CW 318: Resale Property Value Expectations & U.S. Real Estate Market Update with Anthony Lolli CEO of Rapid Realty

Welcome to Creating wealth with Jason Hartman. During this program, Jason is going to tell you some really exciting things that you probably haven't thought of before. And a new slant on investing. Fresh, new approaches to America's best investment that will enable you to create more wealth and happiness than you ever thought possible. Jason is a genuine, self made multimillionaire who not only talks the talk, but walks the walk. He's been a successful investor for 20 years and currently owns properties in 11 states and 17 cities. This program will help you follow in Jason's footsteps on the road to financial freedom. You really can do it. And now here's your host, Jason Hartman with the complete solution for real estate investors.

Welcome to the Creating wealth show. This is your host, Jason Hartman. And this is episode number three. 318. I have been busy traveling and I'm sorry we haven't gotten an episode out to you in gosh, I guess it's a little over a week now. But last week I was in Chicago. I was at an entrepreneur's conference there and it was very interesting and educational and we did some charity work there as well and had a little fun. So that was a good time. And now I am in California this week doing some meetings and so forth out here and look forward to getting back home in Arizona. Everything except for the heat. It is starting to get a little warm there. But you know what they say, it's a dry heat, right folks? At least that's what all the real estate people say. Anyway, today we've got a great show for you. And I just want to remind you of our ten commandments of successful investing. And one of those very important commandments is thou shalt not gamble. And I talk about commandment number three a lot. This is not commandment number three. I want to talk about the gambling thing. This is number five. And what that means is it means that when you invest, you shouldn't have to expect anything great to happen to have a very successful investment. And what I mean by that is so many people who call themselves investors, they basically invest. And I'm saying that word in quotes because I don't think it really qualifies as investing when they're expecting appreciation to occur. That is speculation, that is gambling. And that is very unreliable. But as you know, cash flow is pretty darn reliable. Now, nothing is perfect. Nothing is 100%. Mostly it's less than 100% reliable, but sometimes it's even a little better than 100%. In other words, if you're, if one's expectations going into a deal are 100% and that everything will turn out exactly as planned on that pro forma, sometimes the expectations are met, sometimes they're actually exceeded, and sometimes more often than not, they're a little bit less than what was expected. But as I always say, even if it doesn't happen as well as expected, you're still doing better than pretty much everybody else because of the special multidimensional characteristics of an income property investment. This brings up a good point because I talked to an investor today who was actually upset with a property, A four plex that he bought. And one of the units has had some pretty significant problems in eviction, loss of cash flow, etc. But the other three are doing fine. So if you parse this up and look at that as 25% for each unit, well, 75% of this investment is going phenomenally well. And not only that, this particular investment had a phenomenal projection. And I don't know what the actual projection was offhand, but just given my experience in this particular market that I'm speaking of, where this person bought this projection was probably in excess of 30% annually overall return on investment. And the client himself when I asked. Okay, look, you know, let's get this in perspective here. Let's not be too terribly concerned about this one unit that is having problems, this one of the four. And let's look at the whole deal. Have you done any calculations? Hopefully you're using Property Tracker. This client said he wasn't. And folks, I really want to admonish all of you, Property Tracker is a critically important thing and not enough of you are using it. Again, I don't profit from telling you this. I just want you to be a better investor. And you can be a much better investor if you're using the Property Tracker software, or at least some software to help you analyze and not only analyze, but track your investments. Well, it turns out this client was just doing it manually, which you certainly can do with a calculator or spreadsheet. Way back when I got into the business, I'm a bit of an old timer here. We just use the Hewlett Packard 12C calculator, the famous HP12C. And I remember once I took a three day class on just how to use this HP12C calculator. Well, needless to say, this was over 20 years ago and hate to allude to how long ago this was, but you can do it a lot of different ways. You don't need to use the software. But I Certainly advise you to do exactly that. Anyway, so this client, by his own calculations, was making an 11% cash on cash return. Hey, that's pretty darn awesome. I mean, that's what. It's 22 times better than you're going to do in the bank. 2200% or better of a bank account. I can't even estimate what it is on a mutual fund because on a mutual fund you might lose money or a stock investment, you might lose money. So I can't even compare there. But suffice it to say, perspective is incredibly valuable. Anyway, back to the point here. Thou shalt not gamble. The property must make sense the day you buy it or you don't buy it. And I originally recorded today's guest, who I like very much and I like a lot of his ideas. I originally recorded it for my AIPIS show, Accredited income property investment specialist. It's a. For the trade show, if you will, for financial planners, realtors, mortgage planners and mortgage lenders and people like that who want to cater to investor clients. Well, I wanted to play that for you on this show because I think it's very, very good at illustrating kind of the speculators thinking. And again, I'm not a speculator. I have made money speculating. I've done quite well speculating. But the important thing to understand is that this is gambling. And sometimes gamblers win and sometimes gamblers do well. And now in many of the overpriced markets like California, New York, some other areas around the country, in many of these markets, we're seeing that speculators are kind of winning again and they go in cycles. But at the end of the day, you've got to remember it's like that game of musical chairs. Sometimes the music stops and you don't want to be the one left standing or the one left holding the bag. That invariably happens in every cycle. So thou shalt not gamble. Invest for cash flow. Cash flow is pretty darn reliable. Appreciation is not reliable at all. And you know, again, it reminds me of that conversation I told you about on a. On a recent episode that I had with Doug, who's been on the show before and who has spoken at several of our Meet the Massers events. Well, I said, doug, you know, you do a lot of financial planning or not financial planning, financial modeling, I mean to say, a lot of financial modeling for your work in the, in the big corporate finance world. Well, we gotta really think this through, you and me and the other advisors and people that help create content for my company. We've gotta. We've gotta think this through and come up with a formula or a way that we can figure out how to predict appreciation. And he leans over and gives me this knowing look while we're sitting at the table. And this was at the last meet, the Masters event at the Hyatt Regency in Irvine, Californ, in January. And he says, jason, I'm not that good.

