039: Permission to Glow with Kristoffer (KC) Carter

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This is your time. How can we earn twice as much in half the time with joy and ease while serving the highest good? That is our guiding question here at the Freetime Cafe, your home for heart based business. I'm your host, Jenny Blake. Join me for conversations with authors, friends and fellow business owners as we explore ways to free your mind, time and team to do your best work. Now onto today's show.

Hello. Hello everybody. Welcome back. I am so delighted to be here today with my friend Christopher Casey Carter. He is the founder of this Epic Life, a website devoted to conscious leadership. He has created a daily, helped thousands of people create a daily meditation practice. He's a creator of the four Permissions Framework. And today we are celebrating the launch of his new book, Permission to A Spiritual Guide to Epic Leadership. Casey, welcome to the show.

Oh, it's so good to be with you again, Jenny. Looking forward to this.

It's a dream. You and I had such a fun chat that aired on Pivot. I'll put it in the show notes. This is your inaugural chat here on Free Time and I want to start by asking you tell us about your love of mixtapes and how they can be a metaphor for our life.

Oh my God. Thank you for this question. Well, there's a reference in my book about, I think I was talking about the symbology of a pause button and I've always used the pause button to teach meditation. You know, the pause is our conscious exit from the crazy train of all the noise around us. And when I got to kind of explore that in the book, one of my favorite films, high Fidelity came to mind. And High Fidelity, the main character is played by John Cusack. And he, and it's a great book by Nick Hornby for starters, but the movie's just hilarious. Like it's Jack Black at his best, John Cusack at his best. But he talks about the subtle art of making a mixtape for somebody. And it's, and then I started thinking it's not like dragging tracks into a playlist like some pampered savage. It's like, really?

That made Me laugh. So.

Oh, yeah, it's like. Because that's what that. That's what my teenagers and my kids do, you know, like, oh, I made you a playlist. It's like, well, will anybody actually listen to that? Or the whole songs? You know? But the intention of, you know, hitting record on one tape deck while you're pausing and unpausing the other tape deck to layer on those tracks, I mean, it's a highly intentional. Because you're thinking about how that art segues into the next piece of art, what the lyrics say to that person, what the combination of songs say to that person. So, yeah, I haven't made a mixtape in a little while. I'd have to dig out my tape decks. But I could honestly say I have saved every mixtape from my entire life. It's in one box in my basement.

And I remember there's also patience involved. I remember waiting for just the right song to come on the radio so I could hit record. And in fact, my one time that I got on the radio, I called in and asked them to play Garth Brooks Thunder Rolls. And they played it. They played me asking for it. And I remember like racing to the tape deck and hitting record and. Oh, so this, like capturing the favorite songs and it is such a memory imprint, isn't it? When you listen to a mixtape, it just takes you right back.

Oh, it does. I mean, even looking at them, like there's ones when. When my life, when my wife and I, We've been married 22 years now, but when we were falling in love, it was kind of the tail end of the mixtape era and we were still rocking that old school thing. So I have mixtapes with her handwriting on them and just the names of the tapes that she gave them brings me so much emotion. And so, you know, and I could kind of. And I wore out listening to those when I was living separately from her on a different coast. And I could look at those words that she wrote on the label and remember the track listing, the songs riding up and down Highway 1 on the coast. I mean, it just all comes back from that mixtape.

Wow. Is there one song that jumps out?

Oh, gosh. I mean, it's a lot of like younger 20s melodrama, I'm sure. But there's this band from Cincinnati, Ohio, called Over the Rhine, and they're kind of like an indie band. They're not very well known, but there's this song, the World Can Wait, and it's just such a stunning piece of art. But to hear that in A collection of other songs about love and longing and all the stuff we were going through at those moments. That's the song that sticks out to me.

And I know you have some songs that go with this book, and you have a very musical family. It sounds like in Carter Force Five.

Carter Force Five is musically inclined. I made sure of that. Jenny Blake.

Yeah. So you always have a campfire group in tow ready to listen to you sing and play.

Well, it's been my. I mean, I remember from our last conversation, your dad's an author and he's published some pretty seminal work, you know, so it's gotta be his total joy to see his daughter doing the same thing and following her path that way. And that's what I've been trying to approximate in my own house. My teenage daughter, Elliot, she just turned 17. She's. It's safe to say she is a rock star. Her band just graduated to main stages at festivals here in Ohio. They're opening a stage for Ke$ha next weekend. Yeah, these kids are 14 to 18 doing their damn thing. And, you know, we work on songs together. I've coached the band. I call them my favorite coaching client. The name of the band is Detention. But these kids are just so coachable and so open, and my daughter's, like, fierce little female lead singer who's.

