Build a Winning Marketing Strategy with Contractor Dynamics

Hey everybody, it's Jim Johnson here, the head coach at Contractor Coach Pro and welcome to the contractors training room. We are super excited today because we've got a rock star on our hands. We've got Joseph Hughes here from Contractor Dynamics. This guy is an up and coming superstar in our industry. It's really cool his story and how he got into this and I'm going to ask him to share a little bit of that first before we get into all the marketing strategy and tactics and those type of things so you can kind of get to know him. But Joseph hasn't really been introduced to our community yet. So I've gotten to talk to him a couple of times. We've had a few phone conversations. I've watched him over time and his morals and ethics and core values and things like that really align with us. One thing I know is he might be having a little bit of lag in time. So be patient as I ask him a question. You might see it. Just a few seconds later and we'll get rolling. So, Joseph, welcome aboard. How you doing today?

I'm doing awesome, thank you. Honored to be here. Honored to be in the contractor training room and streaming live on Facebook and different platforms.

All right, cool. So. So you've got me. I'm going to ask you questions. There is a little bit of lag. Everybody will be okay with that, I think. So we're just going to go ahead and get going with the questions. So for those of you that don't know you, can you tell us a little bit about your background and why you started Contractor Dynamics in the first place?

Sure, yeah. I started contractor dynamics in 2012, so about seven years ago after spending a bunch of years growing up in my family's commercial construction business. So grew up in the construction industry. Very different from a lot of the roofing and contracting types of businesses that are probably a part of this webinar here, part of this training. But my family's business is 125 years old this year. Started in 1894. So I was a sixth generation family member. Really awesome to be a part of that. And started when I was 14 working in a shipyard with barges and tugboats and heavy equipment and cranes and forklifts and welding and all that fun stuff when I was 14 and so got to learn some skills, got to learn some life skills at the shipyard with people from all over the world and yeah, just kind of had that in my blood. Worked in the office after I graduated college in 2003, the office, the headquarters Is here in New Jersey and really learned as a smaller business, probably like 30 or so people in the company. Learned to do a lot. Operations, marketing, sales, banking. We're always borrowing money to buy equipment and invest in equipment and everything like that. So got to know a lot of business and just kind of got to the point where I was about 30 years old in 2012ish and I just had the entrepreneurial bug. Nothing against the family business. I love my dad and my uncles, who are the two owners or sorry, the three owners. Got along well. Really grateful for having that opportunity. But like many people here that are business owners, sometimes it's just inexplicable. We just have that itch to go out and create something on our own. And so I did. And I had that construction background in my blood. I had a passion for marketing. I had gone to business school. So I figured, why not combine? Not overcomplicate it. Right? Keep it simple and combine the two things that I have an interest in and a background in. And that's how Contractor Dynamics began back in 2012.

Awesome. So you actually had a lot of marketing experience before you even started Contractor Dynamics, Just from the history of working with your family business. That's really cool. That's a neat story. Like, yeah, we all have this kind of thing. Like, you look at us as entrepreneurs and we're kind of coached by our parents and stuff. Follow this path. Start at the bottom of the ladder, work your way up, that kind of stuff. And I didn't think that sounded like the way I wanted to do things, so I went out and started my own stuff. And it seems like you kind of followed the same path. That's pretty cool to hear.

Yeah. Yeah.

So we always ask this question. We want to start asking this question of any of our people that we do these interviews with. What's your biggest achievement to date? Not including anything with your family, like having babies and getting married and stuff like that. Like, what's your personal biggest achievement today?

Yeah. So I guess you include that because everyone says family, right? So you want to kind of get around that. Yeah, of course. Family. Well, can I use two things, personal and professional?

Sure. Absolutely. We give you an out that way. That way, if your family ever does see this, you go, why didn't you mention me? Well, we.

