HI 128 - Happy 4th & Priming the Pump with Julie Ziglar Norman

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Hello and welcome to episode 128 of the Heroic Investing Show, a podcast for first responders, members of the military, veterans and anyone looking to improve their financial future and gain some freedom with their time. My name is Gary Pinkerton and I co host this show with Jason Hartman. Hey everyone. Happy Independence Day. Happy 4th of July. This should be broadcasting on the 4th if I got this right. And I wanted to go a little not necessarily off topic, but on that specific topic before we get to an incredible guest that I've set aside specifically for this show, we have the pleasure of hearing from Julie Ziglar, Norman Zig Ziglar's daughter. Somebody who, well, certainly I'm a huge fan of Zig Ziglar. I've quoted him numerous times on this show. He's changed my life. One of my big regrets is that I never met the man in person and there's some other greats out there in his space that I'm scrambling to make sure I do actually meet before it's too late. Well, there's quite a few. I won't list the names, but Julie is also someone that I followed for quite a while and have been incredibly inspired with her carrying on her work of her father and just her own personal work. She has a real estate investing company that does a lot of mentoring, mainly focused, I believe, on women and, and mentoring women, educating women on the ability and the confidence, gaining confidence to get out there and own their own rental property, start their own businesses, gain some independence. She talks in our interview about how this came about through some struggles in her own marriage, some struggles her husband was having with respect to money and some other demons that he was overcoming. And so it's a great interview. It's very educational and I think, uplifting interview. And gosh, it's just awesome to have Julie with us here on the 4th of July. Before we get to that though, I mentioned I was going to go a little, a little off on that topic. So I did a little research and studying and refreshing is a better thing to say, I guess, on what this day is all about. And I Know that many of you probably paid more attention in your history and civics classes than I did. And, and maybe it's been a few less years since you did that. A little less water ran under the bridge, if you will, than when I did it. But I am, you know, somewhat a patriotic person and I know most of my audience out there are bent in the same direction. And so I thought you would, you would appreciate this, a little Cliff Notes, if you will, about our independence, how we got there, and, you know, just a little refresher I think might be helpful. So I looked at, you know, two great documents, of course, the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, and just had a couple of observations and took some key aspects of it with a little bit of commentary from Gary, but I'll try to keep that to a minimum. First of all, the Declaration of Independence was not written for Great Britain. It was not written to the King. It was written for the world stage, right? And so that's something that actually I'd forgotten, but at the very beginning of it, it says, when in the course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the purposes which impel them to the separation. So they weren't explaining to the King why they had just, they were about to declare war on him. It was more to the world stage. They wanted to explain to the world that they're not just a bunch of rebels that have no justification for disobeying mother country in Great Britain. And so following that is the phrase that, you know, if we had to quote something from the Declaration, everyone would probably come up with this very famous phrase, we hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. And so that's really a statement about what we're all about, right? I mean, that's probably obvious, but again, it's more a statement about at the time, you know, you go back to what they're doing here is they're just announcing to the world the reason we're doing this is because we're being oppressed. And then the rest of the Declaration of Independence is this laundry list of the really incredible and sobering conditions in which Great Britain had placed the colonies at the time. And so, you know, like I said, pretty sobering. And I think one of the best parts of this message on the 4th of July, as we're all having some bratwurst and burgers and hot dogs and spending some time at the beach and spending time with family and looking at all that red, white and blue out there with the American flags, is that we remember what these people were going through, right? I mean, these guys were signing their own death warrant when they signed this document. But before we get to that, let's just take some remembrance, take a moment to pause and think about the conditions that they were under. And so they talk about what Great Britain had them under. Their list of complaints include for quartering large bodies of armed troops among us. They were actually forced under gun, you know, under armed gun that they had to put these soldiers, these strangers up in their own homes for protecting them by a mock trial from punishment for any murders which they should commit on the inhabitants of these states. So we're talking about the army, you know, killing the colonials, living in their houses without pay and being protected from any colonial law, for cutting off our trade with all parts of the world, for imposing taxes on us without our consent. So that's the one everyone remembers, right? The Boston Tea Party. We were upset that they were taxing us. Every time we talk about, you know, the fact that taxes are 30, 40, 50% when you include state taxes, everyone's like. And we claimed war on Great Britain and our own independence because of some tax that was much lower than that. Well, it was a lot more than just the tax, right? So that's what I'm trying to bring around here. They were killing us without any implications. So for imposing the taxes, for depriving us in many cases of the benefits of trial by jury. Right. That's a pretty important one in our Bill of Rights that we certainly took seriously for transporting us beyond seas and to be tried for pretended offenses, so being put on some pretty antiquated ships and taken over to England to be tried and normally killed for things they didn't even commit. Therefore, the representatives of the United States of America. So I just cut off about three or four pages of many, many, many more infractions that were listed. So we, the representatives of the United States of America and General Congress assembled, appealing to the supreme judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do, in the name and by authority of the good people of these colonies, solemnly publish and declare that these united colonies are and of