1850: Chasing Success - Dr. Alok Trivedi: Rewire Your Life & Unlock Your Full Potential!

This show is produced by the Hartman Media Company.

For more information and links to all our great podcasts, visit hartmanmedia.com.

Welcome to the Creating wealth show with Jason Hartman. You're about to learn a new slant on investing, some exciting techniques and fresh new approaches to the world's most historically proven asset class that will enable you to create more wealth and freedom than you ever thought possible. Jason is a genuine, self made multimillionaire who's actually been there and done it. He's a successful investor, lender, developer and entrepreneur who's owned properties in 11 states, had hundreds of tenants, and been involved in thousands of real estate transactions. This program will help you follow in Jason's footsteps on the road to your financial Independence Day. You really can do it. And now, here's your host, Jason Hartman with the complete solution for real estate investors.

Good morning, empowered investors. Today we have a 10th episode show for you. It's number 1850. We're getting near 2000, aren't we? Episode number 1850. And our guest today will be Dr. A. Luke Trivedi. Yes, he is known as Dr. Rewire. As we talk about general life success, that's what we do on our 10th shows. We talk about something of general interest. And he will be with us in a few minutes. But first, we've got a few things to cover just quickly on the market and on a client case study, sort of a very abbreviated one. We do long client case studies where they come on the show and they talk to us for a half hour, 45 minutes, tell us all about their experience and so forth with their investments, the good, the bad, the ugly, the things they've learned, the lessons they've learned. But today I just want to share with you some numbers, just some client experience numbers here. So this client is our client, Brandon. And no, it has nothing to do with the Joe Biden meme. Let's go, Brandon. But boy, that one kind of faded, didn't it? Unfortunately, it did sort of fade. Probably the big tech companies suppressed it because, hey, if you say that on your show, then they're going to deplatform you or they're not going to show your show or if you post it on fake book, they're not going to show it to anybody, right? So we all know that they show it to like three people to make you think that it just wasn't interesting to people. What a scam. Ghost posting, right? Anyway, so this is a Performa and here is a property that Brandon purchased. And this was November of 2019. Ocala Florida, one of the big markets for us. November of 2019, Ocala, Florida, Ohio. Oh, by the way, one of my guests who is coming up on a show taught me how to use this cool laser pointer feature. And I'm going to teach you right now because it's really neat. Now where is it? Okay, more I guess you click on. Oh, I can't find it. Oh, laser pointer. Here it is. So look at this. Oh wow, that is so cool. If you're watching on video, you can see how cool that laser pointer is. That's a feature in Google Slides. Very neat. So purchased it November 1, 2019, Ocala, Florida. And let's look at what happened. So this property was purchased for $231,900. 2319 or sorry, it was purchased for $149,900. And at the time of this Performa, which by the way was in January, because I presented this in Houston at a conference I was speaking at and it was worth at that time $231,900. So it's probably worth a little more now. I'll estimate that the, this property is worth about 240 to 245 now. But I haven't checked. Actually it might be worth even more than that. Even 2, 250,000 or even a little more. But anyway, 2319 at the time I presented it. So you see the difference here. Now this is really important when you use Property Tracker and by the way, you can go get a free account, just go to propertytracker.com you can do all of these great performers yourself. And I just want to tell you, back in 2004 when I started using this software, this is one of the things that really helped me become a very good, very analytical investor. When you put in the numbers yourself, right, you really understand it better. You know, there's an old saying about how we learn by doing right. And this great Dennis Waitley poem, he says, I can watch your hands in action, but your tongue too fast may run. So the there's a big difference between someone telling you something which hey, that's fine, but when you actually do it yourself, you learn so much more effectively. And we have free accounts available for you, totally free, 100% free, no strings attached. Go to propertytracker.com and get yourself a free account and use this awesome software to help you analyze deals. In all my years of doing this, I have not found a big better piece of software for deal analysis. Now I will admit that on the tracker side, there's sort of two components to this software, the property analysis side and the property tracking side. It is called Property Tracker after all. There are some softwares that have definitely beat it on the tracker side that do more things in terms of like property management. This isn't really a property management program. It does do a good job of tracking and accounting, but. But that's included in some of the management software. So there are some better options for that out there and I've presented them On My Rent