2194: Why Waiting for a #HousingMarketCrash Could Cost You Big

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I'm in St. Augustine now. You know, if I had never worked for you and had that wonderful experience and gotten to know you, buying this investment property was life changing. It has not only been very profitable, but it's a wonderful place for our family. And I just, I mean, I'm here right now and just thinking about and wanted to thank you for that.

Welcome to the Creating wealth show with Jason Hartman. You're about to learn a new slant on investing, some exciting techniques and fresh new approaches to the world's most historically proven asset class that will enable you to create more wealth and freedom than you ever thought possible. Jason is a genuine, self made multimillionaire who's actually been there and done it. He he's a successful investor, lender, developer and entrepreneur who's owned properties in 11 states, had hundreds of tenants, and been involved in thousands of real estate transactions. This program will help you follow in Jason's footsteps on the road to your Financial Independence Day. You really can do it. And now, here's your host, Jason Hartman with the complete solution for real estate investors.

Good day, empowered investors, and welcome to episode 2194. Greetings from Poland. I had to escape the heat of Croatia after our super yacht event ended on Saturday. And I came up north, literally choosing the only direct flight. I just thought, if I can get a direct flight from Split to anywhere that I want to go up north, I'm going to take it. And so I just took a chance, and this may be a lesson in taking a chance in life. And I booked a flight to a town I had literally never heard of, Lublin, Poland. Okay. And I've been to Poland many times. Love Poland, it's a great place. But I booked this flight because it was a direct flight and it was only €69. You can't beat that deal, right? But it's funny because by the time I upgraded to their version of business class, it was €75 more. So the price more than doubled. But that's the way it goes. Anyway, I landed and I thought, what have I done? This is just weird. But once I got to my beautiful hotel and walked outside after showering and changing my clothes, I was so impressed with this charming little town, population about 380,000, and really just impressed. I'm telling you folks, sometimes in life, just take a chance on things. You'll be so pleasantly surprised. And so many times on this trip, I have been pleasantly surprised. Been traveling. This is the longest trip I've ever taken in my life. I've been traveling for really about three months now. So it's really a new paradigm for me. But it's been really fun, really interesting and very, very educational. I've been looking at real estate on this trip. I've been talking with people in the real estate industry and it's just fascina. I haven't reported on the direct points of that too much because really I haven't had much to say about it. It's pretty much status quo that I've reported on prior shows over many, many years about real estate. You know, things in terms of real estate don't change too darn much in Europe and probably a lot of countries. Could say that Again, as I've talked about many times before, the United States has an extremely dynamic and special in many ways real estate market. But that's that. Let's just get into it today and we're going to share with you some more content from our Empowered Pro meeting about self management and how you can get maximum control over your investments. Remember, commandment number three is thou shalt maintain control. So we're going to talk about that today and I think you'll really like that. Again, this is paid content that we're sharing with you. We just decided to take a little bit of this. You know, it's not new content, it's from many months ago and share it with you. But you really should join our Empowered Investor Pro program. It is less than the cost of a gym membership and the value is dramatically higher. Look, you can get fitness outside of the gym and you might be better off for it if you live in a place with good weather and you're outside because going outdoors does so much more for you in so many other ways. Anyway, use that money to join Empowered Investor Pro and grow your financial wealth and grow your control and your peace of mind. It's not just about money, so do that. So anyway, we will have that in a few minutes for you. But first I want to just mention again about our bias as humans. It's just weird because I'm constantly seeing things online, on social media, from people talking about the real estate market waiting for the correction. They've been waiting for that for what, 16 years now, right? And it hasn't happened. They've been so wrong and everything's gone the complete opposite way and they're still waiting for this big correction. And one of the big bias problems that we have as Humans, by the way, it'd be a really good idea to go to Wikipedia and, or just type in a general search engine. I mean, don't Google it because they're so evil. But duck, duck, go it or something like that. Bing it. Another other evil. Use other evil companies. Companies instead of the big evil company and search cognitive bias, right? And realize all of these different biases we have that influence our thinking on stuff because it's really dangerous. Well, the one I want to talk about today, just for a moment, is about how people seem to think that because real estate prices and mortgage payments were somewhere lower in the past, they somehow think that they have to revert to the