I wasn't allowed to. Yes. Coach said I wasn't allowed to, so I brought a prop. Actually. I actually. Random fact. I played rugby for the United States back in a bunch of years ago when I played. So I started Playing in Boston when I went to college up there and I played for a team in New York City. We were in a national league. And then I got the opportunity to represent our country. We went over to Australia, went to South America, did a bunch of opportunities there. So that was a fantastic experience. I hung it up a few years ago and I had a few concussions and my wife was like, all right, got a family now, like concussions. So in retrospect, you know, I do miss it. But that was a good decision to, you know, keep my brain intact. So that's my kind of personal thing. And then professionally, something happened recently which is really cool. I was invited to speak at an event, a private event for Beacon Roofing Supply out in Tucson, Arizona. And they had what's called their voice of the customer event where they bring in some of their top roofing company contractor clients throughout the country and you and just kind of have a roundtable and ask them how they can serve them better and what they need. And one of the things that they had replied to on the survey is that they're looking for help with marketing. And these are some of the biggest companies in the country. And so I was honored to be one of the guest speakers there and do a workshop there for a group of about 60 people. So professionally that was something that I was really excited about. So there's two things.

Those are two pretty darn good things, man. Rugby, like that's a brutal sport. I've gotten a chance to play it a couple of times. I had a brother in law that played quite a bit. And then while I was director of sales at, there was a couple guys that played there as well. And I'm like, man, you guys always have like broken bones and you know, slipped out knees and twisted ankles. I'm like, I don't know if I necessarily want to play. So kudos to you, man. That's quite the accomplishment. Well done. Yeah, playing for our country. That's super cool.

Yeah, it was an honor.

So what's the passion or the purpose behind Contractor Dynamics?

So I like to tell, kind of answer these in terms of stories, right? Facts tell and stories sell. So we had a couple clients this week reach out to us after we had. So we run training for roofing companies, marketing training, and we had a couple of our clients reach out to us via email and Facebook and thanking us up and down for really helping them understand, understand what they were doing in terms of marketing their businesses and getting a lot of Clari. And I love that our team Loves that when our clients win, that's when we win. So that's our passion, is to really help our clients gain an understanding of something that's so important as marketing and really be able to take control of that and improve not only their business, but improve their lives as well by having a better business. We love teaching our clients, educating them on how to take control of their business business and build better businesses.

That's awesome. It was kind of one of the things that aligned us with you is we're all about coaching contractors to win. That's our purpose. It's why we exist, why we wake up every day and do what we do. We want to help them be successful. And we saw the same thing in you, and you kind of do it a little bit different. Although you can help them with their marketing, you also coach and teach them how to market better and understand it and really understand the strategy behind it. So that brings me kind of to my next question. How would you define a marketing strategy?

Okay, so, yeah, marketing strategy is really your overarching. You know, it ties into your business strategy and your vision and everything like that. So it's really your game plan for, like, what you stand for, your value propositions, your ideal clients, the markets, the target markets that you want to serve. And so that's kind of your broad strategy. As we get into, like, 2020, get into the new year, I think it's more relevant to talk about, like, what's the marketing plan? And the marketing plan is really based on that strategy. And the plan is the logistics. It's actually the nuts and bolts of, like, what channels, what marketing channels are you going to hit, what target markets you're going to hit, how are you actually going to do it? What's your budget, how much time are you going to spend on it? So it's really imperative to have that plan because what we see in the contracting industry and a lot of industries as well, but we focus on roofing and contracting, is that a lot of companies will just try to do marketing, but they don't necessarily have that plan. And they don't start with the end in mind, and they don't have a plan. So just kind of throwing things out there and seeing what works and what doesn't. And a lot of times that ends up in frustration. So your plan is going to include, like, it's going to start with, like, start with the end of mind, like, what is it that you want? Like, if you're looking at 2020, what is it that you want? Like, what types of clients do you want? What types of projects do you want? How many of them do you want? Where do you want to serve? Is it going to be residential, commercial, multifamily? What types of business partnerships do you want to go after? Do you want to formulate? So when you're doing marketing, you can be proactive about these things. When you're not really doing marketing, when you don't have a plan or a strategy, you're kind of at the mercy of just taking what comes your way, taking what you get. And referrals are awesome. We all love referrals. They're the best leads and the best customers we're going to get a lot of times. But those can be uncontrollable. So if we're a local service business, you might get a referral that's an hour away, or you might get a referral that's not really an ideal project. But you kind of take what you can get. So when you have that plan and you execute that plan, you can be more proactive and laser focused on what you're getting.

