5 Key Ingredients Customers Demand in a Presentation with Tim Musch

Hey, everybody, it is Jim Johnson, the head coach at Contractor Coach Pro and your host here on Contractor Radio. And one of the things I'm most passionate about is like, the science of the sale. You know, the things we need in there, the. The what we're doing, the how we're doing it and the why we're doing it and what that does for our customer and how it solves, solution, makes solutions for what it is that they're looking for as a buyer from us as the contractor. And I have an amazing guest on today. They have developed a tool that helps with that, but he's got a lot of background and history on the marketing and sales side, so I'm excited to see where this whole conversation goes. The big thing that I want to get across to you guys is we're going to talk about the five key components you have to have in your presentation.

So.

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Well, thanks, Jim. Happy to be here.

Now, did I say that right? I was supposed to ask you before I, like I had it in my notes. Did I say the last name correctly.

You got it, you got it, right?

Perfect. Good. I get one gold star today. So Tim, you have quite a background in this industry. How long have you been in it?

Well, gosh, let me think back. How many decades this is? Jim, you're like me. Yeah. I'm thinking I've been in it for 35 years maybe.

Oh wow, you've got me beat.

Oh yeah. Probably not by much, but maybe by.

A little 10 years. So that's, that's pretty awesome. You don't see many people that can sustain that long in what we do and how we do it. So kudos to you, well done. Can you give us a little background? Like where were you, where are you now and why are you with Paradigm Vendo and what they're doing?

Yeah, happy to do that. Actually, I got started in I guess the home services. Not sure it's really classified, the home improvement industry, but maybe so back a while ago in the late 70s and got started with a solar company back then. This is a product called Solar Siphon. It was created in Eau Claire, Wisconsin and they went and recruited about 40, 50 salespeople out there and said, let's go to it. So we all got these gray pickup trucks and traveled around Wisconsin, Minnesota, look for houses with southern exposure. And we had this story to tell about solar. Now keep in mind, and many people don't recall this because it's a while ago, but we just came off quite an energy Crisis in the 70s, gas lines and all that.

I do remember that. Yeah, I have to remember, 79 cent gas.

Yes. So it was quite a deal going back then. So we were rolling, solar business going fine and. And all of a sudden the administration changed and what happened, Jim, is the industry back then was pretty much fully supported by immense tax credits for solar with state and tax credits. In Wisconsin, I believe the number was about 75% of the system was paid for by tax credits. But the administration changed in 1980 and guess what went away? The tax credit.

Tax credit?

Yeah, the solar business as we knew it back then. Different animal now, but as we knew it back then pretty much ended, you know, and here we were, this group of 40, 50 sales guys out there with their great pickup trucks, you know, got all the sales training, raring to go and nothing to do. So we scratched our head and said, well, what are we going to do next? And we got together with a small group and one guy raised his hand and says, I found something we can all sell. And we went, what's that encyclopedias, cookware? No, he said, it's plastic windows. And we went. Plastic windows, huh? So we went and had a demonstration of these vinyl windows, actually and saw how they tilted in for cleaning and all this and we all got excited and frankly, we all got in the window business. Back then there was a manufacturer up in Superior, Wisconsin that supplied these products to us. We got in a window business. Myself and my brother were in business. Happened on, happened upon this cool product. But what happened in about 1984 is something that kind of, kind of changed past for me. And many people don't remember this. Maybe you do, Jim, but the 1984 Super Bowl. Got any recollection of who played that, Jim?

Well, back in those times was that it's got to be maybe San Francisco in there.

No, it was in the area. It was the Oakland Raiders and the Washington Redskins.

Oh yeah, the Hogs and John Riggins and all that good stuff.

Yeah, you bet. The Raiders won that game 38, 9. A lot of people think that was, that was, you know, John's super bowl in there, but it wasn't. Tom Flores was the coach of the, of the Raiders back then. But the reason I mentioned the super bowl and the impact it had on my life is there was an iconic TV ad on that Super Bowl. Do you know what that was, Jim? You remember?

I have no clue. It's hard to know. I can't even remember the commercials from the last one.

Yeah, you're right. Well, I'm going to encourage everybody to Google this after the, after they listen to the podcast and it's, it's the introduction of the Macintosh computer. Yes. Probably the most famous TV ad in history. And I can see why, because for some reason that ad made quite an impact on me. Don't know why I just saw it. I don't know what that is that they just showed on that ad. But it looks like it might change the world. And it did. So a few years went by, didn't really act on that ad at all, but a few years went by and then in the late 80s, I decided, you know what, I'm going to get one of those things and try to figure out how to make it help our business. And frankly, I went down and got a little 9 inch black and white Macintosh computer and a laser writer. The computer was 34.95. The laser writer was 67, 95. And I got it to help me make newspaper ads because that's what we did for marketing back then.

And just so everybody know, like not everybody Quite gets that when he says 67.95, he meant $6,795, not $67.95.

That's right, because it's closer to that nowadays. Yeah. So it's kind of different back then. But here's the thing. It did help with making a newspaper ads and yellow page ads and all that kind of stuff, and I kind of enjoyed that. But it had a little programming language in there called HyperCard. And I knew nothing about computers when I bought that thing. I never turned one on. But I thought, you know what, I'm going to dive in and kind of check this out. So it had a tutorial in there for a programming language. And here's what it said, Jim. It said, do this type in on mouse up. Which I did. And then it said, hit return. And then type the word beep, which I did. And it said, hit return. And the third line, it said, type the words end mouse up. Which I did. And I looked at that and I went, you know, I don't know anything about computers, but I think I might know what happens when I click that mouse. So I ran the program, clicked the mouse, and sure enough, the computer beeped. And I went, oh, my God, is this easy to make these computers do this stuff? So I kind of joke with people, Jim, and I say, the next line I put in is on mouse up. Generate leads and mouse up.

Not quite that easy.

So I spent the next six years developing what's now known as a CRM. Back then, those letters weren't even put together and created this thing that helped us in our business. And one day a window supplier from Minneapolis came in and said, what's that? And I said, that's a computer first, right? What does it do? So I showed him, he said, oh, my gosh, that's pretty cool. Would you mind showing my boss this? And I said, I guess up to Minneapolis, I go to this window manufacturer. And his boss said, hey, I got a dealer meeting coming up. You want to show these guys what you've created here? And I says, I guess I will. So I remember that.

