Mind-Blowing Biohacks You've Never Heard Of, Deep Sleep Enhancement Tricks, Upgrading Your Immune S

Focus on the things that you're doing repeatedly, not like once a year, but that you choose to do on a daily or weekly basis. And that's where the biggest changes can be seen.

I like to go by the feel and what feels best for me. I always wake up and I feel what my body says. How do I feel?

I think that's certainly a consistent trend that I see among healthy people. So you guys, you're completely normal amongst these circles. I have a master's degree in physiology, biomechanics and human nutrition. I've spent the past two decades competing in some of the most masochistic events on the planet. From seal fit, kokoro, Spartan agoji, and the world's toughest mudder to 13 Ironman triathlons, brutal bow hunts, adventure races, spearfishing, plant foraging, free diving, bodybuilding and beyond. I combine this intense time in the trenches with a blend of ancestral wisdom and modern science. Search the globe for the world's top experts in performance, fat loss recovery, hormones, brain beauty and brawn to deliver deliver you this podcast. Everything you need to know to live an adventurous, joyful and fulfilling life. My name is Ben Greenfield. Enjoy the ride.

Hey guys. Hey girls. What's going on? This is Ben. I'm in the Swiss Alps right now. Literally in the Alps, like right nestled in the middle of the Alps. I'm at this two week health retreat basically drinking the alkalizing soups and bone broths every morning and having like chestnuts with stew and other odd soups and teas and broths and sauteed vegetables for lunch and other odd items for dinner. And then also like getting wrapped in giant body wraps with heated pads placed on my liver, special extracts inserted, or there's a tincture under my tongue before I go eat my meals. And I'm starting to feel quite amazing. I'm glowing. My liver is very thankful. Actually. This is kind of cool. I've never done one of these before, but I'm here for two weeks in the Swiss Alps. I'm going to be fluent in German and Italian by the time I leave here. If you want to follow my adventures down here, just go to Instagram.com BenGreenfieldFitness because I'm on the gram. Go to Instagram.com BenGreenfieldfitness and I may run another one of these retreats next year. I have 26 people down here joining me on this retreat along with my wife and my family. And if I do another one next year, best place to go would be either my website and subscribe for my newsletter@BenGreenfieldFitness.com or go to the gram@instagram.com BenGreenfieldFitness and that will fill you in on all the goodness at some point over there. Today's podcast is very, very information dense in the realm of specifically biohacking for sleep, for recovery, for daily routines. It's a fun one. It's not with gastrointestinal Switzerland guys from Finland, so you'll enjoy this. This podcast is brought to you by Kion, my company where I formulate amazing things like coffees and bars and supplements like our Swiss army knife. Speaking of Switzerland, for performance and recovery and fat loss, our Kion aminos, one of the most.

If I can talk potent fat loss products. One that I, I take this three times a day now. It's called Kion Lean. We actually package our coffee, our, our aminos and our lean in one convenient bundle for you that's vastly marked down. It's called the Kion Daily Life Bundle. Over@getkion.com you save 10% on that and everything else from Kion. If you go to getkion.com and your discount code is BGF10, that will save you 10% site wide. Over at getkion.com check out that daily Life bundle. This podcast is also brought to you by something I'm probably doing the equivalent of all week this week. Green juice. The organifi green juice. You want me to keep doing that accent? Because I can.

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It's very smooth. It's a way to get a vital greens in my body. It's so convenient. The green juice. It's organifi. Organifi green juice. It's got spirulina, it's got coconut water, it's got lemon extract. It's got every alkalizing ingredient known to man. Moringa wheatgrass tastes a hell of a lot better than the, the, what's it called? The wormwood that I'm having to put underneath my tongue before every meal down here in Switzerland. It does the trick. There's no juicing, there's no cleanup, there's no chopping, there's no blending. Just pure greeny goodness in this powdered form you can add to anything. Shake it up in a Nalgene with some ice, you'll go to food Heaven. Green Food Heaven. Green Juice heaven. You get 20% off this stuff from Organifi. You go to Organifi. Organifi with an I Organifi.com Ben and the code you use over there to get 20% off is BENG20@Organifi.com.

Hey folks, I think it was two years ago that I had an article I wrote on my website and it was called eleven Indispensable Lessons I Learned from the Biohackers Handbook of Exercise. And in that article I introduced you to a couple of my friends who are real kind of biohacking pioneers in Europe. Temu Arina and Oli Soleharvi. And I am probably butchering their names horribly, but I will let them give the correct pronunciation of their names if I am because I got to work on my Finnish. But anyways, these guys are both with me today on this show. They're over there in Helsinki, Finland and we're going to be taking a much deeper dive into biohacking in general because a few months ago I released another article and it was called 14 biohacking secrets I discovered in the brand new Biohackers Handbook. I feel like I'm already using the word biohacking too much. And I announced in that article that their entire 544 page handbook had just been released in the English language. And this thing really I think knocks the socks off of the entire biohacking industry when it comes to little known tips and tactics and routines and so called stacks that we're going to discuss today. And I think it's just this big, beautiful kind of coffee table esque type of book. So that book just came out and although the book is jam packed with a ton of tips, rather than just telling you a bunch of stuff that you would be able to find in the book, I wanted to get these guys on the show to just delve into some of their incredibly unique protocols that they have for everything from mental recovery and cognition to immunity to jet lag and travel, to daily routines to self quantification because they're just such welts of knowledge. So my first guest on this show is a guy who wakes me up every morning on WhatsApp with photos and videos of crazy workouts that he's up to. He's an absolute beast when it comes to weight training and exercise, but he's also incredibly intelligent. He's a medical physician over in Finland. He's one of the pioneers of holistic medicine over there. His name is Dr. Olli O L L I. He's worked at 50 different clinics and ERs around Finland. He specializes in nutrition and holistic health care and operates a private clinic over there. He's also the co founder of the Biohacker center in Helsinki and speaks all over the world on this topic.

He also happens an electronic music dj.

And a pretty good one, along with a pretty good impersonator of multiple Muppet characters. As am I. I'm not a dj, but I can impersonate Muppets. Temu is my other guest. And Temu has over two decades of experience as a technology entrepreneur, an author, a professional speaker and of course a biohacker. He is probably one of the most self quantified guys on the face of the planet. When I first met him, he was wearing some kind of a vest along with a watch and I think a few other devices that were transmitting in real. And this was prior to the Apple watch days. This was like I think six years ago.

He was transmitting pretty much every metric that his body was collecting on his heart rate, his nervous system. I believe his brainwave patterns were included in that as well. To a small.

Ipad like device that he simply could carry on his person and glance at any moment to see what was going on with his body. And I realized then that he was pretty, pretty next level and kind of beyond, you know, just say chewing nicotine gum or putting butter in his coffee or jumping up and down on a trampoline for his, for his biohacking. And he was actually selected as one of the top most influential people in IT and has received multiple awards when it comes to the fields of technology and biological enhancement. So. So both these guys are friends of mine, we chat a lot, we bounce a lot of ideas off each other and finally, before we delve into the goodness of today's show, I should tell you, not only do they have this wonderful book available, but they also put on summits all over the world. Biohacking summits in global hotspots like Helsinki, Stockholm, Estonia, London, Toronto. Summits I've personally spoken at. And where many brands have hit it big for the first time. I first discovered the Oura ring at this tiny little table at the Bio Biohackers Summit. I believe I was the first guy from America to purchase an Aura Ring and bring it back to the States. And now that thing has hit the mainstream and you got folks like freaking Prince Harry wearing the aura ring. And there are other companies that have really launched formally at the Biohacker Summit like four Sigmatic mushroom extracts and Amber Night Superfoods. And so their summits really are places where you discover stuff as one of the first places that you can see. Kind of like CES here in the States. Some of the most compelling and intriguing and Interesting new biohacks. And they also really treat folks like VIPs at their summits. Amazing parties, amazing dinners and a fantastic expo floor. They also have all of the playback videos available from previous summits that they've done, as well as registration for their upcoming summit in Helsinki in November. All available for you, along with some pretty hefty discount codes. I'm going to put all of that along with everything that you hear about in today's show over at BenGreenfieldFitness.com Biohacking podcast. That's BenGreenfieldFitness.com biohacking podcast. Fellas, welcome to the show.

Amazing. Sounds like you could give a full monologue of our background and just speak for one hour.

I could.

It's Temu speaking here.

So yes, that's Temu. Ollie, can you speak like Miss Piggy just for the whole interview and that way we'll be able to differentiate you two.

I can do Kermit.

