2112 FBF: Your 5 Year Plan Contest, Buying $100 Per Month for 30 Years, and Multi-Dimensional Investments

Welcome to this week's edition of Flashback Friday. Your opportunity to get some good review by listening to episodes from the past that Jason has hand picked to help you today in the present and propel you into the future. Enjoy.

This show is produced by the Hartman Media Company. For more information and links to all our great podcasts, visit hartmanmedia.com.

Welcome to the Creating wealth show with Jason Hartman. You're about to learn a new new slant on investing, some exciting techniques and fresh new approaches to the world's most historically proven asset class that will enable you to create more wealth and freedom than you ever thought possible. Jason is a genuine, self made multimillionaire who's actually been there and done it. He's a successful investor, lender, developer and entrepreneur who's owned properties in 11 states, had hundreds of tenants and been involved in thousands of real estate transactions. Jason, this program will help you follow in Jason's footsteps on the road to your financial Independence Day. You really can do it. And now, here's your host, Jason Hartman with the complete solution for real estate investors.

Welcome to the Creating Wealth Show. This is your host, Jason Hartman with episode number 904904. We are getting close to 1000 episodes. Yes, and only. How many is that? 96 more. We'll have a thousand. Be on the lookout for some extra episodes. I've given you fair warning, listeners. They are coming up. We publish every Monday, Wednesday and Friday. But we have so many episodes in the can, as the expression goes. And I think that expression came from the old world of film where they actually put the film in the tin, you know, those, remember. Are any of you old enough to remember that when the film was in a big tin round thing? Well, in the can. Yeah. So nowadays it's just in Dropbox. That's where the episodes are that we've recorded. And so we're going to be publishing some extra episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays. So be on the lookout for them and that will get us to episode number 1000 even faster. So we've got a few things to talk about. Kind of some random things today, a bunch of different things. I hope you enjoyed episode 903 with Garrett Sutton and the Flashback Friday episode about China and the end of cheap labor in China. And then 901 with Dan Ammerman. A lot of people really love Dan Amerman's work. He's influenced me greatly and he was on the show recently. And then episode 900 talking about self authoring with Professor Dr. Jordan Peterson, University of Toronto. So we've had some great stuff there. Don't miss any of those episodes. And for today's episode, we are talking with one of our investment counselors. You've heard her on the show many times before, and that is Sarah. Sarah, welcome back. How are you?

Hey, Jason. Great. Thanks for having me on.

Yep, it's good to have you. So what is going on in your world? Tell us what's happening with clients out there and with business and just give us a little bit of a bird's eye view. You know, your finger is right on the pulse there.

Yeah. Actually, it's just been a crazy week. We've got a lot of clients registering for our upcoming Meet the Masters, of course, taking advantage of the early bird pricing. Lots of exciting news coming up there. Properties are selling quickly. We're in several different markets now, doing a lot of business in Memphis, Little Rock, Indianapolis, a little bit in Cincinnati, a lot in Jackson. Really just all over the place. So working really hard to bring new inventory and, you know, help our clients grow their portfolios.

Awesome. Sounds good. You know, we have beat the drum for many years about the scarcity of inventory. And that's one of the wonderful things that is as frustrating as it can be to try and buy a good property today. And I understand that completely. It is also, you know, one of the things that really makes the value of your property very reliable for many, many years to come. Because built the whole concept of the real estate asset class, it just has built in scarcity. And that's why it is such a valued thing. That's why it has the most favored lending status, the most favored debt status. On no other asset class can you get such phenomenal financing because income property is so secure. You know, real estate is so secure. I mean, people just love lending on it. I'm a lender. I lend on properties. Really. The lending environment has been so busy for me. I'm lending on a few properties every week now. I mean, funding all sorts of deals for people to acquire properties and rehab them and then sell them to our investors many times. Sometimes not. Sometimes they're selling them on the retail market to traditional home buyers, but mostly to our investors. It's just very secure. It's just such a secure asset class and it's got that built in scarcity. And then of course, the preamble to the national association of Realtors oath is under all is land. And. And that is so true. You know, it just dictates everything. The last two weekends I've been in Los Angeles, you just look at that. Absolutely psychotic. And I'm saying psychotic, Sarah. You think it's tough for you to operate in this market? Try being in Los Angeles or someplace like that where these prices are. Absolutely. They're just nuts.

