 5am you know, they're afraid of civil unrest, et cetera, et cetera. So maybe this whole thing will just kind of blow over. And that is certainly possible that in a month we will see this kind of subside. And maybe you think it's an overreaction. You might be right. Nobody knows. Nobody knows. Maybe it's an overreaction. Maybe it's an underreaction. We just don't know yet. But this is what has to be done in the case of something like a virus. Because I'm sure I don't need to tell you the news. There is so much news out there now, it's just impossible to keep up. It's, you know, my head is spinning. It is absolutely impossible to keep up with the news right now. You would think there is nothing else going on in the world outside of COVID 19. And there certainly are other things going on in the world, but that has dominated the news cycle of every media outlet pretty much everywhere. And so maybe, you know, this all blows over in a month. I mean, heck, we'll be into April, will be into mid April, springtime. The virus doesn't like sunshine and doesn't like heat. Apparently 86 degrees is the number. You know, some say drink hot water, drink coffee, drink hot tea, because that will help kill any potential infection. You know, there's all kinds of home remedies being peddled out there. Some of them may be very legitimate, some probably quackery, and maybe it just subsides. You know, there's a quarantine for a couple of weeks. The store shelves are bare. Heck, look at everybody in America's got enough groceries by now. And certainly they probably got more than enough toilet paper. And then we see everything recover. But no matter what, we must go into a recession. Because if you take and slice a couple of months out of an annual gdp, you can't recover from that data wise. Now things can ramp back up quickly, of course, but the data will still be the data. And there may well be $20 trillion. That's with a T20 trillion coming out of the world's $80 trillion or so GDP. So it's absolutely shocking. I mean, the Las Vegas strip has basically closed down. Carl Icahn, that's the big corporate raider guy, I remember him in the late 80s, you know, reading about Carl Icahn. Well, he's back in the news and he says he is shorting commercial real estate. And I think he's exactly right. He says it is going to blow up. And this goes to show you that our strategy with the home being the center of the universe was the best strategy for investors. The home being the center of the universe. I have always told you for the last 16 years, it's all about housing, housing, housing. Boy, if that could never be more true than it is today. Never more true than it is today. So Federal Reserve cuts rates to almost zero. They launch a massive $700 billion. That's only 300 billion short of a trillion as another quantitative easing. But what can that really do? Like we talked about last week, on a double episode last week or two consecutive episodes, I should say, you know, it's a supply demand shock problem. Okay? You know, just easing the money supply can't solve this problem. It can help it, it can soften it, but it cannot solve it alone. And on Wednesday, we are going to have a special episode for you we recorded last week. It is about the return policy for real estate. So let's go back to that best and worst case scenario. Best case, it all blows over in about a month and this whole thing calms down. We tame the spread of the virus and the infection rate declines, the death rate declines, and everybody's back to business. All of the investors who bought properties now are looking like totally courageous rock stars. Okay, because they got these insanely low get paid to borrow interest rates that we have, Right? But what's the worst case scenario? Well, sadly, nobody knows. Nobody knows. And I have been morbidly watching apocalyptic movies and documentaries. I watched Contagion, I watched Outbreak, and I watched a fantastic documentary that you all should watch called Virus Empire. Virus Empire. That was really fascinating. You know, we all basically understand the basics of the about viruses and pandemics, but there are a lot of distinctions that we don't understand. And there are a lot of silver linings that'll come out of this. So that worst case scenario well, first of all, nobody knows, but maybe, maybe scarily, this goes on for another year. Maybe it softens a bit in the spring and summer, which I'm pretty sure that'll happen even in a worst case scenario. But maybe we have millions of fatalities. God forbid. God forbid that happen. So maybe, you know, that's the worst case scenario. This will change the world's habits forever. Forever. At least for our lifetimes. People, there will be a push to work at home, okay? There will be a push for home based services. The home will be the center of the universe. And like I said, Wednesday. Sorry, I'm jumping around here a little bit. Folks, listen, I'm only human. I'm frazzled too. This is absolutely nuts. What's going on in the world. Italy is canceling mortgage payments. Okay. Yep. And they're talking about, could the US do that? What kind of aid could the government give to people in the U.S. i mean, the layoffs have already begun. Some of your tenants will be laid off, but there will most certainly be a bailout. What does that bailout look like? I'm sure the president and everybody in government that is involved in this has been working on that problem day and night. And the bailout's coming. Remember under George Bush, when Bush basically sent everybody in America a $600 check? And one of our clients, Christy, by the way, I'm sure you're listening. Christy, Hi. You posted on my Facebook that you got a $1,600 check. I think it was. I only got 600. I don't know how you did that. Maybe that was cause you're married or maybe you got a kid and I don't know, maybe it adds up or something, I'm not sure. But I only got like 600. So that could stimulate the economy. But again, it's a supply demand problem. So this will not be the complete solution. Because remember that the supply demand curve, there's an inflection point in that supply, supply, demand curve where right now demand for some things is actually quite high. Clorox wipes, hand sanitizer or groceries. Right. Toilet paper. Insane. Okay. By the way, use a bidet. You'll only use like 10% of the toilet paper used and it's much healthier. The Europeans got that one thing right. They got a lot of stuff wrong in Europe, but they got that right. And this. Can you believe I just made that recommendation, how to use less toilet paper? Yeah. This, this is a show that's going to save you money and improve your life. Okay? Right there that's good advice.