Wow.

Yeah, so. But. But it was always my dream to. Yeah, to have, like, a family funk band. And I. I still have some time to get the other kids up to speed, but, like, I. I want a family funk band is what I want.

I mean, I can. I can really see it now. And if they have half the charisma that you do, like, I. As you're saying this, I'm picturing you at Camp glp, Jonathan and Stephanie's wonderful summer production that is no longer. Am I wrong? Didn't you wear a uniform onesie? One of the. I mean, sorry. A unicorn onesie on one of the days.

Yeah, it was my uniform and it was a unicorn onesie. It was unicorn. I still wear these pants. They're yoga pants given to me by one of the yoga instructors there. But, yeah, they have unicorn pegasuses on them. And, you know, camp was like, this incredible gift of a job that allowed me to fully express what I call in the book, like, permission to glow in the dark. It was just this unapologetic. These are all the things I know how to do. Teach meditation, be a musician, be an emcee, try to wrangle people, you know, I'm sure. And People have told me I terrified a lot of people too, don't get me wrong. Like, they saw me coming in the parking lot and they're like, maybe I'll just go back to my car.

I just love that. I don't think any of us can picture JF doing that role, you know, so he kind of outsourced it to you and Amelia in the best possible way. Like, he gets to kind of be on this side a little more quiet. He's so profound when he is on stage telling stories and then there's you in your unicorn uniform just rocking it. And I was truly blown away. You even have a section in the book on unicorn symbology. And why, why do you think it is that we are so obsessed with unicorns as adults?

Yeah, that's the one section of the book that on all these passes we were talking just before it rolled, like, you have to do all these passes with your editors and publisher to just, you know, kind of lock the manuscript. And every time I get to that part of the unicorn symbology, it is the part of the book that makes me weep. And the part that makes me weep is that there's something incredibly alluring about like an impossibly exotic beast. And I think that's what the draw to the unicorn is. And unicorns have kind of jumped the shark in our pop culture. You know, there's like this horrific Starbucks drink with all these purple pink, foamy chemicals and shit. It's so nasty and like. And you know, marketers are like, put a unicorn on anything and people will think it's fun or cute or little girls will like it or whatever. But I've met so many men in my coaching practice, that vibe with the unicorn energy, and there's something kind of divine feminine about it. There's something, you know, the symbology I explain is that it connects us to our intuition that when we're able to listen to our feelings and then guide ourselves by them, we tap into something deeper. And I think that's the part that kind of gets me emotional in that symbology piece, is that when you're, you know, in yoga we call it the Kutastha shaitanya, that third eye or the seat of concentration between the eyebrows. And that's where I picture the unicorn horn emanating from. It's like this 45 degree angle that points onward, upward, outward. It's like geometric expansion. And when you're able to quiet your mind and focus there and have your emotions direct you there, something incredibly powerful happens, you know, like this is, you know, what we talked about with you. You know, just listening to that intuition of, oh, here's this idea of free time. And, like, look what's happening in your life as a result by following that intuition.

That is so fascinating. I've never made that connection of the unicorn horn being at our third eye and being a projection of that third eye. Wow, that's so powerful.

And this is the crazy part of my book journey was that all this symbology started showing up. You know, I had the pause button from Permission to Chill. The first meditation program I ever launched was called the Pause. Permission to Glow in the Dark was obvious that it would be a lightning bolt. But the unicorn was always such a huge part of my family, like the. My grandfather founded the Long Island Nautical Heritage Society. And this boat. This is kind of fascinating. The boat that he commissioned to kind of start this thing was this epic pirate ship. I mean, and it was called the Brig Unicorn. So when I was, like, three years old, my grandfather, who's, like this epic individual, he had me hold this massive pirate ship, wheel and steer this unicorn in Long Island Sound. And what's crazy about this, I researched that book. That book became Jack's or. I'm sorry, I researched that ship. That ship became Jack Sparrow's ship in Pirates of the Caribbean, and it mysteriously sunk after shooting three films. Like, this ship had this incredible impact on modern pop culture through those films. And, yeah, my grandfather rented it in, like, the 70s. It's just a trip, you know?

But that is unbelievable.