Competitors, right?

What's that? Yeah, right.

They're not competitors.

Yeah. So I remember I was at a hotel where currently the Mall of America is in Minneapolis, and there was a group of about 100 to 125 people there. I was up in front of the room, Jim, with this 9 inch black and white Macintosh computer. No projectors back then or anything. And I talked to this group about this for seven hours that day. And here's what happened. At the end of it, eight of them raised their hand and said, can I have one of those? I think the rest of them thought I was from Mars or something. But I says, well, I guess so. And that kind of started, you know, what turned into a business of its own. So over the years, and to shortcut the process, it's turned into, over the years having about 5,000 companies acquire a version of that program, which now is known as Market Sharp.

You're the actual creator.

Yeah.

I did not know that. Like, oh, yeah, I knew you were at market share, but I didn't know you were like, the creator of it. That's something to be proud of. Well done.

Well, thanks. You know, it's kind of interesting. Back when we started it, we went with an exclusive arrangement with that window manufacturer in Minneapolis, and they came up with it. It's kind of a funny story. They came up with a name for the program called a Window Seller. And I thought, that's a pretty good name. It didn't last long, Jim, because the friends at Microsoft who were just getting ready to release Microsoft Windows didn't like the idea that any company in the software business had the word Windows in it.

So I bet they probably had a little. A few more bucks. Yeah.

So they said, yeah, you guys might want to stop this. So we did, and it evolved to turn into what's now known as Market Sharp. And. And, yeah, so that's a little bit of the background of how I got started in the industry, in the home improvement space. And it kind of turned into, you know, this, you know, this interest in technology in the business. So sorry for the long story there, Jim, but that's how.

Actually, that was super interesting. If I was a listener out there, I'm like, hey, that's a kind of an origin story. And we all like those. Like, where did it all come from? Yeah, you're like one of the inspirations for the tools that are out there today, like Acumen, where I had some and a lot of the others out there. You're one of those forerunners and probably looking ahead into things like that. And the fact that you said, hey, this programming thing is easy, that's not normally for most people.

Most people don't.

That's something I don't even want to mess around with. But I remember going through some similar stuff. A little bit younger than you, but I remember when the TI99 computers came out and the Commodores, and we were in computer science class, and that's late 80s right. So I remember going through all that and to see where it is today is crazy. Like, I can go out there and write code, which. That seems like something that should never be uttered from Jim Johnson's mouth. He's not that guy. But the whole idea with software is to solve a problem faster, more efficiently, and better than we've ever done before to get an edge, possibly on what everybody else is doing out there. And so now you're over at Paradigm Vendo. Why the transition? Why didn't we just hang out at Market Sharp and enjoy the spoils? Or was there something that brought you over to Paradigm Vendo?

Yeah, that's a good question. There was something that, that attracted me to make the move after 30 years of market Sharp. And, and really what it was is prior to that story I told about, about writing a program that's now known as a CRM, I did something prior to that. And what it was is back then when I was in the window replacement business selling Windows, there was a little product out there. It was a Sharp. Little Sharp is the brand handheld computer I remember. And it had a basic programming language on it. It was attached to a little printing device that had four little ballpoint pens, different colors that would rotate and print out stuff.

And you're like bringing back visions of the past.

Oh, I know we'll get up to the future here soon, so hang on, everybody, we'll get to today. But I worked with one of the people that sold for us, his son, and I said, you know what? I'd like to get my pricing on this Little Sharp handheld computer, so when I go into a home, I can put the measurements in and it will go ahead and spit out the pricing, and it would be a great thing. It also calculated energy savings and proved value and all that kind of stuff. It was really a cool thing. I wish I had it to this day to demonstrate because it was very cool. But I got lost over the years. So anyway, what I learned is when the price came off of that little handheld computer, it was way more credible to the homeowner than any price that came out of my mouth or something I just wrote down. And that always stuck with me. So anyway, Paradigm is a company in Madison, Wisconsin, in my home state. And they've been in this game for a couple decades, you know, configuration software, pricing and things such as that. And a couple years ago, they finished up completion of a product called Paradigm Vendo, which is an in home presentation, coding, estimating tool, contract generating tool, and so forth. In the meantime, My good friend Jason, who I worked with at market chart for 25 years, had already made the move to Paradigm. So I decided, you know what, I'm going to kind of wind this up, going back to the beginning of kind of where I started with this, and go hang out with my friends at Paradigm Vendo and see what we can do with that. So that's why I made the switch. I'm very excited about the technology they have there. It's really quite incredible, many of the things they're doing there. And many of the people on a podcast will certainly learn more about it as time goes on. So that's why I made the move.

Jim, that's a. That's a super interesting story. In a lot of different ways, we have. We have something in common. I lived in Wisconsin for 18 years just outside of Minneapolis St. Paul on the Wisconsin side of the border. I heard you mention Eau Claire, saw that you live in La Crosse, so you probably know where Menominee and River Falls are.

Sure. Do you?

I lived halfway in between them in this little town called Spring Valley, Wisconsin, one of the most beautiful places on the planet. Unfortunately, it's ridiculous cold. So 18 years was about all I could stand and moved back to Texas. So great to have a fellow. Am I going to guess correctly that you might be a Wisconsin Badger fan?

Well, I am. You know, they kind of. In the basketball season, they kind of faded this year. We'll see if they can somehow pull through the Big Ten tournament.

And yeah, we don't want to get to my opinions there on that one. We'll bore everybody on that. But I'm hoping for something different.

I'm sure you are.

