How Genetic Therapeutics are Revolutionizing Disease Prevention, with Kashif Khan

I believe the cause of disease is different than what medicine believes the cause is. I also understand that the majority of people may not be like your listeners and they're just not going to try. If I want to truly affect humanity the most, I have to fix the problem, but in a format that affects the most people.

Welcome everybody. I am Jeff Duden and we are on the home Front currently top 40 podcast on Apple for entrepreneurs. So appreciate everybody that's been listening. Simply building the world's most responsible franchise platform is Homefront Brands who this podcast is brought to you by. Please take a minute if you enjoy the content, subscribe, leave us a comment and we'll engage with you there. So very excited to have our guest on today. It's something that I'm particularly interested in is finishing impeccably in my life, being optimized, being the best that we can be to really serve our partners, serve our family, serve anybody in our life that we care about and. And we've got to be our best to do that. So that's what we're going to be talking about today with our incredible guest, Kashif Khan. Welcome.

Pleasure, man.

Great to be here. Yeah, outstanding. Thank you for being on. And Kashif is the founder of the DNA company where personalized medicine is being pioneered through unique insights into the human genome. Growing up in Vancouver in an immigrant household, he developed an industrious entrepreneurial experiment spirit from a young age. Prior to his tenure at the DNA company, he advised a number of high growth startups in a variety of industries. As he dove into the field of functional genomics as the founder of the DNA company, it was revealed that his neural wiring was actually genetically designed to be entrepreneurial, which will be interesting to all of us. However, his genes also revealed a particular sensitivity to pollutants. Now, seeing his health from a new lens, Kashif drove further and started to see the genetic pathways that led to his own family's challenges and the opportunities to reverse chronic diseases. His measure of success is not in dollars earned, but in life's improved science. Outreach has become a passion project for Kashif and he educates about functional genomics in an accessible format on his podcast, the Unpilled Podcast and his social media platforms. Welcome to the show today.

Pleasure. It's awesome.

Yeah, fantastic. If you don't mind, we always start with some history. Would you mind going back and sharing a little bit about how you grew up and what impact that had on you along the way?

Yeah. The number one thought that comes to mind is My dad was sick and we had no money, so he was older. When I was in my teens, he was already near 60. He passed away when I was 17, in his 70s, it's just approaching 70. And for me, that. That was reality. I grew up in this part of Vancouver where there was a massive influx of Hong Kong Chinese because China was taking over Hong Kong in 1997. So everybody was fleeing to Australia, Louisiana, Vancouver. And so there's a lot of wealth around me, and I lived in this little ghetto in the middle of all of it. So all my friends had money and I didn't have. So I could sense what it was like to be secure. But I would go home every night to poverty and. But my dad came from entrepreneurialism. He ran businesses, he built business. He just got really sick. And so those two things stuck with me. That your health can drive your outcome, can take your passion, your life away from you. And it's very possible to teeter on the line between wealth and health, both of those things, because I kept seeing both sides of both every day, every waking day. And that's what kind of drove me to pursue what I did.

Yeah, if you have your health, we have a million wishes and dreams, but if you don't have your health, you only have one, and that's to be healthy. So you grew up, you're in a challenging situation. You had to overcome a lot growing up. How did you make the transition from there into your early businesses?

So the big aha moment was my father passed away. I was not intending to start a business. What I had intended was to go into engineering, to design cars. That's really what I was. What I liked, I was good at. I was really excelling at it at the time. And I became responsible for the family. 17 years old, my mom, my sister, my mom was also sick. She had hormone issues, which I didn't even know about until that time. And so I started working. So I knocked on family's door first and said, how do I work? Where can I work? And my uncle gave me a little odd job and these types of things. And I immediately started reading books about selling and how to market properly and just whatever book I could read about people that had done things well and all these various skills, and I started applying them quickly. And I. I went from literally not knowing how to pay for food to I had warehouses and staff all over in multiple cities and didn't even know how I got there. I was just working so damn hard. Right. So that happened over a period, a Couple years.

And then there was a point in your life where I think maybe you were on a cruise and you, there was a picture of yourself or something of that nature where you looked at it and you said, hey, I have these things going on, but I don't feel very good at all. And is that what drove you into what you're doing today?

So it was a total system failure. Like every, I would say about a month or so after that picture, which was me looking at myself saying, wait a second, that's what I look like. Like picturing myself as my 19 year old self and meanwhile I look like a beach whale. Like, what just happened? Right? Clueless didn't realize that's what I was doing to myself. So I took a step back and like, how did I get here? But soon after that I didn't do anything about it, by the way. And soon after that I got really sick. So I got eczema to the point where I couldn't open my left eye. It was sealed shut. I had psoriasis, like spots all over my body. I had gut issues which were developing, but I didn't pay attention. And I had depression, couldn't get out of bed. The worst part of all of it was migraines so intense that literally I would have to vomit from the pain. My business partner would drive me home. So all this culminated into me then asking the question, what did I do wrong? What did I eat wrong? What did I breathe wrong? What happened? And I couldn't get that answer from any doctor. And this is in Toronto in the Canadian healthcare system, which is free, so it's great for citizens, but it's diagnosed and prescribed. Here's what your thing is called and here's the pill you have to take. And I didn't know that until that very day when I was 38 years old. First time I had to deal with that kind of clinical experience. So my question being unanswered, I did what I did and whatever I do, I just solved the problem. I didn't accept it. I started learning about functional medicine. I started learning about naturopathy, integrated medicine. I then stumbled upon genetics. And that to me seemed like a real solid scientific explanation. So I started to dive deep and I learned that there were certain parts of my genome that were just missing. Forget about good or bad. Like I didn't even have certain very important biological processes that prevented my business partner from getting the same illnesses that I did with the same food, same exposure, etc. I finally understood it. And that's the day where I shouldn't say, that's the day I then got my arthritic mother out of bed. I then got my anxiety induced niece back to school. I got my friend off of cholesterol pills. That's the day when I said, whatever I've been doing until now has no purpose or meaning. It's just been money. And that's why I was depressed, because I stopped getting a sense of reward and I have to do this. I literally handed my keys to my business partner and said, you keep this, it's yours. I know what I have to work on.

So are you saying that the tools to get a genome study or to get the testing done was available to you or it was readily available, but people hadn't really put it together to go get the tests and then designed the fixes and the adjustments. You had to go somewhere to be able to get the information to help your family members?