They're skyrocketing.

Oh, my God, It's. It's just all out of control. Now, of course, we never recommend these cyclical markets like that because as the old saying goes, what goes up must come down. And it always does. And we like the safe, conservative, linear markets. But so many of our clients are from places like California or the west coast or the expensive Northeastern markets or South Florida or, you know, around the world. We have listeners in 164 countries, and they're doing the smart thing. Many years ago, Sarah and I. You've been with me about 10 years now, I think. Has it been 10 years yet? Are we. Are we ready for an anniversary?

We're going on 11.

11?

Oh, we're going on 11 in May, honey bunch. Yep.

Honey bunch. Did we have an anniversary and you didn't tell me?

I know we did. We had a 10 year anniversary, I guess.

You didn't even invite me to the party.

Yeah, we need to have that party.

Yeah, we really do. What do you think of my new name for Sarah, everybody? Honey bunch of.

I was just gonna say, did you just call me honey bun?

I did, yeah.

Wow, that's a new one.

Sarah and I, just a disclaimer, are not romantically involved.

But since we're talking about anniversaries, I figured, you know, that would be funny, right? Hope I didn't shoot myself in the shoe, as you say.

No, you're good.

And the other thing. If you don't know the inside joke, folks, Sarah always revises old sayings to make them her own.

I haven't done that in a while, though. I'm getting better.

No, you. But you know, I've got one that is lyrics to a song, an old song maybe from like the 70s, one of those old sappy 70 songs. It reminds me of income properties right now and the real estate market right now and what's going on. And I mentioned it to you before we started recording the show today, and that is the concept of the relative idea of price discovery and inventory availability. It reminds me of this old song and the lyrics go like this. Maybe you'll revise it, Sarah, to make it mean your own thing. But the lyrics are, if you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with. Okay, you're thinking, what does that have to do with investing in income property? Well, it has a lot to do with it because what that really means is, look, the marketplace is the marketplace.

Welcome to this week's edition of Flashback Friday. Your opportunity to get some good review by listening to episodes from the past that Jason has hand picked to help you today in the present and propel you into the future. Enjoy.

And we must always adjust our expectations in accordance with reality. So, you know, like the old song says, if you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with. Right. You know, get your expectations in line with reality here, folks. And that's the same thing with the real estate market. It is the concept of price discovery. And you know what's really interesting, Sara, is I love the feature on Facebook as much as I hate Facebook and I do hate Facebook and Google because these companies are just. Oh yeah, no, these companies are abusing our information. Just, it's, it's scary. Okay, but that's another topic. Plus we get on a tangent, but the one feature I do love about Facebook is Facebook memories. And you know what happened to me just a couple days ago. Yeah, I posted a property that we had for sale back in like 2011 or 2012. It is now 2017 by the way. And I mean, talk about an adjustment in the marketplace. Right. This property was in Atlanta and the numbers were, I mean, you couldn't even come close to those numbers today.

It was a 5,000 down deal, wasn't it?

I don't know if it was one of those old really low down deals that we had for a very short time there, but just the rent to value ratio and the quality of the property, people have had to adjust their expectations. And you know, maybe you can speak to that a little bit because Sarah, many of the clients you're working with, you've been working with them for years and years and years. I mean, they were buying properties from you, you know, eight, 10 years ago and they're still buying properties. But tell me about how they're adjusting their expectations. If they are. Hopefully they are.

It is. It's very true. We have to adjust our mindset a little bit. The cash flow is not as good as it once was. But you know, I just have to remind them about the multi dimensions of real estate investing. And you. One thing that I think people forget about, and there are so many that you've talked about many, many times, but one thing that I think people forget about is, you know, yeah, sometimes you get a little bit of that appreciation. But at the same time, your tenant is also paying down your loan. You're getting the mortgage pay down from the tenant. And so, you know, fast forward 10 years, you know, these clients have properties with really low loan balances that they didn't put any more money into that deal. And now they're able to, you know, some of them are able to tap into that equity. It's not just appreciation. Like I said, principal pay down. And so they're able to have a larger spread there and pull cash out and roll it into new deals. That's one hidden, you know, wealth creator that people forget about. And so.