norm, to the past. They have to revert to the past. And that is simply not true. It is not even close to true. I mean, why do people think this? I think they think it because they just want to be nostalgic because they missed out because they didn't have the self confidence to invest when they should have in the past. Now they sit around, around as keyboard warriors bashing everybody else and spewing these predictions of doom and gloom and crash and how housing is so overpriced, which they're not wrong about that by the way, that it is expensive. But just understand, and I'm not, I'm not saying this is a prediction, I'm just saying it could happen. I mean, it may well happen. I don't know. You know, nobody knows the future, right? But real estate could become a permanently much higher priced asset than it is now and certainly than it has been in the past. So watch out folks for these biases that make you possibly think that you're just waiting for the correction. And as you are, your wealth is just getting eroded, eroded, eroded by inflation, by taxes, and you are not getting the multidimensional benefits of income property. Okay, so let's take a look at this. If you're watching on video, I've got some things to show you. If not, listen up and listen good. So here is a tweet or an X, I guess it's an X, right? Thank God for Elon Musk, right? Buying the free speech platform. And this is from Colin Robertson and the handle is Mortgage Truth. It's an interesting point that Colin makes here because he says if it's not mortgage rates, it is a lack of quality inventory or are home prices simply too high? Nearly half of homeowners told Bankrate that they wouldn't sell this year no matter what the mortgage rate. Pretty scary to sell in this market. And try to find a replacement property. This tells me the current gridlock in the housing market goes beyond the mortgage rate lock in effect, which, by the way, of course, we've reported on ad nauseam. And his interesting point here is that it's, it's got more dimension than just that. And, and, and so let's keep going with his post here. There's purchase price lock in, too. Existing homeowners have much smaller loan balances at very low rates. Taken together, it'd be very difficult to reconcile replacing a $400,000 loan amount at 2.75% with a $650,000 loan amount. And at 6.5%, the monthly principal and interest jumps from $1633 to $4100. Even a 3.75% rate puts them at 31, 10amonth. Wow. So his point here is that it's not just about the rates, the high rates versus the low existing rates that are causing the stagnant market and the lock in effect. It's also about the amount of equity people have. Remember, we've reported on this too extensively that people have tappable equity of over $300,000 in their property. So America is very equity rich. Okay? He goes on to say, and by the way, that's me talking. I think you can tell, okay? And if you're watching on video, you can see his post, okay, Then you've got a catch 22, where fewer properties come on the market, which makes it even less compelling to move because there's very little selection and the prices just keep going up. How will this break outside of a distressed sales event? And that's absolutely true. And remember, as I've always said, there is one critical ingredient that you absolutely, positively must have if you want to have a real estate crash or even a correction. And that is meaning that a correction is less than a crash. Right? If you define crash as maybe a 20 decline in prices, you might define correction. I mean, you know, these are matters of opinion. Right. You might define correction as a 10 reduction in prices. Right. Okay. You're not going to have either of those because you've got to have millions, maybe tens of millions of distressed homeowners that become millions of distressed home sellers. And we have the complete opposite of that. We have tens, tens, tens of millions, maybe a hundred million homeowners almost that are extremely comfortable with their situation. And here's another chart, and I believe this one came from John. This is from Bankrate. Okay? Homeowners less likely to sell due to rates. We Asked which mortgage rate, if any, would you need to be comfortable selling a home this year? And here's, here's how they responded. A rate less than 6%. Well, 35% of the people said, okay, that's the rate we need to be comfortable. Less than 5%, 30% said that. Less than 4%. 21% said that. And a rate less than 3%, 11% said that. So it sounds like, okay, that's not terrible. Maybe if the rates went below 6%, it would cause some of the inventory in the market that's all locked up now where people just won't sell. It would cause some of them to sell. But wait, there's more. Here is maybe the most important part of the survey where sellers said, when asked the question, which mortgage rate, if any, would you need to be comfortable selling a home this year? So a home, I guess that means it applies to owner occupants and it imply applies to investors. In other words, would they want to sell? Well, guess what? A whopping 42%, almost half of all the homeowners said that there is no rate that would make them comfortable selling their property. Wow. If you are waiting for a price adjustment, if you are waiting for better housing affordability, be scared, because housing may be a permanently, and when I say permanent, nothing's really permanent, but for a long time may become an even less and less affordable asset. You think affordability is bad now? Many people say it will only get worse. Now, granted, lower rates will help affordability, but as soon as those rates go down, you