We're gonna, we're going to be Mickey Mouse, lose all our listeners in the first, first five minutes. A pretty good Mickey, dude. Okay, so you, you guys, like I mentioned you, you have some pretty unique routines. I know Temu, you travel all over the world and it'd be interesting to hear kind of how you keep your body and brain put together when you travel. And Ollie, I know you're, you're a physician, you're more of a family man based out of Helsinki and you have your own kind of home routines. So I would love to hear some unique aspects that you guys think are just like must do's or real big wins in your daily routines. And maybe Ollie, you can go first, walk me through kind of a typical morning and evening routine for you. And we have plenty of time so don't feel need to be rushed. And if I have question clarifications, I'll ask them as we go. But what's kind of a typical starting off with the morning look like for you?

Yeah, sure. I like to wake up with, without an alarm clock because I used to do that like five years in a row, totally sleep deprived and I used to sleep like five and a half hours and going to those 50 different clinics in all around Finland. So it has left the trace on my nervous system. So I like to wake up like without any clock so it's easier especially in the, in the summertime. So after I wake up I don't use any tech. So many, many people, it's pretty obvious. But don't use your phone so because that's that's the first thing you're going to be programming your mind with. So another rule I have developed.

Ollie, do you use, yeah. Do you use a sunrise alarm clock or one of these devices that wakes you up in your lightest sleep cycle or do you just wake up?

No, I just wake up. So usually my body tells me it's about eight hours or.

My genetic makeup is telling me that I should sleep a little bit more. So I need a little bit more sleep. So my ordering tells me that my average sleep time spent on sleep is 8 hours and 22 minutes. So that's about a time I naturally wake up. So of course with a child it's not always possible, but I've been able to arrange things with my wife so that's, that's not an issue. So yeah, I get up within 30 seconds. No phones, no tech. I go outside whether it's winter or summertime. So barefoot outside, fresh air, just grounding.

Sun when available. So I like to just get the nature connection immediately and that, that's usually a thing. Even though I was, I would be like a bit groggy or something. Getting fresh air and nature connection, it's, it's just.

You do that in the snow too, huh?

Yeah, yeah. I think I've sent you some crazy.

Yeah, yeah. I've seen you exercising, doing your kettlebell workouts out in the snow. I, I, I will go out in the snow in the winter to get that grounding effect and some of that morning light exposure or at least what I can get with the, with the trees around my house. But I still have those, those wool socks. I've got the, the, you know, the barefoot five toe socks and I've got the wool winter version. I still have to put those on because, you know, for me to be outside 10 to 15 minutes with my feet in the snow, my, you know, I'm no Wim Hof. They get cold. Cold.

Yeah. But we are, you know, we are from Finland.

Yeah.

The land of cold.

Yeah.

Lakes. Yeah. So from there on I use some tech, some like vibration, I have a vibration plate. I do some squats in there just to get blood flow, nervous system waking up and, and usually I drink some water at the same time. So I have a pretty, pretty like standard cocktails. So I, I like to really hydrate myself and that's, that's usually the first things, those nature connections I do. So it's, I think I sent you this morning even my latest recipe for getting really good hydration. So it was these ice Cubes, which.

Yeah, that was interesting. Tell me about that. I hadn't seen that before.

Yeah, that's it. That's a Finnish company called Biomed and they're, they've been actually producing those ice cubes for I think about 20 years or at least 10 years now.

Bimet, like B I M E T Biomed.

Yeah, so yeah, so it's Green plus is the name of the product and it's consisting of four green elements. So the first one is organic fresh, dried and frozen wheatgrass and then this high quality yayama chlorella and Hawaiian spirulina and organic green tea. But, but the freshness is just something else. When you get these just they're like freshly frozen and you have these on ice cubes. So all you all do is put on a glass, some water, stir it a little bit and wait for a few minutes and then pour it down. And that's.

I wonder if you can get those.

Yeah.

I don't know.

I'll look for them. If I can find them, I'll put them in the shows for people.

Yeah, you have to really take care of the like the cold chain. So it's, it's. They need to be frozen so you don't want them totally like liquid.

Okay.

Yeah, yeah. Anyway, the hydration, it's critical. In the winter time I like to use more of like ginger, lemon juice, apple cider vinegar, some turmeric, just a little bit of the warming effect. But in the summertime it's more of these cooling herbs and the greens and so on. So.

That'S a stable for me every morning.

Okay, so when you wake up, are you doing much in the way of intermittent fasting or are you kind of throwing down these greens cubes in the first hour of your day?

Yeah, the calorie content is, I don't know, under 30, so I, I consider it fasting. So I don't really eat anything until like very late lunch or even dinner. So.

Okay.

I just hydrate, hydrate myself and I take some essential amino acids and you have been speaking about those quite extensively.

So.

So you're basically doing the one meal a day type of approach, but you're including like some choice supplements and superfoods during the day leading up to that big meal.

Yeah, exactly. So everybody talks about autophagy and. Okay. Disrupts that. I don't believe it's that black and white. So I think you can be in, in different kind of states and stages of, of the cleaning process. So I like to go by the feel and what feels best for me in that particular day. So I don't have like strict plans. Okay. I do every day the same thing. I always wake up and I feel, feel what's, what my body says, how do I feel? So that's, that's more like intuitive process.

Okay, got it. So, so you have these cubes after you've kind of gone outside, you've done some vibration training, some, some body weight type of exercise and you, you have another like hydration recipe that you drink as well that you sent over to me. Both you and Temu kind of start off the day with, with some very unique blends. Can you go into what you're putting into like your, your morning drink aside from these cubes?

Yeah, so it's, I, it's cleaned up water, so it's structured and totally like purified. So get the cleanest possible water or a well water or, or even better, if I have a spring water then, then I would go with that. So I, I combine with the half a teaspoon of Himalayan pig salt, 4 centiliters of ginger juice, 5 centiliters of lemon juice, 5 centiliter of apple cider vinegar and I usually drink it like pretty slowly and this not kick you out of ketosis and this might actually even increase the autophagy. So this is my version and Temu has some others he likes more of like maple or birch SAP with spruce sprout powder and sea buckthorn juice and ginger.

Hmm. Wow, that sounds delicious. So, so Temu, just to interrupt Ollie's routine, what, what's up with the birch SAP or the maple SAP?

Well, I mean there is a lot of discussion about electrolytes and the importance of them when you are drinking fluids. And I just like to go with everything that I do in a natural manner. So I think there is something to the full complexity of natural products that we dismiss by just looking at the label, like how much you have certain micronutrients like magnesium or calium or potassium. I mean and then when you're looking at something in nature like birch SAP, there's a lot of different compounds in there that don't do not really show up in a label. And many of them are anti inflammatory, are stimulating the immune system. Them have properties probably not yet studied fully. But our ancestors for sure were drinking here in the northern hemisphere, things like bird SAP at this time of the year. And that's one of my go to beverage pretty much in the morning to hydrate myself and things like pine sprout powder. I Use one particular brand from Arctic Warrior, which is a Finnish company here from the northern Lapland. And they are basically doing this wonderful extract. And many people put things like vitamin C, like maybe lemon in their morning water, but I like to put some pine sprout powder. And pretty much the reason is that the sprouts in nature, in pretty much everywhere. You take, you know, roses when they are just growing their first shoots of. Of leaves, those have some of the highest source of vitamin C in nature. It's a protective antioxidant for them and really key for their functioning at that stage of growth. And I like to get these compounds in such a form. And if you think of chlorophyll, anything green, it's just like one molecule difference from hemoglobin, which is oxygen, pretty much carrier agent in your bloodstream. And I like to have a lot of greens in my backpack when I travel. So Ollie has all these morning routines and evening routines. He's a family guy. Me personally, yeah, he's a family guy. So I'm traveling extensively and I don't have always the luxury of having, you know, my full medicine cabin with me or the office where we are right now, which is like the biker's cave full of all kinds of stacks. We can get into you that you can do throughout the day. But I have to improvise and I have to be very light in what I carry with me. So some of the things that I always have with me in terms of supplements are actually pretty much natural products. I have some cream powders, I might have a mix of wheatgrass and so on. I really love Amber Night as a potential lunch replacement. So when I go to conferences often, there is all this conference food. So if it doesn't look really good from a health and performance perspective, I will just take a bag of Ambronite, which pretty much is the bio organic version of Soylent. Instead of put together from chemicals, it's 35 different organic ingredients put into a bag.

Yeah, I had a bunch of that stuff over at your guys's biohacking summit. It's tasty. Yeah.