YouTube channel, which is real estate news and tech R E N T. It's an acronym obviously. And so check those out there and we talk about them sometimes in our monthly inner circle calls, which by the way, the Empowered Investor Inner Circle has a new name. It's now called Empowered Investor Pro. So just want to let you guys know that because we're upgrading some of the features and doing a huge overhaul and upgrade to the social networking site. Really cool stuff coming. You're going to see it really soon. It's. It's almost ready for launch, so more to come on that. But anyway, go get yourself a free property tracker account so you can type in the numbers yourself and you can see the effect of them. When you change one number versus another number, how does it affect the overall return on investment? How does it affect the cash on cash return, the cap rate, the gross rent multiplier, all of that stuff, right? What if you change the interest rate, the property appreciation projections, the management fee, the maintenance cost? All of these things really have an effect and you can see how they impact the bottom line differently depending on the metric. And not the least of which, of course, the debt coverage ratio. Okay. Another metric not too many people except lenders ever talk about. Okay. So anyway, one of the things we will not allow our partners, our local market specialist, our clients that are selling properties to do when they upload properties to our website@jason hartman.com is we will not allow them to use a different purchase price here than the initial market value, even if the property is below market. And it may be. I mean, that's sort of not always easy to determine. Exactly. Right. Because remember what I say, the ultimate appraisal is when there's a meeting of minds between a ready, willing and able buyer and a seller. Right? That's the ultimate appraisal. When those two come together, right? Everything else, income approach, cost approach, comparison approach, the three approaches to evaluating properties, those are all an opinion, right? They're a bit subjective, even though they may seem analytical they are subjective to some extent, one degree or another. But the ultimate appraisal is when a buyer buys the property and closes on the deal. Okay? So anyway, we don't allow them to make these prices different. But now with this, we are looking in hindsight. So this is no longer subjective, it's objective. Because we know what Brandon paid for the property and we know what the current market value is. Right. And by the way, this is out of date. Even so, it's higher than that now. All right, so these are the numbers and it's really good to look back and use this as a rear view mirror Performa, not just a forward facing Performa for a one year projection. See at the top of this sheet, the, this segment of property tracker is called the one year projection. Right? It's a projection. And projections are just that, they're an estimate of the future, they're a prediction and they may not come true. Or they may do better. They may do better, they may do worse, nobody knows. Right, because you're looking to the future, but this is looking in the past. So this ought to be called the track record of actual performance. Okay? That's what it is. We're using it in a different way than it's usually used. So look at the total return on investment here. 246%. Wow. That was the period from November 1st of 2019 to January of 2022. A 246% return on investment. Wow, that is just phenomenal. And this is because income property is that beautiful multi dimensional asset class where you earn your return on investment from many different ways. And I know this might seem extraordinary, incredible, unrealistic, but don't take my word for it, do the numbers yourself. Go to propertytracker. Com, get yourself a free account, it's 100% free. And just do these numbers yourself. And if you don't believe the software, you can actually just do the math by hand. You know, you can use what I love, the good old fashioned HP12C calculator. I know some of you don't know what that is. You weren't even born when that calculator was invented. But us old timers, we love the HP12C. It's, it is the awesome calculator. But you can use a regular calculator on your phone or whatever, you can do these numbers by hand, right? You don't have to trust the software, right? Just do them by hand and you'll see that these numbers are real, they are realistic. Okay, so let's talk a little Bit about inventory real quick. And then we'll get to our 10th episode guest Dr. Alou Trivedi. So this meme I posted, I talked to you about it before. You know, let's say there are a thousand buyers who can afford a home with a 3% mortgage, 800 buyers who can afford it at 4% and only 600 buyers who can afford it at 5%. Well, none of this matters when there are only 100 homes for sale. That was the original post. And inventory, which I'm about to show you some charts on, that ticked up a bit with the higher interest rates. So I crossed out the 100 and I put 120. Still a massive inventory shortage. Right. And, and here's how that looks. Okay? At the beginning of the year, we started off with about 293,000 homes for sale. By the way, national association of Realtors publishes these numbers. They calculate it differently. Their number is different. All I want you to do is use an apples to