So that supply, demand curve inflection point that is coming and we're already seeing some of it where we see supply shock and demand shock. Remember China, the workshop of the world has been basically shut down. Now it's starting. The engines of China are starting again. We're starting to see the pollution rate pick up, which is sadly a way to monitor the engine of the economy. And as we see that come back, we are going to see a big demand for some products, for necessity type products. And who knows what that demand will look like because the thing that will determine it is what kind of layoffs have there been? What kind of bailout has been initiated? We don't know yet. We just don't know. We know there will be layoffs, but we don't know what the bailout looks like. And the bailout is coming. And, and guess where it's coming from, folks? It's coming from.

Money created out of thin air. That money created out of thin air. I shouldn't even call it money. It's not money. It's currency. It's fiat money, as they say, which is really just currency. It's just a symbol that everyone believes, right? The value of the dollar, the value of the peso, the value of the yen, the value of the ruble, whatever it is, right, the euro. So that is going to be created on a scale we have never witnessed before in history. The money creation, the currency creation, I really should say currency, that's the proper word that is coming at us is nothing short of a massive tidal wave, a tsunami of epic proportions. And you know what that means? That means inflationary pressure. It's got to work its way through the system. But it has to, it will, it must, it always does. Okay, there's some lag time there, but it will work its way through. And when it does, those people who have been following my plan of iidd, inflation induced debt destruction will profit in huge, huge ways. So look for it, expect it. It's coming right now. All I can go back to is really the quote from Warren Buffett, Be fearful when everybody's greedy and be greedy when everybody is fearful. Okay? That is what we've, we've got to recognize. So best case, this blows over in a month and becomes sort of a secondary news story. And that could easily happen. Worst case scenario, it's three years. And we're going through this for, you know, one, two or maybe even three years, which is, by the way, the normal kind of cycle that every 10 years there's three bad years, right? That's kind of normal. And we were due for an adjustment anyway. So maybe like my guest said almost two weeks ago, maybe that's exactly what's going on here. Maybe this is just the excuse to sell the over inflated assets in the stock market. I mean, the stock market is absolutely in free fall. I might be even making stock tips. Okay? Yes. Me, who doesn't even like stocks, okay, Might even be recommending stocks in a couple of weeks. Who knows? Stranger things have happened, folks. Stranger things have happened. Okay, Reach out to our investment counselors. Learn how you can take advantage of pandemic investing. 1-800-hartman. That's 1-800-hartman or Jason hartman.com and you've gotta be talking to and working with our investment counselors. You cannot do this just by going to our website. You need a person helping you finding you the best deals, helping you making recommendations, kind of guiding the way. And that's what we're here for. We're here to be your guide and to help you through this as I have been doing for the last 16 years or so and overall many more years than that, but just in the investor only side. Now our guest today will be Drew Baker. Remember him? He's been on the show many times. He's back today to talk about his two years of self management. He's been doing it for two years self managing. So we wanted to get a kind of an update and a recap from him. And of course we're going to talk about the big news story, coronavirus. So we're going to talk about both of those things here. I believe in this segment we started off with self management and we're going to circle back to the economy and the way it's going and what this all means to us. So here we go with that. And we will be here every day this week, five days a week to help you with all of this. Also, one more thing I wanted to say. Remember one of my many other podcasts is the Holistic Survival Show. The Holistic Survival show is designed to help you protect the people, places and profits you care about in uncertain times. I started that show and did about 250 interviews of all types of. I started that show just over 10 years ago during the Great Recession and it's a show you might want to check out again. So the Holistic Survival show, look it up on any podcast platform and you'll get some good advice there on some more survival y type tips. We've talked to, I've interviewed infectious disease experts, preparedness experts, et cetera, et cetera. So check that out. But right now, let's get to Drew Baker as we talk about a recap on self management and then of course, what's going on in the economy.