Yes. Like, I wanted to include that. Like, I knew no matter what, I had to make the unicorn fit in the framework. But not until did I start, you know, kind of meditating and writing on it did I understand how it connected to feel the feels and that it was connected to that seat of concentration. And all these things get unlocked when you are willing to sit down and write something.

Yes, that's so true. It's like you start writing and then the faucet opens a little wider and a little wider. It's like you get rewarded for sitting down.

Oh, totally. And there's like, half the time you're thinking, well, I'm totally insane. Nobody's gonna get this. But then finally, after many edits and many testing of it, you're like, oh, yeah, I guess this is how it works, you know?

And it is refreshing to read a book about leadership and land on unicorn symbology. Like, thank goodness for you. Oh, my God. For this book. And I do think that there's this mystical quality And a childlike Jo. And even the translucent colors, there's just something that breaks the pattern. And even the boat that you described, your grandfather's boat. First of all, I can't believe unicorn's in the name.

I know.

But it was also part of this epic adventure, this swashbuckling set of movies.

Oh, my God.

This evocative creative enterprise.

Yeah. I mean.

The purpose of the book for leadership, and this is something I really struggle with in my work, is to take a spiritual conversation into corporate environments. Like, not everybody's open to that, you know, So I don't even. This will be kind of the first time a lot of my clients really see and understand this language that I've been using, kind of behind the scenes with them. But then I have other clients who are like, Gen Y millennial leaders. And one of my guys I've worked with, Benji, I've worked with him for about three years. Every Friday, he said he gave me the best compliment on coaching. He's like, dude, it's like you give me keytar lessons every Friday. And a keytar is this, like, 1980s keyboard that's kind of like a guitar. It's usually red. It's like a dude standing out on the edge of the st with a keyboard, like, around his waist. And I was like, I want the book to feel like that Gen X quality or like that 1980s aesthetic of some pop culture. A lot of sugar to help the medicine go down. Because, let's face it, leadership and personal transformation are extremely hard. Like, it's heavy work. It's shadow work. And I just wanted it to feel a little bit more light and fun because most days it's anything but.

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Yeah.

I mean, you say in the book, you ask, what is one quality you bring into any space? And I think that is such a powerful question.

It is. Yeah. That's taken from the amazing people at Accomplishment Coaching that helped train me. They're training my wife right now. Yeah. That Essence Conversation. What shows up when I do? What do I bring into the space? And we think we know what that is, but we need people around us to really reflect back to us what that is and what's come up for me so many times, like, that you pointed to. That's actually kind of confronting for me, is people would say, divinity. You bring divinity. And so, like, my survival mechanism always pipes in, is like, who's this fool from the suburbs of Ohio that thinks he's bringing divinity into a. But the fact is, when I am able to just kind of be in that space with the work or the teachings or whatever it is I'm trying to impart, that other voice just kind of shuts the hell up. And then I realized, like, oh, yeah, it is kind of my interpretation of what it means to access spirit. And that's yoga, you know, that's union with spirit. And. Yeah. So I think, like, my crazy voice is, like, for better or for worse. It's like, okay, you're gonna get a lot of weird humor or pop culture with it.

See, this is what's so interesting. You share the phrase, and I've said it before, too, on this podcast of you can't read the label from inside the jar.

Yeah, exactly.

I wonder, what did you think your quality was? Like, when I enter a room, the one thing I bring is, did you think it was something else? And then what you consistently heard from others is this quality of divinity.

Yeah, well, I wanted to think it was, like, monster pecs and, like, you know, incredibly firm glutes. But no, it was anything but.

I mean, radiant charm.

Radiant charm. Yeah. I honestly thought it was levity and humor or whatever. And my teenage daughters keep me in my place with, like, dad, you're all dad jokes. You're nowhere near as funny as you think you are. And the thing that came back consistently was just, like, this spiritual quality of putting people at ease. And one of the things that I really kind of rely on from that essence exercise that my coach gave me was the word dynamism that I'm willing to modulate between these different things. And I use humor as a pattern interrupt for people, or I'll use different.

Tools to kind of get people's attention in a different way, because most of us want to stay firmly lodged in what's comfortable for us. And my job as a coach, which can be very uncomfortable for me or for anybody, is to dislodge that comfort zone. And so I use the humor for it. But, yeah, it's not a primary trait at all. It's just, you know, something in the toolbox.