Yes, testing was. It hasn't really changed. So testing is what version of what gene do you have? The interpretation or the application of it is what was broken. So keep in mind that billions of dollars were spent on researching the human genome and sequencing in full. But most of that came from the pharma world, where and still today, most genetic research is being done pharma centric, which is disease centric. How do we find that needle in the haystack that equals a disease? For the most part, the majority of our healthcare spend, both in Canada and the US is on chronic disease, which you're not born with. You cause your choices, your food, your environment, your relationships, all these things cause these diseases. Which disease is a combination of poor genetic hardware plus your choices equaling some chronic condition? And we can get into some of those examples. And that's what, what was broken is. When I got into my genetic report, like you said, I had some PhD explore it, and it was like five different people told me five different things. How is this thing that's supposed to be so precise? It's my human instruction manual. So open to interpretation. And what I realized is not the gene results that are open to interpretation, it's the application, meaning that single. I'll give you a simple example. There was a recent documentary with Chris Hemsworth on Netflix. No, it wasn't a documentary. The mini series called Limitless, where he challenged himself in various things. And one of those, he was told that he has a specific gene called apoe and a specific version of it that called for an 8 to 10 times elevated risk of Alzheimer's and dementia. And there's another version of it that calls for a 17 to 25 times elevated risk of dementia. That gene doesn't cause dementia. This is where people get it wrong. Like doctors truly believe the gene causes dementia. But if you ask for the underlying biology, what's the trigger? What actually happens when you have this gene? What's the next step? Why zero? Why Perfect health. The cognitive decline. What it actually does is, is transport lipids in your body, cholesterol. So the efficiency by which you move cholesterol around your body. Cholesterol is a hormone that your body uses to fight inflammation. So if you have inflammation in your brain and you send cholesterol there and you have a bad version of apoe, you're more likely to develop plaque because you don't efficiently move it. That plaque will lead to cognitive decline. But the real question is, why did I have inflammation in my brain? Pharma is funding genetics disease centric. The very last stage is Alzheimer's dementia, which is the plaque. Now if I can make a pill for APOE and I don't have the plaque, I won't get dementia. No, you'll probably still get it. It's just going to express differently. What we really need to understand is that there's certain detoxification pathways that people are missing. There's certain anti inflammatory pathways, there's certain hormones that people make too much of, too little of. And if you start to look at that, you find the root cause for the individual. Now all of a sudden, for this guy apoe, Chris Hemsworth was just the priority. It's a warning sign, red flag. We need to dig another layer deeper and find the actual trigger. And if we deal with that, he's not getting it. Eight to 10 times goes to zero. That was what was missing from genetics. And I realized that again, an outsider looking in became so obvious. But the guys in it, it was just too close to them. They couldn't see it. And so I funded that research. Let's sit in front of people. So we spent three years studying 7,000 patients one by one to truly solve each problem at an individual level. And now I feel we're in a place where give me a problem and we already know what to do. It's like we've seen everything.

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Exactly. Yeah. I'm dealing with a musician right now. He was a well known musician in his time. He now has Parkinson's. His daughter is still in the industry. She works with another famous band. And I said to her, we need to work on you. She said, what are you talking about? I'm 40 and I have no symptoms. I said, this is when it starts. Your dad has the genetic wiring for that disease, but some other genetic failure is causing the trigger. We need to see if you have the same problem so that you can start the right habits today to not end up like your dad. Chronic disease doesn't start like a light switch. It takes 10, 15, sometimes 20 years of your body resisting and fighting to eventually get to symptomatic crossing this threshold. Your body can't fight it anymore. Then it becomes acute. So we can take a five year old child and tell you, here's all of what we see, here's your gps, here's all of the potential things that you need to detour around. And by the way, here's all your superpowers. You want to pick a career, you want to pick a sport, here's what you're actually designed for. And the earlier you start, the more, the more the better the outcome is because you're preventing and reversing everything.

So I grew up in Chicago, Midwest and then I moved in 1989 to the south. And the diets in these two areas are distinct, they're different and, but they're consistent across your peer groups. So when I grew up in Chicago, me and my friends, we all ate the exact same stuff, moved down here to the South. It's A different diet, everybody's eating the exact same stuff, yet we're all different. When I look at people in my extended family that live to be that ate, I can't even describe the amount of fat intake that was in their diet. And they were 96, 97 years old, healthy, nothing wrong with them not taking drugs. And it was unbelievable. And then other people don't make it to 60 on that diet. So basically from a root cause perspective, we need to invest the time to understand who the unique, who we are at a unique cellular level and then take the time to map out. So immediately my thoughts were Christmas for this year, I'm going to buy all of my kids one of your tests. That's what we're going to do. So I got to get it, I got to do it. And then we'll sit down as a family when we get back together over the holidays and we're going to go through it. And so I'm giving them something at an early stage in life that they will always know their genetic predisposition to certain things. They can choose to make an impact, they can choose to adjust their diets or adjust their supplementation, but at least they'll know and in the time to do it, so very excited about that opportunity. So why would this not be a mainstream practice at an early age? Is that the goal of the DNA company? And if not that, then what?

My first thinking was exact. When you land on this, you think, wow, I'm going to change the healthcare industry. Then you start to work.

Yeah, good luck with that, by the way. I've worked. It's a tight group. I'm just saying it's a tight group.

You start to realize it's a 4 trillion dollar machine, truly. 90%, and this is not a random arbitrary number, the actual percentage, 90% of that $3.6 trillion is spent on chronic disease management. Exactly what we're saying does not need to happen. Yeah. So try going up against that. The insurance system is not insurance. I didn't understand being a Canadian. I have a government health care card. When I go get sick or need medication, I go to the doctor and it's paid for. Right. I thought that's what insurance was in the us And I realized all it is a sort of moat to administer a group of customers for an employer. The insurance company is actually profiting from you being sick. Didn't get that until I started investigating. Two things happen. I realized that we need to build our own system outside of the system. And you're already Seeing this with biohacking longevity anti aging type clinics, it's being treated as that is true health. Health is not masking and responding to disease. It's maintaining the God given gift you have. I was born healthy. I want to return this body in the condition I got it. Why not? If I always make the right choice, I should be able to maintain this and live to 120 with good health. As opposed to the current American reality. By the age of 55 you have a chronic disease. By 65 you have two. You have the last 15 years of your life spent in chronic disease management. 66% of American personal bankruptcies are due to healthcare costs. It's absurd. We have the wealthiest empire that's ever lived, but it's also the sickest. So we realized that we have to work outside of the system, which we are. And people work with us from testing to coaching to clinical support, all sorts of things. I'll work with employers on their whole employee base. I'll go fly it to a corporate presentation to make sure that their team knows how to be the healthiest they could possibly be. All of that's needed. But the one thing I just landed on is I realized that there are existing genetic tests that insurance companies deal with and I'm plugging those into my platform so that I can interweave myself in the system. Kind of under the radar and support people without having to reinvent things.

Cash. As I think about this, it's blown my mind a little bit because I understand I've got a partner that was in Pharmaceuticals for 25 years and he has his opinion on it. He's now in fitness, right? Because he wanted to actually help people. He wanted to cure people or help people be healthier, not just keep them enough to continue to take more medicine. But outside of that, think about the food industry, think about the fast food industry, think about the grocery industry where we're going to get these things. It's almost like you don't. I read something about salmon the other day and I'm thinking I order salmon all the time because I'm under the impression that I'm doing myself a solid. Like wild caught salmon is actually a breed of salmon. It's called wild salmon and it's farm raised, but it says wild. So I'm thinking if I order wild, it's going to be healthier. So there's. You're fighting this battle of commercialism not only in big pharma, but also in food. And if you're not going to go to the farmer's market and grow your own food, which is certainly an option for you to do if you. The more you want to invest in your time, your time and being healthy. Now is that where this concept of precision medicine comes in? Because I've heard it before. It was mentioned in your book, which by the way, the DNA Way is a great book. It's incredibly well done. It's an easy read for a heady topic. The book, it creates a simple understanding of your cells and how they're constructed and how they function and how the different parts of them are. So it was really great to go through it. So I do want to talk a little bit about the book. But precision medicine, putting ourselves at the center of it, what can you tell us about that as a concept?