right ought to be free and independent states that they are absolved from all Britain is and ought to be totally dissolved. That as free and independent states, they have full power to levy war, conclude peace, contract alliances, establish commerce, and to do all other acts and things which independent states may of right do. And for the support of this declaration, and get this part, with firm reliance on the protection of divine providence, we mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor. Again, these gentlemen who put their signatures on these papers signed their own death warrants. So these guys are true patriots. Right? And we should all be very proud and reflective as we go through today and this week of what these founding fathers put at risk and what the soldiers under George Washington put at risk to fight a far, far superior and better equipped army force from Great Britain. So that was a Declaration of independence. Again, it's been a little while since I've read it. I remembered, obviously, the opening preamble statement about freedoms, but I had forgotten the four pages of very sobering grievances and that this was a document written for the world stage. It was not written for Great Britain. And then in the Declaration, you know, the Declaration is really very much a legal document. You know, it's. There's not. I'm sorry, not the Declaration. The Constitution, excuse me, is very much a legal document. There is a preamble, which is nice, but it says really what the Declaration of Independence says. And then it just goes into the sections of the government. What I found much more appropriate to talk to this audience and our reflection of the fourth of July was the letter of transmittal, which is down at the bottom. And this one, there's a few of them, but this is from George Washington to the president of Congress. And it kind of gets to what we should be thinking about, I believe today. It says, the friends of our country have long seen and desired that the power of making war, peace and treaties, that of levying money and regulating commerce, and the correspondent, executive and judicial authorities, should be fully and effectually vested in the general government of the Union. But the impropriety of delegating such extensive trust to one body of men is evident. Hence, results the necessity of a different organization. So he's talking about the three legs of our government. Right. And I have long been a huge proponent of this. I know it is frustrating when the government shuts down because they can't make a decision. It's frustrating that we have three different branches, really. The judicial does not often get involved other than just finding of course, legality of congressional decisions, but of course, the executive branch in Congress, having two branches of Congress and having two parties, at least with some independents, it gets a little muddy, right? People complain about things like filibustering and that it's wasteful, but personally, I have always believed in the beauty of our three legged government and of the ability to have deliberations, sometimes very long deliberations and very slow decisions in our government. You know, I always point out that when people get frustrated about that, that people in Congress cannot get anything done. And when Donald Trump talks about draining the swamp, and, you know, I think he's done a pretty decent job of following what he said, but he certainly has not drained the swamp. I'm not sure the swamp should be drained personally. And the reason I say that is because a slow, methodical government is one that generally in the end protects the liberties of its people. May not be efficient, but, but when you think about efficient and fast acting, those are the kinds of people that a very scared populace puts into power and they get things done and it's epic and it's scary and it has nothing to do with liberties of people. If you want to think about efficient rulers, think about Napoleon, think about Hitler, think of Stalin and Lenin and just about anyone else who had tremendous powers, made tremendous change in a very fast period of time, and it was not pretty for the social rights of individuals and for humanity. Okay, so I did go political on you there, and I apologize. But I believe there is some beauty in the distribution of power between the three legs of the government and in the deliberations that are required to get very much done. Goes on to say, it is obviously impractical in the federal government of these states to secure all rights of independent sovereignty to each and yet provided for the interest and safety of all. So individuals entering into society must give up a share of liberty to preserve the rest. The magnitude of the sacrifice must depend as well on situation and circumstances as on the object to be obtained. It's at all times difficult to draw with precision the line between those rights which must be surrendered and, and those which may be preserved. And on the present occasion this difficulty was increased by a difference among the seven states or several states, excuse me, as to their situation, extent, habits and particular interests. So you can tell these guys, you know, they understood the sobering conditions in which they were doing this. They also understood the expediency where they had to take action. So it was, you know, done with heavy hearts, I guess I would say. And they go on to say that they can't meet the goals and not every state was going to get exactly what they wanted, basically, is what this says. But he said that all states that were assembled, all 13 colonies, were, you know, in agreement that they had met the most important. And he was handing to Congress a constitution where they could take action. And, you know, another interesting thing as I close here is I think we get the dates really mixed up. You know, so, I mean, obviously 1776, we made our declaration, but this is the constitution was 1787. Right. And I think we. We think they came out together or they were very short shortly afterwards. Right. Took us a really, really long time to come up with a document that, yes, has been amended, has been changed, but it hasn't been changed a lot in those years and is, you know, still looked at across the world as a document that created the most successful western free country and has retained it throughout centuries because it was a thoughtful, well written document that retains power within the people for a government that serves at the pleasure of the people and protects the rights of the people. So, anyway, that was a little bit of a trip down memory lane for many of you. Definitely a needed refresher for me. I hope it was of value to you. And I really can't wait for you to HEAR the amazing Ms. Julie Ziglar, Norman. So please join me, spend some time with your family, make some great memories, and enjoy your fourth of July week. Thank you all. I'll talk to you soon.