That was an excellent explanation of what strategy is. It's this, you know, overarching what's the thing we're after? Like if you can figure out, hey, what you're after, you can start to work it back from there with a plan and then apply specific tactics to that plan based on what that end goal is. We see that much the same way. So that's pretty cool definition that you have there. So I get this all the time. You see this branding and lead generation side thing. So my question for you, what's, what's more important for a contractor to consider, should they be more worried about branding themselves and, and getting their name out and that type of stuff, or should they be more concerned about lead generation when it comes to marketing strategy?

Well, I think it's helpful to define branding and marketing in lead gen. So branding can mean a lot of things. I mean some people think of like your rap truck or your logo, your hat or whatever, branding is really getting people in your market to know who you are. Like building that know like and trust in your market, being a recognizable name in your market. So whether it's a service provider like Contractor Coach Pro or Contractor Dynamics, or if you're a local contractor serving local areas, getting people in your area to know who you are. So you're one of the go to contractors. You're the choice when people need a roof or need something done that you provide. So that's branding and marketing is really building that brand is the process of getting people in your market to know you tends to be somewhat of a longer term thing. Lead gen. Now lead gen can be short term. You can go out and buy leads, go knock on doors, you can do advertising and things like that. We focus on branding and marketing because branding, marketing is going to create leads anyway. The thing with marketing is that marketing and branding are going to produce leads. They're going to produce better leads and better customers because they're going to attract the types of people that understand your value proposition. They've seen your content, they've seen your marketing, they understand that you're not just any chuck in a truck. And that's a big thing. We don't want to be a commodity. And when you get people calling you who know like and trust you, then you're going to get less price resistance, you're going to be priced up less, you're going to lose out on fewer jobs to inferior contractors who you know aren't going to do a great job, as great of a job as you will. And it's going to put a lot of pressure on your sales team and make them very frustrated. And when you have frustrated people out in the field, then it can lead to client dissatisfaction and unhappy customers and bad reviews and it can kind of be a downward spiral. But when you have those people who are contacting you because you've done the marketing and they are like, I want to work with those guys because they seem reputable and trustworthy and they have great reviews, that's such a better proposition than just someone calling you because you can put on the roof and they're asking like how much per square or how much does it cost? So we always focus on building quality over quantity. Branding and marketing are not only going to generate customers, but one thing that a lot of people don't think about is that you're also branding and marketing to recruit and to build your team. Because the top people out there, they want to work with a company. They want to work for a company that has their act together, that has some systems that can show them a brighter future than they currently have themselves. So when you're branding and marketing, think about it as not only marketing for customers, but marketing for recruiting as well.

That's awesome. So if I understand branding right, like most people associate it with what you said, like the wrap trucks, the hat logos and stuff like that. But really, I think you should almost change the word from branding to reputation, your reputation building. And that's so valuable. It takes a long time. Building a reputation takes a long time to do it. We've tried to work hard at it. I can tell you've worked hard at it. But when you do and you have a reputation that you can stand behind, things tend to get a little bit easier. On the other end of things, when you start talking to people because they trust you, they know you, they know what you're all about. So I think that was a really good way of putting it. The other thing I want to say before I ask you the next question is you guys that are watching, you're on Facebook, you're here inside the webinar, you can ask questions. And we actually have one right now. So we're going to go ahead and answer that question, if that's okay with you. And. And the question's from Jake Dempsey. Any tips on changing culture in a company to embrace better marketing if you aren't used to doing so?