So the allopathic healthcare world thinks that precision medicine is just personalized dosing. Right. So it's still the same thing, just a precision version of it. What I think it is, understanding. It's not only precision, it's also personalized. Right. So it's. Precision means accurate, personalized means it's exactly what I need. It's not a one size fits all trial and error type process. Figure it out through measurement, measure five times and cut once. Type medicine as opposed to I have a mental health issue and I've tried eight different pills and I'm still not feeling well. So what we've learned now is through the genome we don't need to necessarily think about it disease centric. We can think about systems versus symptoms. So if I have your genome, I don't even need to ask you what you're feeling. It's like going to a traditional Chinese medicine practitioner that checks your pulse and tells you that a kidney issue. Right. And you would think why are they treating my kidney? I have a rash. That's why you have a rash. So it's the same thing. If you're missing certain, I'll use myself an example. GSTM1. It's a gene that is protective of the gut. So when you're eating your foods and there's toxins, plastics, whatever coming along with the food, there's a process driven by glutathione, this master antioxidant that's meant to help you clear those toxins and not enter the bloodstream where they can cause inflammation. I don't have that gene. So it's not even about what version or to what level of like missing don't have the gene. It's a unique phenomenon called a copy number variation. How many copies of a gene you have. And it doesn't happen in all genes. It only happens in some of the most important health genes that will determine your longitudinal health. So this is why I had the migraines and skin issues. And because what I was eating, that my business partner was eating, had a major impact that it didn't have on him because he was able to detoxify what was coming along with it. That one thing can completely change somebody's health outcome. It can literally take or add 10 years to your life. That one thing if you didn't know and had the wrong habits. So that's precision and personalized. Let's get to the root. The system failure. Forget about the symptom. And when you solve the system failure, there's multiple symptoms, spokes that come out of the central hub that seem to go away because they're all. That's the result of inflammation. The inflammation itself is the disease. We need to get rid of that.

So as I think about your business model and I think about what we truly need to make this happen, I'm thinking about education. There was a great Malcolm Gladwell book. I forget which one it was in, but it was talking about how people won't say anything to doctors because the doctors are an authority figure. So you go in there, they take the tests, they tell you what their interpretation of it. Heck, sometimes I've gone to the doctor and I'm thinking it's one thing and they tell me something completely different. You don't need any medication. It's a virus. This, that and the other. Like, how did they know this? I don't know. For us, the education that we have to take personal interest in our own health. And really nobody's going to advocate for us. We will have the information, but then we're going to have to. And you've got a private business where you consult with people. Us in precision medicine, having the final say is difficult if we're not educated to the point where we can be confident in what that final decision is.

It's amazing that you said that because that's exactly where I've landed after years.

You should have called me years ago.

So it went from needing to make the tool easy to access. That was step one. The thing that glaringly was obvious was that this is way too complicated. If I need five PhDs to tell me that my ears connected to my head when I could have just read it in a report. A gene that drives that, too complicated. So step one for me was making it easy that you Received something in your email that you don't need help. That was step one. Step two was the interpretation. Now, what are we providing you? What is the information you're actually getting? You already know your ears connected to your head by looking at a mirror. There's more important things you need to. So filter out the noise and give you what matters and make it applicable in your real world life. What supplements do I take? How do I eat? You mentioned eating fats. Should you actually do that? The genes around that, for example. So we then started doing that and then I realized we needed to have clinicians support our work. So we went on this sort of mission of speaking at conferences. I've speaking at so many health conferences, summits, digital summits, to teach at least the functional and integrative world that their precision and personalization is possible now because we have the science. Where did that land me is I recently passed the torch and we hired a new CEO. I'm the founder, I'm the CEO, biggest shareholder. And I realized I'm not supposed to do this job anymore. I built it. I'm the innovator. I saw what was needed and what I keep doing is teaching. That's the biggest gap in the industry is lack of knowledge. Not only the industry, but also for the patient. And that's where I find I'm delivering the most value. Running the business is a CEO's job. So we hired a CEO and brilliant lady who comes from a couple decades of healthcare experience so she'll help us integrate into the system. That's what she's good at. And meanwhile, I started this sort of private practice of my own where I work with entrepreneurs, celebrities, world class athletes to help them where they're stuck. And that education, the time that I spend with them and the more because now it's not just here's the pill, it's I've just taught you how to use your body and I've armed you for life. Because 10 years from now, you're gonna be asking different questions and solving different problems. And 10 years from there, you're gonna be asking different problems, different questions, solving different problems. You may decide to go hiking, you may decide to take it easy, you might decide to get married. Whatever's happening, there's always a question that either drives you towards health or away from it. And the context is going to keep shifting. If I can teach you how your body works and you're just always making the right choice, I realize that's the most powerful gift I can deliver. So I've started doing that now.

How to scale. That is going to be probably the next question. I have an idea. Franchising. But that. Because that's exactly what it is. Delivering services to people belly to belly. Where in every city and town in North America and internationally. That's literally what we do. In thinking about this. How young is too young to engage in this practice and if I can go to my own personal family experience. So my father was. My father's father died when My father was 14 of diabetes. And then my father had diabetes and it severely impacted his health. Both. I'm the middle of three brothers. Both my older and my younger are diabetic and are full blown on insulin. And I just had. I'm 55 years old and my doctors. You're in rarefied air. There's all of Your numbers are 150% of what I. But I've done nothing different. I've probably treated myself well worse than they've treated themselves. From a health perspective and a toxin perspective and from a food perspective. If we all would have had this information early, could they have pushed off the onset of their diabetes? So you think about this and pushing this down into the earlier you can make an impact in somebody's lives. Like how young is too young and are there any areas where this technology can be misused? Insurance companies, premarital. Should we even have kids based on our genetics?

Yeah. So all of that. So first of all too young is you're not born yet so we can't get DNA. But as soon as you hit this planet, I think that's the right time because you're immediately going to start making decisions about vaccinations, medications, environmental exposures. Food, baby food is full of heavy metals. We now have a schedule of 80 vaccinations that children are supposed to get in the United States. The active molecule itself isn't the problem. It's the heavy metals and the serums that are delivered along with it. Then you have this whole argument over autism where it's absolutely true. The pharma companies are right that the drugs do not cause anything that we call autism. The parents are also right. That's what my kid changed. So please explain it the day after my kid was never the same. It's some kids genetically do not detoxify properly. Specifically heavy metals. Some kids do not fight inflammation properly. Methylation is what the process is called. Some kids suffer from neural inflammation. That cascade, that trifecta equals literally brain damage from heavy metals. Being you have a child whose brain is completely Underdeveloped is already susceptible to neural inflammation. And you inject them with heavy metals and then they get a fever and their response is give them Tylenol. Tylenol. Acetaminophen, the active drug, uses your glutathione pathway to be metabolized, which is the exact same pathway that your body needs to clear the heavy metals. So it's this perfect storm to equal literal brain damage. Right. So I'm just giving you this example, one of thousands of things we could talk about that if you knew, you would have made different choices, right? We had. Sorry.