Hi, Julie. Gary Pinkerton. I'm doing well and you doing great.

Thank you. And looking forward to this time.

Yes, I have, too. Thanks so much for spending it with me in the audience. Love to talk about you and time with dad. I'm a huge fan, but I also understand. So most of these, most of the audience, it's aimed at, you know, first responders, firefighters, police officers, EMTs and members of the military and veterans. And in trying to explain to them the benefits of investments where you take back a little bit more control, like real estate and, you know, their own business and things like that. And it's my understanding, I want to say this is from listening to your brother on the Ziglar podcast, maybe, and interviewing you. I want to say that somehow I came across the idea that you're doing some real estate investing, perhaps for women. Is that right?

I do talk to women about. Yes, I do, because I share pretty openly about my. And I do this because my husband was fine with me sharing anything that made a difference in our lives. That if Our experience can help other people. We'll do it. And my husband had a credit card issue. And all through our marriage, we were married 30, almost 32 years before he passed away. I kept trying to buy land or a house, you know, rental property. I wanted something that I knew was going to grow, equity that would give me financial security when he was gone, because I knew he had a credit card problem, and I knew I was probably going to get left with a lot of debt. And, you know, my mind went to. I could. If worse came to worse, I could sell our home, and then I would still have investment properties, smaller properties. I could live in, that sort of thing. But he resisted. And I know it's because he already had so much debt, but he did relent and let me get one piece of land that joined the property we already had. And that really is the only true investment that I have that has more than doubled, you know, in value since I've gotten it.

So that's cool. Yeah.

I encourage women to be proactive about taking care of their future financially, most especially if they have a spouse who's financially irresponsible.

Yeah.