But that is a unique thing about Wisconsin, how tight we are with our teams and the Badgers and the packers and that kind of thing. It's just unique. And I didn't know that Market Sharp was originated in Wisconsin. I didn't know that Paradigm Vindo was either. So that's a. That's pretty cool. Now, the reason that we wanted to talk today is there's these five things that need to be in our presentations in order for us to have some success, is the way I believe that that's being brought across. Before we get to that, though, we want to take just a short break real quick. We're going to play a little sponsor. We got to keep the lights on around here. And. And it's a nice one because it's actually contractor, coach, pro. Oh, that image. Quickly. I did. The end didn't come Off. Right, sorry about that. But we're contractor coach pro. We help contractors grow and scale their businesses through helping them get control of that business first so that they can then grow it through scale, make it repeatable, well oiled machine that they own instead of owning them so they can actually find a little bit of personal and financial freedom that they were probably chasing when they started their contracting business. So in order to help some people find some financial freedom, let's talk about these five key components that we need to have in our presentation. So Paradigm, that's, that's what they do. Sounds like a presentation tool, estimating tool, and probably a proposal and contract tool. Is that a fair understanding of what Paradigm does?

It is, yeah, it's, it's kind of a complete in home presentation, coding, estimating, contract generation tool. Kind of just what you said there, Jim. So, so that's what, that's what Paradigm, that's what Paradigm vendor is. Yes. And Paradigm is, is a fairly substantial company. Well, I shouldn't say fairly. It's quite substantial. There's about 500 employees and we're really creating some pretty cool stuff as time goes on here. So, so keep your eye on what's going on in Paradigm.

That's, that's why we're talking, we're keeping our eye on you and watching what you guys are doing. It's been pretty interesting to watch your growth in the industry because a couple years ago never heard of you and now I'm like hearing of you everywhere. So I want to find out more. But let's talk about these five key things. Where do we start?

Well, if you don't mind, I'd like to start maybe by setting the stage for the five things. And what I mean by that is, gosh, I'm sure you would agree, Jim, and the folks on the podcast would agree. The last couple years have been quite the ride. You know, Covid came around, we all kind of were wondering what's going on. We wondered what we even have businesses and so forth. And then all hell broke loose and demand was off the charts and things such as that. But I want to share some metrics here that my friends at Market Sharp made available to me. And I think many people will find these interesting and useful and you can use them as benchmarks actually with your business. But I want to make one particular point before we dive into the five things. And what this is, is I'm going to talk about the marketing and sales funnel that we all go through, beginning with inquiries or lead generation. So this Group that market Sharp got this data from large group, Big, big sampling of our industry. So they're pretty reliable numbers. Last year with this group, there were 3,027,126 leads or inquiries generated. Now, if you want to make some notes here, write these down. Of those, 56 or 55.6% of those turn into appointments set. Of those, 80.7% of those turn into leads issued to salespeople. And of those, 77.1% turn into leads actually and fully demoed. And then of those, 391,164 sales were made and projects were installed with an average sale of $10,611 and a total revenue of installed sales. $4,115,850,605.

A lot.

Now, these percents I mentioned, something interesting happens. As we all know, in the marketing funnel, you continue to dwindle down. The marketing funnel starts wide, narrows out, and our job as marketers is to widen that funnel out the best we can as we go through it. But here's an interesting thing. Here's a metric, Jim, that many people don't track. You know, they track closing rates, and they track all the other metrics that I mentioned and so forth and should. But there's one metric many people don't track, and it might be the most important one to track. And what that is is the difference between inquiries or raw leads that come into a company and actual installed sales.

I noticed I was like, from 3 million to 391,000. About 10%.

Yeah. It's actually 12.9%. Yeah, yeah. Now, here's the interesting thing and the point I want to make before we dive into the five things, Jim. In 2019, this figure was 15.4%. Then we went through this couple years of incredible demand from consumers, and we had a 16% decrease in lead conversion as an industry. Now, why in the world is that when demand was off the charts? And I think some of the answers are somewhat obvious, along with abundance, meaning you got more leads and you know what to do with. Oftentimes comes waste and inefficiencies settle in. Can't have that. These are the times, and these have been at times to really make hay and take advantage of that. So with that in mind, I think the conversion aspect of it is really what we want to focus on as business owners. We want to make sure we get a little better at every one of these conversion points in this marketing funnel. Because what I've discovered, Jim, if you can get just 10% better at your conversion points, meaning inquiries to set up appointments, set appointments, leads issued, issued to demo, demo to sales, get a 10% increase in performance there. Your business doesn't grow by 10%. I call this the compounding effects of micro gains. Your business grows by 61%. Now, is a 10% increase feasible here? Consider this. If your closing ratio is, say, 33%, and if you want to get 10% better than that, you're not adding 10% to that 33% and ended up with 43%, you're just adding 10% on top of the 33%, which might take it up to 35, 36%. Totally achievable improvements throughout the marketing funnel. So my encouragement to many people over the past couple years is get your group together, get your staff together, and say, hey, whether you're a lead setter, whether you're a salesperson, commit to getting 10% better at what you do and watch your business and your profits grow.

So I'm going to interrupt you for just a second because I want to tell the listeners to do something. This is something I do whenever I'm listening to a podcast and I catch something that was really impactful. And no podcaster is ever going to tell you to do this. Stop the podcast right now, Pause it, rewind it, go back this last three minutes or so and write down those points that Tim mentioned, each one of those points, and then focus on exactly what he said to do. 10% improvement in each one. What was the ultimate result of that? That would be how much? 62, 61%.

61% increase in revenue by, by just increasing those handful of metrics throughout the, the marketing funnel process.

So, so go write each one of those down. I wrote them down. 3 million leads. 55.6% of those become appointments, 87% are issued to a rep, 71% of those are demoed, and 391,000 are actually sold. Is that approximately the right numbers there, Tim?

Yes, it is.

So go back, write those down, write down what those things were, and can you increase them by 10% even if you only increase it by 5%? Still significant. And I think the big thing that, that I took from that is this compounding effect of the micro gains. That's, that's super cool. I don't even know if I'm too worried about the five key elements anywhere that I think that was as impactful as anything else that we're going to talk about. I love that kind of stuff. That is the type of thing Because I think so many folks out there get so focused on one thing. Like I'm gonna increase my closing percentage by 5% and see what the difference is on that. While that is absolutely important, it's all those little ones, when you combine them together, that's the guys that really blow up and do a pretty amazing things in their businesses that look at it that way. That's pretty awesome. Thanks, Tim, for sharing that.