Yeah. So the nice thing about it is that many of the ingredients are basically sourced from the northern hemisphere, which has some of the cleanest food and air and nature and water. So that's one of the luxuries we have here. So, yeah. Another thing that I carry with me is a bunch of different mushroom powders like chaga and lion's mane and cordyceps and there is something called agaricus plaseae also Agaricus blase is Agaricus. Yes, Agaricus. Okay. Bl A from Brazil. Yeah, that's a Brazilian mushroom. So that's one of those. Yeah, that mushroom is one of the, the most effective, powerful.

By the way, that's in the four Sigmatic mushroom blends. I think they have that in their 10 mushroom blend.

Yeah, it's in the 10 mushroom blend, not necessarily in a dosage that would be.

Strong enough. So I have that separately. And it's one of the strongest blood sugar regulator. Much more stronger than cinnamon, which has been touted in the back and seen as one of the best blood sugar regulators. Yes, for sure. If you have high enough coumarin content. There are some studies that show that not necessarily the Ceylon cinnamon, which is kind of touted as the more quality one with less coumarin, doesn't necessarily have.

As strong because coumarin has some amount of organ toxicity. Right?

Yeah, that's right. So I like to go with agaragus. Plus it stabilized blood sugar. And so for me stable blood sugar management is key in a busy day, running from one conference to another, speaking, doing work at computer. I want to stay focused throughout the day. So the mushroom blends really helped me to regulate my blood sugar, also enforce and fortify my immune system and also increase neural growth factors like, like what's in lion's mane. One of the capabilities of that is it can really increase neural growth factors in the prefrontal cortex where your higher functions of logic reside. And what else do I carry with me? So yeah, many people drink coffee, I like to cycle it in and out. Right now I'm drinking actually mate, which I call the titanium tea. So mate has a nice combination of, of stimulants, basically all the tree stimulants that people often consume on a weekly basis like caffeine which is in coffee, theobromine which is in chocolate and theophylline which is in green tea. And it also comes with supplements that have health benefits, have shown to have different health benefits in them. So that's one thing that I am drinking right now. Occasionally I switched it over to puer. So I love different types of pu erh tea and I also like to make this kind of butter teas out of it. So I carry in a mini grip or some other form, some butter and MCT oil.

In my bag. So as you know from airports you can't get through with a lot of liquids. So those are some things that I throw in as some. And by the way, grass fed Butter, which is kind of touted in bakking scene as the best possible butter you can have, is not. I mean, it's kind of, it's in a category which is it's okay if you're an animal and you don't have wild trees and herbs available, then you opt for grass. So grass is kind of your last resort. So grass fed is not the optimal state of an animal, but it's wild herb fed butter. So something where it's growing in mountains and the cattle is grazing in there, they might be eating, eating a tree.

That's great. I've got one of those steak lockers out in my garage where I'm dry aging some beef and I have about 100 pounds of meat from a scrub bowl I shot in Hawaii, which are these wide indigenous species that just roam lands free in Hawaii. And they're these super hardy cattle species that feed on the wild plants and, and herbs at the base of the volcano down there. So yeah, I've. I've got some better than grass fed up in my garage right now.

Yeah. And when it comes to salt, I like to carry my own. And the, the type of salt that I use is, I mean, there is a lot of discussion about things like Himalayan salt or sea salt salt as a better option because the mineral content there is some isotonic hypertonic blends also filtered from seawater, like totum sports. But what I really like is one particular salt that I found from an island in Indonesia, which is basically on a mountain island in a mountain spring. It's basically a salt cave, a salt spring. And the indigenous people who live there, they go up the mountain, up the river and to the spring and they harvest this salt. And I'm particularly aware of things like microplastics leaking into our food chain. And salt is one of the highest sources of hidden plastics that we're getting into our bodies. And so definitely when it comes to the cleanliness of natural reserves is kind of key for avoiding that. Actually. There was a recent study that showed that Finland has the lowest amount of microplastics in the food chain coming from local products compared to anywhere else in the world. Some of the highest in. Yeah, some of the highest in terms of tap water is actually us and India. So you guys are right next to India. Yeah.

And this brand of salt that you're getting, what is it?

There is no brand. So that's another thing. You know, the best stuff is not really branded. So you basically gather it yourself or you find someone to find kind of.

Like Water over here in the US there's a website called Find a Spring where really the best water you can get. It's obviously a little bit more of a hassle, but you get a big glass carboy and you can go, you know, find your own water.

I have right now on my table, I have this natural, wild, living raw honey that comes from giant bees from the Malaysian rainforest. So these are giant bees that the, the people go in there and they harvest it wild from their nests. And this is, this has much higher amount of minerals in there. You can just see in the color is completely dark and it's also very liquid because of the high moisture content in a rainforest. So I like to focus on a daily basis on quality when it comes to any kind of category. That could be salt, it could be coffee, it could be tea. So it could be mushroom powders. I want to get the best possible one if I'm using that repeatedly. And I think that's the cornerstone of biohacking is really to focus on the things that you're doing repeatedly, not like once a year, but that you choose to do on a daily or weekly basis. And that's where the biggest changes can be seen. Yeah, so that was some of the things that I'm carrying with me. Do you want me to also kind of list a few other hacks that I figured out?

Let's come back to your travel hacks here in a second. I'd like to hear the rest of Oli's morning routine real quick. So Oli, we left off where we were talking about how Temu kind of drinks like maple or birch SAP with some spruce sprout powder and sea buckthorn juice and ginger and you do those biomed cubes and then I know your other drink is some Himalayan salt and some lemon juice and apple cider vinegar. And then once you've had that drink, what comes next in your morning routine?

Yeah, I actually got an idea of the air, air quality. So if you think about air, the Finland has the healthiest, the best air quality in the whole world. That's according to World Health Organization. So if you think about that, we are breathing about like, I don't know, 50, 000 liters or something every day. So that's one of the things you want to invest. So doing breathing exercises in the nature, whether it's winter or summertime in Finland, that's, that's gonna boost your deto, your overall energy production and overall well being. So I just had to mention that. And because we take it for granted but for some somebody living in an urban area, for example in the States, in New York or something, it's, it's quite rare. So. Yeah. But after my multiple drinks I, I make yet another drink. So that's my personal preparation for biakers upgraded coffee. We have actually a few recipes in the biker's handbook, so. So I've come into this very unique recipe. So as you spoke about butter a while ago, so I have this alpine amazing butter. It's fed with over 400 plants. The cows are fed over 400 plants and they're living in about 2,000 meters in the alpine. So that's the most amazing butter I've ever tasted. So I mix that into this dark chaga organic Chaga coffee. I use some caprylic acid, actually pretty hefty amounts like two tablespoons or so. And also the highest quality collagen protein, about 2 tablespoons. I put on some Madagascar vanilla, some Ceylon cinnamon, and I might use some warming spices like.

Some chili or, or cayenne pepper rather. And then I mix it up with organic stevia drops. So I only take two drops. So just to get a little bit of the sweet taste but not so much that it would necessarily affect my blood sugar. And I blend these all together and it's a delicious drink. But that sounds good.

Yeah, you guys have a lot of, a lot of recipes in your biohackers book that make my mouth water. But what was the key that you were saying?

The key is that I use eight hours to drink it. So I'm kind of, yeah, I'm microdosing my upgraded Biacris coffee. So I'm not drinking that like right away and getting like 400 calories, but.

I'd rather I drink it all at once while it's piping hot.

And if you think about caffeine metabolism, so I'm, I'm a slow metabolizer. So it's really gonna kick me out. So it's gonna be stimulating as hell. So I found this to be very useful and it's keep keeping me in ketosis, keeping me in the fastest state because the amount of calories you get in this eight hour time span is so little. So that's, that's been one of the key hacks mental wise and also for my gut health and about everything in my energy wise. So yeah, I think table is something.

Yeah. I would like to add that US military, I think they did a research on microdosing coffee and they basically had better results in terms of Focus and attention. Once the cup of coffee was consumed over a time, a period of time when they were microdosing 5-10mg instead of the whole cup at one go, compared to the ones who drink the whole, whole cup. And another thing that I want to add about these alpine butters is that if you make ghee out of them in the high altitude, you have a different boiling point than if you're at sea level and you're producing less of oxidized fats at this high altitude. So if you want to hack your ghee and you don't want to have the milk protein, you want to do that in as high as you can on a mountain.

That's interesting. And why is that?

Again, that is because of the different boiling point. So once you go into high altitude, it changes atmospheric pressure and that changes the boiling point of water.