It has been about two years and you have heard our client and friend of the show, Drew Baker, on the show several times talking about self management. In fact, at last year's Meet the Masters he was on talking about self management. And now that he's had some time to do it, I thought we'd get into the good, the bad and the ugly and just kind of go over some of that stuff quickly. And then some thoughts on coronavirus and the economy. Drew, welcome back. How you doing?

Hey, Jason. I'm doing well, even though my hair's on fire based on what's going on in the markets. It's crazy.

The world is absolutely crazy right now. My question is, how many times have you washed your hands today?

Yeah, I'm going to not say because I'll be in trouble.

Well, wash them more then. Hopefully you're washing. Wife is nagging you, right?

Yeah, I haven't left the house though, so that's part that's good.

Okay, so let's talk about self management. First, you use the Buildium software, which you recommend. I want to distinguish something for our listeners. There are a few different pieces of software that you'll want to avail yourself of as a real estate investor if you're self managing. The low cost version of Buildium the that Drew uses is good for sort of what I'll call the mechanical operations of managing your property. Now, if you have a property manager, probably not going to need Buildium. Property Tracker is a different thing. It doesn't do as much on the mechanical of managing your properties, but it does help you sort of deal with them from a more macro level and also evaluate other investments that you might or might not want to purchase. Drew, you're self managing in Indianapolis and I think just one of your Memphis properties. Is that correct?

Yeah. Well, the thing that's nice about Buildium is it keeps the tenants responsible for paying rent on time. And if they don't, the system automatically assesses them a bill and they have a balance, a renting total there that they can log in and see themselves. I don't know, I'm not like a QuickBooks Pro or anything like that. And Buildium is its own ecosystem that you become familiar with, but I probably only know how to use 10% of the application. It's Very robust and it's enough that can keep the system going between the tenant and I. So you don't need to know every functionality, but it's been good. And then your other question.

Buildium is a software that a lot of bigger property management companies use, but they do have a really skinny down, sort of minimalistic membership that you subscribe to and I think you pay what, about 40 bucks a month?

Yeah. So you have access to their full features and they go off of how many units you're managing. So I think if you manage 20 units or so, it's $40, $45 a month. And what's nice is that gives you access to call them and say hey, I need help with this or can you show me how to do this? So they really hold your hand and you get sort of the same white gloves treatment as a full service property manager would get. Renting, leasing hundreds of buildings.

Yeah. Thousands of doors or and of course.

They'Re paying a lot more for the software because they get the functionality of spread across their entire portfolio.

Right, right. Okay, good. And then you've got several properties in Memphis and several in Indianapolis. And I think in Indianapolis are you making managing all of them? Self managing?

Yeah. I lose track of how many are over there, but I think it's something like seven or eight or maybe nine. I don't even know. I think I've enough to keep me busy, at least for now.

Okay, you're just self managing one of yours in Memphis, right?

Yeah, one of the properties I have in Memphis. I would look at the statements from my property manager and there were sometimes there were entire years where, where we weren't getting one service call. I felt very comfortable when I pulled the plug for my property manager making a couple missteps that I wasn't happy about. I basically said, okay, well I'm going to pull this property away from you and if you don't improve I'm going to pull all of them.

I've been self managing that one for about a year now. I've actually have found it that it's not difficult but I've had some trouble kind of closing certain types of things, buttoning up certain things that I can't get people to go out for. Certain types of tasks that I thought it would be easier to deal with.

Okay, so here's the moral of the story. Just to give people the macro picture. In Indianapolis where you've got several properties, you've got a better network there of people to help you do your remote self management handyman, etc. But in Memphis, since you've only got one property, self managed, and that's a newer experience for you, I think you just took that over recently, took it back from the property manager there. It's more challenging because you don't have that network and also you're new at it and you don't have the economy of several properties. Right?

Yeah, I think that is probably a large part of it. I think the other part, at least maybe this is my bias is I think that Indianapolis is an easier market to self manage in than something like a Memphis or one of these other areas that I think has a different set of dynamics. I think you're dealing with a different type of tenant.

And I think that's not to be. I think the problem is a lot of people go into these markets where they're buying a house for $50,000 or $100,000 and they're dealing with the type of tenant that's not going to be as compatible with self management because you don't have boots on the ground.