No, go ahead.

We had, you know, two generations ago, one in 10,000 kids, autistic, last generation, one in 500, now it's one in 38. And I can tell you genetically, the kids have not changed. What has changed is the inputs. Right, and this is going back to your next question about premarital. You. There's this phenomenon where one of the highest propensities of autistic birth is in Silicon Valley because you have these two highly introverted engineer type people mating, right? Having their kids.

Sounds so. So clinical.

Yeah. And all of a sudden you're passing on what leads to that type of behavior. It's the neurochemicals and the anti inflammatory pathways equals this. Here's who I am typing on a keyboard. Don't talk to me. Right, Bordering on neurodivergence already. And both parents pass that on to the kid who's no longer armed to deal with all the inputs that causes that eventual problem. So yeah, there's a lot of things, even relationships, somebody's ability to experience trauma. How much meaning do people give things when you have that conversation over and over again? Not this again. Because two people are truly remembering it different. There's a neurochemical called adrenaline which we know of as like our. When I'm running on the track or fighting or that adrenaline rush. It also is implicit in how you imprint memory. So that adrenaline rush, one of the purposes of it is to give you the warning sign so that next time you don't make the same mistake. Now some people do this really efficiently, which means that they experience trauma. Not only do they remember the information, but they also remember the feeling. That literal, exact emotion comes back the next time they're in that scenario again, talking to that same person, seeing that frown, seeing that color of car, whatever the trigger was, some people don't do it at all. Now imagine those two people trying to have a relationship. It's powerful to have different perspectives, but there's Certain areas where that's always going to be friction. And just knowing this creates major relief because you truly believe you're right and they're wrong. Until you know that, oh, that's my neural wiring. That's how I see the world now. I understand their perspective. We've can't tell you how many diabetes and weight loss sessions turned into marriage counseling sessions once we started talking about the brain.

Yeah, for sure. I could the two different types of addiction, rewards based and binging. I could see that if two partners have the similar addictive type behaviors, they could really go. It could. If you're both binge addicted, then you're probably going to goad each other on to be binging on whether it be food or other things like that. So it'd be helpful to know, I guess that's what they say, opposites attract because you balance each other out a little bit. And I know that I'm reading the book and trying to figure out where I am on this and the addiction thing, being an entrepreneur, the way that I look at rewards and risk. Can you talk a little bit about that? Maybe the addiction types and how that plays into entrepreneurs. I'm particularly interested in talking about these entrepreneurial profiles that maybe you've seen.

Yeah. So you mentioned the beginning that I have these entrepreneurial genetics. And keep in mind I said that interpretation is important here. Why I say that because when I first cracked the code and figured that out about myself, I thought that was entrepreneurial genetics, meaning that's the only way. Then I started to learn by interviewing people. This is what we did, 7,000 people, one on one. Right. I learned that there was multiple different versions of what made people entrepreneurial. Different reasons, different motivations, and all of them are equally valuable. You just have to understand who you are so you structure things the right way. So take me for example. Dopamine is a chemical that allows you to experience pleasure but also reward. So eat some tasty food or achieve something. Both give you that sense of satisfaction by binding and experiencing dopamine. So the biology of that is you have to release dopamine, which is the anticipation. I smell the food. So dopamine starts firing. You then have to bind it to actually experience a pleasure. So I bite into that tasty food. The receptors in my brain bind the dopamine. But genetically we have different levels of density of receptors. So the actual hardware, some of us have really dense. Like I experience it way up here. And some of people like myself have very sparse receptors. So it's actually very Hard to feel the reward. Once you're done with the reward, a gene called MAO comes along to break the dopamine down to eventually get you back to normal. And another gene called compt comes along to clear like a broom sweep up that metabolite. So I have dopamine way down here, lowest possible. And I have the fastest possible MAO and the fastest possible compt. So not only do I not feel it, but it's gone like that. This leads to high reward seeking behavior because I can't get no satisfaction, right? It's. I'm. My baseline is depression. And this is why I went through depression. Because when I finally achieved at work and I had money and my mother was taking care of care of and I got married, I had kids, all this stuff, I stopped trying and I got depressed because the regular day to day is not good enough for me. Or addiction because you go down this pleasure route and you find something that gives you that elevated reward and you need it constantly and more and more and more and more because it's never good enough. Or high level of achievement. Entrepreneurialism because again, you can either pick pleasure or reward. You don't need both by the way. Your brain just needs satisfaction. And this is why you see this teetering of people that are at the top of their game all of a sudden. Suicidal, right? Top of their game. All us also addicts, depending on the context. When I'm at work, I'm not drinking, but when I get home, I am. There's a shift in context. I no longer have my reward. This wiring, this extreme wiring leads to extreme behavior. And if you understand, here's the machine I am, I'm not a Jeep, I'm a Ferrari or vice versa. I'm not. Take a Ferrari off roading, it's going to fall apart. Put a jeep on the track, it's going to lose. But it does have a superpower, something that is designed for. And I now know what my superpower is. It's risk, reward seeking behavior. So I do that, I give myself the challenges. Even something as simple as I need to read five pages today that will stop me from being the addict because I gave myself another challenge. Now the flip opposite. Imagine the opposite, you say, okay, the opposite person is an entrepreneur. They also are, but for a different reason. Maximum dopamine receptors, very slow clearance. This person has such an easy time experiencing pleasure that they end up becoming flaky. This is the person who's in the meeting with you, nodding their head. Yep, got it. Show up next week where's the stuff? What were you talking about? What stuff? Where is it? I did it. I didn't. You didn't do it. We talked about 10 things. You did too. They're only going to do the things that they actually truly value and take interest in as opposed to the reward seeking person that I got to do it, got to do it, got to do that high functioning anxiety drive. But the things that they do, they're going to deep binge on and do a better job than anybody. Me, I can only do macro quality work. It's very hard for me to sit there for eight hours and do it. But I can do five things at the same time. Right squirrel effect versus the binger. Because their dopamine levels are so high, because their clearance is so slow, they get stuck. They binge in that thing that they enjoy, but it's hard to get them into that state to begin with. Now we've only talked about the dopamine pathway. There's so many more chemicals that drive this behavior. I could spend an hour just talking about this.

Yeah, understood. What would you say is the most common epiphany that people have when they start working with you in your private practice?

I would say it's exactly this, that the way that I perceive the world and the way the world perceives me is actually nature, not nurture. And I did not know that. Now I understand this relationship. Now I understand this business. Now I understand my children. Now I understand my. I get it all. It all.

So we were under the illusion that we were under the illusion that we were in full control and the choices that we were making were based on logic and the way that we thought about things. But when you get right back down to it, we're hard programmed in certain things for certain tendencies. And if I want to make a change, for example, let's say I want to change from some of my addictive behaviors that I consider to be non constructive to more addictive behaviors that are constructive. Now there's a pathway for me to implement strategies, supplementation, to move that chain over to be more productive. Like I started the call with if I want to finish impeccably. And I'm 55 years old, I've done the hormone therapy, exercise, watch my diet. I'm doing all these things, but I'm not really getting the lift on the productive side that I was looking for. So I'm missing something. There's something that I'm doing that is suboptimal. Is your work going to give people those simple, common adjustments that they can make that can give them a maximized return on the investment of time.

