Anthony Valletta - Redefining what guest-first actually means in hospitality

We're back in the restaurant world today with Anthony Valletta. He's the CEO of Bar Taco, and of course he talked about what he does to keep it human in his leadership. We also talked about boxing and a lot of other interesting things. Can't wait to share him with you. So let's jump right into it with Anthony Valletta. Anthony, first of all, thanks so much for being with us today. Your story is a fascinating one, and we've been doing quite a bit of work in hospitality. And when your story came across my desk, I thought, wow, this is pretty cool. You reminded me a lot of somebody we just worked with, Hopdoddy, Jeff Chandler over at Hopdoddy.

I know Jeff well. Jeff's a great guy.

Yeah, yeah. So you guys seemed like kindred spirits, so we thought, let's hook up with you and see what you have to say about it. So I mean, I've got a question for you right out of the box, if you don't mind.

Yeah, please.

Yeah, well, you talked about building a high-performance culture. I think these are your words, without becoming a cold numbers-only leader, right? So where do you think most leaders are getting that wrong? I mean, and that's a struggle these days.

You know, it is. It's really tough. And it's funny, as I climb the ranks, and I was just actually with my YPO CEO group yesterday, and we were kind of like bantering back and forth talking about some of this, and You know, as you get to a certain level in an organization, sometimes you forget about not where you came from, but—

Yeah.

What it really takes to be at the ground level. And what it, in my business, what it really takes to run a restaurant day to day and the taxing things that go on it. And a lot of times when you get to a certain size, your assessment comes from a spreadsheet, it comes from P&L, it comes from a ranking system. And the thing, especially in my business, you know, numbers are the report card of what happened, but How you feel when you leave today is what happens really tomorrow. And I think it's really interesting when you find this balance between— I know the numbers tell this story, and I just shared this with the VP literally a couple days ago. I said, you should be looking at restaurants that on paper might not look perfect, but when you walk in that restaurant, all the fundamentals are there. They have a great team, the restaurant looks good, the music is good, the quality is right. They build these fundamentals that are working towards a growing sustainable business. But oftentimes businesses look on paper and say, look at this guy, look at all the money he's making, look at how great they're doing. And when you go in and realize that either the sustainability isn't there, or in the worst case in my business, the brand has lost some of that, you know, vibe, some of that character. And I see it far too often. And it's so, there's so many metrics in any business today, but really in the restaurant business that you can look at, there's labor, there's cost, there's profit, there's guest feedback. There's so many things. And I think we get in this analysis paralysis mode of let me just aggregate as much as I can together. It's going to tell me exactly how these teams are performing. And you lose touch to what matters most. It's the feel the guest gets when they walk in the door. And to me, we've tried to build a culture around, you know, there's high accountability of numbers. You're in a business, so you still need to drive revenue and make money, and that's never going to stop. But making sure it's done in the right fashion, that it's sustainable over time. Um, we hit 15 years this year, and I think there's a good reason that we've had an amazing trajectory, because we've always landed on that one principle of it's how the guest walks out and feels. It's the only thing that you need to worry about measuring, and there's really no good way to measure it.

So, you know, you're opening such a can of worms there though. It's, um, right, because that's the thing that so many people struggle with, is how do you actually measure these things, and how important are the measurements compared to the vibe you're getting from your people face-to-face? Because that's one of the big things we talk about all the time. You got to guide people face-to-face. You got to be willing to share your knowledge, your experience, your wisdom in person, not just through reports and metrics. And so many people now are turning right to automated training and online training and are removing themselves from that relationship. So how do you exactly know where are the numbers telling the truth and where are your people giving you more valuable intel? How do you manage that?