At a lower, lower boiling point. And because of the lower boiling point, you are producing less of oxidized problematic compounds that we are always touting are the key problem when we fry things. And if you're making your ghee, you have to boil it up a little bit to isolate the milk protein. And this is one of the ways if you want to make the best tasting, less oxidized ghee that is actually healthy for you.

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So that'd be the complete opposite compared to like making your ghee in, say, a pressure cooker. You're actually making your ghee at as low atmospheric pressure as possible. That's interesting. By the way, something that I thought of as you guys were talking about like multiple drinks is, you know, a lot of, a lot of health enthusiasts and anti aging enthusiasts and biohackers. I know they do have a similar protocol where there's kind of like multiple liquids, especially because many are following some form or flavor of an intermittent fasting protocol used during the morning routine. So, you know, for example, even myself, I get up in the morning, I have a giant mason glass jar full of these hypertonic minerals called ketone minerals with structured water. And I'll then move on and like an hour later in the morning I'm having my own. And it varies from morning to morning, but usually it's some kind of a nutribullet blended version of chaga and coffee and Ceylon cinnamon and stevia and cayenne and any number of sometimes cacao, sometimes it's some form of a green or a matcha tea blend. But typically up until the time I'm having breakfast around 10 or 10:30am yeah, there's a lot of different drinks going down the hatch. And I think it's just a cool way to fuel your body while you're in a relative way, relatively fasted state. And I don't use a lot of fats or oils or calories, et cetera, because I like to stay lean and tap into my own adipose tissue. But I think that's certainly a consistent trend that I see among healthy people is they've got all sorts of crazy brews that they drink in the morning. So you guys, you're completely normal amongst these circles.

Have you heard about chokamin Chocolateman?

What's choco? Chocomin is a, it is a standard choke you amin. Yeah, it will choke you in chocolate. Basically it is a standardized extract of chocolate. So if you have like one teaspoon of chocolate mint powder, you're getting equal amount of like one or two bars of chocolate into your system. That's not an amount of polyphenols from chocolate that you could easily consume in your, your morning coffee drink. But with chokamine you can get that in. So you get much more anandamides, which is the internally produced cannabinoid that actually makes you feel really good. When you have a runner's high internally your body is producing anandamides and that's available in chocolate but not in high amounts. So with the chocolate extract you get more of that, that you also get theobromine and you get a bunch of other Things that are giving you much faster information processing speed. So they did a study, a quite small study on this with 1,000 milligrams of chakramin. And they showed increased information processing speed compared to any other method. So that's my go to additive.

Okay, I'm gonna find it and I'm gonna put it in the show notes. BenGreenfieldFitness.com Biohack Podcast I'll find this chocolate mean stuff and toss it in the show notes for you guys. Okay, so Ollie, you've got your coffee. You're sipping on that throughout the day. What else are you doing in the morning to get yourself ready to go see your patient starting at about 4pm when you finally finished your morning routine?

Yeah, it takes eight hours before morning routines and then I'm done for the day. No, just kidding. I go downstairs, I take usually 8 minute program in the Bamber program device. So that's a PMF or microcyclist and.

Stimulation device and the, the pulsed electromagnetic field therapy. Pemf. Yeah, I love that.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah. So it's eight, eight minutes. Then I go to the clear light infrared sauna. I usually sweat there about 20 to 30 minutes. In the summertime. It's. The sweat comes like enough after 10 minutes. So, so it's. I, I really like it. I like to have a little bit of sweat every morning. And the infrared sun has been like, I've been using it like five, six years. So it's, it's been stable in, in my morning routines for a while. So I might do some dry brushing on the skin so it's actually stimulating the kidneys and, and the liquid drainage and, and also, also like overall like liquid circulation. So that's, that's really good. I don't do it every morning because if you do things too often so it might like turn against you.

After the sauna. I always, I never miss it. Even though I wouldn't have time for the sauna. I always take two minute cold shower.

So that's, it's just a good routine. But when I was in Finland, you guys hit each other with stuff in the sauna. Like you have like branches and you hit each other and it feels great. Did you do that when you're in the sauna? Do you hit yourself with branches and leaves?

Certainly I spank myself every time.

Spank each other with birch leaves.

Birch leaves.

So that's our national sport. We go to sauna. There's nothing sexual about it. You, you're completely naked and you Heat the sauna to over 100 degrees Celsius. I don't know what's in Fahrenheit. That's a complicated system you guys have there. But anyway, so then you take some bird sleeves and you, you basically tie them together. You can use other trees also. Oak is great as well if you want to go hardcore. You get some stinging nettle and once you, or you could even, you know, get one of those trees with some needles in them like pine or and so on, or spruce. And once you hit your cell with something like stinging nettles into your kidneys, you get this, you know, red rash, but actually that increases circulation on that area. So that was one of the good old treatments for kidney problems that you basically hit yourself with. Stinging nettles, you can also eat them. It's very high in iron and chlorophyll. It's.

I love stinging nettle, as a matter of fact, I think because of its nutrient density and high amino acid content and a pretty high protein content plant wise. It's one of the things that the deer, the white tailed deer around my property feed on quite a bit. There are these giant stinging nettle patches all over my land and these deer are large animals and one of the things I see them eating all the time are these stinging nettles. Now I've never thought about taking them into the sauna and slapping myself with them, although. So now that you've said it, I'll probably be on the Instagrams at some point this week hitting myself with stinging nettles.

You've been naked already. So now it's time for the stinging nettles to come in.

Yeah, but what I like to do is I go out there and I harvest a bunch of these nettles and I make nettle pesto. It's very, very good. You blend the nettles with olive oil and a little bit of Parmesan and some pine nuts. And usually I'll throw a little rosemary and, and thyme and salt and pepper in there and they're just absolutely amazing. On the way to the nettle patch, the big one, there's a bunch of wild dandelion that grows alongside the trail. So I'll usually go to the nettle patch with a big plastic bag and on my way to the nettle patch, I'll pick some dandelion leaves, then come back and throw those into the pesto as well. But that's kind of something I've been doing the past month. Now the nettles come up and you know, I'm eating largely carnivore now, but I'll do like a big dollop of this wild plant pesto next to my rib eye and I'll dip my rib eye in it and it's just, it's amazing.

Sounds good. I mean, you. We were foraging together, I think it was 2015 Biohackers Summit when you came to Finland. And yeah, we went wild foraging with wild food chef Sami Tallberg. And he cooked the upgraded dinner with this kind of wild herbs. And one of his tricks is also to ferment some of these wild herbs before doing the pesto. So you maximize the nutrient availability and you actually get some of those umami taste into it. So you don't necessarily need to use the parmigiano. That's a way to hack your.

That's a good idea. Because I don't like cheese. Dairy doesn't agree with me much. But I always find with the pesto I can't get that flavor. So if I were to ferment the nettle, I would get that umami flavor and not need to add the pesto.

You got it?

Yeah. You can even. You should mix it, what, like, I don't know, 15, 20 different wild herbs. So the best thing I think I have ever eaten in vegetable wise was I got this from Yako Hal, who was the third guy in our biohacker's handbook group. So he had this 30 wild herbs herb fermented goodness. So that, that was just the most amazing thing I've ever, ever like eaten.

So I was just like a couple of days ago in the evening, I mean, we are now in Finland and this time of the year the sun really never sets. It's still light outside, although it's, it's getting close to midnight and I like to go, you know, take a bike or, or, or, or just walk into a closest natural park and pick up a bunch of wild herbs. Make a vinaigrette on the spot. I think one of the best replacements for vinegar is actually sea buckthorn. Much, much better alternative for the, for the acidic taste. And yeah, you make your own vinaigrette. You mix that up and you get the energy into your system of those plants. So the energy of your food becomes your mind. And once you eat the, that as an evening snack, you sleep like a baby and you're fully ready to go for the next day.

Wow. And should people be wondering about like fermentation of plants like this to get through mommy flavor? You know, my wife does a Lot of fermentation. And you know, typically in a situation like this, rather than me taking the nettles home and just putting them in the food processor with everything, I would instead put like some, some salt and then preferably some kind of ferment. I mean, I could use like whey from the, from the top of a container of yogurt or I could use like a brewer's yeast or anything like that. Sprinkle a little bit of that in and massage that into the nettle along with some salt and then just shove that all as airtight as possible into a big glass mason jar, cover that and then just basically leave it at room temperature for a couple of weeks and occasionally open the lid if it needs to kind of burp because a lot of these ferments, they tend to burp a little bit and bubble up. But that would be it. And I've already noted to myself that's what I'm going to do for my next batch.

Nice.