Yes. It's come down to after thousands, thousands of people, there's seven things we need to go through. And if we do those, you're going to be the best version of yourself. You're going to add a couple decades, literally, to your life. And what are they? Everything around executive function, mood and behavior, and how your brain works. So if you understand that, that's likely half the problem for people that are stuck in chronic conditions or aging too fast or not feeling right, a lot of it is how you perceive. So that's a big one. Diet and nutrition, at the macro level, it's not eat three sticks of carrots and some broccoli. It's more macro. Like, how do I metabolize fats? How do my time metabolize starches? Should I actually be a vegan? Do I produce the enzymes for those things? Micronutrients, in terms of supplementation, what does my body actually need and how much and what version? Because you don't need that. Trial and error. So that's another huge one. Everything around sleep, and this is an area that a lot of people ignore, but we've done a lot of work on understanding the genetics of I can't fall asleep. I fall asleep well, but I can't stay asleep. I sleep through the night, but I don't wake up feeling rested. I'm still groggy. Those are genetically very different things, and they can all be resolved in their own unique way. And when you optimize sleep, everything else gets better. Hormones, neurochemicals, inflammation, all of it. Then we look at hormones. So, for example, you are taking hrt. What should you actually be doing there? Because there's some. I'm in Toronto, so we work with a lot of NHL hockey players. This is like the Mecca of NHL training. And there was this phenomenon where all these hockey players were taking these androgen gel packs. So it's like a pack you put on your stomach goes in. There's a gene called CYP19, a one that determines how efficiently you convert your testosterone into estrogen. Some of these guys, the reason why they're so big and strong is actually because they make a lot of estrogen. It's counterintuitive. That's what gives you the size of. And when you give them testosterone, they just convert it into more estrogen. And all of a sudden they lose their libido. They got beautiful hair and skin and they're moody, and it's not giving them the outcome.

Yeah, I read that in your book. I was blown away by that.

Yeah. It's such a simple thing. Like, to your point, can we do this simply? It is such a simple thing. It just ignored. Because we don't look at things personalized. Right. We think testosterone is testosterone. No, not in certain people. Then we look at chronic disease. What are the big red flags for the major health concerns and how do we avoid them? And if somebody already has one, how do we reverse it? I can't tell you how many people we've taken off of pills that are no longer diabetic, that their cognitive decline. We've been able to improve it. 20, 30%. A parent who has dementia is now able to function. They still have it. But we brought back, would turn down, turn back time where they're at. Right. Then number six is everything about innate cellular health. And this is really the foundation of everything. So immunity, inflammation, detoxification, oxidation, all of the core systems that maintain the health of your cell. What does that equal the pace at which you're going to age? You can choose. If your cells are thriving, you're going to age slower. If they're burdened, you're going to age faster. Simple truth. And we can understand what your red flags are, what the threat source. You can prioritize and focus on those. You don't need to do everything that everyone says, do what your body needs. The last part is longevity. So all these six things I said are reinterpreted for the context of how do I thrive at 95? Right. How do I be not in a hospital bed, but playing with my great grandchildren? Those are truly options that people have if we understand how chronic disease develops. So all of these things we reinterpret to give a longevity context. And then I believe if you do all of this, there's not much left on the table other than optimization. Now getting into like biohacking territory. Right. Like the crazy stuff. But this is how you be the best version of yourself and prevent disease.

So it's really all about cellular health and the way that your individual particular unique cells function.

Yes. If you bring it down to the top 15 killers in the US 14 of them are all rooted in inflammation. Same exact thing. It's the same problem. Cellular health. How healthy is a cell? And the number 15, which is actually the number three cause of death is medical error. Doctor. Prescribing the wrong medication and killing you, which is also rooted in inflammation. We can say the top 15 killers are all based in the exact same thing. Maintaining the health of your cells, allowing them to breathe and thrive. And we are so close to being in a good bucket or a bad bucket based on our choices. It's very delicate, especially as you get to 50 and your mitochondria start to decline. By the time you're 70 years old, you've lost 70% of your mitochondria. This is the main powerhouse of the cell that allows you to create your energy. That also gives your cell its resilience. So everything that it's constantly fighting. This is why people don't get diabetes at 25, for the most part, because they're still mitochondrially strong and they're fighting it. You're still making the same bad choice, but your body can handle it. The mitochondria starts depleting in your mid-30s, and that's where by the time you're like 50ish, it actually expresses the disease. So maintaining that cellular health is foundation to longevity.

You made the analogy in the book that the cell is like a chimney. Can you expand on that for the audience?

So your cells are constantly taking in oxygen and nutrition to create energy. That's their primary job. There's so many other things going on, but that's.

And proteins.

Correct.

So energy through, proteins.

Through. So there's, in your mitochondria, there's something called ATP. It's like this store of energy. Right? And proteins become building blocks. So they're more like building blocks. So the actual energy storage called ATP, you dip into it to release what you derive from oxygen and nutrition. And the byproduct of that, and this is the chimney analogy, is an oxidant. So the irony is the oxygen that gives you life is slowly aging you and killing you. Because in order to use any fuel on this planet, you always create smoke. There's a byproduct. And so the oxidant, which is a byproduct of oxygen being used as fuel, is meant to be cleared from your cell through a genetic system called SOD2. SOD2, superoxide dismutase, it's called. Some people are doing well. And when I say some, I would say more people are not doing well here than are doing well. So the ability to clear this oxidation, which means cardiovascular activity, oxidative stress, is actually a bad choice for some people. Some people, we have to tell them that running on the treadmill is the reason why you're going to get a heart disease. Completely counterintuitive, right?

Yeah, that's exactly where I was going. Because When I heard you speak about. That is a compelling enough reason for anybody listening to go to the website to order the test and to do this. Because conventional wisdom would say you got to do cardio. You need to be on the rower, you've got to be on the peloton, whatever it is you need to do. And for some people in particular, you referenced that there's marathon runners and people that are extraordinarily fit, and the more oxygen that they intake, the faster it's killing them.

Stress, oxygen intake is 1. Lack of sleep is 1. Imbalanced nutrition, meaning not only too much food, but too little, not eating enough, which a lot of people are doing these days. Right. Intermittent fasting is fine, but you have to have the right calorie intake when you actually have an eating window open. All of these things that are potential stresses on the cell, oxidative stress. Some of us handle it well, some of us don't. You'll see. Simple example. Look at a picture of old marathon runners, and you'll see two or three of them look incredible and six of them look like they're, like, leathered and haggardly. Right. Why? Because they prematurely age themselves from all that oxidation they probably have. And so the oxygen, the oxidant in the blood now causes inflammation to your arteries, your organs, which then leads to disease. So it's not only external but also internal sources, but knowing your innate biology helps you make those choices.