apples comparison. So if you use one stat in January and one at the end of the first quarter and one today, just use the same stats. Okay? But I don't like the way NAR does it. I like the way Altos does it. So that's why I'm using their numbers, because I think they're more accurate. So 293,000 homes and then inventory actually went down, down at the end of the first quarter to 241,000 homes. But, but what is it doing now? That's the question. Now, at the beginning of the year, as I've been talking about this, I said, look, it's like going into the supermarket and seeing 66 to 80% of the shelves empty because that's the inventory shortage we have. The inventory should be 3 to 500% higher than it is currently to have a quote, unquote, normal market. Just normal. Not a glut of inventory, not an oversupply that would be considered normal. Just to get to normal, we need the numbers to go 3 to 5 x 3 to 500% of what they are now. But inventory has risen a bit. So are we at an inflection point? Are we at a turning point? Well, let's take a look right now. Well, not right now, but the last published one, okay, which was about six days ago on the 25th of last month. Okay, 344,000 homes. That's a big spike. Okay, it's up 8%, 8% increase in inventory from the week prior. But overall, compared to the end of the first quarter, 100,000 homes higher. That's a lot. But it's still not even close to where it needs to be to have a normal market. What is normal? Depends who you ask. But six months of supply of inventory is what most would consider a normal market. With a given absorption rate and the given inventory, it takes six months to eat up that inventory. Right? That's what most would consider about normal. What does that mean in terms of numbers? Well, it means, you know, anywhere between about 900,000 and 1.5 million homes for sale. So you can see we are still in a massive inventory shortage. Massive shortage. It is going up now. We'll watch the numbers closely. We'll report on them for you and I. I don't think they're going to go up to normal levels anytime soon. But remember, even if they go up, even if they increase by 3 to 500%, it's only going to be normal. It's not going to be exceptional. Right? I mean, look at 2015 when homes were selling like hotcakes and we were complaining. Listen, go back and listen to my old podcast episodes, okay? Go back and look what I posted on social media back then. Look at my Twitter account at Jason Hartman roi. You can't look on Instagram because I wasn't doing it back then. But you can look on Facebook, okay? And you can see all of the postings I made about this stuff at the time, you know, contemporaneously, right? So they're all date stamped. Listen to the old podcast episodes. You, you know, you, you hear all this stuff. We were complaining like crazy in 2015 that we did not have enough inventory of homes to sell. And that was true because when you segment for the entry level market, this inventory shortage is dramatically worse. It's dramatically worse. This is not price segmented. This is just overall inventory. So it includes 1 million dollar homes, 800,000 dollar homes, 3 million dollar homes, 5 million dollar homes. Everything's in here. It's all in one mix. But if you looked at the inventory numbers for $200,000 homes, oh my gosh, it would be like this. Pretty darn low. Okay? Pretty darn low. All right, let me announce the winners of our giveaway for last week. I didn't do that on Monday. So here it is. So Ryan Klein won the YouTube comment. $50Amazon gift card goes to Ryan Klein. Claim your prize@jason hartman.com. ask. By the way, if you have a question, go there too. Looking forward to empowered investor book. Oh, Ryan. Yes, I got a, you know, finishing a book is a real chore. But yes, I'm looking forward to it, too, Ryan. I can't wait till it's finished. So thank you for your comment. And you have won, so congratulations. Okay, now for the Apple podcast review. It's Smurf Dog. Okay. You know, I used to have a friend in high school and her last name was Murphy, and I called her Smurfy. She liked it. It was cute. It was like a little loving thing. Anyway, so Smurf Dog. Smurf Dog. You won. Valuable content. I've been listening to Jason for years and still find every episode full of content that has been invaluable to my real estate investing. His tangents are amazing, too. Yeah, okay, I'll take it. My tangents. Yep. I'm going to keep doing it. You know, for a long time I thought I got to shut up and stop with the tangents, but then you all keep telling me you love them, so I keep doing them. I'm here to respond to market demand. We are here to please. And whatever you want, we're going to do it for you. Because this is a marketplace of ideas and we respond to consumer demand. Okay, let's get to our guest, Dr. Aluke Trivedi, and let's talk about rewiring your brain. This is a really good interview, folks. I think you're really going to enjoy it and get a lot out of it. So here we go. It is my pleasure to welcome Dr. Loke Trivedi, or Dr. T as he's known, or Dr. Rewire. And today we are going to. If I didn't just give it away, we're going to talk about rewiring one's brain so we can rewire our life and get different results. It all comes from that important instrument between our ears. So I'm glad to talk about this. And he's coming to us today from Chicago. Welcome, Dr. T. Hey, thanks, Jason.