You bet. Maybe at some point what we can do is we can have another session and focus on each one of those parts of the marketing funnel and talk about how you can improve at 10%. So happy to do that sometime if you'd like.

That sounds like a soon to be future. So I don't bring too many people back a second time unless they're just full of content and sounds like you are. And it's usually a pretty long wait. I'm not gonna wait very long on this one. I'd like to do a part two or something like that with you, Tim. Fairly soon.

Perfect.

So. But hey, let's give the listeners what they came here for. So let's talk about those five key components of the presentation that should be there.

Yeah, you got it here. So what I'd like to do is say, really, what do customers want when they're doing business with you? And I want to kind of break this down into.

I'm interested to hear this answer because I have a pretty strong opinion here. So I can hear this.

I'm going to try to break this down into the very basic and then get a little more broad. And then we'll finally evolve out to the those five things that I'm sure you'll have plenty of comments on, Jim, as well. But when you think about it, what customers want at the very, very core of it is to be satisfied. They just want to be satisfied. So when we start there and we try to define customer satisfaction, it's really a measurement that determines how well a company's products and services meet customer expectations. Now, I say that definition I just mentioned might have run its course. I think in today's marketplace, customer satisfaction is similar. It's a measurement that determines how well companies process products and services. I added that word process there, meaning the whole customer experience meets their expectations. It's not just about your product anymore. It just isn't. So you want to make sure when you're going forward, beginning with customer satisfaction being the goal, make sure you consider your whole prospect process and everything that customer goes through, not just the product they end up on their house. It's a whole different deal nowadays.

So, Jim, the only thing I would add to that, because I'm with you on this, I think that when it's ran its course, I kind of was in agreement with you there. I don't want to just be satisfied anymore.

Right.

And I think you have the correct direct definition. Satisfaction is customer experience meets the expectations. But if we're truly going to be out there and competing in a pretty competitive market, we've kind of got to beat that. You know, you hear sales guys all the time talk and brag about, hey, we meet manufacturer specs and building codes, right? Like, that's the minimum possible requirement. That's the least you have to do, like you're making a C in class. How do we make it even better for them and give them a customer experience that actually exceeds their expectations? I think that's what's changed. I think that's what's changed in the last five years is we used to just be okay with being satisfied. At least they didn't burn my house down and got things done. Right now it's like, hey, you know, that was kind of what I expected. There was nothing special there. It's kind of like going to a restaurant. You go to a, go to a five star restaurant and you get a three star service, but it was still great. You're just satisfied. You didn't get that wow that you were kind of expecting. Do you see things similar?

I do. You know, all of us, all of us have made a purchase from a company that had an experience that just shocked us. We've all done that. There's not many out there that do that. But we've all had that experience where we bought something from some company and what they provided went miles above what your expectation was in terms of just getting that product. The experience was just so cool. I love this word remarkable. Jim. When you think about it, you really want to give people what's called a remarkable experience. And when you say that word, it's just kind of bland. Yeah, I get it. Just give them an experience where they're happy with what we did. No, no, no. Think of the word remarkable. Literally that word, if you look at it, remarkable meaning give them an experience, they can't help but want to make great remarks about you. And I think that is exactly what we're trying to achieve here. These remarkable experiences where these people are raving fans of your company because you went above and beyond just putting a great window in their home or a beautiful Roof or whatever the case may be, you really got to do that. So I'm absolutely in agreement with that.

And I think the frustrating thing about it for me is when we say it like that, the listener, the contractor out there hearing us say things like that, probably first instinct is like, that's more work and that's hard. Right. That's kind of the first instinct. But the reality is you only have to be 1% better than everybody else. Just one. Do something, anything that sets you apart from anybody else, and they'll probably remember you a little bit longer.

You bet.

One of the key components, like this being. Or is that just setting up these five key components?

Yeah, that's just setting it up. And I want to, you know, I want to. I want to evolve it down from. From what I just mentioned, that. That satisfaction experience level. One more level, you know, and when you think about it, you know, where are we as an industry? I'm going to get a little negative on people here, Jim, so bear with me. This is from the Consumer Federation of America. Okay. 2021 Consumer Complaints Survey Report. Top 10 complaint categories by industry. Guess what? We're not top of the list. Thank God. Auto sales and repair, top of the list. Landlord and tenant relationships, second in the list. Home improvement, third.

Anymore. So we're making.

No, we used to be.

I was gonna say we used to be first.

Yeah. Because guys like you are going around and teaching people the proper way to do business. So it's all good things. I hope you're right. Yeah. Some people might say, tim, why are you talking about that so negatively? Well, it might be the most positive thing we mentioned on this whole podcast, because, you know, what this says to you as a business owner is the people you're competing with are pretty easy to just dominate.

Because actually, funny that you brought that up, Tim, because that was the first thing I noticed whenever I got in this industry. I looked around and I went, this is going to be easy. Now, that bar has risen here over the last about seven or so years. I've seen that change. There's been this dynamic change and at least the cream rising to the top and setting a bar that now others are having to rise to as well. You know, the rising tide brings all ships, right?

Yep.

And we're seeing more and more of that, and it really is why we started Contractor Coach Pro in the very first place. Like, yeah, we want to help contractors, but ultimately, the byproduct of that and the real reason for doing it is I think the consumer out there Needs a professional that they can trust. I was so sick and tired of being. Trying to use some other word than what it was that whenever people ask me what I do. So what do you do? I'm a contractor. Was. Okay. I would try to build it up even maybe a little bit more like insurance restoration specialist in some cases or I'm a full service home exteriors remodeler. Like those type of things you would say to like, like build it. But I couldn't say I'm a roofer.

Right.

I couldn't say I'm a deck installer. I couldn't say I'm a fencer. Because then it's automatically like that. Homework's perception changes immediately to somewhere between ditch digger and con man. So right in there somewhere. And I was just sick and tired of it. I just don't think it's a fair assessment of actually what the majority of us are. And that it's like everything else, the loud minority screws it up for the vast majority. And that's what we've been on a mission about. So I'm glad you brought that up. Thank you. That's pretty cool.