see, some of this inventory might loosen. Most of it won't. People won't sell no matter what because they're locked in for the multiple reasons they've got the lock in effect. And it's just going to make homes more affordable, causing more buyer demand, causing prices to rise. So It's a catch 22. It's a really tough situation as far as housing affordability. Okay, we've got a breaking story here. And this is about a another podcaster in my same business. And I have told you for 21 years, commandment number three of my ten commandments of successful investing is thou shalt maintain control. And this person, Marco Santarelli, who, by the way, full disclosure, I do not think this is a good person or a good character. Okay? That's just my personal opinion because he has stolen a lot of my material over the years. And in fact, we have had many podcast listeners come to me and say, jason, this guy is copying you. He just copies you almost verbatim. And I'VE heard it myself. I mean, I listened. And he would say literally the same words as I would say, okay. And then during that big case that I had a few years ago where I won that 56 million dollar judgment that I reported on before, we did a whole show on this. Look it up. And Marco Santarelli actually ganged up on me with this competitor who was trying to ruin my reputation to gain market share. So now he has started a fund a couple of years ago. I don't know exactly when he started this fund. And all of these people have come to me asking about it. And there's a bunch of reviews on the podcast. And so here's what they say. Again, I don't know a lot of the details, they're very murky. But I'm sure more will come out. So I'll just share with you what the reports say. But, folks, this is why you want to be a direct investor. You want to control the things you invest in. Many people have asked me over the years to be on the show to promote their fund. And, you know, I just am really, really, really just cautious because I don't have control. I basically said to them, look, unless you're going to let me run it because I know I'm honest, okay, I'm not promoting your thing when you're in control. Okay? So this is from Trey Cruttenden, who wrote this review. It's a one star review, one out of five saying scam and Ponzi scheme. And this is about the passive real estate investing podcast. And by the way, I think that name in and of itself is very misleading because I've told you for 21 years that there's no such thing as a passive investing, not even a bank account. Okay, but the semantics maybe. Okay, the review says complete scam and Ponzi scheme. Don't believe me, question mark? Ask around and check Reddit. Go look for his podcast promising 12 to 15% returns. He pulled all of that after everyone invested and won't give anyone's money back. No communication. And yet he has time to record podcasts and ask for more money. Karma is coming. Run, run, run. That's Trey Cre. And who wrote that review? And then here's another review. And this is Evie, and maybe it's Evan. That's sort of an Internet way of writing Evan. Possibly. It says, beware, there's one star. Marco took money from investors just days before he defaulted on his note fund, costing investors millions of dollars. He absolutely knew that the fund was in trouble. And took people's money anyway. If he didn't know, he was totally inept. Whether his note fund turns out to be a Ponzi scheme or fraud, there is definitely some ethical and moral issues that were missed here on Marco's end. Go to bigger pockets and look under neurotic capital thread to see his true colors. So that's another review. Again, here is another one. One starts as missed payments. He defaulted on promissory note, yet he's still out here trying to convince people to invest with him. Please don't fall for his lies. Business Insider 23, based in US 1 stars, has defaulted on flagship project. Marco does not value his investors terrible experience working with him. 200 plus investors hope slash pray we see our money back run from this man and all his investment opportunities. So, you know, folks, look, these people invested in a fund run by Marco Santarelli. People in the real estate industry, I've heard over the years, call him Scam Torelli. And I don't know exactly what he did. I've heard a lot of things. But again, I didn't look at the red. I didn't look at, you know, any of these references they're mentioning to see more details. Strictly just sharing these reviews with you. And one of the investors who was talking to me about this, who listens to the podcast, said, these funds and these people, it always takes years to find out that they're bad apples, that they're cheating people, that they're stealing, that they're mismanaging, that they're doing whatever they're doing, right? And here you go. Remember when, when Meet Kevin was out trying to expose Grant Cardone and, and Meet Kevin. Grant Cardone both, by the way, have been on the show. You can go listen to those episodes. You know, there was a case over that and this investor said, you know, I wonder if this will happen with Grant Cardone. And I don't know. I mean, Grant Cardone has raised probably hundreds of millions of dollars now from investors. Maybe he's legit. Nobody really knows. Nobody really knows, you know, until the jig is up. I mean, you just don't know. But this looks really bad and it looks like it affected over 200 investors. So I'm sure that story will continue to break. But I'd urge you to, to do your research. And number one, most important thing is follow my commandment. Number three that I've been talking about for 21 years now. Thou