Yeah, I love it. Okay, so anyways, back to some of our tips here. So Oli, you've gotten your sauna on, you've gotten your cold on. If you were temu, you'd be sleeping, slapping yourself with stinging nettles while you're in the sauna. You've got your coffee and then you head to work after that.

Yeah, I'm ready to head to the workplace. And in the workplace it's basics, basic stuff, switching positions. I like to stand and just move around and go back with the hydration. So I hydrate a lot. And I don't like to eat because it's disrupting the mental, mental flow. And if I'm in the writing flow, I don't want to disrupt that with eating break or something like that. I might not be that. Like a cozy co worker and you go to lunch with. No, I'm working so I like to enjoy the dinner and then have the evening routine. So I'm a routine guy that gives the, I don't know, it gives, gives me good amount of energy and it's kind of a. Regulates the circadian rhythms and keeps my body and mind in the full flow. I would say every day. So yeah.

Interesting. Okay, cool. So what about in the evening? Do you have any kind of sleep routines once you're back from work or any evening routines that you think are little known things you do or must haves in your evening routine? Oli?

Yeah, I think your listeners have read probably or if you haven't read the Deep Sleep Optimization article on your site. So there are quite a bunch of those. But probably some of the things I don't think many have heard is, is the whole body low level vibration therapy. Whole body vibration therapy in the low level. So it's, it's a, from Neurosonic, that's Finnish company again. So they have different programs for different purposes. They range from like 10 minutes relaxation to 12 minutes activation to like 40, 41 minute recovery. So I usually take the 41 minute program especially on days I've been working out. So that's, that's been a game changer and it's actually been dramatically increasing my HRV average and also the deep sleep amount. So it's, it's, I kind of wait, they go outside Finland and just blast on Europe and us.

That's, that's the Neurosonic unit that you use for that now. Now what's the difference between that and like a power plate or one of these units that you'd find in the States?

Power plate. It's, it's, as the name says, it's, it has a lot of power and, and the hertz or the vibrations, the frequencies are usually the same. So for example, you choose like, like 35 hertz and you stand there and do, do whatever ever. But this is more subtle. You're lying on a mat or a couch or they have different devices and it's really subtle but you can totally feel in your whole body. And they have different programs that go from your lower body to your thighs and your lower back and to the up of the back and back on. And they have actually studied this in multiple studies in Finland in different universities in Kuopio and Oulu. And they're about to release this huge study done in the University of Kopio this year. So I'm really looking forward to that. But in the pilot sleep studies they have found that about 80% have increased deep sleep and also better recovery. And the feedback that people give is just amazing. It's just, I cannot believe that there's such a technology like this. So this has been a game changer.

It's really interesting because usually you'd use vibration therapy as either a way to enhance limb fluid circulation, say like in the morning or to prime muscles for, you know, like literally just this morning I was doing squat sets, but I have a power plate vibration platform so I stick to stand on that or do an isometric pre fatigue squat on it before I go out and do the barbell squats. But you're actually using this in the evening as a form of low frequency vibration to activate the parasympathetic nervous system for deep sleep enhancement.

Exactly. So the effects go via the autonomic nervous system. So it's balancing the stimulation between sympathetic and parasympathetic tone. So for me, I'm pretty, I go in the sympathetic mode.

Pretty much all day. I have these parasympathetic breaks, but I tend to be more sympathetic dominated. So I need these hacks to actually activate my parasympathetic mode and get into more of the recovery state. So this is the perfect technology for this. I think even Chris Kresser, he actually sent me a message and ordered this device, so.

Oh, you know what? Actually I remember because I was on Chris's podcast and I was telling him about that deep sleep article you wrote from my side I'm getting. He must have gone and read that article and then emailed you. That's interesting.

Yeah.

Okay, I'll link to that article. By the way, for those who want to read the excellent deep sleep enhancement article Oli wrote because he has all sorts of little tricks up his sleeve for. For deep sleep enhancement. So I'll, I'll link to that in the show notes over@BenGreenfieldFitness.com BiohackingPodcast so you do your whole body vibration therapy in the evening. Anything else you're doing in the evening that's notable.

Two of the same things I do in the morning. So I usually go to the infrared sauna to have a sweat and the cold shower. And I use the PEMF treatment with the Bemer Pro. But in the morning I use the 8 minute program, but in the evening I use this 2 times 60 minute programs which are programmed from like a lower activation to higher activation. So that's also for recovery purposes. I finished off with five minute session with red light therapy of this Joovv mini. I think I purchased like I don't know, three years ago. So I use it on my upper body because the red light has been shown to actually stimulate melatonin colon production and helping me to get more deep sleep. And my special hack is this. I eat two kiwis, two green kiwis every night.

Two green kids. You're gonna get fat, man. It's a lot of fructose. Fructose. Poison.

Poison. Donate it. It's nature, it's not natural.

Kiwis your only carbohydrate for a ketogenic diet.

What is that the only carbohydrate you have for your ketogenic diet? Because I Know this, you don't eat really anything at work.

Yeah, yeah, I do eat quite a bit. It depends on my activated level. So I might eat some white potatoes and stuff like that. So it depends on the activation if.

You'Re in a ketogenic state and like you're doing something because I know every single day you've got some kind of glycogen draining workout that you do that is a speed bump for any type of metabolic issues eating a couple of pieces of fruit at night. As a matter of fact, yesterday I was kind of thinking about how many carbohydrates I'm eating these days because I'm training pretty heavily and doing a lot of weightlifting and running and preparation for this year's obstacle course season. And I started to think about it and I'm like, well I have a small dollop of like pumpkin puree with lunch. I've got about a half piece of dark chocolate after dinner with a glass of red wine at dinner and then typically a little bit more sweet potato mash with dinner and a little raw honey on it. And I'm doing the math and I think right now, even with that evening carbohydrate quote load unquote, I don't think I'm even getting 100 grams of carbs a day day. And I feel fantastic. I hate to say that because I know there's a bunch of particularly orthorexic, hard charging female listeners who are going to tune in and create more of the metabolic damage I see in women who are highly ketogenic and active guys seem to be able to get away with it a little bit more. So proceed with caution and understand. I've been doing low carb and exercise since 2011, so I'm somewhat adapted to this. I'm not saying that to be narcissistic, I'm just saying you gotta be careful and ease yourself into it. But yeah, I mean, for me, even that little bit of carbohydrate in the evening, if I don't get that, my serotonin and melatonin seems to suffer. And so, you know, I'm doing that and then getting a carb refeed in usually about once a week, just due to my travel and stuff, I'll wind up at a steakhouse where somebody will order like some kind of a potato based appetizer or there'll be a wonderful bread basket there, something and you know, there'll be like an evening where I might have 150, 200 grams of carbs and even that Isn't, isn't a lot or I might have a trip to a sushi restaurant. But yeah, I think a couple of kiwis are probably okay. And by the way, kiwis, you explained this a little bit in the deep sleep article but there's some research behind kiwis and sleep, isn't there?

Yeah, there are actually two, I think two clinical researches that show that kiwi actually increases deep sleep and makes you sleep more deep overall. So you're not waking up that much. And they don't actually know why it is like that but they think that they have the nutrients for the melatonin synthesis pathway like folate and vitamin C and zinc and so on. But I think there has to be something more also into it. Probably some, I don't know, some energetic information that's in the kiwi or something like that totally woo woo stuff but I just feel, feel it in my body and it feels really good and my body is actually craving for those kiwis so I don't know, I just, I like to do that and there's some reasons to back it up and not really.

Yeah, I think it has a lot of, a lot of levels of just natural serotonin in it, I believe.

Yeah, totally, totally. So yeah, I have a quite extensive supplement stack in the, in the evening I don't usually do many like supplements if, if I'm not eating. But in the evening I, I like to boost everything that helps with the relaxation and also the melatonin production. So there's a lot of stuff in the article but staples are like different forms of magnesium like, like magnesium glycinate, taurate, malate, zinc, taurine especially taurine is, it's been my favorite for having a pretty sensitive nervous system. So it's, it's really calming, calming my nervous system down. And phosphodidylserine excellent for lowering cortisol, especially on days if you're working out or having heavy stress fish oil as well combined with phosphatidylserine. And I have, have this special supplement blend that's also from the BioMed Finnish company. It's called Secure Secure Fort Forte Forte in Finnish. So it has this bioactive curcumin, bioactive selenium and bioactive resveratrol.

Resveratrol?

Yeah.

When you say bioactive do you mean that they are, they're blending that with lipids or they've got some other method to make it bioavailable?