You're welcome. You know, I saw recently a J.D. power study, 2022 based on the responses of more than 3,000 customers who made a home improvement purchase in the past 12 months. Just going to mention a couple things here. What they concluded is home improvement shopping is often a large investment and can be difficult for customers to know which brands to consider and where to make the purchase. And here's what they concluded. Manufacturers and retailers that. And here's the key. Personalize the experience. We'll see overall higher satisfaction scores. And then I'm kind of going to go down and do the real conclusion. Customers will be willing to invest more when they have this type of experience. So Jim, let's get to those five things. But before they do, I want to put one layer between the five things. And the first thing, which is the.

Anticipation is killing me.

I know we're teasing this thing, but we're actually going to get to it. But I'm going to ask you this question, Joe. When you think about it, people buy things from people. They. There's three words here. You know what these are?

Oh, you're one of the good guys. Because most people only say 2. Most people only say people buy things from people they like and trust. And we know this because we just got finished with a sales conference. We asked the question, everybody said it. But there's another word that goes before all of those. No, like trustee.

You're right. So our job is really quite simple. You know, structure your whole experience. You give people making sure you are touching these know like and trust basis, you know, as far as know. Your marketing has got to get people to know you, obviously. And when you land in a home, they want to know you. They want to know about your company. And to get them to like you, they want to like you. Got to get them to like you and your company, your product and service and they got to like your price.

You might actually want to have a conversation with them, like actually talk to them like a real human being, not somebody you're selling something to.

Exactly.

We, we always use this concept to. As a reminder, not as a, not as like a fake thing. But whenever you're walking up to the house and this is old school, this is like, it isn't my thing. It actually comes from the diamond selling system way back in the day with Sears. But form, family, occupation, recreation, motivation. As you're walking up to that home, look for one of those things so that you can start a conversation about and actually go from being a salesperson to at least an acquaintance. Maybe not a friend just yet, but maybe an acquaintance that's kind of likable. Our whole goal being, hey, let's be like their next door neighbor that they'd like to have a beer with. Right. So let's start some conversation. Continue. Sorry, Tim, I interrupted you.

You bet. Well, when you get past that one, then the trust, you know, comes along with everything you did and the know and the like part. But trust, make sure you're integrating social proof into your presentation whenever possible and things such as that so people can get it, you know, an objective perspective from someone other than you as a salesperson that's going to tell your story for you. So we've arrived. Jim, let's talk about these five elements today's home improvement buyers demand in your presentation. You ready?

I like the word demand. All right. If it's that important, I better write these down.

All right. Now, I'm going to expect you to chime in on these five things because you are the sales expert. Expert more so than me. I just look at it from the angle of, you know, if I'm a consumer, what would I want from somebody that's coming into my home? And here's what they are. First one is they really want to know what they can expect. And that might. This is one that many, many people skip in their presentation. But when you think about it, these people don't have this experience very often, and frankly, they're somewhat anxious about it. And if you don't give them an idea what's coming. You know a fellow podcaster, Kyle Hunt? Do you know Kyle Hunt?

I've not met him, no.

Okay. Yeah. Kyle hunts a podcast, and he has these. These magic words that. That I think are so important. And here's what they are. You know, you pretty much start your whole presentation with these words. This is how we work. And then what you do.

Those are great words.

Those are great words. Then what you do is you fill in the blanks of what's coming. You know, I love. I remember listening to some Zig Ziglar training years ago, and he said, whenever you're trying to communicate with people, whether it be in a presentation or whatever the case may be, follow this formula. He says, first off, tell them what you're going to tell them, and then tell them, and then tell them what you told them. And I think that's what we're talking about here. Tell them what you're going to tell them so they know what the expectations are from what you're going to offer, but also what you're expecting from them. You'll let them know you're going to ask for their business, for example, at some point. You know, things such as that. So this is how we work. Write those words down. Thanks to Kyle for that bit of wisdom. I think that's very useful. So I think that's one thing people expect, Jim, is knowing what they can expect.

Yeah, I do something a little bit similar. Now. First off, we, as a company that teaches sales, we just finished our top rep event last Monday and Tuesday. We're going to build a rapport first. Then we're going to set expectations. So we want to have a little bit of a conversation, and then we're going to set expectations. And we do use those words, work, or even like. I like this a little bit better. Hey, one of the reasons that I'm in this is because I've never had all that great of experiences with contractors in my own home. And I think one of the things that they mess up on is setting proper expectations and informing you of what's going on. So do you mind if I take just a minute to let you know what that looks like?

Perfect.

And that works out really well because I'm about to go do some things. Right. I'm going to go do an inspection. I'm going to be taking some measurements. I'm going to go up, maybe up on a roof, or I'm going to go out in their yard, or I'm going to go up in an attic. You got to let them know not only that you're going to do those things, but why you're doing those things and why they're important. And then you start to position yourself from this salesperson to this contractor that hopefully in the end, you might become an expert they're hoping for.

Well, you're right, you know, because if you don't do that, if you don't go ahead and let them know what's coming, their mind is wondering what's coming. And that's not. That's not a good place to be in a presentation. Tell them what's coming, then follow that to a T, and they're going to be right with you. Because you know what? You know, another thing I learned in my Sig Ziglar training, he said something years ago. He said a confused mind automatically says null. And my gosh, I believe that you've mentioned.

You've mentioned Zig twice now. Like, he's one of my heroes. I think it's one of those things where he's kind of starting to move into the past a little bit. I don't see as many people, like, talking about him. Fundamentals and everything else that ever could be possible in sales or even leadership. If you haven't read Sig stuff, you got to go and get it. Watch. Watch some of those old videos. They are amazing. So a lot of where my core comes from, so I just want to call it out, like, if people, some people on this show might wonder who Zig Ziglar is, amazingly enough. But, yeah, that's. That's pretty cool.

Yeah. All right. You mentioned something. After we tell them what they can expect. Next up, full understanding on your part as a salesperson of what they need and want. And this is where what you just mentioned, Jim, the whole needs assessment, inspection, whatever you want to call that, you know, has to take place. And. And Jim, I'm frankly amazed at how many people skip these first two steps totally in presentations.