And, you know, I agree. Nobody's that good. Appreciation is extremely difficult to predict. So if you want to be a prudent, safe, conservative investor, hey, invest in areas that you think will appreciate, but don't depend on them to appreciate. Invest in income, invest in cash flow, because by and large, over time, it's pretty darn reliable. Not perfect, but pretty darn good. A lot more reliable than trying to predict appreciation and trying to be a speculator and gambling. So our first guest will talk about that, and if we have time, I want to do a recent interview we had with our Austin, Texas local market specialist. Now, this is someone we brought on board a few months ago, and we have not aired the show. Sometimes we do this. We'll kind of go into a market again. Now, for those of you clients who've been around a long time, you know that I've done a lot of business in the Austin market over the years. I own property there myself. We've put probably 200 investors into that market, but we haven't really been able to make it work for quite a few years now. So we stopped recommending it because, frankly, it's just a more expensive market, but a very, very appealing market at the same time. Well, we've recruited a couple, a couple three, four months ago, a new local market specialist there who actually has some pretty good inventory, and we don't do that on this show. If time doesn't permit, we'll do it on the next episode on episode number 319. So I'm going to let our producer decide, depending on how time goes after our first guest, if we play the Austin, Texas local market specialist interview or if we do that on the next episode. But in either case, if you're interested in Austin, Texas, which is just a fantastic city, really, really a great city, check with your investment counselor at my company. You can contact them through jasonhartman.com the website, or. Or go to jasonhartman.com, click on the properties section and look at the properties in Austin, Texas. And again, we have not been in this market for several years now, and we're recommending it again because we found some good inventory. So check that out. And again, we may or may not get to that interview on this episode. But without further ado, let's get to our next guest, our guest here. And let's look at a market that again, we don't recommend, but it is interesting to get a perspective on this market. This guest is a very successful real estate broker in a market, I'll tell you in a moment just what it is in a market that is very competitive, very high priced and a market that I wouldn't be recommending. But he's got some very interesting insights into that market and I think you'll really enjoy the interview. And he's a great guy and a very successful businessman. So you may glean some tips there as well. So we will be back with our guest here in just a moment talking about. You didn't think I was going to tell you, did you? New York City. Yes. Amazing. You'll probably never hear that on this show again, but New York City. So we'll get to that in just a moment here and possibly Austin, Texas as well. And we'll talk to you on the next episode. But we'll be back with our guest in just less than 60 seconds.