No, not, no, they're not blending with lipids. So it's just been shown to really absorb really well. And also I've tested out with like, hundreds of patients, so I, I've seen that it really lowers the inflammation. Also it elevates the blood, whole blood selenium levels. So it's, it's. I think it's basic, good absorbable forms, but not in, in like muscles or, or any like, fat lipid formations.

Interesting. All right, so you have that blend and I'll. I'll list all of this over in the show notes.

Yeah.

And then before you hit the sack, are you doing anything else to kind of activate your, your parasympathetic nervous system?

Yeah, I've been using this Swedish spike mat with this, like about 1cm long spikes separated by about like an acupressure mat. Yeah, like a really, like, hardcore mat. So I've had this mat, like 10 years, or I, I think even 12 years. So it's ridiculous how much I've used it. So it's basically every night boost in some oxytocin endorphins, really helping with the relaxation. And I always use combine it with binaural beats. I. I like the Sleep Stream 2 Apple app, which is really, really good use, I think. Used also.

Yeah, sleep. Sleep seems great. If I'm not playing some kind of like, you know, slightly more almost like psychedelic tunes or something like that, you know, I'll use the Pzizz Pizz app for, For. Yeah, for Ziz. For. For something a little bit more intense. But that Sleep Stream 2 app is like a, you know, it's like a DJ for sleep.

I love that one.

Yeah, I use Brain fm.

Yeah, that's amazing.

Brain fm. I like that one. For naps. Yeah. Yeah, there's. There's a few, as a matter of fact, the three apps on my phone. Really? There's actually four apps on my phone that I'll use for any type of sound therapy, whether it's focus or cognition or sleep. I've got that Ziz app, the Sleep Stream app, Brain fm, and then finally something I've been using recently that I recently did a podcast on as well, the. The NuCalm app, which I really only use if I'm pairing it with their cranial electrical stimulation device that they have that kind of comes with that app. But, yeah, it's kind of fun. I absolutely love experimenting with all these apps that will play different sounds that lull you into different states. But Sleep Stream 2, I think, covers a lot of bases.

Yeah. Also, Oura Ring has the new moment Function. Have you. Have you.

No. What's that?

Moment? You can actually track your heart rate and heart rate variability, and they have this built in soundscape, which is amazing. So you can program your meditation update.

My. Really?

Yeah. Yeah, that's. That's amazing. It's. So I've been. I've been actually using that, and my wife loves it, and it's. It's just a great addition from. From the orgasm.

I had no clue that that was an addition. Where would I find that on. On their app?

You just update the app and there's the plus sign on the bottom right corner, and there you can open up a moment session. And after that you get your results in hre and resting heart rate.

So it's a bio.

Yeah, I'm bad at updating. I just opened up my. My aura app. I had. It says I need to update. Update my firmware. Okay, cool. I'll update it and check it out. The aura moment.

Shame on you, Bear.

You guys teach me all sorts of crazy stuff.

I'm gonna be spending all day fermenting nettle and playing around with my phone. Okay, so you have your. You have your. Your acupressure mat. You have your sleep stream app. Are you doing any type of meditation or anything like that, or breath work before bed?

Yeah, yeah, it's. I might use the moment and just, you know, deep breathing exercises. We have a lot of those different methods covered in. In the biochar sandbox. So there's like 4, 4, 7, 8 breeding or box breeding or just, you know, just deep diaphragmatic breeding. And that just comes from natural because I've been, like, playing on with different breeding techniques for about 15 years or so. It's. It's. So. It just comes so natural, so I don't usually even think about it. So it's.

It.

What. What comes first and.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah. I. I like Sadhguru meditations in. In YouTube. So it's.

Health Medit. Sadhguru. Yeah. Yes. This health meditation, that's. It's. It's just. It's. It's really good. And Timo actually introduced me his meditations, and I'll be using this, you know, every now and then, and it's sad Guru health meditation.

Okay, can. Can I find that on YouTube?

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah.

All right.

It's on Spotify. Yeah, you can find also on Spotify, some of his tracks. And he's this Indian guru who wrote the book Inner Engineering, which is basically biohacking. Like, how do you change yourself? And it's pretty cool in, in terms of my own travel schedule, what I do in the evening, as a kind of deviation what just was described here, I like to carry a mobility wad with me. So I roll on that thing for my spine. I carry some black tape and I tape any leads that might be in a hotel room. I also use noise canceling headphones and do some breathing techniques with Brain fm. While using that, I might have mobile target, near infrared or red light device with me. YOEL produces one. I have a portable one also from a different manufacturer. I also use blue light blocking, which is kind of already pretty common. And I also roll a towel inside my pillow to make it much better not to push any of the large arteries that go into my brain, which many of the typical pillows do. But I kind of roll a towel inside the towel so that it rests on my temple. And I've noticed that once my neck is not pressured by one of these things, I don't have morning headaches or any of that stuff from sleeping in hotel rooms.

That's interesting because I interviewed a chiropractic doc from Boston about this pillow called the Neck Nest, which essentially allows you to sleep on your back. And what I'll do when I'm in a hotel room is I'll take the. If there's a down pillow, I'll take that. And if there's not a down pillow, I'll usually call the front desk and see if I can get one. But I actually wrap that underneath my neck so I can be in this same back sleeping position. But you're taking a towel and you're putting it in the pillow and you're putting it on top of yourself.

I put the role of a towel inside the pillow cover on one end, and then I use the pillow to optimize my head position. And yeah, that's one of the things that I do. And when it comes to air in halter rooms, it's often quite dry because of very strong air conditioning. And I carry a boneco air humidifier. B o N e C O It's a really small device and you can screw in any bottle, like a water bottle on it. And once you remove the blue light, there's LED on it. It's pretty useful in a hotel room to increase the humidity and reduce the pressure on your mucous membranes or the dry air. And yeah, when I. When I walk around the city, I also like to hack my air. I have an anum a I r a n u m dot com. It's a Swedish, I think Swedish company that produces this.

Filtered.

Basically nose mask. And that's pretty useful in polluted cities like, let's say, Hong Kong. And there's a new company called.

O2, O2CO. And they're producing this pretty cool futuristic device that is the top of the, you know, the game when it comes to filtering air and also make it enjoyable. And you also look like a freaking cyborg for. From some kind of sci fi movie.

You are a cyborg.

It has a LED on it and the LEDs tell you if, if it's running out of, of power, which is also needed.

And so this, this would be acting almost like an air filter for your face if you were traveling to a polluted area, like, I don't know, like Banglade or Bangkok or something like that.

Yeah, I would also use something like that on an airplane just to reduce, you know, breathing in any of the potential exhaust fumes which are notoriously circulating in cabin air. And it also increases a little bit of the humidity of the air that you're breathing because once you are in high altitude, it tends to, you tend to lose water much more quickly. So that's one way and also to filter out any of the, the germs. So this O2, O2 device actually can filter out viruses and bacteria and a bunch of other things.

Seems useful just to even have tucked away from the zombie apocalypse.

Okay, so 0202CO. I'll link to that one in the show notes. Okay, cool. What else are you doing that's interesting, Timu?

Well.

In the end, it's all about minimalism and traveling light, not having a lot of stuff with you because I think that stuff owns you. So once you get something, you start organizing and you start thinking about it and you start maintaining it and all that. So with all this biohacking gear, very easily, you know, ramp up a lot of stuff. And it's when you're traveling, you don't want to think too much. So I want to avoid having anything, you know, that I'm not really gonna need with me. And I want to travel light. And once I'm at the office, I let it loose and there is a bunch of stuff here.

It's spreading all over.

What are some of the interesting things you guys have? Actually, what I know you guys have that I would love to hear a little bit about because I want to make sure we have a chance to squeeze in. What I alluded to in the introduction are some stacks like things you can stack together for immunity or for A workout or for recovery. If you could kind of of fill people in on some of your favorite stacks, I think that would be a cool place to go before we, we give people some, some discount codes and all sorts of cool stuff for your summits and for the book.

So I mean, if you do all the routines that Ollie is doing, you're probably preparing yourself for your morning and evening all day long. So you want to stack things and all these buy hacks together and there are synergistic effects of doing multiple buy hacks at the once. So to give you a few ideas, if we take some of those recovery things in terms of mental performance, like meditation, breathing techniques and red light and spike mats and neurosonic and BEMER and PMF and all that together, you can actually combine all of those. So you can have a neurosonic divan or a bed, and so you can have one of those pulse electromagnetic field therapy devices on it. You put a spike mat on top of that, then you lie down and you bring down a full stack infrared panel on top of you. You close your eyes, you put noise canceling headphones on, you listen to some Brain FM meditation tracks while you are diffusing, some lavender that relaxes your nervous system. And you can do also some supplements like fermented Reishi. And yeah, in the end you can just fall asleep and have a power.