Okay, so I'm on the hot seat. Thanks, Jake. Great question. Actually, I spoke with a roofing company owner last week in the Midwest. Decent sized company, they're like 20, 25 million or something like that. And he's like, yeah, we have all our sales reps and guys out in the field, guys and girls out in the field hosting, say on Facebook and sharing their jobs and things like that. But he's like, we have no like cohesive kind of strategy or message or look. So we're talking about helping them out with that, like having some, some guidelines like, hey, if you are going to post on Facebook or you are going to share your work, then here's some guidelines to use. So we have that consistent look and we're also controlling that reputation and looking like the professional company that they are and not just kind of out there winging it. So changing a company culture. I think one of the biggest things to get buy in really from your team is when they start seeing the results of this stuff. So whether it's investing in sales training or investing in technology or marketing, when your team starts to see how it's making their jobs easier and how it's making them more money and how it's making their lives better, then they're going to, it's going to have that snowball effect. So it's like, hey, you did this video, you put this out on Facebook and you ran it as an ad and you got these leads. It turned into customers, it turned into more money, more sales commissions if that's the case. And they can see that. And then People are incentivized to do more of that. So I think that can be just building a culture around whatever your core values are and getting on the same page with those. And then as far as branding and marketing, just making sure that you have like some brand guidelines like what you stand for, things that you. Types of language that you use, language that you don't use, things like that. Does that answer your question, Jake?

I hope. Yeah, I think I'll kind of throw something in there as well. When it comes to culture, you know, it revolves around several facets of who you are as a business. The why you do what you do, what you do and how you do it. And there's this dream aspect, like what's trying to be accomplished. There's a vision that a purpose, core values and mission. And I would be, if I was somebody that was trying to convince my company to market more or do it differently or do it better, I would attack those areas of does it align with our vision and our purpose and our strategy? And what we're after, if it does, is something we should look at that'd be looking at that mission. This one year strategy of we're trying to accomplish this thing and if we're going after that thing, how does marketing play into that and what should we do about marketing to bring that into the fold where it's part of that strategy? And so hopefully that helped answer your question, Jake. You got kind of double answers there. And they probably hopefully built off of each other kind of a little bit of teamwork there. So.

Yeah.

All right. So that kind of handled the branding and lead generation aspect of things. It seems like branding is the thing that you're a little bit more focused on knowing that if you brand yourself right, you build the right reputation, leads will come. And I couldn't agree more with that. I'm kind of a lead generation guy though too. I like to see, like I want to see some leads as soon as possible. And so are there any tips for that? Like if I wanted to get leads quickly, is there anything that people could do or is it something where, hey, this is going to take a little bit of time?

No, no, I mean that's, that's the, a very common question. They will be on the phone with a prospective client, like, yeah, get this. Awesome, exciting. So how quickly can I start getting leads? That's kind of like the bottom line. So yeah, I mean this is a long term thing, but at the same time we get it like you're investing in something or you're trying something new if you're doing it yourself and you're like, you always want to get that feedback loop because you want to know that you're on the right track and you're spending your money and your time in a judicious way. So I would say like getting tactical, like transitioning from strategies to tactics. Again like getting clarity on exactly what you're after. Like who are your ideal clients and project build that customer avatar, like who is that perfect client that you're going after. So you figure that out. Like you start with the end of mind and then think about what that person and I know Jim, you're a Frank Kern fan and I think you guys may have done some work together. And he talks about this too. Think about what that ideal client think about what types of information or knowledge education they need to make an informal, intelligent, smart decision. Whether it's about their home, their business, their personal life. Just think about the knowledge that they need and then put that in front of them consistently. And the way that we do that is that we propose to do that is with video. 90% of communication is non verbal. So it's your tone and your body language and the way you come across, your eye contact and all those sorts of things. Things. So video is a great way to connect with your market because it builds no like and trust. Most of the digital and social platforms are going to favor video. So if you are sharing video you're going to reach many more people than with just say like an image or some text. And really basically most contracting roofing companies aren't doing video and if they are, they don't really have a strategy and they're not doing it effectively. So just the mere fact that you're doing it is going to be a huge benefit. And then as far as like we're just, we're huge on consistency. So like not over complicating it, like really focusing and just doing it. You know, maybe it's not every day, but consistently several times a week. And I always say this when I speak at events like that. The companies that are going to win with marketing are the companies where there's someone inside the company, like ideally a W2 employee or an owner that's waking up every single day thinking about how they can market their company better. Maybe it's something internally with building culture, team building, maybe it's something externally, but there's someone that's waking up every day and thinking about marketing. Kind of what you mentioned before Jim, it ties in with your vision and who you are and why you do what you do. It's not an afterthought. So just doing those things consistently over time is going to get you the compound effect of those small efforts put in every day. So that's kind of like. That's kind of. Our game plan is start with your ideal client, figure out the types of information they need. And how do you figure that out? That's just as simple as taking the FAQs from your prospects and clients. Like, what questions do people ask over and over again? Turn those questions into answers, answer them on video, and, you know, start putting those out on the Internet. And that's a very pretty simple strategy. I'm not saying it's easy because it requires work and a little bit of time, but it's a pretty straightforward strategy for getting out there and building your brand.