I'm in the unique position where a lot of those hundred thousand dollars homes that I had in Indianapolis, the tenants had already been in place for a couple years, so the tires had been kicked, so to speak, and the tenants are there to stay for a while. And some of these tenants have been there since 2014. So they're good tenants, they're paying on time. Whereas if you're just jumping straight into the fire and you don't have any, you don't really know what's going on, you don't have any context, it can be more challenging for sure.

Yeah. Okay. So in other words, the lesson is the better quality tenants in Indianapolis make it easier to self manage, you think? But you also don't have as much experience in Memphis yet, and you've got the weakness of only having the one property there. You might change your mind about that probably in the future. Maybe, maybe not. But for right now, you definitely like the self management when you have the better quality tenants in Indianapolis, right?

Yeah. And I'd say it's about half my properties in Indianapolis are sort of the, you know, C plus B, you know, homes and then the B plus A minus type properties. So. And I'd say in Memphis it's more like a solid C. Yeah.

Right. So lower grade property, less expensive property, but also comes with a lower grade tenant. Maybe the property manager is more necessary when tenant quality goes down. Interesting point. I think that's, that's something I could totally See? See? And that makes sense to me. Okay, Drew, any other tips you like hello sign. I know that. And then let's wrap up the self management topic. But I know you wanted to talk about HelloSign. It's been really handy for you.

Yeah. So kind of going back from that, I had a tenant in one of my kind of pristine, you know, nice kind of jewel properties that I have in Indianapolis, and I actually bought it with the idea that if I ever want to bail on California and try out that market, because every time I've gone out there, I've just Really?

You could even live there?

I could live there, yeah. So this was kind of a place that I bought that I thought was good enough for me. And, you know, so I found a tenant and they've been excellent and so I wanted to renew their lease. And, you know, my leasing agent offered to help me with like a docuSign between the tenant and I. But like, it's sort of like playing telephone where you have to, you know, contact the property manager or contact the leasing agent, have her draft the lease and just there's too many cooks in the kitchen and have to get two signatures from both the tenants. And so I didn't want to subscribe to DocuSign because it's 50 bucks a month and I'm only going to do maybe one or two leases at the most.

Just for those who don't know. HelloSign and DocuSign, which you've probably heard of, is an E signature platform where you can get documents signed through email without ever printing the document. So it's quite a bit easier. HelloSign is free for just a few documents a month. Right. And that's why you use it.

Yeah, it's extremely simple to use. You just put in the tenant's name and their email and then you can say whether you want them to sign, date or initial wherever it is in the document. And then it just sends out the email to them and they just can do it right on their smartphone. And then it emails you the PDF when it's been signed by both tenants.

You've got a legally binding signature. Good stuff.

Yeah. What's nice is this tenant I thought was really an excellent asset for the house. They replaced the water heater for me and they did it. The husband said, hey, I think I can handle this. I'll be happy to do it for you. I don't feel as stressed out doing it because it's not my house. Which I thought was kind of funny. So he replaced the Water heater. And so I said, hey, you guys have been great tenants. In a perfect world, you could commit to stay for another two years and rent will stay the same. I decided not to try to get an extra 20, $25 out of them just because they kind of have that pride of ownership. And to me, it's not worth. It's worth me securing them for another two years than trying to squeeze a little bit out of them. And that's the approach I took. But the thing that's so nice about this is I have a relationship with the tenant where I know them and my decision to have them stay is one that I'm making. Whereas like a property manager, they want them to stay because of the fees that they get. And it's not one that's an informed decision on whether the tenant's good for the house or not.

Yeah, no, I definitely think there are many, many benefits to self management beyond the obvious. Obviously, you're going to save money that might be $1,500 a year or so on property management fees. But more importantly than that, you're going to have a better managed property most of the time. And Drew, I mean, you really are improving your properties as you go, which we've talked about on prior episodes, so we won't get into it now, just in the interest of time. You're really making better properties that long run are just going to have nice, huge benefits for you. And really, your tenants, they're just having better experiences now and they have that social pressure of having that personal relationship with the owner. I just think the self management option is really a great one. And the fact that we can do it long distance with technology nowadays, you know, it's just, it's just amazing that we can do that. Yeah.

So to just put a button on it, the thing that's nice about this is I, the tenant who moved in maybe 18 months ago, the rents have not changed dramatically in that amount of time. Not enough for me to already raise the rent. And I secured what would be equivalent to like a $40,000, you know, when you annualize or take over the two years, what the rent's going to be. I mean, you're talking about, you know, a $40,000 lease that I wrote and sent to them without paying a penny.