Thanks for having me. I appreciate it.

It's good to have you. So why rewire our brain?

It's a great question. Right? And in your world, in financial and maybe in health and relationships, all these different things, what we're trying to do is we're always trying to live a better life. But. But what I realized over the years is that we kind of do this old. I'll say the old adage of personal development is that we always want things to be better, but we've never actually created a science, a proven, reproducible science to be able to rewire something so that you can actually get what it is you want, right? A lot of times we sit and say these affirmations, which are great. We do exercises, which is great. We do reading, which is great. You do all this stuff. But does it guarantee a process that's going to get you to help and get over whatever obstacle you're holding? And I'll tell you honestly, like, it just doesn't because we know people, and you probably know people as well, thousands of people that have been doing the old methodologies but aren't getting where they want to in their life. Or maybe they got something, but they're afraid of losing their investment. All of this comes down to the way that we think, the way that we actually navigate our brain. And the process is neurochemical. It's completely neurochemical. And what it does, it stops us from doing forward, getting forward in our life, doing what it is we want it.

So the way we navigate our brain. That's an interesting statement. I like that. So how do people navigate their brains differently?

Well, most people don't know that how to even navigate it. Most people, what they're doing, they don't. They don't even know there's a. Thinking is a thing. I like to say that thinking is a science and not the science of psychology. Now it's interpersonal neuropsychology. Right. You can now actually navigate your brain to be able to see what thoughts you're having, what why you're having, the thoughts you're what are the neurochemicals. And we now know this from scientific perspectives to be able to grow and live our life. But most people unfortunately don't know this. And what they do is they're constantly reactive. I'll give you an example of this to give you some context. Right when we're recording this, it's towards the end of the year and January 1st, everyone's going to set these New Year's goals and New Year's resolutions and they're going to say, oh, you know what? Last year I didn't actually achieve what I wanted to. So what am I going to do this year? Believe it or not, every single person will do this one thing. They will double up on what they said that they weren't going to do. They will say, I will do twice as much the following year. I don't know about you, but I did that for many years. Right. And the reason we do that is one neurochemical, it's dopamine. Because when dopamine goes up and then it crashes because we don't get what we want, we actually. It goes down twice the level of actually achieving your goals. And so you need to balance out this dopamine thing. And this is all neurochemical. We express this to people, places things inside of ourselves, and we don't realize what we're doing is we're actually putting ourselves into a bottomless, endless pit of chaos into our life. That's why thinking is important.

So you're saying that the dopamine hit, does that come from achieving the goal or making the goal?

The dopamine hit comes from making the goal, but making it too far and too big and not achieving it makes the contrary. And the shame emotion kicks in and actually gives you double the dopamine loss on the other side. So you create.

So, so in other words, people beat themselves up over their lack of initiative or failures or whatever, right? And you're saying that's twice as bad.

Twice as deep, twice. You don't even realize you're doing it, right. You're doing it twice as deep to the level of actual growth that you actually want. So let's say, let's just take, you wanted to make $1,000, obviously, or a million dollars next year, right? And you don't achieve it. Most people will sit and say, you know what, Instead of taking up 10% or 15, 20%, what they'll do is say, you know what? The following year I'll actually do double. And that's a compensation to our actual dopamine levels. And what that does, it leads us to shame, guilt and resentment towards ourselves.

Okay, so does it always do that? I mean, how do we know if we have this shame, guilt and resentment? You know, not everybody view. Is it how you view failure? You know, some people have really learned to just take failure in stride and say, hey, look, I figured out a way not to do it. But you know, a lot of people haven't, obviously. So does everybody do this or how do we approach this?

You know, everybody automatically does it. Those that have actually gone through more failures and have been able to rise above it will actually realize that the failure was the lesson. They will put it together and they'll create their own strategies, their own navigational processes to be able to help them get over that. They'll be able to do that inside it. But they've navigated their own failures. That's why we all know, like, the people that are most successful are the ones who get through failure. They've overcome their failures because they navigate through that. They understand and rationalize it. They think about it and they grow beyond it. However, here's the problem with some individuals never actually do that. What they do is they may come back and seem to be successful in society, but they constantly live with that fear of it happening again. And that's. Every human being deals with that. That is just a neurochemical process. So someone, let's say, makes $10 million, and they were in the bottom of the pit before. They're now going to create the fear of loss of that $10 million to navigate and balance out that brain.

Okay, so it seems like we've identified the problem pretty well. How do we fix it? What is the specific, you know, how to fix that?

Well, there's several things. What we want to do is first, you want to take it. You want to take everything that you've actually achieved. It's not the failures that actually create the chaos. It's the successes. It's the successes that we keep chasing because it's constantly chasing more dopamine. So if we hit one level of success, what we do is we want to do it again, and then we want to do it again. Then we want to do it again. And so the idea behind this, the process, is not to live successfully. The idea is to live in balance. And let's say you hit it. Let's say, Jason, this is, you know, let's say you get to the 2000th episode of this show, and that's a goal that you wanted. Great. What are the challenges of that? When we look at the downside of our successes, we'll actually be able to navigate and govern and make sure we keep our brain and our body in balance. It's not the failures that have to get lifted up. It's the successes that have to get brought down.