Want to know what you've missed in the Creating wealth series? Well, here's your opportunity with Jason's first five book set that's shows 1 through 100 through digital download. You save $288 by getting this five book set. Learn all of the advanced strategies for wealth creation. For more details go to jasonhartman.com.

It'S my pleasure to welcome Anthony Lawley back to the show. He's the CEO at Rapid Realty in New York City. And we're going to talk a little bit about the investment outlook and what's going on there. Anthony, welcome back. How are.

Very good, Very good. Thanks for having me back.

Well, good. So, you know, we just Talked for literally 30 seconds before we started the show today and we both very, very quickly agreed that the market is improving quite a bit. Talk on a national basis if you would for just a moment outside of your local market and let us know what your thoughts are and then we'll talk specifically about what you're seeing and hearing in the Big Apple.

Well, what's happening nationally is you have institutional investors buying up a lot of these properties. You have things like the banks expediting foreclosures a lot quicker. There's been a couple laws that have been passed. Like in California this January, there was a law that stopped the banks from foreclosing on people while they were in the middle of loan modifications, which kind of slowed down the pipeline. Then you have other things like rebound investors. Basically people that got foreclosed on, their credit was mangled, but then a year or two later, now they're back and they're ready to buy again. So there's all sorts of things happening in the real estate atmosphere that's strengthening up the confidence. You have specifically like the Toll Brothers now investing in properties, mainly towards rental related properties. So it really kind of gives a vote of confidence to the consumer. But what's happening is people are being outbid on some of these existing homes. Specifically, if you're selling right now, you're in a great position to sell for above asking price because there's very limited inventory.

What are your thoughts, Anthony, about the inventory hangover? You know, we used to hear that phrase all the time. Now we still hear it a bit. And I still think it's out there to some extent. However, I don't. I really always debunked it a little bit. I mean, of course, it depends where. That's a huge question, is where. But what they never really accounted for in this inventory hangover discussion was that they would predict, for example, when adjustable rate loans were adjusting and thinking that at that time people would have payment shock. And if they had payment shock, they wouldn't be able to afford the payments and they would ultimately enter foreclosure and be back on the market. And that would create a lot more inventory. But what they never bothered to think about, at least in almost every survey I saw, was that a lot of these problems are worked out at the loan modification level or the property is sold, maybe sold on a short sale, either way, or, you know, some of them do end up in foreclosure. And then the other thing they never considered is that, and you alluded to that just a moment ago, is the rebound or the recycling, where these people that are kicked out of their house have to recycle into the renter pool, actually increasing demand for rentals. So as an investor looks at the market, okay, take one position, say there's a huge inventory hangover. Now it's lower. You know, they're saying 2, maybe 3 million homes, but before they were saying 7 to 10 million homes, really a huge number, frankly. And. But you take it from an investor perspective. Well, even if there were a lot of homes coming onto the market in foreclosure, maybe softening prices, still, though, there was a lot more demand for rental Housing because when a foreclosure happens, the person is still alive. They still need to live somewhere. That's what, that's what none of these surveys ever seem to understand. The doom and gloomers never really get the whole picture. It seems like, sure.