It's amazing, isn't it? And we actually like, when we're setting those expectations and we're getting ready to. To go do our inspection, we're doing some detective work with what we call objection defeating questions. We're asking them some questions like, have you ever had work done on your home before from a contractor? Yes, I have. What was that experience? Like? They're going to tell you everything that was awful so that you can now Handle that. But you also have to ask questions like, well, what were you hoping for by working with a contractor like us? What type of look are you going for with this thing? Have you done any research and you have some ideas of what you're looking for and getting some of that out early so that you can prepare yourself and be ready after your inspection. Because once you do your fact finding side of things and that gives you the full understanding you need. You got all the measurements, the inspection, but you also know where they are with things so that you can then tailor this demo to them. Am I on the right track?

You certainly are. That's coming next. You know, a different sales trainer, a gentleman by the name of H.C. peebles, the way he described this is, he said this full understanding of what they want and this needs assessment and inspection, he calls that emptying their bucket. You know, get them involved, find out what's on their mind so you know how to fill their bucket, which is next of what people expect. Your product and service presentation itself. This would be the demo. This would be configuring those personalized recommendations. Remember the JD Power study? People are looking for that personalized experience, not just a cookie cutter thing, you know, and if you do a great job on a needs assessment and really let them talk, you then can fill their bucket back up with your recommendations and your products that really satisfy what they need. So that's next up. Any thoughts on that, Jim? Just, you know, our friends at Engage, you know, Paradigm Vendo integrates hand and glove with Engage and it just does a great job because a demo nowadays is more than just getting a product sample call out. It's way more than that. You know, there's videos, there's testimonials, the social proof stuff that I mentioned. Well, you know, it's so important.

Yeah. If you fully understand and when I say fully understand, you've asked the questions about their, their wants, what are they really looking for? What's the, you know, if they could wave a magic wand, how would this go for them? You get a pretty good understanding of what that might look like. You know, what products have you been researching? Now you understand products a little bit. You've done your own inspection. You know, the, you know, you know, the things that are going to be a problem, the things that aren't. So now you have, we always call them like bullets in your belt. Right. So you're going through your demo and all of those things that were personalized because I think that was really important piece that you put in There is personalized them. I'm not really talking a whole lot about the things they didn't tell me about or weren't concerned about. I am going to show it to them, but I'm going to move through them quickly. But those ones that were personal to them, like, hey, I, you know, I was really unhappy with the cleanup afterwards. I'm going to spend a good bit of time in my cleanup part of my demo and how we do it different than everybody else because then that's personalized to their wants and needs. Am I on the right track there?

Well, you are, you know, and gone are the days of these six inch pitchbooks that, you know, don't allow any personalization, so to speak. You know, technology using things like Engage and Paradigm Vendor that allows you to flow with where it should go really is what makes that personalized experience.

I'm glad you brought that up because until recently, so back in the day it was like pitchbooks, right? You had this pitch book. You go through and flip it, or what was called a flip book, and you go through and do your thing. And if you were personalizing it to them, you had to skip pages, right? Need that thing or want that thing skipping pages and they're going like, what'd you leave out? Which psychologically isn't great in a sales presentation. And then we got to PowerPoints and like Google Slides and things like that. And those were better. They're visually more appealing, a little bit more flexible, but still in a linear order. Right. Like you had a boom, boom. And you would have to skip slides if that thing wasn't the thing that they needed or wanted. That's what I love about Engage and that's why they're one of our partners. It allows you that flexibility to go what to what their need and what is tailored specifically to them. Instead of wasting a bunch of time in the areas like trying to flip past something and putting something psychological in their head that wow, what do you skip over there? Was that something important? To me, it is literally the most radical change in presentation practice in the last 20 years, right? Absolutely. A game changer for folks. We, a lot of our clients use it. If you haven't heard of it before, Engage IO. I think if you put Backslash CCP or Contractor Coach Pro, you'll go to a demo page, go check it out. I'll put it in the show notes down below. We'll put a little link to Paradigm Vendo as well.

Right. A couple of stats here. You know, 75% of customers expect companies to use new technologies to create better experiences, you know, and that's engage paradigm, vendor things such as that. But how about this one? A recent State of the Connected customer survey discovered 62% of customers say their experiences with one industry influenced their expectations of others. And there's plenty of other industries that are using technology in great ways.

I know this. I don't go to Walmart anymore.

Yeah.

I haven't walked Walmart in like, three years.

Yeah. You go in with your, with your pitchbook. Yeah. I'm not so sure that's what people are looking for.

By the time I show up at the car dealership, I know exactly what vehicle I want to buy and what it should cost. That's coming in our world. So that's why that personalized aspect of it has to happen.

Yeah.

So what's number four?

Number four is, all right, you've done your job, told them what they can expect, found out what they're really looking for, filled it up with your solutions. Time to present price. What consumers are looking for is clear pricing and payment options here. And pricing that's presented in a way where it's extraordinarily credible, because that's been an issue on industry, Jim, over the years. You got all the price drops going on and this price and that price and all that. And, and you know, I mentioned a little while ago back in, in the 80s, when I use that handheld computer, and the price came off the computer way more credible than me just coming up with the price as a salesperson, they just believe that.

Or even a spreadsheet, like the spreadsheet thing is still something that most homeowners are familiar now with how spreadsheets work. Those can be manipulated. Right. You can adjust them back and forth. So if you have something that says, here's the price based on what it is that you want, and it's digital, and it feels like it almost comes from a third party, that makes it. That solidifies. Hey, that's. That must be the right price.

You're right. You know, and talking about price, and I'm sure you guys have had plenty of conversations on this, so I won't. I won't beat this to death. But one thing again, I'm stunned that many people in the business don't do is offer a financing option every time they present a price. You know, over the years, I've talked to many companies and I asked them this question, do you guys offer financing in your business? And Jim, fairly often the answer comes back, well, no, we don't and when I ask them why, you know what they say? They say, because our customers all pay cash.

No, that's the only customers you're able to sign.

Right. I wonder why they only pay cash.

Because you never gave them another option and you missed out. You probably missed out on about 20% of the people you could have probably sold.