Yeah, no, it's a great question. I mean, it's a little bit of an art, right? It's not a science like we want it to be. And I think there's two components that we really spend time on. We spend a lot of time on leading KPIs. We've researched and discussed and debated what are those numbers that actually are telling the future story? And there's so few because most of what I measure in the restaurant space is reactive. It's your food cost is what happened yesterday to how you operate in the line, right? Labor's yesterday. Even guest feedback is your shift from yesterday or even earlier today. Like no two shifts are the same. So we try to understand like what are the leading KPIs, the measurements that we can say give us an inkling in terms of what we should suspect in the future. 'Cause we always believe, and we say this a lot in the restaurant business, sales are what you did 3 to 6 months ago, not what you did yesterday. Like it's not instant, right? You and I don't go to eat today, say, oh my God, it's so good. We gotta run back tomorrow in the day. It's not a repetitive action day to day. Maybe we do, but not, not often, right? It's more next time we meet up and go to dinner, that was really good, why don't we make this our place? So we look at a lot of frequency data and, and really that time between visits. So you and I go into a restaurant for the first time, we've never gone in, and there's a time between that first visit and potentially a second visit, and we monitor that component. And then there's a visit between second to third and then so on and so forth. And I think what's really interesting, if you look at a lot of the data for a lot of restaurants is restaurants do a great job with the first visit. Everybody comes in, they've got all these cool programs. They meet you and you might get something, you know, from the chef. And we do great with regulars, right? We recognize like, that was Jim. We know, like it's that transition gap that no one does a great job of. So we spend a lot of time understanding how people process through that funnel. And when we see that even slide a day, like for example, from a first to second visit in our brand, it's on average 72 days from that first to second visit. That's the number, our average across all of our millions of people we have in our data platform. So the measurement of health to me is that that 72 point dot, dot, dot, dot, dot is moving closer to 71, And these things take time to go after. And I look at it by a store cohort basis. I look at it by a visit basis, right? Are we moving more towards loyalty faster, meaning they really have more of a connection to my brand than the 4.0 or 5.0 they give me on Google? And when we see a minor slide, then that's the qualitative piece of does the restaurant feel right? Like, are we building or are we regressing? Because no two days in our business are the same. Either get better or get worse. Nothing ever stays stagnant. So then we pull that qualitative side in and say, all right, how's it feel in the restaurant? Right? Is it— is the restaurant clean? Are the plants healthy? Is the music volume right? Is the staff right? How's the food qual— then you take all these qualitative pieces and couple them and say, well, this makes sense. The qualitative is really strong and my cohort frequency is starting to nudge up even 10 basis points. Like the tiny little bits are a big difference. And we spend more time connecting those dots than we do saying, you know, here's a secret shopper or here's a Google review and here's sales. Like, it's too linear for a very nonlinear industry, right? It's all, yeah, consumer behavior.

Well, the whole thing— this is why it's so interesting. I'm meeting so many great leaders in food service because, you know, you guys are in a people business. Not that everybody isn't, But sure, sure, it's so immediate in food service, right? Your guest is right in front of you. Your guest is spending time with you, which is a lot different than a lot of retail, right? Where they're running out or they get what they want and they're out. And you're creating— you're really creating an experience. I mean, when people, you know, go to a restaurant with friends or they go to a restaurant for especially a special occasion or something like that, you're creating a moment for them that's going to live with them sometimes for the rest of our lives, right? And so, right, so how do you translate all these numbers to to your staff through training? Because it's interesting, before the show, I should tell people, we were talking about our boxing connection, you know, and I had a trainer one time. He always said this. It was— this guy was like a little Yoda. He was such a wise man, you know, guy from the streets, but really wise man. And he'd say, usually when we got our ass pounded, he'd say, you know, you never win a fight in the ring.

Look at that.

No, I said, no, you can lose a fight in the ring. You win your fight for sure. Right? So it's that training and the preparation that goes, you know, that's really where it all happens, right? So how do you take all these numbers, all these metrics, all the intel that you gather, you know, up in the 11th floor, right? And bring it down to the people that are on the front lines?

Yeah, it's a stellar question. I mean, we kind of take a two-pronged approach. The key is not really in the training, and it's exactly your commentary about the boxing match. The key is in hiring. Um, I mean, you, you can train a monkey to wait on the table. I say you can't train out a good personality. And I use that analogy with my team. They always say— I'm like, it's like, I'd go to that—

I would go to that place.