And things happen. People are still active, people are trained. Even in the rental market, even the luxury rental market, when things got a little tight and people were kind of downsizing and it was cool to not necessarily upgrade but downgrade, people were, Instead of spending $4,000 a month, $5,000 a month on a luxury rental, they would downsize to maybe $2,000 a month. So the $5,000 luxury rental was, the price was lowered. So even on the rental end, the, the cycle kept continuing. So, you know, there things that weren't factored. For example, how long it takes to actually foreclose on a property. There were many people that just opted to not pay the mortgage whatsoever and just wait it out and basically live and occupy their home that they used to own that's under foreclosure for three years because, you know, there was just a big bottleneck. And then some cases, people would rent out their homes and actually profit. They would rent out their homes, they wouldn't actually pay a penny of the, of the rent towards the bank, and they would actually profit and use that as cushion. Then there's also the cash for keys program that some of the banks were offering where they would give you cash in exchange for just giving the keys and not giving the bank a hard time going through a long, arduous court process. And just then they have something else that's out there, which is the zombie foreclosures, which I think you've heard of, where a person says they get all the notices. And they said, okay, no problem, I'll leave the home. I understand, I'm not paying. I understand you don't want to negotiate a loan modification. I'll pack up my bags and I'll leave. And then what ends up happening is six months later, the homeowner gets stuck with the water bill, the tax bill, an eviction bill, all sorts of things. And the reason why is the banks, they don't want to be landlords. They weren't equipped to be property managers and to handle squatters and vandalism and paying of taxes and water and sewer and things like that. So there's so many things that, that were unforeseen circumstances that all happened all at the same time.

Well, so explain the zombie foreclosure thing a little bit. I Mean, I've heard that term to some extent, but you kind of explained it differently than some people. What do you mean? The homeowner ends up with a bill. I mean, if it's foreclosed, the homeowner's gone, the homeowner's out.

Well, they never went through the bank, never went through with actual possession or repossession of the home. They never actually went through, through the court process and said this, we now own this home. And for good reason. They didn't want to own the home. So until the bank actually takes possession legally through the courts, the homeowner still on the hook.

Yeah. Okay. All right, got it. Yeah. So.

And in the interim.

But then it wasn't really a foreclosure.

No, but if you, if you look at some of the letters and they were basically saying, you have to leave, you're under foreclosure. I mean, some of the letters were crafted in such a unique way and look so official that a homeowner can just. You can scare a homeowner out of their home. They'd rather, they don't want to see the marshal. Some of them say a Marshal's eviction in 10 days. You know, all these different types of tactics that are now being scrutinized and looked at and penalties are being implemented for some of the tactics, but some of them really scared the homeowner out of their house.

Yeah, very interesting. Okay, so what else are you seeing? We talked about the foreclosure issue. Now, in your market, I assume you're seeing rents. Rents strengthening, right? Rents are increasing.

Oh, boy. Super. I mean, there was a recent article that came out that talked about it. I mean, New York City in general, for the first time in 50 years, we have more people moving in than ever and less people moving out. And mainly it's because we have a strong rental economy. If we study the bank atmosphere, they were only lending to rental related projects. And where do you find mainly multi unit homes? New York City or any metropolitan area, but New York City just happened to carry the flag. And what's interesting about the study was Brooklyn was at the forefront. And so many things happening in Brooklyn with the Barclays center, with the nets, and over 160 hotels planted their flags in Brooklyn. Brooklyn was named one of the coolest places on earth to live by GQ magazine. And then of course, why?

What's so cool about Brooklyn? I never.

I mean, you have all the hip towns, Park Slope, Brooklyn Heights, you have Williamsburg, you have all the reality shows that are based around some of the five boroughs, particularly Brooklyn and even Manhattan. And it's just New York in general is just a cool place to live. And the boundaries and the tolerance level for people wanting to have transportation into the city have increased due to the quality of life. I mean, Bloomberg is coming to the end of his run and are a.

Lot of people happy about that because they want to order maybe a 20 ounce soda? Obviously that didn't happen, but.