Yeah. Sidebar. That's going to go nowhere. But when you look at these pictures of these people that were on these ships, like in World War I or coming home or whatever, and you see 100, 200 sailors and the crowd. Nobody's overweight. Like, very few people were overweight in the early 1900s, man. And it's now, I don't know that they were healthier. They probably. We had probably all kinds of toxins. I don't know if we were eating healthier or what, but, man, it is really. We have really gotten very comfortable and especially in the United States, with the amount of the access to processed foods and things that have the opportunity to, for some of us, manifest as toxins.

We've become comfortable and accustomed to a certain calorie volume and to a certain calorie source, meaning that we. But it's also. We've lost knowledge. Last generation, they knew. Two generations ago, this is absurd. Nobody would eat the way we eat. Nobody would walk into a Walmart and fill their cart with a good 90% of what's in that store. So we've Lost knowledge. And we truly believe that if it's on the shelf, it must be safe. Somebody vetted this thing. If you understood what is allowed in the US versus the EU and China and all these countries that ban the import of American food.

Sugar content in cereal by, just as one example, is much higher in the US Than it is in other countries.

Yeah. There's an iced tea. I try to avoid sugar, but there's an iced tea that I may get sometimes. It has 8 grams of sugar in it. It's not horrible. The same one in the US has 40 grams.

Yeah.

Same exact product. I literally bought it at an airport, and I spat it out like, what is going on here? And I read the label. 40 grams of sugar. My young. My daughter, who's my youngest child, we went to Disney last year, and her once in a while, guilty treat is a cake pop. Cake pop. Sorry. From Starbucks, which I've bitten into. Didn't seem so bad. She had it at Disney and she said, what is wrong with this thing is rotten. And she was 6 years old at the time. So I took a bite. It was so sweet. And it's the high fructose corn syrup. There's a study that was done where people were fed high fructose corn syrup for, I think, six weeks. Their lipogenesis production of new fat increased 600%. 600% on the standard American diet. The food is such a threat. And it's also a $4 trillion industry, and it's the same owners on top. Seems like a major conflict of interest.

Oh, yeah. If you go up the chain fast enough, there's a small group of organizations and people that own just about everything. There are strings to us. We are all puppets to a certain. To the extent that we allow ourselves to be things that I avoid. The only things that I really know to avoid are. Are high fructose corn syrup and things like that. And then seed oils. I had Mark Sisson Primal on the podcast, and really, he's big on seed oils too, and they make things taste good, but they're not really that good for you. I do a cursory scan of a label, and if I can find a product that doesn't have a lot of either of those things in it, that's usually the one I'll pick and go with that. You may or may not have an opinion on this, but I've been having conversations with people, and a lot of it has to do with what's driving the conversations is concepts, private equity, the impact of this on industries that you would have never thought, but Ozempic and the. This massive wave of people now that can pop a pill. And I guess it is a glucogen, like peptide receptor agonist. I looked it up to see what it was. But as you look at that, do you have any opinion on that drug and whether it's good or bad for us long term?

Yes, I do. So I think that first of all, it's not needed. I think that this. And it's misrepresented in terms of what it even does. So what happened is you had a Incredible launch campaign. 300 million views on TikTok on its launch, because every celebrity was talking about it and every influencer was talking about it. And so it created this buzz where it was sold out for weeks, if not months. And so what is that peptide you're talking about? So GLP1, there's these receptors in your digestive tract that can turn the dials on satiety. So satisfaction from food. So knowing when to stop. And there's certain foods where your body doesn't think they're safe. So it will turn these GLP receptors on really rapidly to get you to stop eating. There's certain foods that your body's, oh, I want more of this. It will turn the dials down to let you have more. So Ozempic and these products will go via also they manipulate that, those receptors to cause you to feel satiety and eat less. They also paralyze your stomach. Like, truly, there's people that are having stomach paralysis now because of what it's doing in the artificial sense of manipulating these receptors. Something as simple as a bitter, literally. There's these Italian drinks called bitters. There's kernels of the insides of seeds. Bitter melon activates the exact same GLP receptors. GLP1 they're called. So you can take a natural bitter, there's supplements you can buy in the store that are bitters that you don't even need to taste that activate these GLP receptors. This has been known. And this is exactly what I just said, that we've lost knowledge. This is not new information. It's been known for generations. Ask great grandma. She already knew that bitters would turn your satiety up. You'd feel full faster. Right? There's a gene called MC4R which determines satiety of the palate. And a lot of us are walking around with a bad version of that gene. And what does that mean? That our ability to get satisfied not at the gut, but at the Mouth is not that efficient. This is actually a survival mechanism of the past where people would seek out variety to get enough nutrition because they didn't have access to food. Some of us still have that trait with a pantry full of food. Right. Which is. So why do I bring this up? Because the hack to satiety shouldn't be a drug paralyzing your gut. It should just be creating variety. Think about when you eat Thai food, that wow factor. Oh, wow. Because it's soupy, salty, crunchy, but has lime, coconut, crunchy noodles, soft noodles. That's all of those things. So it gives you that. Yeah. That instant satisfaction. Right. Because your brain, the more variety there is, the more you'll get satisfied. So why do I say this? Because we already know genetically that there's ways to deal with this where you don't need a drug, where you don't need the risk of paralysis. You don't need the outcome of. You're also losing muscle. Forget about the fat. People on these drugs are losing their muscle, which is so important. It's completely counter to the production of the drug, which is meant to be. For diabetics. You need muscle to process glucose and sugar. Right. The less muscle you have, the more likely you're going to be diabetic. So it's literally breaking down the root cause and making you addicted to this product for life.

And it's simply because it's. You're decreasing your caloric intake so much that you're wasting away a little bit.

Yeah, you're wasting away. You're truly wasting away. And it works. If you want to hack to lose weight, it works in the worst possible way. There's so many better choices for you. And this again goes back to your genetics. Why does somebody lean on this? Either they're lazy or they're stuck if they're lazy. There's things you need to do up here, which is why I said it starts with finding what your motivation is. You're probably not lazy. You're probably been offered the wrong motivating factor, not the thing that drives you. For me, I need a sense of reward. Right. Some other person may need a sense of ego, fine. If that's the thing that drives you, use it to your advantage. So step one, laziness is not laziness. It's you've been triggered with the wrong reward. You've been offered the wrong outcome. And then in terms of genetics, you got stuck because you're trying the wrong process. The thing you're eating less, exercising more. What if It's a hormone issue. What if you just make too much estrogen? What if it's a toxin issue? When you're overexposed to toxins, your body stores toxins and fat so you can't lose weight. So you may just be trying to solve the wrong problem. So we've done, I've done a lot of weight loss programs with people where we don't do any of the conventional stuff. It's usually these two things in combination. How to make me not lazy anymore, find my motivation and find why I'm stuck. You don't need those pills. It becomes very easy when you figure these things out.

Yes. And that's the education piece of it that I think is missing. People, people think that we're just stuck. We're stuck in our habits, we're stuck in our families, the people around us. For you to make real change in your life, sometimes you've got to switch more than one thing out. I tend to eat better when I'm on the road and I'm traveling because I just like, I'm. I guess my need for pleasure is satiated because I'm out. I'm speaking at a conference or I'm working or I'm traveling somewhere new. So I'm. I've stimuli all over the place. So I don't need some extra food at night because I just had a long day. I'm under stress. I might not have the, the reward that I was looking for during the day. So now I'm gonna eat poorly at night and go home. And it's available and it's simple. Sometimes you change the window that you're looking through to change the habits and things that you have. I'd like you to do a little visioning here because I'd really interested to know and if you were to go forward 10 years from now and you get a copy of the Wall street was a paper up there in Toronto. I don't even know. Let's go with the Wall Street Journal. Let's say you go to the Wall Street Journal, you're on the COVID of it and the DNA company has been wildly successful. It's changed life. It's done everything that you would have wanted it to do. What would that article say?