Maybe that's my next marketing gimmick. Um, the technical delivery of, of our product is service, right? The industry is hospitality, and everything starts at training— or I'm sorry, everything starts at hiring. So To me, it's how we're selecting our team. And, you know, I think back to my career and some of the best employees I've had never worked in a restaurant before. I remember I had this kid years ago open a steakhouse in Boston, a high-end steakhouse. He'd never been in a restaurant, never touched a liquor bottle, you know, behind a bar in his life. He was 19 years old. I made him a bartender. He's the best bartender, one of the best bartenders I've ever had in my career because he had a personality and he had grit. And he was determined to make sure it was fun And he was good at his job. So for me, it starts there, is that— and you think of guys like Nick Saban who've preached their career in terms of like high performers want to be around high performers. Yes, in sports it's easy to monitor that, right? In restaurants, a little bit harder because performance looks different. So to me, I take that approach of like high impact personality want to be around high impact personality, right? Then infectious genuine hospitality likes to be around people like that. They don't want to be around that sluggish, cancerous type feel. They want someone that's really exciting. So we start really there. In the training component, we've got probably the same as everybody. It's a great program. We use a great LMS. It's systematic, you know, the check-the-box component. But for me, it's really about do they understand the values of what's important to us. It's not about how the water gets to the table. It's not about how you clear the tray. Although important, not necessary, right? We've, we've all gone to restaurants that have, you know, cold food and warm beer and cobwebs in the corner, but it's our dive bar that I gotta take my friends to because there's a genuine connection there. And I think in our training, we spend more time explaining the why and less about the what. Like, you have to clear the glass this way. Yeah, I don't give them this perfect spiel. I say, just tell them what you enjoy What's different about us and that you're here to take care of them.

Well, it sounds like a lot of that has to happen peer to peer, right? Because one of the themes we hit on all the time is leadership has nothing to do with rank or title or position of authority, right? You have managers and you have leaders and they're both important. And to me, the best leaders are also adequate managers. The best managers are good leaders. And the qualities that we talk about a lot, see if we're in harmony with this, You know, we talk inspire, empower, guide. These aren't pretty words. These are essential disciplines, right? And the point is that everybody can inspire, anybody, everybody can touch someone else's heart, right? Everyone can empower, everybody can share what they've got and guide and empower people to help them do a better job. How much of that process do you see happening peer-to-peer? Because again, sometimes, and I think one of the mistakes that a lot of leaders make is promoting people either based on performance or based on seniority. Not understanding that sometimes they want to stay where they're at as far as the hierarchy goes, and they're tremendous leaders. They don't need a title to be a tremendous leader and influence other people, right?

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I say all the time, I think titles are cheap. Exactly to your point, I agree with you. I think it's, you know, form over function, that term. I think for us in the peer-to-peer component, you know, we pride ourselves in the culture that we've built, that is built off of what we call our touchstones, and some people call them core values, but I think when you build that, and there's a waterfall effect, right? It starts with me, it goes down to the team, but the impact is really at the hourly level. The ones that are the dishwasher, the busser, the hostess, if they really understand those, the cultural importance that I'm trying to profess, then I've done a good job and the team in between's done a good job. I think when that really lives day to day in everything that you do, and that's the filter for everything that we do, the peer-to-peer accountability comes naturally. And I think to your point, the promotional component, I totally agree. I see that far too often. I actually always carry a stack of books with me called The Motive by Patrick Lencioni. If you've read it, it talks about two CEOs that both wanted to get promoted when the companies merged and why each of them thought they deserved the big CEO job.

Right.

And what one was basically, I want to solve problems and help my team. And one was, well, that's the natural thing for me to do, right? Very high-level summary, but anytime someone in my company wants to take a big step up, I encourage them like, read the book and come back to me and tell me why. And most times, to your point, it's, it's natural. Like, well, if I'm a manager, isn't general manager the next best thing? Not necessarily, right? There's a zillion— yeah. And I think, I believe that, that hierarchy in any job, not just restaurants, people always saw it as like a stair step. Like, I go from step 1 to 2 and 2 to 3, and that's how I get to the top. In the world today, like, it looks more like a maze. Like, you can go in so many directions, and I've met so many great leaders in all different levels of organizations that have the most unorthodox backgrounds to get there. And I think they're some of the best leaders in the world. And I think that's what's really fascinating, is, is creating a culture of, like, it's not just a natural next step. It's what's best for you, what's best for your talents, what's best for your team. And those are hard conversations to have because, to your point, I'm a manager and I think I want to be a GM, but then I'm like, you're— imagine the impact you have here, how your growth could be done. I think when they realize that it's not just a title, it's impact, all the world changes around them. And we do our absolute best to make that a common conversation.