shalt maintain control. Be a direct investor. Buy some houses and own them. Control them. Yes, it's a little more responsibility, but you're not going to lose all your money like these people are saying, right? And you're in control. You know what's going on. And the best thing is to not only be a direct investor and control your own investment investments, but to self manage your own properties so you don't even have to depend on a manager. You are really, really in control. And again, many times it takes you less time. Less time. Hear me clearly, to self manage a property than it does to manage your managers. I know a lot of people don't see that until they actually do it. And that's largely what our empowered investor pro community is about. It's about self management where you're in control. So please, please take advantage of that. It'll really help you. And here by the way, is a screenshot from Wikipedia about the anchoring bias. Right? And this is really what people are doing when they think that somehow real estate, mortgage payments, monthly payments or prices will go back to the way they were. They don't have to ever go back to the way they were. Dynamics in the market have changed and they've changed permanently. There is a, a huge difference in this market versus the global financial crisis, which was the worst economy we've had in really seven or eight decades. This is nothing like that. It's the complete opposite. I mean, look, the cost of money has tripled and housing prices have risen, risen, risen. They just keep going up. So inventory is definitely increasing in some markets, I mean we're back. In some markets we're now back or almost back to Pre pandemic levels, 2019 levels. And a lot of the doomers and bloomer are saying, oh, this is the sign that the crash is happening. Nothing could be further from the truth. Here's why. I mean, many reasons, but I'll just tell you one. The one big reason for that is that 2019 was a great market. I mean there was nothing wrong with the real estate market in 2019. Yeah, you know, it had some dynamics. It was slowing. It wasn't as good as it was a few years earlier. But 2019 was a fine market. I mean, nobody is saying that the market had crashed in 2019. So inventory levels at the 2019, 19 pre pandemic levels are by no means a crash or even a correction. Okay. You've got to go back a very long way. Really. You have to go back to at least 2012 to start talking like that. Okay. And 2015, you know, three years after 2012 would only give you the Quote, unquote, normal market, right? Which 2019 was way below the normal market in terms of inventory levels. So just focus, folks. People just don't have perspective. They don't understand the market dynamics like we do. I've been doing this all my life. This is my only career, right, since I was 19 years old. I have a deep understanding of the way these fundamentals work. And you just really got to be careful who you listen to. And one of the things that's funny is, you know, you can take someone to court and sue them for peddling a bad investment and for lying about the investment and misrepresenting the investment, you know, like we were just talking about here, right? You know, or for a Ponzi schem, a scam, right? But why is it that all of the folks out there who have been predicting doom and gloom and who have been wrong, who have caused millions and millions of people to miss opportunities, right? We have this bias, right? We notice the flaw, we notice the problem if we act and it doesn't work out, but we don't notice the flaw or notice the problem. And certainly we don't go out and sue somebody for were making a prediction that the market will crash. That caused us not to act. And that's the biggest loss we probably could encounter is the opportunity cost of not acting. That's just the way the human bias works, right? We can't hear the dogs that don't bark. We don't pursue someone or blame someone because they caused us to miss an opportunity. We blame them, them and sue them or file regulatory complaints against them if we took an opportunity and then lost money, right? And that's fine. You, you should hold them accountable. But think about if you followed any of these doom and gloomers like Nick Chiarelli out there on his YouTube channel that has been talking about a crash. I mean, look, I have screenshots of all the thumbnails of his old videos, okay? Because these people are so cagey. They take them down. They take down the videos, they try to hide any evidence. Bad predictions, okay? And I'm not saying he did that. I mean, he may have. I really don't know. I haven't looked in that much detail. But I'll tell you something. The worst thing is missing an opportunity because you believed the end was coming and it didn't come and you missed out. That usually is the biggest cost of all. But we will see. Okay? One more thing I want to encourage you to do is join us on Wednesday and join us every month on the second Wednesday of the month Jason hartman.com Wednesday to register for that our empowered investor for pro members got a very small group private session with our guest who will be asset protection and tax advisor JJ Childers. He's a tax advisor and attorney who's been around for many many years and a first time sharing his wisdom with us on Wednesday. This is totally free so go register for our monthly Zoom meeting. Space is limited. Jason hartman.com Wednesday and we will look forward to seeing you there. Okay, let's get to probably a little bit truncated version because I' talk so long of part two of today's episode where we talk a little bit about self management.