I believe the cause of disease is different than what medicine believes the cause is. Medicine believes it's innate, it's aging. It's just going to happen because you're aging. I believe there's biological processes that make people exposed to what we're environmental, food, etcetera the meaning of that exposure is more for certain people. I also understand that the majority of people may not be like your listeners and they're just not going to try. Right? So the unfortunate truth is the majority of people won't eat better, won't exercise better, are not going to do it, and it is their doctor's job to fix them when they break themselves. And that's knowing that if I want to truly affect humanity the most, I have to fix the problem, but in a format that affects the most people. So I believe 10 years from now, you're going to see genetic therapeutics, where I want a cover of the Toronto Star, by the way, which is Canada's biggest newspaper. And it's going to say that diabetes doesn't exist, Alzheimer's doesn't exist, cardiovascular disease doesn't exist, many cancers no longer exist because we now know how to fortify the poor biological pathways in people that they didn't even know weren't operating properly. We also know how to suppress the overactive biological pathways that were making people sick so that the people that aren't going to do the work don't need to, but the people that are willing to do the work and still do that, but also have the clinical answer. So rethinking what medicine is, medicine isn't masking a symptom. It is recharging the system so that the disease can't even happen. And let me give you a simple example. We talked about the chimney, the oxidants. So now I have too many oxidants and they're causing inflammation. There's a gene called 9p21 that determines how, what the quality is of your arteries. So here's your heart, the arteries around it, the inner lining is called the endothelium. That's the. That's where the blood actually touches the endothelium. We know. Do you have stainless steel, robust endothelium or do you have paper thin, highly prone to inflammation endothelium, genetically determined. I already know that by looking at your DNA. So now what if I could give you a genetic therapeutic that gives the people with the bad version the good version? And they're not prone to inflammation and they can't get cholesterolemia because I know they're not going to stop eating the bad foods and they're not going to exercise the way they're supposed to, they're not going to stop breathing chemicals. So let me fortify their hardware so that they can cope with this new reality we live in that's where I think things are going to be.

You have a huge task, sir, to get there, because just like Ozempic is impacting some interesting industries, for example, somebody told me this morning that the forecast of tummy tucks and some of the plastic surgery is they're down 50% because people are just taking this pill as opposed to having to go in and have surgical modifications to their guts and things like that. Your vision is going to require that people are more motivated, more involved, more educated. And I'm sure it's doable because there's enough people like me and you and others out there that are going to go to the DNA company, we're going to get our tests, we're going to understand that a little bit of education is going to lead to a little bit of modification, which is going to lead to a massive improvement in the quality of our life. And then we will implement that to the people that we care the most about, because that's what we'll do. And it's very excited about your company and the work that you're doing. And I ordered the test. So we'll start this journey myself today. Outstanding. Is there anything else that you think we should cover that would be important today?

I think that. So what? I've been doing this for some time now, right. And first of all, just so everyone knows, I'm not a scientist, I'm not a doctor, not a PhD, I'm a guy that was sick. And this is where usually the best sort of functional health stories come from. And you'll see the cancer specialist or the migraine specialist, they had to heal themselves because everything else didn't work. And then it was so impactful that they started screaming from the rooftops like everyone needs to know. And that's what happened to me. So why do I say this? Because exactly what you just said, if you actually do it, it's not difficult. We're not saying to flip your life upside down. We're saying you already eat, you maybe already exercise, you already choose what cleaning products to buy, you already speak to your spouse. What if you just did it the way your body was wired to do it? It's not like adding more activity, just replacing the bad with good and vice versa. And being at that homeostatic middle place where all of your choices are aligned for your biological wiring. It's a very different way to think about healthcare as opposed to reacting and masking. And what can I add? It's no. Your habits, if they were all correct, you would already be Healthy. And the blue zones prove this to us. You have five cities where people consistently live over 100. They're not genetically different than us, by the way. There's been plenty of genetic studies on these people. They just have the right habits. And simple example, the, the longest health study that's ever happened is out of Harvard. It started in the 1930s and it's still going on. And they're trying to crack the code on what's that one thing people can do that will give you longevity, extended life. And they've been doing this for decades now. And what they've determined, it's the quality of your relationships. They said that's the one thing that we find over and over again for people that truly live 100 plus is they had a small amount of really high quality.

See, I thought you were going towards sweet potatoes, but relationship sounds good.

Sweet potatoes. Those Japanese sweet potatoes have something in them called anthocyanin. And anthocyanin is a potent antioxidant. That oxidant we were talking about that causes inflammation, it neutralizes that. And this is a big chunk of their. So if you look at the calories of Okinawa Japanese, it's purple sweet potatoes. It's fermented food which heals the gut, which is where your immune system is. It's fish protein to maintain muscle mass and deal with glucose. They also eat. What am I missing here? I'm missing one thing. Sorry. Oh, algae. Algae spirit. Right. And they eat a lot of seaweed and algae which has phycocyanin, which is what chemotherapy is made out of. It's a potent cancer killer. Right. And they've just taken that thing that we could get naturally from blue algae. It's the pigment that actually makes it blue. And they've synthesized it and sell it for tens of thousands of dollars for treatment. Right. For elongated treatment. I should say that those simple four or five habits and having the fifth thing, sorry. Is this tight knit group of peer group that they. And purpose, what they call ikigai. They have this purpose to everything they do. Their life is designed around longitudinal health without even knowing it. Right. Simple habits like that just replace what you're already doing and then all of a sudden you can live to 100 with good health. Yeah.

I was reading about the blue zones and I think. And this can be completely wrong, but I think it was about one of their. One of the diets they looked at was about 69% these purple sweet potatoes. And then most of the other things were 1 to 3%. So there was a diversity of these different things that they ate other than the sweet potato. But the sweet potato was the predominant piece of their diet. And I found that to be interesting. I love sweet potatoes. So now we've started eating sweet potatoes almost every day along with or as a meal. And who knows? We're just. But that's the whole point, isn't it? I'm guessing. I'm absolutely guessing. I'm seeing something on the Internet and if it doesn't look like it's going to hurt me, then I'm going to try it. I'm going to see if I feel better. But there's no reason we should guess that. We don't have to guess anymore. I know. One last question, and it could be a big one, but it's just a personal interest of mine. Coding the human genome. What was the significant. What is the biggest lift that we get for that project being completed now?