Yeah, it sure can. You know, it reminded me of— there was a time I was running the martial arts centers and I had two 2 young guys vying for a center director, assistant center director position. And one was more charismatic on the floor. They were both good teachers, but one was a little more charismatic. The other one was just a hardworking kid, you know. And I promoted the kid that was more of a hardworking kid. And it's funny because the other one came to me and basically he said, "I'm a much better teacher than the other guy. So why'd you promote him?" And I said, Well, because he cleans the bathrooms every day. And so the second sensei, you never asked me to clean the bathrooms. I said, yep, I never asked Jason to clean the bathrooms either. Yeah, but he came in and did it. And I always ask, you know, sensei, what can— what else can I do for you? Right? And those are the people we notice, isn't it? You know, that's— that's really incredible leadership. And actually, he's a world beater now. He did it. Both of them are. They're both great kids. But, well, kids— oh my God, they're like 40 now.

It's all relative at the end of the day, right?

Oh man, yeah, it goes by, it goes by. What's the pressure you're feeling with technology? Because a lot of the folks that we're working with in restaurants right now, and I know you're not fast food, but there does seem to be a lot of pressure to engage with the new technology. And don't get me wrong, people that think that I'm a Luddite about this, I may be a caveman, but I'm not a Luddite. I love AI. I love the process. I use it all the time. I use it for my writing all the time. I use it for research. And to me, it's engaging. It engages me mentally. But I don't like seeing it replace people. Most people. Some people need to be replaced. But, you know, like I said, what's the challenge that you're seeing and how are you managing that? How are you going to integrate you know, these new technologies? Because, boy, I'll tell you, if anyone's still ignoring it, they better not ignore it for long. By the time we put this on the air next week, the whole world could change.

100 things are going to change at minimum. Yeah. Um, no, I mean, we were early adopters in general in terms of technology. We kind of call ourselves, you know, next-gen casual, just thinking about the future of how it incorporates. I think the key to me is I don't ever want to replace the personal connection in our industry. In my business in particular. I think the more and more technology becomes even more forefront than it is now, I think there's gonna be some more people reverting back to just still wanting like, I kind of wanna just sit down and put the phone down for a minute. And we're seeing a little bit of that. So I really think that's crucial. I also think it's gonna be hard for AI to go up and greet a table and read them to that level.

You know, that— You're gonna have monkeys for that. You already said that.

That's right. I'm gonna have an AI monkey. Great. Um, but like, but heavily behind the scenes, I think the personalization journey for a guest is where I'm spending a lot of time. That there's so many ways now to connect data points that can then be delivered by a human, right? Not, not replaced when you log into a tablet and all of a sudden it says, hey Anthony, thanks for being here, here's like— that's great, but I don't think that elevates my experience because I can easily hit my chips and salsa reorder. It's nice, but it doesn't drive me to be loyal and want to run back. It just is easy of access. What drives me to come back is if they come and say, Anthony, I know that you love mezcal. We bought a beautiful new mezcal and I'd like for you to try. My, my beverage director is going to come out and give it to you. That is next level, right? But the technology behind the scenes is working with that. And I think the job replacement piece— maybe this is too far to say— like, I do think it's going to replace a lot of people. People. Um, I think there are other jobs those people still need to support this behemoth that we're seeing. But I think a lot of those entry-level kind of components, they're all going to be automated. Um, so I think it's going to allow people to still use a different part of our brain where you can put whatever you want into Claude or Gemini or ChatGPT, but there's still that cognitive piece that a human thinks about and feels and is like, ah, I think this feels differently, right? And the chat always agrees with you because you're the smartest person in the room to them. And then you move on, right?