Okay, so let me comment on that for a minute. Okay, so everybody listening is familiar with the concept of an annuity. You know, like a defined contribution retirement plan or an annuity or any investment like this, or even just a budget for saving money, right? Everybody's familiar with these three ideas. Okay, so if you decided you were going to save some money and you opened up a savings account, we'll just make it a simple example, right? You decided, well, you're going to put a hundred dollars a month into that savings account. Twelve hundred dollars per year. And, you know, over the course of a few years now, the account won't pay you any interest and you'll get creamed by taxes and inflation. Even though inflation's relatively low, you'll still, you're still earning essentially negative returns. Forget about that. Just do simple math of just saving the money like it's in a Piggy bank, right? $100 a month into a savings account. Well, if you could buy the rights, okay, look at it this way. If you could buy the rights to make someone else put $100 a month into a savings account for you, and you only had to pay $20,000 for that. But that right lasted for three decades, for 30 years. And they put a hundred dollars a month into an account for you. Would you pay $20,000 for that? Like, that's a super simple way of looking. And I just thought of this, you know, while you were talking of just looking at a mortgage and the dynamic of real estate, which is actually tremendously better than what I just said, because of course that principal pay down will start. It may be $80 a month, but as you go through time, the principal pay down gets much bigger. You get to year 16 of that mortgage and whoa, you're taking some huge chunks out of that balance and that person's paying a lot of money down just from that alone. With none of the other multidimensional characteristics of a great income property investment. I mean, just that alone, man, I would pay $20,000 for that all day long. What I mean with the 20,000 is, you know, the down payment, right? I mean, roughly 20,000, give or take. But you know, you're paying 20 grand to get someone to put money into an account for you, which is your mortgage principal pay down for three decades. Pretty good deal, right?

Yeah, it's a great deal. And that's also one of the reasons I like some of the more expensive properties. Number one, they're usually in better areas. But number two, and again, this is just something people don't think about, and I had a great conversation with somebody about this last week, is that, you know, the bigger the loan size, the more principal pay down that tenant is doing for you. I mean, you're still getting the cash flow, but you're chipping away at some of that debt. Now, you know, there's another. There's an argument for the other side. I know you don't like lazy equity, right? But you know, the idea is at some point you'll reinvest it or put it to work or sell the property on a 1031 exchange, right?

Right. And even if you do, hopefully you do equity stripping and you follow my refi till you die plan. And if you're not familiar with that, just, just go to Jason hartman.com and type refi till ya ya slang refi till you die and listen to the podcast episodes on that. And I mean, you know, it's just a phenomenal deal because not only do you get the right, you buy the rights to have a slave put a hundred bucks a month in your account for you. Right. But then every seven or 12 years or whatever, you refinance it and you pull a bunch of cash out. It's the greatest investment on earth, right?

Yeah, absolutely. I actually had somebody ask me about the refi till you die. And you know, just to make one clarification or disclaimer, there is that you never know when you're going to be able to access that equity. You know, there's a. We have some examples that we've done in some of our past seminars and podcasts where there's like a seven year plan or a 12 year plan. It really just depends on the property, what the financing looks like. You know, financing guidelines are subject to change. But yeah, the idea is at some point strip that equity and put it to work.

Absolutely, absolutely. Okay, so I had asked you what's going on with your clients and we got off on a tangent, but I think it was a decent one. Yeah. So what else do you want to say? What markets are they buying? They're just buying all over because the inventory being scarce, you don't have a bunch of inventory in like any one market, Right?

Yeah, I mean it really does change from week to week or month to month. One month we might have a ton of properties in Memphis and they sell and maybe takes a couple months before we replenish inventory in that market. And so one thing that I've been helping my clients do is just to be open minded, come up with a plan to start looking at two to three different markets, be open to investing in two to three different markets. And then it's almost a timing thing, you know, when, when the right property becomes available, you have researched those markets, talk to the local market specialists, talk to the property managers, so that when the right deal comes up, you're ready to move forward in any of those given markets. And so recently we've closed. Well, I can kind of rattle off some, some clients that are closing. I mean, shout out to my father in law, Pat. He just closed on his second Memphis deal, so that's exciting. And now I can test him and see if he's listening to the podcast.