My husband meant he could make a ton of money quicker than anybody I knew. Brilliant businessman. But the credit cards were just something that he felt like were there for his youth. And. Yeah, yeah, he's worth every penny. I'm paying off, though. I accepted that we were never going to get past that one. And we had 20 awesome years of marriage because I quit worried about money.

That's awesome. And I know that I saw some of your past as well, with marital challenges, with some of his, you know, his alcoholism, I guess, right?

Oh, yeah. We were both. That was part of the big attraction. We could certainly drink together and. Yeah, and then we had communication problems after we quit drinking because we didn't know. We were afraid to talk openly. I mean, you know, without the little bit of loosening of the tongue there, we weren't quite as honest about what was going on, but we got it right with the right help. And like Jim said, our marriage was as dead as Lazarus.

But you don't actually have an investment company or something. Somehow I got that idea that you.

Actually were like, my daughter is my broker, and she is a part owner in our Prime Properties Realty. And we are an investment real estate company. We buy properties, we rehab them, and now, I mean, gosh, it's so hard to find anything to buy that we're actually building investment properties for resale to our investors, only they never go on the MLS and we manage them. We get a two year contract. So we keep them in house for two years. But people don't leave us because we take such good care of them and the property. But we have top rung. I mean as far as our houses go, if we buy one and rehab it, it is in as close to new as you can get for an older home. Ours are really nice. They command a higher rent. Everybody wants them, people want to buy them. We won't sell them to anybody.

But our investors are those mainly in the south.

Down there we're in Fort Worth, which happens to be Fort Worth, Arlington area. And that's one of our hottest areas up here of Grove. We've got so much, you know, great commercial business coming in. So we really have a housing shortage and it's wonderful. I specifically focus retail up here in Northwise county near the LBJ National Grasslands. I specialize in horse properties and land.

Very cool.

Yeah, I sell investment real estate, of course, but where I live is where I get probably 90% of my business.

Very cool. So how big is the operation? Like how many properties you manage?

Oh, gosh, if I tell you a number, it's not going to be something I know for a fact, but it's probably over 200 at least. We're only two or three years old and. Yeah, so it's growing and we have people who, you know, who move properties to us when they're not happy with their management companies as well.

Well, that's wonderful. You had asked me in the email and I don't think I ever got back to you about my story of Zig and how he helped me. And I've got all the books, of course, and I've listened to his automobile. I've enacted automobile university and trips that I used to do every week down to Annapolis, about four hours from home for four or five years. And so I've listened to his stuff on selling, you know, see you at the top of course, was the one that really kind of got me going. And I, you know, and then the courtship after marriage was huge for me as well. You know, treating your spouse like the person, you know, with the attentiveness that you did when you were trying to gain their favor. You know, at the beginning I thought was just brilliant. And it really led me to, you know, learn a lot about my own marriage and mistakes I've been making. So that was certainly a life changer for our marriage for me, for at least from my side. And our things are so much better in our world now than they were five or, you know, eight years ago when I was still active duty military and away from the family all the time, throwing everything on sue to take care of, you know, and on the sea at the top stuff. Gosh, just so many lessons in that book. Just really good for me. Really helped me change, see where what I was supposed to be doing. So his teachings have helped me completely change direction of just about everything and save a marriage and have a great, happy family. Very appreciative of what your dad did. I'm sure I'm not the first person to say that.

I'm so glad to hear it. Well, I'm sure you're aware of what a huge patriot dad was. He loved our first responders. And when I was a little child, I can remember long before Dad. I mean, when dad was a cookware salesman, straight commission. I can't tell you the number of meal tickets I saw him pick up for police officers, firemen, military. I mean, back when he had almost nothing. And I watched him run our troops down to shake their hand and thank them in the airport over and over and over. We traveled together four years, and he just couldn't be grateful enough. And because of his love, our company, we support a group that supports widows and widowers of military personnel killed in action. We have camps for their kids, the bereaved, grief camps, and got that coming up this summer. I get to be involved for the first time. And then there's a group. It's not the Wounded warriors group that got a bad rep, but it's a group that runs. They run. Gosh, I don't know. It's like 48 hours down through Florida. I don't know if you've heard of them, but our group are all people who've lost limbs. And so when our group goes to run, they're in their military. We run with, you know, the men and women who are out there running on their prosthetics and switch off with them. And it's all fundraisers and we just fits our heart, too. Yeah, that's Ziggler, Inc. Nice.