Brett, did you have a thought on that?

I absolutely went through that and I got 12 house disputation and Jason, thank you because I, I got my first house in 2014. So we're at about 10 years with.

You now like and you're now Congratulations.

Yeah, well actually yeah, you made me a millionaire and I've never been my whole life and you actually did it. So you are, you are the guy. I, I, I speak very highly of you.

Awesome. I'm honored. That's awesome.

But I, I feel like you give the best advice. I think you just, you're you, it's in your DNA. You know, you just kind of have a good eye for things. So you had said that to self manage and you know I was a little uncomfortable with that at first because it's just like the, all the unknowns. But what I did after I accumulated a few properties I just decided to just pick an area because I had like the Delton, Florida area and then I had Memphis and then I went into Alabama. So those are like my three areas. Because you say kind of do like three markets, right? So I said I'm just going to do one thing at a time and as I grow with that I'm going to go deep and then I'm gonna, after I get in deep I'm gonna go wide perfect. That's what I did.

Great idea. So you do one market, you do all your properties in that one market and then you do it. Yeah, yeah.

Then I started to see clearly what I need to do and I have my own system and I would kind of do my own spreadsheets. I just do Google sheets for my expenses and I do cash flow flow and I just create all my formulas. That took a little time, you know, but I have my own way of doing it. You know I would just call like, I mean you're going to need probably like a nutrition and appliance guy. Maybe like a septic person. If you got like a septic, you know, city's always better, right? You know, just your basic contractors and talk to three of them or four of them and just get a spreadsheet, you know, commit to yourself. It's an investment of your time. And I would just kind of price out. I would say, hey, you know, even if I didn't need work, I would say, I'm looking for someone. I have a few properties here, and I'm looking for a handyman. Can you tell me, like, what you charge and how you do it? And I would just kind of. Kind of, you know, you'd be surprised. Like, some of them don't really tell you till later on the conversation, like, oh, there's a travel fee. Or here. And I'm like, I didn't know there were travel fees for contractors, but there is for some places, you know, but some are just very upfront. And those are the kind of the ones, you know, that I like. But that's what I did. And then once I. After like, a year or two went by, I could tell which. Which ones are more, like, prompt. Good. You know, you just learn, and then now you have a relationship and just sticks.

And then you.

Now once you get that, you just go to the next market. It's easier, you know?

Right, right. But, Brett, it's even easier than that. Where are you sourcing your. Your contractors from? People. Your maintenance people?

Yeah, I mean, I, I, I go online. I also, too, is. I. I know you could do it. You can kind of look at reviews off of. What's that website?

Y.

Was it Y. There was another one, too, just for contractors. Yeah, yeah.

That you can pass. Grab it.

I would just go on Google a lot and then just look at, like, reviews, but I would kind of watch how far the reviews go back from the current date. Because when you see chunks of reviews done, like, you see 25 reviews done in, like, the same, like, time span, like, two months, you know, they're all.

Like, friends and family, you know, probably a scam.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But look, it's better than what you're from the property manager, because with the property manager, you have only their review, and their review might be, you know, unduly influenced by the fact that they're getting kickbacks from them. Right. So it's so easy, you are so empowered to just go directly nowadays. It's so easy to go to taskrabbit.com thumbtack.com. yeah, Yelp. I mean Yelp has a whole thing now where you just fill out the work order on their website. It's so easy.

Oh really?

Unbelievable. And TaskRabbit, it takes like a minute. It's so quick. It's just easy. This stuff's easy nowadays, folks. You know, it didn't always, it wasn't always that way, okay? I mean now you're just much more empowered than you used to be, okay? And you get to know what things are worth, what they cost, what's, you know, when someone's scamming you when they're not. And it's just easy. Like you never have to even talk to these people. You just do it through the interface on the site and it's just super quick, you know, a couple keystrokes and you're taken care of. So you're empowered. Okay, so good, Brett. I'm really glad to hear that. And folks, I tell you something, just to Brett's comment, he started in 2014. When did you start self managing, Brett?