Yeah, because he'll say you mentioned my.

Name and you'll know he will. So I'll know, I'll know if he's caught up or not on the podcast.

Good, good.

You know, I actually just had Scott good call with Scott yesterday who bought several in Jackson and I got really good feedback on the property management and just that the properties are performing as projected. On the Performa, we have Damon who just recently closed on a couple in Jackson.

Oh yeah, Damon's got all kinds of properties. Congratulations, Damon. You've really been with us a long time. Yeah, that's great.

Yeah, he's doing great. And I have to check with him. Is he coming to Meet the Masters? Because I'm looking at some of these clients and wondering who's going to be there.

Damon would not miss Meet the Masters. In fact, none of you should miss Meet the Masters. This is. Folks, this is our 20th anniversary meet the Masters. Now as I said before, we used to do it twice a year. Right. We've been doing Meet the Masters for I don't know how long you've been doing that event. Maybe 12 years or something or 10 years or something like that. But, but anyway, this is our 20th event and so we are really just making this a top notch Event. First of all, we've got a lot more space. We've got a much bigger space. We've had a lot of ticket sales so far and that's been going great. Got Garrett Sutton, Rich dad advisor, author of six books, including a few in the Rich dad series. The attorney. He's back. This will be his third Meet the Masters where he's speaking. Danielle DiMartino Booth, the founder of Money Strong, full time columnist for Bloomberg View and a former Federal Reserve advisor. Andrew Zatlin, the leading economic forecaster, Moneyball Economics. John Burns, CEO of John Burns Real Estate Consulting. He's a leading real estate research and forecasting really company. I mean, his company just puts out all sorts of fantastic articles. Brian Smith, the founder of Ugg Boots. For a really inspirational entrepreneurial story, we'll have our local market specialists and property management teams flying in from all over the country. You know, it's sort of like, like the usual Meet the Masters, but we added a day because we're adding a bunch of great speakers to the event. We've got a couple more big name speakers that we are waiting to announce. One that I'm literally reviewing the contract. It's sitting on my desk. And that speaker is super famous, but we can't say the name yet, Sarah, so shh.

Okay, but how many pages is that contract did you find out?

This is a nine page contract involving a lot of money and a big fat speaker fee. Working through this very famous person's agent. Looking forward to announcing that it's just going to be a fantastic event. So get your tickets@jason hartman.com, click on events when you go there. And that's mid January in La Jolla, California. And you know, a lot of people listening live in places where in the middle of January, you know, the weather's not too nice. This is a, a great escape, okay? And it really sets the tone for the year. This is why we always hold it at the beginning of the year, because we want to help you set the tone for your year. And by the way, Sarah, you don't even know this, but Brittany and I, of course Brittany's been on the show just a few times. She's not an investment counselor, but she's been with us for, I don't know, like a year less than you, like 10 years or nine years now. And Brittany and I came, came up with a little contest idea. Okay. So, you know, you can start working on this. We'll announce the exact details on the next Monday episode. But here is the scoop. Okay, what we want to do is we want you listeners to do a little video about your five year plan for your real estate portfolio. Okay? So we're going to pick like first and second prizes for the best five year plan. And you don't have to post the video, you can just send it to us. We'll create a little page for it where you can upload your video, but it's better if you put it on YouTube and get like 6,000 or not 6,630 8,253 views. Okay? If you do that, you're really going to win even some. So you get a better hit if you put it on YouTube and get a lot of views. Okay? So even if your video is terrible and your five year plan stinks, if you get a lot of views, you have a better chance of winning. And we're going to have some great prizes. Our first prize will probably be a Venture alliance weekend for free for two people. That's a $3,000 value. And then second prize will be your travel expenses to meet the Masters. Okay? We're going to have some great prizes. Okay? So we'll formally announce, you know, all those different categories and stuff later. But if you want to get working on this and thinking about it, now's the time to do it. So we want you to come up with the best five year plan. Tell us your goals, the kind of income, property, portfolio you're going to build, where you're going to be in five years, where will you own properties, where will your portfolio have to have properties? What will they be like, what will some of your metrics be like? And again, this is just projecting into the future. You know, there's an old saying, if you shoot for the moon, even if you miss, you still land among the stars. Right? And so it's good either way. You know, look at a lot of the goals I've set for myself over the years. I didn't even come close to hitting them, but I still hit something good. Okay? And you just, you gotta declare goals publicly and that's what your video is going to do. And you know, this is just a short video, a few minutes, you know, two, three minutes long, no big deal, nothing fancy, no high production value, you can do it on your smartphone, whatever. And so just get thinking about this and think about your five year plan. There's another saying. People usually overestimate what they can do in a year and they radically underestimate what they can do in five years. And that is so true when it comes to Income, property. Sarah, think about all the people that were buying properties from us. In fact, some that you just mentioned back in 2012, five years ago. Okay. And now it's 2017. I mean, they have enjoyed massive amounts of appreciation and cash flow. And in five years, the world is going to change dramatically with all of the technological innovation that's going on. Yeah. Lay out your five year plan. I mean, what is your life going to look like, feel like, sound like? What's going to be in your, in your investment portfolio? What's going to be in your bank account in 2022? 2022. Can you believe it's going to be 2022 in five years? That's just crazy. Wow.