No, that didn't happen. But you know what happens is that he's really doing a great job job to really exit on a high note. I mean he's really green lighting so many development projects, cleaning up the red tape, making it more attractive for developers to be more creative, for more creative architectures, architects and interior designers to really showboat a little bit on some of their skills making it attractive. Another thing that made New York attractive was the Nando market Condos turn rentals.

That was the nickname they were calling it. And basically it's a condo project that obviously due to the recession couldn't take off. And they decided that the city allowed them to take advantage of some of their tax relief and switch it over into a rentals, which upped the bar so you could rent and lease an apartment that you otherwise could never afford for a reasonable price, which really raised the standard for what a rental building should look like. So now almost every new rental project has a doorman, it has amenities, so it's so attractive to rent. And even in general, I mean, there was another study that came out talking about women are at the forefront of being renters.

Well, what's that mean? What do you so what?

Well, the study was, it was interesting study. It said 4.2 million more women than men over the age of 25 are employed. 3.2 million more women than men over the age of 25 are enrolled in college. And the study also showed that more women obviously with some of these degrees are snatching up some of these high power jobs and high powered jobs really come with the necessity for agility. One day you're in New York, one day you're in Chicago, one day you're in California. And they also are very demanding, which requires you to not be so committed to a property. So that in combination with equity appreciation not really being as high as it used to be, right now the people that are buying are people that are just buy and hold. I mean, buying in general is a smart way. It's. I like to call it a forced way to save.

Yeah, it's a good forced Savings program.

I agree, it's a good force savings program.

You've mentioned so many things here, Anthony. I got to talk to you about a couple of them. So first off, and I want to get to this women thing for a moment because that's really, I've read a lot about that. I've been seeing that for the last 15 years. Stuff, stuff like you mentioned, we'll get to that in a moment. But you mentioned that it was so attractive to be a renter in New York. And you know, my company does business nationwide. We help people buy investment properties. And this is one of the reasons we don't do New York or any high priced market because we just can't make the numbers pencil. You know, we got to see 1% per month. So if the property costs, you know, I'll talk numbers like you, you live in there, you know, and this is cheap for New York probably. But $400,000, can you get anything for four? But if you've got a $400,000 property, you've got to get 4,000amonth or better. And so it really is in a high priced market, it's a great deal to be a renter because what happens is there's just not much price elasticity if you're going to live in la, New York, even Miami, frankly, any sort of flagship city where prices are high, where land is expensive, it's a great deal to be a renter. It's a better deal to be a renter there and own less expensive properties elsewhere. Now granted, you could have appreciation in the more speculative, high flying markets, California, certainly that's my whole background is in California for so many years. But getting those numbers to pencil, boy, it's just hard to do it from an investor perspective, from a renter perspective, it's an awesome deal. Is that what you were saying or did I put words in your mouth?

Well, no, that's exactly what I was saying. On a quality of life perspective, if you're a renter right now, you're going to get more bang for your buck. Especially if you don't know what your job and your personal situation is, you know, within the next three to five years.

But if, and let me say, let me say one thing about that, the best thing, and I've said this for many years, the best thing you can have on a, on a resume is mobility. If you can move to where the jobs are, that's how you've got to position yourself in today's fast changing economy. You gotta be mobile, you gotta Be flexible. America is the most, most mobile population in the developed world. And the fact that people can move and not be tied down to a house is a great thing that really can increase your employment prospect.

No? That's right. And then also the ability to have a nice home to come home to makes you a happier employee when you don't have to go home to something that really wouldn't be your best case living scenario.

Give us an example of what's one of the better areas in New York City that someone would want to live.

Well, there was.

If.

It depends. Now, if you have a family, there was an article that came out that talked about Park Slope and Bay Ridge being one of the best places to live to. To raise a family. Namely because you're going based on school districts and graduation rates and reputation scholastically. Okay, so if you're.

What, so what can you get there? Just give me an example really quick. You know, like a three bedroom. I mean, if you've got a family, you gotta have three bedrooms, probably. So what do you get? How much does it cost and how much can you rent it for?