I'm just struggling with this a little bit because. Are you saying that we shouldn't appreciate our successes or that we over appreciate them or we over emphasize them? Is that what we're doing?

That's a great clarification. It's not that you don't want to appreciate them. Appreciation is from seeing from both sides. But when we over index and get too happy and become too elated, too enthusiastic about them, that's when we're going to create chaos in our system, in our body, to recreate balance. So when we get too elated, we're gonna bring the opposite side to ourselves, and the whole nervous system is gonna crash on the other side. So we've got to do is take our successes, but take them and take them from a perspective. Of balance in that, okay, this high success is great. It's something I've wanted to achieve. It's also got its challenges that you've achieved it. There are the downsides of those. There are the upsides of, of the failures. But nobody talks about the downsides of the challenges and the successes. Excuse me, we talk about one because we get addicted to the idea of always achieving, always successful. Because the more we try and achieve, the less or the more we try to achieve, the more we constantly want to chase the idea of more success versus truly being fulfilled. Health and fulfillment come from a state of when we actually governed and have the body in a state of balance. That's what I'm talking about.

Okay, so we get on this treadmill and we keep chasing success. That's pretty elusive because no matter, no matter what you achieve, there's always someone achieving more. The mountain always gets bigger. You look at, in the money genre, look at Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos. Right. Elon's very ahead now, but who knows if that'll stay that way?

It depends on what. It depends what's going to happen tomorrow in the market. Who knows?

Right, Right. Yeah. So chasing is part of the problem then?

It is. And the reason we chase is because we're constantly looking for the next hit of dopamine.

Right.

Which is why I wrote the book Chasing Success. Because it's constantly looking for that next hit of dopamine and that becomes a state of unfulfillment. Right?

Yeah.

I like to say that success is one thing and fulfillment is another thing. But when you actually can have success and fulfillment together, then that's truly living a state of gratitude. And most people are chasing success from the outside, chasing fulfillment from the inside. But realize that success and fulfillment have to happen from the outside and inside together. That's called wealth, true wealth. And that's what I've been able to help people with and gain that true wealth inside of that.

Okay, so let's talk about this dopamine response just for a moment. You know, the social media companies have been criticized, rightly so, for trapping people into these dopamine cycles, I guess I'll call it, for lack of a better word. You know, what they're doing is absolutely disgusting. It's awful. But look, dopamine is there for a reason. The video gamers and, and the social media, just so addictive. Right. And. And same with gambling and casinos, and what they do is awful. What are we trying to do though, is kind of even that out? I Mean, what is the way to handle that? Because we all go after this stuff, it's a reaction. And we do it more because it feels good, right? And you know, this is even true with something that seems like it's good and it's not good in excess, which is exercise, for example. You know, even exercise can be quite negative, actually lead to oxidative stress and you know, a whole bunch of problems, joint problems and so forth, years later, you know, you know, but there's a dopamine hit in that too, right? And people become addicted to it. So is it just a matter of balance? And you know, if so, how do we know where the balance point is?

It's a great question. That's exactly what it is. Social media, right? TikTok, you go on TikTok, you're addicted, you don't even realize you're scrolling through, right? Facebook, you're scrolling. That's right. But that's what it is. And we constantly are being bombarded by over, over dopamine and dopamine. Dopamine, Dopamine is necessary. You need it for life, for food, for reproduction, for growth. It's needed. But it's the over index of dopamine that causes our chaos, right? And what I mean by that is this is right, say exercise, Exercise, it's the endorphins that pull us more than it is actually the dopamine. The dopamine is the chase to feel, actually get the endorphin. But the endorphin is what makes us high from the exercise. Now at the same token, if we're looking at this in society now, we're talking about medical here and health in that capacity. But let's take this now to a business, right? Let someone's trying to do a real estate deal if they're looking always for the next hit, to be the richest, to be the biggest, to be the baddest, that's a dopamine chasing mechanism. And no matter how big the house, no matter how big the portfolio, those things are going to fall apart. Those things, there's always going to be something that's bigger. Someone's always bigger and better at what you do. Now if we grow our net worth and our income and our potential by 10% at a time, our brain can actually navigate this. Our brain can navigate a 10% fluctuation without creating massive index of highs and lows in our life. And so you're right, we want to govern that out and balance that out. How do we do that? First thing we do is we have to first look at and regulate that 10% mechanism so we're not over indexing and creating neurologic imbalance in our system.

How do we regulate it?