Excellent. Well done. So you mentioned Frank Kern. I thought that was interesting. We're big fans, and it's funny, like, we're a coach. We coach contractors. We teach contractors business strategy and how to develop their holistic strategy for their entire business. Marketing, sales, you name it. And we align ourselves with folks like you to help build on that and make that thing even better than we could do on our own. But I thought one of the things that Frank said that was really kind of enlightening is whatever it is that you do, like you're putting this out there, especially when it comes to video, it shouldn't be about you. It shouldn't be about. We built this many roofs. We've been in business this long. That kind of stuff. It should be about. This is what you deal with. If you are this person and you've dealt with this, these are some of the things and provide value to that person that they can make some educated decisions with. You'll get a lot more from that than you will talking about you. If you talk about them, it'll be much more beneficial. Would you agree with that, Joseph?

Wholeheartedly. And let's go into a couple examples if we're gonna talk about roofing real quick. So we see a lot of, like, whether clients or other roofing companies, they'll do a video, it's like, hey, make sure that you're. The roofing company you hire goes down. Goes down to the decking when they're doing a reroute, right? Like, you know, make sure that's the case. But the thing is, like, most. If you're in residential roofing, like, most homeowners have no idea what decking means, and they don't know why that's important. So like, they don't care unless it's like, what's in it for me? Right. What is decking? Why do I care? So you have to kind of go a little level deeper. Like, what's the implication? Okay, well, if you don't go down to the decking, then you never really know if there's any issues, if there's any rot, any gaps or things like that that can really compromise your roof and your home. So a great contractor is going to take the underlayment and the shingles down to the decking, strip everything, inspect the roof to make sure your whole system is good, and then they're going to reroute from there. So that's kind of framing it in terms of like, what's in it for your client or what's in it for someone that might be consuming your content. But yeah, absolutely. You always have to like, think about if someone's watching this video that I'm going to put out there that's a minute long, are they better off after having watched it than they were before? Are they more educated, more informed, more entertained? And you got to ask yourself that question before you hit publish or hit post.

So I'm asking myself that question right now as we're doing this video. Are the people that are watching this better informed and educated? I think one of the things that if I was going to pick a key point to this point and what we've been talking about, there'd be a couple branding and reputation being super important. Got a focus there and that if I'm a contractor, I should be marketing with video. Would that be fair to say? That's probably the two things so far that we've come to.

I would say so, yep.

Okay, awesome. So does the size of the contractor make a difference in the strategy that they're going to go after? As a contractor with marketing.