That's amazing. I didn't realize Zingler Incorporated was in that. My wife sue and I participate in Tunnel to Towers race, which is put on by an organization for a young gentleman firefighter who passed during 911 helping respond to those who were in the towers. And the Schiller Foundation. Excuse me. And that family has done, you know, very similar, but it's a run in New York City. Retracing his steps very Similar giving back to catastrophically wounded warriors. It's just amazing that our lives are operating in a parallel path. And I'm sure it's from the influence from your, your dad. I did know of his patriotic views and it's no surprise to anyone who I think has ever read from him or listened to him speak, you know, So I wanted to go back on some stuff we talked about, stuff you were specifically doing for, you know, in real estate. And you have a big real estate focus right now. And you know, you were mentioning that your daughter's your broker, that you do both residential and commercial. But that's, that's certainly an interest level of our audience. Could you kind of, for the benefit of everyone else, kind of go over that a little bit more?

Absolutely. Be happy to. Our market here in the Dallas Fort Worth area is incredible. So I have that added confidence of knowing that if I have an investor here with kind of corporate businesses moving in here, it's amazing the property shortage we're experiencing. New bills are going up as fast as they can and rehabs are going on. And it's an exciting, very exciting market to be in.

Yeah, it's amazing what Dallas, how different Dallas is from the 1980s when the last oil price reduction occurred. It darn near destroyed Dallas and Houston. And now Dallas is so diversified that it's just growing like crazy. It's amazing to watch.

Yeah, my husband and I were some of the people who were destroyed financially by that oil business deal and the savings and loan debacle because we had a huge property management company, thousands of apartment units, most of them owned by oil people who immediately took back their management. And we went from tall cotton to burned out in about three months. Lost everything we had. Oh, gosh, yeah. Like anything, it all came back.

I work with a group, Jason Hartman in the Platinum Properties Investors Network, very similar model to yours, have been in Dallas in the past. I sourced most of the properties that Susan and I have through his network. Very similar, very like minded in what we're doing. And like you have found that the Dallas market is an awesome one, but very hard to find inventory, as you were mentioning before, and you all are managing, excuse me, 200 plus properties. Pretty amazing. But you had mentioned that you do this and you talk often to spouses, generally women, individuals who are not necessarily the primary breadwinner, but you do it for a specific purpose. Some lessons that you learned. Could you maybe go over your personal experience there?