You control it. You ask yourself. Instead of looking for success from the outside, you sit and say, let's say a million dollars. Let's say you hit a million dollars. Instead of saying, next year I'm going to do two, which is a very large gap. You take it, I'll go 1.1, take a 10% growth, and then take it to 1.21. But if we gradually look at this over the years and you compound that, you will actually grow much further than just trying to go high and low and high and low. I have athletes, professional athletes, that work with me, and they've been in the World Series, and everyone gets super, extremely elated afterwards. And then they crash after the championship. What do we have to do? We have to rewire that so that they can come back and realize that that imbalance is what's creating what's called a root experience in your system. And that root experience is constantly navigating and governing the experiences of your body because it's been out of balance for all these years. And what we do is that rewire that so that you can actually learn to rewire that, therefore rewire your life, your health, your wealth, and your relationships because of it.

Tell us more about a root experience. You're making me think of a few things, by the way, and I just don't want to forget them, so I'll mention them. Now you're making me think of the concept of the person who peaks too soon. Like in high school, you know, the quarterback, the hottest cheerleader, the most popular, the homecoming queen, whatever, right? You know, that kind of thing. But also lottery winners or people that have sudden success in life. And maybe it was success due to their own efforts, but it was sort of like an imbalanced amount of success. Celebrities, but certainly just people in business that aren't even celebrities, that just have a thing. And, you know, it reminds me of one of my favorite quotes from Napoleon. The most dangerous moment comes with victory. I have seen that play out so many times in life where people are victorious and then they just crash afterwards. They just ruin their life in some way. So the root. That was the question, though.

That's exactly right, though. But you're right on, Jason. You're dead on with it, right? So, like, I have clients who hit their peak with high school. I have valedictorians that come to me all the time. They're super intelligent people, super intelligent individuals. But they peak at that point and then from there forward. Now their system is the nervous system. The blueprint of their nervous system is now trying to chase that same high and they can't get it. And they crash after that. The high school cheerleader, the high school football player. Right. The peak is so high, they peak too soon. I like to say I'm not ready to peak until the day before I die because that means I'm constantly growing. But every individual that is constantly looking or wins, too early, too soon, they crash. I'm a perfect example that in my business, my business career, I started off as a in practice and I built one of the biggest practices in the country. We were seeing over 12, 50 patient visits a week. And I was just a 26 year old kid making a couple million bucks a year. Didn't know that's a lot of. It was a lot of money for me at that point in time. What did I do right after I found my way on the other side? And I kept on chasing this idea of success. And this is why I dug deep into this, is because I had to rewire and navigate my own brain around this. Because if I didn't, I kept on realizing I kept on going high, but then crashing. Kept on going high and crashing. And probably like much of your audience, Jason, like, they're used to succeeding, they're used to winning. They can get what they want because they're smart people. But how do you navigate the emotional side of that? How do you navigate the internal psychology? How do you navigate the internal system? That is what it is. So all these major successes are root experiences that are actually causing you for more chaos in your life. You can have positive root experiences. You can also have negative root experiences. I'll give you some examples of negative root experiences. Bankruptcies, divorces, losing a job, business partner ordeals. These are negative ones. That's common. Everyone knows about that stuff. But where did those come from? They came from the positive ones, not the negative ones.

So what are some positive root experiences then?

Just like we were saying about being a valedictorian.

Okay.

Or maybe hitting, you know, a certain goal that you want to. Maybe building the biggest portfolio.

Sure, sure, sure. But if we're going to set goals and try to achieve something big. Right. The whole point is to have positive rude experiences. So what's wrong with that? You know, let me just frame that question a little better for you. It's sort of an issue of relativity, maybe right because what is a big achievement for. And we'll just take money. Because money is easy to quantify, and it's not the only thing. Certainly there are more important things in life than money, but it is a tool, and it's easy to count. Okay. Other things aren't so quantifiable. You know, you take a person that makes $40,000 a year, right? And that's not much money in today's world. And you take that person and they've got a goal to. To increase their income to $60,000 a year, right? And, you know, that's 50% increase. That's pretty big number. But then you take someone who's, you know, worth $100 million, and they want to be worth $150 million. Same percentages. But the mindset and the context from which each of those people operate is quite different. So is it an issue of relativity? Like, if we make our root experience bigger, then it seems like we're more capable of achieving bigger? Is it?