I've got mine trained to kick my ass once in a while.

Yeah, I changed mine. I was like, be my biggest critic. Like, tell me I'm wrong. I want to be told. But I think that the emotional side of it is almost nearly impossible to ever fully put into that. And I think the key is use as much as I can behind the scenes to make my company efficient, my systems very proficient and almost error-proof and feed more data to my frontline people and to my high-level thinkers and directors to spend more time on creative ways to build the brand. I think you said it best. These forums are great as like a creative partner, just a thought partner of kind of get some— I've got 30 random ideas, I can't connect them, can you help? And all of a sudden you're like, oh, there it is. And then it just kind of gives you that runway And I think that's really fascinating. So we're very heavily into it in a zillion different ways. Some I can speak of, some I can't, but like, I think it's— you're right. If you are not adopting and jumping into the water headfirst, you're already behind because it's growing faster than we can keep up.

You know, you said something, if you don't mind me challenging this a little bit, because I'd love to hear your response to this. One of the dangers that we've seen recently, we just published an article about it on our Substack, was some organizations now are noticing that if they're too quick to replace those entry-level positions, they're finding a vacuum in their leadership succession planning. Because especially, I think again, you guys are the canaries in the cave with this. There's experience that happens on some of those mundane jobs and some of those frontline positions that just can't be replaced, and particularly customer service. And the one we heard recently in restaurants was automating the takeout, process, right? And that they're connecting AI to the takeout process and that they're already seeing some backlash that, that's kind of pissing people off. But also, like I said, if you take that interaction, that frontline interaction with the customer and somebody, you know, how does that prepare them for a leadership position later on? Does that remove some of the experience that they— that would— is irreplaceable?

You know, I think it's a super valid point, and I can see the concern. I think it's a short-term bridge from what we knew of needing— I go from an hourly to a manager to learn kind of some managerial skills, and I get mentored and sponsored and I grow as a leader. That middle gap of like, I'm a manager trying to be a leader, I think you're right, that is now going to be vacuumed out. But what I think is going to happen is you're seeing some of the, the earlier education, what they're getting either as an hourly employee or in college is going to be actually focused more on one of two things. Like, you're going to be figuring the system out from a development component and writing these, these codes, or it's going to spend more time on leadership, right? I'm an advisory board member on two universities, and both of them we talk about how are we training for real next-level leadership at the college level. I like that, because ultimately this— it's coming, right? It's already starting, but it's— we're gonna have to— this is a little deep, but like Societal change has to happen to realize that at some point a lot of that's going to be extracted. So there has to be a path to connect those dots. I think that dot is you're going to learn leadership fundamentals earlier. The fear I have is that you're going to be put into a higher position job called a director, maybe, and a director of tomorrow is managing more bots than it is people. So like, I actually worry the long-term implications of high-level leadership because Even someone in my job that I've spent time leading thousands of employees in my career, and I've experienced a lot of interesting stories. People in the future could get to my level with only having minimal experience how to deal with it. So right now you're managing high-profile executives with low emotional intelligence potentially, and it's like you only teach so much EQ. A lot of that's, you know, changed just by happening, right? There's no book that tells you perfectly how to do it.

No, no, no. I'm so glad you— I'm so glad you go in there because One of the things that comes up, especially when we're dealing with C-suite level executives and senior executives in retreats and whatnot, where people can really open up, is sometimes people don't realize coming through the ranks or have no ambition to, that you guys are dealing with amplified emotions coming at you from all directions and especially from yourself, right? Leaders like yourself, it's so— cool to talk to folks like you. We don't talk to any lousy leaders anymore anyway. We're getting a little choosier.

You're not going to tell them on the podcast if you do. You'll wait till after.

They don't get invited anymore. We erase those.

Yeah.