Oh, no question about it. So if you're not presenting price in a manner that gives them options, not just one. Because here's what happens, you know, if you just give them a price of the project, if they don't have that money or know where they're going to get it, here's what they don't do, Jim. They don't say, oh, geez, yeah, we just can't quite. We just can't quite do that now. We don't have that kind of money. You know, do you have any options? They don't do that very often. What they do is they tell your salespeople, oh, okay, well, we'll let you know. We'll think about it. Because they don't have any option. So give them that option and let them choose what's best for them.

And gosh, worst possible objection. I need to think about it. Yeah, I love it. I love when people give me objections. That just gets me excited because now I get to. I now get to prove I'm a professional. Right. If it just went smoothly every time, then it's just, you're a robot, and that's no fun. All right, so that was number four. Options, pricing and financing. So those come out. Now, what's number five? I have a sneaking suspicion, but what's number five?

Well, you might be surprised. Five is just wrap this all around, as much social proof as you can possibly include. You know, bring people in. You might be scattered in your presentation and so forth, but bring people in, get them to have easy access with your technology to online reviews and videos and testimonials and all that kind of stuff and just kind of intertwine that into your presentation. And if you do that, if you do all these things we mentioned here, you know, really what you're accomplishing, you're accomplishing that simple formula we mentioned a few minutes ago. They're going to know you, like you, and trust you. And when those three things come together, that's when they buy from you. So those are the five. And Jim, as you mentioned earlier, we probably could do a session on each one of these.

Yeah. Could I add a couple?

You can.

So again, the social proof you're seeing more and more software around this social proof type of thing where it's taking the jobs that you do and it's putting them on a map so that I can then go on the website and compare, like have people in this neighborhood done what it is that I'm doing. It looks like they have an okay, so that company must be good type of situation. You've got companies like Project Map IT and Real Work Labs out there. Both of them do those and they do them very well. The idea of having testimonials on your website, in your presentation, in your own world, like the idea of knowing, like, that's super important to me. Everybody talks about the liking and trusting, but the knowing part is so important, especially as a salesperson. Understanding that you're also a marketer going out there and getting out on your social media, sharing what you do, how you solve problems and what you do for your community. That social proof alone right there will get you that know that you need probably get you a little bit of like too. We attract like type people, which makes it easier to work with them. So the one I would add to that for sure would be something proprietary that I have a proprietary thing that I do that nobody else does and maybe multiple things. Like we help contractors build these custom proprietary systems that incorporate their great manufacturers. Right. And they're great warranties. But that isn't about the manufacturer or the warranty. It's about our company and the unique way that we do the thing we do, whether it's how we seal the windows or how we install the roof, the nail we use, the drip edge, the type of fencing fasteners, like whatever it is, how do I make that thing unique so that my competitor can't do the same thing I can. Because anytime somebody else can do exactly what you do, you're now in a price war and you're a commodity versus a value proposition. And that's a very important aspect I think a lot of contractors miss. And even if they do know it, they don't know how to build it, like how to put that together, where it works. So that would be the one big thing that I would probably go. You know, you might want to consider that when you're building, building a presentation, the other thing, and this is the one I thought you were going to say and you didn't say it. So I have a. There's a question for you. Why didn't you. I believe that the customer actually at wants you to ask for the sale.

Yeah.

From my studies and my Going out and being with sales reps. Did you know that it's 32% of the time that the sales rep doesn't ask for the sale? That is a astronomical number to me. Like, why in the world do you do that? That's. That's a frustrating thing for me. Is there a reason you didn't include that in there?

Well, no, there's really not a reason. You know, and I guess my assumption is that all. When you're. When you're working with, like, you take.

It for granted that you would just do that, right?

Well, yeah, I guess I did. But when you're using Paradigm Vendor and you have this payment and financing option built in, it kind of flows that way. So it's probably why I. Probably why I didn't mention it, but.

And that was my assumption on your part. Like, that's in that pricing and options aspect.

Yeah.

When I show them, I'm more. I'm like, hey, which one's best for you? And when do you want us to put you on the. The production schedule?

You're right. But, you know, bringing it up again is certainly something because that statistic you mentioned, that 37%, that. That ends a presentation without an attempt to close the sale. It's been that way forever and mind boggling. Yeah, you gotta. You definitely gotta have training. And going back, going back to your mention of having something proprietary, something different. Let's face it, Jim, the products that most of us sell can and are being sold by almost all our competitors. They just are. You know, you can try to put a little different twist on it and say, yeah, well, we got a different lock on our window, different color lock. You know that it's almost meaningless to a homeowner. So the kind of things you got to come up with to separate you from the competitors are the things you mentioned. You know, I've always recommended a book that's been out for quite a while, still relevant today. It's a book written by a gentleman by the name of Seth Godden called the Purple Cow. Great book. Oh, my gosh. That book will give you ideas of things you can do with your experience for a homeowner, separate from your core product, but totally separate you from your competition. It's a quick, easy read. If you haven't read that book, just get it. It'll stimulate you and motivate you to do this kind of stuff.

So I read that book. Boy, that's got to be 20, 27 years ago.

Yeah.

And, man, it was like somebody turned a light bulb on in my head, because then it was like, okay, everybody else is this. They're doing it this way. What's the one or two unique things I could do to separate myself from everybody so that it was a different experience with me than everybody else? Because those guys are gonna have to sell on price. I'm going to get to sell in value. And that concept clicked to me so quick, and I've applied it to everything I've ever done since I was in the health club world at that time. Then I was in contracting, then I was in software, and now I'm in this coaching thing. And we have those things even in our coaching stuff. Like, what makes us unique and different from everybody else that's out there. Tim, man, this has been one of my favorite podcasts of all time. I love talking about this kind of stuff. I think it's valuable for our listeners. I hope they learned something today. Like you said before the show, that we're going to talk about these five things, and they're probably things they already know, but how many things do we already know that we lose sight of those fundamentals and really think about them and almost make things more complicated than they need to be? Sometimes I think my big takeaways from today or make sure we have those five key components in there. Make sure that you're meeting the customer where they are today versus where they were 10 years ago. They're expecting technology, they're expecting ease. One of the things I think they're also expecting in this isn't just you meeting their expectations, but taking stress off of them. So many buyers today are so busy. We're all so busy. Everybody's like running a million miles an hour in the world that we have with all the decisions we need to make and the kids and all the stuff and me and all the activities and just everything that's going on. A lot of your sales, and I would say 80% or better, are solely based on can you take the stress off of me so I don't have to think about this too much other than picking out some cool colors? And you're going to do a great job. I think if we can focus there on really solving that problem, we do pretty well.