No, it is an issue of relativity. It's an issue of governance is what it comes down to. How do you govern your brain? How do you navigate it? If the person who made the 60,000 gets super excited and super elated, like, oh, my God, I made 60,000, and they raise a dopamine spike on it, then chances are they're going to have some issues on the back end of that. The person who made 150 million, if they didn't and they realized, okay, it's just a number, it's just the money and they've got it organized, that they're not too elated about it, then they'll continue to grow. The root experience comes in when you become imbalanced with whatever it is you did, when you become imbalanced with the successes or the failures, either of these will create a place where you will now have to navigate through a cycle of trying to get back to balance. So it is relativity, and it's based on the individual, right? You're super successful. Your number of relativity is different than someone who may not be as. Let's take financially liquid as you, financially successful as you. But at some point, whatever deal you're at, if you sit and say, maybe, maybe it's a billion dollars for you, but that number stretches your consciousness. Big goals will then create big chaos. Strategic goals will create a system for you to actually achieve it. That's the difference.

Okay, I like that. So how do we know if our goal is a big goal that's going to create chaos? Or a strategic goal that's going to be, you know, manageable. I've always kind of thought of myself in my own career and financial life as an incrementalist. And, you know, I just kind of plod along and do my thing and I keep growing my wealth and, you know, works pretty well, I must say. But, you know, I do, I admit, I'm human. Listen, I get a little envious of sometimes these people that come out of the woodwork and I'm like, where did that guy come from? And now he's like this big deal, you know, we're like, you know, got all this money. A lot of those are false stories too. We gotta, we have, we have to adjust for exaggeration.

That's exactly right. You're completely right. Right. Like, if you're an incrementalist, as you're saying, you will lead a longer, healthier, more fruitful life than the person that comes in out of nowhere and then crashes out of nowhere. Because, you know, in your industry and mine, in my industry, there are people that have come out of nowhere, but they can't sustain it. Right. And it's the same way in the body. The longevity factors. There's two things we need to focus on for longevity is regulation of dopamine and regulation of glucose. These two things will determine or really insulin, right?

The insulin response.

The insulin response inside. But those two things are dependent for longevity of a human being. If I take that to the same life cycle in business, it's the same thing. You have to be able to navigate the dopamine and the insulin response in business because they're connected. And if we take that and then we say, okay, long term, what's going to happen? But the short term, our society. So dopamine fixed, it says, look at this person. They did all the success out of nowhere and it becomes a rags to riches story that we all love inside of it. But that long term is not healthy.

Yeah, interesting. Okay, so the question was, how do we know if our goal is strategic or, you know, it's going to create chaos? And I just want to make sure people catch that. I want to catch it myself. So if. Can you elaborate on that?

Absolutely. I would say do two things. First, make sure you have the downside of the goal listed out. So you know, exactly what are the challenges that you're going to actually have to go through to get this goal? Because if you can't see that goal objectively, then it is a fantasy. So objectively, can you sit and say, all the negative things that you're going to go through, all the downsides of achieving this goal, if you can look at that, number one, you know, psychologically, from the perceptive standpoint, it's now objectively balanced. Now, do you have a true strategy to actually achieve it? Can you put the steps in place incrementally, day by day, week by week, month by month, year by year, to get what it is you want? That's a strategy. That is a plan, a system. However, in my experience, most people live their life in a fantasy, chasing the next dopamine to next dopamine, not putting a strategy together. I'll give you an example, like exercise, it's a great example of this, right? And I'm just as guilty, right, as maybe someone else. But it's like you start lifting weights, you start training, you want to lose all that weight overnight. Like, oh, I want to lose 15 pounds, I don't take a month. And they're. The marketing is great. Lose 20 pounds in 60 day and 30 days. And all you got to do is take this one pill and that's all you have to do. And you know, and I know, Jason, that's not reality, is that it takes work, it takes effort, takes a strategy to get there. You have to get your, your diet right, your carbs right, your. All these factors to make sure you exercise right and muscle training rate to be able to get you there. That's what we're looking for, is a true strategy around it.

Right. You know what I think happens there? It's interesting that you say that, you know, when you can lay out the steps, and it's a strategy that gives people incremental, small dopamine hits along the way.

Correct?

And then that, number one, it's character building. But number two, you know, because people kind of earn their stripes, if you will, right along the way, then that big success at the end, if the goal is achieved, it doesn't seem like that big a deal. It's like it's a natural consequence of just following these steps, following the strategy and making it happen. So it's more real and more expected at the end of that journey to that goal. Is that a way to make the dopamine more manageable rather than being like a big high and an ugly crash? Because you get those hits along the way by achieving this, that and the other thing, all the incremental steps, each.