So the intention, it's more about genetic conditions that are innate. Right. So if you look at the research and science, first of all at a high level, we now have a human instruction manual. We know how to read the instruction manual. What is your DNA? Simple terms. Every cell in your body is doing all these jobs all the time. Your DNA is the instruction manual that tells it how to do its jobs. Certain cells read certain pages. The heart cell only does the heart jobs. Liver cell does the liver jobs. Some cells do every job. So your DNA is just the instructions. Now, the quality of those instructions are based on these variants and mutations. Some instructions are broken. There's a letter misspelled, there's a page missing. Then you can start to understand how well or poorly your body does certain jobs. So the big thing is we've understood genetic conditions. There are some cancers, less than 5%, I would say. Dr. Tom O' Brien says lost less than 3% are actually innate. That you're going to get right. That are, that are genetic per SE. The majority, 95% plus, are caused due to epigenetics, environment, nutrition, lifestyle. So for those, you're gonna have a very powerful tool. Because all of a sudden this thing that is just part of you, your genetic code calls for it. You can turn the switch off. Same thing with things like autism. The majority of autism is caused by, but there is a small fraction which is innate. Child. Children are born with a genetic condition that will be turned off. So that's going to be the big win with understanding what does each gene do, what does this instruction mean? And where are the Instructions broken. And how do we intervene with genetic therapeutics? The thing that I was talking about, the other big one is the utility of it. You're going to be seeing genetics applied in context that you didn't think about identification, manipulation. There's already artificial womb labs in Europe where they're saying you don't even need to be pregnant anymore. Right. And by the way, we're going to alter this child to make it exactly the way you want. There's already biotech companies saying that we don't even need an egg and sperm anymore. We're just going to use your genetic code in your stem cells. So you're going to see different application now that the coding is complete, some for good, some maybe shouldn't be happening. And that's the other layer of it. There's a company right now, last thing I'll tell you about that, there's a company in UK right now that's saying that they're going to scan your DNA. So when you go to a grocery store it tells you what to buy. And based on your.

Okay, well see, people will do that 100%.

Yeah. So we're years away from that.

That's a good outcome. And then our supply chains and everything can adjust for the population and. But that's a big if, Kashif. It's, it's if the companies, the 4 trillion dollar companies will allow it because that is counterproductive to a 4 trillion dollar industry. Us being healthy is not good business.

Yeah, for sure it is. It's very. I did not know this. I'm 43 now. I started this journey at 38. I had zero insight into the reality of food and health. A few years of exposure and completely opened my mind to every conspiracy theory being a fact.

They're mostly true.

Yeah. And I'm not because of just an opinion of mine. Because I see it, I'm in it. I see it, it's happening, it's. And it's not being disputed. The guys doing it are telling you how they're doing is clear, very purposeful. Right. Do as much as you can get away with. That's really the American way right now.

Working with the DNA company. Can you just give us a little visibility into the easiest way to do that? Do we just go to the website?

There's a couple layers to this. Just recently we talked earlier about, I've changed my role because I realized what my purpose is. And there's another evolution. I went from startup to building a company to walking away from my company, finding My purpose. And now I've found an even more elevated purpose. It keeps getting more refined and defined. And what I found is my purpose is to teach, educate, heal. The company can go do its thing and change the healthcare system. We have a great CEO now. So I've come off that. And so there's two things. You can go to the DNA company, you can buy a test, you can learn about yourself, read the reports and implement. I've also learned that there's so much more that people need that a lot of stuff we're not allowed to say. FDA won't let us say we know, but we're not allowed to say without a clinical intake. And there's things that I know that go beyond genetics because this is what I live and breathe all day, all night is longevity. Constantly learning, constantly teaching. So I've launched these programs. And why do I bring this up? Because I know who's listening. Here is more entrepreneurial business. And it's like you also have your teams to think about, your families to think about. So I've launched these to answer your question about the scaling. And I've tested this. I know it so well that I can sit in front of a group of 100 people online and go through the report where everybody feels like I'm talking to them, right? And I've done that. I've done this with 400 people at one time, right? So this is where I can build corporate programs, group programs where I can personally be hands on and do this for somebody. I just did one in the Dominican Republic of all places for this construction company where the whole family has diabetes and there's depression and the children, they're really well off building mega projects. But the whole family screwed up in terms of their health. And so we did this group session for all the family, all the executives and a lot of the team that was in different cities, we all got online. Everyone's lives was changed in this session as a group. I realize that's my purpose now is I can through technology reach many people at one time, right. And we can, as a corporation setting or a family setting, do things as a group where we all get that value together. That's my personal website, which I'm sure you can share all this with people after.

Do you want to tell people right now?

Yeah. So it's Kashkon K A S H K H A N official.com cashconofficial.com Go there and you'll see this like one on one thing. What I do right now is I work with a lot of celebrities and athletes. I have an annual membership or celebrities. I work with them and just I'm like on call helping them, right. And then there's a group session. But contact me because we can work on something custom. This is us doing what you need, not me saying, here's a product for sale, right? What problem are we trying to solve? And we'll custom tailor this to make that work. So contact me through there. Then there's the DNA company dot com. Right. If you want to learn more about the science, the testing is there. It's all there. The programs will include the testing for you. If you come to me through the programs, the last thing I'll say is, again, education is key. Go to my Instagram. It's the same thing. Cash.

That's a great account, by the way. It's so well done. And the little 30 second messages on there, it's on point. We need to incorporate some of that in what we do. For sure.

Yeah. So for me, it was never intended to be anything other than me venting about what I see in the clinic. We have hundreds of people that keep coming to us, say that I have Lyme disease, I have endometriosis, I'm dealing with this. If I were to say her name, everyone knows her famous lady that owns one of the world's largest cosmetic companies has been suffering from a female hormone issue for 20 years. Now. Imagine this lady, multi billionaire, no doctor that she's paid tens of thousands of dollars to can help her, right? One phone call. We figured it out. Literally one phone call. And she's like, why does not everyone in the world not have this? Literally, that was her question. It was just a hormone root cause hormone issue that needed basic supplementation to slow a gene pathway down and speed another one up. Otherwise she would have kept having that problem anyways. Why do I say this is because, like you keep saying, the solutions are simple. The. The detective work is the most important part, like figuring out what to do. So this is why I've opened up these group sessions, especially in the corporate setting. Because I understand it's not just you, it's your team, it's your family. As an entrepreneur, these three things have to be thriving for your business to also thrive.

This has been amazing. Kashif, thank you so much. I've really enjoyed this. I've gotten a lot out of it. I know other people will as well. If you had one sentence to make an impact in someone's life, maybe something that you share with your so you mentioned you had kids. Do you have a go to sentence that you would care to share with the audience?

Two came to mind. What I say to my kids and what I say to everybody else.

Well, pick one.

What I say to my kids, I constantly remind them, I said work like it comes from you, but pray like it comes from above. Never lose how humble you are. Right. Work as hard as you possibly can, like everything is dependent on you, but pray like it comes from somewhere else and always have gratitude. I remind them of that and I think that's key for me.

Faith doesn't go anywhere without the works. You gotta put the work in. This has been amazing. Kashif. Thank you so much for being on and we have really enjoyed it and we will look forward to following your progress and engaging with you further and helping you any way that we can do this. Great work for all of us.

Pleasure man.

Awesome. And I have been and continue to be Jeff Duden. We have been on the home Front currently top 40 on Apple podcast for entrepreneurship. So if you liked what you heard today, please subscribe, comment if you feel compelled to and we will definitely engage with you there and thank you for listening.