So if I have like a pulsed electromagnetic field table or somebody has like a Beamer mat or any other type of PEMF device, what they could do is they could lay on that, but put one of these acupressure mats on top of it and then turn on like some infrared lights that you'd have shining on your body while you're laying on that acupressure mat on top of the pms. Then you put in your noise canceling headphones with some type of like a meditation track or like a binaural beats track. You take something relaxing like Rishi, and then you, you diffuse some essential oil in there and that's like the ultimate power nap.

I dig it. Wow, that's pretty cool. Yeah.

Yeah, that's great. What we have for our workers.

We have actually, we, we have actually our workers doing this in our office. So if they feel like, okay, I'm mentally tired. So, okay, take this protocol. It takes about like 20 minutes and you're like newborn, you're totally good to go for another eight hours if you want. So it's a diminishing time for recovery.

Looking at some other things that we have at the office, like in our meeting room, we actually have an infrared sauna as one of the seats you can be in. So you can sit in an infrared sauna while you're, you know, taking part in a meeting. So, so, and you can combine that with red light therapy and all that. If you want to do like a businessman's workout, you can go on a vibration plate, which we also have in our meeting room. You can stack on that some electrical muscle stimulation devices that are like a complex that is activating once your muscle is contracted and you do some kind of variable resistance training exercise, use rubber bands or an X tree bar that is extremely effective. Combined with some kind of way to limit your breeding to simulate elevation training. So like an elevation training mask.

Hypoxic training.

Hypoxic training, yeah. And then you throw in a stack of different supplements that expand your micro veins and increase circulation blood flow, like maybe some theopromine, caffeine, cordyceps or beetroot juice. And yeah, then.

What you want to do is just, you know, do that a few minutes, feel like dying. But you can do this with your suit on. You don't need to go to the gym, undress, you know, know, change clothes.

Yeah, I like that. So, so if an executive has like in their office a vibration platform they could stand on and then you could hook electrical muscle stimulation up to say your, your upper or your lower body, take some heavy resistance bands like the X3 bar or something like that and do like the X3 bar 10 minute workout on a vibration plate. Well, and don't laugh people, because I know this sounds silly, but, but I mean, we're talking about time hacking and getting a lot into your body all at once. I do like this idea. I consider this to be time management. You're wearing a training mask, like an elevation training mask, but then also you've got some kind of vasodilators in your system like beet juice or coffee or cordyceps or something like that.

Yeah, we also produced our own chocolate. So our co author, Jako Halametta is the chocolate alchemist pretty much. And he designed the Biohackers chocolate that has beetroot.

Juice powder and cordyceps and really high quality chocolate in it. We have another one which is for work that also has the chocolate extract and some lion's mane in it.

Bilberry.

Yeah. If you order the Bakker's handbook, you can, you know, bundle it up with one of the most amazing.

Well, that code that works for a bunch of stuff on Your website. I think you guys have a good code Ben saves on stuff on your website. Can they use that on the chocolate here?

If you use the code Ben, you get 10% discount on the book and everything else in your cart. And I mean that chocolate is a functional chocolate. So it's designed to bring all those cool supplements, nutrients into your body. I think people are popping too many pills nowadays and drinking too much coffee. So I think chocolate is the next phase for combining as a carrier, as a taxi driver, you know, all these cool, all these really amazing compounds into your body.

It's not some, some hormetic amounts of like coryceps. It's. It's like 3 grams of cordyceps and 7 grams of maca and really good amounts of beetroot. So it's, it's actually. There is some effects there and yeah.

And also the work chocolate as bilberry actually extract. So blueberries are the woozy version of bilberry. Bilberry is the original badass that grows in a Finnish forest and it has exponentially more of the polyphenols that are great for your eyes and recovery from the work that you do. So there is at least a handful, large handful of equal amount in one bar of those chocolates that we produced.

Now how about in the time that we have left self quantification. Is there anything that you guys are doing as you would consider to be almost like a self quantification stack if you were going to measure a whole bunch of stuff on a weekly basis or something just as like a check in for your whole body that you could do without needing to say like go to the, go to the doctor's office for a checkup.

Yeah. So I think Ollie can jump into this. We realized that aura is amazing for tracking your nighttime recovery, but daytime recovery for that. I mean the new moment functionality is awesome. But there is other things that you may want to do during the day and we discovered another wearable which is cool.

Yeah. So I have two devices I use day in, day out and of course O ring has been. I've been using it two years. It's really stable. I like the trend that it gives me and I like the sleep tracking, also the HRV tracking and, and all these parameters it has. But in the daytime it's, it's not really that useful. And the moment it's just for it.

Does, doesn't give you real time HRV data while you are, while you're just doing whatever during the day.

Yeah. And I, I like to have like the long term data. So I use Garmin's Vivo Move hr. So that's giving. It has the first beat algorithm on the HRV variation and it actually shows me how much recovery I get during the day, how stressful the day has been, what my stress levels have been, and it gives recommendation for the recovery. So I really love that. And those two devices are my go to.

It's also a pretty cool watch because it doesn't look like a wearable you, you don't look like a freak on it. So you look like a businessman having one of these watches and no one knows that it's actually super intelligent like having an Oura ring and a watch like The Garmin viomo.hr Nice thing about the device and the algorithm also is that you get the breakdown between sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous system activation. And I noticed that when I moved to nature last year I was still working as much as I did previous, but going to sauna in the evening, going to ice swimming and nature walks, I noticed that my stress level dropped like 20 to 30% on average, even though I was working a lot and I was not doing a lot of other biohacks. So when in a city environment, you want to load yourself up with a bunch of different biohacks, but once in nature you don't really need any of that stuff. And that's how I discovered that with my Vivo Move hr what I really would love to touch, if we have time for, is.

How to really hack your sauna experience and infrared sauna.

Yeah, yeah, I would if we get a chance. But first, just to clarify, so you've got Vivo Move HR by Garmin and is that tracking your actual real time HRV during the day?

Yeah, it has the First Beats algorithm. So any of those who have done the first beat analysis, you don't get this, this numerical value. You just get this, you get this graph and it's actually showing if you have the parasympathetic mode or sympathetic mode. And, and what's the grade of the sympathetic or parasympathetic activation? Okay, so it's not for like a quantification, it more like shows you the real time process that's going on with your nervous system. Okay, yeah, yeah. Other things.

What you have been doing like for, for a while now is the continuous blood sugar monitoring. So I had this two, two week period of, of the Freestyle Libre and I tried like different kind of things that's, that's really have an effect on my, my blood glucose and there are Some pretty interesting things. I think I. I sent you some data as well. So the biggest drop I got was from Run Tea Gardens. Longevity tea. Have you heard of that?

Yeah, I've had the longevity tea before.

Yeah. So. So it dropped, like my blood sugar from 5 to 3.2.

So that, that's. That's a pretty extensive drop. So it has some serious effects. But I also like the general of formals, glucose optimizer, berberine, cinnamon, and also the temu mentioned, the agarigous plase, the hime machitake mushroom and all things like that. And if you want to know what's really elevating your blood sugar, for me, it was actually having a heavy sauna session combined with some cold water exposure and the heavy sauna. I mean, I. We went to sauna like, I don't know, an hour straight.

I, I don't. I don't think it's the cold that's elevating your blood sugar because I've done a lot of tests with my dexcom. The sauna.

No, it's. It's the heat.

Yeah, the heat elevates blood glucose dramatically. The cold. Yeah, I've brought my blood glucose down into the 40s with a decent cold session, so I'm pretty sure the cold brings you back down and you get a transient rise from the heat. But, but, you know, same thing with coffee. It's such a transient rise of your own glycogen that stays precise, present in the bloodstream for such a short period of time. The, the pros outweigh the cons. A lot of people think anything that spikes your blood glucose should be avoided, but, you know, if that were the case, you. You wouldn't want to ever be having sex, for example. I mean, like, there are certain things that naturally needs a glycogen release.

Yeah.

So. Now one. One thing regarding self quantification is you told me that. That you were. You were looking into something that could actually analyze inflammation in real time, which I love, because the two things I track to really keep my finger on the pulse of my longevity are a blood glucose. And I use a continuous blood glucose monitor called the Dexcom G6 for that. But I haven't found a good way, aside from just like a quarterly blood test or whatever, to monitor inflammation regularly. Now, there's some device that you found that might be able to do that, if I'm not mistaken. Am I remembering properly?