Incremental step along the path is a 10% spike. And your body can manage that and you'll grow by that 10% spike your body can manage, your brain can manage that. And you're exactly right. You're putting a piece. I think you naturally probably do this on your own, which is. It says why you're successful. However, most people don't get that. But yes, you want to set it where it's a strategy. And you say, okay, you know, week one, if I do this, this is my success point. Then week two, I'm going to hit this as my success point. Week three, and you're constantly growing a little bit at a time. Right? We build belief a little bit at a time, and that's putting one step in front of the other. One neurologic or one dopamine hit after another. That's how we build belief. This is a psychology of building belief around it, but it's done in this system. I am not a fan of setting big goals because I have seen more people crash and burn off of big goals than actually setting a strategy that they can actually achieve something.

Is it fair to say with the goal that it should be just out of reach but not out of sight? Would that be a good way to look at it?

I think that's fair as long as you can have a strategy behind it. But if it's out of sight and it's so big that you. It scares you. Right. Like, we've heard these things before from personal development that set a goal so big that it scares you. If it scares you, you're never gonna actually move towards it. Like, the brain doesn't work that way. If it's a. If you're afraid of it, then you're never gonna actually move towards it. You're not. And so, like, that doesn't make sense in any capacity. You've got to set it where you can see it. You can see the tangible path that you can take towards getting it. And when you can see that path and you'll actually take action. Our brain is designed to take action on what it is we see in front of us.

Yeah, yeah. You know, that's why I love income property as an investment. It's not like a big hit on some crypto thing that's here and then gone or some deal. You know, it's. It's very incremental and the returns are great. The, you know, the safety and the prudence of it is just great. It's, you know, historically proven for hundreds, if not thousands of years, quite literally thousands, and it's very incremental. So I think that's good. It reminds me of that quote By Einstein who said compounding interest is the eighth wonder of the world.

Yep, exactly.

Anything else you want to share with the audience? Questions? I didn't ask you something we didn't talk about to just wrap it up for us.

I would just sit and say that, you know, we talked a lot about the brain and dopamine, but the emotions that follow it are essential to follow. If you become too prideful, then you realize that that's a state of high end dopamine. If you become too shameful or resentful, it's also mechanisms and feedback to let you know that you were too high in dopamine and now you're feeling the effects of it. So just realize emotions are the feedback that lets you navigate the neurology of the body.

That is great. So too much pride. Pride goeth before the fall, as the saying goes. Right. Too much pride, you know, you're riding on too much dopamine. Okay. And on the other side of it, if you have a lot of shame and guilt, then you know the dopamine hit was too high. Is that correct? The way you look at that, that's really good. I like it.

Yeah, we didn't, we didn't get into the, the emotions and all that. We could do, you know, we could talk about that for hours on end.

Yeah. Well, give us a snippet of it if you would. And then give out your website.

Yeah, I mean absolutely. Just I would sit and say that. I like to say whatever you resent, you'll resist. So if you have any resentment built in your body and built in your brain from a pass root experience, you're going to resist it in the future. If you have guilt or shame towards something, you're going to give away your wealth towards whatever you have guilt or shame towards. And those two mechanisms really run the financial mechanism. And as we're talking about here in getting wealthy from the financial aspect, those two emotions govern it, but they all stem from being too prideful earlier in your mechanic earlier at some point. Pride, as you said, is before the fall. Right. So either of these are mechanisms to give us feedback. If you want to learn more, you just go to drewire.com and that's drewire.com you'll learn more about different things and more content around this stuff. But this has been truly a delight and I appreciate this, Chase.

Yeah, my pleasure. And you've got a book coming out too, right?

We do. It's working on, I don't know exact dates or it's. But it'll be rewire your life. It's coming out hopefully by the summer. That's my plan.

Good stuff. Well, I expect you to take a very incremental and strategic approach to finishing the book.

That's right.

Good stuff. Dr. T. Thanks for joining us.

Thanks for having me.

Jason. Hey Jason, it's Johnny. I just wanted to let you know I re listened to an old episode you did on guided visualizations and boy was that awesome. There's not enough people out there like you who are espousing truth and espousing time tested principles that have created wealth and human freedom. Just want to let you know that was great.

Keep it up man.

Thank you so much for listening. Please be sure to subscribe so that you don't miss any episodes. Be sure to check out the show's specific website and our general website, hartmanmedia.com for appropriate disclaimers and terms of service. Remember that guest opinions are their own and if you require specific legal or tax advice or advice in any other specialized area, please consult an appropriate professional. And we also very much appreciate you reviewing the show. Please go to itunes or Stitcher Radio or whatever platform you're using and write.

A review for the show.

We would very much appreciate that and be sure to make it official and support subscribe so you do not miss any episodes. We look forward to seeing you on the next episode.