I really don't think so. And I know you sent me this question yesterday and I was giving it a lot of thought. And I mean, we have clients that are, they're doing a million a year. We have other clients that do 100 million a year. And honestly, they're all after the same thing. They're all sales driven organizations, which is fantastic because they've grown great companies and they're trying to figure out this marketing piece. So it's not necessarily how big they are, it's about like where their ideal clients and customers are, which increasingly are online and say social media. And how are they going to go through the steps that we've outlined thus far to reach those people and get some value in front of them. So yeah, of course the bigger company is going to have a bigger budget. Like if you're smaller then and your funds are limited, I know, like starting a business, you know, every single dollar counts in any business, really, any dollar counts. But you're going to maybe have some more time to focus on this stuff yourself, which is really important. Like building some of this, getting some of this understanding and building some of this, we call marketing DNA out into your business is going to be extremely important. So regardless of the size of your company, I would say take some time to understand this stuff beyond this webinar, this training, take some time to understand marketing and how it works. So whether you're doing it yourself or whether you're hiring an agency or maybe it's a combination of the two, then you at least know you're doing it's necessary. In this day and age, you can't just, in my opinion, go out and hire a marketing company and expect them to produce amazing results if you're not like bringing anything to the table and you're not participating. So that goes back to what I said. Someone in the company has to be thinking about marketing every day. Yeah. As far as the size of the company, I mean, you're gonna have a bigger budget, you're gonna be able to go out there and get results much more quickly. But if you're a small company, then our recommendation is always to focus. So like, let's just use Dallas as an example, you know, roofing capital of the world or the country, if you will. If you're a smaller company, even a larger company, they don't try to market to the entire DFW metroplex. Pick a town, pick a county, Pick an area that you want to focus on, whether it's close to your office or whether it's like a high income area, whatever, and just focus on trying to own that area instead of trying to cast such a big net. Not only are you going to enable your marketing efforts and dollars to go further by focusing locally, but when you use like the town name in your messaging, like Frisco Homeowners or Plano Homeowners, it's gonna connect with those people on a much deeper level than just like, hey, Dallas homeowners or Texas Homeowners. So the more specific you can be, the better. Does that answer your question?

I'm just sitting here taking it in. And the funny thing is, you know, there's a reason I do these. The reason I do these is I'm here to gain knowledge and then take action on that knowled so that I can serve others. That's really what we're at and about at our core is how can we provide better information to contractors so they can do their thing better, get some value out of each time that they interact with us. It's really. And truthfully like, I know it sounds like a shtick, but it isn't. It's. I've done very well in this industry. I want to give back if I can. And so you. Man, those are spot on. I'm like high fiving over here. I'm not even taking notes. These are great little nuggets for these guys when it comes to actually having a strategy and some of the tactics you might use now. Okay, so let's give them kind of one of those top three things. What are the top three things a contractor should consider when developing a marketing strategy?

Okay, well, the top three things, again, get some clarity on this. Consider that you're going to have to spend you as an owner or someone in your company is going to have to spend a handful of hours every week on this stuff. Call it two to six hours every week on marketing. That's a very conservative thing. You can spend a couple hours every week working on marketing your business. Kind of get that into your mindset as we get into the new year. That's going to really serve you both in the short term and the long term. And I guess another thing would be just don't be afraid to put yourself out there. And I know that's a big thing that holds a lot of people up, especially on video. If you're on this webinar and you're like, man, I'm not the type of person to get on video, that's okay. It doesn't have to be you. We have plenty of clients. The owner is on there as the face of the company and then we have plenty of clients who the owner is nowhere to be found online. He or she wants to remain kind of behind the scenes, but there's always someone in the company that secretly wants to be like a social media star. So find that person that's going to be comfortable on camera or those people that are going to be comfortable and they can be kind of your brand ambassadors. But don't worry about putting yourself out there and looking like a fool or not looking polished. I always say it's like going to the gym. Like you're not going to go to the gym the first day and just lift 500 pounds, you are going to go there every day. You're going to get a little bit stronger, get a little bit better. You're going to get those reps in. Same with marketing. You're not going to be perfect. Marketing is testing. It's putting out messages and putting out offers to see what resonates. And don't take it personally if you don't get a good response. Just keep getting better and getting better and iterating on that and you'll find something that clicks. And then again, just keep in mind that most roofing contracting companies aren't doing here we are getting into 2020. Most companies still aren't doing much online effectively, so. So you're gonna have a huge advantage if you just get out there in front.