Yeah, there is actually a device on the market which is quite small and portable for sampling your highly sensitive C reactive Protein and homocysteine values and other biomarkers in real time. I personally I've used like this finger brick test for checking out crp but it's not very useful for taking low level inflammation. It's great for looking if you, you got a food poisoning or a viral infection going on or something like this. But it's not really helpful for low level inflammation. So there's a device called Uralizer Smart and Uralizer Smart is pretty expensive, like €4,000 and maybe like four and a half thousand US dollars.

But it's kind of getting small.

This and accessible this ability to do things that you formerly went for a lab for. And if you are interested in these things on a routine basis, I think in a couple of years time because of exponential technologies and the reduction of size and cost and improvement in analytics and all of that, we will get into a place where you can pretty much have something that's hooked up with your mobile device to track your inflammation in real time. But we're not yet there. So you're kind of, you have to look at your pulse oximeter, you have to look at your blood pressure, you can look at your maybe even morning saliva cortisol, all of those maybe urine test strips to look at what you're excreting. But in the end we will have real time information from the human body. And as we, we move in terms of healthcare from snapshots, which is periodic testing, to real time information, that's when we. You can apply algorithms to predict where this is going and you can follow the trend more closely. Because what I figured out of doing blood work for seven years on a regular basis was basically that it's not a single variable, but it's the trend, it's the change that is happening. And the way how you link that to the data that's coming from your OURA ring or your smartwatch or your regular sampling of your blood from your fingertip or maybe something that's under your skin in the future, that's kind of where we are getting into or information even from your environment, like air quality, levels of pollution, all that our environment is influencing you and your blood sugar values and all of that. So once we combine lifestyle factors with hard data from your bloodstream.

Interesting.

Wow.

Well, there was one thing before we close out here and I talk a little bit about how people can get into the Biohacker Summit, get access to some of the videos and get this wonderful new book you mentioned something about the sauna Temu, something you wanted to mention about the sauna.

Yeah. So when it comes to sauna, I mean people tend to mix up infrared sauna with the dry Finnish traditional sauna. I don't think wood warm sauna. Yeah, a wood warm.

You would want to. A woodworm. Sorry to interrupt. There's difference between woodworm sauna and electric sauna. So the wood warm sauna creates negative ions and that's really helpful for the recovery. And the electrokyic sauna, it's a positive ions and you can actually feel it in the difference. But go ahead.

And you also have higher humidity in a wood heated sauna compared to an electric grill. So if you have a kind of a traditional Finnish sauna, you want to get a wood heated one for sure. Or even a smoke sauna which we have around here. The other thing is an infrared sauna is not really a sauna. According to International Sauna Federation. You can't even use the term sauna for an infrared room or I don't know, like box that you get into. So I don't like to call infrared sauna sauna, but it's infrared room. But anyway, so you combine these two. So you take a dry sauna and you put some infrared panels in there. That's one way to get both benefits of detoxification and then the application of heat shock proteins on a cellular level for improving.

Basically recycling all the cellular waste and and activating the pathways related to longevity like Foxo 3 and making you more resilient human being. Now many people combine niacin with an infrared sauna because niacin has this effect called niacin flush which causes vasodilation and the redness of the skin. And that can help you drive more of those toxins and heavy metals out of your body because of the rebound lipolysis that is happening. So basically what happens is that you get a massive fat cell release of trisulc rides into the bloodstream with niacin and fat is which stores heavy metals. Now when you combine that with an infrared sauna, you sweat that stuff out and you can then actually make a massive stack with niacin in also by combining with lion's mane and a bunch of medicinal herbs and adaptogens and mushrooms to drive several medicinal compounds down deep into your nervous system. Some of those things that I would stack with niacin and infrared sauna are a bunch of different medicinal mushrooms that we already mentioned here with antibacterial, antifungal, anti cancer, anti inflammatory inflammatory properties like cordyceps and reishi and chaga etc. Those are great for basically.

Limiting also or killing parasites such as nematodes and protozoa and pathogenic bacteria including Borrelia species. So if you're suffering from Lyme's disease, some of these medicine mushrooms can be beneficial aid and supporting you. Now what I would also throw in are other plant sources for neurogenerative properties such as Bacopa monieri or Gotu kola or Ginkgo biloba that have all shown to be beneficial for neurogenesis. Now what else should I throw in is a bunch of anti inflammatory spices like maybe cinnamon and vanilla and things with anti inflammatory polyphenols. Ginger, holy basil, oregano, rosemary. So I would make like a tea that I drink and turmeric and all that, a tea before I go to a sauna which can kind of preheat.

The body too, which is nice.

Absolutely. And then afterwards, immediately you go for a ice bath.

Immediately, immediately you go there immediately.

Right.

And you do, you know, relaxation. Once you feel that your heart rate goes up trend immensely, that's when you feel that all those helpful healthy longevity related pathways are opening up. And once you feel sweating all that crap out, then you jump into an ice bath. And I don't think cryotherapy in terms of these cryo chambers is very effective. I think based on the research and all that, I would actually just dip myself into ice cold water with, with a bunch of ice and do some breathing exercises in there to relax muscles. And, and, and after three, five minutes I would go back to the sauna, I would just repeat this for an hour or so and there you have it. That's the optimal immunity protocol that will improve neurogenesis, will increase the extraction of toxic compounds from your body and your, and enforce and fortify your immune system with all those medicinal herbs that you just stacked into your system and help the sauna and the cold dive deeper into your body.

I love it. I love it.

Wow.

I have taken so many freaking notes for today's show. A ton.

I can hear your penis.

Yeah. So of course the book itself is jam packed with a whole bunch more. I mean a lot of this stuff isn't in the book. A lot of this stuff and variants of it can be found in the book. Along with wonderful recipes for biohacked ice creams and coffees and workout equipment and sleep tactics. It's a real gem of a book. So what I'll do is since time is tight here and I know we've been going for a while I'll just put all the discount links for the book. I'll also put all the discount links for any of your guys summits and also discount links for any of the live stream playbacks of your summits. Because you guys have recorded dozens of talks from your summits and I'm just going to put that all in the show notes over@BenGreenfieldFitness.com BiohackingPodcast and for those of you who are concerned that this book might only be available in Finland or that shipping might be excessive from Europe, Temu and Ollie are in the process also of making this completely available in America for, for a very good price. And I'll put all the links and the details for that in the show notes as well.

You can, you can basically pre order, you can pre order the US copy with free shipping and a discount from Ben from those links over there. And when it comes to Biker Summit, this year we have a five year anniversary in Helsinki, Finland. We have organized around eight summits and you can get the recording package also from the links and Ben is featured. Never before heard talks online are in that package and you can, you can get a massive discount on the recording package. It's huge, huge volume and library of some of the top biohacking tactics and techniques that have been featured here in Europe. Never heard in US really. And so you want to check that definitely out. And yeah, if you want to come over, hang around, discover some of the northern biohacking techniques and tactics here in Europe, you know you're most welcome to biker some comments.

Yeah, they're pretty fantastic. They're, they're amazing events and, and I love to attend them when I can get out of the country. Get a tiny little. Spokane, Washington. All right guys, well this has been wonderful and for those of you listening, all of the links are over@BenGreenfieldFitness.com Biohacking Podcast. I hope you've learned a little bit. Temu and Ollie. Thank you guys, guys so much. I just love your guys passion for this and all the cool things I learn from you every single time we talk.

Absolutely. And we, we will definitely put together some of those stacks into an article that you can publish in the future to your audience as well. So if, if you were making notes on how to combine different biohacks, we give some of our proven and tested combinations.

Cool.

Yeah, thanks. Thanks Ben. We love you man.

Cool.

All right guys. Well thank you so much folks. I'm Ben Greenfield along with Temu and Ollie, the crazy Finnish biohackers signing out from BenGreenfieldFitness.com have an amazing week.

Well, thanks for listening to today's show. You can grab all the show notes, the resources, pretty much everything that I mentioned over@BenGreenfieldFitness.com along with plenty of other goodies from me, including the highly helpful Ben Recommends page, which is a list of pretty much everything that I've ever recommended for hormones, sleep digestion, fat loss, performance, and plenty more. Please also know that all the links, all the promo codes that I mentioned during this and every episode help to make this podcast happen and to generate income that enables me to keep bringing you this content every single week. So when you listen in, be sure to use the links in the show notes. Use the promo codes that I generate because that helps to float this thing and keep it coming to you each and every week.