It is crazy. And hey, if you post your video on Facebook, in five years, it'll be a memory and you can see if you hit your goal and then you can, you can share it and maybe you, you know, exponentially just do so much better.

Absolutely.

Never know.

Absolutely. That's a great thing. That Facebook memory will come up and that's kind of a diary. You know, they're, they're doing a great job with that. And yeah, so that's the deal. So get busy thinking about your five year plan. We'll show some of the winning videos at Meet the Masters in January. And hey, if you can get your airfare and your hotel paid for to come to the event, that'll be better. And you know, can get a free Venture alliance weekend event, that'll be phenomenal as well. So we'll have some great prizes. We'll get those all outlined. This is just for you to get thinking about it. And hey, you can make your video now. Right. And we'll announce a little link where you can upload it if you don't want to put it on YouTube, but if you put it on YouTube, you can just give us the link and that'll make it easy. So, Sarah, what do you think? You didn't know I was going to say that, did you?

No. I mean, we've been talking about a contest. So I remember we did one a.

While back and Marge, Marge was hilarious.

Yes. Hi, Marge. There were so many great videos. There were a handful of, of really good ones and it was really fun.

And remember one of our clients did a song. I loved that. And he came to Meet the Masters when we had it in Irvine. And this was probably, I'm gonna say circa 2010. He did a song about the, you know, my philosophies and techniques, the ten commandments and refi Till you die. And, and it was like a country song. He got up in front of the audience with a guitar and you know, it was.

I can't remember.

Forgive me. He's probably listening. It's gonna kill me. I think he's from North Carolina. I think from North Carolina. Yeah, yeah. Gosh, that was a long time. Time is flying and see, I'm having a senior moment. I can't remember. But anyway, that was awesome. So you can make a video, be as creative, as funny, as geeky as you want. The more raw and gritty the video is, the better probably. So, so just, you know, just do something. It's no big deal. It doesn't have to be perfect. We're going to love it anyway. So get to work on that. Get to work on your five year plan and memorialize it and declare it publicly. That will be much more likely that you will achieve those goals. You know, maybe you'll be retired from your day job by then and you'll do that through income property. You know, we just had a client, one of our listeners retire from the irs. Yes. Based on her real estate investments. Wasn't that awesome?

Yeah.

And Ani, it's even better when someone retires from the irs. I mean, it's great to hear that people retire investing with us, but when they retire from the irs, there's just a special satisfaction in that one, so.

And I believe Ani's coming to meet the bastards finally. I've been wanting to meet her in person.

Looking forward to seeing you there. Definitely. Definitely look forward to seeing you there. Good stuff. Okay, so what else should we talk about, Sarah, before we wrap it up? Anything else on your mind?

I think we've covered it. I mean, we've gone on every tangent we can possibly go on. One thing I was thinking about earlier, you mentioned something about financing and I was thinking, I cannot believe that interest rates are still this low. I remember about a year ago they started to tick out just a little bit and I thought, okay, this is it. They're going up and I've been seeing a lot of these closing statements and clients are still closing with a 4.75, 4.855% interest rate. So it's still an amazing time to be an investor. Yeah, inventory is a little tight, but there's still a ton of opportunity out there. Be open minded, research a few different markets. It's, it's really a great time to be an investor.