All right, so you've said it a few times now. I mean, I want to like drive it home to these guys because I think they can maybe relate it to something else in their business. All of us, you said it. We're a sales driven organization in this industry and what we do. And we all have a sales champion, if we're any good, that sales manager, sales director, chief sales officer, whatever that person is. We've got this champion that's constantly pushing and getting after it. And hopefully he's recruiting, training and coaching and doing what champions should do and pushing and driving that business. And we in my time at Acculinx as the director of sales there, we were looking for a CRM champion, this person that got behind it, held people accountable to it, taught, trained, coach, that type of thing. And it sounds to me like what you're saying is each one of these companies need to have a marketing champion. Somebody is looking at that and pushing that agenda for that business that aligns with its overall vision. Am I catching that correctly?

I never thought of it that way, but that's absolutely true. When my team and I get on the phone with a prospective client, we'll do some research on them before and then we'll get on the phone like, alright, well someone in your company's doing marketing, who is it? Is it you or is it a marketing manager? Because you can tell, you can tell when there's someone that is waking up and is being the marketing champion every day. So yeah, find that person, whether it's you as the owner, whether it's a spouse, an office admin who has a few hours per week, you know, a son or a daughter who might be in college, like that can be A good resource if you're small, local interns from universities. We've had, you know, local interns here in New Jersey. It's awesome. So, yeah, I mean, someone. And don't get it out of your head, that has to be very expensive. It's more about just understanding it and doing the fundamentals.

So we got some questions here. Let's roll through a few of those, if that's okay with you. You good with it?

Oh yeah, I love questions.

Alright, awesome. So is it better to encourage your salespeople to build their own brand, to develop leads, or for them to pump up the company in general?

I would say the latter. The company, the sum of the parts is going to be greater than each individual part. The synergy. Right. So I would say it's great for people go out there and be doing videos and posting on social media and things like that, and maybe even having their own little landing pages, maybe within your website as a sales rep. But ultimately your brand has got to be kind of flowing through everything that people in your company do. In my opinion. There are exceptions, of course. If it's like the vagabond salesperson who's with a different company every year, then sure, go out and build your own brand. We do have a couple clients who are in that boat actually. But it's just gonna be so much stronger because, listen, people are. Your prospective clients are going online, they're gonna be looking for reviews, they're gonna be looking at Better Business Bureau, Facebook, all these different things. And so you want to have as many reviews and good mentions on your company as possible. For a homeowner to say, hire like a sales guy, there's just not going to be as much trust there as if that person is not backed by like an entire company and a strong brand. It's going to build that trust. So it's my two cents on that.

Yeah, I think that kind of relates a little bit to sales. Right. Like, hopefully all these contractors that are on here have some type of system that they teach to their salespeople to follow this process, this pattern as you're working with our clients. And we get that in our training, we kind of start with that. We say this is who we are and this is how we should do it. But every one of us kind of makes it our own a little bit. Kind of puts our own little personal spin on that. I would think it'd be the same with marketing, like, hey, this is our brand, this is what we want it to be. These are things and components that you have to have now to put your own little pizzazz to it, put your own little sizzle to it. Maybe you do something different. Like, you know, every time you do a video, you're on a ladder, and that's your thing, or you're on a roof giving some kind of sign like that, or doing a dab or whatever it is that you do. You can make it personal, but it still needs to live within our brand. Would that be a good approach?

I totally agree. Yeah. It's like the guy I mentioned before, the company owner in the Midwest who's. He's personally not on social media himself, but he knows his company's big and 20 million and growing and that he knows that they need to have, like, a cohesive brand, that everyone's kind of following those guidelines. But of course, you know, putting in their own personal flair, if you will. But, yeah, I think that's a great way to put it.

All right, we got one more from Brooke. Brooke, thank you for the question.

Got a couple more there.

This is a tough one. Like, I always wonder what the answer this one's gonna be. Which social media platform is the best for marketing your company?

Well, the one where people were. The one where people are hanging out. So right now, if I don't know what type of company you are, Brooke, but I'm gonna assume contracting, maybe roofing. So right now, Facebook. Well, let's not. Let's not skip over Google.

Google's.