Well, a three bedroom range, you can rent from 2,500 up to $4,000 a month. But you'll get something that has the works. It'll have an elevator building, it'll have a doorman, it'll have concierge. It might even have an ensuite gym. So you have all those amenities.

That's 4 to 5,000amonth you mentioned.

No, 2,500 to $4,000 a month in some of the prime neighborhoods of downtown.

That same place, how much does it cost to buy it?

Well, that same place, if it was. If you're talking purchasing a condo, it could be something like 7 to $800,000.

For the $4,000amount or the $2,500amount for the $2,500. Okay, so see, there you go. That's a perfect example, Anthony. Thank you for mentioning it. So you can rent the $700,000 condo and not have a homeowners association dues or co op dues for 2,500 bucks a month, give or take. I mean, that's a great deal. That's just a. That says be a renter. That is an awesome deal. And give me another area. Where do the happening singles live? What area is that?

Well, you have the Tribeca area. You always have SoHo in Manhattan. You have Williamsburg, you have East Williamsburg.

Bushwick, Tribeca's probably, or SoHo are the most famous of those two. Those are the Names people would know off the top of their head. What can you get in Tribeca or soho? How much does it cost to rent it and how much does it cost to own it?

Well, here's something that's interesting. In terms of cost, it's still expensive, but what you're looking at is owners looking the other way at roommate situations. Before an owner would say, no, no, I don't want a bunch of people roommating and cooperating, paying the rent. I just want one or two people, that's it. A couple working, professional. But now, when the recession hit, it kind of loosened things up where the owners aren't as strict as they used to be. So the price is still maintained in terms of renting. So in an area like Tribeca, depending if you're talking three bedrooms, you're going to look at something. You know, in SoHo, you're going to look at something at the starting point of $3,800 a month is up to almost 8 or $9,000 a month.

But still, let's round it off. So say it's $4,000. What do you get for that? Is that a one or a two bedroom or what is it?

You'll more than likely get a two bedroom.

How many square feet?

Oh, less than a thousand square feet.

Whoa, that is pricey. And how much does it cost to own that place? To buy it?

You're looking at close to about a million and a half. Whoa.

It is such a better deal to be a renter. This, folks, is the rent to value ratio discussion right here with Anthony. And that is a strong case to be. There's some great opportunities to be a renter. Americans have got to change their thinking about stuff. Real estate investing is an awesome thing. You just got to do the investing in the right product type in the right markets. And renting is an awesome deal too. I'll share with you my example. I don't know if I mentioned this to you. I moved from Southern California, Orange county, you know, lived mostly in the Newport beach area for many years and I spent ten grand a month on my house there that I owned. And it wasn't even that great. It was pretty nice, but it wasn't super great. And then I moved to Phoenix last about a year and a half ago and for $4,000 a month I've got this gorgeous brand new penthouse house. I've got 3, 700 square feet of living space and decks. $4,000 a month. I mean, views of the curvature of the earth. It's, it's Phenomenal. But to own this place, it would cost a million, five to two million, I'm estimating. And I should be paying 15 to 20 grand a month. It's just like your example you gave of. I think, Tribeca, that example was right.

That's right.

Yeah.

Well, the only difference is. The only difference is, is that you don't have to put a down payment, a huge down payment on a rental. So you can.

Yeah. And you don't have homeowners association dues that are huge.

Absolutely.

Yeah, absolutely. That's a great deal. Yeah, good point. Yeah, good. So your market, though, the prices are increasing, right?