I started dabbling in 2018 maybe. Yeah, 20.

Okay, so you've been self managing for like six years now, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, roughly like that.

But you know, it's funny, like each year I got somewhere much more comfortable that now like when I see my properties, man, like screw up, I'm like, you're out, I'm in. It's just not even flinch. I'm like, I know what to do.

It's like, exactly. You're much more empowered now and you can to buy a lot more properties and you're gonna, your return is going to be so much better on your properties. I mean, you're instantly saving, you know, $2,000 or more a year on just management fees, right? But what you're really saving is all the stuff you're not paying for that you're going to pay for with a property manager, okay? And you're, you're going to get better tenants because they're better screened people, okay? And they have a relationship with you and you're going to find that the bad tenants, the deadbeats, the people that thrash your property, that's going to be just drastically reduced with self management. It's just going to be a much, much better experience. So I'm really glad you did that. But another thing is, you know, back in 2014, I mean folks, a lot of people thought the market was going to crash back then. I'll just tell you, we had been a few years out of the Great Recession. Prices had started to come back and they were going up and everybody's saying, oh, this recovery is long in the tooth. You know, it's going to crash, yada, yada yada. Right. And here we are ten years later. We haven't had a crash. Right. You just gotta get in the market and buy more properties. You're going to be so happy you did. You know, of course it depends what stage of wealth accumulation you're at and all that. I, I get it, but the crash certainly never happened. Okay. And now that the Fed is pivoting, it's even less likely. Sales are up, inventory is up a little bit and the buyer demand is keeping up with the inventory that's slightly increased. Only slightly. And sales volume is going to be a lot better.

All right, so Jason, I got one follow on comment to this. Elena mentioned America's rental managers and new properties, you know, I believe bought seven of those last year from them in Alabama. And there's another conflict of interest that I'm starting to be worried about. I haven't stepped into the self management yet, but I think I might need to consider it. But they had a rent guarantee for initial tenant placement on the new properties, which was great because as you can imagine, they filled the properties pretty quickly. Now I have a couple of tenants that moved out and rerent is taking considerably longer than I anticipated. And I'm wondering if they're putting priority on tenant placement on new properties over people that are, you know, having move.

That's a good point. They might well be doing that. And you know, when you self manage, Derek, the other thing you're going to see is you're going to see the volume of leads that comes in. Okay. And you're going to really have a feel for that market. And you do it long enough, what you're going to find is some of these tenants, actually if you own, you know, several properties in market, they move around like, you know, balls in a pinball machine and they come back to your properties year after year. You know, you got like the same people. Oh, I knew you from four years ago, you know. Yeah, you rented one of my other properties. Right. And that's going to be good for you too. But yeah, they may well have. I mean property management has a built in conflict of interest because they're trying to keep the tenant happy and they're trying to keep the owner happy and it seems like they usually weigh more on the tenant, frankly. You know, every property manager I hear when there's some issue like with a tenant damaging a Property. It's like, oh, just give them all the money back. Just give them all the money back. I'm like, well, I'm not giving them all the money back. Okay, that's what a security deposit's been for, right? And he's like, oh, they're, they're going to take you to court. They've never taken me to court, okay. Like, I'm fair. I do the right thing. You know, I tell them what it's for. It's just ridiculous.

Jason, I think what you said about seeing the leads being generated is super important, especially Derek, with these, these bigger companies because they've got so many houses that they're managing, managing. And let's say they just have like one or two people managing those leads coming in. They're reactive, they're not proactive. So they're waiting for somebody to fill out an application and then they're going with the property that's been probably sitting on the market the longest. And so the leasing process is like almost like a machine, you know. And so you're just kind of like waiting in line versus if you see the lead flow coming in, you know, like Carrie was talking about earlier, you know, she just picked up the phone, called the tenant and decided which one she wanted. And you know, I've had similar experiences in my self management. You know, I lease my property so fast and it's just because I'm, I'm proactive rather than reactive, you know, that, that person working for the big management company, you know, they're getting probably an hourly rate, maybe they're getting a little bonus, but they're not incentivized like you to get at least quickly.

So yeah, you care about one property. They're trying to care about, you know, 30 properties, right, that might be up for lease at a time. So yeah, I really want you to have the advantage. And when you, you're in control, Derek, you're going to have it that way.

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