Right. And we want, we want you ultimately, by the way. I just, I meant to Say this earlier when we were talking about, you know, having people look at different markets, when Sarah said that, she was talking about when you're starting to invest. Right. Or if you're already with us and investing now, you know, be open minded to a couple of different markets. But overall I just wanted to tie that back in with the overall plan. And this will help with your five year period plan video, by the way. You want to be in three markets at least. You want to be investing in at least three markets, ideally not more than five. Everybody knows, because I've said it a zillion times, that two major mistakes I made in my real estate investing career, one is that I over diversified. I was in too many markets, you know, 11 states and 17 cities. Just too much, too hard to keep track of. And the other mistake I made wasn't really an investing mistake, but it just a prediction mistake that I wanted to reack knowledge again. And that is what you just mentioned, Sarah. Interest rates. I have been just famously wrong about interest rates. I mean, I thought they would be dramatically higher by now. I was predicting higher rates a long time ago. Now I've been super right about a lot of my other predictions, but interest rates is not one of them. So very, very hard to predict interest rates. But at Meet the Masses Masters, one of our speakers, the Moneyball economist, is very into interest rates and he's going to be talking about that a lot. And also John Burns, who's also speaking at Meet the Masters, he had a really good article just yesterday maybe. Yeah, yesterday it was about spooky things in the real estate market.

In line with Halloween. He was talking about how if interest rates bumped up to 6% percent, what that would do to housing affordability. And still 6% is relatively low. I mean, when I got into the business, you know, rates were like 12% and they were coming down from, you know, 19%. So everybody thought 12% was a bargain.

Jason, when I started working with you in 2007, I bought my first out of state property in Houston, which I still have, and my interest rate was 6.5%.

Wow.

I mean I still bought it, still performed over all these years. And I've had the benefit of being able to refinance that a couple times now and lower the rate and stretch out my payment and, you know, increase my cash flow. So it's been a beautiful thing.

Yeah, no, it is. That's that like I've said many times, that's the one. One of the many wonderful things about income, property is an investment you can refi. Get all your cash that you put in out of the investment, back out, and you still own and control the asset. So super powerful in that way, but also super powerful in that you can agree to certain terms of the deal today, including the price you pay for the house and the type of financing you get on the house and the rent that you get for the house. And then you have the opportunity to change the terms and improve the terms in the future so you're not stuck with the same deal. Right. You can literally redo the deal. If the interest rates go down, you basically have a whole new deal that just got a lot better. Right. If they go up, you also have a whole new deal that got a lot better. Why? Because as I talk about in the three dimensions of real estate, go to jasonartman.com type 3 dimensional of real estate for podcasts on that topic. As I talk about that, as rates go up, basically you're going to get to redo the deal as you see upward pressure on rents and you'll see short, shorter supply, a supply shortage because new investors won't enter the market as much when rates go up. So either way, you can just win. You just get to change the deal along the way. It's a phenomenal asset class. Okay, we could talk forever.

The famous, famous, the famous line is what ABC Always be closing.

Always be closing.

It's got to figure out.

Yeah, always be closing.

Figure out where.

Yeah, right, right. Always try to be under contract where you're buying something. You know, this will, this will get you into the habit of picking up, you know, three, four, five properties every year. Some of you are moving a lot faster than that, as we know some of our clients, but you can just get a few properties a year. You'll, you'll be amazed at how good your five year plan looks if you do that. I mean, you'll just be amazed. So good stuff. All right, get your tickets for Meet the Masters while they're still on early bird pricing. Go to jasonhartman.com, click on Events. Get your tickets there. We'll see you in January for that. We'll see you on the next episode. We'll talk more about the contest. Get to work on your five year plan video. And you know what else, folks? Even if we never see that video, do it for yourself. Everybody listening should at least do it for themselves. Right? But you can share it with us and we'd love to see it too, and maybe you'll win a nice prize. All right, Sarah, thanks for joining me today and I want to wish everyone very happy investing. We're here to help you and assist you with your five year plan any way we can. Just look forward to helping you and thank you so much for your continued faith and support. We're just happy to be there for you and be a part of your plan. So happy investing to everyone. And Sarah, thanks for joining me.

Thanks for having me.

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