Yes, and I want the audience to know that I share everything that I share has the blessing of my husband. I lost him three years ago, but we spoke about these things as a couple publicly together. So what I'm sharing with you, he'd be happy for me to share, and there is no shame in it. Years ago, we had some marriage issues, and one of them was the fact that my husband loved credit cards. And there was no amount of debt that seemed to be too much debt for him to feel comfortable carrying. He had a capacity to make large sums of money helping people build their businesses, and he always felt like he'd have time to take care of it. I always knew in my heart I was going to end up with a lot of debt payoff because my husband was almost 13 years older than me and not in real good health. But through counseling, I learned that that was a trait, a characteristic that he was probably never going to be able to change. And I was told that I needed to accept it in order to have a happy marriage. And I decided that I wasn't going to worry about those credit card bills anymore because it wouldn't do any good because nothing was going to change. And my husband and I had wonderfully a happy marriage. 20 years of the 32. Part of that was because there was some alcoholism involved in the beginning and then sobriety for both of us within two and a half years. A lot of growth. A lot of growth. We grew together a bunch. And I had always wanted to invest in land or houses because I understood equity. I had. The only way we had ever made huge sums of money as a married couple, in big chunks, was every time we'd sell a house we'd own for three or four years we had all this equity. It was just like, to me, it felt like free money because, I mean, we were gonna live in that house anyway. So my husband just kind of resisted it, except for the 8.24 acres that adjoin the land my house is on. He went along with me to get that because I knew that would be the only financial security that I would have in the end. And sure enough, that's how it turned out. But I encourage men and women to make that investment because it is a solid one. And that land, that house, that rent house, is going to be a solid investment, especially in. Well, good times are bad because more people end up in rental homes during the down times than ever before. Ones who can't continue to make their mortgage payments. It's just a good investment, and that's. I encourage people to do it because of my own personal experience. I sure Wish that I had insisted and pushed harder for the cute little houses around the corner. Because quite honestly, Gary, if I could move to a smaller house now just for convenience, I would. The equity is so awesome in the home I'm in. There is no way I can move anywhere and have a fraction of what I've got right now. So if I want to keep my horses, if I want to be able to have all my kids come, I need to stay where I am because otherwise I would get like a thousand square foot home and no land for, you know, what I owe on this house. That's it.

Got it. Got it. Well, there's a lot to personal residence that is beyond the investment aspects of it. You know, it's your family, it's your sense of worth, and it's your enjoyment and satisfaction that's incredible. Let's transition a little bit. If you're okay with what is your involvement with like Ziglar Incorporated, you know, with speaking tour, you know, helping to share your dad's message as you were doing when you still had him with you.

Ziggler Inc. Our goal, my brother Tom, my sister Cindy, the mom, our goal is to keep dad's legacy alive in regards to how his teachings change lives for the better. So from the beginning, well, actually years before dad passed, we were making plans on how to transition because his was a personality driven business and he was powerful personality. Nobody's gonna zig Ziglar, but what we've done there is we are training people to go teach his material. It's called Ziglar Legacy certified training. And everyone, believe me, there is a background check you wouldn't believe. And everybody has to pass. Laurie Major's, she's the one who does the investigation on everybody's background. Laurie was dad's personal assistant and executive assistant for, well, Golly, I think 30, 35 years that he was alive. And now she's been with us 40 years. So Laurie Majors, make sure everybody we're involved with are on the up and up and good folks who want the best for other people. But we do that four times a year. We have a Zigler Speakers Institute teaching people how to be the best public speaker that they can be and take those big stages like daddy had. We. We only do that twice a year. And there are several other training, small business, that sort of thing. But I am specifically involved in the legacy training and in the speaker training because I became an accidental speaker by virtue of helping dad on stage at those great, great big motivational seminars that we used to do around the country. And I was quite shocked when dad quit speaking and I was still getting invitations.

And honestly, I gotta say, Gary, I got involved in real estate because speaking is six months out of the year in the fall, and in the spring, nobody has conferences. In the summertime, nothing happens from the week before Thanksgiving until pretty much the end of January as far as public speaking goes. And I was thinking, what on earth can I do? Because I couldn't get a job job because I would be leaving to go speak. Nobody would want that.

Yeah.

And I realized that real estate happens mostly during the times that I'm not speaking because my daughter's a broker. I knew she'd take good care of my clients if I had to go. Go speak somewhere. And there was a closing. So it was a perfect combination. And dad instilled a love for real estate in me. When I was a little child. He would take us out and stand on raw land and talk about, I see the house here. We could put the pool there. You girls can have your stables over here. I mean, these were the things that we saw. So.

It'S a mental thing for me. I just love land. Yeah.

And so you were mentioning that you have. You also do quite a bit of retail on the side, not as part of your prime properties business, but, you know, have horse lands. And I guess you're. You're selling land brokering land to other individuals or did you just mean that you owning yourself?