Yeah, I love. And I love how you distinguish, too. You described what you were doing at Camp GLP as glowing in the dark, but you also. You had a friend say, it's. There's also glowing in the light. And I actually feel like in those moments, you're glowing in the light, which. I don't know if you experience this in your own life or with your clients, but when you mentioned Gay Hendrix and the upper limit problem. But sometimes it's even scarier to glow in the light or to reach for or, I don't know, just to. I don't think people talk about very much that success can be scary or we can be scared of actually getting the things that we say we want.

Oh, God. I thought about you. First of all, as I was drafting so much of that Glow in the Dark, I was actually a third or fourth draft. I started adding all of this Gay Hendrix, the Big Leap stuff. And I remember you and I nerding out over that book. I know it's one of your favorite books, too. And when I first drafted the Glow in the Dark chapter, my editor basically said, we're not there yet. Like, you haven't shown me what the darkness is. And I realized, like, well, you know, glowing in the dark as it relates to, you know, something like camp. I was terrified before I went out on stage, like, showing up in my, you know, pajamas or whatever. Whatever I was in to give the effect. I would take, you know, a lot of social risk to do that. And I was mortified. But I knew because I was mortified that I had to do it. And that was just the fun part. Glowing in the light to distinguish it is standing in the full power of others because you've done the work of standing in your own full power so you are no longer threatened by the competition or the scarcity or what has this person done? Or what will they take from me? You're not thinking about these who's better or Any of that. You're standing shoulder to shoulder. And I think that that's hugely confronting. I mean, obviously, because we probably would be way further down that road of collaboration as a species if we were able to stand, you know, kind of fully vulnerable in the full power of others without feeling threatened. Yeah. And I do think camp was that experience because everybody was so elevated and had permission to be themselves that you felt like you were truly part of some sort of utopian kind of vibe.

Yes. Yeah, that's true. And everyone who's attracted to the Fields are so heart centered and conscious, like spiritual conscious, friendly, giving, warms. You're right, it is this little utopian.

Well, the thing about Jonathan Field is like.

He is like a true visionary yogi. Wise, wise, calm, chill dude. And he's very funny and very irreverent and very, you know, trusting to empower somebody like me or Emilia Zheviatovskaya to represent that event. I mean, he wants people to have that heightened, joyful thing. And I think that all of those things is what makes his experiences so undeniably magical.

Yes. So you're coming out with your first book, Permission to glow. This is a very vulnerable process and we are recording this before the book is officially out.

Yeah.

What's this like for you, being at this cusp of such a vulnerable. I feel like book writing. You pour so much heart and energy and soul and spirit into it. Yeah. And of course it is a co creation with the universe, however you call it the divine. And it's so friggin vulnerable. Like you are about to release your best ideas for scrutiny basically, or for joy. But tell us how you're feeling in this moment.

Hold on, let me grab my barf bag. Yeah, I. Well, Susan Piver, who's published like nine books, I mean she's ended up on Oprah with some of her books. She's really done the publishing thing and she told me last week she's like having a new book come out is like walking around stark naked and asking people, so what do you think? You know, what do you think of my dad bod? What do you think of my.

It's like putting your mind out. Stark naked.

It is.

What do you think?

Yeah. And one of the things I talk about towards the end of the book is like this model of conscious competence that if we want to move into like being competent in something. In my case this is like eventually I want to be a competent author and I want that to be unconsciously competent. I just want it to be what I do. Right. But this first book is like crossing the desert of conscious incompetence. Like, where I know it's new, I know I've put a ton of work into it, and I also know very clearly how much I don't know. But, yeah, it comes up every single day. I mean, I go into, like, disaster mode, but then I come into unquestionable, knowing all of my power and being very grateful mode. So, yeah, it just shows up as me being increasingly erratic around my family sometimes. Just all this vulnerability. And I think it's that fear of what are people going to do when they see who I really am or the language I really use when I write. Yeah, it's vulnerable, but it's also exciting. Melissa Bernstein, I recently interviewed her. She's the founder of Melissa and Doug Toys. She's a really brilliant woman and she coins all these word mashups. And the one that she uses is nervited, like nervous and excited or exhilified, which is excited and exhilarating and terrifying. I mean, it's literally both of those things nerviting and exhilifying.

And it's almost like, of course they come together. They're two sides of the same coin. We wouldn't be so excited and fulfilled and energized if it wasn't also simultaneously so vulnerable and terrifying.

Yeah. Like, I'm just glad it's not a. I'm glad it's not a memoir so I don't have to, like, proactively apologize to, like, family members for how I remember.