But no, that you genuinely care and you feel the weight, and that's a heavy emotional burden. So you need to be working and networking be mentored by. And I'm sure, you know, I already know the answer to this question because in the little time we spent together, I'm being very presumptuous, but I'm sure even with all your success that you have mentors that you go to continually. I can't imagine that you ever would stop doing that. I know I certainly wouldn't. So to have those people, like you said, that have that experience and have the wisdom, you know, which is— it should be commonplace, but Uh, you know, to be— which involves an awareness component. That's the thing, right? Every knowledge is cheap. Experience, you're going to get experience whether you like it or not. That's just life happening to you. But that awareness part that really distinguishes wisdom— my martial arts is showing, right?

Yeah, I like it.

This is my Eastern thinkers. In fact, it's funny because I think if I read you, I've got like 4 pages of notes on you. Are you from the Boston area?

Are you— yeah, originally from Boston area.

Did you know Dr. Yang Xuanming, Y-M-A-A, martial arts? Yeah.

Amazing. I'll look him up.

Well, I'm going to send you a podcast. I hadn't seen him. He's one of my most influential teachers and just one of the most wonderful human beings I've ever met. One of the greatest living philosophers ever, yet he's so grounded, down to earth, just nice guy. I reunited with him just a few months ago and we did a podcast together. I'll send it to you.

Oh, amazing.

Yeah, very wise man. But that's one of the things that he kept continually teaching us, you know, um, the, the mind of the true master is beginner's mind, always seeking, always wanting to improve, always wanting to learn and grow and develop, and, and having that humility. And it sounds like that's, that's where you're at. I mean, tell me if I'm wrong.

No, I mean, I'm gonna like coin that and put that on a plaque for myself. But no, I— it's—

we'll send you a t-shirt.

I believe it.

Yeah.

I mean, I have to be a steward of the industry and of my job every day. And, you know, I, I challenge myself if I didn't learn 10 new things today that I'm not pushing myself hard enough. And what's fascinating, to your point, like, I've got a handful of really great mentors and coaches in my life that, um, you know, some kind of got me through a period, some are with me now, right, right.

And change as your needs change.

Yeah. And I couldn't be here without them, there's no doubt about it. And I'm thankful every day, but What I'm actually finding, which is interesting, is I've been coaching a few people recently myself, and I started coaching this young kid, um, really eager, really smart, small company. And it's incredible that, like, while I'm on the phone coaching him, he's mentoring me in a weird way because it's bringing me all the way back to full circle. And bingo, it's funny, like, I've gotten that point now where it's like that almost has more value to me than anything. I just started— I had my assistant just start last week. I said, can you do me a favor? I said, I want to be on the phone every week, a scheduled interview with one of my managers in the company. Anyone, I don't care, just put them on the phone. And she's like, perfect, just 30. I said, just 30 minutes. And I did my first one this past week with a great GM in the Connecticut area, and it was so great. Nothing, just casual conversation, but to pull back to that component and understand the impacts and really get more FaceTime than I ever get the opportunity to do, um, is so valuable. And I think like now I look at my, my job to inspire is to be inspired by them and then lead them to the future. And I need to know really their, their sense of place before I can do that. So it's been a really powerful exercise.

And see, that's why we rip up, that's why we rip up the questions before we talk to anybody because the conversation's always more interesting when we just let it go.

Yeah, of course, of course.