The prices are increasing. And it's mainly because there's lack of inventory. So people are getting above asking price. Institutional investors buying up whatever's out there that the banks are selling, you know, REOs and short sale properties, scooping them up bucket loads, buying portfolios. But, you know, the difference is we have professional people buying properties, whereas in before, anyone that had a Home Depot credit card and a little bit of equity in their home could now be deemed a real estate investor. And, you know, and they would take shortcuts and not really renovate up to snuff. Now, these institutional buyers, they know exactly how to renovate the properties. They're renovating them for the specific purpose of renting for now, but they do know they're going to cash in somewhere down the road. So they're adding in the right amenities, the right appliances, the right type of renovation. So it really shores up the equity appreciation and the surrounding properties, because they're doing the right thing inside and out, and they have the right type of managerial staff, mobile porters and things of that nature. And they're employing people that's not necessarily Mr. Fix It Guy, man with the van, who operates all cash. They're employing professional contractors. So it's really doing a lot to stimulate the economy.

It is. When we represent several hedge funds that are buying up properties in different markets. They seem to like Atlanta, Indianapolis, and the Texas markets. I mean, there's several in Texas quite a bit. But I gotta tell you, I think a lot of times they're overpaying.

They're not too chintzy in terms of prices, and I think they're driving up the prices. I mean, of course they're doing it just because they're buying inventory and reducing the inventory supply. But when it's somebody else's money, you're not too picky about it. It's kind of like the government when it's everybody's money, it's nobody's money. So, you know, you got some fund manager, their job is to go acquire stuff. And they don't seem to be too picky if they pay 10% more sometimes. I mean, we're kind of shocked at how they don't really. They don't really care that much like our individual buyers. They're more frugal.

They are, but the margins are so big right now. I don't think you can make a mistake. And the rental, I mean, as soon as you put the place on the market for rent, sometimes in a matter of hours, it's going to get rented. So the return is there. It's not really where you have a vacancy rate of 10 to 20%. And they're miscalculating. They're not calculating on the time for renovation until the time that lease is signed. I mean, they're going to make money on the front end and on the back end, they're making money simply on the renting and when they sell down the road. So. And also from what I hear, they're not planning, you know, when the market does really turn itself completely around, they're not planning on putting all their properties on the market. They're going to just slowly release some of the inventory into the market so as to not flood it.

Yeah, good. Good stuff. Well, hey, thank you for sharing some of this with us today. Interesting conversation. Anything else you want to mention about what's going on in the market or, you know, what's going on with your business? Just anything. I didn't ask you.

Well, you know, all positive things are going on in the market on sales and also on the rental end. I mean, that's actually my company. Our niche was apartment rentals and we actually had to bring in a sales division because there's so many renters now ready to buy. I mean, they were only renting temporarily and there's credit restoration companies out there repairing some of these renters credits. So now they're just equipped. They're, they're not as scared. They've, you know, the saying goes, a broken bone is better when it's healed. It's stronger than a regular bone. So that's what's happening now with some of these people that suffered a little bit. They took their licks and now they're ready to back jump back in. The dream of home ownership is still alive. In fact, I was on Fox Business last week and we were talking about renting versus buying. And the truth is, if you're gonna buy and buy and hold. It's definitely the right time if you want to be an investor. To buy and flip, really, really sharpen your pencil. Really, really do the math.

Yeah, you got to be careful. You're asking for trouble. If you're a flipper, you got to be super careful because you can get stuck. And I've seen a lot of flippers really turn an otherwise good, good progression to what they looked like. They were really going to go places. And one or two bad flips will really just, it'll just destroy their career.

Destroy it.

So you got to be super careful. Yeah. Good, good stuff. Well, thank you. Give out your website if you would. Anthony.

My website is anthonylolly.com that's a n t H o n y L O L L I and I always have good information on there and also have my company website, rapidnyc.com r a p n y c.com good stuff.

Anthony Lawley, thanks so much for joining us today.

Thank you. Take care of.

This show is produced by the Hartman Media company. All rights reserved. For distribution or publication rights and media interviews. Please visit www.hartmanmedia.com or email mediaartmanmedia.com Nothing on this show should be considered specific personal or professional advice. Please consult an appropriate tax, legal, real estate or business professional for individualized advice. Opinions of guests are their own and the host is acting on behalf of Platinum Properties Investor Network, Inc. Exclusively.