You bet.

Tim, how do people get a hold of you and Paradigm Vendo, if they want to get a demo of the product and what it does, how it makes that experience so much better and meets them where they are and allows you to have that flexibility to not only go through what it is that they're looking for, but give them that proposal, give them those options and make choosing you easy.

Yeah, you can reach me at my email address. It's Tim Mush M U S c h@myparadigm.com Now, Paradigm is kind of a tough word to spell. P A R A D I G m so Tim mushyparadigm.com or just go online and Google Paradigm Bendel. I think if you get a demo of it, I think you'll love what we're up to here. There's certainly some differences of what we're doing and what some other technology solutions in the same space are doing. So check it out. Jim, if you don't mind, I'd like to just end with a couple thoughts. One is just some advice from a great business philosopher. I'm sure you probably know this gentleman. Jim, same as Jim Rohn. Yeah, Jim passed away just a couple years ago, unfortunately. But everything that comes out of this gentleman is just true wisdom. And I love one of his little simplistic formulas for success. I guess you would call it that. Regardless of what you're doing, he says, here's what you want to do. You want to be successful in your presentation or in your business or whatever the case may be. Three things says, first off, have something good to say. I think most of us do with what our companies offer. But here's where it gets difficult. Next thing he says is say it well. Are you saying it well in your marketing? Are you saying it as well as you can in your sales presentation? Think about that. And then the third thing Jim says, just say it often. And my gosh, if that isn't like wisdom of wisdom, you know, competency is.

The key to all of this stuff. Like you want to be successful at something as long as it's good and you can say it well. And I would add one more thing to the well part. Like you actually do the work well.

Yeah.

So you market well, you sell well, and you do the work well.

Yeah.

And do that consistently over time. There is nothing in the world that will get in your way of being successful. So you mentioned Jim Rohn. Another one of my favorites is John Maxwell. And I always get a little bit frustrated because I know who they are as human beings and individuals and sometimes we get disconnected from it. But I mean, you think about that for just a second. That's biblically based. Do right by another human being and you will be blessed. That's exactly how it goes. To me, that's pretty amazing. And do it consistently. This is you Know, it's not something you do just one time. It's something you do often and every time.

Well, let me wrap up something I like to wrap with whenever I get an opportunity and what it is. This is an experience I had before I was in the home improvement business. I was in a different business, doing pretty good, doing okay. Went to a national conference, wanted to learn from the best of the best, and they were there. So I thought, great, I'm going to kind of learn these guys secrets and take it back and implement my business, and next year I'll be where they're at. So I remember I took one, one guy aside, his name was Jim Place. And I said, jim, what can I do to make my business look like yours next year when I come back to this conference? And he looked at me and he said, all right, Tim, I'm going to tell you. And I got all excited. I thought, awesome. He looked me square in the eye and he said, I'm going to tune you in on what I call reality thinking. And I went, okay, what's coming next? So he looked at me and said, here's what you want to do. Ask yourself this question. Think of how you got your business to where it's at today and ask this question. If you do what you've always done, Tim, and I think everybody on this podcast knows what he said next. And he did. He said, you're going to get what you always got. And I went, ugh, I wanted some magic direct mail piece that's going to revolutionize my business. And you give me this goofy advice that if I do it I've always done, I'm going to get what I've always got. Decades later, guess what? I'm still talking about that's some of the best advice ever. But unfortunately, today it's not true anymore. If you continue to do what you've always done in your business to get it to this point, you're going to start getting less than you always got.

Yeah, it's going to. It's going to get worse.

Yeah. Other companies are going to run you over, so just want to end with that. A little bit of advice I got years ago, hopefully that can help people and understand that. Always be on the edge and looking for things and embracing technology and things that can truly improve you and your business.

This. Well, Tim, this has been, like I said, a great show. I'm glad we got through those five key things that customers demand in your presentation. I love the way that you put that. I can't wait to bring you back because I want to talk about this compounding effect of micro gains. I want to talk about that and apply it to the to the funnel. We're going to take all the information of how to get a hold of Tim and Paradigm Vendo and get that in the show notes down below. As always, if you've enjoyed our podcast today, make sure to rate it. So download, subscribe. I want to ask a favor. If you found value in what you heard today, share it with three people, go out there and put it somewhere that you feel like you could help somebody else with. I think what Tim brought to the game today was worthy of passing along to others. Please do that for us out there. Let's help raise the bar in this industry that we love. Affords us great opportunity. It's something to be proud of what we do. Tim, thank you so much for being here. Thank you to Paradox Vindo for being on the show. I hope you enjoyed yourself and had a good time.

Thanks. Sure did, Jim. Thanks for the opportunity.

No problem. All right, everybody, that was this week's episode of Contract Radio and I'm telling you, that's top five right there for sure. It's always great to bring those guys on that have kind of trod the path and done the journey to come and share some of that wisdom that it takes all that experience to gain that moves us all each other forward a little bit faster if we'll just take that wisdom and that knowledge and apply it. Having knowledge is useless unless you apply it. Pay attention to what you heard a little bit today. I hope you found it valuable. And if you need help and getting control of your business so you can grow your business and have it be that thing that you were hoping it would be, which would provide you personal and financial freedom, this well, machine that you get to work on instead of in, check us out@contractorcoachpro.com scroll down to the contractor assessment button. Take the quick assessment and we'll do a free coaching call with you so you can actually see what coaching looks like. Not a sales pitch, but an actual coaching call based off of that assessment that you provide to us. If you like coaching, great. We'd love to have you as a client. But if not, we're going to give you two or three things that day will help you level up your business. Thanks for being a listener here on radio. Always. We you and we love this industry. We'll talk to you later.