I don't have the stomach for that. No.

Yeah, yeah, but. But I do. I do start anticipating, well, you know, what happens when I do butt up against. Butt heads with people who just don't want to be connected to or believe in spirit. And I'm fine with that. Like, I bump into those people all the time. But to do it publicly or in, you know, review forums or whatever, I don't know what that's going to be like until I. Until I'm there.

Yeah, well, one of my 1 stars on my first book, they said, if you've never thought about anything ever, this book is for you.

I'm sorry I typed that, Jenny, but I was just really feeling it at the time. No, I'm just kidding.

You were having a bad day.

I was just having a bad day.

Isn't it funny? It's like, don't you. I don't know if you have this, but I have, like, this one star reviewer committee that kind of sits next to Me while I'm writing. And they go, ooh, that sentence is going to be your one star right there. Or like, ooh, I'm going to use that one. And you know, it's not, it doesn't get in the way anymore. But I just go, okay, I have 350 pages, and in my case, 80,000 words. Which ones are they gonna pick apart and rip to shreds, if not the whole thing?

Oh, my gosh. Like, I have these Indian devotees of Yogananda. So I'm a devotee of Paramahansa Yogananda, and I've given a few public talks about Yogananda's work, and I'm really proud of those. I put a lot of work into them and I thought at the time, at least very good intention into representing the master work in an authentic way, in an unbiased way. But there's a group of devotees in India that will just comment anytime on YouTube. Like, anytime I, you know, if I refer to myself as a yogi, I thought that was somebody who practices yoga. I didn't call myself or intend to call myself like a highly enlightened person or anything like that, or a guru, totally. But people will project onto you. You know, like, the more you share your ideas, you become a screen for others to project their ideas onto you. And I think that that can be triggering with somebody, and I think it's probably a good thing. At the end of the day, if you're out in the world doing something that's triggering other people, it doesn't make it like, I want to be loved like anybody else. Like, it, it hurts for a minute, but at the same time, it's like, it's probably part of the process is to mix it up a little bit.

I've never heard it put that way, that the more public, the more ideas you put out, you become a screen for the projections. That is so powerful as a metaphor. It's like I just see it. It's almost like you become the walking screen they would roll down in a movie theater and more and more people see you to project their movies. That's a fascinating way to think about it.

Well, what's interesting, one of my teachers, Alice Bandy, who's an incredibly gifted intuitive and clairvoyant, I mean, she really saw past, present, future. She was the real deal. And she probably led like, like 40 or 50 retreats in her life. So that when we were partnering to lead my first retreat, I had her in to be a teacher, and she kind of gave Me, all these advanced lessons before I welcomed these people into my home. She's basically like, you love these people. They love you. That's why they're here. And we all want to find the flaws of all of our teachers. So just know that whatever they project onto you, it's not about you, and just remember that. And I remember trying to take that to heart because I've had people come in and out of my either teachings or coaching practice or whatever that at some point they may decide that I'm a threat or a mortal enemy or something. And that's, you know, at the end of the day, that's their thing to work out. I can try my best to love them on the way in and on the way out. But, yeah, that projection thing is real, and I try to notice it when I'm doing it to other people. You know, there's always people we envy or appreciate, and sometimes that line gets blurred. But yeah, that screen thing has come up a few different times.

Yeah, yeah. And that's so true. It's easy to forget in the moment when you feel so attacked or feel bad, like, oh, no, what did I do wrong? I always have that thought. Am I in trouble? What did I do wrong?

I did this.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Always like. And that's. That's. We talked about this in our previous podcast. I think we talked about codependent tendencies, but where it's like, let me do all the backflips to make sure everyone around me is happy and doing okay and to be constantly monitoring the room and. And then if anyone is the slightest upset, it's like, what did I do wrong? And just. Oh, it's hard.

It is. I mean, especially. Yeah. If you. I'm an enneagram7 and we're really well known for this. It's like over processing, overly concerned with what everybody's thinking at all times, whether it's about us or not. But even more so if it's about us. And it's exhausting. I mean, I'd rather just try to, you know, meet people where they are and let them be in their process. And if they want to be pissed at me or, you know, think I'm this or think I'm that, that's co. You know, it's. Sometimes it still really bugs the crap out of me, but. But other times it's like, okay, I have other things I have to be focused on. Right.

Moving on.

Yeah.