No, you— are you, are you a martial artist? Have you ever—

no, so I was a boxer. Uh, I boxed for 2 years in college.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So I was a lacrosse player and, and that was not great for my academics, so for some reason I thought boxing would have been. Um, so I, I, uh, I, I had a trainer in college named Sione. He was a heavyweight, great guy. Um, he was an amateur fighter and I had 16 amateur fights in college and I enjoyed it. The discipline of it honestly was the best part for me. You know, you're a junior and senior in college, it's easy to get tied up in a lot of, a lot of other nonsense. Um, the discipline of boxing was incredible. I mean, I, I did it for a little bit after school and realized I couldn't walk into a table with a black eye in case I got hit too hard. So I decided to just— I just did some training. And, you know, I've unfortunately lost, lost it since then, but I think it was an incredible part of my life because just the discipline, the regiment, and, you know, you realize that, as you know, in this sport, boxing is about respect. It's not about fighting. Um, and it's, it's about respecting them, what they bring in that ring. And it's not just physical, it's emotional. Um, and I remember the first time I got knocked out. I remember the first time I knocked somebody out. It was a— the first thing you do is you get up and, and you give a guy a hug. And it's a weird, it's a weird thing to say you know, I need to hate you for a minute, but I respect everything you bring in. I think, I think about the restaurant industry in a weird way the same way, is like a guest comes in carrying some kind of baggage. They could be having the best day or the worst day of their life, and our job is to change it and respect that. And it's the same thing in that room, right? When you leave every fight, you left feeling different no matter what the outcome was. Um, and I think restaurants the same way. There's a similar philosophy. So I think it really paved the way for the way I think about the experience and like we change no matter what. When we get in and out of the ring, we change when a guest walks out of the restaurant. And there's a lot of similarities. And to your point, the training leading up to the guest experience, that's how you win. The guest experience itself is relatively fluid if you've done the work up front.

I don't want to talk anybody into getting their brains bashed in because if they don't want— but for those, you know, you're absolutely right for those. And you did a lot better than I did because those other things got in the way and I didn't get to the junior or senior year. I'll send you the book. It has more of the story in it.

But there we go. All right, I'd love to read that.

No, it sounds like we have a lot of parallels. Listen, before we wrap up, I just— I'd like to know from you, what's the one thing that you can share with people that you've learned as a leader? And I'm so— based on what you basically— I'm so looking forward to this. Uh, yeah, what was the most valuable lesson that you've learned or that you're learning right now that you can share with others that'll— I don't want to say make their path a little easier because that's not always the best thing, but to help them along the way a little bit. Yeah.

Yeah. You know, I'll share a story. It was in the first learnings as a leader, but it's never left me. I was a very, very young GM. I was 22 years old. I was one of the youngest employees in a restaurant. I took over for a gentleman that was, uh, he was there for 10 years. He was a very tenured GM, very well-loved guy. And I come in as this young, cocky, confident, like, I'm gonna prove myself general manager. And every day the team was like, you know, when so-and-so was here, we did this. And when he was here, you'd never let this happen. And I got really frustrated. And one day I finally told my team, I said, if you don't like it, you can leave. Um, And precisely every single employee within the next 2 minutes walked out the door.

Didn't quite go as planned.

All of them. And I share the story very often, you know, when I speak, when I'm on things like this, because I had to do a really hard thing at 22 as I'm going around, you know, not a corporate apologist. I am genuinely pouring my heart out of like, I just learned the worst lesson of my career and I just started. And I had to fight to get people to come back to work for me. And not all of them did, and not all of them should. But when I realized the— I realized early how powerful one team rowing in one direction is. And it sounds cliché, but that was it. When I stood looking at a restaurant with no one in it, I couldn't open. And I say this to my team all the time today. Every job I've had, I'm like, you can do your job without me. I cannot do my job without you. And I believe that the way org structures, quote unquote, work is that I'm at the bottom holding the whole pyramid up. I work for my C-suite and my C-suite works for VPs, so on and so forth until you get to the guests on the top. And if I'm not wearing all that weight on my shoulder, then I'm failing at my job and the pyramid topples, right? Whereas most people look as like I'm sitting in my ivory tower and I'm up here and I can do my thing. I just don't think that's a way to lead. And I think that 22-year-old me constantly, like, I can close my eyes and picture that exact moment. I could draw a picture as crystal clear as it was that day. And I think it happened for a reason. I think it really paved who I am today. And I, I've made plenty of mistakes, and then I'm still learning every day. Like, I, I'm nowhere near, near, you know, perfection, but I always go back to that. And I think that, that to me was such a fascinating thing that flipped the way that I look at leadership and hierarchy and titles. That's why I don't really like them, because I'm here to serve my people and they're here to serve our guests. The guests win, the people win, people win, I win. It's easier said than done, but that's kind of my philosophy.

That's so wonderful. I've so thoroughly enjoyed having you. We've got a lot more to learn from you. Will you come back again?

100%. I'd love to. This was great. I really appreciate having me on.

Anthony, thank you so much.