No, I sell to others. I live next to the LBJ National Grasslands. We have 22,000 acres of land, public land, and we have over 75 miles of marked, awesome horse trails. So it's a really hot market for people who like to trail ride. And I have specialized in selling horse properties because I am a horsewoman and that's why I live up here. But I also love selling the ranch land and the farmland. I love raw land, and I blame that on daddy. I just can't. I'm so excited to get to see any property that anybody wants to see. And I had one girl tell me most people only show me three. I think we've seen nine today.

I just love to look so.

Yeah. Well, it sounds like you're in a good. A good fit.

I am. And I enjoy the people and the area. It's a lot of fun helping people get their dreams made.

Absolutely. So I'm curious if we could turn just for a few minutes to being an extreme groupie of Zig Ziglar, as many people you've met has been. And and of your speaking as well. I'm curious, what is the most frequent feedback you get about dad, like the stories that you tell the most? Is it prime in the pump? Is it you can have everything in life you want if you help enough other people get what they want. What's like the consistent thing that you always hear from people?

Those two things. Exactly, Gary. You hit it right on the nose. Those are the things people remember most is you can have everything in life you want if you'll just help enough other people get what they want and they remember the story of priming the pump. I will say this. There are now people coming through our Legacy certification who ever saw dad in person and didn't see the pump and have never seen a real water pump that has to be primed.

It's taken on a little different light. So what we do is we show a video of that doing the pump, and it is on YouTube. If any of your listeners want to go look, just put in Zig Ziglar prime the pump.

Yeah, yeah, I've watched that one, and I've pumped a few of those myself by hand. They weren't the primary methods of getting water, but I have certainly done it. I did not have the luck of seeing your dad in person. I got pretty close once, but I came to the Ziglar way of thinking and his works almost too late. But, you know, I've read everything he's got and am a huge fan and hope to see you in person one day here soon. You know, one of the other things that was a huge benefit for me I mentioned was courtship after marriage. I think anyone who feels like there's a little bit less luster in their marriage than there was and pizzazz when you got first married or when you were dating made a huge change for me, and it was just changing something in my own mindset. The main thing is your dad, you know, commenting that if you dodled after, if that's the right word, thought about your spouse the way you did when you were trying to win their favor, you would not have any of the problems that you have in your marriage. And when that. When that switch flipped for me, I'm not saying I'm perfect at it, but I started paying a whole lot more attention to this person that I could not survive without thinking about constantly. You know, before marriage, when I started acting a little bit more like that, it changed things for us. And it wasn't about my wife changing. It was about me changing, you know, me changing my perspective and the way I was treating things and not just getting, you know, going about life and forgetting what you have, you know, made a huge.

That's right, huge.

Huge for me. And then the other thing I would say is the self talk cards. As cheesy as it is standing in front of a mirror, your dad's exactly right that those eyes are the windows to the soul. I mean, you just can't lie to yourself, you know, in front of the mirror. And it really does help. It really does help.

No, it does. And you got to put it in front of you and put it in there to get it back out. Because what does go in is what's going to come out when you're jostled. It's just like being ready for the opportunity when it presents itself. If you are not thinking in terms of how you're going to move forward, you won't recognize the open door when it's there. But if you have a distinct plan, you will see those opportunities as they present themselves and you'll take them because you've been planning on it.

Exactly. It's all about attitude. It's all about painting yourself in the right mental picture, which is all you know. That's your dad. See you at the top Book the most famous one. And so I, you know, audience. If you don't have the self taught cards, you can get them for free from the, from the Ziglar website. And I highly recommend the Ziggler podcast. I listen to it, you know, frequently, all the time. Well, everyone, if you enjoyed this one with Julie, please give us a rating and reach out to me and let me know@garyarrypinkerton.com how I can bring more amazing people like Julie on. More importantly, how can I re engage again with Julie to provide more value with you because I have no doubt that she would love to do so. Thank you so much. And Julie, thank you for joining us.

Thank you, Gary, for inviting me. I enjoyed it.

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