Well, speaking of which, let's move into a rapid fire round.

Yeah.

Just a couple minutes. First Question. You and Gayle have been married for 22 glorious years. What is one relationship lesson learned? I won't even call it a tip because everyone's different. But what is one word of wisdom you would give to listeners?

Be a warrior for your partner's growth.

I love that. What is a favorite business book that you've read recently?

Business book that I've read. Every book is a startup by Todd Satterston.

Oh, cool. And what's one of your favorite books of all time?

I always have to say Autobiography of a Yogi because it is my number. Every time you read it, it's a different book. So I'm talking about Autobiography of Yo gentlemen, the 15th reading. That's my favorite book.

Wow. Isn't it wild to reread a book that many times? And you have changed so much between every reading and then you pick up things you never even saw.

Oh, yeah. Things like things that made me. Things that made me laugh the first time, make me cry other times, and vice versa. It is just such a deep experience with that book. It's a trip.

Yes. And then it tracks. There are certain business books like that where I just couldn't have groked half the stuff the first time around without the experience of. And you're reminding me I need to reread Autobiography of a Yogi.

Oh, yeah.

Only one time in.

Yeah, I'll send you. They just released this class for the 75th to coincide with the 75th anniversary of the book. That is just the best hour of them. Setting the frame and the context, the cultural context in which it was written and what it's become over the decades, I think you'd really appreciate it and it would get you excited about a second read.

Send that to us. I'll put it in the show notes for this as well. For listeners who want that, as well as the font that generated the gorgeous ampersand in the italics of your book, you have two pieces of homework, Casey. Don't forget.

I'll dig it up.

I asked him before we hit record. I said, casey, what is this font that's the most beautiful ampersand. My heart leapt. Like, my heart started fluttering when I saw it. It's in the italics of the notes in the back of his book. And so that's his homework.

So this is one of the things in a microcosm of what I love about Jenny Blake so much is that I consider myself a big nerd about certain things. Like the band Rush, for instance. I'm a total nerd. Like my favorite Podcast is the Rush fan cast. But the. When you asked me about that ampersand, I had to go look it up and understand what you were even saying. And then I was like, oh, but I totally see why you're obsessed with it, so. Yeah.

Yeah. But it is exquisite.

Nerd. Must day. Jenny Blake. Nerd mustang.

Nerd mustang. Oh, my gosh. That's the best, best phrase. That's a Caseyism right there. Why isn't that in the book? You got to end the book with nerd mustang.

Nerd mustang.

Oh, my gosh. Okay, last question. If you could write a permission slip, which I know. Permission. You have the four permissions. It's like so perfectly parallel. You could give listeners a permission slip as they run their businesses. What would it be?

Permission to breathe. There's time.

Mm. So good. I love that. Thank you, Casey. This has been a real treat. I love this. Permission to breathe. I love your new book, listeners. If you haven't gotten your copy yet, it's called Permission to A Spiritual Guide to Epic Leadership. Casey, where else do you want to send people?

PermissionToGlowBook.com is probably the best place. We're putting together some ridiculous pre order packages with socks and posters and unicorn stickers and all sorts of fun on pop culture y crap. But this is what I love about our conversations, that we covered mixtapes and unicorns in the same conversation. I think our work is done here.

Absolutely. And ampersands. We're done. We're done. We're done. An autobiography of a yogi. We worked that in. I mean, done. Check, check, check.

Yeah. I want you to travel with me and just be the MC for my life. Jenny Blaze.

Can I. That's like something I love so much. Is not. I mean, I can't be at KC level of mc. I'm more like relaxed. But I would love to just interview you on all your stages. That's what I would do.

Let's do it. And I have this other weird vision of us going roller skating and eating nachos together.

Can we please? I love roller skating and rollerblading. Even though it's not very cool to say that, but I friggin love it.

All right, let's do it. We're gonna make it happen.

Yes. Let's eat nachos rollerblading down the west side Highway. Or we'll rollerblade down. Or roller skate all the way down. There's a Mexican restaurant in Battery Park City. You can sit outside. We'll have celebratory nachos all right.

I'm doing this on my book tour. I'm riding my motorcycle out there. We're doing this around September 25th. Going to do this.

Done. I'm there.

Yes.

Help me in.

Yes.

Amazing. Okay. Thank you so much. I hope this is the first of many more conversations for free time. Casey, you're the best. Thank you for being here and thanks everybody for listening.

Thanks so much, Jenny.

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