Thank you for mentioning that. You know, that's something I want to mention. As real estate investors, as landlords, let's all remember the size of the deals we're doing. Okay. When we bring on a new tenant, if their rent is $1,500 a month, and it's a two year lease. You know, that's a $36,000 deal. We just did. Okay. A lot of you listening are probably in sales. Maybe you sell software or business services or whatever you do. When you sign up a new customer on a $36,000 deal, you know, that's sort of significant. Right. Just understand that's basically what you're doing when you sign up a new tenant in your property for that two year lease in your example. So that's great. Good stuff. Okay, Drew, let's talk about what's in the news nowadays. The scary, scary world we're living in with the coronavirus pandemic. We literally can call it that now because the WHO World Health Organization officially renamed it to a pandemic from an epidemic. You have some interesting thoughts about this. I thought I'd ask you to share those quickly. As far as the virus itself and economic impact.

Well, I want to preface that I'm not a scientist and I feel like everybody's an expert because they've been on Facebook for 15 minutes.

That's a scary, scary thing about today's world, isn't it?

I want to preface by saying that. But yeah, I don't want to say I saw this coming, but I've been paying attention to this for over a month now. And I guess people that have been really on this have been paying attention since early January. But it has started to sink in that this could be bigger than the 2008 crisis. I mean, because in 2008, we sort of knew what was. We knew where the problem was. And this is a whole different set of factors because we just don't know. And the markets just don't like the unknown. And what I would say is this could possibly be a nuclear bomb directed at baby boomers.

Okay, so that's interesting. Now, just a couple comments on that. First off, this is such a wild card scenario. This thing could literally be blow over to a large extent in three months. But maybe not. It might be a huge issue. We just don't know. Nobody knows yet. And markets certainly do not like uncertainty. They're giving away free money now. I mean, the Federal Reserve has cut rates. The government is talking about all sorts of stimulus. The Federal Reserve is talking about all sorts of stimulus. The federal government may literally start buying stocks. I mean, my God, this is just absolutely weird. But why is it a bomb directed at baby boomers? Are you saying because of their retirement savings and stage their hit or because of their susceptibility older people with weaker immune systems. What are you saying?

I mean, you sort of nailed it. It's like, here's an older generation who is just on the verge, if they haven't already retired, that needs to keep what they have if they're going to make it. I mean, because even though the baby boomers are the largest wealth cohort of all the. In the demographics sense of things, this is targeting older people more so than the young. Luckily, kids don't seem to be affected as much by it. But I think the part that's scary is that it's being underreported how this can have an adverse effect on people in their midlife. The guy who was the whistleblower in China died, and he's 39. So it's really uncertain. Some people say it's mild, some people say it can be really bad. But my brother is an RN nurse in la and he works in the icu. And so I'm talking to him because he's the one who's going to be in the front lines of this and the icu. I mean, in Italy, they're saying that the hospital infrastructure is going to be 10 times under, understaffed, under, you know, able to handle this. And I mean, it's scary, man. I mean, that whole country's in lockdown and we're starting to see it here, right?

Right. And interestingly, one of the things that actually plays against us in the US is that, you know, we are a theoretically free country, right? And the government is less likely to just insist on a curfew or insist on quarantine and things like that. And the citizens are less likely to follow them because we've got this sort of attitude of, you know, oh, my constitutional rights, you know, I'm free, I can do what I want. You know, understand something, everybody. The virus doesn't care about the Constitution, okay?

It is constitutional rights agnostic. And in a country like China, you know, you could argue that, yeah, maybe their numbers are false. I mean, the numbers are juiced. Every government does it. Okay, but maybe even more so there. And maybe they reacted poorly initially, but once they got ahold of it, they locked stuff down and the infection rate has really subsided there, you know, at least that's what they're reporting. But in the us can we do that? Will we do that? Probably not so much.

Yeah. It's easy for China, who has a stellar track record on human rights, ha ha. To tell everyone to go inside. And if you don't, I mean, it's scary. I don't know if you've seen on Twitter just people wailing, being locked, being welded shut into their apartments just without any food. And basically the health minister administrative staff comes to your door, checks your temperature. If they deem that it, they take you with you, lock you in a steel box behind a truck and you go to a detention center where you're supposed to get better. Except those people seem to never be coming back.

Yeah, in the detention center where they make you better, you also get some reeducation in favor of the Communist Party, right? Well Drew, that got some interesting stuff you've shared today. Thank you for sharing your self management experience and please keep reporting to us on that. And also the thoughts on coronavirus. I think it's really still a big question mark as to how all of this is going to work out and the intended and the unintended and the unknown consequences of all the players in the economy. So we'll continue to follow it. Thanks for joining us.

Okay, thank you so much.

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